Ep 52: How to thrive when you’re the sole black female firefighter with Kaylyn Gill

You are listening to episode number 52 with Kailyn Gill.

If you're someone who wants to make major changes in their life, someone who wants to achieve their goals, or maybe you're someone who knows this is not as good as it gets but you have no idea where to start, on the Reinvent You Podcast we explore different types of people, their successes and failures, and how they reinvented themselves to create the life they love. It's our hope that from hearing their stories that you too may have more insight into what it takes to build the life that you envision for yourselves. Here to help you do that is performance and life coach Travia Steward.

Today on the Reinvent You podcast, we are answering the question: how to thrive when you are the sole Black woman in an all-white, male-dominated firehouse. My guest today is firefighter Kaylyn Gill, who's been on the force for 21 years and is a 21-year resident in Arizona. In this episode, we talk from things about like overcoming adversity.

We—

Kaylyn shares with us one of her most pivotal moments that has shaped and molded her into the person that she is today. We also talk about the impact that her parents have had on her. We talk about the ingredient that Kaelin thinks most people need in order to flourish in life. You know, like what separates one person from the next when someone finds success and the next person doesn't? You know, we talk about her next chapter in her life as she begins to wind down this career. We talk about some of the discrimination that she faced as a female Black firefighter. And we also talk about the person she is today and how she intentionally created the life that she's living today that gets her excited to get out of bed every single day, no matter what day of the week it is. So welcome to the Reinvent You Podcast, my guest, Kaylyn Gill. Here we are with my girl, Mesa resident, 21-year Mesa resident, 21-year firefighter, Miss Kaylin Gill. Kaylin, welcome to the Reinvent You Podcast. Thank you so much for joining us. I think my audience is really in for a treat, especially who? The homies. Kaylin, how's it going today? Introduce yourself to my people and give us a little bit of context as to who else you are except what I just said.

Trey, I want to thank you, uh, and I'm very humbled to be a part of this. Thank you so much. I've watched a couple of your other podcasts and I hope I can live up to the occasion. I'm Kaylin. I'm Kaylin. Some of my friends have nicknamed me Kamo.

Okay.

I'm a regular woman living out here in Arizona. I am a 21-year firefighter. That's a big part of who I am. But I'm also the daughter of Betty and Patrick Gill. Just recently lost my— it's important to me because that's a big part of who I am. And I think as I've gotten older, I've realized how important they've been in my life. Um, I have tons of friends out here. Like you said, I lived here for 21 years. I've got a lot of colleagues on the department. Um, I love to, you know, um, hang out and just live life, have fun, nothing more, nothing less.

I love that. What would you say, like, your closest friends, your co-workers, how would they describe you?

I'm always curious of that myself, but I think, um, knowing, um, we have some friends in common, as you know, and you know, if we ask them, they'd be like, "Kaylyn's cool, Kaylyn's cool." Right, right. Um, I have some friends that say I'm a little quirky. I have friends that say I'm lighthearted. Um, I hope that they say that I'm loyal and I'm there for them. Fun, I think, is what they would say. I think sometimes, you know, you meet your friends out and hang out, so they don't get to know the, like, you when you're by yourself and quiet. But I know myself as being— when I'm home alone, I enjoy that time. So not one of my friends would describe me as an extrovert, but I consider myself as much an introvert as I am an extrovert.

Ooh, I love that. So when I think of Kaitlyn, what I would say about you is that you are really confident. I feel like you're confident in who you are. I do. I think when you enter a room, you command the attention in a room, which I know that's going to help you with your speaking as well. But so when we talk about the confident Kaitlyn, right, because we are the average of the 5 people that we spend the most time with, where do you think that's a gap? Because, you know, truth be told, I'm one person with the homies. I'm one person with my coaching clients. I'm one per— right, right. How wide is your gap? Like, who are you? Like, like, have you ever— like, and the reason why I asked that is because I've been on a mission to merge all of those identities so that I'm the same person no matter who I'm with. How wide is your gap? Wow.

Uh, I've never thought about that in that way. My gap would be very wide then. Because I'm one person when I'm a daughter and around my family.

Yeah.

I notice I watch my mouth a little bit more in that I don't cuss as much.

Of course.

But when I go to work, I don't know if it's in the culture of being a firefighter, I probably curse more than I should. My jokes are a little bit more off-colored. I have to not censor myself, but I have to be able to get along with different types of people. There's other women, there's white males, there's Black males, there's captains, there's engineers, there's— we're working with all different types of people. There's the public that I contend with, that I have a different quote-unquote face for. When I'm talking to young kids, I find myself being more of a motivator to them. But when I'm sitting with my friends and we're meeting at the pool hall to have some drinks, I'm not motivating anyone there. I'm hanging out and enjoying— enjoying their company. So you're right, there are a bunch of different faces. With my friends, I'm more relaxed. At work, I'm relaxed, but I maybe blocked off a little bit more. I don't know.

Right.

They know me, but they don't know the intimate Kalyn. Right.

And the reason why I ask that question again is because I go through and I do the same thing, right? But part of my coaching is aligning your true authentic self with who you were meant to be. And so I always feel like when we hide a certain part of who we are because These people will say, oh, that's corny. Or these people will say, oh, you're a know-it-all. I feel like you're putting on 5, per se, different masks every time you hang around different people. So that's why it's been important for me to try to merge those things because the people that are in my inner circle that are close to me, I want them to know all sides of me. I don't want to feel like I have to go, you know, like when, like when the homie has a party, I'm like, It's party Trey night, baby. It's time to perform, right? And I've been doing a better job of trying to merge, you know, it's not always just about that. So that's why I asked that question. What would you say the challenge would be to Kaylin to start merging some of those identities?

Well, um, I was going to ask you a question about for you personally, Trey. If you work, let's say you work in a corporate office, or let's say you're a firefighter or whatever your profession is, you will have an identity outside of work, but sometimes you can't always bring that same identity or merge all of those parts of yourself and present it at work. It's not always acceptable. It may, you know, people may be turned off by it. Some may be hyped, they view you differently. So sometimes I don't think that's always possible. I think you can still be, be your true self. You can be true to yourself. And thank you for feeling like when I come into a room, I command myself and that I'm confident. And that probably comes with, uh, just like age and upbringing. And, you know, I don't really, really, really know. I've never thought about that. But the way that I present myself with I am with my friends, I may not be so much— may not be that way at work. Like with you guys, I may break out in song for no reason, singing an oldie but goodie. Right, right, right. I'll walk into Vicki's house, our mutual friend, and be invited and break out and singin' Diana Ross. But when I walk into work, I'm not necessarily going to do that.

Right.

So I get that.

I get that. And so many times, because, you know, I coach on this, so many times we don't do those things because we're allowing those external factors to control who we are. So is it that we're going, they're going to think blank of me if I break out with Aretha Franklin? That's not the person I am around them. So why would I do that? Because they're going to think this. So it's our thoughts that are creating, and it is. That's stopping us from being truly aligned. Yeah.

That's true. That's true. And what do you think is the benefit of being, quote unquote, truly aligned?

I think the benefit—

maybe—

in my personal experience, I think the benefit is just being truthful and being the person that you were meant to be. And I feel like, for my whole life, I fought. Acceptance, you know? And so I feel like if I'm this person over here with one group of friends, then I can't be my full self. So I feel like they're not accepting me fully, but those are thoughts that I've created. So in merging, I want to feel like 100%, I am fully accepted. I'm loved. I'm valued for every part of me. That's why it's important.

And for that to happen— and when we talk about this topic, I think specifically about a conversation I just had with a colleague of mine, a young Black guy that has probably been on this department for 2 years. And we were having a conversation, and he said one thing he didn't understand about— he's from Watts. He's from Watts, LA.

Right, right, right.

Inner city, inner city kid. I love the way he presents himself and everything like that. I love his demeanor. He got hired. He's doing a great job, no problems. But he struggles with what he calls two-facedness. And he believes that he can— he has these brothers. We call each other like we're family on the fire department. Right. That's the culture of the fire department. This is your family. We have each other's backs. When we go into fires together, and we don't leave that house fire until all of us are coming out of that house. If something happens to a family, one of our family members, we rally around them. We have guys that have come down with cancer. We stop by their house, mow their lawns. We bring dinners to help the family while that person is, you know, fighting their illness. So he said, "From where I'm from, if you say you're my brother, you're my brother, and I have your back 100%." Yeah. He had a situation where he told the couple of his classmates, the guys he was hired with, uh, some things, or, uh, they had a performance issue or something like that. Basically, they turned on him, and instead of coming to him directly, they told supervisors or something like that. And it's something minor like a performance issue or something like that that we all have, and you get past. Um, he goes, 'Kay, what I'm not used to is, uh, why didn't they just tell me? They said they're my brothers.' And so that's what we got started talking about, how few of us there are. And they are your brothers, they are your colleagues. I do believe that, but I feel like you still have to protect yourself. Like whatever it was that he shared with them that he didn't feel like he was able to accomplish well, that he needed more assistance with, and he didn't mean for it to go further. He was just super disappointed in that. And I still— and my point is that he felt it was a him and a them, whereas prior to that he thought it was brothers and we're family and we're gonna— and we and us. And, uh, he was disappointed in that. And then— and my thing is you just have to be able to maneuver being a part of we and us but understanding there's still a you And you can still be true to yourself, but just kind of be wary of where the line stops. Learn people, watch people. Of course. Just like you do with friends, I guess. Anybody in life.

Yeah. So let's go a little further with, you know, I know that you are the only Black female in, at your, would you say fire station? Is it firehouse? I watch Station 19, so they call it a firehouse a lot.

It's a fire station or firehouse.

Okay, perfect.

There's 427 sworn firefighters in Mesa, and I'm the only Black female.

That is unheard of. That's so crazy. And so, you know, we all know that we're probably not the biggest fans of our last president, you know, 45. You know, I saw family members, I saw friends change in the blink of an eye because they were emboldened to speak their true mind. Being the only Black female firefighter at your station, have you felt like you've always been treated fairly? Have you been, you know, always involved in the conversation when you're talking about we're a team? Or have you always felt supported where you're not the only one in the fire and the people are like, let's leave her in there. That kind of thing. How is that? You know, how, you know, especially talk if there's a difference between pre-'45 and post-'45, talk to that as well on how you're treated.

Okay. Um, first of all, the answer to that is yes and no. Um, about how I'm treated as a Black, woman on the department, and the first and only. When I was up— now let's also understand that once 45 became in office, I feel like it emboldened those people that don't like people of color to speak their minds, speak it freely, and without be unapologetic about it. Like they said what they, you know, however they felt and they carried themselves in that way. When I first came onto the department, there was a gentleman that I promise you, he's since retired. He was the chief of the training department. So he was over our training. I promise you, he voted for President Trump, which is a-okay if that's what he believed in. But this was 20 years ago. 21 years ago, I'm hired on. A bunch of us were having problems getting to work on time. So it was me and maybe 4 other people. The second time that I came in late, walked in late with another person, in fact, another guy, we were individually called to the office and the chief said, Kaylyn, the training officer said, Kaylyn, don't be late again. Why were you late? And I didn't have, I was like, I overslept. And keep in mind, um, I was in my early 20s. We don't need to go into my age either. That's another thing I should have put on the form. Let's not talk about my age.

We will not talk about your age.

Anyway, I'm just, I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. But I was younger and, uh, not aloof, but aloof. You supposed to get to it. At least you can do, if someone has hired you for a job, show up on time.

Show up.

So I show up late. Yes. And they told me, don't be late again. And I was like, okay, I need to get myself together. I'm not worried about the other people that have come in late until this. They send me back out there, send me back out to the field where everyone's already involved in our activities for the day. And then the chief calls me individually, Kaylyn, and waves me over. We sit in his office. He has some papers, he slides them across the table and he looks just, full of— he looks happy as all get out. He said, "You are fired." And I was like, "I'm fired?" You know what I'm saying? I'm like, "Really?" And my pride overcame me because this was an old— he was probably 60 years old. First of all, they weren't too fond of women on the Mesa Fire Department. I can't imagine what our fire chief, Mary Camelli, with 37 years on this department went through when she first got on. But I'm also Black, and I'm the first Black person they've seen come through, first Black woman they've seen come through. So that's a double whammy. I proudly signed the paperwork and walked myself right back out to the parking lot and drove home. My inspiration for becoming a firefighter was a friend of mine who has also— who just retired a couple of years ago from the Phoenix Fire Department. She was new on her career. I called her and told her what happened. She's the one that helped me get ready to test with Mesa. I got on, it was a success. She's also Black female. She told me, "They, Kaylin, they will be calling you. They don't understand what they've done." I don't believe he made that step without any, I didn't have any paperwork to substantiate that I was a problem there. I hadn't been written up for being late. There was no paper trail on my activities. And being the nerd that I was, I had great scores. Scores in the academy. So there was no paperwork on me. So she was like, they have just fired the first Black woman in the department. And I told her, well, so-and-so walked in late with me and nothing happened to him. And she goes, they'll be calling you back. And true to form, true to what she said, they called me back 3 or 4 days later and insisted I hadn't been fired. And I was like, I have a copy of paperwork says I've been released.

I'm reading right now.

Yeah. And I'm on my way to my other, my other job. So they asked me to come back in and we made a deal that they would send me to EMT school. Back then you needed to already have— you needed to eventually get EMT certified. And then I would start again in the next academy. And I went with that, Lisa. And I thank her to this day because now 3 years and some change from retirement, from being done completely. Best decision I ever made, best advice I ever got. Lisa Jones said, "Whatever you do when you go into this meeting, get your job back." And I did. I was very agreeable. They had human resources, the main fire chief, all types of white shirts in there. We had a discussion and And here we are. So I was in, I had that incident and I am going to be straight up tell you that had everything to do with the fact that I'm Black and everything to do with the fact that I'm a woman. Right. As a rookie, I walked into Fire Station Stray. There was notorious Station 8, old guys. There's an airport out there. It's a slower station. So that's where old guys would go. To do their jobs and it was less strenuous. I walked in, I was working overtime, and said good morning to the guys at the station. If you're the rookie, the booter as they call it, then you go to work, you say good morning, and you start mopping floors, cleaning bathrooms, wiping the truck down, checking equipment. And I was ready to do that, but I walked in and said, good morning, everyone, how are you? Introduce myself. They're reading the newspaper. And this is literally what happened. Oh. Back to their newspapers, rolled their eyes. And I got to know those guys a little bit further down my career. And that was motivated because of my color, as I've gotten to know them. So you have all kinds at work and as you go through life.

Yeah.

And you can't believe it's happening, though, like in the 2000s we're in.

No shit.

Can dislike you for the color of your skin.

Like we're back in the '60s, right?

Right.

So I want to go back a little bit to something you said a few minutes ago. What did it look like when you said you went in there, you were very agreeable, you got your job back? Because, you know, we can always assume that, oh, she just sold her soul. Or like, what did that look like?

Okay. What it looked like is, um, the way I was raised, you, uh, doesn't matter. That Billy, Trevor, John also came in late. I came in late. So I have been taught by my parents who have been very pivotal in who I am. Be accountable for what you did. If you did it, you are responsible for the consequences.

There we go.

So I went in with that knowing that I should not have been let go if they also weren't let go.

Right.

So they asked me why I was late again in the meeting. And I said, because I overslept. And they asked me, were you aware of the rules that were introduced to you on day 1 of the academy that you were to show up on time at your desk and prepare to go? I said, yes, I am aware of that rule. Their problem as a city is that they didn't have any documentation, any paperwork where I had been written up or counseled or anything like that. They just have a document that says, we fired this, this woman.

Right.

Um, so what they did have to lean on Trey was, okay, maybe you are exhausted, Kaylyn, because of all of the stress that you're going through because of the accident that I had. Two weeks before going into the, um, fire academy, I was driving and had an accident that resulted in a young kid being killed. He was running across the street with his friend, cars were, it was really dark, there was construction in the area, all the streets, like street lights were out, all of these construction signs, there was a Circle K on the north side of the street, its lights were casting shadows everywhere, these boys were mid-block there was a traffic light probably 100 yards ahead, but they were mid-block trying to cut across the street to a field, presumably so they could get back home. The car ahead of me started swerve. So I'm thinking it's 10 o'clock at night, they're probably drunk. I'm looking ahead at the car and I'm looking at the green traffic light and I'm like, I need to get around them. And be on my way. Never would I have imagined that there'd be pedestrians in the street. So there was two at the median. One of them darted out in front of that car that swerved out and then in front of me. I had no time to react. I remember all in a split second seeing, right, to the left of me, his friend holding a white paper bag, his Circle K bag. And then it's so crazy. It's like all probably in less than a second. It's a split second. I see his friend right there in the left quarter panel of my car. I see him. I see his friend. I'm like, no. In my mind, I hit my brake, but it was too late. I just did not have time to make any sort of evasive maneuver. I hear a thud. My Jeep comes to a stop, and his limp body is like almost to the intersection. Wow. And his— yeah, his limbs were turned every which direction. I get out of my Jeep. It was a 4-speed at the time, so it died. I looked like— we're all just speechless. A couple of cars had stopped. This is like immediately after the impact. I look at his friend. He's like the same color as that white paper bag he was holding, and he's frozen stuck. And my eyes are big. And I walk over to his friend that I hit. And I know immediately that he's dead. And I'm shaking. And at the time, this is like 2000, March of 2000. So the anniversary of it was just last month. Wow. I have a flip phone, but you don't know what to do. You're just like frozen. The car ahead of me had swerved to miss him, stopped. And the lady got out, and she just grabbed me and hugged me. And she said, it's not your fault. It's not your fault. And she must have told her husband to call 911. There was a fire station— this was in Ahwatukee— less than half a mile away. They showed up, and then it was just a freaking blur. I'm just watching things unravel. The firefighters are getting there. And it's so crazy because this was— this is going to be my life for the next 20 years, I think. But I didn't know what was going to happen. I've never been in any sort of trouble or had any Incidents like this with law enforcement. Okay, so everything's happening. The detective comes to me, we're talking, this kid's mother shows up and I hear her scream and it's a scream I've heard so many times over 20, 21 years. She screamed bloody murder and I'll never forget. It's been 21 years since this accident and I'll never forget it. And he took me in his car, asked me some questions. I went home that night. Couldn't sleep. And then I called my parents the next day and told them what happened. And for a whole year, they investigated this. I had to hire an attorney to defend myself because I didn't know what was going to happen from there. And, you know, basically, I was on the line for vehicular manslaughter. And I was— I had a bunch— I had grief. I had guilt. Why did it have to go out at that time? What could I have done differently? And then I was angry because I was just starting my new career. Um, I gave that attorney every dime that I had, which was $5,000. At the end of it, he said, uh, obviously it was, uh, slate was wiped clean. I was deemed not at fault. Um, that attorney was like, kid, you have your whole life ahead of you. He goes, forget about the rest. He goes, I'm glad I was able to help you. So that was it.

Kaylyn, that, like, just hearing you tell that story is so impactful, you know, and I can imagine it's been 21 years mentally, emotionally. I know it's something that you never get over, you know, but how long, like, I can't imagine you were able to tell me that story like you just told me. You know, 20 years ago.

How—

what was that process like with you coming to terms of, you know, because, you know, I've never taken another life, but if, if what I can imagine in taking another life is like, oh my God, you know, how— what— like you said, what could I have done differently? What could I have changed? You know, why is my life worth living? And, you know, just all those things in which I'm sure you fought through some demons and How long did it take you to walk through that adversity and go, okay, emotionally I think I'm okay now?

I think in any grieving process there isn't a definitive how long. You just learn how to manage it. Like I mentioned, I, um, like all of us, you know, eventually will lose a parent. I lost a parent. I don't think I'm ever going to get over it, but I'll learn how to manage the grief. I feel bad for that kid. He was 14, so he would have been 35 last month. I think about him. I think about him every year. And it's just, you become manageable. I wondered why me? And I'm one of those people, I'm not religious, but I'm spiritual, spiritual. And I believe like, it is not that it's supposed to happen. I don't believe that. But things happen because that's life and it makes you stronger. There is— you have to be able to learn how to gain strength from it or to pull something positive from it.

I love that.

So what it did for me is make me believe in my own strength that I can get past it. I am comfortable in the fact that I know it was not my fault. It didn't happen to me. It would have— it could have been the car behind me. It could have been the car ahead of me that swerved. It could have happened to any of us. But fate saw it that Kaylyn was strong enough to handle it. Guess what? She's going to be handling it because I'm going to see that every other day for the next 20 years, 25 years. And it's given me a more— when you go through things that are hard and then you see someone else go through it, It gives you a level of compassion that will help the next person.

Absolutely.

So thank you. So that's, you know, that's it.

Yeah, I appreciate you sharing that, you know. I mean, because, you know, some people are like, you know, it's hard to talk about those things, but I know that that's something that's so valuable and it's so pivotal in your life. So, you know, I'm— I was so sorry to hear about your dad and his sudden passing.

Oh, thank you.

And you speak, you know, you, you opened up talking about the impact that they had on you. You know, I feel feel like they're, you know, because cultural circumstances based on how we were raised. I 100% believe that we are who we are today is because of our conditioning, direct result of our conditioning, our environment, all of those things, whether it's you're doing the exact thing or you're doing the opposite, but there's motivation. You speak so highly about the impact of your parents. How did your parents instill integrate, implement things that you are living with today? How did they help Kalen become the Kalen we see today?

I'm with you, Trey. I believe your parents and your upbringing, uh, are so influential in who you become. And it seems like the older I get, the more I appreciate that, and I just get it. I don't know that I've ever like kind of verbalized How, but one thing, I'm so grateful to both my mom and dad. They just set me up right for a good life. And, but I still think I'm just, I think I'm fortunate in that he was so driven to get his education, to get gainful employment.

—right—

and to raise his family and take care of his family. And it just rubbed off on me for some reason. It's just— I don't know if it becomes genetic and, you know, environmental or what. But I went to high school. I graduated top of my class. And then because of where I grew up and because of who my parents were, it's really no discussion. After high school is college. I mean, for every— for everyone. So I went to college and, uh, lo and behold, I became a firefighter. Now that's the, the loop that I threw my, uh, dad who, uh, grew up in a generation where women weren't firefighters. Right. Um, and you know, he paid for this, uh, nice education and then that's what I chose to do. But, um, I don't know. I think they— that's a hard question to answer because I believe your upbringing has an effect on how much confidence you have in yourself, how much you believe in yourself, how much you think you can achieve. Yes. And it's super, just super, super important. And then it, like, trickles over. At my dad's funeral, I thought it was so sweet. My brother spoke. And he said, one thing my dad said was, you take care of your family. And I presume that's because he took care of us. And Kevin spoke— my brother spoke to my dad and said, that's what I'm going to do. And he is the replica of my dad. He is taking care of his family. He's got a good job that he goes to every day. He doesn't— he hasn't missed a day of work. Those types of— that work ethic is there. So that's super important. And then, like, being kind. I think I have the kindest mother one could ever have. Kind, warm, compassionate, caring. And I know I have those traits. Yeah. I was also raised to be super humble, so you can see that was hard for me to say I have those traits, but I do. Yeah. I'm a kind person.

You are a kind person. You are. And I feel, you know, because I can attest to the fact that whenever you and I converse, like right now, I know it's just the two of us, but I always feel like I'm the most important person in the room when I'm speaking with you. Yeah.

So I mean, that's— wait till you— wait, I want you to meet my mom. You wait till you meet Betty Jo Gill. Yes. That's how she makes you feel. And that means I want to be just like her. Yeah.

That's so special. What do you think? You know, let's really talk to our Black people now. What do you think is— what do you think it takes? I know you had parents, you know, what about like, like my parents were divorced when I was 2. My dad left when I was 2. Is my mom, she's working all these different jobs. She's working, you know, paycheck to paycheck, that kind of thing. And so when I look at like, like here is me telling, you know, just, just being vulnerable here. One thing that I learned from my mom was to get payday loans. Right now, if I were to really, really, because I watched her do it. And so I, yeah, I followed right in her footsteps. It wasn't until I was like early thirties that I went, oh, these aren't so good for real. And so, and then I watched, you know, some of my, my, my siblings, you know, like my brother who was like, who didn't really have high aspirations to achieve things, you know, which is why, like, what do you what do you think that ingredient is that allows some of our people to flourish and some who just don't?

Gosh, like, what is it? Like, are you asking, like, for, as an example, what was it about you in your 30s that made you realize payday loans aren't so good?

No, I'm just all Black people, like, like, like, just kind of all of the above, you know? What do you think when you see people that, you know, maybe that we both know, we have some successful friends, you know? Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. Just what do you think that ingredient is?

That's a good question. And this is what I think it boils down to, honestly. Choices. And the reason it's a— it's, it's— you have to know who you are, who you want to be, and make a choice to go whatever direction it is that you decide. Right. And the reason I say this is because I used to downplay my own success because I grew up with a parent— with two parents a mom and a dad that were married for 51 years. Wow. My— yeah, 51 years. Um, they, uh, were— remained together until he passed last year. Um, he went to college, so he instilled in us going to college. You know, we were middle to upper middle class, and so because of the way that I was set up— oh, he paid for college, offered to send me to France to college, but I was like No, I want to stay close to home. I'm going to go straight up the street to University of Colorado in Boulder. So I'm going to decline that. But can you give me— I come home every weekend and get money for the week. And then every semester, he'd write out a check. Like, I used to downplay my successes because I believe— I was in my mind, I was like, I have no reason not to be successful. But I could have thrown all of that away and become a drug addict or done something like that. So I made a choice to do the right thing and can continue on and be what I deem to be successful. Or— and then there's people that maybe did not have those. You know, maybe they are single, come from a single-parent home, and maybe had to struggle a little bit financially. I didn't have the opportunities for college. And that makes it harder. And I respect those people that pulled themselves up out of that, like Vanessa, who was on a previous podcast of yours. Right. Pull yourself out of whatever situation, make decisions to make your life better and to give yourself opportunities. And she's highly successful. And the reason she's successful is because of the choices she made. So I stopped downplaying my own success just because of what my parents, the opportunities they provided for me. And to me, I feel like it boils down to choices, uh, for anyone. I think Black people, we, we have some disadvantages that all of us know of, and then we could go on and on and on back, you know, the trickle-down effect from slavery and stuff like that. I believe, um, we are at, uh, you know, some disadvantages, but I believe that you can make choices to, um, provide yourself and your family with a better better, you know, a better life, better ways of living. Yeah. And that's so true. It's a choice.

It is a choice. Everything is a choice. How we react to things is a choice because, because in between a stimulus and a response is what? Choice. Is choice. Everything is about choice. Yeah.

I love that. And, and, and it's okay to make a mistake. If you make a choice and you make a mistake, you can still make a choice to recover from that mistake. Yeah. So, um, you know, I had that car accident and Trey, I, I don't even know words to like fully encapsulate how I felt deflated, defeated. I had, I was going into the fire academy, hired, um, in 2 weeks. Yeah. Um, life is going great. I had $5,000 in my pocket, you know, I'm going out to meet some friends and this happens. Now, I had a choice. I could hang in there and do whatever I could, find the resources to help me to build, to kind of get out of the situation, to defend myself, to— you know, I didn't have a car, so I was like, I need a rental car. The PD department, they— I forget the word for it, but basically took my car because it was part of an investigation. Yeah. I had to figure it out. So I had a choice, either keep fighting, get to that academy, um, uh, or I could have gone and been like, you know what, they're gonna let me go anyway as soon as, you know, I could have just, right, just gone in a room and cried myself to sleep.

So I'm gonna pivot a little bit. So thank you so much for being so open and sharing. So I want to talk about, again, another part of Kalen. You know, when I look at Kalen and I remember the last time, you know, we hung out, I said, you didn't gain any pandemic pounds like everybody else. And you're like, nope. And I remember the first time our mutual friend Jenny met you, you came in the door and Jenny goes, damn, I wish my jeans looked like that on me the way they do on her.

You know? Is that what she said?

She did. That is exactly what she said. She's like, wow, wow, pow, you know, kind of thing. So what is it that, like, you know, because obviously you've gone through some stuff, some, you know, very, very pivotal. How do you maintain the high physical level that you maintain and also emotionally? Like, like, is there a routine, something that you do in the morning? Just like, how do you prep for the day? You know, because something that I do with my clients is Every day I get up and I, and I ask myself, okay, what's my number on a scale of 1 to 10? 10 is I'm dancing on the side of the road and there's no music playing, but I feel good. I mean, you have seen me hang from the rafters where I'm feeling so good. That's a 10. Most of the time I generate myself up to an 8, 8.5, sometimes 9. Right now I'm about a 9, right? Because I love doing this, but I don't just roll out of bed and I'm a 9. How does Kalen become the Kalen who is emotionally well, she's physically fit? What gets you ready to take on your day?

I'm just generally happy now. Like you, I don't roll out of bed and consider my mood to be in a 9 or a 10. But some mornings, sometimes when I go to bed, I'm like, I can't wait for the freaking next day. Because I want to do this, this, and this. And I don't know where it comes from, but I think just having all of your circumstances in order helps. Like, you like— liking, enjoying your job. There's nothing worse. I can't imagine waking up and, and saying, oh my God, I got to go into this, got to go into this fire station today, or I got to go into the office today. Now let's keep it real. We're all regular people. I'm a regular person. I have days like that where I don't feel like it. But in general, it's just kind of being— it's a general contentment. And then if at any point I don't feel content in something, I just try to figure out a way to make it better, or I just will tell myself it'll pass. I'll feel better. Let me just do this next thing and I will feel better. Working out and training, I started when I was 21. And being on the fire department has enabled me to easily maintain it because at my age now of 48, I can't imagine going to work 9 to 5, getting off work, taking off my suit, putting on my workout clothes and going to the gym. There's just no freaking way. So I understand the struggles those of us, most people have that, you know, don't have the job I have. My job, there's a gym at the station. There's almost no excuses. But I started working out, Trey, before I was a firefighter. And, but I was younger, so I had the energy. That's what I did. I went to work and after I got off work, I went to the gym. For me, it's gotten to beyond aesthetics, but I've always been competitive. And so I always try to get better every day. So it feeds my need to be athletic. And then gradually as I've gotten older, it just relaxes my mind. That is my time in the gym. I love that. That is my time. I'm just focused on sweating and feeling my body, feeling my limbs move, feeling my heart pump, letting that sweat just come down. That's my time. And it's just something, it's just in me. And I'm glad, and I'm glad because also as you get older and you become, I'm a medic on the department, you learn the benefits of it. You know, it'll make, you know, as I get older, it makes it just, it's just easier. Saves off so many health issues. So many health issues.

Would you say, because not everybody can say the words that you just said, that you get up, you go to sleep, you're too— you're so excited. I couldn't say that. Like, I was a high school teacher for 24 years, probably for the first, uh, 15, 16, I was— I could say that the last 8 to 10 years, I wasn't saying that anymore, which was why that was motivation for me to make that jump. Would you say that Kaylyn has created her life by design? These are choices. Everything's a choice, right? Mm-hmm. Have you been intentional with creating the life that you've always wanted to live?

Absolutely. I met a Black female firefighter. I remember I asked her— she was like super fit. This is a friend of mine, and I can say her name is Lisa Jones, and she's a retired Phoenix firefighter. She was super fit. And so I was super fit and I was like, hey, so you work out? She's like, yes. And I was like, what do you do? And she's like, I'm a firefighter. And I was like, a firefighter? So this is in 1999. OK. And I was like, you're a firefighter? And we exchanged information. She let me do a ride-along. Which people can do on the fire department, just with this coronavirus. As soon as this gets over, we'll do more ride-alongs. I did a ride-along, and I love the fact that every day was different. Like, every call was different. And in between, they would train or work out or talk about strategy and tactics, go to the grocery store. I know people have seen us in the grocery store shopping, ribbing each other. It was light. But then when there was an emergency, it was like a well-oiled machine, how they worked together as a team, and, and they were able to help that person, um, on what we call their worst— the worst day of their life. When you call 911, generally it's the worst day of your life, and so you're showing up to help them through that catastrophe. I was sold, and, uh, so I made a concerted choice to test for Mesa Fire Department after I did my research on which city in the East Valley I wanted to try for. I tried for Mesa. I got on and I looked at also because I'm, even though I was young, I did look ahead and I was like, wow, they have a pension. They have, I have health benefits. I'm going to be taking a little bit of a pay cut, but I can work overtime. Like I'm real concerted in that. And that's like the best. When I tell you that's the best decision I ever made. At 48 years old, I could literally walk out of the station right now and call it my last day. I'll collect a pension. They give— they have retirement saving plans. I'll get health after— health benefits after I retire. And that's why I want to talk. Sometimes if you see it, you can believe it. So when we get— when I get out of the ladder truck in some of the neighborhoods where I work in downtown Mesa and these Black kids are out playing in the street or whatever, even, you know, the Mexican kids, all the white, little white, young white girls, they run up. I feel so good. And they're like, oh my God, I want to be like you, I want to be like you. I love it. Absolutely. And, and I hope, I don't know what'll happen, maybe that'll stick with them and one of them will become a firefighter and get to enjoy all that I have, have a fun career, of course with its ups and downs and the things that you see every day, every day, the things unfortunate things people go through, but you're able to help them with it. Maybe I'll be able to make the difference in someone else's life, like Lisa, me meeting Lisa Jones that one day in 1999. Yeah. And not even knowing, I didn't even know women were firefighters. Maybe I can have that effect on someone, you know, someone, some other little girl. Absolutely. That's what I'm hoping to do after I retire. Just maybe speak to young kids, speak to college kids. Yeah, because it's a, it's a nice career. So is that, is that your plan?

Like, you know, because some people are like, I just can't wait to retire, I'm gonna buy a Winnebago and I'm gonna get all the 50 states and I'm gonna put them on the tire on the back and I'm gonna color them in. And that's what I'm looking forward to doing with Joyce, you know, me and Joyce are going. Yeah, you're right.

That's what one of my friends actually did. She bought, she bought a Winnebago. Retired firefighter. Yep. We, we went to a retirement party and she showed up with this big old thing and I was like, this is where you live now? She said, he's like, sure is. Yep. All the states. Yes, which I love to travel to. Yes, I think I'm gonna take a plane when I retire, but yes, in the interim I want to be— or I'll jump in a car. I want to, uh, just, uh, I had an idea to, uh, to have a, um, a little business called Kay Speaks, and I would be able to talk to young kids, to college athletes, um, to, uh, women to women that are considering jobs in male-dominated fields, even to organizations that maybe want someone to come in and talk about teamwork and what makes a winning team, what creates a winning culture, and just kind of draw on my experiences as a firefighter and offer what I have. My problem is my humility. My problem is my humility. So if I can just believe that I do have something to offer. Um, and maybe I can be an inspiration, especially to some young Black girl is what I hope for. Yeah.

Then we'll just know that you're an inspiration to Black girls who are the same age. So, you know, just know that you are, yeah, you are an inspiration. I love that. Kay Speaks. Let me tell you, I'm working on my signature talk right now. We should definitely get together and do some stuff because I think you'll be a powerful speaker. 100%. So Kay Speaks is your second chapter then?

Yeah, it might be. I, it will be. That's— I'm going to do it. I just need to get, um— I would love to do that. I want to tell you, you're like Barbara Walters. You almost made me cry, and I would be mad. Did you cry? You know, some of our friends would be cracking up. They would. They would.

I can't believe you cried.

They would. Uh-huh. You cried, Kalen. Um, I was like, Trey is really trying to pull a Barbara Walters, Oprah Winfrey. Right, right, right.

Oh my goodness. Yes. Right. So just a couple more questions before we wrap up. I love that, you know, and how open you've been with sharing everything. What would you say are Kaylyn's biggest fears? Like, and the reason why I ask that is because I like to lean into, I'm working really hard on facing my fears right now. I have two really big ones. One is death. I'm really scared of it.

Okay.

You know, cause I don't know what's, I don't know what that looks like. You know, the second one is not fulfilling my potential and taking my dreams and my visions to the grave.

Those are my two fears. I want to tell you one thing, the, uh, cojones that it took you to stop being a teacher that you'd been doing, you said for 24 years and to go into this, which you clearly have a passion for and you're talented. I watched some of your first podcasts, which you were excellent in, to some of your more recent and awesome. I'm like totally serious. I was like, you on? I don't know. It seems like a conversation. I was like nervous as all get out to do this podcast. And I really do feel like we just were sitting around talking. There it is. Only thing we're missing is some tequila. So that's awesome. Good. Yeah. As far as my fears, if I'm being really honest, I've always had a fear of getting older. And somebody said, well, it's actually a blessing because what's the alternative? And I don't know why. So that's probably something everybody has heard of, but I never— I was like, that hit me different. I was like, right, right. So all I can do is take care of myself and, and, and give myself the best opportunity to be healthy into my retirement. Um, and just trust in, like I said, I trust in God that he will keep me healthy. And if I do get a health scare, uh, to have the strength to, uh, to get, get through it. Like I've demonstrated to myself, I believing in oneself is huge. I've demonstrated to myself with all the other hurdles that I've had in my life. All of us have. You get past it and you should, uh, give it— all of us should give ourselves kudos for our accomplishments and getting past what we have. And that's what I need to do. And so I've been taking care of myself. So that fear of getting older and what that means for my body and maybe my mind, I need to— I, every day I think about it and I just need to let it go and just keep setting myself up, making those choices. Choices, right? Choices to do the things that it takes to maintain good health.

Love that. So I know that you're looking forward to K Speaks. Tell me a couple of things that are on Kalen's bucket list. What else is out there that you're like, before I die, I got to do these couple of things?

Because I believe and I feel like I have a long way before I die. But this job has told me that tomorrow— it's taught me tomorrow isn't necessarily promised. I want to travel more and kind of be more free-spirited in, like, my spending, like treating myself more, being kinder to myself. I've been— I'm a lot like my dad. It's just like I got a plan for the future. Yeah, I'm more apt to, you know, have fun. But my bucket list would be like to see parts of Africa. Absolutely. To travel more into South America and being a short timer at work with retirement on the horizon and the option to stop right now. It is so hard. Like, you want to plan a trip, but you're like, God, I got to go to work on Wednesday. It's like a pain, but it's a good pain to have. It's a good thing to have. I'm grateful for it. Yeah. So I don't have a specific bucket list. I've been able to do a lot. Over the years, but just travel more, spend more time with my friends. I think friendships and relationships are more and more important to me. Absolutely. So just being a little bit more focused on that and just being happy and being grateful. Like, I just every day I like think about that. Stop being down for menial things. Just be up and grateful. Yeah. This coronavirus pandemic has taught me that too. Nice.

I love that. Love that. So you're not on any social media anywhere? Like, it's like if I didn't know you, I know it's like, it would be like, I don't know anything about this girl, right? But let's say someone's listening to this podcast and they go, I want to get in touch with her so she can come speak to the youth, so she can come speak to my, my group of people.

How can they contact you? I guess I'm old school to everybody because I'm not on Instagram, Twitter. Right, not even on Facebook. Never, never had a MySpace account from back in the day. Yeah, I don't have to tell you my age. Oh, everybody can guess it with this, but I can be reached at, on, by email specialkgill@yahoo.com, specialkgill@yahoo.com. And my phone number is 602-326-0023. It's the same phone number I had since flip phones. I love it. So I'm reachable that way. So feel free to call, text, or email. All right. I'm gonna drop that phone number in the show notes.

Very cool. I love it. I love it. Kaylin, thank you so much. This has been an absolute blast for me. I've learned even more about you today. And I feel like you really did drop some nuggets for the audience because just all the things that you've gone through is definitely a testament to the adversity that made you the person that you are today. So thank you so much for being so forthcoming and so open and sharing that with us.

It has been a pleasure. Thank you, Trey. Thank you. Absolutely.

If you like what you're hearing and perhaps you're interested in having a complimentary conversation with me, click the link at the bottom of the show notes. Thank you so much for listening. If you even want to know more about what I'm up to, head over to traviasteward.com. Com. And if you like seeing the videos of the podcast, every episode is on my YouTube channel. Take care, guys.