Peptide Therapy for Mitochondrial Health, Energy, Body Composition, and Immunity

Welcome to the Peptides and Longevity Podcast, redefining aging and transforming health. Each week, Dr. Kent Holtorf will dive into groundbreaking science, innovative therapies, and the future of health and longevity alongside visionary physicians and experts. We'll explore how peptides, cutting-edge medicine, and lifestyle strategies can redefine the way we age. Get ready to transform your health, optimize your vitality, and unlock the secrets to a longer, healthier life. Let's get started.

Hi, this is Dr. Kent Holtorf with another episode. Today I'll be interviewing Dr. Amber, and she'll be talking about novel peptide therapy options to boost mitochondrial health for brain power, body composition, and better recovery. Dr. Amber is a licensed naturopathic doctor at MetroMD Institute of Regenerative Medicine in Los Angeles. She trained in regenerative medicine, detoxification protocols, hormone testing and treatment, bioidentical hormones, anti-aging peptide therapy, IV nutrient therapy. She's a private practice in Redondo Beach, um, where she specializes in peptide therapy and bioidentical hormones. She's worked with a lot of entrepreneurs and athletes looking for performance optimization and and has really used peptide therapy to augment her practice. And also she treats chronic infections such as Epstein-Barr, Candida gut infections. She's used peptide protocols for weight loss, body composition, cognitive performance, ADHD, autoimmune disorders, and many more. She's a physician member of the International Peptide Society and has a peptide certification through American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine. She graduated from Baskin University in San Diego. She's passionate about blending natural medicine and modern technology to provide therapies that truly help patients get answers and outcomes for their health concerns and diagnosis. She's passionate about educating patients on peptide therapy and works with patients. She also has an office in Hollywood, and she does a lot of telemedicine as well, which is really big now with the COVID issue. So I'd like to welcome you, Dr. Amber. Thank you so much for taking the time and being with us.

Absolutely.

So great. Tell me just a little background. How did you get into peptides?

Yeah, so I learned about peptides actually through a book that I was reading. It's called The Testosterone Bible by Jay Campbell, and also through some podcasts. I actually didn't hear about it through practitioners. It's not as well known. A lot of doctors are really just hearing about peptides. And so I heard about it, I started using some of the growth hormone analog peptides, some CJC and ipamorelin, on myself, noticed profound changes, you know, dug into the research, decided I need to get trained in this. This is really powerful medicine for patients. I was already doing a lot in the bioidentical world, uh, women's hormones, a lot of Dutch testing, bioidenticals for men, and then, you know, found that peptides really just complement that so beautifully.

Yeah, I think that they're really synergistic. And you said you tried the, um, growth hormone secretagogue. So, you know, growth hormone gets a little— it was kind of a big thing taking, but the FDA It's the only drug you can't give off-label, and which is really weird. No one's died of, you know, growth hormone overdose. But so these peptides, it will boost your own growth hormone. And who do you use that on? What do you find with those? Which ones in particular? There are many combinations of them, but you find those helpful for what type of patient?

Yeah, so I work with a lot of women. Big complaints, sleep issues, can't sleep. And then, you know, as a follow-up to that, can't lose weight. I have a trainer that I work with in Hollywood who sends me women who are really, you know, their diet is clean, they're training 5, 6 days a week, and they're just not able to drop the weight. through doing all that. And so adding in something after we've kind of addressed Pillar 1, what's going on with the hormones, uh, balancing that and then adding in something like CJC and ipamorelin. So, uh, those two growth hormone analog peptides can catapult their results as far as fat loss goes. And not only that, it will give you that deep restorative sleep, which we know will help regulate hormones just by that alone.

Yeah, so it basically— it's instead of giving the growth hormone, you're stimulating the hypothalamus pituitary to produce. So you're basically anti-aging that, you know, that, that master gland, and it tends to do a lot of, you know, other things and then also improve sleep. Um, do you use, uh, Epitalion as well, or Delta Sleep Inducing Peptide?

I have used, yeah, I have used epitalon. And the one thing that I love about that one is it's the one molecule that I know that increases natural synthesis of melatonin substantially over time. And we know that that's protective for immunity and so many things. Think about COVID who's susceptible to COVID? Those low in melatonin, those people who are older and they're low in melatonin. So I do love that one. DSIP I have used on occasion for, I have a couple clients who fly internationally for work and so they get these flipped circadian rhythms all the time and they really need to just recalibrate that. So I've seen that work really well there. But the, honestly, adding in, sometimes we'll just start on ipomerelein, but I really find that the combination of CJC and ipomerelein is the most effective. The way that I like to explain that to patients, because peptides are such a foreign concept when we're explaining it to somebody who's never heard about it before, I like to talk about the CJC as almost like the production, so the producing of the growth hormone, and that's signaling the pituitary, hey, let's produce more. And then I like to think about the ipomerellin as more of like a delivery truck, so let's get it out to the body. And they work very closely in tandem. If you think about how Amazon works, they have their manufacturing plant, delivery trucks, and, and that's—

You're very good at explaining it. Yeah, I'm sure patients appreciate that because it's just like so foreign. But yeah, yeah, so one's a growth hormone secreting peptide and one's a growth hormone secreting hormone, and they work very well together. I have found that, you know, one I'm sure you found, if people don't sleep, they don't lose weight. And that combination of— we treat a lot of chronic fatigue syndrome, fibromyalgia, chronic Lyme, and they just don't sleep. But that combination of delta sleep-inducing peptide, Epithalion, and the growth hormone secretagogues, all of a sudden they get some deep sleep, which is key. Yeah.

That's really where the magic happens, because when you improve the sleep, you improve autophagy, you improve brain function, you improve everything. And we also know you have growth hormone receptors literally all over the body, in the brain, in the gut, in the muscles. And so those two peptides, when somebody is not feeling recovered, restored, not waking up rested, not getting that deep sleep, hormone regulation is off, just adding in those two alone, I find just produces tremendous effect.

Nice, nice. And nice things that how the peptides are very synergistic is the BPC-157, um, will basically increase growth hormone receptors on all the cells in the body. So you get, again, synergistic effect.

Yeah.

So, so what got you into mitochondria? Can you talk a little bit about the importance of mitochondria? What are mitochondria? I'm sure people have heard about it, but what really are they?

Yes, so I love to use analogies, and this is the analogy I use with my patients in explaining what mitochondria are. And I've worked with some athletes who I bring up the word mitochondria and they're like, "Mito what?" And you know, they're training intensely.

They should know of anyone, yeah.

So essentially mitochondria are the powerhouse of the cell. We know that from 8th grade biology, but they also have other function, so they help to protect the cell too from oxidative damage. And the best analogy is we live in LA, we're both in LA right now, and in LA we have a power plant that fuels this entire city to work every single day. And if immediately in this moment the power plant discontinues working, we couldn't plug in our computers, our Wi-Fi box, we can't run our dishwasher, everything stops in the city of LA. Nothing has power. And so in a cell, we think about LA as the cell, the power plant is the mitochondria. Really, we need to make sure that we're continually producing that energy for the cell to function.

And people think, I think of like energy, think of exercise, but it's every function. And you think especially the tissues that need the most— brain, um, and like their, uh, you know, immune system. And even cells need energy to die. And you talk about autophagy— when they don't have the energy, they can't go through what's called apoptosis, so they hang around, and that's when you get cancer. Yeah, so not enough energy, you don't actually get rid of the old cells, and they turn into cancer. So it's pretty amazing. It's, it's, um, uh, counterintuitive, but it affects really everything.

Yeah, it's so interesting. There's, there's a lot of medical literature, and A4M talks about this, and you and I are both well-versed on how mitochondrial dysfunction is a driving force behind so many of these chronic illnesses now, and it's not really being addressed or talked about It's so interesting that, you know, we know things that are mitochondrial toxic, so NSAIDs, pain-relieving medications, most pharmaceutical drugs are toxic to mitochondria, as well as alcohol. And so you think about those 3 things, most people have come into contact with those in the last 30 days in America. So not only as we age our mitochondrial function decreases, but then we come into contact with these substances we need even more support to overcome that.

And I totally agree. And there's, you know, so many things we just can't get away from. BPA, and we'll check people's basal metabolic rate, so how many calories they burn per day when they come in. And, you know, you get the woman who can't lose weight and there are people, oh yeah, you're just eating Ding Dongs in the closet, you know, they're exercising. And we find that they're about 25% lower metabolism than they should be for their weight. And, you know, they're like, see, I told you, you know, it's like, um, and it's mitochondrial dysfunction. Sometimes, you know, the thyroid boosts that, but there's other things that also affect the thyroid, affect the mitochondria. But yeah, and it's, you know, the theory of aging, it's all fix the mitochondria. You fix such a wide array of issues.

You do. Yeah, it's, it's really fascinating too. Looking at the role of hormones, I mean cortisol, part of the metabolism of cortisol and creating cortisol, it happens in the mitochondria. And you think about the role of cortisol and weight gain and L-carnitine being that amazing molecule that shuttles those fatty acids that we burn into the mitochondria to be burned. So fat, when you look at fat loss, body composition goals, you have to look at mitochondria in my mind.

Yeah, and I, I agree. And you look at diabetics, we find— and also all the studies, you look at the conditions with mitochondrial dysfunction, neurodegenerative diseases, uh, diabetics, they all have mitochondrial, you know, dysfunction. Autoimmune, anyone with inflammation, and you know, and everyone's inflamed. And then you start talking about the gut, you know, the whole gut-brain axis. Like, I mean, everyone's gut is so messed up. And even people who consider themselves healthy, we find their gut is so leaky and causing that inflammation, mitochondrial dysfunction, and they just don't feel great. I think everyone I know is either— like, you go to a party and talk to them, they feel terrible. They have a family member or friend and just, oh my God, my doctor says I'm fine, and put them on statins. But you find You fix their mitochondria, cholesterol goes down, you know, their risk for cardiovascular disease, much, much better prevention than giving them a statin. You know, they don't have a statin deficiency. Actually, statins, they decrease mitochondrial function.

They deplete CoQ10, which protects the mitochondria, right?

Yeah, and yeah, it's kind of a classic. People get muscle aches and brain fog, memory loss, mitochondrial dysfunction. And the doctor goes, "Oh, but your cholesterol is lower." Why not fix the problem? Fix underlying problem.

Yeah.

Awesome. So what types of things do you do? What's your first step? You come in and you treat a lot of women who maybe can't lose weight, not feeling great, not sleeping, and how do you approach that patient?

Yeah, so generally we're running a hormone panel, which is going to be a comprehensive panel where we're looking at the the cortisol levels, we're looking at melatonin levels, we're looking at what are their sex hormones, and then checking thyroid because that's a huge player for so many women in weight loss issues.

And the levels, they're told they're normal, right?

Right.

And you find that they're not. Yeah.

Yeah. And they could potentially have completely normal levels and lots of symptoms too. That subclinical picture. So yeah, really, I run a hormone panel, assess what's going on depending on the situation. A lot of women are on bioidentical or they'll be on birth control, another pharmaceutical medication for anxiety or depression, and then have alcohol consumption, potentially pain reliever, BPA, and I look at that as, man, their liver is just suffering with all of these things that are taxing those pathways. And so a lot of what I do is liver support of detoxing hormones. It can show up on the skin, really just supporting them there. So that's kind of pillar 1. And then looking at, since I'm trained in peptides and I know how to use them in an effective way for women, we can add in other solutions to help their mitochondria. And that could be anything from, you know, a supplement that boosts mitochondrial function. So adding in things like PQQ, resveratrol, CoQ10, a lot of those really important protective factors. Or we could talk about peptides that we use for mitochondrial function too, like MOTC is an amazing one for weight loss.

Or let's just go back for a second. You mentioned toxins, so I just want to mention one toxin that people don't realize. Tylenol is so toxic, and there's a bunch of studies showing it may be the number one cause of autism.

Wow.

Yeah, and it's just toxic to mitochondria, and it's a major issue. Now you talked about other things for mitochondrial function, like it sounded like antioxidants. Why? How do antioxidants help mitochondrial function?

Yeah, so the mitochondria, we have DNA in the mitochondria. So we have DNA in the nucleus and DNA in the mitochondria, and essentially The mitochondria produces energy, yes, but they could turn into, the mitochondria can turn into like a battleship where it's trying to protect the cell. And if we have overwhelming amounts in a, say a Tylenol overdose, that DNA will be damaged. And that's a problem because then the mitochondria are not working appropriately. It's like the whole city of LA will shut down. From the prior analogy. And so protecting against oxidative stress and damage in the mitochondria will preserve the ATP production. It'll keep everything flowing. And when we have an overwhelming amount of reactive oxygen species, that's a problem. That'll damage our mitochondria. That puts us in a really dire situation.

Yeah. And so the mitochondria, yeah, they make the energy, and they, they cause oxidative stress. So they make the energy. And so when you have oxidative stress, otherwise just kind of stops it, you know, it stops the production. And, uh, and I think, you know, a major thing finding, you know, in aging and all these illnesses, and, and everyone's just incredibly inflamed, right? And probably the number one suppressor of mitochondrial function is, you know, There's toxins, a lot of things, but inflammation just seems to be a key. And have you found— just, it seems to be like everyone just has so much inflammation. And so really everyone has mitochondrial dysfunction.

Yeah. You know what, I really— when I think about the whole situation about the research and the literature, and we know all these diseases are associated with mitochondrial dysfunction, from Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, with autism, diabetes, all of these things. It's really the future of where medicine is going to go is providing us— the people who are going to fare well are those who have the tools on board to protect these biological systems like mitochondria. There's some things we cannot avoid. We can't avoid all plastics. We can't avoid all toxins. We can avoid some of them, you know, on purpose, but it's going to really be about bringing things on board that help support the body. I mean, we're going to fare way better preventing cancer, preventing these chronic degenerative issues, and this is going to become, I think, in the next 10, 20 years, pivotal. Like, this is pivotal if you have access to these things and know how to use them.

I totally agree, and it's interesting. It's like you talk to most doctors or you learn you know, biochemistry in school, then you forget it. Now we're having to relearn it because we actually utilize it. And I really agree because people were keeping people alive, but are they living better? You know, there are nursing homes and these chronic neurodegenerative diseases. Now, if you go to someone like yourself and they go and they get their mitochondrial, mitochondria tuned up, they're likely going to prevent those diseases 10 years, 20 years, 30 years down the road and have a great life instead of being in the nursing home and fragile and having, you know, neurodegenerative diseases and osteoporosis and cardiovascular disease and dementia. And you can really prevent that. And we're, we're finding, and it's interesting, you know, how standard medicine is, well, let's wait till it gets bad enough and then We'll give you a med and we'll keep you alive and try to stop, you know, so it doesn't get worse. But prevent it beforehand, it's just life-changing, literally.

Yeah, it can turn around your entire destiny, future of your life. And what's more important than your health and well-being? If you think about it, like with COVID that's really brought that to the surface for many people is you can lose your job, your car, your house, but if your health is in a dire situation, I mean, that is really the most important thing is you, your wellbeing.

Yeah. And I had it myself where, you know, with chronic Lyme, was so sick. I was like, I would give up, you know, anything to feel, because you can't use anything. And we have some other super rich and, but they're so sick. Like, what's the use? You can't use your private plane, you know, it's like, and it's so your health is key and we forget that. And I think until you lose it, you just take it for granted. Yeah.

Yeah. So maybe we could talk about one of these really powerful molecules that we're using for mitochondria, which is NAD+. Yeah. There's all different forms of NAD, the NAD IVs, but essentially what is NAD? We could talk about that.

Yeah, so the nicotinamide dinucleotide. So yeah, tell us, tell us about that and, and how does that work with the mitochondria?

Yeah, so NAD is that really important coenzyme, right? And nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide, but essentially it powers the cell to continue producing energy and it's involved in a redox reaction but I love— so there's different forms of NAD+ that we can give to people. We can give NAD+ IVs, we can give NAD+ intranasal, we can give NAD+ in a patch form, transdermal, we have sublingual forms, We have precursors like NR and NMN, which we can give. We can also talk about 5-Amino-1MQ, which is like dear to my heart peptide.

Yeah, we'll talk about that. But yeah, so with the NAD, and it really, I think taking NAD, so it just doesn't absorb very well. I don't think sublingual even. Some of the precursors. I think the nicotinamide ribonucleoside, probably the best precursor. But you're doing going right to the source and finding the IVs, doing IV NAD, getting the best results. Can you tell us about some of those things you've seen and what you use that for?

Definitely. So I like to use— of course, the bioavailability of an IV is just compared to none. It just, it goes straight into the cell and right into the bloodstream. And so what NAD does is it helps the brain cells to age well. And so we know that by introducing NAD to those cells, that we're— it's like giving the cell a spark plug to recreate energy if they were having, you know, kind of sluggish mitochondrial function. It'll actually even upregulate PGC-1 alpha, which is that molecule that we talk a lot about going back to biochemistry, and that protects against oxidative stress in the cell. So it's so valuable. We're using NAD IVs for addiction. There's, you know, where you can go through a whole week of NAD IVs back to back. We use them for Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, any type of neurodegenerative condition. Athletes can benefit because we know that muscle tissue has just way more mitochondria because it's powering, uh, needs that energy to fire. So I've seen athletes use it. I really like the back-to-back IVs for someone with a more serious condition. So when we're doing like 4 or 5 days in a row, somebody advanced stage Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, somebody who's you know, really, uh, trying to avert an addiction to alcohol or something. And I like to use the NAD IVs more. Yeah, yeah.

Oh no, I was saying it's just, it's interesting when I give, you know, lectures on peptides, like, I almost— especially to the public, and you say all the things they work for, it's, it's a little embarrassing because it sounds like snake oil. Like, well, how can it work for addictions? And Parkinson's and for athletics. Can you, can you talk about that a little bit? Why would it work for addictions?

Yeah, so it's balancing, it's balancing those brain chemicals, um, and it's working through— so if you think about, you know, why is autism related to, uh, poor mitochondrial function, right? It's, it's an issue with those nerve cells. We know that nerve cells also have way more mitochondria than, than typical cells. I think the comparison is like a normal cell in the body has about 1,000 to 2,500 mitochondria. A nerve cell has about 10,000+ mitochondria, so way more. And so if we have any sort of issue with mitochondria, it's going to show up in two places first: the brain and the muscles. Brain fog, fatigue, muscle weakness, lethargy, no motivation to work out, right? So in the case of addiction, any sort of, you know, think about like mood disorders and you think about Alzheimer's and Parkinson's, why is it impacting the brain? Well, you have a lot of nerve tissue that's playing a role in that conduction and it can absolutely impact those conditions. So Yeah, I haven't used it specifically for addiction in my practice. I've used it more for a neuroprotective for some of my Alzheimer's, Parkinson's patients, but there's a clinic in San Diego who does phenomenal work on addiction with NAD+.

It's amazing. Yeah, I think it works great and prevents— like, it reduces the withdrawals and that, but yeah, if you're going to do addiction, you gotta, like, do addiction. Totally different clientele. But it is amazing. It works for that. But yeah, it's interesting. Again, we'll do big panels, like sounds like yourself, and look at immune system. And we find that autistic kids, their panel, their immune system, all the dysfunctions look just like a chronic Lyme patient, look just like a chronic fatigue syndrome patient. And that ultimate— everything's a vicious cycle, especially with mitochondrial dysfunction. That everything starts breaking down, which causes nothing to break down. And but you get at that commonality, you fix the mitochondria, you're going to fix a lot of things.

Yeah.

What has been your— some of your biggest success stories?

So I had a fibromyalgia patient who, uh, I actually was using LDN with her because she also had depression.

And so that's lotus naltrexone. It's a opiate blocker at very low dose, and it modulates the immune system. So it— so all these chronic illnesses also have immune dysfunction where Th1 immunity is too low, Th2 is too high, but that causes a lot of inflammation, which then causes mitochondrial dysfunction. And then once again, we're back to mitochondria.

Back to mitochondria, yeah. So we, we use some LDN. That's a great simplified explanation of what it does, but it helps increase those endorphins in the brain. Through adaptation. So we block the receptors transiently at night and then ends up improving mood, helping with pain, all these things. So the LDN, I've used NAD+ with her, she had marked improvement in pain, went from probably 8 or 9 out of pain to 2 or 3 within a matter of 4 weeks, which is amazing.

Wow, just think of her life, how much you changed her life.

Yes, yeah, that was a powerful case.

And she was told, I'm sure, you know, we actually published our results and this was 12, 15 years ago that people saw on average 7.2 physicians without any benefit. And then they came in by the 4th visit, 80% got significantly better. But, you know, they were told that, oh, it's all in your head. And then they start believing it. And, you know, like, oh my, am I just lazy? And then they're friends abandon them, and they're all, you know, they look fine, just exercise and eat better. And it's a terrible illness because doctors, you know, in general, if they don't know how to treat it, it doesn't exist, and it's patient's fault. So I'm sure when they come to you and you're like, hey, this is a real illness, and I'll show you the dysfunctions and I can treat it, just right there I think is very powerful.

Yeah, there's so much power in explaining to someone that the symptoms and what they've been going through is really a metabolic cause. Same with weight loss. It's a metabolic issue. It's an insulin resistance issue, which is driven by mitochondria and other mechanisms, but the insulin piece is why things like MOTC, which is mitochondrial peptide, that it's so amazing for insulin sensitivity. And they actually found that children who had obesity had really low levels, like a third of the levels of MOTS-c that they should have. And MOTS-c is that peptide that helps with insulin sensitivity and shuttling the glucose and the fatty acids into the cell through the GLUT4 receptors to be burned for energy. And they were low in that. So we know that mitochondria plays a huge role in the obesity issue, the chronic disease picture of insulin resistance in America. And we're not talking about that and we need to be offering solutions and addressing that. And so I think it's just pivotal to finally bring the mitochondria into the spotlight and treat that.

Yeah. So you're kind of breaking the cycle because once they kind of get the insulin resistance, then they actually get increased inflammation and suppressed mitochondria. They're actually suppresses thyroid function, metabolism drops. So now they get more weight gain and more insulin resistance. So that's why it's so difficult for people with insulin resistance and diabetes to lose weight, because they— if they also go on a diet, it basically— the thyroid senses that and basically gets lower, metabolism drops. So it's— yeah, you have to intervene and fix their broken mitochondria because they're not burning any calories. Even though people think all they're doing is just eating all day, but really it's that inflammation and mitochondrial dysfunction. And you fix that and they're like a new person. And they're like, oh my gosh, I'm like a regular person. You know, they see their friends that are skinny, just eating crazy. And, uh, it's, yeah, what percent of population is obese? And it's just, it's going up. I think the only country that's more obese than us, I think, is Saudi Arabia. Where they can hide under the big, you know, clothing. Yeah, but it's bad. And what do you think the whole obesity crisis is from? You've kind of mentioned a number of things, but what's your thought?

Yeah, you know, it's interesting because in America, we're one of the most industrious nations in the world. I mean, we've created more novel companies, business ideas, is we're one of the most creative nations. We've done so much in terms of innovation. We got Microsoft and Google, and a lot of these things have started in America. And so we've created this, and I've worked with people on Wall Street, and I've worked with entrepreneurs and people who are building their businesses, and it's a burnout culture. And so we're burning ourselves into the ground working to accomplish something. I know med school is exhibit A of that, so. I think it's really about— not to say that, you know, I'm so ambitious and all for hard work, but we need to help the body support itself through that. And that's looking at mitochondria, what's happening with chronic stress, sleep deprivation. We're not able to do that autophagy in the brain like we need to do. And that plays a role in setting you up for something like Alzheimer's and Parkinson's. Down the road. And so what are the things— it's not telling people to, you know, not be ambitious, but it's like, what are the things that we can bring on board for you to help you support you? And I don't think that conversation is happening enough with really high-level go-getters or people who have really high-stress jobs in LA, you know, and who's using NAD+ to support themselves when they're tired. I know I am, but a lot of people don't know about that. So yeah, I think it's a cortisol issue, sleep deprivation, chronic stress, cortisol, you know, we know that that causes abdominal adiposity and that visceral fat, which just poses risks. So I think it's a lot of things, mitochondria we already talked about.

So you think stress plays a big part and it's interesting with, the cortisol— and when your body's like tries to make cortisol, it secretes corticotropin-releasing hormone, what actually really is a huge stimulator of mast cells. And so stress equals inflammation, inflammation equals mitochondrial dysfunction. And yeah, and so we're, we're back to your, to your core thinking. Everything comes back to mitochondria.

Yeah. And then the one thing that you mentioned earlier that was really valuable is how immune dysfunction plays into that. So the effects between cortisol and immune regulation, there's a very tight link right there. And so chronic stress, you know, why do so many women after the age of 30 have autoimmune conditions? Well, the thymus gland involutes, we're not producing those thymus peptides, we get set up for a perfect storm for autoimmunity. Right? So—

And it's interesting, you look at, you know, I don't want to bash on doctor, you know, but like endocrinologists, they don't look at the immune system and they don't think, let's say, of Hashimoto's or other autoimmune. I mean, they say, oh, they'll just treat the thyroid. But you find, you know, that you look at their immune system and really you can look at the immune system and tell how healthy a person is. And with dysfunctional immune system, they are going to get all these diseases of aging. And after, when the thymus, the involutes, and when we're 45, it's basically a fraction, about 5% of what it was. And so that immune system's off, which then again causes all that oxidative stress, makes you much more prone to autoimmunity, worse. With women, you know, so they tend to get autoimmunity. And instead of just like, you know, going after the damage and say, oh, try to limit the damage, why not try to fix the underlying immune system, which ties right into mitochondria? The immune system basically affects mitochondria, the mitochondria affects the immune system. So you kind of got to look at everything. And So do you use immune modulating peptides?

Yeah, so I've used the thymus and alpha not only in myself and patients, and I have seen that one be pretty, uh, prolific and effective. Also, the other one that's not really talked about a lot I've used is LL-37. So that one upregulates that, uh, cathelicidin in the gut. So it essentially wakes up the surveillance system in the gut to say, hey, let's get Candida out, let's get any gut infection taken care of, because usually the patient will have a low secretory IgA and their immune system is just in the tank and they're not able to actually, you know, identify and kick out the gut pathogen. So I've found that one to be really effective.

And now, you know, with that, so LL-37, it's an endogenous antimicrobial peptide, uh, and it's pretty amazing that it's such a wide array of effects. For instance, Studies show that it kills the Lyme cyst better than like the antibiotic tinidazole, which is for that. It works against yeast and parasites, and they find it's low. So you find you, you give it to patients, um, and you find— are you looking for infections first? Are you finding that?

And, um, stool test, GI panel, and look for the gut.

And what are you finding in that? You're finding a lot of patients just have significant parasites or dysbiosis or Candida?

Candida is a big one. I see a lot of people with Candida, especially if they have a history of eczema, psoriasis. It's usually driven by some sort of Candida overgrowth or, you know, gut microbiome imbalance. So we'll address that, and there's a multi-prong approach, but Peptides are just bringing in a new level of what we're able to do for patients because I've put patients on gut healing protocols, leaky gut, Candida protocols, and I just haven't seen anything work as quickly as adding in something like LL-37 or TA-1, thymosin alpha-1. It's just, it blows my mind that we're able to actually reintroduce those peptides that are bioidentical to the body. We already make, you know, thymosin alpha and thymosin beta, but to, to add in more of a good substance, or add in the signal to help our body make more of what it knows.

And just to explain, so thymosin alpha 1, thymosin beta 4, they're thymic peptides. So as we were talking about, the thymus, it basically, it from age 15 on, it just keeps declining. And so your immune system gets worse and worse. And that's about age 45 is when you start seeing— you get the immune dysfunction, you start seeing all those issues. And, um, and so thymosin alpha 1 really increases that thymus— the, uh, Th1. And it's approved in, uh, 30 countries or so for HIV, cancer, because this side of the immune system not only fights infections, it monitors your body for cancer. And then thymosin beta 4 is a modulator. And then BPC-157 lowers that Th2, so you can use these peptides and follow that immune system, and you find everything gets better. And I know you probably see, you know, SIBO, and everyone's like, oh, treat the SIBO. But, you know, there's that gut-brain axis, but also the brain-gut axis. And I find I got in so much trouble with the SIBO guys. I said, I think it's a symptom, not a cause. Because it is, you get— you basically treat it, it comes back because you got the gut dysfunction from the immune dysfunction that's causing— so you can treat it, people feel better, but you still didn't fix the underlying issue, the reason they got SIBO. Yeah.

That's fascinating. Yeah. So it's really digging deeper, a little bit deeper. It's the immune dysfunction, it's the mitochondrial dysfunction, it's this really paramount, pivotal, underlying. You know, I talk about it like it's 7 layers deep. Weight loss is the issue up here, but down here we got a lot more going on.

Yeah, it's like you don't even— yeah, it's fixed every underlying. You find the gut plays a big role?

Yeah, so I have loved using BPC. I've used the injectable, but I've also used the capsules in a lot of patients for leaky gut. I've found that to be more effective than so many other leaky gut protocols, or sometimes in tandem, but usually just BPC alone is just really effective.

Yeah, and so just a little plug, shameless plug, so yeah, we now have the BPC-157 out as a supplement, and then TB4, thymosin beta-4, big molecule that again modulates, but it's too big to take orally. It needs to be injectable. But so we found the fragment that actually is orally available and active. So it does all the same things as thymosin beta-4. We did take out the part that stimulates mast cells. So, uh, that's— and it also, it's shown to specifically heal the tight junctions. So you get kind of that, um, double the BPC lowering the inflammation Fixing the tight junctions, and we're coming out with KPV added to it. So we're kind of getting off, but it's a melanocortin, um, uh, troubling— alpha melanocyte stimulating hormone. So I don't know if you've heard of, you know, Melanotan 2, which is like the Barbie doll peptide where you get tan, you lose weight, and you have increased libido. And then PT-141 for libido, which works for erectile dysfunction if nothing else works, but it's also very anti-inflammatory. But the problem is, is if you take it for inflammation, you'll get tan, which can be good, but I don't know, you may have found different, but if you're older, it can make all dark spots darker. But so we took out the, the small active section. There's only 3 amino acids that has all the anti-inflammatory properties but doesn't cause the increase of melanocyte stimulation. So running that orally and it is so anti-inflammatory that there you put on, you know, let's say psoriasis, within a couple hours it's, it's so much better. But so that should be coming out a couple weeks. Again, shameless plug, but yeah, so So with the gut, well, what other peptides do you use? Brain peptides, do you like?

Yeah, so I have used the Semax and the Selank. Selank for very specific for anxiety. Semax more for increasing that BDNF. I've used that in medical students, I've used that in myself just for improving retention and memory. This could be really effective as well. Have you experimented with those?

Yeah, yeah, and we like them. And, yeah, and sea lang, you know, very calming. It can be subtle and used over time. Then there's cerebrolisin, which I know you've used and everyone find can work very well, even like end-stage Alzheimer's. It studies that dramatic improvement but had to be given IV. But we are— that will be coming out as an oral supplement probably in the next month. So we're excited about that. So yeah, that will be able to— because, uh, for everyone, it's like the peptides are very big, and all of a sudden we're worried that, you know, the FDA— I think it's Big Pharma— kind of says, hey, we, you know, we, we don't want to lose all this, all this business. So they're putting pressure on to stop compounding pharmacies. We— and compounding pharmacies may go away. We may not have bioidentical hormones. That's a big deal.

Yeah.

It's very, very scary and they're doing it behind the scenes and so we don't know how long. So we're trying to move to bringing these out in a different modality where— but I'm worried but A lot of people just don't know. And, you know, the power of big pharma. Let's see. So how do people— what would you recommend to a patient? They're like, I've been to all these doctors, I'm not feeling well. They can call you, they can do telemedicine, or do— who do they look for?

Yeah, like, how did they find me, reach out to me?

Yeah, or, or how would they go about finding a doctor if they want someone in their area? Or—

yeah, so if they're looking specifically for peptide therapies, they could go to the International Peptide Society, uh, or A4M. They have a network of doctors. You can usually look up who's a functional medicine doctor, who's a doctor who would be trained in peptides near you. It's few and far between. There's quite a few practitioners that are not trained in it. You and I both are very well versed and are prepared to use that in practice and always learning too and experimenting on ourselves with peptides, which is part of the experience too. But yeah, they can, uh, they can go to either one of those sites. Those are pretty reliable places to find a practitioner. Uh, there's some functional medicine trained practitioners. You can go to the Institute of Functional Medicine, uh, and locate a doctor.

A lot of societies popping up because— and it's interesting that we're now having, you know, been doing this for, I don't know, 20 years, you know, you kind of— it was small group and now it's, you know, cardiovascular surgeons in there and they're realizing that they're, you know, and they're just not satisfied of just doing the standard stuff. So I think it is the way of the future. And one, I think the good things about this COVID is they really expanded telemedicine, correct? And before, you had to have a license in the state where you would connect with that patient via telemedicine. So, but now they rescinded that. Hopefully it will stay. And because it really opens up access. So you can go to a doctor anywhere in the country. Like a patient could say, hey, they want to see you in Florida or whatever it may be. And you do a video first visit. Before you had to see the patient and they would come out So I think that's a great thing.

Huge win. Yeah, it's already happening. Like, patients are flying. If they live in Florida and their doctor's in California, they're going to fly anyway just for that initial visit. They're already doing it. It's going to open up access. I agree. It's going to be helpful.

Yeah. And I think it is hard for patients to figure out because with the internet, it's, hey, who markets the best? It's scary, some of the things that are being said out there. And people that say, "Oh, they're doing this," and you go, "Oh my gosh." Or I'm sure you've had this, they go to a so-called integrative functional doctor and you're like, "Oh my gosh, they messed up." And it's giving everyone in our group or way we practice bad name. I love it. But I think you see that with everything. Nice, nice. So, and did you ever do standard medicine?

So I, as far as like conventional medical school or practicing conventional medicine?

Yeah, practicing.

I'm skeptical. Yeah, I have only looked through the lens of holistic functional medicine. That's been— I was lucky because my last year of med school, um, I was out in San Diego. I was in Seattle for quite a while training there. And then I came down to San Diego and did a lot of clinicals and I got exposed to this entire world of regenerative medicine and joint injections and IV therapy and NAD+. And, and then, you know, upon graduating, peptides. And so that excited me. I actually, I was going to go the conventional route and I job shadowed a bunch of practitioners and what I really witnessed was the insurance-based model, the 15-minute visits, 6 prescriptions, walking out on a 7th one, you know, just— I was really depressed thinking about doing that the rest of my life and considered changing my route and The doctors are doing the best they can. They're amazing practitioners in a lot of ways. It's just the system that's broken. So I just didn't want to be a part of that system.

Yeah, they can't do this stuff. They have 9 minutes and they're judged on how cost-effective they are, which means not doing testing, not doing therapy, seeing as many patients as they can. So they're stuck. It's not that they're bad people. It's a bad system. And really the doctor and like HMO style, who cares the least makes the most, you know, and for us like yourself, and it's, if we don't get the patients better, we don't get patients, you know? And so, you know, you have to keep learning. And I think it is nice. It's now, you know, people 10 years, what do you do? I'm like, oh, how do I explain this? You know? And because if you mentioned, I mean, I was not going to say alternative, and that means no evidence. And when I first got sick myself and found, hey, I'm not getting better, I don't want to go this alternative. And I went to these so-called alternative, uh, conference. I'm like, oh my God, they're more evidence-based than what they're teaching me, right? And now at least I think the medical students, everyone is getting exposed to these things and seeing the difference, because I do think it is more evidence-based and it's really just practicing better medicine and I think that's what we do.

Absolutely, and I'm a huge fan of looking at the research and the evidence and I was trained that way even, you know, very, very, very much so, you know, sourcing what is NAD effective for, what are the research studies, what— and then it brings us back to the biochemistry which is so fun about going to A4M, it's just I get to dive back into all these pathways that I forgot about since med school, and now they're all relevant and they mean something to me.

Yeah, it's weird. Yeah, it brings you back to, you know, second year of medical school where most that, oh, forget that, just wait for the drug rep to come in and tell me what med. And, you know, now it's like so algorithmic. They have this, I can give them this drug or this drug, you know. And so it's, yeah, it's, I think, being a medical detective. It's It's much more satisfying, you know, I find. I think that's what practitioners doing this find, and so much more satisfying seeing patients get better that have been so many other standard, you know, good doctors but in a bad system. Yeah, that's wonderful. Keep up the great work, and it was very nice chatting with you, and thanks for taking the time.

Absolutely, pleasure. I'm excited to be on the Peptide Summit when it goes live. Yeah, promo, everything.

Thanks again. All right, bye-bye now.

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