Interview With Woot Johnson (Ayo & Keyz) :: Producer's 20/20 Vision

Woot! How are you?

Doing well, Wendy Day. How about yourself?

I am doing awesome. Thank you so much for being here. So I'm doing a series for producers called 20/20 Vision. And basically what I'm doing is just educating them on how to make money as a producer. And as someone who— you actually have two roles, which is kind of— you're a twofer today. Um, you manage producers and then you also really get the whole publishing side. So I'm just going to ask you a bunch of questions today. I guess let's start by having you introduce yourself.

Absolutely. So, uh, hello guys, I am Woot Johnson. I'm born and raised here in Atlanta, Georgia. I've been in the music industry, I'll say, probably 5 years at this point. Kind of really got into it in 2014, 2015. So my day job, 9 to 5, you know, I'm A&R for Songtrust here in Atlanta, Georgia. So I had the whole A&R process down here. So anybody that's unpublished, self-published, definitely come holla at me. On the flip side of that, as Wendy just stated, I lead, head the A&R for Ayo and Keyz's label, the Upperclassmen Music Group, here in Atlanta. So on that label side, we have 4 producers, 2 writers, actually 3 writers at this point, and 1 artist. Within that, I do manage pretty much everybody on the label. So I do manage 4 producers, I manage a rising songwriter right now, two songwriters and artists. So that's pretty much my day-to-day.

Yay! So if a producer wants to hire a manager, what skill set should they look for? Like, what do you look for in a manager?

I would recommend someone obviously who's knowledgeable about the business, someone you'll be able to learn from. They'll be able to pour a lot more information into you. Also someone that has relationships, I would say, that would be able to get you in certain rooms or, you know, have those relationships with certain clients that you may not have to be able to help and aid your career. So one, someone who's knowledgeable, someone you trust, and then I would say also lastly, the end, like I just stated, someone who has a lot of relationships to be able to put you in those rooms, provide more opportunities for you, for you to be able to advance.

Gotcha. So if somebody is a new producer, and most of the folks that, that seem to watch my videos are relatively new to the industry. What are some things that they can do? Um, I'm gonna ask this twofold. One, to increase their ability to get placements, and my second part of that question would be to become better producers or beatmakers themselves, right?

So I'll tackle the second question first, just to better your So you have to study. I think you have to study the game, study the people that come before you, study the sound that's going on right now. Um, and it's not really stealing the sound, but it's educating yourself, knowing about certain drum patterns, some certain chords, actually playing the keys, like really taking on that craft and studying the people that comes before you to actually learn that sound. Um, two, I would say the first question to Help yourself get placements. You know, one thing I tell a lot of upcoming producers, everybody wants to shoot to the star, everybody wants to get a record to Beyoncé or Chris Brown or Justin Bieber and the Drakes. Start at the level you were at first. You have a lot of people within your network that you know, um, in the, in the creative community that you can reach out to. So I would say start building with them first, um, and it's okay to get these smaller placements with up-and-coming artists, you know, um, and that's actually, I would say, the cheat code. That's one thing we've been doing on our end is, you know, we have our A&R team and we're like looking like, who's the next artist? So attaching yourself with them, because guess what, if you give them a hit, the artist is going to get signed, the label is going to be like, well, what producer produced this record? There you go, that's your way into the industry. So it's okay, I know everybody wants to shoot to the stars, like I said, to get the big placements, but I would say start at the ground level and work with the creators, you know, that you have access to. If you're excited about some new artists Everyone has IG at this point, so DM them, find an email, and see how you can connect with them.

That's great advice. What is one of the ways that somebody can study the new sound? And the reason I'm asking you that is, when I get to be in the studio, I get to hear the music that people are making, and it's always a little bit different than the music that's dropping, because the songs that are dropping today were kind of recorded like 6 months ago. You know, when we're looking at major labels, it's a little different when you're indie. Is there a way that you're able to stay on top of the sound, or do you just have to be in that inner circle in the studio?

You don't really have to be. I mean, I think right now a lot of different platforms are doing a good job of grabbing some of these producers and doing a bunch behind the beats of how they created this sound. So like, again, it just goes back to studying the craft. So, you know, if you're an up-and-spiring producer, You know, there's plenty of platforms that, you know, that will have the songs that you're— that you love, or do you like to hear on the radio, that, you know, they've done one-on-ones and set the producer down, and really he's walking you through every single thing that he did to create that beat. And some producers are even giving out beat packs, um, they're selling beat packs to be able to hear what they're doing, and you can kind of put that into your own, you know, your own sound. So I would say, you know, study There's just so many ways that you can kind of look into how was this beat produced, or again, many producers are selling beat packs, some of them are very cheap. And also too, studying the game to figure out what's the next sound. I think that for me, I love producers who was always kind of ahead of the curve, you know. Certain songs will come out now, I'm like, this sounds like something, you know, it's 2, 3 years away, but it's here now. But just staying ahead of the curve and kind of figuring out what's trending, what's going on, and kind of make them into your own.

Got it. Um, as somebody that does work with producers, we just spoke about like what producers should look for in a manager. What does somebody like you look for in a producer if you're looking to bring them on board or manage them or just help their career, even just like as a mentor?

Yeah, absolutely. For me, just to manage some For me to mentor someone, you can just contact me. So I'm open, you know, anybody, I'm very accessible. So you guys can, you know, contact me IG, you know, have my email if you need it. You can contact me that way. But as far as managing a creative producer, for me, I look for versatility. So I don't want someone who just have one type of sound because I feel like our label and what we stand for, we're very diverse. So, you know, I want someone who can give me a pop record, or urban R&B record, a country record if needed, you know. So I look for a lot of versatility in their sound, and I try to push my producers now to continue to, you know, push your sound. You know, you don't want to walk into a room or a meeting and they tell you to press play and you run out of beats. Or they like, hey, you got something for this? So you always want to be prepared for any opportunity that's presented to you. I've had conversations with, you know, some well-established producers, and those were some wake-up calls for them, you know, in their earlier careers when they walked into some meetings and were underprepared. So, someone, you know, just underprepared as it relates to being versatile on their sound, you know, they thought they walked in the meeting for one sound, it was like, "Hey, do you have this?" and you don't have nothing, you know. So, someone who's very versatile, again, You know, as far as the sound, I have to have a certain ear. So as long as the beats, the drums are very sharp and your chords are very sharp, so certain things I have to hear, you know, to be like, okay, this is somebody that I think we can, you know, we can get some placements with, or I can see that their career can go far.

That's outstanding. Um, are there, are there up-and-coming producers that you kind of watch to see like what they're doing and what they're working on?

Absolutely. Right now, you know, like Jetson Made It, and you know, I think you interviewed ATL Jacob, like just the younger guys.

Oh my God, I love ATL Jacob. I also love Carter Z.

Right. And you know, so I look at their— I look at what they're doing. I hear some of the placements that are coming out, and I can hear how the song, how their sound is evolving. Even also with the producers that I manage, you know, Marco Mabee, Clip4 across the board. I mean, we got these, we signed these guys fresh out of college.

Wow.

Some were still in college when we signed them. And now, you know, just to see them have these Teyana Taylor placements and Chris Brown placements and Eric Bellinger, just all some of the top artists to see how their sound is evolving. And sometimes I'll literally kind of go back on my drive and just hear, you know, what they had back in 2016, just 2020 now, it's like, your sound has evolved. 360, you know.

Wow, that's impressive.

Yeah. Wow.

Okay, so now I'm going to ask you to put on your Songtrust hat. How do, how do producers make money?

So there's a variety of ways. So the first one I'll touch on, the, the, I guess the most important one, which they always want to talk about, is the producer fee. Um, so if you produce a beat, you know, an artist cuts to your beat puts that record out. You know, I would— if you— I would suggest getting a lawyer, having a manager, someone that can represent you to, uh, to be able to negotiate those terms. So, um, I'm not going to throw a price out there, but there are tiers. So wherever you feel like you're at in your level, it can be $250, $500, $1,500 and up, um, to start. So I always have a starting place, and you'll kind of know where you're at in your career where your number needs to be as far as your producer fee. So that's just the upfront fee for them paying for your services, for using your beat. That's one end of it. The second end of it, I highly advise any creative to sign up with the home society, whether that's BMI, ASCAP if you're here in the US. CSAC is here, but it is invite only. But wherever you are in the country, you make sure you want to sign up with your home society. So that way, let's just say, you know, this record comes out and it's being played on radios, live events, clubs, etc., you have access to, you know, your royalties that you're owed. A lot of people don't understand. I talk with producers a lot of time and they're like, "Oh, I didn't even know I can get money from this." It's like, listen, once you produce a beat, you bounce it out, it's timestamped on your Mac or whatever device you're using, at that point you own the rights to that beat. You own the rights to that beat. Regardless if you sell the beat and then that song goes on to, like I said, to get placed on radios, become a mainstream record, or even just doing well streaming-wise, you still own the copyrights to that song. So make sure, I said producer fee is one way you can get paid. Your PRO company, which is BMI, ASCAP, here in the US, you can get paid that way. And also someone like Songtrust, I would highly advise right now, if you're early on in your career, Even if you're established, you know, there are admin and co-pub situations out there. Songtrust in particular, we're an admin company, so we pretty much will take you on as a client, make sure your songs are registered worldwide with every single collection society, both performance collection companies and your mechanical collection companies, to make sure we're collecting everything for you. So producer fee, BMI for your, for your, uh, your royalties, for your publishing royalties, I'll say, and your writers, your writers' share. And I would say get with the admin company such as Songtrust to be able to collect both your performance and your mechanical royalties.

Should they also sign up at, um, SoundExchange?

Absolutely, forgot about SoundExchange. So, yeah, for SoundExchange, for you, for guys who are watching who don't know, they collect your non-interactive streaming royalties. So let's just say you have a record that's playing on Pandora, Pandora, or SiriusXM radio, um, you know, you— or any internet radio station, any internet radio or cable network. I'll use Music Choice, right?

I forgot about them.

Yeah, so like Music Choice, the last— the 900 channels on your cable, they're playing your songs, they will send those payments to SoundExchange. So with those 5, you'll be able to collect everything, you know, that you need from a producer standpoint.

Yay! And the last question I want to ask you is about split sheets. How important are they?

Very important. It causes— it's very important because it minimizes— once the song is placed, it minimizes all the confusion, the back and forth with labels and managers and so forth. So I would highly advise, if you're in a session, when that session is near the end or that song is complete, you guys go ahead whoever is involved in their creative process, go ahead, fill out you guys' proper percentages for the record. I'm a very even, equal guy, so me personally, we try to split everything down the middle if everyone is involved. So that way, again, you have something to refer to if, you know, you're working with a major artist or you're working with any artist. It cuts out all the confusion once it's time to sign any type of paperwork or documents.

Awesome. Split sheets, are they tracking just the writer share, or do you list the publisher's share as well? So should— I guess what I'm asking is, do they equal 100% or 200%?

So it should equal— well, depending on your— it should equal 200%. So you want to have your writer share on there. If you are affiliated with the publishing company, you want to list their, you know, their— your publishing tag. If you're self-publishing, you just have yourself designated. So yeah, you want to have all— as much information is filled out as possible again, because when it comes down to these songs getting placed or, you know, if you are dealing with an artist that is signed, it can get very tricky, uh, especially if you're doing a lot of verbal. Never do any verbal commitments. You want to have something in writing. That way you can always refer back to it.

Yeah, especially if it becomes a hit record. People get selective memory.

Oh, absolutely. Very quickly.

Didn't I write the hook?

Right. Everybody in the room, oh, I— it's my line that makes the song pop.

It was like, it was my idea.

Right. Absolutely.

Woot, is there anything that I didn't ask you that I should have? Is there anything that I missed that would be helpful to a new producer?

Yeah, so here's one thing I've been talking to lately with a lot of producers. So, because we missed on one of them. So let's say you're a younger producer, right? And you're working with an artist, your friend. So he's using DistroKid or CD Baby to distribute his music. Let's say, you know, you guys discussed $500 for the fee. He pays you $500. Again, being that you are the copyright owner, you still have some type of ownership to the master copy. So a lot of times what I'm seeing now is a lot of unsigned artists, or even artists that are signed, producers are not collecting from their distributor their master percentages. So I would have some type of agreement or have something in a contract to where, you know, if they're using CD Baby, DistroKid, whoever they're using in the contract, to where they can sign you up to be able to collect your master share. Because there's a lot of artists out here, like I said, unsigned, that are doing well streaming, and $200, $300, $400, you know, can be a lot for some people. I have an unsigned artist now, and she's making some pretty good money on the DistroKid side. So, you know, we want to make sure that we're taking care of the producers as well. So, you know, like I said, make sure you are collecting on your master because you are a copyright owner of that. It's very important because you can be sitting to the side and the artist that you produce this record for can, you know, like I said, maybe not be a lot of money, but there's some money that there's there for you in a pot to collect.

Is that something Songtrust does? Do you guys collect the mechanical side?

So we do not from the— on the master side of it. We only deal with it, you know, publishing side. So yeah, like I said, if you're with the artist, I will have them sign, like, they can— there's a way they can go on their account and, and kind of make you— give you a percentage of that record. So whatever you guys discuss, 2, 3, 4, 5%, um, DistroKid, CD Baby can be able to send you that directly to your—

directly. Yep, beautiful.

So make sure you're doing that.

Oh, I thought of another question, if you don't mind. So where do you stand on leased beats or exclusive Beats, do you have an opinion on that?

It's tricky. You know, for me personally and our team, I mean, it's pretty much all exclusive. We don't really lease Beats. So if I had any advice, I would probably say I would lean more on the just try to do exclusive deals, because on the lease side, it can get tricky, especially just leasing it out to every single person and they're paying for it can get real tricky. Once one or two people wants to drop the record. So, um, I would probably stay— personally, I would stay on the exclusive side.

I agree with that. I did an interview last week with Abe from BeatStars, so we got the, the leased side of it for the producers that just want to make as much money as they can off of each beat. And of course, I'm, I'm more on the side that you are because I consult rappers that put out music to make money, and you can't put a budget behind the least beat. So I just wanted— I just always want people to have the balance between both sides.

Right. Absolutely. Nothing against it. You know, if that's how you make your money, you're able to sustain, I'm all for it. But personally, I would probably stay towards exclusive.

Yeah, I prefer seeing producers get the placements with the up-and-coming artists and the bigger artists, and you just can't do that with lease beats because you can't market and promote a lease beat, or you shouldn't.

100%. I agree 100%. Exactly.

Well, thank you so much for doing this.

Thank you for having me, and we, you know, we're going to be doing— I'm excited to see you later on this week, and, uh, you know, I'm always a phone call or text away. Just let me know.

I love that. What is your Instagram so that folks can follow you?

So it's Woot Exclusive. It's W-O-O-T, X as in x-ray, C-L-U-S-I-V-E. Woot Exclusive.

Beautiful. Thank you again for doing this, and congrats to your girlfriend on her new PhD.

Thank you so much, Wendy.

I'll see you later this week.

Okay, see you.

Okay, bye.