This Kid Podcaster Can Teach You A Thing Or Two About Being An Entrepreneur With Benjamin Wong(Podfaded)

Wish you were one of those influencers with raving fans who binge on your every word, consume all your content, buy everything you have to sell, and demand even more. Then stay tuned while Authority magazine columnist and buzzfeed contributor Tracy Hazard shares strategies, tips and tactics from top videocasters, podcasters, authors and social influencers on creating that bingeable factor. Now let's join Tracy as she explores how to rise above all the digital noise with the Binge Factor.

Hey everyone, welcome to the Binge Factor. I'm Tracy Hazzard and today I don't have your typical podcaster at all. In fact, I've got a really young podcaster and he is full of energy. I have a 14 year old podcaster who's got multiple shows. Doesn't that put you all to shame out there? And you're thinking, I'm having so much trouble getting my own show off the ground and this 14 year old gets three off the ground in a couple of years. He's just amazing and I can't wait for you to hear from him. So I'm going to introduce him right away. Benjamin Wong is the CEO of Kids CEO Media, a youth run communications company dedicated to uplifting the growing community of young entrepreneurs. Ben is also the host of the podcast Young Trep with Benjamin Wong where he interviews renowned entrepreneurs and experts on topics ranging from sleep health to career acceleration. Additionally, Ben is the host of the Kids CEO Podcast and the co host of two Kids on the Block. And by that he means blockchain cryptocurrency. NFTs some really cool topics that he's getting into and its first co hosted podcast. So this is just so much fun. I loved meeting Ben. He was introduced to me by Mark Hirschbrook who is one of my favorite guests because he was like a serial guest, right? He didn't have his own show, but guest on so many shows and a lot of times when he comes across a podcaster that just wows him, he has to introduce them to me. And Ben was one of those. It took us a while to get our schedules coordinated and get this episode going, but I'm so glad we did because we have so much to learn from that young generation. So let's hear from a nice young podcaster tearing up the podcast world.

Ben, you know I've been waiting to talk to you for quite some time since Mark Hershberg introduced us and I absolutely loved the idea of talking to a kid CEO and a kid podcaster. And so. And now you're on your third show now with which is just amazing. So tell me a little bit about how did you get kicked off doing this podcasting thing. What inspired you?

Yeah, Tracy, it's great to talk to you today. So it all kind of started a while back. I like to say 2015, maybe 2016, around that time. And so my entrepreneurial journey as a whole started with avocados. And I would just sell avocados on the street to buy things like Funko Pops. And then when I got a little bit older, I want to say my 11th birthday, I got into stock trading. And so from there I went around to all my friends and was bragging about how I own Nike and how I own Disney, because I had one share of Disney stock that my uncle gave me and I made a few good moves. I mean, there were like $20 gains, but for an 11 year old, making $20 out of nowhere sounded really cool. And so I. I would kind of brag around to all my friends about all these huge profits that I made out of nowhere from the stock market. And then I was talking to my mom about this and my mom was like, you should start a podcast. And 2018 wasn't the beginning of podcasts, but 2018, I think was a little bit before.

That was still pretty early, you're right. Yeah, that was still pretty early on. You could get ahead of the game there.

Yeah. And then the podcast really took off like last year, you know, year before. And so I think it was 2018, but I never really got to it until about 2019. And so the idea was kids CEO podcast creating entrepreneurial opportunities. And it was about, I guess in general entrepreneurship, but also about investing. So the first five episodes I interviewed my mom, who's an entrepreneur. That was my first ever interview. I talked about like stocks, mutual funds, all that good stuff. And then I did that in 2019, October. And so I kind of took a pause there after like five or six episodes. And when quarantine came around in March 2020, that was really when I kind of got back to it because I had all this free time now.

Yeah, Extra time at home. You got into it. I love it. I love it that you were doing that. So you got like 48 episodes in kids CEO by the time we're recording this. You've got the Young Trep podcast, which has 35 already. And you've got a third one, which is blockchain cryptocurrency NFTs, like all those really cool hot topics called two kids on the Block with a co host. So you've really got all the shows going. Are they all going at once or are you kind of like tapering one, starting another? Like, how is that going for you?

So they're, they're kind of tapered. Young Trap I'm on a little bit of a hiatus to record a bunch of episodes now, but we're trying to get that back up in February. And then two Kids on the Block, we record that every week. We're recording tomorrow to release Friday. And that one's with NFT stuff. So it's a reoccurring thing. Talking to you about news and then Kids CEO. I haven't touched that one in a little bit, but there's a bunch of content there. I'm looking to kind of get that one back up and rolling.

You got to kind of balance them all. I have seven shows myself, so like, I know that they need to go. They like Ebb and flow. It just does. Like there'll be times when you don't do them. And so, yeah, it's just so great that you're still finding time to do it though. Seeing things are a little bit more back in swing here. What I want to talk about is a little bit of this sort of multi show dynamic. How did it happen that Young Trep came about and why do multiple shows? What did you see the benefit in that?

So the first time I ever ran. This is an interesting story. I've never talked about this. So basically up until that point, I released a podcast episode on kid CEO almost every single week from late March of 2020 until December, almost every single week. And over the summer, me and my neighbor friend Noah, we basically wanted to take what we did with Kids CEO. And Kids CEO was very niche. It was for entrepreneur kids. It was a minority, but the idea was that we could have multiple shows talking about different things. So the first time I ever did two podcasts was we had another show called Fireflies and that was basically a kid debate show. And the idea was even though we're small, we have really bright lights, kind of like Fireflies. And so that was the first time I ever did two podcasts, but back into the current. Basically the Fireflies is kind of like a limited thing. We did like seven, eight, nine episodes and that was that. But I did the Kids to you podcast solely until January, I want to say, of 2021. And then I did a summit for that podcast. But then basically at the summit, I was approached to create a new podcast in partnership with Kipreneurs.org and the Torren Brothers to create another podcast that was a little bit more actionable, advice based. So whereas Kids CEO was a lot about stories, and it was kind of just whatever I felt like that week we put it up.

I love that you've got actionable advice on Young Trip, and that's the one that I listen the most to. So when you interview people, when you interview other kids who are entrepreneurs, there, you're really getting them to give advice. And I think that that's really critical because you can listen to a lot of entrepreneur podcasts from a lot of us adults out there. Right. And it's not how you're going to do it. It's not how it's going to work for you. I can give you all this advice, but I got a team of 100 people. It's not going to work for you on your show. Right. So you need to come up with ways at which you can get it at your level. I think Kidpreneur Academy did a really smart thing by choosing to sponsor you. And I think that's something that we all have to think about when we're out in the business world, is that partnerships, maybe we're not always the best person to reach our audience. Maybe it's someone who's right in the middle of everything, like you, Benjamin. So I just love that that's the approach you took. So now you're 14, you kind of got this little podcasting empire going on here, but how is it really doing? What kind of measurements do you look at to say this is working successfully? I'm going to keep doing it.

Yeah. So that's kind of interesting thing that I've learned really recently, or more of a revelation, basically. So by conventional terms, by traditional metrics, Young Chop is doing well. But Kids CEO, looking back on it was, it was doing better, but by traditional metrics, it wasn't amazing by any means.

It's not Joe Rogan numbers, right? Not Joe Rogan numbers, but who has that right? You know what I found that was.

Really interesting was though Kid CEO wasn't traditionally like, it didn't. It didn't become the Joe Rogan podcast. It opened up so many doors that would never have been possible without it.

So that's a measurement in and of itself.

Exactly. Like today, the Young Chat podcast was the only reason why I was able to find them and connect with them was because I did a podcast. Some of my closest friends who are also entrepreneurs, philanthropists who are my age, they live across the country. The only way I would have Met them was through being able to reach out to them, interview them on my show. Both that bond and while I didn't realize it at the time, some of those people that I interviewed way back when are now, like, opening up so many business opportunities for me.

So, yeah, you've built this giant network that's across the country now. Yeah, love that. So you've got opportunities that have come your way. I like to call them authority because they've created, like your authority within the industry creates these opportunities. And then you've got network now going for you, too. So you've got two really great things that you didn't leverage and couldn't have paid to leverage. Right. Because you can afford that in your young entrepreneur days. Right. So you couldn't have afforded that either. So those are great things that you were able to access from podcasting. Anything else.

Those are the main ones. And I want to stay on that real quick because I think a lot of podcasters, myself included, worry a lot about the numbers. And like, listener, I mean, because it's hard to quantify these other things. So the only thing you do see is the amount of followers you have, the amount of listeners you have. And these are very numerical numbers, but they don't always translate to the true consequences of a show, which is the things like networking and meeting people. Who knows, one day that person you met on your show might turn out to be your best friend, turn out to be a business partner. Who knows? But these are like secondary results, but they're so, so, so important. Right?

And, hey, publicity results. Right. So you also get to be on my show because of how you did the network you created because there was a guest on your show who recommended you to me. So that's how that works. Right? You get other opportunities that to create more opportunities for you, and especially when you're starting out or especially when you're on a low budget, finding ways which you can create those opportunities. And those networks are more valuable than most people recognize. So very amazed that you were able to realize that so early in your journey, which shouldn't surprise me, Ben, because you have been on an accelerated path since you were 11 here. So I love that that's where you're going. So I want to comment on a couple of things, because a lot of times I'll review somebody's show and I'll check them things out, and there's a couple of things that we notice in them that I'll say again and again in evaluating a show that they shouldn't have done. One of them is put your face on the COVID art. But in your particular case, you need it. I need to know that you truly are 14, that you truly are this young entrepreneur. I need to know that I need to see it visually for myself. It's critical that you did that. It's not the best choice for a lot of other shows out there, but it is the best choice for your show. And, and so I want to point that out. And then it's also really strikingly, especially your young trap. It's like super bright yellow in the background and it just really has nice contrast. It stands out among the other shows and that's really important. So one of the things that I notice in the marketplace is, and I hear this a lot from networks, that there's a growing youth audience and not enough shows for that. So have you, over time, even on your shows that you're not diving in and doing weekly or you're not as diligent about, are you still seeing listener growth?

Yeah, for sure. All the shows are gradually increasing in the amount of listeners. I think there's. Compared to a year or two years back, there's so many more kids who are open to listening to podcasts now. The podcasts have almost kind of become a little more cool now to listen to podcasts and stuff like that. You know, it's definitely been a huge help because now podcasts are so much more accessible. A lot of these celebrities and people look up to have their own podcast. So it's like that's kind of cool listening to podcasts and then being able to have podcasts run by kids. Because a lot of the guests on our show don't normally talk to kids. Like Evan Carmichael we had on the show. And he's a huge motivational YouTuber. He only humanely, I would say 99.5% of his audience is like adult entrepreneurs. And so being able to have these world class experts talking about advice for you is a really rare thing. So I think that combination of being a kid when the youth audience for podcasts has grown and being a kid podcaster in that who has a podcast for kids, that had just been a tremendous combination.

Yeah, absolutely. That I think this is something that a lot of people don't get an opportunity to be a part of. And there are niches growing, but are you in a growth niche? And that's where you are. You are in a growth area that is only going to take off more and more over time. And the fact that you have multiple shows gives you, when you were saying you didn't start at the beginning of podcasting, the reality is, is that you started at really the height of youth joining podcasting. So you're actually really an early adopter, and that's good. I think you're going to start to benefit more from it, and I think all your shows will benefit from it. So I have a couple of shows that they ran their course. I did 150 episodes of Product Launch Hazards and WTFF, which is about 3D printing. We did 650 episodes. That was our first show and we started that one back in 2015. So, like, we were early on there. But that one, they still have listeners every single month. And it shocks me in the growth area because there's still a gap in the marketplace in the niche that they're in. And that's what I think is going to happen with you. There is a larger growth amount of young listeners, but there's also a lot of growth in young entrepreneur listeners. I think we're starting to see a lot of that because you guys are the generation who's coming to see total disruption in the workplace.

Right.

So what are you going to take away and what are you going to bring with you? Now? I have two young daughters and they, they do think it's cool that mom talks on their microphone all day and they would like to be on their microphone talking all day, but they don't want to do a podcast. So, you know, I keep hoping they will because I think they'd be great at it, but we'll see. So do you get a lot of kids coming to you, asking for advice and saying, how did you start your show and what'd you do and what should I do?

Yeah, that's been a really great consequence of creating the podcast and doing everything I do on social media is that a lot of kids do ask me, like, how do I create my own podcast? How do I create content like you? And so I've tried to hone on that a little more. I post reels about, I do these kind of quote images for my social media, and people type up and say like, oh, this is so cool. And so I've been trying to like, make it a lot more. You can relate and make it yourself. So I post like DIYs on how I made this image so that anyone can then, oh, I like that. And then they can go and make something similar or use that concept and do something. But in terms of podcasting, there's definitely like my young trap One of my video editors. He's like 12. He just turned 13 and he was doing video. He still does video editing for Young Trap. He's starting his own podcast. So he's been.

He got inspired. He's like, if Ben can do it, I can do it, right?

Yeah. And it's really amazing. And so he is starting his podcast. I think it's about like politics and it's coming out soon.

I love that. The kids show on politics. This is just awesome. So what advice do you usually give them?

At first, I've had. There's a lot of pieces of advice, but the greatest thing I ever learned was I think it originated from Guy Raz. I'm sure you've heard of Guy Raz. And this goes for a lot of things, but podcasting especially focus on the small percentage of really engaged listeners. So when you have a podcast, there's a portion of listeners that are like the super listeners they listen to the end of every.

We call them binge listeners here. That's why it's the binge factor, right?

Yeah, exactly. And so there's that. The binge listeners there are small percentage. I was literally talking to my mom about how this applies to my social media because I have half a followers. There's about 20 of them that are super engaged and like they DM me and. And they go to my weekly kids CEO calls. And so it's like 5% was about the number that. And I've been on a few other influencers and looked at their profiles and it's like the 5%. So I'm going to call this the 5% rule. And it's like the 5%, the binge listeners, the super engaged ones, the ones that are subscribing, leaving you reviews, that are sharing your stuff on Twitter, on Instagram, and instead of spending a lot of your time trying to market, you can still spend time marketing, but really try to engage those 5%.

Sometimes we call them in the entrepreneur world, sneezers, which is awful in a viral world, let me tell you. But that's what we used to call them. And they're the ones. They're the super sharers. And so that's where you benefit from it. So first off, you're in their ear so constantly that they quote you, they mention you, they share you with your friends. And so that super engaged group is the group that's going to help get the word out for you. And I love that that was the advice you took, and that's the advice you give, because I Think that's extremely valuable because too often we focus on like the tactical, like how to start your show and. But do you have someone to talk to and like will they be super engaged when you talk to them? I think it's probably more important, right?

Yeah. And like if I tell you to go listen to the ABC show and I love the host, Jonathan and I love what they do, you should go listen to the ABC show. That is worth so much more than if the ABC show did a Facebook campaign and randomly got to 50 other people like that 5% of the binge listeners, they're the superheroes of our show. And if you can really engage them, which is making better content, finding ways to interact with them, that's like way, way, way more impactful than running a bunch of Instagram ads and everything like that.

So now you have a show with a co host and so and you've had a little test run, now you have a co host regularly. Do you find it different? Like is it harder? How does it feel and what kind of tactics do you use that are different?

Yeah, it's definitely been a change. It's a nice change because I initially started just talking about myself like monologue style. I would talk for 45 minutes about stocks and have a script I did some non scripted, some scripted. And that was I initially started there like a monologue, me in my closet with clothes around me and iPad and just like talking into it for 20, 30, 40 minutes, reading a script. And so that's what I did first monologue style and then I did interview style and then I more recently tried out the co hosting style. And so being with the co host is definitely a different ballgame. It's nice because me and Kameya, he's a 12 year old, my co host and he's very different from me in that he's very analytical. Like if you listen to the show, he talks a lot about like explaining things. He explains like what is the blockchain? These concepts, what's the difference of Solana? He talks about gas fees, how Ethereum works, all that good stuff. Whereas I'm more of a. What's the opposite of analytical?

You're more of that sort of passion people like. Right.

The qualitative stuff. So whereas he talks about what is bitcoin and how does the blockchain work Me, it's more. Here's a project that I really like and my prediction for this is that this will do this because of these things, but they're not as stat based. They're more of human psychology. Behavior based.

Yeah. That's fantastic. So you're balancing each other nicely out. Is it hard to record with a co host though? Because it's pretty simple by yourself. Right. So do you find it harder?

Yeah, I'm still working on it, definitely. Like, I don't consider myself a master at co hosting it, but I think the biggest thing for me is because a lot of times in podcasts, we want to talk a lot. Like, we want to be the ones that talk. And so I'm really trying to work on that. Is really listening a lot more.

Are you in the same space when you record or are you separate over zoom?

Over zoom. He's in Canada.

He's in Canada. So, yeah, I just gave this advice to someone in our office today who, because his the first time he really co hosted with someone else over zoom. And I was listening in and trying to evaluate it, and there's a lag time on Zoom too, which makes it difficult. And so if you're just recording, you need to have the video on. Cause you need to see each other's faces. That's essential because you need to read the other person. If they're getting antsy and excited and want to say something, you can see it in their body language.

Right.

And so you have to pay attention to those visual cues. And it's a lot harder. So I've co hosted almost all of my podcasts except for the binge factor here is co hosted with my partner and husband. But we know each other really well. We've been together for 30 years. So, like, it's not that hard to read the body language. Like, it's just easy. And normally we record sitting next to each other. So, like, there's also, like the touch cue. Like, I can touch him and his arm and he'll say, oh, okay. He'll wrap it up and I'll give it to me. So these are things that, like, you'll discover over time and I'm sure it will get better, but it is harder when you're in that distance world and you got to navigate zoom.

Yeah. And like you said, like, building the chemistry. I don't think we'll ever have that same chemistry as you and your husband, but, like, slowly building that bond. And I've got a lot closer with him. Like, you just got. I sent him a Christmas present and he just got that in the mail today. Christmas. It's a little late for that, but that's okay.

You gave him a present. That's wonderful. So. But that's so true. That chemistry builds over time. And you get better and better at podcasting, and you get better and better at co hosting and all of these things. You know what? It just takes diving in and doing it. Do you think that holds a lot of people back, that they're intimidated because you're doing so well, You've been doing this longer than me, that kind of thing. So do you think that happens to a lot of kids?

Yeah, for sure. I think there definitely is that fear side of it, of entering this new scary world. And I think that definitely impacted me. Even now, sometimes I'll listen to something, especially in the beginning of every show. Like Two Kids on the Block, our first episodes, I liked them, but I had just met the guy two weeks ago, so my chemistry obviously wasn't as much there. And so there wasn't a whole lot I could do about that yet, because we just met each other like two weeks to a month ago. And so I think a big thing for me was being okay with not perfecting it and just releasing it.

Yes.

And understanding that the core content is there. Right. The core important information and content is there. And over time, we'll get better at communicating it. But hopefully people stick by us. And so that's definitely a big challenge for a lot of kids, for a lot of adults in the podcast world. Something I'm really still working on is being a little less perfectionist and being more okay with releasing content that isn't perfect yet, but still is valuable and being able to get that out to people.

I love that. Well, I'm gonna ask for some more advice now. Cause I'm gonna hit my three questions, and I'm always trying to be transparent with my audience. Cause this is a podcast for podcasters to learn things and to get some success t out of it. So in transparency, I use these three questions on social media. There are part of our social media plan and social media strategies. So we use video clips from them on TikTok, we use them on YouTube shorts, so Instagram stories. We use them all over the place. So that's why this is the only repetitive section to the show that I use with every guest I have. And we do this for a reason. It used to be five things, like a half a year ago, and now we only do three because we discovered it was just too much content to share on social media. So now we're down to three. So the three things that I ask everyone, Ben, is how do you get great guests? And how do you decide that someone's going to be a great guest.

I think a big part of getting great guests is the host, because I really believe that everyone out there has something, whether it's a piece of advice or a topic that they're super, super passionate about. And I think, first of all, you can find a guest, and there's so many guides out there about, like, how to find guests and those websites. But I think the key to putting to getting a guest and producing a great episode with them relies more on the host and the host being able to extract that flame topic, whether interviewing a kid entrepreneur and what they're most passionate about, what they talk about the most, they get excited when they talk about how they got started. Maybe more than their actionable advice, they're really passionate and really good at storytelling, then it's up to me as a host to capitalize on that. If they love their story and that sounds a little weird, but if they really love talking about their story and it's a good story and they're a great storyteller, being able to understand that as a host and then sit on there and using my curiosity, let it go.

Let it go right like that to take on. What I want to do is point out what you did there. It shows a great guest. And what you did was you took my question, which is a generic question, and you turned it into something that you felt you could answer uniquely. So you turned it into, instead of getting great guests, because you can answer that any which way. Right. It could be about how, I guess, how I actually go about doing it. I can answer it tactically, or in your case, you were tying it into what you're passionate about, which is really making great content for your listeners. And so how you tie the two things together to make that guest a great episode, you just tie that together beautifully. So I want to share that with the audience, because sometimes when we're new hosts and I'm not a new host, but sometimes when you're a new host, you don't do that well enough. And so if you get a great guest on who does it for you, that's fantastic. You're really lucky. Right? So this is the kind of thing you want to get out of a guest, is it? Just what Ben did there. So he's not only a great host, but a great guest, too. So let's go on to number two, the number two thing that is. And you know, this is the thing. It's like, it's one of the hardest things for every podcaster I've Talked to is how they get to increase and get more engaged listeners. How do they encourage that with their show?

I think I'm going to go the opposite direction and just answer this one directly. I think creating engagement with your listeners is a lot easier now than ever before. Because one, you could go the direction of creating a discord channel or a Facebook group where people can react and ask questions that you can answer. And most podcasters release content about the episode. You're probably going to release a video clip of this and put it out there, and then there'll be a few people who leave comments and then basically engage with them in the comments. So that's a pretty direct answer to that question, like, how do you engage your listeners? You could start a Discord or Facebook group every morning. Good morning, everyone. Tracy here. What did you guys think of last night's episode of Ben? Do you have any questions for him?

That's what most people don't do. So they put out their podcast kind of passively, right?

Yeah.

And that's what you've done by focusing on those super listeners, you're focusing on making sure that you're engaging with them. Because at the end of the day, that comment, that back and forth thing that you're doing with them is creating a better environment, a community that is going to serve you well. And other people are going to be like, oh, watching you comment back and forth and say something. They want to be seen on social. Right. They want to be heard. So they want you to comment back. They don't want to just hit a like button. It's passive.

Yeah. And again, remember that it's like 5% of your listeners. If you have a thousand listeners, a thousand people aren't going to wish you good morning every day. But there's the 5% that will respond to you good morning. Or that will listen to this episode and ask, ask, wait, Ben. Or they'll ask me whatever question. It's that 5%, like every single person to leave you comment, asking something every single episode. But there's a sub niche of those binge listeners that are going to be asking me those questions. And then like one time it was late at night, like 10:30, and I released a piece of content about NFTs and what they were. And there was a guy, he's a kid, I think he's from like India, Africa, I want to say. And he was just asking me, like, what is.

Well, that explained the time change, right?

Yeah, they didn't. I. And so he was asking me, I think we went for like 10 replies. I replied to him and he replied back to me.

So you were having like a whole conversation over social. Right? I love it when that happens. And when you're there for them and you answer questions. It really was the key to our 3D print podcast taking off now because we could answer those questions, and when we answered them, we didn't just give a casual answer, we took them seriously. So if we miss something in our interview, we'd say, you know what, we're going to find someone for you. And we would go ahead and do that. We'd go find the next expert for them. So that's a way to take the engagement, take the feedback and do something with it. And really, it does, at the end of the day, inspire more listening. Because if that guy just only listened to one episode, he's likely to now listen to your others because you offered him the opportunity to get some other details right.

Yeah, and like, I never really met him before, and he probably listened to a few episodes of probably two kids on the block, those about NFTs. Maybe he listened to Young Trap Kids CEO and he just commented once and then I responded to him and then we went a few times. And now that guy's like, I think he, like, he comments on every single thing I do.

He comments on everything now. So, yeah, you created a super fan.

Exactly. And I've considered your Discord. Again, there's that 5% rule we have. About 5% of people who follow me are in the Discord. And the Discord is made up almost entirely of people who have listened to the show or seen my content who then leave a comment or DM me. And one guy DM me about, he wanted to interview me for his podcast. He was starting out suggest to it and now he's also a lifelong listener and fan and a few more people with that same kind of recipe. So I think with engagement, it's relatively simple. Either start up a discord or take your existing content and just engage with every single person in your comment section. I mean, that's really the easiest way to do it.

Such great advice. I'm so glad you said that, Ben. The third question I ask everybody is about monetization. And this is the thing. You're an entrepreneur. You want to make some money here. And it's not always a clear path, as you know, because you might not have the tens of thousands and twenties of 1000s of listeners that are required to really make money off of advertising. So there's alternative ways to look at that. But you got to be thinking a little bit of how am I making money and where am I going to make money in the future? And where do you think that is for you? It may not be today, it might be a year from now, but where do you think that's going to be?

I've always had a very untraditional approach to podcast monetization. This doesn't work for everyone. But my biggest thing was taking all the podcasts that I do and they all have a niche of people, that's kids who are interested in these outside techie type things like entrepreneurism, stem. And so all these podcasts are targeting that niche of people. And so my idea was taking that niche and in addition to podcasting, creating social media, the official good CEO, Instagram and the website, the blog events, the discord. So my entire idea with podcasting was not monetizing those episodes. I know that Young Trip has a pre roll from Kiperner's, but other than that, not like doing outside monetization. Instead make ad free content. And again, this formula doesn't work for everyone. But create ad free content, that's great content and then take those listeners, funnel them into a larger community and from there being able to do outside things, maybe merchandise, maybe it's something more like all these kid entrepreneurs also want to.

Get their hats in check, right?

Yeah. Events. What if I could create an oatmeal? Literally an oatmeal like what you eat. An oatmeal packet is kids CEO oatmeal. And like you pay $5 a day and get this oatmeal that's jam packed with all these vitamins. And so now instead of directly monetizing those listeners, I can build this community that's now going to all buy this oatmeal that's going to help them a lot and it's a lot more effective.

Products, services, events, like community. Right. The program. So we call that a platform. And that's what you have created here. And what I really love about what you said, Ben, and really is the key, which most people don't recognize, is that you didn't keep all your eggs in the podcasting basket. Right? You didn't put it all in Instagram, you didn't put it all in YouTube, you didn't put it in one place. You have blog going, website going, you've got discord going, you've got Instagram going and you've got the podcast going. And it's all feeding off of each other and creating engagement all around wherever those people want to live. Right. Wherever they. To hang out. You've created a space for them and a way to enact with them and engage with them. So I love that that's your model. And I do think, especially at the kid group, I mean, it's difficult to. You can't advertise to kids that easily. Like, it's just not.

Kids don't have buying power. They can't.

They don't have the right buying power, number one. But we see it on YouTube, but it feels really pushy to the parents, too. And I think that at the end of the day, it's much more authentic for you to stay ad free, do what you think is the best. And that way, when you do finally offer things, they feel much more purposeful.

Right. And it's like all about providing. And I kind of get annoyed when I see adult entrepreneurs, also kid entrepreneurs who like their entire social media profile is buy this, like 50% off, buy it. Here's the website and reviews are testimonials from the middle. But like half or 75% of the posts is buy this necklace, buy this bracelet.

That's what a lot of Instagram is, right? Yeah, it is by Diamond Art. Like, I see that a lot at my daughter's Instagram. Right.

Without providing enough value. Like, I don't even know what you do. I don't know who you are. And you're asking me to buy this from you. And there's like, there's nothing wrong with, like, monetizing the podcast if you provided that value in the first place.

The value needs to be there first. I love that advice. So I'm going to do your bingeable factor. So your binge factor, Ben, when I listen to shows, and I listen to a lot of shows, in addition to helping launch over a thousand shows, I probably listen to at least a thousand more of other podcasters. And my team does this all the time. We audit shows, so we're always listening to them and checking them out and sharing them between us and finding out what people do. And the interesting thing is that the binge factor isn't the same again and again and again from every show. So your binge factor is really unique to you, but in your particular case, it's also unique to the age group you're serving. Right. You're providing some unusual views into a market area that those kids don't have necessarily a view on. Right. You've carved out a space of which you have personal experience. And so you didn't like contrive it so you have personal experience as a young entrepreneur, a kid entrepreneur, kid CEO, right? You have experience there and you're sharing it in addition to interviewing, finding experiences, curiosity, exploration out there. You're not a full expert in it, and you don't need to be. And that's comfortable place. And I think that that's what kids are responding to. I think there are a lot of adults of us who should listen to your show just to understand that aspect of it, because not enough adults do that well. And you're doing it just perfectly. You've got this wonderful blend of curiosity, of experience and view that you're combining together to make a fabulous, bingeable show.

I appreciate that a lot. Thank you so much. And it just comes down to I really empathize with every listener. Like, I am the listener for the show and the audience for the show. So putting myself, now that I have access to these people, putting myself in the position of other entrepreneur around my age with similar interests, and if they were put in my place, what questions would they ask? What do they want to know? And so that just been whenever I think about writing questions or asking questions on the spot, it just goes back to that. As someone who would listen to the show, what are they looking for? How can I help myself? Which then translate to everyone else who listens.

Fantastic. Ben, I'm so glad you came on the show. I'm so glad we finally connected up and I got to meet you and I got to experience all that you bring to the world. You have just inspired a lot of adults out there podcasting, and I know you're going to keep inspiring other kid entrepreneurs to podcast. So thank you, Ben, for doing that. And all of you listeners out there, don't miss Young Trep Kid CEO and two Kids on the block, because you're going to want to check them out.

Thank you so much, Tracy. This was amazing. All of you podcasts out there, go get it. I'm reading for you.

I'm totally inspired. In fact, I'm going to have to do a little more exploration on Discord because Ben put me to shame when he was talking about Discord. And I realized, well, I know what it is, but beyond that, I don't know much about how it works. And so that's what I love about this show. That's what I love about getting to interview. That's why my favorite outside measurement, as Ben called them, or my favorite alternative monetization, my favorite alternative return on investment, is getting tips like that, getting ideas like that that I can utilize some way and go out there and explore something and then maybe find something so useful that I didn't know I could adapt. That's where people who are outside of our reach, outside of our normal world or sphere of influence are so valuable to our show, so valuable to you, my listeners. Right. And valuable to me as the host. I'm always learning something. And there's so much that I learned here. I love the 5% rule. Those super engaged fans that make our shows so much more worthwhile. They make it worthwhile to do, especially in the beginning. We don't have those listener numbers when we don't have all those other monetization strategies working for us.

Right.

They make it worth it. And focusing on them makes it so, so valuable. So my dedication to all of you super fans out there is to do what Ben's doing, focus there, make sure I'm learning something so that you're learning something. And I'm going to bring you more great hosts like Benjamin Wong of Kids, CEO Young Trep and two Kids on the Block. You're going to definitely want to check those out. I also want to make sure that you know that you have an opportunity to be on my show. So if you've been sitting out there listening for a reason and you think you're not successful enough, that doesn't mean there's something that you don't have that you could teach me and you teach our audience. So we want to hear from you. So go ahead and go to the bingefactor.com apply to the show. There's no harm in doing that. We can check out your show. Maybe we'll give you some feedback. If you're not right for our show, that could be really valuable to you to make sure that you're moving forward. And if you haven't started your show, I want Benjamin Wong to put you to shame and get you going, inspire you. You need to just take home hold. Forget about all those perfectionist things holding you back and just get your show started. Find those outside measurements and values that you can bring to your business, to your message, to your entrepreneurship, to why you've been sitting around thinking and tossing around this podcasting idea. Start doing something about it. So thanks everyone for listening. I'm Tracie Hazzard and I'll be back with more binge factor.

You've been learning listening to the Binge Factor Podcast. For more information on podcasting and videocasting success tips and tactics, please go to thebingefactor.com and be sure to listen to our other show for podcasters called Feed you'd Brain. If you'd like to be interviewed on this show as well as featured in Tracy's column, please go to thebingefactor.com guest and apply.

Sam.