Maximizing Your Podcast's Lead-Generating Potential: How To Convert Listeners To High-Quality Leads With Alesia Galati Of Listeners To Leads Podcast

Wish you were one of those influencers with raving fans who binge on your every word, consume all your content, buy everything you have to sell, and demand even more. Then stay tuned while Authority magazine columnist and buzzfeed contributor Tracy Hazard shares strategies, tips, and tactics from top videocasters, podcasters, authors, and social influencers on creating that bingeable factor. Now let's join Tracy as she explores.

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Hey, everyone. Welcome to the Binge Factor. I'm Tracy Hazzard and I have Alicia Galati today, and we're going to talk Listeners to Leads. That's the name of her show. Alicia is a podcast manager and she runs a full service management company and helps corporations help business owners launch, maintain lead generating products, including their podcasts. Right. So it's her sole focus. And if you're not using your podcast as a way to drive listeners to Leads, you haven't really thought through the full power of what you're doing. So I'm so excited to have this conversation with her today and really hear about what companies and corporations that she's working with are doing to drive that through that process. So let's hear from Alicia Galati and we'll talk about Listeners to Leads.

Alicia. Listeners to Leads. Like, that is the number one thing I hear from everyone. That's why they start a podcast. They actually want leads. So Listeners to Leads. I think the name of the show is perfect.

You know, I'm not someone who comes up with like, snappy names or, like, super creative things. And so, like, we were just talking about starting a new podcast and I am starting one with some business friends and like, ooh, it's gonna be like coffee and entrepreneurship. And like, they're coming up with these, like, puns, and my brain is like, oh, God, no, keep it simple.

I think it's really a hard thing. How do you name your show? Right. So you have some older shows, two older shows that you've done, Two Sisters and a Cult. I mean, it's straight out right out there what it is. You had a show on E Commerce. There needs to be some clarity in what they're gonna get in the name. And Listeners to Leads, like, puts it right out there. I'm interested in that. That's something I either can't get, I would like to get.

Right.

And so that's a reason to listen to your show. It's a great name for that.

Thank you. Yeah, there's so many podcasts about podcasting. Right. And I definitely wanted to take that approach, but spin it more for, okay, you might not be the hobby podcaster. Yes, you can get value from my show, but most likely you're not looking to generate leads with a hobby show. So make sure that the content that I'm talking about and the title that I'm using is actually going to attract the right kinds of people. I think that's really important when it comes to naming your show.

I agree, I agree. Like, if it's not meant for that audience, you're gonna find yourself very easily pod fading. Right. You're just gonna quit it because you're like, those are not the right kind of people I'm getting. And there's not a gigantic return on investment for podcasters. Right. It's not as clear and distinctive. So if it's all strategized wrong, then it's not gonna work for you. And you're gonna easily find that you don't have the motivation to keep going.

And I hate when that happens. Like, it devastates me. I know you feel very similarly. I get devastated when I hear that people are like, oh, this is so hard. I didn't realize it was so hard. I'm like, I've been talking about how for years, guys.

I know. I'm so tired of people going like, oh, just start a podcast. It's easy. Please stop saying that. And you don't say that, which is why you're on this show today. Look, it's not the part that you think is hard isn't hard. But there are lots of hard things about content marketing in general. It has nothing to do with the podcast part.

Yes. I mean, and there's so many big name entrepreneurs who are like, if you're a business owner, you should have a podcast. And I would say, no, no, you shouldn't. I think that you need to figure out a few things before you jump into something like a podcast. So, yeah, I'll drop my soapbox for a second.

Yeah. But let's talk strategy. I think that that's really what I want people to hear from you. When you started your first show, which was about e commerce and inventory management, supply chain, you were thinking about the thing of how can I serve that audience, how can I provide them information? So that was that content marketing strategy model. And now listeners to leads and the services that you provide have an alignment with the strategy piece of things. So how do you get people to start thinking about their bigger picture strategy?

Yeah. This is so, so, so important when you are deciding on Wanting to have a podcast or even like shifting your podcast a little bit. I've been talking to a lot of people lately where they've know they're a hundred, 150 episodes in and they're wanting to really hone in on their audience and get even more clear on who they're talking to. Maybe they want to do a mild brand tweaks. The audience tends to be the same. But when you're starting out doing that market research, and this is where a lot of people don't like, this is what people miss. Number one thing they miss when they are launching a podcast is the market research. My team spends like eight hours on a podcast. Market research, it takes effort, it takes time. And we take two weeks intermittently going back and forth between myself, my executive assistant, making sure that everything like, okay, are we actually looking at the right podcasts? Have they pod faded? Here's an example. We had a client where they wanted to talk about GMOs, right? Ooh, cool. Interesting topic. Great topic, Love it. First of all, how is it going to funnel back into your business? Let's talk that, because that's really important. Is this a test for you? How much effort are you going to put into it? Those are questions you need to ask yourself. But then when we started doing the market research, we saw that the majority of the podcasts that are about GMOs actually stop at about 15 episodes. There's not a lot of conversation to be had, even by the experts on the topic of GMOs. And the really good episodes were those like someone being a guest on a health and wellness show. And so we told this client, like, look, it doesn't make sense for you to have a full length ongoing show, a limited series where you cover the topics that you want to cover. You talk to the people you want to talk to, but bookend it, right? Like just kind of make it a bookend. And that way you don't feel like, oh, I'm going on and on and this is not working. Like, clearly it's not working for anyone, right? So that market research is so, so important up front.

Oh, I'm so glad you do that market piece, because that research piece is, I mean, you and I come out of the products world, right? So we come out of this e commerce product world. And if you didn't market research, you are going to spend way too much money and end up with way too much inventory. That's going to cost you a fortune, right? So you can't afford not to do the market research side. So I could see why your brain goes there, but too few people actually do it. This is what I see on the podcasting side. They get their podcasting idea and they think that's it. They think that if they want to talk about it, then everyone wants to listen to it, and they don't always think that all the way through. So I have to say, when I started my first podcast on 3D printing, I never imagined we'd have gotten to 650 episodes. That kind of astounds me still. But I knew we could do over a hundred. Like, I clearly knew that before we started that I knew there wouldn't be a shortage of things because I could already brainstorm a hundred different things. And then when I googled it, you could see that it was in a conversation, or you could go to any of the Facebook groups and you could see conversations happening. Right. So sometimes there are topics and GMOs could be one of them. So you do have to be careful when you do that. Is that. Is it just so new that you're on the early stage of it and maybe you do want to wait a little bit longer, but keep an eye on it?

Or.

Or is it really. It's just limited set of topics, limited set of people who can talk about em, and there's not enough there?

Yeah. Another thing to also consider as you were talking, it made me think of another part of the market research that I think is really important for people to focus on is you're gonna find other people's shows that are doing very similar things. And like, ooh, I can talk about that. This other person's talking about it, though, which then leads to, oh, well, who am I to talk about it when this other person's talking about it?

And.

And I think that main thing that you can do is look for that thing that sets you apart. What's that thing that, like, really grinds your gears? So, like, for me, it was, I want to differentiate myself in my industry. What differentiates me? I don't agree with the idea of launching a podcast in four weeks. I don't agree with launching a podcast in two weeks. We take two months. We do two weeks of market research. Like, that is what could set me apart of that.

Thank you, Alicia. Like, that's all I can say is thank you. But I also guarantee your results are there. So I guarantee you you have less pod fading clients now. It still happens. Their businesses shift. Things happen. It's not like you'll never have anyone. I Don't have a perfect record. But I guarantee you your results are more like mine because you're putting that strategy in place. You're making sure it fits in their business, making sure it's got its differentiation edge, making sure that somebody actually wants to listen to it. Like all of those pieces, taking the time to do that makes a difference in the sustainability of a show.

Yes. And also setting the expectation. Right. So a lot of us go into podcasting thinking I'm going to have thousands of downloads in the first two weeks. Millions of people are going to show up and listen to me. And I am so sorry, but that is not how that works. And I actually had a conversation with someone yesterday. They were potentially looking to hire us. And I was like, let's level set this expectation, like right out the gate. Before you even hand me, you need to know that this is what we can do. This is what we have done. These are the results that we've gotten. And it's a long game. Podcasting is not something that is going to within a month. It's not like TikTok. You're not going to be all of a sudden TikTok famous getting thousands of sales. That's not how it works. It's a long game, long form content, but it can be used a million different ways. It's fantastic and I love it. But I think setting that expectation is so important in really allowing yours and my clients to be able to understand. Like, okay, this is something that I have to actually step up for a while.

So I'm curious because I can just start to see the conversations because I've had them before. It's like this can of worms that you open when you discover and you're in that discovery process with your clients that they think they have a marketing plan, but they don't have a marketing plan. They have marketing tactics or they have a marketing mission, but they have no plan. Right. How often do you get into that situation where you're like, let's get down to the marketing basics of where you are and what we need to fit together.

And I know that you're very particular in the people that you let into your clientele as well. We are very particular. They have to be in business for a while. It can't just be like, hey, I have the money, take my money. No, I'm sorry, I love you, I will.

Because they have to know what works and what doesn't work. Right. And it may not be fully articulated into a really clear content marketing plan, but they've tested enough to understand what works with their audience. They understand who their audience is.

Yeah. They're not at the beginning phase where they're trying to figure that out. And if they are, I tell them, go guest on some podcasts, go talk to some podcast hosts, get on some shows, see if podcasting is even a good idea for you. Do you have an established audience? You're not gonna see really great results right away if you don't already have an established audience. And like, these are basic business things. This is from coming from like a business degree, a marketing degree, as well as like seven years in manufacturing. Like, these are things that businesses do that I think a lot of entrepreneurs are like, I have this great idea, I'm going to run with it. But there's so much more that goes into it that I don't think we really consider as you're saying that.

What I'm thinking is, is that it's too often that I hear from large businesses, businesses with 50 employees or more, for instance, where they have not even considered podcasting as a model, which is, I think, a mistake personally. And I think that's your ideal audience, to be honest with you. So what do you talk about as the return on investment for them? Because they think, well, podcasting's for an entrepreneur, podcasting's for a celebrity. Podcasting is not for a company.

Yeah. So we do work with some big companies as well as some nonprofits. And so there's a few different ways that they use them that is very different than the normal entrepreneur. Right. Norman entrepreneur is looking to do more of like one to many, getting more reach, getting out into more spaces. Whereas the business owners that we tend to work with and the nonprofits we work with, they're more about brand awareness and creating more of a clearer picture of what it is that they stand for, who they're actually serving. So their return on their investment tends to look like being able to have those one on one conversations with their ideal clients. Right. So podcasting is a great way for businesses to do this that I think a lot of entrepreneurs could learn from that. Right. Like what are your goals for your podcast? Is it actually to get listeners? Which I know you have feelings on this. I do as well. It's not about the listener's guides, it's about the connections you're making, those conversations you're making, the conversions that you're making. That is what it's about. So making sure that you're actually being intentional, that's what you can learn from these businesses. But then the nonprofits, they're also looking to expand to even like senate levels, talking to people who are higher up in political stances and things like that, where they can have those conversations, bring more awareness to those spaces. And so we tend to work with people who are like, more on LinkedIn than on Instagram and TikTok. You know what I mean?

I agree with you right there. Like, that tends to be more of our client base as well. And but I think what you're pointing out, like, on the nonprofits, I see that this multiple level of things, one is this, that it's really hard to keep your donors. And I say that from that level because it's not investors. There are like top level sponsors and people you have long term relationships with that are always keeping your nonprofit going. The super fans, if you want to call them that. Right, the super sponsors. But then at a donor level, it's really hard to keep them engaged. And if you're not constantly in front of them making a donation pitch, it's really hard to get them engaged and involved. And a podcast is a great way to do that. But then if you're also using that podcast with another layer of strategy on, it is like, hey, I want to have conversations with these people about our area, whether it's health and wellness or GMO or whatever that is. But I can't get them to have a conversation with me because they're thinking I'm lobbying them. But if I have a conversation on my podcast, no problem. It's all set. Right? So that multilayer of strategy is essential. And I don't know about you, but we don't always do it all at once. I do think it through the path for them, but I don't always have them do it all at once. What about you guys?

Yeah, no, I definitely agree. I usually end up telling clients to do it more in, like, chunks. Right. So this quarter you're going to talk to this type of guest and we do strategize with our clients on the types of guests they're going to have. Does it make sense for their actual listeners? Does it make sense for their goals of their show? We also talk through, like, all right, long term, what programs do you have coming up? Who do you need to have in place to promote those programs or to promote those things? So that way it makes sense to have them on before you need to start talking to them now. And so I definitely agree. And my brain works very similarly where it's like, zoom out, see big picture, and then Zoom back in. All right, where do we need to take this?

Well, because if you give it to em all at once, it's too much for them. Right. And also because the show has to build. So let's talk a little bit about that. Cause I wanna touch on the three things that we always talk to everybody about. And listener growth and engagement is like the big area that everybody's worried about.

Right.

Like, and obviously you're talking about listeners to lead. So if you don't have enough listeners at all or enough of the right listeners, you're in trouble. So what is it that you think are some of the most effective ways to determine whether or not you have the right listeners and grow that.

Yeah. So I would say the first thing to look for, and I know you've talked about this on your show as well, is what is that listen through rate? And so I was just talking to a client about this earlier this week. We were looking through those numbers and I was like, your solo episodes are getting a lot more listen throughs. They're getting listen backs. Like people are engaged with that content. That's an easy way. Without being like, call me to your listeners to get that information. Right. Cause it can be difficult. I get it. It can be difficult to get your listeners to engage with you outside of the podcast or to take that next step with you. So what is the data actually telling you to do? What is the data telling you that you need to know in order to create the right type of content? So that would be the first place is look at what those listener rates are and see what kind of content is resonating with your audience. That tells you right there. And then the second thing is do make that call to action for your audience. Even if you're not seeing a lot of people come back and talk to you. It will grow, I promise you. If you keep asking and keep saying, hey, if this resonated with you, send me a dm. If you thought this was interesting, send me an email. I want to talk to you. There's some something about being a podcaster that creates what I like to call the celebrity effect, where people meet you and they fangirl hard it is.

They do.

So weird.

I have, I've been at events where people are like, would it be okay if we took a selfie together? I'm like, yeah, like, like I'm nobody. Like, oh, yeah, sure. Yeah. But it's an unusual thing and I think from an audience perspective, it's like, really reach out. Tiffany Kane. We were just Talking about her before this call. Tiffany is right here in this area. And it took her like almost a year of knowing about me for her to actually talk to me. And we live in the same town. Like, how am I unapproachable? But there's something about the podcasting host position that gives you that authority level.

I think what it has to do, and I've talked on this at length, is the idea of, and I think it's even more than just video or blog writing, that what creates that deeper connection is you're with that person in their most intimate moments. Right. So your listeners are listening to you while they're driving to work, while they're driving from work, while they're walking their dog, they're doing dishes. And so you're with them throughout their day like a friend. And so, I mean, when I would listen to podcasts, I can't anymore. It hurts my ears sometimes just to listen to somebody.

I have a hard time retaining it now. I do. I feel for you. This is a job hazard, no pun intended on my last name here, but it is. It's a job hazard. Those of us who are podcast strategists, we've over listened to shows.

Yes. But when I did, I would listen in the shower. So, like, literally my most intimate moments possible, these people are with me. And yes, I would totally fangirl if they were like, hey, Alicia, I'd be like, what me? It's me.

They know me.

Like, they don't.

So it means that you do have to do what you're saying, which is reach out more and offer that opportunity. Because it's not something that as a go to. In their mind, you think I'm giving you all of this content, so I'm being generous with it. It's like you still haven't offered them the opportunity to connect with you and they need to hear that.

Yes. And like invite them. Right. Even if it's not into the DMs. Say it's a co working opportunity that's just virtual where like maybe once a month you just invite them into your space. Or maybe it's a getting to know you for the listeners, like, hey, I'm gonna answer any questions you guys have. Let's hop on here. Something like that, where it just takes them to that next level where they can engage with you. I also have one client where she does this really well. I don't have the mental capacity to do this, but she does it where when she's on a show and she sees a Spike in her new social media followers, she will actually send something out to them of like, hey, where did you find me? Just to start that conversation, like checked out your page. Here's this point of thing that we might have similar. Did you hear me on this podcast? Awesome. I love that you listened to me there. Did you have any questions about what I said? So it's from a place of like serving and interacting and just creating that.

Engagement and it's inviting it in a greater way. Because there's a lot of times we don't ask the question, it's coming across our mind and we think, oh, we'll follow you. But we haven't actually reached out to ask the question. That's burning.

Right. And like make social media social. Right? Yeah, that's what it's for. Exactly.

I love that. Is there anything that you found is really like even if it's a paid program or something where you find that listener growth is happening? I mean, look, I get like a hundred a day, I swear that I know are junk and spam and like not going to do anything for you. But have you found anything that you feel works?

Honestly, the only thing that I believe works and can help with allowing you to grow and like those listeners stay is to be a guest on other people's podcasts, create those connections with other podcasters that have similar audiences and that's where you're gonna see that long term growth.

Oh, I couldn't agree more. I keep saying that and I feel like a broken record. So thank you for saying that.

You're welcome.

So let's talk a little bit about that guest model because I think that. Do you teach your posts how to find the right guests? Would you have some principles on screening for that?

Yeah. One thing that we definitely make sure is that just like any type of content that a business owner is creating, you kind of have these what people tend to call content pillars. Right. I call them your content buckets because I have an 8 year old and a 5 year old and we go to the splash pad and you just like imagine that big bucket it that just like falls down and splashes everybody. It runs through all those funnels. That big splash is your brain. All of those brilliant ideas that you have in your head of like, ooh, yes, I want to talk about this big question. Does it belong on your podcast or not? Is the question, should I just let.

That one fall to the ground or should I put a bucket under it? Right, right, exactly.

So how do you filter those guest ideas or those Guest topics through something that allows you to then have better conversations that are actually gonna be beneficial for your listeners. Right. So we have one client where instead of doing those content buckets, like, I like to have a list of. Okay, let's dial back a bit. So mine are podcast marketing, podcast monetization, podcast content, and then I also throw in podcast launching sometimes and mindset, which I know you've talked to Tiffany about as well on the show. Right. So, like that mindset piece, I think people miss that a lot behind podcasting and it's so important. So everybody go back and listen to that episode because it was fantastic.

It was great on that topic. Exactly. Well, I think that it's that I'm going to call it that cold start model that people get nervous about on a podcast, but you're working with businesses that are already established, so they already have clients, they already have partners, they already have employees. They already have these things in place, and they shouldn't be as daunted by that. If I start a podcast, I don't have any guests, like, who are gonna wanna come on. Because you already have a reputation.

Yeah. But they get really distracted.

That's where the mindset comes in.

Right. Like, it's just so easy to be like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna have this person on and I'm gonna have this person on. It's like, let's dial it back a bit. Okay. Is your guest list diverse? If that's one of your values, then how can you make it more diverse? You want to talk to someone about this topic, but you have maybe like two old white guys in a row. Maybe we switch it up a bit. Maybe you find someone else to talk about that topic who's still an expert and can still offer value to your audience. And so it kind of allows the host to really take into account. Okay, yes, I'm a business owner. Yes, I have these, like, biz besties and these people that I can talk to and like, these people that I am like, buddy, buddy with. But how can you also expand that? Right. Because the podcast isn't just about, yes, you're creating content, but it's about creating those connections that you can then take to the next level with partners, with collaborators, people that might in the future potentially work with you. So I think that it's really important to expand, not just, okay, yeah, I know what I'm talking about. Here's my list. Here's my list of people. It's going to be great. Really get clear what your goal is for your podcast so that you can actually achieve it without getting distracted by all the things that podcasters do tend to be distracted by.

They really do. I think that that's such a good point that you're pointing out there, because really, the thought of if you're not using your guests as leads to or as expanders in your business of your thinking of your viewpoints, of your network, of your community, then you're making a mistake. And one of the great values of podcasting.

Yeah. I was recently talking to someone where she's like, well, it wasn't a fit to work with us at all. And I told her straight up, like, yeah, no, I don't think that we'd be a good fit. I think that you should go this direction. I'm happy to do a strategy session with you and we can talk through strategies. And so one of her things was, well, the podcast is just me having conversations with my friends. And I was like, yes. And like, yes.

And I like that.

Let's take it a step further. What about you're talking to people who have incredible stories. You know how many millions of people have incredible stories? There are Facebook groups that you can go to to find people, places like Podmatch, where we met, where you can find people, social media sites that you can go and people like, it is possible to expand who it is in your network, which then can lead to more opportunities for you. Like, it's a win. Win all around.

Absolutely. I'm so glad you said that. Well, let's return on investment and monetization, because I think that that's probably a big point of conversation with a lot of your clients, because if a business is deciding to spend their time on podcasting, it's a question of not just the money that they're spending, but the time that they're spending. And is this going to have a return for the company where entrepreneurs, I think, are a little bit more willing to take a risk, try something. Right. It's a test. Business is a little more conservative. So what do you see as your own return on investment? And then maybe you said monetization. Right. So some people clearly have that in their head.

Yeah. So for my own, I've been able, in my podcast, I use it specifically for those listeners are going to eventually work with me in some capacity or talk to someone who might work with me in some capacity. And so I've gained two clients that are ongoing from just the podcast, like back to the fangirl thing. Literally got on the phone with me. I didn't have to pitch them anything. They were like, oh, my gosh, Elisa, I listened to your podcast and it's fantastic, and I love what you're doing. I'm like, where do I sign? And I was like, slow down.

Yeah, this needs to be a fit.

For both of us.

I think that that's one area I'm going to call it return on investment monetization that people clearly don't measure, which is having less pre calls. Right. Like having less phone calls to close a client. Right. That happens all the time from podcasting.

Yeah. You don't have to sell them because they're already sold. They already know you, they already like you, they already trust you because the things that you're telling them are getting them results. If they're already taking action from your free stuff, they're more likely to take action from your paid stuff. And so for, say, the nonprofits, Right, that we're working with, what is that return on investment? That would be them being able to have those conversations with, say, someone who's had their lives changed due to their nonprofit, which then leads to someone saying, hey, I heard that story. I want to donate. There's a spike in donations after sharing that story. We saw this with a client recently where she shared her own story and got a huge spike in engagement where it was like, you know her as, like, the leader, but it made her more personable, it made her more real. And people were like, I wanna be there. Like, I wanna stand with her. Let me know more about her. And so, like, things like that. We had another client where they had someone and they sold, like, group programs and things like that. So more of the entrepreneur side, where someone binge listened 19 of their episodes in three days and then signed for $6,000. Group program, like, things like that.

Yeah, I mean, the power of binge listening. That's why my show is called the Binge Factor, because when we find that that's happening, the monetization model is clear. Like, it's clearly coming through. Whether it's the speed of them buying from you or it is upgrading and buying more from you, those two things could be happening.

And that's not gonna happen. Back to what we were talking about in the beginning, that doesn't happen in the beginning when you don't have a back catalog for them to binge. Podcast listeners are bingers, and so you're not going to see that in the first two months, which is why we tell clients, don't even look at anything for the first three months. Please Please don't. We'll look at it. Please don't look at it.

Yeah, give us some time. Right. But this is also why it's a slower start in podcasting. And I think that you setting that expectations with your client base is essential because you're telling them you're in it for the long haul. But it's clearly why we see it, like, start to really ramp up after 25 episodes.

We just do, yes, 100%. So then even taking it a step further for, say, the businesses, so we have one client where we actually do audio and video courses for them. And so they're doing more of, like, a certification style to their business model. And they're a real estate investment firm. I never thought in a million years that I would be creating a podcast for a real estate investment firm.

No, I can tell you, I probably.

Have 10 of them. So.

Yeah. Yeah. Like, that was an area that grew for us first in real estate finance. And I was kind of shocked. But we have not found overlap yet.

There you go.

We're still going. It's like, yeah, really? Okay.

Yeah. And like, their way is like, all right, we're going to do these limited series. We want to educate our audience during the off season of our courses and our programs and when we're training people and, ooh, we have this really interesting topic that people are really getting engaged about. Let's do a whole series on that. And so it creates that extra aspect. I was just talking to a client of ours who she works with health providers, like psychiatrists, but where they own the building, and then a bunch of psychiatrists work for them. I don't remember how to phrase that, but you guys know what I'm talking about.

That someone out there does.

Yes. Where each of them are doing webinars. I had no idea that, like, psychiatrists and therapists were doing webinars. I was like, that would be a great way to do a limited series podcast. Why is no one tapping into this?

Like, you know what I mean?

Like, come on, turn those webinars into podcasts. Like, reach new audiences with the content that you're already creating. Like, if you're already doing it and it's something that people can just listen to, they don't have to see you. Right. To be able to get the results and feel like, ooh, I connect with that person. I want to work with them. And this is something that I definitely have seen a lot with. Like, the shift in AI, right, Is like, the bias that can come with AI. And I think that audio allows anyone who looks like anything to get their message across. And I love that so much. Like, there's no bias.

I think I've given like six lectures already in just the last two months alone on AI and why. Podcasters are going to be at a great advantage, and it is simply because you cannot remove the emotion from the voice. It's not possible. I mean, there are some AI tools that you might use that might over edit it to the fact that it doesn't sound real anymore. That's a mistake. But for the most part, you can't remove the emotional impact of what you're saying. And when that lands into my ear at an intimate time in the day, as you were pointing out before, my message has greater advantage than anything else they will read or see, especially when their brain is going, is that real or not? It doesn't happen when we hear a voice. And so we're not questioning everything. Right. Every time I see an ad, every time I see a marketing email, I question whether or not it's real. Is it a scam? Is it real? And if we're always coming from that place of skepticism, then no messages are able to land in the right spot. However, podcasting doesn't work like that because it's not being pushed into you. Right. You're choosing it and then you're listening to it and you know it's real.

Yeah, because you trust the person. Right. You listen to enough of their episodes to say, I like them, I vibe with them, I align with their values and what they say. Yeah, let's go. So I love it.

I wanted to tell everybody. So I review probably a dozen podcasters a month, so I check out their shows. It's my model for everything. I listen to at least three of your shows when with PodMatch, because Pod Match does such a great job of matching us up. I only do an initial check and then I wait until we're about to interview so that it's fresher in my mind. But a lot of times before it was like, I'd check you way before and then I'd have to refresh myself on who you were. And I was like, that's more work. So I do like this model of it. It was like, all I have to do is do a quick check of a few things just to confirm that I'm hearing what I'm reading is accurate together, and so the match is accurate. But I knew instantly that it was when I was reading your stuff. And so now that I listened to your show, I started to get into this place of, like, your binge factor is the epitome of what I want to see in a podcast is you do it all right? There are red flags that happen in a lot of people's shows, like, things that they just don't do well and that they don't realize that it's having a counter effect to what they're doing. And I try not to point out the good things that they're doing and then give them a nudge in the direction of where they want to go. But here's what I hear in your show. I hear your perspective. I hear your fabulous advice. I hear you talking directly at and on the level of the people you want to attract. And that doesn't happen often in a show where you get all three of those things in the right place. And it's why I'm very sure that your listeners are turning into leads and clients for you, because all of those are in place and built together. So if that is not. How do I say this? If it's the example of what you're doing for yourself is what you do for your clients, this is a win, win for all. This is why they should work with you.

Thank you.

And that's built into your show already. So I do have to ask you this, though. You don't do that many solo shows. You do them every, like, four or five or, like, they're kind of spotted throughout here.

Yeah.

Have you checked your own statistics on that one?

I have, yes. And so there's not much of a difference in my solos versus the others. And really, my goal with the solos was to kind of create a content bank of way, like, content that I could personally repurpose into a bunch of different ways. And I found that I get winded after, like, 20 minutes. Right.

I don't do solo shows longer than 20 minutes unless I have a co host. I agree with you.

Just, I can't. And I'm at the point now where it's like, I've already said this. Go back and listen to that episode. I've already said this. Go back and listen to that episode. And yes, I have some solos that I'm planning up. But last year, it was like, okay, I wanted to do a solo every other week, and let's try to keep with that format. This year, it's shifting more to, I want to be on more podcasts, which means that I need to interact with more podcasters, which means that if I can invite them to be on my show, then I Can see is this a good fit for me to be on their show. Doesn't make sense for me. After we have that conversation of hey, I saw that you haven't had anyone to talk about X, Y, Z. Would you like me to come on your show to talk about that? Like no pressure, you can let me know later. But there's already that reciprocal effect there, right. Of like we've created rapport. You like my energy, I like your energy. Let's keep this conversation going. And so that's more the strategy of yes, I still want to create excellent content. I'm also able to because of the style of my show. Yes, I am amplifying these podcasters. I'm amplifying what their show is about, but I'm also talking through how they started and how they keep going and that allows me to still show up as the expert, which does not happen with a lot of guest shows. Right. That's something that I should be really careful about.

Yeah, it really does is that sometimes that they don't shine enough and so people don't understand, oh, she's providing services, I need to work with her. Right. And so it gets confused in the process. And that's why I do like to have this show here. There's a whole sister show. I say sister show, but I don't know, I probably should call it like the parent show. Cause it's Tom and I. But like there you go. Feed your brand is our show with all the solo topics. Right. Do it here. It's just a little bit different model so I don't have to do it here. But this shows intertwine all the time. So we're getting it. We're just doing it in a different model. But if you're open to it, I would love to share an idea that I have for you. So I prefer to offer to have someone on my show first. If you see that that happens. Like you came on my show first. I'm going to be on your show. I think I've signed up for it. Yeah, it's going to happen. And so anyway. But I invited you on my show first and I like that because it puts us in a place of I've given first but also because I know that I have great promotion and follow through. It's a built in part of my process and team. If you come on my show, we build a great rapport and we want to have a follow up conversation. Anyway, we now have that set in the future when I come on your show, we're going to have another conversation. But I've also. In that time, I will have promoted you. I will have given you all my tools. You'll actually experience what we do as a company. And what I find is this. Between the time that I invite someone on my show and then I go on their show, they've either already decided to have a conversation with my team, or in that call, they're like, how do I get in touch with your sales team? And so they become a client. And that happens in that process without me doing anything, but having been the first to give. And of course, our process is there. Right. Like, I know that what we've got is good, but I think that might really work for you as well. So rather than putting the mission of guesting is that your guest selection is a podcast swap.

Right.

Somebody who already has a show, but by inviting them on, they're absolutely going to reciprocate later. But when they see what you do so well and how you think it's going to actually make for a better show. Also, because I find there's a lot of podcasters out there who don't do their homework. You on my show first, and you didn't do your homework, though I'm very sure you do, because I can hear it in your show. Right. I'm very sure you do your research, but there are lots who don't. The first time that will happen is if I'm on their show and they're meeting me for the first time and they have no idea. They didn't do any homework. They didn't even read my bio. And so that's not good because you don't get into the conversation fast enough and into. They're still trying to figure out where to take it.

Yeah, and that's why I actually take, like, the first 15 minutes before the recording. And I'm an enneagram. One which, if you guys know anything about that enneagram, that means, like, there's my way and then all the wrong ways to do it. And I'm highly disappointed with anyone if they don't do it my way. So I just go into the conversation. This person's never listened to me. They don't know anything about my show. They don't know what we're talking about here today. And I will set them up with everything they need to know. And that way, it can make for a better conversation. That way, we're already, like, jiving, but.

You'Re still doing the heavy lifting where if it went the other way, then you don't have to. They already know you. And so I always do think that. So that's my approach. And just what I find is that, honestly, sometimes I don't. I want to be on their show. So then I just. Like, way out. It'll eventually happen. But that's okay. You didn't have to disappoint them and turn them down.

Right.

You just.

Yes.

It eventually falls off the calendar.

I love that.

So I think there is just too many podcasters come in with wrong mindset, wrong expectations. What's the best advice you can give them to sort of shift that, to get them focused into that. Right. Model that right path to get started. Right.

Yeah. So I would say the first things, quite frankly, talk to someone.

Don't do it all alone.

Don't do it alone. Like, hire someone like Tracy. Hire someone like myself, someone who has been there, done it. Even if you talk to someone who has a podcast and you're like, look, can I just buy you coffee and talk to you, please? Like, something like that, where you get an idea of what it actually takes to have a podcast before you jump into it headfirst. I don't want you to pod fade. I know Tracy doesn't want you to pod fade. And yes, it can happen, but, like, let's not happen right away.

Yeah, let's make it task 25, please.

Yes. Be strategic about it and go into it with intention, just like you would any other content. Like starting a YouTube channel. You're not just gonna start it. Like, no one does that. No. You have to have intention and do it with purpose. So that would be my number one advice, honestly. Talk to somebody. I agree.

Like thinking that you can handle this all by yourself, even if you have sound background and all of these other things, there's so much you're not considering. And having a guide along the way, having someone to help you strategize at the beginning is even more brilliant, which is why I'm glad you have your company and your business. Thank you. Thank you for having that. Well, before we go, is there anything that is on the forefront for how you look at podcasting, how you think about podcasting, things that you want to test out and try, things that you see going on that you're really excited about.

Yeah. So I know. I feel like you talked about this on LinkedIn recently or maybe someone else did. SEO is the future of podcasting, and I cannot, cannot stress that enough. And so we are focusing really heavily on SEO for our clients to ensure that for searchability not just on Google, but also on these podcast listening apps that our clients episodes are getting found. Because with millions of episodes out there, millions of podcasts out there, like, we want to make sure that the content that we're producing is actually getting seen. Right. So that's like really important to us. And then also really just taking the business to the next level of being able to step back more into that strategist role rather than being in the day to day, which I'm very excited about, and being able to like enjoy that and like do what I love, which is like telling my clients what to do pretty much.

Well, I look forward to you telling more clients what to do. I have to say that because I can't wait to hear the resulting podcast.

Yes.

Well, Lisa, thank you so much for being on the show. Really, really appreciate you appreciate your contributions to the podcasting world. Listeners to Leads must listen.

Thank you.

I think the perspective on this idea of business podcasting is right in line with so many people that I touch and so many people that are following us and following the show and subscribing here, we're looking at getting more from our show. And one of the things that we really need to do very well is drive that into leads and this model of making sure that we're taking people off of our social feeds, we're taking them off of our podcast feed, we're taking them off of where they are out there in the world and bringing them back in to our ecosystem, to our home base, to our lead generating mechanism, whatever it might be. It might be our email list, it might be our lead generator just trying to get to the opt in form, whatever it is that you are going to do with that. That idea that they come into our community is so critically important here. And I'm glad that there's a person and like Alicia gathering that up for her clients and gathering that information up and sharing that with you on her podcast. Listeners to leads. There really is such an important part of this. I'm going to call it the cold start model, which is a common terminology in technology. We really need to expand our ability to get both parts of our platform working together. Too often we have one but not the other. So we may not have leads, but we have clients. And so how do we get them to do both? How do we get our clients just help us lead generate and how do we get leads that will lead to more clients who will lead generate for us? Right. So like there's just a whole bunch of this cold start we Gotta get both sides of our platforms working together, and that's really out of balance. And it's why too many of you go starting on TikTok and starting on Facebook and starting in Instagram and starting in these other places is because they claim to have a lot of people out there, Right? But are they a right fit for you? Is this the right system? Is this the right place to be in? And if it is, that's fantastic. Start in a place that has more. That's why we started with podcasting. Right? Start in a place that has listeners who are out there seeking information. But when you start attracting them in, you've got to continue that filter down from listeners to weeks. Right? You gotta continue down that whole path. So Alicia has a lot of great tips. I hope that you really learned a lot from this episode. Go follow her, go listen to her show. There's lots of wonderful things over there that might be perfect for you. So I'm excited to bring you another podcaster every week here on the Binge Factor, but you are need to be a part of that process too. You have to let me know what kind of podcasters you want to hear more from. If you love listeners to leads, tell me that so I can go find more great podcasters like Alicia. Just let me know how we're doing here and what you want more of. You can reach out to me anywhere on social media. You can go to the binge Factor, send us an email straight over the site, fill out a contact form. There's 101 different ways to reach me. All you gotta do is google me and you'll be able to find me and contact me. And of course, as always, you can join me and my partner, Tom Hasard. Yes, same last name, my partner and husband. And we are live every single week for our feed your brand podcast. That's the sister podcast to the binge Factor that talks about tips and tools and tactics of marketing and promoting your show and all the things surrounding your show. And we do that every single week live and on Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, YouTube. I think we're everywhere. Yeah, we're everywhere all at once. So come check that out. Every Wednesday at noon Pacific time, we are live, live posting our coaching call and recording our feature brand episodes. We'd love for you to join that as well. Thanks, everyone for listening. I'm Tracy Hazzard and I'll be back next week with another great podcaster, just like Alicia Gilotti. Listeners to leads.

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