Finding Joy and Fun in the Challenge with Jacky Hunt-Broersma

Welcome to True Grit and Grace, a podcast designed to empower you to claim your resilience and thrive through life's challenges. I am Amberly Lago, a mindset coach, fitness expert and bestselling author. Each week, I'll dive deep with the world's brightest thought leaders and elite performers to share tangible tools and practical advice to inspire you to keep your eyes on the prize and forge ahead. So get ready to conquer your fears, heal any trauma, lead with your heart, and elevate your life with grit and grace.

Hi, thank you so much for being here. I'm Amberly Lago, and I always say that this show is for the real warriors, and I have a true warrior here with us today. Joining us on the True Grit and Grace podcast is Jackie Hunt-Broschma. She is one of the most accomplished amputee ultramarathoners in the world. An endurance coach, mom, and cancer survivor. She's the first— you're like setting records all over the world for female amputees in trail and ultra running and holds a few world records. One that is being highlighted more than ever, and we'll talk about that. She's been featured in Shape magazine, Runner's World, Women's Health, Yahoo, Ultra Running Magazine, Chicago Sun, and that's just to name a few. You are in the news all the time. I'm so grateful that you're here with us. Thank you so much, and I hope I pronounced your name the right way.

Perfect. Oh, thank you. I really appreciate being on the show, and thank you for having me. And yeah, you pronounced my name perfectly.

Oh, good, good. Well, I've been following your journey, and I'm so inspired by all that you share. I found you on Instagram. And it was like, oh my gosh, who is this amazing lady? And then I looked deeper into some of the things you're doing and learned that you're actually a cancer survivor. Can you please share a little bit about your journey from kind of what you went through to where you are now?

Yeah, it's been quite a long journey. I mean, I was diagnosed with Ewing sarcoma back in 2002. So I've been an amputee for quite a while. And it's It's bizarre. The journey going from cancer to amputation was a really quick journey. I had discovered a lump. Well, I had like a painful— I'm trying to start right at the beginning. And I had a sensitive spot on my leg that was really painful. And I kept going to the doctor. I'm like, what is that? It really hurts. And they couldn't find anything because there was no lump. There just wasn't anything. And they were like, well, we're not quite kind of sure what it is. It's We don't know. It's— hopefully it will go away. And it didn't go away. And the one night I went to bed, the next morning I woke up and that part that had been so painful suddenly popped out and it was the size of a golf ball.

Wow.

It was huge. And just overnight. And I kind of went back to the doctor and I'm like, yeah, do you still think this is nothing? And he kind of went— he went a little bit pale because he was— I mean, we were living in a really small village, so it was a real family orientated. Everyone knew everyone and things like that. So for him, it was quite a big shock, me walking in there. And from there, the journey, it was just a bit of a whirlwind because within a week I was scheduled for a biopsy. I went in, they told me basically that you're coming in for the biopsy. When we get the results, if it's good news, we won't ring you within the next 4 days. But if it's not good news, Then expect to get a call from us within 1 or 2 days. So I'm like, okay, so if I get—

That must have been a long day or 2 to wait.

It was, it was. So the first day you kind of, you don't get a call and you think, okay, great, I've made it the first day, it's all good. And then of course the phone rang on the second day and the doctor's reception said, well, You need to come in, but you need to— we've got your results. You need to come in, but you need to bring someone with you, which is never a good thing when they tell you that. And so of course I started preparing myself. But the weird thing is I never thought it would be cancer. I don't know what I was thinking. I just, I don't know. I just thought, well, we'll see what happens. Maybe this— I don't know. I don't know what I was thinking at that point.

Well, I think we never want to think of It being cancer.

Like, that's the thing, you just don't— you kind of go into a bit of a denial, I think. And it's just like, yeah, cancer happens to other people, it doesn't happen to me. That's kind of how you start thinking a little bit. We went and got the results, and I kind of walked into the doctor's surgery. And, and at the time where we were living, the hospital, they, they had— there was a priest, and there was a nurse, and there was a doctor. Kind of walked into the office, and I'm like, oh my goodness, this is No good at all. And my heart kind of sunk.

Oh my goodness. A pre-doctorate nurse?

I'm like, oh my goodness, am I dying? And that's kind of what you think.

Yeah.

They broke the news to me and they said it was cancer. And I, to be honest, I kind of went into— I can't remember anything after that because I just, you kind of just blank it out. I wasn't listening. My husband had to take notes because I just, I kind of as if I'd left because I was in so much shock. It wasn't a diagnosis I was expecting at all. I mean, I was in my 20s and it's kind of, I just got promoted at work. I was, we were doing really well. We were traveling a lot. I mean, it was kind of, and we'd only been married for like 3 years. So we were like, we were still in the kind of the honeymoon phase and just enjoying life and things like that. And I remember walking out and I just, my husband said, do you want to go home? Do you want to go back to work? And I just, that's all I remember after that appointment was I just said to him, I said, I just want to go back to work. So I just totally ignored it and I just, I didn't want to know anything about it. So I went back to work that day and then obviously I had to kind of face up with it and we had to kind of start making decisions and things. And they had a week after them telling me, we kind of went into, we had to go see a specialist. And at the time they hadn't told me what kind of cancer it was yet. They said they'd kind of leave all that information for the specialist to kind of talk to me and things like that. And we thought, okay, fine. So I just thought naturally I was going to go down the chemo route and we'd see what they say and what the next steps were. And we get to the specialist and there was no— we never— there was no indication. I never thought that amputation would be like on the cards at all. And we walked into his office and he sat us down. He said, well, you've got Ewing sarcoma, which was a very— it's a very rare, rare— it's a childhood type of cancer, and it's a kind of, um, it's a type of bone cancer, but it's a very rare type of cancer. So there wasn't a lot of— there's not a lot of studies into it and things like that. And he just said, well, where your— where the tumor was located is if they removed the tumor, I'd lose the use of my foot. And they could try chemo, but it's not successful in this kind of tumor. So it wouldn't shrink down. And if it broke off, it would go straight to my lungs.

Oh.

So they're like, the only option you have is amputation. And I was like, what? And it was like, first you get cancer, then you have to have your leg amputated. And especially being a woman, it's like losing part of your body is quite a big deal.

And you're in your honeymoon phase of your marriage and you're so young and feel like you're just starting out in life.

Just starting out and all that. And everything happened so quickly that I didn't have time to kind of grasp everything. And within a week from that appointment, I was scheduled for surgery. They needed to move with everything. So I had like a week where I was going back-to-back testing to make sure that If the cancer, did it spread, has it gone anywhere else and things. And thank goodness it hadn't. I was really lucky that it hadn't spread because I don't—

That's like, I want to go back to the part where you, you had this pain in your leg. And were you an athlete already? Were you very in tune with your, with your body as far? Because I mean, for me, I grew up an athlete and I was taught so often to just suck it up and push through the pain. And was the pain so bad that it was like, this hurts, like it's—

It wasn't. It would be like, there is an element, because I've got it, and that's also the other part is I've got a very high pain threshold. And it's probably because, I mean, yeah, I used to be a swimmer. So I mean, you just, you do, you learn to push through certain things. And my parents were quite strict and it's like, oh yeah, just suck it up. I mean, you fall off your bike and it's like, oh, get up, you're fine, go on and stuff like that. So I think there's definitely an element of that. that. I mean, it was— it would be like, like if someone bumped it, it would be really painful. But other than that, it was like I kind of lived with it. So I don't know how long I actually had it before it kind of actually became an issue.

And thank God that you, you know, took the steps to go to a doctor and say something's not right. We really have to be our own advocates and really Go and say, nope, now do you believe me that something's not right? Look, this is what's going on. And thank goodness you did that so it didn't spread. But what was that like when you went to the hospital and they're about to amputate? What was your thought process when you were about to go under anesthesia for that?

Oh man, it's just part of me just wanted to get it over and done with. And just go. It was like, it was weird. I kind of went into survival mode and I just, I wanted to get it over and done with and I wanted to go on with my life. I just, I was kind of, I think, survival and denial in the same process. It was the weirdest thing. I was back at work within 4 weeks after the amputation. I was back playing sports 6 weeks later just because I just wanted to get on with it. I just wanted to kind of forget about it. If that makes sense. It was a really weird time in my life and it kind of later on caught up with me that I didn't really deal with it because I just was trying to put it behind me and just kind of try and ignore it. And for a long time, like, I wouldn't accept my body. Like, I wouldn't look at myself in a mirror because I thought I was ugly. Yeah, and it's just like— and I remember the night before my surgery, I sat in the bath and I looked at both my legs and I just cried. And I was like, tomorrow I'm gonna— and I literally said that to myself. And it's the weirdest thing. It's the weird things that you actually remember. And I looked at my legs and I said, tomorrow I become ugly, because I believed being an amputee made me ugly. It was the weirdest thing. Yeah, I just—

Well, I so relate to what you're saying on a different level because I woke up From a coma after my motorcycle accident. Yeah, I saw that. And when doctors told me they were going to amputate my leg and they said, you have a 1% chance of saving it. And I was like, okay, then we're going to save it. And I remember there was— now, had I known that I was going to have 34 surgeries and be in pain the rest of my life, I probably would have said, you know what, let's go ahead and amputate. But I didn't know, and you can't go back in time. But I remember my first big talk show. I was sitting with Megyn Kelly. We're on the Today Show. And she said, well, why did you want to keep your leg? And I said, the only thing I could think of, I said, well, it was my leg and I wanted to keep it. Or she's like, why did you want it? Why didn't you want to amputate? And I'm like, because I wanted to keep it. So I think I had some thoughts Of that, you know, amputation to me meant that maybe I wouldn't be able to run the way I used to. Maybe I would be less than, maybe my husband wouldn't love me. Did you have thoughts in your mind of what if my husband doesn't love me anymore? What if I'm— were you already a mom?

Absolutely. No, I wasn't. I wasn't a mom yet. No. We, yeah, we had children quite a lot later. And those are things that go through your mind is just because at the time when I had it, you believe, If you had your leg amputated, you become disabled in a sense. And that to me just felt like there aren't a lot of options. Will I be in a wheelchair? Because a lot of people said, oh, you're going to be in a wheelchair now, aren't you? And I'm like, yeah. So there was a lot of that too that you kind of had to fight. And then of course, yeah, because you're going to look different. And is your husband going to love you the way you are? Because especially because we'd only been married 2 years. So you're like, I'm gonna look very, very different. And it's kind of all those kind of things you have to deal with, which I wasn't great at dealing with in the beginning. I kind of, it took me quite a few years to kind of work through the process and kind of accept myself for who I am.

How do you think that you started to learn to accept yourself and look at yourself in the mirror and start to love yourself again? How do you think that you were able to do that?

I think like take, like doing like running has definitely helped with my confidence. It's definitely helped me to appreciate my body and seeing it for what it is. I mean, for a long time I would cover up my legs. I didn't want people to see that I was an amputee, weirdly. I didn't want people to feel sorry for me. I didn't want a lot of like, even unless you knew I'd gone for surgery, you wouldn't know that I was an amputee and I would never bring it up. I wouldn't tell anyone. I was kind of living like, I felt like I was living a double life. Because I was in so much denial and I just, I just didn't want to, I didn't want to be an amputee. I just didn't want people to feel sorry for me. And it was, it was, it's— and luckily, and thank goodness for me, running definitely helped. It just showed me that I was stronger. It gave me confidence to kind of come out. You know what? These legs run ultramarathons and I run up crazy mountain races and things like that, and I am strong. And having kids too, I mean, it's seeing their faces and their excitement when they see me, because they don't see me as an amputee, they just see me as mom, and that's it.

Mm-hmm.

I mean, a lot of the times when I'm walking outside or go to the store and my little girl will go with me, my 7-year-old, and people will like stare or point. I have people Staring, I have people pointing. It's weird sometimes. And my little girl will go, Mommy, why are they pointing at your leg? It's just your leg. As if it's nothing. It's just, it's all normal. It's like, what's the big deal? So yeah.

Yeah, I think my kids have been my biggest inspirations. I remember one night we were, I was sitting, we were in the bathroom sitting on the floor waiting to get in the bathtub and I looked down at all the scars on my leg and I told my youngest, I said, oh, I said, you don't even remember when my leg was better, do you? And she goes, well, Mom, your leg is better now. It's already better. And I was like, oh, they say like the sweetest things, you know.

They're so honest and just, they say what they mean and that's what they see and it's brilliant.

And I think that working out, definitely, I knew before, I can't run the way that I used to. I tried and tried, but with CRPS, it ends up flaring me up. And so it leaves me in a lot of pain. So actually about a year after my accident and all these surgeries, like I was probably, I was in the 20s. I don't know, maybe 24 to 25.

Yeah.

On surgery number 24 or 25. And I actually went in and asked them if they could amputate because I was like, this leg just gives me so much pain. Can you just amputate it? And they said, well, no, you have complex regional pain syndrome and we can't guarantee that that would get you out of pain and it could cause it to be worse or spread. And I was like, that is when it was really a point of, okay, well, these are the cards I've been dealt. I've got to do the best I can with what I've been dealt. And that was a turning point for me. easy, but it was a turning point. But I'm always very thankful that I knew that working out would make me feel better. So even when I was in a hospital bed, I would work out and do what I could. And I love that you bring that up, that working out, that running gives you confidence, because to me, that is what moving your body does. It moves your mind and it shows you what your body is capable of.

Absolutely.

Now, were you always a runner or was that something that you started to do after you became an amputee?

No, I was, I was not a runner. And it's, it's actually a funny story because I was the kid that used to hide in the bathrooms when we used to have to do track workouts at school.

No!

I hated running. I absolutely hated it. So it was the weirdest thing that I took it up when I became an amputee. And I think it was an element of people telling you, you can't do it because you're an amputee. And I kind of was a little bit stubborn because I was like, why can't I do that? Why can't I be— in my mindset, I was normal. I wasn't an amputee, so why couldn't I do it? And that's kind of how the whole journey started. And I, yeah, I fell in love with it. I just— my only regret is not taking it up a lot earlier and kind of, yeah, doing it then. But I think it's been, it's been a good part of the process and the healing process and me finding my confidence and going on this journey has been great.

Well, where do you think that stubbornness and that— I mean, I think it's a lot of grit that you have. Where do you think that comes from? Is that something that you feel like you've always had, even as a kid? Was that, you know, oh really, you say I can't do this? I'm going to prove you wrong.

I think it's something I've always had because I Growing up, I was very much— I mean, I grew up in a pretty strict household, and my dad always believed— I don't know, he was very much men did this, women did that. And I was always— I don't know, my mindset was very different. It's like, why, if my brother could do that, why can't I do that? Why is that just because I'm a girl I can't do that? So I think it kind of started from that. I would never tell him that, but—

Yes.

I always just felt like, no, why is everyone always telling me I can't do that? can't do things and I want to do it. And I, so I've always tried everything. I have it with my kids too. They can be absolutely anything they want to be. There is no limit to what you want to be. And I would never tell them, no, you can't do that because you're a girl or you're a boy or, or none of that will, or because if you're an amputee, you can't do that. It's just, if you want to do something, you put your mind to it, you can do it.

Oh, I love that. And I grew up in a very similar household. Even, you know, the boys were supposed to mow the lawn and I'm like, well, why is that a man's job? I can do that.

Yeah, exactly.

I can do that. What do you mean? You know, I grew up in a small town in Texas and it was very much, you know, with my mom and dad. My mom's a Southern belle and so everything was like, be very ladylike. And I was always a little bit like, uh, no, that's not me. Where do you find your motivation?

I see my kids. I always look at my kids. They always look up to me. I never want to disappoint them. And I think they're definitely like a big part of my motivation to keep going and keep pushing. And it's fun to see their little faces when I've achieved like big goals. Or this afternoon I'm going running with my 7-year-old because she's like, Mommy, I can't wait for us to run. This is the best day ever. And so it's kind of things like that that kind of keeps me motivated.

Well, what would you suggest for somebody who's like, well, I want to build my confidence. better. I want to start running, but I don't even really know how to set up something. You teach people kind of the endurance and how— what would you suggest for them to do?

It's, it's all, it's all small steps. You kind of have to start slow and build yourself up. Don't expect to kind of in a week run a marathon. It's all, it's a process. So it's just, and, and for me, running is, is It's about the joy of it. It's got to be fun. You just, you have to enjoy it.

I think that goes for anything in life. If it's not fun, then you won't stick to it if you don't find joy in it. And that's why I've been in the fitness industry for so many years. And I always try to make it with, even now training clients through Zoom, just try to make it fun. Like, if it's not fun, Why would you want to do it? You know?

Exactly. It's like, yeah, yeah. What's the point then?

Yeah, yeah. But you really go to the extreme. And I want to talk about your biggest, latest accomplishment, which was you ran 100 miles on a treadmill within 24 hours.

Yes.

And I was reading that to my husband and he's like, What do you mean? How, how's that possible? And within 24 hours, like, how do you run straight through? I'm like, well, honey, she's got to get off and like use the bathroom.

Uh-huh.

Oh, you know, but 100 miles, and then it's, you know, for an average, you know, regular person with 2 legs or an average person that runs all the time, Or any person who runs is one thing, but you explained how running with a blade is a lot trickier on a treadmill. And I didn't think about that, like how it could get caught, how you could trip. I mean, I can barely go on the treadmill anyway. But how did you, or why, first of all, did you decide I'm gonna do 100 miles on a treadmill?

Because I'm a bit crazy. No, I'm just kidding.

Well, that's good.

Yeah, gotta be a little bit crazy. I was due to run 100 miles, and then with the whole COVID, it got cancelled. And I was determined I really wanted to run 100. So I kind of looked, and it was— I was gonna do a loop around my neighborhood, and that's like a half a mile loop. So I'd be going around in circles. The neighborhood at the time, it was back in April, so it was just the whole COVID was quite new and things like that. And there was a lot of neighbors kind of out walking their dogs and things like that. And I thought for a long time, like for 24 hours, I'm going to be going around. And I just felt like I didn't want to get in anyone's way. And I just felt it might just get a little bit complicated and stuff like that. And then I thought, well, I've got a treadmill, why not try it on the treadmill? And then I kind of looked to see if an amputee, and it wasn't even in the thinking, but I looked to see if an amputee had ever done it, and I was like, oh, an amputee hasn't done it before, so why not give it a shot and see if I can do it? Bearing in mind my treadmill is— my treadmill was quite old, and I'd only— the longest I'd ever run on the treadmill was 10 miles, and I thought I was dying then. So I was like, yeah, 100 miles is gonna be a challenge. Yeah, we kind of planned it, and, and like when you were asking about Running on a treadmill on a blade, it is quite a balancing act, and I have to be careful because a lot of that in the beginning when I first tried running on the treadmill, I'd be running too much on the front of the treadmill, so my blade would kind of hook under it a little bit and that would trip me up. Or I'd be running too much at the back, and because I can't feel as much on my blade side, I'd be flying off the back.

Oh wow.

So I was just like all over. I was like Such a mess, but I've been practicing, so it kind of— I've got into a rhythm. So it, it was all right, it wasn't too bad. But the other thing I had to think about was, will my treadmill last for 24 hours? Because I'm gonna have that thing on for 24 hours. And I had loads of people message me and they're like, well, at the gym treadmills always cut out after 3 hours because that's kind of what they're set on. I was like, oh, okay, the treadmill's gonna cut out at 3 hours, so I'd have to take that into consideration. And others would say, yeah, but your motor's going to burn out. So I'm like, okay, I don't have a backup plan. So if my treadmill breaks, I'm like, well, then I guess I'll have to do something else. And surprisingly, the treadmill lasted for the entire— I was saying to my husband, imagine if it had broken like the half a mile before the 100 miles. I would have been absolutely gutted.

Oh yeah. I mean, that's a lot to think about. Because it's one thing to think about how your own body, your own engine is going to hold up and get you through. But to have that in the back of your mind, like, ooh, I hope this treadmill keeps going with me.

I hope—

and by the way, you should get a sponsorship from that treadmill company. Absolutely. Because that is—

Well, actually, now that you say that, they did actually send me a brand new one. After the 100-miler. So I was really thankful. They were like, you know what, you deserve it. And they actually sent me like, yeah, one of their top range treadmills. So I was really lucky. Wow.

Well, you deserve that and more. I mean, that's amazing. Now, what is your thought process when you're running? Okay. For example, yesterday I went for a hike. I had planned on seeing one of my best friends for a hike right when COVID went down and she is a ball of energy. She is just a spitfire. It's really hard to keep up with her. And so COVID came. We didn't want to, you know, be, you know, close. And so then we finally, here it is 6 months later and we're like, well, let's meet 6 feet apart. We can go on a trail that we can kind of space ourselves and we can still go outside and hike together. And we get to talking and we went Like, it was like 7 miles. And I thought my leg was gonna fall off after. I was like, okay, we got to start heading back. And I remember just having to look down, kind of look down, not look at how much further that I had to go. And just keep— I was having to tell myself, okay, keep going. You can do this. You're going to be able to sit down soon. Because in my mind, my leg hurts so bad. I just was like—

I know.

If she wasn't with me, I probably would have sat down for a bit just to get off of my leg. What do you do in moments when you're like, oh my gosh, I'm hurting, or this is a lot harder than I thought, how am I going to keep going? What does you— what do you tell yourself at those moments?

I try and, like with all, with all my races, I try and break them down in small elements, and then I kind of say, just get to the next Like, at first I start with like easy targets, like 5 miles or 10 miles. Just get to that, that the 10 miles. If it starts getting really hard, I'm like, just do 2 miles. Just get to 2 miles, see how you feel, just keep going. And then you get to 2 miles and you're like, okay, I can keep going. And then kind of take your— so that, that kind of— you're focusing more on just those small different steps instead of focusing on the pain. Because there's a lot of elements where I have to cut the pain out because my stump, I mean, it swells up, it gets bruised at the bottom, it's— I get like friction on the sides. So there's like, there's an element of where I've learned to kind of just push it to the back, but by focusing on the little steps, like 2 miles. And sometimes, I mean, with the 100 miler, I was just going, all right, I just need to make it to the next mile, make it to the next mile. And it's like you're kind of counting down, but that kind of keeps you focused on just little steps, and then it doesn't feel so overwhelming. Like you don't have to think, oh, I've got another 80 miles to run, you're thinking, oh, I've just got a mile. I'm just moving to a mile. Okay, I've got to the mile, it's the next mile, and just kind of break it down that way.

Yeah, I think that's so important, and I think it's important in any big goals that you set. I always tell even clients that come to me and they're like, I want to lose 50 pounds, I'm like, don't focus on the 50. We got to focus on the 1, like 1 pound. Just get it, you know, 1 pound or, you know, people that want to start working out and you are saying just focus on the mile. There may be people listening. I am like, just focus on getting outside and walking for 10 minutes because so many of us have become so sedentary since COVID Yeah. I know so much of my work is sitting behind a computer. And so I try to make time every day to at least Just get out and move my body, get some sunshine. But I think that is such great advice to just focus on one step at a time, one mile at a time, 2 miles, like whatever, and kind of putting your pain in a compartment. Because I can imagine how that— the friction you would have on your leg and blisters. And did your—

Uh-huh.

Did your leg, did it have blisters on it when you were—

It did, yeah. I've got so many different like socks and things that I kind of work around with and things like that, and when it gets really bad, I'll kind of switch legs that I can kind of just use another leg. So it's kind of like you changing shoes, so it just gives you a pressure point on a different part of your stump, and that kind of helps. So I'll do a few miles in a different prosthetic and then swap back again to my running prosthetic just to kind of give it a little bit of a break, and that kind of relieves it. I mean, I've kind of learned, which sometimes is a good thing, sometimes it's a bad thing, to kind of push a lot of the pain to the back of my head. But I have to— there's a fine line of like that you're not pushing over. And because I've got a high pain threshold, there's an element of where you have to kind of be so in tune with your body that you know, okay, wait, now I think I might be going a little bit too far, and kind of hone it in a little bit.

Oh, that is such a balancing act because I'm—

oh, it is.

I'm the same, and I have like pushed it too far so many times, and I'm just trying to get— and also too, like, it was, it was hard for me, like, it— because I would be like all in my ego About running and proving to myself that I'm gonna do this, or, you know, and it was really hard for me, still hard for me sometimes to even like yesterday with my friend say, I'm gonna have to turn around now. I won't be able to walk any further if I don't. And it's not that, I mean, I want to do it, but I know that—

Yeah.

I'm not sure my leg will hold up that much further. So that was really hard for me to like, you know, listen to my body and go, I can't— sometimes I can't walk from here to the end of, you know, the store or whatever it is.

Yeah.

Do you have to do that and maybe use crutches sometimes or a wheelchair? Are there days where you're just like, okay, today is— I'm gonna use crutches? Or do you always have A prosthetic that you can find to make work?

I'm lucky because I've got, um, I don't, I don't actually have crutches at all.

You don't?

So I'm lucky. No, I don't. Um, I'm quite— I was stubborn from the beginning with that and I just, just never got them. I mean, there's been elements where I do wish I had them because I mean there's been accidents where I've actually fallen in the house and I've banged my stump that badly that I couldn't actually put a prosthetic on at all. And then it was very much jumping, literally jumping around on one leg because I couldn't do anything else. But on days where I've had like, I've done something crazy and ran a very long distance, I'm lucky that I can switch then over to another prosthetic that's a little bit bigger than what my running prosthetic is. So it just gives me a bit more room because there's a lot of swelling and all that, and it's a little bit more cushioned, so it kind of helps. So it's just— It's kind of like putting on a pair of slippers. It kind of feels a little bit like that after you've been in a running blade for so many hours. It kind of feels the best thing. And if it's a big issue, then I'll kind of just say, well, that's the day I'm not wearing my leg today. And I kind of just make do around home and stuff like that. So I kind of adapt a little bit. Depends on the situation.

I think so. I think it's just, you are truly living a life of starting where you are. Using what you have and doing what you can. And I do the same with, you know, there's only certain shoes that I can wear or it flares CRPS, the nerve disease I have up. And so even going for a hike yesterday, I had an extra pair of shoes in the car so I could change out because I wasn't sure how those shoes were going to work. So I always have an extra pair to slip into. So it's very different but similar.

But very similar. Yeah, because that's what I do. I always have an extra leg in my car and stuff if I'm out on the trails, because then I'm like, well, I don't know what's gonna happen out there. I might need to switch. And it's, it's very— it is, I mean, it's different, but it's very similar because it is like switching out a pair of shoes, kind of same thing.

Well, I, I mean, I've always been a runner. I love running. And that was the hardest thing for me, was finally going, okay, I mean, I was the definition of insanity because I would finally run and, you know, doctors told me, oh, you'll never run again and you will be in a wheelchair for the rest of your life.

Yeah.

So I'm just like, I focus on gratitude. And I told my friend this yesterday when we hiked. I said, you know, I'm just, I'm grateful and I'm very lucky that I can hike the way that I can because a lot of people aren't able to do that. But it was so hard for me to go, okay, Maybe running's not the best thing. And I tried all kinds of shoes. I have Kangaboots. I don't know if you know what those are.

No, I don't know what those are.

I thought, well, my ankle's fused. So if I buy these fancy boots with— it's like a blade on the bottom.

Okay. Yeah.

I'll be able to run because I won't need to really— my ankle won't have to work as much. Well, that didn't work. But I think the key to really finding joy in working out is making it a practice. And for me, I had found other things that I could do that still allowed me to move my body, but not necessarily the running. But I just, I dream, like I would love to see what it felt like to run with that blade on because it looks so powerful. You know, it's so cool.

It's Yeah.

And I think you were featured in another magazine today.

I was?

I think so.

Okay.

I just saw something on Instagram.

I'm like, well, you must— Oh, that was Strong Fitness Magazine. Yeah, it was one of my posts they featured. So yeah, yeah, so that was pretty cool. But I mean, running on a blade is, obviously I wasn't a runner before, but a lot of people asked and they were like, you look really fast. And I'm like, well, I do feel pretty badass in it. I mean, I do. And you look it too! I'm not fast, but I do feel like it. But it's different. It is hard work. It is hard work because you have to— it's weird, like the first time you run, because you don't have your ankle and you don't— you need to teach your brain to trust it because it's like this foreign thing on your leg. So it's like it doesn't automatically go, like your stride is off. you kind of have to get into a bit of a rhythm to kind of trust. Yeah, there was a lot of trust issues with my head. Yeah, my brain just didn't trust the blade. And that's kind of something you kind of need to get into and kind of build your confidence and things like that. But it does, I mean, it feels amazing. It does feel like you're flying a little bit and stuff. I can't compare it because I wasn't a runner before, so I'm like, It kind of just has become part of my body, so I'm like, yeah, I just go out. And I think sometimes I probably take it a little bit for granted because I'm just— I've become so used to it that I just put my leg on and I go out. So it's fantastic. I feel incredibly grateful that I'm able to do it, and I do realize there's a lot of amputees who would love to go running too, and they can't afford prosthetics because they're ridiculously expensive. They're just so expensive.

Right.

Sometimes I kind of, when I'm always posting and things like that, I feel there's a bit of guilt too because I've been very fortunate with where I am and that I'm able to go running and things like that. So when it gets really hard—

But you know what? You've worked really hard for that.

I have, I have. But there is an element where, I mean, we all have it. We have our bad days and you kind of feel, have a bit of a pity party. And I've always been very honest on my social media and everything like that. And it's like, sometimes, some days it is hard, but then there's an element of a bit of like, I need to be really grateful for being able— and then I just remind myself there's a lot of people that would love to be going out for running, like, like yourself too. And I can't have a pity party because I'm able to go out and run. So yeah, so it's a big element of being grateful.

You just said so much in that, all that you shared. The first thing was trust. Like you had to learn to trust the blade and that you were gonna run. And I think that goes for anyone, whether you're an amputee or not, is learning to trust your body, learning to trust that your body is gonna work for you and it wants to work for you and it wants the best for you. And if we view it like that, then our bodies start to work for us, you know? Exactly.

But if we—

I think it is trust and knowing that we will be able to get something done, we'll be able to walk up that mountain. Well, and for me, I had to learn to trust that my body— it's so interesting. I just, for some reason, this popped in my head earlier today about the first time that I was able to stand on my leg again for the first time when I had been non-weight-bearing for months.

Yeah.

And it was such a trusting process because the inside of my leg is all metal. And I just remember those first steps of walking and thinking about, is my leg gonna hold up? Is it gonna crumble beneath me? Am I gonna fall?

Yeah.

Like all those things that I would think of. So there is a lot of trust. And then I love that you talk about gratitude because gratitude is alchemy. It's always what changes the way that I'm feeling and it snaps me out of my pity party because I think we all struggle at some point with something, especially now. And it's easy to kind of get, you know, have that little pity party, but then, okay, did that, time to move on. And I think gratitude is the quickest way to do that. Just be grateful for what we have and what we can do.

Yeah.

Well, I just love all that you shared. And I love seeing that you run on trails. And whenever, you know, there's anybody that's like, oh, I don't know if I can do that. I'm sure they just look at you and just go, "Oh, she runs hundreds of miles. She runs on trails. She's you know what? I'm gonna do it. You're so inspiring." I always like to ask people on the show, like what their definition is of resilience, and you are such a beautiful example of resilience. But what is your definition of resilience?

I just never give up. Everything, I will give it a try. I just do my best with everything and just never give up.

I love that. Yeah, it's never give up. Actually, look, that is what my shirt says. That is so funny.

Oh, that's funny.

We are like, I swear, we're like soul sisters.

Oh, we are, definitely.

We think so much alike and your whole process of how you dealt with, you know, your cancer and your amputation. I felt the same way going— I was in denial. And I mean, so I can relate to so much of what you said. And I love seeing you. Y'all gotta check her out on Instagram and your website's beautiful. Tell people where they can follow you to stay inspired.

Instagram's probably the best, @ncrunnerjackie. And yeah, because that's kind of where I seem to post everything.

Yeah. And your stories, I'm always watching your stories and you can find her website there and you can also check her out on all the magazines and news stories that she's been on, especially the recent one with running 100 miles on a treadmill. So thank you so much for being here to share your experience strengthen and hope and inspire us. I just appreciate you, and I hope that I get to meet you in person someday.

So do I. That would be fantastic. But thank you so much for having me on the show.

Thank you. Thanks so much for joining us this week on True Grit and Grace Podcast.

If you liked If you like it, please rate it or share it with your friends. That would help too. If you're not yet on the newsletter list, come over to amberlylago.com and jump on it. While you're there, you can grab a free downloadable gratitude journal, and you might just want to check out my book or even check out my monthly motivational membership. Thanks again for tuning in, and we'll see you next week.

Bye.