The 7 Essential Steps From Idea to Product with Tracy Hazzard from Hack the Entrepreneur Podcast with Jon Nastor

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Welcome to Hack the Entrepreneur, the show which reveals the fears, habits and inner battles behind big name entrepreneurs and those on their way to joining them. Now here is your host, Jon Nastor. Hey hey. This is Hack the Entrepreneur. Thank you so much for joining me again today. I am your host Jon Nastor, but you can call me Johnny. My guest today is a retail product manager, 3D printing expert, writer and an entrepreneur. She is co founder of Has Design Consulting where along with her co founder and husband they have designed over 250 retail products that have generated more than $750 million in revenue. My guest is also a contributing writer to Inc. Magazine and she co hosts a podcast called wtfff. Yeah, it's a wacky name. Don't worry. We get into this. Now let's hack. Tracy Hazard. I want to take a moment to thank today's awesome sponsor Casper Mattresses. Obsessively engineered American made mattresses at a shockingly fair price. And now you as a hack the entrepreneur listener can get $50 towards any mattress purchase by going to Casper.com hack and using code Hack. Listen, you spend about a third of your life sleeping. Let's make sure you're doing it on a good mattress. Casper brings together two comfy technologies together for better nights and better days. Latex foam and memory foam. So you've got just the Right sink, just the right bounce, no matter how you sleep. And they've got a risk free trial and return policy. They will deliver it straight to you and you can try it for 100 days. If you are not happy, they will pick it back up at the store. Maybe you get a minute to try mattresses with Casper, you'll get to actually sleep on it for 100 days. It's $500 for twin size mattress and $950 for a king size mattress. Comparing that to industry averages, that's an outstanding price. So now's the time to get a new mattress. Get $50 towards any mattress purchase by going to Casper.com hack and using the promo code hack terms and conditions apply. And get your $50 towards any mattress now at Casper.com/hack.

We are back with another episode of Hack the Entrepreneur. And today we have a very, very, very special guest. Tracy, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much for having me.

It is absolutely my pleasure. I really have a good feeling about this one.

Me too.

Let's jump into it. Let's jump into it. Tracy, as an entrepreneur, can you tell me what is the one thing that you do that you feel has been the biggest contributor to your successes so far?

I think for me as an entrepreneur, I know when to hire the right resources and that's because too many times I didn't hire the right resources and things went phenomenally wrong.

So when you choose to hire the right resources, they save you money, they speed you to market, they. They help you avoid a lot of risks. And knowing that and when the right time is to do it, you need to make the money to make that happen.

Yeah, I think you're right. This is where we usually find it out too late. But how.

Did you learn or how do you continue to learn when to hire the right resources?

Well, on one side, I am the right resource. And so many people come to me and it's too late for me to help them. So I see it from that side as well. So we get a lot of product inventors and other things who come to us and they've spent hundreds of thousands of dollars and they have tooling that doesn't work or product that's just sitting on a shelf because it didn't function properly and they thought they were being safe. And this happens with manufacturers in the US and Asia. So it's not exclusive to a specific country or difficulties with that. And they come to me and I'm like, well, you just spent all your money, now you don't have any money to hire me to fix this problem. But if you came to me before, I guarantee you we would have spent half that. So seeing it from that side really helped me. But also because early on in our we invented the stylus pens for handheld computers back in the late 90s, and we went to a local manufacturer in New England and we thought, well, this is great. We'll source locally. This will be really easy for us to maintain. We'll be able to visit them and see how goes. But they'd never made pens before. And so shortly after the first run got shipped out to all of our customers. And it was a really big deal. And we were in business and we were super excited about it. The pens started exploding. Like, they started popping apart right at the joint. And so we were like, what's going on? Well, it turns out they messed up the threads because they. And they were the wrong direction. So they would literally unscrew as you wrote. Yeah. And it was because they didn't have experience doing pens. They had great injection molding experience, but not doing pens. So we have always made it a policy since then. And I guess, lucky I learned that within the first five years of my career. But that we really try to hire someone who has walked in our shoes before, been there, done that, at least in the category, and recognized when we know we're asking them to do something they've never done before.

Yeah. Okay, so this. I need to go into this because this is really. I know for a fact that you are right, that people. So first of all, it was like completely. I didn't expect you to say that. You've seen it from the other side when people come to you as the right resource. But this is something that people do. Right. Especially, I mean, I know my listeners. I know just people around me in this sort of creation and entrepreneurship space, we come up with ideas of things we want to invent or create. Right. And it seems like most of the time it's gone about in the wrong order.

Exactly.

So what would be your recommendation for somebody who comes up with, say it is a pen again, that this special new way to create a stylus pen didn't exist yet. And now somebody had this idea. Do you think that they should go find somebody who's been in this before? Because I know people are going to be like, well, I don't want to share my ideas.

You know, we get that a lot. And we have 35 patents. Actually, we just filed 36. So it's for us, the way that we do it is if we have something so secretive and so inventive, we split it up between manufacturers, but always with manufacturers that know what they're doing for the particular product type or material type we need. So that way you can, in the early prototype days, you can hide it. And they don't know what they're making. So that's just an easy way to do it. We always file provisionals and we make sure we. And we don't even really bother with non disclosures most of the time. I know all the attorneys out there are just going to send us nasty hate mail, but we don't because they're not really enforceable. Because, I mean, are you really going to have the money to sue them? Especially when you're a solopreneur or an entrepreneur. Exactly, exactly. Yeah. So that's how we do it with the protection side. But speed to market is so much more critical to protecting your idea than anything else. So if you hire the wrong people or you try to do it yourself and it takes you three times as long, you're more likely to be to lose your innovation than you are if you get it to market fast with the right resources.

I like that. Speed to market. And don't worry about the attorneys. They've stopped listening a long time ago because I kind of make sure they do. We don't want them around here. We don't like their paper shuffling.

So that's cool. And so the provisional is for. That's not trademark, is it? That's.

No, that's a patent. Yeah. For utility patents, we don't really do that. For design patents, we actually don't file that many design patents. But if there's something unique in the way it functions, we do that in 3D. Design copyright applies. We do file official copyrights when our product's done. But your copyright is protected from the moment you design it in the computer, so that works as well. People who design apps and coding, it's copyright.

It is. But again, it's. Do you have the resources to go fight it when you could really be spending your time, energy and resources getting to market quick?

Exactly.

Yeah. That's because, I mean, people can take your code and do whatever they want with it. By the time you figure it out and get them to court and win and get any money from them, the market's been saturated or.

Well, and I have a personal experience with that. So we, we know that when you win, you lose. So it distracts your business, it costs you a tremendous amount of energy and Money. And at the end of the day, you will not end up with any money. You might cover your costs for having hired lawyers and filed your. If you settle, you might. But chances are pretty good you'll get $0 out of it.

Yeah, that's when you win, you lose.

I mean, we were talking about those stylus pens. So we were infringed upon by Ideo and Palm computing in 2001, and we did take them to court. We didn't go all the way. We had no money. So all we did was file the initial filing. We didn't even do any discovery, nothing. And it cost us $5,000 at the time. And that was all we had. And at the end of the day, they settled. But they settled because they were trying to go public and there was a lot of pressure and there was an indemnification clause and, you know, it was a whole bunch of circumstances that made it go our way. But at the end of the day, they killed the product. So any royalty stream from that just disappeared.

Wow. Wow.

So we learned early on exactly why you don't do that.

Exactly, exactly. And that's, that's definitely the rule, I think, that people should follow and learn. Let you learn that for them rather than trying to learn themselves.

Exactly.

All right, Tracy, so I went back through your career and you've been. I would like to, I think from the outside that you've been entrepreneurial for probably most of your life at this point, but you also worked for a lot of other great companies doing other things, but in the last almost seven years now, you've been full time in this. So there. I know going through it, it doesn't always make sense, but looking back, often it does. So I would like it for you to kind of answer me about this time in every entrepreneur's life when they realize sort of something about themselves. And it's either that they have this calling to make this difference in the world, or they found that they've just kind of somehow become unemployable. I would like to know which side of the fence you see yourself on and when it was you discovered this about yourself.

So, yeah, so I have worked for some great companies very early in my career. That's exactly why I wanted to be. I wanted to be a corporate designer and have a high powered career like that. And I worked for Milliken and Herman Miller, you know, great design based companies. And I thought this was going to be exactly where I wanted to be. And then my partner, who is my husband, invented that Stylus pen back in the late 90s. And he said he wanted, and he always wanted to be an entrepreneur and he's an inventor by just nature and he said he wanted to do this. And at that moment I was kind of a little unhappy with what was going on in my career. And I said, well, if you're going to do that, I'm not going to let you run the company because you can't do it.

I got forced into that situation of being co partner and entrepreneur at that time as we started up a business, you know, kind of right before the tech bubble burst. And you know, and so we got forced into this business and I felt like I was good at it. And even though there were lots of circumstances and everything, but it was also really stressful and risky to have both, both people in it. And I have kids so, you know, have that at the time seems so much so we were happy to have time off after that. After we sold it, we sold off all our intellectual property and you know, it ended well. But I had had enough for a little while and so I actually took some time off and started blogging and writing. And he went to work for a company but he was so unhappy because he always wanted to be an entrepreneur. But seven years ago he got fired and it was at the worst time, it was 2009 and I was two weeks from delivering a baby. And the only choice we had because some extreme situations that happened with that he had a non compete and they were suing him and it was horrible. And I'm about to deliver a baby and so the only choice we had was to tap our networks and get the first project we could take. And it launched this business that we didn't know we were going to be in. So I was dragged back into entrepreneurship and dragged back into a partnership at a time that I expected to have my little sweet miracle baby and just have this great little time. And so. But it's really in the last, I'd say two years that I found that I love it.

Wow.

That I absolutely love it. It is my calling. I'm good at it. I have so many people I can help with how I do things. So yeah, now I don't want to do anything else.

That's awesome. I love it. And see, that's what I mean by it seems like these stories don't make sense as you're going through them, but then you look back and it's like, there it is. That totally makes sense.

Yeah. But I think I had to go through all that risk, I had to go through all of that and see it from, I call it the dark side. See it from that dark side of it to understand how to design a process that does it differently.

Right, right. Okay, I need to go back a little bit again into this answer because it's really good. And I love the idea that you are co founders, you're partner with your husband. Partners, I've said, and I'll say it again, need to be as polar opposite as they can be because it's the most benefit to have that. And so at the beginning, your husband has always wanted to be an entrepreneur and go into business. You said.

That you're not going to let him do that because he wouldn't be good at it. And then a couple of minutes later you said that you felt that you are really good at it. So what did you see about your husband? Not to offend him. That's not what we're trying to do here. I just want to know, because I think this is why you guys are successful, is because you are polar opposites. But why is he no good at the entrepreneurship? And then you. And then what do you see in yourself that makes you good?

Yeah, I wouldn't say that he's not good at entrepreneurship. He's very good at designing and inventing and doing all of these very sort of self propelled type things. Things that, you know, you have to be very driven to do, of course. So from that side of it, he's very good at it. But at the end of the day, an entrepreneur is building a company, building a business. And so he is a little more on the product and invention side of things, where he's focused on the what and not the how. And so I feel that I am much stronger at building the how, what.

That's awesome. That's awesome. And I really didn't mean to put you on the spot.

No, that's.

I thought it was just. I thought there was going to be a crucial thing there and you actually made it even more crucial. He's focused on the what and you're focused on the how.

Exactly.

Wow, that's awesome.

And we both. But the difference is, and this is what people who aren't in business with their spouse or it doesn't work for them. We have the same why, our same purpose. We have the same mission. We have the same direction in life. Our why is to build a great life for our family. Our why is that we want to help other inventors and entrepreneurs from making the same mistakes. We've made so because we have that same why our paths are aligned. And too often partnerships get misaligned paths.

And to me, a partnership is a marriage whether you're actually married or not. And so that all in commitment's required. And thankfully for us, that is easier.

I love it. I love it. So the what, not the how, but you have the same why. That's awesome.

There you go.

That's really cool. That's really cool. Okay, so in your business as an entrepreneur, you say that you know when to hire the right resources. That's your one thing. Now, every blog post, every expert, as you probably know because you write for Inc. At this point, but everybody talks. 80, 20, right? Do 20% get 80% of the results. Do what you're good at. Delegate the rest. Tracy, I would love it if you could tell me something that you're absolutely not good at in your business.

Ah, that is so I am not good at delegating. I mean, I can hire the right resources things, but I am not good at delegating. When it's these small tasks, I'll be like, I'll just get it done. And so it's those little things that bog you down really quickly in your business. And that's the one. I'm at that stage where I'm like, okay, I have to take my own advice and I have to do this, and I have to get myself a real assistant, and I have to let go of these things.

What's your next step to doing that?

Right now, it's finding the right person. And we have a home office. So we're about to break out of that home office in the next couple of months. So I think when that happens, it's the right time.

Nice. I like it. I like it. Okay, so let's move to projects. Yes, Projects is a very loose term. Take it as either just a new even product that you want to create or even with the podcast, how you decide to start that whole new project. But I would like to know what your process is right now and whether that's an internal process you go through, Tracy, or a written process. But what is the process you go through to judge an idea of a new project and decide when it's worth your time, energy, and resources.

So I'm so glad you asked that question. It's exactly. We've honed this process over 24 years, and it is exactly the sequence we know works every time. And it pre screens and causes and forces fast failure at the early stages before you spend a lot of Money or a lot of time. And so we, it's. We call it the seven 7P steps and it's prove it. And so we actually, we actually don't make anything at that stage. We're really proving a concept of something. So we might have to draw something, but we really don't go that far. So we're checking market and product fit or market. And it could be market and podcast fit. It doesn't matter what it is. It works for products and services. And so we prove it and then we go on to our next step, which is really where we start to plan and we start to look at where might we need these resources and who they might be and where's our risks in the process. And so we kind of identify those. We call them launch land mines. And so from there we go on to price it. And that's really the key for us. That is that sequence that most people do out of order, that step. And so we actually price something before we make it, before we design it, before we prototype it. And because of that, we make sure that it will be a right fit. And that's so critical. And then we prototype it and then we patent it or protect it. It depends on what it is. But sometimes those two steps overlap as you're prototyping. You have to patent or copyright or do any of those things. And then we go on to predict it. And here's yet another step. You realize we haven't gotten to the seventh one and we haven't made anything yet officially. And predict it is where we forecast and where we really figure out what happens if this explodes. Because the next most common problem we see besides pricing, making everything go wrong, is when you grow too fast and you can't achieve the volume. And this happens mainly because we're in the mass retail world. You're talking about high volume, tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of units. So. And then we produce it. So then we make it. So that's our seventh step.

Wow. So prove it. Plan, price it. Prototype, patent or protect it. Predict and then produce.

That's right.

That's awesome. So is it true or correct that you would at any of these, whether it's step one or step four, if it doesn't move past there, is that where you determine failure and move on?

Yeah, we always have a gate. It's a gated process. So there's always a review, revise and reject stage there. And you know, we might table something at a stage and come back to it. It happens all the time. It's just not the right time for something or we don't have the right resource and we know we need it, so we keep looking for it. You know, it just depends. But we never completely reject something, but we never keep working on it either. And that's, I think, a mistake people make.

Oh, okay, I see. So because you said you use this seven step process, the 7Ps, to force fast failure, is that right? Yeah. Forces fast failure, which is really, really cool. How do you, how is it to determine that? You determine when you're going in that direction. Even if you're just at the proving it stage, if you feel something in your gut is right and you don't prove it right away, how is it you determine whether you need to kind of push through it? Maybe this is another piece. Push through it to keep. To prove it or just take it as feedback that it's a bad idea?

No, that's a great question. So I. With 3D printing, for instance, the market's not really ready for what we have to offer. We can design amazing consumer products via 3D printing, but there's no retail store that wants to carry our designs yet, so who's going to pay us to do it? So we looked at that and we said, well, we're too soon for the market, but we believe really strongly this is coming and this is going to happen. What should we do to continue to position ourselves to be ready for that market? And that's exactly why we decided to start a podcast. And so we put a. We lay groundwork if that's. If it's not ready yet, and a way for us to continually test that market to prove it out. And when it hits a. A proof point where we say, ah, it is ready, then we go forward. And we've done that. And it's been almost a year, and right about now we're just hitting our proof point, actually.

Wow. I love it. I love it. That's awesome. That's really smart. And now you're building up an audience with that.

That's what we thought. We, you know, we're ghost designers normally, so you don't know that you're buying our products that we designed in the mass retail world. But once you're a 3D designer, it is your design and you're right out there. So we thought we had to build a following first. And so that's what we did.

That's awesome. All right, Tracy, this has been an absolute blast. I want to wrap up on one final question for you. This idea I'M calling the entrepreneurial gap, meaning that as entrepreneurs and dreamers, because we're always projecting our successes into the future, oftentimes, no matter how successful we look from the outside, from inside, we feel like we live sort of in this gap where we are never successful, no matter what we accomplish. If we set a huge goal in a month or three months or six months down the line, right before you hit that goal, you're going to set bigger, loftier ones into the future to continue pushing forward. And sometimes we end up in this gap. So you've accomplished a lot. You got to work for some brilliant companies coming out of school, which probably felt like a success in its own right, and then moving into now creating a lifestyle sort of business and successful brand with your husband working from home. Up till this point, it looks like it is an absolute success. But I would love if you could stop and turn around, look behind you. Everything you've done and accomplished up till today, the highs, the lows, the win, the losses, and tell me how you feel about it up till this very moment.

You know, I think if I would say, was it a resounding financial success? I'd have to say, no, I don't. I mean, like when my business for Stylus pens, we sold it off and we made, you know, returned a moderate investment to the angels who, who helped us out there. But I never felt like that was a success, even though at least I, you know, didn't go bankrupt in the process, you know, But I didn't feel like it made the money that I wanted it to make. So I look back and I think that there are various things over the time that I didn't quite make as much money as I should have, or I didn't feel like it was as successful from a financial perspective. But I do feel very successful as a person. I feel very fulfilled. I have a great family. I love working with my husband. I love the people I meet every day. I love my clients. So from that, I feel extremely successful and also really grateful.

Awesome. And you should. You absolutely should. And we're always going to feel, I think, that things, I mean, weren't obviously perfect and didn't work out exactly as we wished, but that's why you get to move forward.

I think it's kind of an inherent part of just taking a lot of risks. And so, you know, it is. It's always going to be some up, some ups and some downs, and you've got to, you know, overall, you got to look at it. But, you know, I If you feel successful as a. As a family person, as a husband, wife, whatever it is, you know, I think that, at the end of the day, is more important to me.

I absolutely agree. I absolutely agree. All right, Tracy, we've got to talk about your business and also your podcast, which has possibly the greatest name of a podcast ever. We've got to talk about them in passing, but could you specifically tell the listener where to go? Find out more about both of those.

So you can find at my business, which is hazdesign H A Z Z D E S I g n hasdesign.com and that is our design consulting, and it also has links to my Ink articles. And then wtfff, which is the name of our podcast, which stands for what the fff. And FFF is fused filament fabrication, which is a really geeky term for 3D printing. And so it's kind of an inside joke, but we're really focused on people who want to learn how to 3D print or want to learn about 3D print or who are building businesses, because we do give a lot of business advice around 3D printing.

Awesome. Is that not the greatest name ever? It is.

It's fun.

Yeah.

It took my mom a while to figure out that I wasn't swearing. I was like, mom, have you listened to the podcast yet?

That's supposed to be the point of it.

I know.

So it's hasdesign.com hasdesign on Twitter.

Yes.

And WTFFpodcast. I'll find a link to itunes, and I will link to all of that in the show notes for you, as well as Tracy on LinkedIn. So that way, when you are done working out or walking or driving, whatever it is you're doing right now, you can track them down on Hack the Entrepreneur, and those links will be there for you. So, Tracy, thank you again so very much for taking the time to stop by. I really, really, truly do appreciate it. And please just keep doing what you're doing because it is awesome and inspiring to watch.

Thank you so much, John. You keep doing it, too.

Thanks.

Tracy. Thank you so much for joining me. I really, really, really, truly, truly do appreciate the conversation. I had a lot of fun, and I'm glad that. I'm glad we got to do that. So I hope you out there enjoyed that as much as I did. It's. It's interesting. It's the idea of, I don't know, like, as a consumer, I forget that these products are designed. They don't just. It's not Even just that they're invented by somebody, but then they're also designed to become a better product, to sell better, and to affect the customer in a more sort of meaningful and impactful way. And that's what Tracy and her husband do. I think that's really, really awesome. After this great conversation, I got to go back and listen to. Listen to what Tracy had said and how she had responded to the questions. And so there was 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 things I went back and listened to, and they were really good. And so I got rid of two. So I got it down to four, and then I went back again, and I got it down again to two. I went back one more time and I listened and it was just there. It was this one thing that Tracy said that was so very clear to me when I heard it. Did you get it? Did you hear it? Let's do it. Let's find the hack.

An entrepreneur is building a company, building a business.

He is a little more on the product and invention side of things, where he's focused on the what and not the how. And so I feel that I am much stronger at building the how.

And that's the hack.

Tracy, Tracy, Tracy. I love this. I love this. And you out there listening, I wonder if you knew that I was going to pick this one because even when Tracy said.

Kind of knocked my socks off, as they would say. So there's a couple things really, really important here. So if you are the inventor type, if you are the person who comes up with those ideas and can create those, but it's so essential to admit to yourself, if you are not the entrepreneur, not the business side of things, it's not it, it. It's a weakness. As in it's not one of your fortes, one of your strengths, but it's. It doesn't matter. It's irrelevant to like the overall you as a human being. But you have to admit that because so many brilliant products, so many brilliant inventions, so many brilliant things never get. Get to see the light of day, never get to get the audience that they deserve because there isn't a business side person behind them doesn't mean that the product isn't better than the thing that even ends up on the shelf and sells millions of versions of it, because that just had a better business person. So you need to know this and admit this about yourself and take it as that's cool. That just probably makes you a better, more focused inventor and creator. So partner up with somebody, but don't partner up with Another inventor. Partner up with somebody who is the entrepreneur who can build the business. This is key. This is very, very, very, very key. Because an entrepreneur does it. Builds a business, builds a company. Focus on that. Give them a product, they will take it to market and they will sell the crap out of it. This is what you want. So I love that. I love the idea of partnerships always. I'm big into partnerships. You know that about me or you should. But I'm only into them when you come from polar opposites, when you really can work together and you each have different strengths that can be brought to the table and used to make the company better, stronger and just more, more, more able to succeed. And it's so, so, so essential. And then I love the idea this might help you if you are that type of or to figure out even what type of person you are. Think about it. Are you more of the what do you think always about the what or do you think always about the how? That to me, that's awesome. That's profound. So E Myth, the E Myth Revisited is a book that kind of pivotal business book was written, I believe, back in the 1990s. And it was this idea. It was started like in construction and contracting and stuff. And it's kind of the like business that I grew up in as a kid and I saw this, I see this all the time still, is that people have their craft, so they have their trade of being a carpenter or a plumber or something or a graphic designer. And they're so focused on the what. They're so focused on their end product that they don't think about the how of building a business around it. And it never ever gets to be fully developed. The E Myth Revisited. Excellent, excellent book. Kind of makes you look and step outside, step back, give that 30,000 foot view sort of of your business and your actions so that you can systematize things and make the business grow. Really it makes you think like the entrepreneur and sort of takes you out of that, the just the what it is you're doing. So I love that. Tracy. I love the clarity of the what versus the how. So thank you very, very, very much.

All right, that was fun. Thank you so much for joining me. I really, truly do appreciate it. Hacktheontrepreneur.com is the website. Head over there, get onto the email list and check out the show notes. I'll link to the E Myth for you because I think that it's great. And the WTFF podcast, I think I have enough Fs in there. But yeah, stop by the website, check it out if you haven't yet either. Itunes, it's a great place to leave a rating and a review for the show. It helps so very, very much. 313 of you have done that so far and I thank you for it. If you can leave your Twitter handle there on itunes so that I can go and thank you on personally on Twitter, I would love to do it. And I'll follow you too. How about that? Good deal. Good trade. Is that a trade? We're not allowed to trade for reviews. So I'm not actually trading you. I'm just. It'll just friends. That's what we do.

All right. I won't take any more of your time. I appreciate you stopping by. I truly, truly, truly do. Take care of yourself. And until next time, keep hacking the entrepreneur.