Creating A Code Of Conduct: Fostering Trust With Your Podcast Audience

Want your podcast and videocast to be seen, heard, found and rewarded. In this noisy digital world, you are not alone. Join the nonprofit community at Podcasters United and podcast industry experts Tom Hazard and Tracy Hazard as they debunk all that outdated and bad advice you've been getting from the podcast gurus and find out what actually works. Today, get ready to finish feed your brand with smart cut tactics proven to cast your original voice to the world.

Hey there. Welcome back to Feed you'd brand. I'm Tom Hazard along with my co host, Tracy Hazard. Today we're going to talk about crafting a code of conduct, cultivating trust with your podcast audience. Tracy, for new podcasters they may not realize, and this is something we all learn, we start a podcast. Your voice has a lot of power with your listening audience and there is an inherent amount of trust as long as you podcast recently that your listeners give you. It does tend to build trust quickly. However, you can really cultivate that trust and build it to a different level. And I think that's what we're going to really talk about and share today. Right.

Well, I think we're going to go a little bit deeper into that as to why you might want a code of conduct. Like, why do you need it? What benefit does it do for you? And if you're not going to have a website, it doesn't matter because there's no place to put your code of conduct. So if you're not serious about podcasting and you're just using your page over on your hosting platform, doing something like that, there's no place for you to put this information. So there's no way for you to do this because this isn't something that you just verbally say on the show. This is a written code of conduct that you're going to put in. Now, if you want to get registered with social media platforms, and there really are only two that do it, and that's meta and Instagram. LinkedIn used to do it. It seems all shut down. And like, the last time I went to it, it was like completely closed off and giving error messages. So I don't think they're offering it anymore. And X is really controversial as to whether or not a blue check mark or you want to be notified. You want to notify everyone who's doing Twitter with you. Twitter X who's doing that, you want them to know you're the media because it could just actually tank your Twitter. So you may not want to do it there at all. But there is a way to do that there as well. So looking at this, thinking about, do you want to do it? Is it worth it? If you don't have a website, I'm going to tell you, you can just tune out right now, skip this episode, come back another time when you decide you really want a home base for your podcast that's truly yours, where you're going to make a statement, where you might put a shop on it, where the things that you're going to sell or affiliations you're going to make have linking and systems for that. Because the code of conduct matters when you're doing that. So this is one of those things that you just need to have a more business focus to what you're doing and whether or not you want to be considered a real news media journalist or a news media type, or you're doing true crime and other things like that, that has to do with more of a trust level that you want to engender with your audience. But having a base code of conduct is a necessity. If you want to register for, let's say, events, where you're going to be the podcaster and you want to get free tickets into the event, you can do that. But you got to have a real registration as a media, you've got to have a code of conduct. You've got to have some of these things because they check the boxes and ask for it when you're filling out a media pass. And then over on Facebook meta, they have the meta, they call it the Facebook news and subscriber updates that you're able to opt into. So there's benefits to doing it over on meta that don't come to just any podcaster who happens to post their content. You have to register. So those things are reasons why you might want to craft a code of conduct for your website and for your podcast. But I think at the end of the day, it's about making sure that that code of conduct fits how you plan to act on your show.

I'm glad you said that, Tracy, because so far everything you were talking about was really the benefits for the podcaster of having a code of conduct on your website. You can get media passes for events, and we've done that because of our podcast, been registered as media and gotten into certain events we might not have been able to get into otherwise. But isn't it just really self serving if this doesn't come down to something that you practice what you put into that written policy on your website? Right.

Well, keep in mind that that policy so no matter where you're putting at, if you're stating your policy, then it gives somebody a reason to get you shut down so they could report you to Facebook, they could report you to the event. So you do not want to put something in that code of conduct that you can't live with that isn't in keeping with how you plan to act. So. So in a way, Tom, I guess to answer your question is, it is self serving, but it is also being transparent and trustworthy. So you have to do both at the same time. So it is for the listener too.

The title of cultivating trust with your podcast audience really probably has very little to do with this policy written on your website because they're rarely going to go read it, right?

They're rarely going to go read it. But that doesn't mean that you're not complying with this, that this isn't how you plan to act. So let's talk quickly about it and I'm going to share with you. You can go to thebingefactor.com because that's where I register as a journalist. I don't do it because feed your brand. The show that we're recording here is really for our business. That's covered under our normal terms and conditions. But I have the code of conduct assigned for the binge factor because the binge factor is only a media show, it is only a podcast. It's not a business in and of itself. Its purpose is to be part of the media. And whenever I show up at an event or, or do anything on Facebook, any of those things, I'm showing up as the host of the binge factor. So that's where I built it and I was able to register it. I received notification within 72 hours from Facebook and was proved by using the code that I've put here. Now, I wrote this code myself. I am not a lawyer and I'm not advising you to copy my code, although I am allowing you to use it as an example. You have to build it yourself. You have to decide what is it, the way you want to act, what do you care about what's important to you and what's going to build trust with your audience. So let's make sure that we do those things. So the first thing you have to do is disclose ownership. You know how we listen to the news all the time, Tom, and it might say, hey, X News Channel is owned by the parent company Paramount and this story that we're telling has to do with Paramount. So you have to Disclose the relationships and ownership. So it requires a disclosure. So, so in my ownership disclosure, I have that potitize that Brancasters Inc. Is the owner of the Binge Factor because Brancasters pays for it. Potatoes publishes it. Right. So I disclose that right there in the ownership. I also disclose that the host is the CEO of that Right. Like, so that makes sense to everyone. So it's right there. But you'd be surprised how many people guessed on my show the Binge Factor, I have no idea there's any relationship.

To Poditize because the vast majority of them don't take the time to research it. They're just like, oh, I get to be a guest on the show. They look at the show maybe, and that's about it. They don't go deep into looking at the relationship.

Well, they only look at the first two sentences of the description, because if you read down, you'd also see that that's there. Right. So it's just. They're not looking for the disclosures. They don't care, but it's there. The second thing is, is that when they look at you to screen you, they want to know that you're an organization, that you're a team of writers, that you're a team of podcasters, that you're a team there. And so the way that I do it is because I have a staff, right? We have a staff who does publish articles for us. I have a ghostwriter who writes some of those articles in there. So I disclose it as me as the main host of it, and then the staff writers. So I kept it really simple. That's all I have to say. And whenever I have someone who published the article and I didn't personally write it, we put it under the binge factor staff. And so that's how you distinguish who did the writing or who spoke it. Now, if Tom were on my show or substituting for me, he would be named on there. And so we would have Tom Hazard and Tracy Hazzard. We would have both of us as writers, technically, because it's a blog, and as hosts of the show. So that would be disclosed there as well. So they like to know that you have a team. They want to see a staff. That's a sign of an organization. So you do want to put something there. And like I said, you can just simplify it by calling it staff. Your staff, they can be independent and not paid.

Yeah. But to be perfectly transparent, for all those independent solo podcasters that don't really have a staff, you Often can still get away with being classified as media for an event, just having a podcast.

Having an event, it doesn't always work or get approved over on meta side of things. And Instagram, I forgot to mention this, Instagram is really picky. So even if you get approved over on meta, you don't always get approved for what they consider news media or badge verification for that on Instagram. So it's just not the same. They have a different set of criteria. The next section on it is ethics. Now here's really have to think about your show and your audience. Are you an opinion show? Are you a news show? Are there conflicts of interest? Are you featuring clients on your show? Are you using paid guests for your show? That's something that's going to need to be disclosed. Now you might disclose it farther down, but this is a point of ethics is saying that I'm disclosing this and I'm being transparent about this and this is what is happening. So you do want to think carefully about your show. Now I really want to say something to you, all of you out there who are doing much more of an opinion style show that might be a little more heated than others. Controversial topics, covering politics, covering religion, covering science, because you still have issues about health and science warnings and other things like that. So there are issues with the types of shows and some of those areas. In order to even post on social media, you have to comply with some ethics rules or some more like disclosure and marking rules are usually required there. You might want to notice it in this section that that you're complying with those rules if there are any in your industry or your area. The other thing is, is that Tom, remember when we had Maria Speth on the show and she was talking about all the trouble you could get in as a podcaster. Remember, free speech doesn't allow you to disparage someone to say some of those things. So you do want to be very careful about your legal requirements. But putting something here doesn't give you free reign.

Yes, I agree with that. We've had Marianne a couple times talking about copyright once and then we were, yeah, there was a free speech discussion.

But that's because a couple of podcasters were in hot water over what they said on their show and what they said about other companies. And so they were in hot water over that. And especially a true crime show where you could tip the balance of fairness. You could be not being truthful about things on your show or you could not be fully researching it. This is a Good place to disclose what you're doing and be straightforward about it. So this is a good area to do that. The next place is fact checking, and here's where you want to state your fact checking rules.

All right, so sidebar for a moment, to use Maria's sort of legal lingo, is just the free speech thing. It just deserves a mention. I know it's not the point of this episode, but the US Constitution grants all American citizens the right to free speech. But let's be pretty specific here. To speak out against their government. Because that's what the founding fathers were worried about in forming a new government. They weren't allowed to speak out against the King of England as British subjects. Right. So that was the point. Freedom of speech. To speak out against the government and not be worried about the government retaliating against you. That was what free speech, that's what free speech really means. Mean you can say anything you want about anybody, anywhere without any repercussions or consequences. There are limitations to what freedom of speech really means. I love podcasting because it is a safe haven of free speech. That is one of the things about this whole ecosystem that is fantastic. We don't have to worry about we're airing something on a network and that network doesn't want you to speak about something controversial. And so you can't do it on your own show. That's the wonderful thing about podcasting. But it just to be clear, and we're not lawyers and I am not giving legal advice, but it just understand what freedom of speech really means in the United States and what it doesn't. I think you should do some homework.

Because it can trip over into cyberbullying, defamation, and you can get yourself in some hot water. So be careful here. And what I really like is the fact checking section. I think this is an important section because it says what you are and aren't capable of. I just said simply, look, I don't have time to fact check. This is the opinions of my guest. If you find a fault with what they say, tell me and I will remove it. Like, that's it.

You have takedown rules, or you'll consider removing it?

Right, I'll consider removing it. Yeah, I do say that. And so, like, this is a policy of, like, give me some proof. And if I'm. If my guest violated your copyright, my guest violated your rights. They said that. It's on them, not on me, is what I'm saying here. I don't have time to fact check the truth. This is an opinion show. Right. It's my experience that these things happen. The whole show is framed that way. But if they state a fact that is not true, let us know. We have takedown rules. We'll comply if we think that it falls under that realm. So those are some of the things we do. But I don't leave in my show because I edit my show. I wouldn't leave something that I thought was truly bashing a company because they had a bad experience and not necessarily a truthful account of what that company was like. If we have a bad experience when we were reviewing a product on our 3D print show, we would say, hey, we only did one test and I'm proving to you because there's a video that shows you how it failed. But that doesn't mean that you can't get better results. We almost always used to say it that way. Right. And so it just gives it that broadness to make sure that you're not really influencing your audience in a negative way that could come back to harm another company. That was never our intention. Our intention is to promote the community, not harm the community. Right, but that's our purpose. Your purpose might be something totally different. Just be careful. Gifts and payments. If you're taking payments for guests, if you're taking payments for sponsors, if you're doing sponsored episodes that are truly paid for. When we took our hp, when Hewlett Packard sponsored our show, we disclosed it everywhere. That's all we're saying. We're not saying we're not going to take money. It's saying if we do take money, we're disclosing it. And it's required. Because if you then post that article, you post that podcast out on social media and you failed to disclose the that it was a paid for spot and paid for content, you're violating their rules and you can get yourself self in some serious hot water there. So you must disclose that that's an ad, it's sponsored content, it's paid for. That's all I'm disclosing in the gifts and payments section, however, I do distinguish gifts and payments separate from speaking fees. And I did this because I get invited to speak in a lot of places. I do not personally take a speaking fee. You might take one. You can disclose that there and say that you take one. In fact, you might even want to put your link to your speaking calendar where they can book with you if they'd like to invite you to speak. Like that's a great way to promote that. But I allow expenses and nominal gifts. So sometimes when I speak, somebody gives me a mug or a T shirt or something like that. So I say I accept those and I don't have to report them. They're not big deal. And I will accept speaking events where people pay me to come to speak there, and I've done that many times. But I usually do not allow speaking fees because I want to be able to sell my stuff from the stage. That's my own rule. So when you'll see that in the code, you might have different code.

I agree with those rules. I can't tell you how many T shirts I have from different events that I never wear. And it really has not influenced me to do one thing or another, right?

No, it doesn't influence you to take a nominal gift or a paid VIP meal or something like that. So, I mean, I state it right there that they don't count, that they're allowed, but these are the same rules that I used to have when I was an Inc. Magazine columnist. And so I followed actually those same rules here. The next thing is clients, advertisers. And this is where I would lump in your guests. If your guests are paying for spots like an advertiser is. So if you're using your guests, you could discuss that you occasionally take rush fees here. I don't think that one's such a disclosure, but you might want to just to be super transparent and honest about that. But basically, coverage of those who pay you and how you're marking that transparently for your listeners, that's what matters here. And then making a difference in distinguishment between advertiser versus editorial content. So if it's an advertising or sponsored content versus that and that there is a separation of those two, they're clearly distinguished. How are you going to mark them? What are you doing? How are you documenting that? You don't have to disclose how much you make anywhere. There's no requirement to do that. None of any publication, any social media platform, or any event. They don't require you to tell how much that you make. They only do require that you disclose that you were paid for it. So those are the basics to this agreement. It links up also to your terms and conditions and privacy policy. So make sure you have both of those in place. You can go around and play on the bottom of the bingefactor.com and you can see mine as well. And you can see how they link back and forth to the code of conduct and the code of ethics.

There's Tracy. How does some of this code of ethics and maybe disclosure, transparency rules, how might that apply differently to a nonprofit organization? As we do have several podcasters we support that aren't nonprofit organizations, I think there's nothing wrong with actually using that. The fact that you are a nonprofit and that if you love the show, please consider supporting us by going to our website and making a donation. I mean, that can sort of be a helpful thing to do, I would think, for a nonprofit. At the same time, you're also being very transparent that, number one, you're a nonprofit. Number two, you do accept donations to help fund continuing to bring this content to you, the listener.

Right. Well, so I asked this for our nonprofit partners because I was concerned that there might be a difference here. And what they're telling me is you have to comply with the basic for profit rules here. But what you should do is state somewhere that you are a 501C3, here's where you're registered, and state the transparency of that. Just like you have to do with your corporation at the bottom of any privacy policy or on your terms of use, you would have the statement of where you're located. You have to buy the terms of the GDPR and some of the other privacy policy requirements. You have to have your company name, your address, your phone number, all disclosed in that document somewhere, your contact information, basically your legal contact information. So you might want to put right in that same position all the information about where your 501C3 is truly registered so that it's clear that you are a registered 501C3. And that's the difference there. But I would say I think your ethics matter more here and this code of conduct matters more at this point about how you want to show up in the world as an organization that is receiving donations, what you're doing with those donations, how you're directing those donations, how it works. You might want to be a lot more transparent with that if you would like to get donors. But it's not a requirement for the things that I'm talking about. This is a voluntary document. A privacy policy is not if you have a website.

Yeah, privacy policy these days is required when you have a website. So, Tracy, I think that's a really good point that you made because I do these podcast power appraisals for a lot of different podcasts. So I see a lot of existing podcasters and what they've set up, and many of them have a donation button, buy me a coffee or donate through Patreon or something. And the vast majority of these podcasts are not nonprofit organizations. It's an independent individual, sole, proprietary proprietor LLC or something that is either a sole proprietor is just yourself and you're in business. And if you make money, it's not a nonprofit, it's a for profit. Or maybe you're just hoping to recover some of your costs, but it's still a nonprofit organization. You're just saying, hey, do you want to contribute and help fund me? And it's almost like, go fund me on a tiny scale, right?

But go fund me and buy me a coffee. And all of those have their own policies about how they police them and they're governing that. So you state here, if you've got that. But that's not exactly what I was thinking of in terms of what you were what was being asked for the nonprofit side of things. But like here I put into the chat in our zoom, which is where of course, if you're watching this on live stream, you're not seeing that. If you've got it in the podcast, it should be in the blog post for this episode@potatoise.com so you will be able to access that. But Amnesty International, amnesty.org has an about us that says has their policies put right up front. They call it how we're run. And so it's great because they're stating, this is how we use your donations, this is what we do with it. If you're going to be a nonprofit, I think part of building trust to get donors is making sure that you have a code of ethics of some kind. And the one that I'm proposing here, that it works for journalists, could be adapted to work because those same sections are equally important. But instead of how you're taking advertisers, how you're using sponsors and donors money, what you're going to do with that, how it's being spent, what's happening with that, how it's marked and earmarked for its percentages and breakdowns. You might want to even be disclosed that amount.

And I wanted to draw a distinction between the average podcast that's trying to recoup a little of their expenses by having a buy me a coffee or a Patreon or something, which I've never seen anybody really make a heck of a lot of money or even cover their costs using Patreon. I'm sure some do. So don't write into me say, oh, I know someone who does.

I've only heard of one and I can't verify them.

Right. But my point Here is that if you are, for those of you that are a legitimate 501c3 nonprofit organization, I think disclosing that actually gives you a lot more credibility. Yes, you're being transparent, but I think it really gives you more credibility and. And might very well build trust with the audience to the point where they're willing to donate more than for the typical independent podcast that says, hey, do you want to give me some money? Right. It's a different thing. And so I encourage that it is.

And so it starts with this code of ethics, this code of conduct, thinking about how you're going to operate and how you want to show up in the world and how you want to build trust with your listeners or with your donors or with your guests, with your audience, whoever they might be, and whatever the purpose is of your show and your business that it goes along with, because this must be contained on a website. As I said before, that's its purpose is to be put there so you will not have a place to put it anywhere else. I mean, I guess you could put it in your show description and somebody could click out to it, but very often there's no dynamic links in many of those descriptions, so it won't really work for you. There's.

So a little example that might give some help to our listeners is I remember back in our 3D printing podcast days, Tracy, which is going back quite a ways, can't believe how long ago that was now, but was really our very first podcast. And we would review 3D printers. We got to be such authorities in the space. People would say, hey, can I send you a 3D printer? Would you try it out and do a review of it? And, yeah, we were happy to do that. We had people give us many thousands of dollars worth of equipment. Some of them were four or $5,000, just one machine. But we were very transparent with our listening audience, saying, hey, we're testing these. We checked them out. We're not accepting this as payment for a review. We're not accepting payment for a review if the manufacturer who sent it to us did not want us to ship it back. And they weren't willing to provide a prepaid shipping label to pay for the shipping back. We would donate it to an organization, a school, at some other organization that could use that 3D printer. So we weren't taking value. But there was one time when I reviewed one that I was so blown away with it that I was like, all right, I'm making arrangements to keep this one. And I told the Audience, it's like, all right, this one I really like. It's so good. And I'm not sending it back. I'm not giving it to a school. I am paying for it and keeping it. And so I think as long as you're transparent with the audience in these ways, not only about your code of conduct, but when you're doing something maybe a little unexpected with it, it's going to build that trust with your audience even more, I think, through your actions, through your behaviors, through how you speak with your audience. And you don't have to. It's not like you have to read some legal disclaimer in every episode. I wouldn't really suggest that. But you just mentioned, naturally, the things that are worth mentioning and are important about your organization.

Right. And we did something slightly different there. We didn't have a code of conduct on the bottom of our website there. It was called 3dstartpoint.com you can go check it out. We used to have a form submission. Because we no longer publish that podcast, we removed that. So it's not there. But we would have submit for a review. Want to have your thing reviewed. Right. And then there was. Above the form was our conduct information about what we did so it was disclosed. And then Tom would state in any review, if it deviated from that, such as he decided to buy it at the end. So we would verbally state that. And of course it would end up in the blog as well. And that's how we handled the policies on that. So we did it on a case by case basis because we found it to be so different. But everyone knew when they were submitting for that that we were getting materials. Right. That they were being provided to us. So if we were using filament, someone was providing to it, it was going to get consumed, we weren't going to return it. Same thing with books. Like, if you get book reviews. Yeah, it happens all the time. They send them to you, they're free, you review the book, whatever it is. That's kind of very common for how it would work.

I'm sure it's a rare, extreme situation. I just think that whatever your unique situation is, there are going to be nuances. I think common sense goes a long way in this of being transparent, of having integrity with your listener. Right. If you're making money on something, that's okay. I don't think anybody's gonna hold that against you. Just be clear about it.

Right, Absolutely. And that's the point of this. Be transparent. Do what you say you're gonna do and tell everyone about it so that you can get some benefit for it, right?

Absolutely.

Well, that's it for all I've got for the code of conduct side of things and be thinking about whether or not this is something you want to try and do. And hopefully we've given you a little model to go off of today.

And for this episode, there's an awful lot of links that have been floating here in the chat for those live on Zoom. I don't know if any of those have been shared on social. But you know what? When this episode comes out as a podcast and those of you listening to the podcast on your favorite listening app now, it's already there on the blog post@poditize.com so go and check that out and get the links to anything we've talked about that interest you today.

Well, thanks everyone for listening. I'm Tracy Hazzard, along with my co host Tom Hazard, and we'll be back next time with another feed your brand and a topic for all of you podcasters out there.

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