Wedding Planner Tips for Micro Wedding Venues, Late Payments, and Difficult Vendors | Wedding Q&A

Hi, and welcome to Union Podcast. My name is Jamie Wolfer, and I'm a wedding planner who absolutely loves to share how I got started and scaled my business to above 6 figures in this amazing and occasionally extremely competitive industry. In this podcast, I share the tech, tactics, mindset, and mistakes that got me to where I am today. No gatekeeping, no cloak and dagger, just full disclosure and a little humor along the way. So whether you're a planner or a solopreneur, my goal is for you to be a better business person than I ever could have been and support you on this journey. Let's dive into this week's episode. Today's episode is one of my favorite things in the entire world, and that is a live Q&A from one of our Union Mastermind calls.

I know you're gonna love it.

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We've got Jen who says, I am launching a brand new venue that is only for micro weddings and elopements with a guest cap of 20 to 25 max. It seems like there is a big niche in my area of southwestern Ontario, Canada for these types of venues. I don't think couples appreciate being pigeonholed into either a backyard, city hall, park, or public space. Or on a Tuesday in March just to get married. Very specific, although we love those options. I believe couples should be able to have a venue option available for small events in peak season and prime time slots that don't cost a small fortune. The average wedding in Canada costs $30,000 to $40,000 this year. Our couples would spend between $5,000 to $15,000. That's in Canadian, more like $3,500 to $1,200 USD. Sorry, $12,000 USD. At our venue. Would you agree there is a market or need for this type of venue? We offer a hybrid of all-inclusive and more DIY options. Also, what should I do or offer to really stand out from the big fish in this pond, or have I just created my own pond? Jen, I'm gonna be totally honest with you. I don't know enough about the micro wedding sphere to be able to speak to this eloquently. My initial knee-jerk reaction is— comes with a bit of concern. If this was a really big deal, I feel like we would see more of them. So I would highly, highly, highly encourage an extensive amount of market research. Is there anyone else that is doing what you want to do? Now, that doesn't necessarily mean that you have to see someone else that's doing what you want to do in order for it to be a good idea. No one else was creating YouTube videos, I think. Correction, I think one other person was creating wedding planning YouTube videos when I got started. So just because no one else is doing it doesn't mean it's necessarily bad. We wouldn't be here. If I had to find someone else that was doing it super successfully. But man, that sounds like I'm so full of myself. I'm so sorry, but that's the best point of reference I've got for this. I would say market research. Look at your area. I really want you to boil down who your ideal client avatar is. And that's something that we work really hard to do here in the mastermind, because when we first get started, we want everyone to be our clients. And you're already doing a really good job of being like, nope, I am niching down. We're going to make sure that we are just serving This community, it's going to be like this budget range. It's gonna be very specific, very niche. Um, I would also say, cuz you said you're opening a venue, correct? Um, I would also say, make yourself available to corporate, make yourself available to small events in general, mixers, et cetera, and really make sure that you have enough packing your calendar. Corporate events tend to be a lot less emotional, which are great. In fact, I know several of the planners that have been through this mastermind went in to add corporate events and they're like, dude, it is so different because it's just they have a budget and it is what it is and it's not anyone's big special day. So I would say that there is, there's going to be a sweetness to that, to offering that, to adding that in, but it might mean that you need to diversify. So I hear that this is the goal. My biggest suggestion, do market research, build out your avatar, figure out You know, where are they? Are they in Facebook groups? Are they going to expos? And meet them where they're at. Host little mixers yourself. Now, when you're operating off of a space that only holds 20 to 25 people max, it's gonna be really hard to host mixers. So I would suggest host networking events with other vendors. That's gonna be where you're really gonna start to put some feelers out there, get some photographers, that are in your area. How do you know that? Do some heavy stalking on Instagram. Find those that do elopement photography, those style of things, because they'll likely be contacted first by people who want to do micro weddings. They will want an elopement photographer. Um, I also think it'd be a really good idea to bring in photographers just for an extra eye on the space because you kind of want it to be really— you want it to be really photogenic. Um, market research, find them where they're at, uh, connect with photographers first. And then if there's any micro planners in your area that are kind of already doing this, getting them, having a mixer with them, getting on their radar. I think networking is going to be huge for you. And I think diversifying, so we still can get enough events in the door that you can keep the doors open, right? And then you can start filling in with your ideal client, which would be couples trying to plan these micro weddings. I also think there's a really big market for craft nights, and I don't just mean paint-by-number or wine and paint night. I do mean— gosh, have you guys seen where they do like the custom hat nights where they do the iron-on patches? And so they come in, there's a whole bunch of different options. You get a bunch of moms together and they'll chuck money at a project just to get out of the house for a minute. Okay? And then they get to go home with cute little hat that says babe on it because they're a babe and they deserve to have a cute little hat that says it. That was a lot of me talking. If you do have follow-up questions, obviously you know where to find us. So diversify, define your ideal client avatar, network your pretty little fingers off, and then meet your clients where they're at. See, try to figure out where they would be, and that could be via networking, or it could be going to mixers, or yourself like networking at other locations and not just hosting them. In fact, that might be a good first step. Network with other people at preset mixers, not just your own. And then maybe after going to a few of those, you say, hey, I actually have my own place. Why don't y'all come out? I'm having a wine and cheese night. It'll be great. And then you do your schmoozing. Just stretch beforehand, you know, maybe drink some Throat Coat because you're gonna be doing a lot of talking.

I'm only mildly embarrassed to admit that in the beginning, I printed out every single piece of paper, every single contract. I took handwritten notes and created a binder for every single one of my wedding planning clients. Now, in theory, that sounds really cool, and I thought I would look really cool showing up to these meetings with these binders that are full of all of these contracts with handwritten notes. But let me tell you, the chaos that ensued when I tried to stay organized on my own and got over 5 events at a time, it was a nightmare. Enter HoneyBook. I am telling you guys, HoneyBook was literally exactly how my brain was processing wedding planning, but just in digital form. It's so easy to go in there and make any sort of customizations that you want, from adjusting your contracts to adjusting your packages, maintaining conversations back and forth that not only pop up in the app on the website, but also in your inbox as well. It's a great way to stay organized. So get out of the paper and get onto the digital. Head to wolferandco.com/hb and use code UNION at checkout to get the best deal. We interrupt this podcast because there is something extremely special that I want to share with you guys. Uh, I don't know about you, but for the last who knows how many years, I have been using a Frankensteined, Googled, copied and pasted contract. And while that is extremely embarrassing to admit to all of our listeners, I know that there are people out there who feel the same as I do. And there were a couple things that kept me from actually getting an attorney drafted contract. Actually, no, there was one thing. It was so expensive and it seemed so out of reach. That's when I learned about Legally Set. You see, Kunbi with Legally Set has created industry-specific contracts for people like you and me working in the wedding industry. They're easy to customize. They're drafted by an actual attorney and not Googled. Can you imagine that? And last but not least, they are so extremely affordable. So if you were like me and maybe using a less than appropriate and/or legal contract, it's time to step up your game. You have no more excuses. Head on over to theunionpodcast.com/legallyset to check them out. Use code UNION for 20% off your contracts.

All right, um, Justine said, I have a client who hasn't paid their wedding balance. Oh no, I hate this feeling. Oh, we don't experience this for very long, do we? No, ma'am. Uh, their wedding was on July 19th.

No!

On the wedding day, they pulled me aside to communicate that they were— there were some unforeseen expenses. Sorry, there is a fly in here. We have too many animals. Don't tell my husband I said that, okay? I never said that. Uh, they pulled me aside to communicate that there were some unforeseen expenses with the venue and that they would need an extension for payment. I was in the middle of something Timely, so I couldn't sit and talk with them for long. I asked them to call me after today and we'll talk as a courtesy. I didn't get a call, so I texted them and they responded saying they're away on their honeymoon and that I was the first debt they were paying off when they got back. They weren't gifted the money from the fam— they weren't gifted the money their family promised them. Um, oh, so your heart is just in this too. It felt bad because I know exactly what family member they were talking about— Dad, who decided to not show up to the wedding. At the very last minute, my heart has been pulled in many directions for this couple, but their communication has been far from great throughout the process. They're beautiful people, but how do I get my money? Like, how should I go about this? Okay, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I appreciate you sharing this with us because this is not something any of us ever want to have happen. Um, I will also tell you that I've had the circumstance happen—not this exact one—but literally where I stood at the wedding venue that night and said. Okay. You can go get the checkbook. I'll wait. I'll wait. And then had to hang around for an extra hour and a half just to, just to get the check. It's uncomfortable. It's icky. I, to this day, don't like discussing payments. I'm like, nope, it's automated. It's through HoneyBook. This is one of the reasons I love them because I don't like talking about the finances. Okay. Makes me uncomfortable. Now with you guys, I'll talk about it all day, right? With you guys, I'm like, let's figure out boundaries. Let's establish this. Let's figure it out. Um, you have a couple different options, but the 2 main ideas that I see here are either play hardball or start contemplating and/or praying over letting it go. Um, hardball sucks. Hardball feels like you're being mean to people. I want to encourage you to remember that you didn't break anything here. You didn't mess up. You didn't fail on what you were telling them that you would deliver. Um, you knew this information on the wedding day and said, I'm still going to continue my service and we'll figure it out later. And so you have upheld your end of the bargain. And I think you can still continue to uphold your end of the bargain with grace and with kindness, but with firmness. And so I think that finding how you want to phrase that, whatever makes you feel the most comfortable in phrasing that would be important, right? We want to make sure you're sending off an email that you don't feel bad about sending. Um, just kind of want you to be able to sleep at night. Some people can put together an email and be like, no, I'm just sending it off. But you wouldn't be asking in this group, in this context, if you already felt that way. So, hey guys, just wanted to follow up. Per this section of the contract, as you know, this final payment was due. Um, we've already kind of inadvertently worked out a 2-week extension or whatever it happens to be. Um, as it stands, we will need to see payment remitted by X date. This is why contracts are so important. If you get to this situation, a contract is only as good as the person enforcing it. Because it doesn't matter if you paid $5,000 for someone to put together a contract for you, if you do not say this is in the contract, some people might not follow it. So We need to see payment by X date. And that's where you'd have to potentially start to play hardball is if they say, well, we don't have it. Well, we can't get it to you. Then you need to decide, is this a small claims court situation? Does that sound and feel icky to hear and receive? Yep. Yep. We don't like any of that. We don't want that. That sounds gross. A strongly led and strongly worded letter from an attorney will get a lot of people moving. These are not the answers that you want. I know it sounds not fun, but that's what hardball looks like. It could be that you send a singular email and say, hey, final payment is due at this point. If you would like to do some sort of payment plan, or if, you know, please don't forget, I'm open to having a conversation. We just need to see this resolved so we can— you guys can move on with your marriage and I can move on with my business. There's enough kindness that you can insert into the conversation. I don't feel like you have to just be mean when I say hardball. Or you send that email off and then go, okay, if they do, they do. If they don't, they don't. Is it worth the emotional turmoil of continuing to pursue this? What does that look like? Is it worth sending another letter? Is it worth saying, hey, if I don't hear from you, I'm going to get an attorney involved? Is it worth small claims court? I don't know what that final payment is. And if you're like, listen, it's like $3,000. That's a lot. That's a big conversation. Okay. So circling back, rounding it up, putting a pretty little bow on it. Give them a timeframe, infuse as much grace into the conversation as you want to. You can, you're in charge here. You can decide that. Refer to your contract. What does your contract say if people are past due? Do you have a clause for that? If not, you probably should figure one out. And this would be a great opportunity for that, although this might be more of a proposal sort of things. I'm not quite sure where the payment language would fall, and this could be something that instead of putting into your professional contract, you put into your proposal instead. Here's how payment works out. And then, in order to make sure that this doesn't happen again, we need to backtrack and make sure your final payment is received before you step Put on the property day of. Because you don't want this to happen again. So a lot of vendors require final payment 30 days in advance. That's perfectly logical. That's an okay request, even if you're only doing day-of coordination. That is an industry standard. So you are not being mean by asking this. A lot of us, especially when we're wedding planners, our identity is wrapped up in our job and wrapped up in the service that we provide for people. That's normal. We're not weird for feeling— we're not weird feeling that way. That's perfectly fine. There's nothing wrong with us. It's, it's a very natural feeling to feel that way. So just, just know as an industry standard, it's, it's not necessarily anticipated that you are waiting for your final check day of. I would prefer that you now, and especially all of you that are listening to this, you, if you haven't had this happen, just that feeling in your gut of like, oh shoot, I either have to be mean to people that I like Or kiss thousands of dollars goodbye. Just cool. Love being put in this scenario. Love being put in this situation. So that's another way that you can prevent this from happening. Strong language in your proposal and/or your contract that says final payment due this date. Final payment must be paid or remitted for us to be there on site on your wedding day. It does look like aggressive language. They're responsible for reading over the proposal and the contract. So you can put that in there and then not have to deal with it necessarily until it becomes an issue. I would rather have you chasing the money before the services are rendered than after. So that's kind of where I feel like we land on this. And I just wanna say for a sec, I'm so sorry. It's just like the worst lesson and we don't wanna learn it. And it sucks because you feel like, man, I've just been so nice to these people. And I performed the service. Why don't they— why don't they just want to pay me? And they might just be in like a world of just feels, right? Like, especially if dad didn't show up, there's a lot going on. Um, but it doesn't excuse them from holding up their end of the bargain. You did everything you needed to do and more. You completed a service without the payment being finished, and you completed it with honor. And I know you did it with grace and with dignity, and I know you made their wedding day absolutely incredible, especially in the face of this really big emotional upset that happened. That's a lot to process. You didn't drop the ball. You deserve to be paid, and you can ask for that gracefully. Well, I've officially met a vendor that I'd love to never work with again. Great! That's the best feeling in the world. Mm-hmm. They reached out asking for a review. Mama says if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. Is that appropriate in the wedding world, or will this come back to bite me somehow? I mean, what do you do? Um, I don't feel like there's necessarily a wrong answer here. It sucks. I luckily have never had a vendor that I don't want to work with reach out to me and ask for a review, because I would be like, oh, I can't. If I give you one, you won't want to use it. Uh, depends again kind of on the previous question. Um, what's gonna help you feel better and sleep at night? You know, if you're like, yeah, I'll save people if I, if I share this with them. Or you know this, I might not have a relationship with them afterwards, but at least my conscience is clear. Like I can just like tell them that this is how I felt about the experience with them. Um, you can say something like we don't give reviews to other vendors. I personally don't usually do that either. That feels um, I don't want to say like cheating, but it feels a little bit like a cheat code. You know what I mean? Where like you're like. Yeah, I mean, vendor reviews, I think, are awesome if we receive them. I feel very honored by it because, you know, if a vendor goes out of their way to review you, that's a good review because they do this all the time. That's why I tend to really not do it unless I feel compelled to do it, but I don't request vendor reviews from other people. And I don't necessarily really freely give them to other people as well, simply because I personally feel like a review from a fellow vendor has a different weight to it. So you could simply say, we don't review other vendors. It's just not— it's not part of our practice. And leave it at that. If that is a choice that you choose to make, obviously, I don't want you being dishonest with them just for the sake of not responding to this message. You could say, actually, there were a couple of things that happened at the event we worked together that may make me feel uncomfortable leaving a review, or at least maybe a review that you'd want to share with people. If you want feedback, I can give it to you. If not, You might want to look to someone else for a review and just leave it at that. Or you just flat out say like, hey man, I really, I really, I don't want to. You messed up, you dropped the ball. I didn't enjoy our working experience together. Pick whichever one suits you best. I would probably find in the beginning, I probably would have found myself in that. Yeah, we don't review any vendors. Sorry. Thanks. I'm not, I'm not doing that. And just left it at that. Now today, I would probably say, Yeah, I actually have a couple of instances throughout the day that point to a not great result. So I don't— if you want to hear my feedback, I would not be happy to provide it to you, but I'll share it with you. But I'm not in a place to leave a review that you'd want to share with others. Sorry. But it is at least an honest way of saying, yeah, you don't want this from me. Now, how do we make sure we don't work with vendors we don't like again? And how do we do it gracefully? Because that part also kind of stinks, especially when you don't work with them. We have a beautiful opportunity as planners and as wedding vendors in this area of the field where we kind of can pick our coworkers. In some ways, as long as they align with our clients and they align with the budget. I mean, we've probably— if you've been, if you worked a couple of weddings, you might have found a couple of repeat vendors and you're like, wow, I really like this venue, or that man, that photographer is so much fun to work with. They always make it so engaging and they pay attention to the timeline, which is great. And I don't have to be, you know, hunting them down every 30 minutes to figure out where they've gone to get their new artsy photo. We can kind of develop these relationships and then it's almost like you get a little posse of people. Gosh, there were a handful of photographers like that for us. There's one DJ in Southern California who's still my favorite DJ, DJ Griff. He's just awesome. He just got engaged recently. Like, just like those that almost become like family members. You're like, yeah, I would like to keep— did you do that? What happens when you get the reverse of that? What happens when your client comes to you and says, hey, I'm interested in so-and-so? How do you handle that? How do you approach that? With grace and with honesty. Hey, I've actually had an experience with them before. The clients really liked it from their point of view. I saw a few things from my end of things that I wouldn't say are red flags, but I made the day a little bit more difficult to pull off. So I would think that there might be a couple other options that we could consider at that price point, should you be interested in hearing some suggestions. Right, gentle. We're not bashing. If you want me to get into details, I'm sure I could find a PC way of sharing them. We're not protected by HIPAA, but we are wanting to make sure that we keep our reputation and not necessarily go out there and just smear people because we're frustrated by them. So that's kind of the language that I would use should a client be considering them. Should a client book them? I mean, very rarely do we get to the point where if I'm doing planning with them, they haven't run anyone by me unless it's day of coordination or month of coordination, depending on what you call it. And then it's just, well, we'll just figure it out. And we luckily, knowing that they might have some of these shortcomings, can do our best to make up for that because, hey, we saw it last time. We're not gonna let this happen again this time. We're just gonna kind of just protect ourselves and anticipate that the same behavior, the same patterns are gonna happen this time around. And then start building your preferred vendors list. I wouldn't say as soon as possible because you wanna make sure you actually like them first, but if you can build out that vendor family that we're talking about, then you are going to ensure a smooth experience both for your clients and for yourself. And please note that this is important that they connect with the clients. Like, I don't care how much I love a DJ. If the client is annoyed by them, I'm not gonna shove that DJ in their face. But usually if they like my vibe and I fit within this price point and I know their budget, I'm not going to suggest a vendor that's out of their budget. It's going to typically mesh really well. And this is why figuring out that ideal client avatar and really using specific language on your website to hone in who you want to work with, you know, fun-loving, happy-go-lucky couples that just want someone else to handle the details, right? That gives you a very specific subset of Or Type A, detail-oriented, who loves to get into the nitty-gritty. That gives you a very specific vision of a bride right now, right? So that, that sort of language, when we're building out this avatar, as we're walking through these questions, working through these questions, that's gonna be the kind of thing that you'll start to attract the kind of couples that you want to work with anyways, and that you will suit best. And then that conveniently, as you kind of keep chugging along, you'll find vendors that suit these couples well. As well. Now that doesn't necessarily mean that we are one size fits all and we can only work with happy-go-lucky couples or Type A brides or anything like that. But it does really kind of create, um, yeah, that avatar that we were talking about.

That's all we have for this week's episode, guys. If you enjoyed it, do me a favor, screenshot that episode and share it on socials. Tag me in it. I would love to see Wolfer and Co on Instagram. Let me know if you're enjoying it. You can also let me know if you didn't enjoy it, but I'm probably not gonna reshare that one.

I hope you guys enjoy this week's episode, and we'll see you in the next one.