How Podcasting Can Help Amplify Your Message | Avi Arya | Travis Chappell |

The goal is to make yourself better at the skills that you're trying to make yourself good at, skills that are difficult to master. Because if you can get good at skills that are difficult to master, then the paychecks start increasing all the time. Whether you actually have a job or you're an entrepreneur or a business owner, storytelling is definitely one of those skill sets that you're going to want to master if you want the, you know, the freedom and stuff that comes from being a full time podcaster. Because that's really the only way to get around it. Your content has to be engaging, it has to inspire people, has to motivate people to take action. It has to, it has to get them to destroy their inner false narratives around how they live their lives. And the only way to really do that effectively is through storytelling. You gotta, it's gotta be one of those skills that you put into the, put into the. I need to work on this category and start consuming content around how to, how to tell stories better. But really the bottom line is tell more stories. That's why I love podcasting.

So my name is Avi Arya, father of two girls, six dogs, husband to a superwoman, streetcar racer, turn hotelier, now social media marketer and founder of Internet moguls. Travis. This is my 10 second hero introduction. What would be your introduction?

Well, I mean, I feel like I, I feel like it's going to pale in, in comparison to the guy who came up with a 10 second hero introduction. But I'll give it my best shot.

Let's do it.

So my name is Travis Chappell. I am a husband and I am a father to a 2 month old and a 20 month old. I am a former ministry person turned door to door sales guy turned podcaster and now a software founder. How's that?

That is fantastic. You know, off late. They always say that you attract people based on the energy that you're vibrating with. For whatever reason, I've been attracting a lot of people on my show who are current or ex ministry people. So thank you for your faith in everything. So Travis, tell us. So you're, you're in Vegas and as you said, it was snowing last week. And what, what. Tell us a little bit about your rituals. Like how does your day look like with a 20 month old and a 2 month old? You know, you still look fresh and healthy and how does your day look like?

Yeah, it's a facade, man. It's, it's all a facade. I, yeah, so I was always, I was always a Guy that liked to sleep in. I've always loved my sleep. I was always really tired. It seemed like in high school and college and I fell asleep driving all the time. I had to pull over on this. I don't know how many times in college I had to pull over on the side of the road and take a 10 minute nap. I've just always been somebody that loves sleep and so I have never been an early riser. But when I had my kids it just got to the point where I was running a business. And then before I had my daughter back in October, I just launched my software. I had my other podcast coaching and course business and so I'm launching a software company. We have our second kid and at that point I was just like, I saw the writing on the wall. Luckily before our daughter came. And so I ended up doing a program from andy Frisella called 7500 hard. And I started doing that before my daughter came because I was like, if I don't get these rituals and get this discipline in order right now, it's going to be ten times more difficult to try to make it happen after we have her. So I basically just started getting up at 4am every day and started going. First thing I do is go straight to the gym and I sit in my car and I try to read for I like, I like to read at the gym parking lot because it gets me out of my house. If I, if I try to read at my house, like on the couch or something, I know I'll just lay down on the couch and go back to sleep. So I love that guy. Out of that house. Yeah, I get out of the house and I take my pre workout on the way to the gym so that that caffeine starts pumping into my system a little bit before my workout comes. And by the time I'm done reading, I'm ready to go in and get a good workout in and then I work out, come back home, uh, you know, do all the morning stuff that you gotta do once you're done working out, shower, change, get ready, all that good stuff and then sit down with my journal and look at what I have to do for the day. And then my wife goes to the gym and it's my turn to watch the kids for a couple of hours. So from 7 to 9, I usually am at home with a cup of coffee doing some things that don't require a lot of intentional focus. You know, like I can answer some emails or whatever while I watch my daughter and play with My son or whatever, if he happens to be up yet. Um, and so I do some, do some, some non focused task work that's just kind of like do it, do some social media, do some emails, do a little bit of this, a little bit of that. And then my wife gets back around nine, she showers, gets ready for the day and then, and then from there I can get to work on some of my projects and stuff.

That is fantastic. I learned so much in the last five minutes. Getting up at four in the morning, taking your book with you and your coffee with you. So you're doing three things together. Awesome. I guess you have to with, you know, with two babies in the house.

And if you're not intentional about your schedule with, with kids and stuff and all of a sudden it's 7:30pm and you haven't done anything all day. You know what I mean? You just, you gotta, you gotta be intentional about it or else other people are gonna be intentional about taking it from you, you know?

Lovely. Be intentional about your day, your focus and how you plan it. Fantastic. So tell us about, you know, how did you get known as a podcasting guy? I mean, how did the podcasting journey start?

Sure, it's a good question. I started back in 2016 listening to podcasts. So it was a year of my life that I looked at as a really big rebuilding year because I had figured out a couple of years before when I graduated college in 2014, that I didn't want to be in ministry anymore, which is what I had my degree in. And I didn't know what I was going to do at that point. So I just did what I did in college, which was door to door sales. And so I started just getting, going door to door and actually pushing hard at it. I did it full time, year round and full time by the way, for door to door, it was like 20 hours a week maybe. So it kind of was a cool gig. You know, I was 22, was knocking doors, making six figures for the first time ever and working 20 hour work weeks, you know, just knocking doors, selling stuff.

What were you setting?

So that year I was selling alarms. I started off selling solar and then I started selling alarms.

Can I ask you, do you really have to believe in every product that you sell? Or now looking. But you know, let me ask that Travis, who started then, and then this Travis, do you really have to believe in the product?

A hundred percent, man. Yeah, I tried after that there was a little bit of an in between period after I got into like listening to podcasts and diving into personal development and stuff where I tried to start making a little bit of extra money because I literally stopped working. So after the year that I sold alarms, I made six figures. But I was just like, I didn't like the future version of what that looked like, you know, when I like, I didn't, I didn't want to look at 32 year old Travis and still be a door to door salesperson and not to talk trash in the industry. I have several friends that have made millions of dollars selling stuff door to door and I'm not talking trash about it at all. Just for me personally, I didn't want to be doing it. So I took a pivot. I stopped working because if you're not in on when you're doing a hundred percent commission sales, you can't, you can't half ass it. You know what I mean? It's not like a 9 to 5 where I could just show up to my cubicle and do my job. Ish. And still get a paycheck on if you're not there, if you're not selling, you don't get paid. So I stopped doing it and I started jumping into personal development for the first time. Books, audiobooks, first time that I rolled on podcasts. And so in that time period I wasn't working at all for six months. And I was just kind of lucky. My wife went back to work and started working and then we cashed out on a real estate deal that we were in to give us a little bit of Runway. And I was just trying to figure out what I was going to do with my life essentially. And then a buddy of mine was selling outside sales for Home Depot. Um, it was a hundred percent commission as well. Almost every sales job I ever did was all 100% commission. And But Home Depot would generate the leads for you and then they would send you out on, on and to close the leads. And it was for like roofing, siding, gutters, window jobs, like all that kind of stuff. And Home Depot is not cheap either. So we're selling like 20, $25,000 window jobs, $15,000, you know, roofs.

How much would you make out of that?

So we made, we made a small percentage commission on that based on volume and stuff. So it was, honestly, it was, it was a decent opportunity. My buddy was making like 30k a month and 100% commission sales just being a sales rep and working for a company like Home Depot. So they took care of you. There's like spiffs and trips and you get, you still, Even though you're 100% commission, they still paid for your medical insurance and things like that. But for me, I didn't believe in the product enough to sell it effectively. So when I sold solar, when I sold alarms, I believed in all of those products. And so I don't think you have to have a passion about a product to be able to sell it, but you do need to believe in the product to be able to sell it. So it's difficult for me to sell products that I wouldn't personally buy or don't personally use. So when I sold solar, I didn't have a house that could get solar, but I would have gotten it if I could have. So when I sold alarms, I definitely had an alarm and I sold it to my test is like, would I sell this to my own parents or grandparents? You know what I mean? Would I feel comfortable selling this to them? And if the answer is yes, and I feel like they definitely should have it and I hook them up with it, then I can usually get behind it. Started selling for Home Depot, not to talk trash, and Home Depot, great company, but I didn't believe in the products enough because I knew I was familiar enough because we had bought some real estate and flipped a couple of houses. I was familiar enough with like, what generic industry pricing was, and I felt like we were so, so much higher than all of those to the point where I would never have bought, I would never have bought a window job from Home Depot. I would never have bought a roof from Home Depot. I would have never bought any of that stuff from Home Depot. I would have definitely paid somebody else to come to get the, get the job done. So it was really difficult for me when I got in those sales situations. As soon as objections would come up, I wouldn't, I would just, I would, I would piece out. And as you know, if you can't overcome objections, you're not going to make good money in sales. That's the difference between a sales rep that makes 70k a year and a sales rep that makes a quarter million a year is overcoming objections. And so I couldn't, I couldn't get behind the product enough to overcome it. When somebody was like, oh, that's really expensive, I would just be like, yeah, you're right. You know what I mean? That's a good point. You know, like, we would be $4,000, you know, if I'm quoting a $12,000 window job and this other company that came in like Lowe's. Right. It Wasn't like, it was just these crappy companies that were totally bad quality. It was like, we're competing against Lowe's, and they're selling this same exact job for 8 grand that I'm gonna have to charge 12 grand for. If it were me, I would also go with Lowe's, you know what I mean? So I don't know how to overcome objections like that. It's not. It's not in me to do it. So I don't know. That's a really long answer to your question, but the answer is, no, I can't. I can't sell something I don't believe in.

No, it's. The long answer helps so many people who are listening to this right now, so. And people who are listening to this, if you actually. You learned so much from the last two and a half minutes, put in a drop in a comment. What's that one thing that you learned? Should you go with your heart or not when you're selling a product? Excellent. So how did you get known? How did podcasting start happening for you?

So when. That. During that year when I was just consuming podcasts and stuff like that, I eventually got to the point where I heard a guy, his name is John Lee Dumas, runs a really popular podcast called Entrepreneur on Fire. And I was listening to a show, and he was talking about, hey, you should podcast. You know, if you ever thought about podcasting, go check this out. And so I went over to his website, started poking around, and I found his income reports, which is probably where I spent the most time on his site. And he's published his income reports with the CPA for the last. You know, still does it to this day. So since he started in 2012, now all the way to 2021, he's been publishing those income reports. And he gives you the exact breakdown of his gross revenue, his net revenue, what he spends his money on, all these things. And so I would go in there, I was like, man, how did this guy make $283,000 last month? Being a podcaster, like, that's crazy, you know, and it really piqued my interest. And so I was like, you know, this seems like a pretty cool medium, and it seems like a pretty good way to get to know people and meet people and have people on my show that I admire and respect. And so I just started a show, and it was about networking, because that's what I wanted to get good at, which is kind of a takeaway for some people, is you don't have to be an expert, to get started, you just gotta talk about something that you're interested in learning more about and then go interview people who are good at that thing. And then you can kind of be the person that helps other people discover more about that thing that you're also learning about. So I started learning about networking in a really big way because I started doing three interviews a week when I started my show, and it was all about how to build relationships better. And so when you take on the identity of somebody who's leading the conversation and networking, you start taking the actions that somebody who's in that position should take. Meaning that I started reading the industry books and I started. Whenever an article would pop up on relationship building, I would read it and whenever there was a speech on networking, I would listen to it. I started to really soak into a lot of those principles and practices on how to build relationships better. It ended up going pretty well with my show and got me in front of a lot of people that honestly at the time shouldn't have given me the time of day. But for whatever reason they did, people started kind of asking me about it and said, hey, can you help me start a show? And that's when it kind of clicked with me because I was really trying to sell networking products, like I was trying to sell a networking course and coaching and stuff, but just wasn't taking off very much. And I didn't have a clear understanding of the big result that I was going to offer people because networking is such a long term game that you don't know. You know what I mean? Like, you don't, like. I can't guarantee you that something's going to come out of this, but in seven and a half years from now, this connection that you made might have led to a different connection that leads to this person, that leads to this giant opportunity. But I can't say that on a sales page or a landing page or my email copy or anything because I can't guarantee the result because it's such a long term game. So it was kind of a little bit difficult. I'm sure that somebody that's a brilliant marker would be able to sell it, but I was having trouble selling it. And at the same time, people are offering me $15,000 to coach them on how to podcast. I was like, oh, this is the business. Why am I busting my ass trying to make this thing happen over here that nobody wants to buy from me when people are like begging to give me money for this podcasting thing? That I figured out. So that's when I shifted all of my attention away from anything else and started focusing on podcasting and started making that, you know, the core of our business, which is helping entrepreneurs learn how to podcast.

That is fantastic. It's so from the heart, you know, it's. It's. It's lovely. You. I love how you're, you know, you. You share your vulnerabilities and you say, you know, I didn't know what was happening. I was going towards networking, and then I realized this. This is better. And I saw the income report, you know, because that's what we do. We look at things and we look at. We look at a shiny object, we go after that. Sometimes that doesn't work out. But in the process, as long as you have a ritual, as long as you have that intentional focus, you make things happen. Fantastic. So for all the people who are watching right now, what would be your, you know, like, let's. Let's say three things to get started. Okay. I want to.

I'm.

I'm. I don't know John Lee Dumas. I mean, I'm talking about the audience. I hope they know them. I actually interviewed John Lee Dumas a couple of weeks ago, and that was a lot of fun. But a lot of people are like, I don't know John Lee Dumas, but I love this Travis guy. I love his family story. I love the fact that he's, you know, he's so chilled out. He's talk how. What would Travis's message be to people right now who are watching this? The three steps on how they should think about a podcast, what should be the topic, and, you know, should. All you need is a mic and a phone, and you can do it from everywhere or just the three steps to get started.

So the very first thing I would say is you have to understand the goal of why you're starting a show to begin with. What is the reason that you're starting a show? Is it. Is it to bring more clients into your existing business? Is it to be a lead generator for your core offer? Is it to interview people that interest you? Is it to be a hobby and something to let you escape and hang out with your buddies in the garage and talk sports on the weekends? Like, what. What is the purpose, the main purpose of your show? I think it's super important to get clear on that from the beginning, because that's going to inform everything else, because podcasting is such a wide array of. Of results that can happen from it. So if you're not intentional. Again, back to that word, intention. If you're not intentional about the direction that you're headed, that's how you kind of just start a show and then you end up seven months later quitting because it never went anywhere. It didn't give you anything that you wanted it to give you because you never got clear on what you wanted in the first place. So, you know, step number one is, what do I want this to be? So for me, I wanted to become a full time podcaster. And I wasn't exactly sure what that meant. I just knew that I wanted the, the majority of my income to come through my podcast in an online sort of a way. And that was my goal from the beginning. So if you have an existing business, your goal might be, oh, I just want credibility and authority in who I am. So people buy my products and services more, even if they don't come from the podcast. Right? So there's so many different ways to look at it, but you just got to figure out what that goal is first. Secondly, you have to figure out who you're talking to. Once you figure out the goal, you have to figure out, who am I creating this for? Because that, that answer is going to help you create all of the other answers to the questions that you might have rolling around in your head. Like, you know, what should my name be? What should my topic be? How many times a week should I release? What should my episodes be about? Should I interview people? Should I do solo shows? All of those other answers are going to get answered by your unique listener profile, your avatar that a lot of people refer to it as. It's the person that you ideally would love to listen to your show the most. And you got to get to know that person inside and out. I always tell people, aim small, miss small. If you've ever seen the movie the Patriot with Mel Gibson, there's a scene in the movie where his, you know, the redcoats are invading his farm and they burn his house down and he's hiding in the forest with his kids and they're about to open fire on this platoon of redcoats. And he tells his son before he shoots to as a reminder, because he'd obviously told him before, he said, aim small, miss small. And so the whole time the kid's repeating to himself, aim small, miss small. Aim small, miss small. Basically what it means is don't just aim for the guy. If you're aiming for the guy and you miss, then you're going to miss completely because you're aiming for the guy, but if you, if you aim for a button on his jacket or a stain on the sleeve, or if you aim for something really tiny that's on his person and you miss that mark, you're still going to hit him because you might only miss that by a couple of inches. But if you aim for the guy and you miss the guy by a couple of inches, you don't hit him at all. You know what I mean? So basically, aim small, miss small. I take that into niching and targeting your audience because I think it's really important to get extremely granular about who you want to speak to, because if you don't hit the target every time, which inevitably is going to happen, you're still going to, like, you're still going to have a good grouping. You're still going to have the people that are around the target that you're shooting for at least share a lot of the similar qualities, characteristics, thoughts, needs, desires, wants, pain points as the ideal person that you're, that you're mapping out. So you really got to get to know who that person is. So what's the goal? Who are you talking to? And then if I was going to say one other thing, I would just say be consistent because I could say a bunch of other things for number three there. But ultimately, the thing that's going to be the biggest needle mover for you is just consistency. Committing to creating consistent, quality content for a certain period of time, whatever that, whatever that's going to be like, you got to make that commitment and you got to release consistently, because then the number one killer of shows is lack of consistency. So if you can't, like whatever episode release schedule you can commit to, commit to it and stick to it, rain or shine, you know what I mean? There was a time in my life where I was going through a lot of things personally and I was still putting out three interviews a week. You know what I mean? Like that you just, you just got to put it out. If you, whatever you commit to put it out, because that's. Consistency breeds trust. And the only reason to get into content creation to begin with, especially as a business owner, is to create more trust people so that it's easier for you to be able to sell products and services and add value to the people that you're building your content for. And if you can't even be consistent in your own release schedule, then your listeners and the audience is probably going to have a little bit of a lack of trust in you. Even if it's not on a conscious level, it's almost definitely on a subconscious level. So I would say those three things get clear on your goal, make sure you know who you're talking to, and be consistent for the long haul.

I love that. I love that. You know what I took away in the last five minutes? Lots of notes. And also my biggest takeaway was that you took me back. I'd seen that movie, but I forgot it. But you actually took me back and you told me exactly what happened and that you missed the button and you missed it. So obviously, over years of practice and training, you become a good storyteller and you take people in your journey and your answers to that situation. So for all the new podcasters listening, how good, how important is it to be, or how valuable is the skill of being a good storyteller on a podcast?

I mean, how much time do you got, man? Like, it's storytelling. I've learned. One thing, I've learned a lot is that if you can get good at skills that are really difficult to master but are huge needle movers, then you can have success that most people will never see. The harder the skill, the fewer people have that skill and the more you're going to get paid for that skill. Right? That's why if you're a minimum wage worker and you flip burgers for a living, you don't get paid that much money because you get paid for the amount of value that you can bring to the marketplace so they can go put out a job post and get 3,000 other people that are totally qualified to do that position. That's what sets the price for how much you get paid. So the goal is to make yourself better at the skills that you're trying to make yourself good at, skills that are difficult to master. Because if you can get good at skills that are difficult to master, then the paychecks start increasing all the time, whether you actually have a job or you're an entrepreneur or a business owner. And storytelling is definitely one of those skill sets that you're going to want to master if you want the, you know, the freedom and stuff that comes from being a full time podcaster. Because that's really the only way to get around it. Your content has to be engaging, it has to inspire people, has to motivate people to take action. It has to, it has to get them to destroy their inner false narratives around how they live their lives. And the only way to really do that effectively is through storytelling. So you gotta, it's gotta be One of those skills that you put into the, put into the. I need to work on this category and start consuming content around how to, how to tell stories better. But really the bottom line is tell more stories. That's why I love podcasting and that's why I love releasing so many episodes because it gives me more opportunities to work on my skillset and refine my skillset. And when you magnify that over five years and you look at how many stories you've told over the course of 6, 7, 8, 900 podcast episodes, you really start to get a little bit better all the time. And when you look back over that period of time, that skill set and that learning has compounded in that time period. And like I said, that skill set is going to pay you a lot of money.

My next question is, are you intentional in giving so many nuggets and at the end of every section, or do you. Do you know, because I love what you said, tell more stories to destroy the false beliefs that your clients have and then maybe probably build new ones. So that's a beautiful way of saying why people should, you know. And so I actually have a very high ticket client coaching call after this, if you don't mind. I'll use some of these. You know, I say I learned it from.

Of course.

This is really fantastic. Awesome. So we spoke about consistency, we spoke about, you know, storytelling. In terms of marketing, there are different schools of thought. People are like, you know, like you said, learn a skill that allows you to make money. You saw John Dumas's thing, you know it. So obviously money, you know, you've got two kids, I've got two kids, and we need that money, and we need that. A lot of people say don't do podcasts if you, if you want to make money. A lot of people are like, no, you mean you follow a system and you'll make money. What is your take on why and how to monetize this endeavor?

Yeah, the people that are selling or that are telling you not to start a podcast because they don't make money are the people who have influenced figured out how to make money with a podcast. So I always say, don't take advice from anybody that you're not willing to trade places with in that category. Right. Let me caveat that by saying in that category, because I don't, I don't necessarily mean to trade lives with them. I just mean have they done the thing that you're trying to do? That's all I mean by that. If they haven't done the thing that you're trying to do, then it's probably not a great person to take advice from. You can listen to their stories and learn from their failures in that area. But in terms of like, that's pretty hardcore advice to listen to somebody who never figured out how to monetize a podcast just to be like, well, they couldn't figure it out. That means I can't figure it out. Like, that doesn't make any sense because the question is really, did somebody figure it out? And that answer is resoundingly yes. So if somebody figured it out, I can figure it out. I just got to go learn how they did it and implement the same things. It's not that difficult. You don't have to reinvent the wheel and come up with your own strategy. So I definitely think that it's very possible to monetize a podcast. You just have to kind of have the right strategy going into it. So I look at it way more as your first goal should be like, your goals with podcasting should be all of the other things that come along with podcasting. And the goal that most people focus on to me is like the back burner goal. That's the long term goal. That's the one that's going to be like the cherry on top at the end of the finish line when you're, like, when you're seven years into this thing. That's so, so everybody thinks audience, listeners, sponsors, like, that's how you make money podcasting that to me. Again, cherry on top. That's, that's, that's down the road. 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 10, 12 years later, after creating consistent content, you probably have an audience base and you'll probably be able to monetize and you'll probably be able to have a large following of people who actually give a crap about what you have to say. But in the meantime, it does a lot of other awesome things for you. And that's kind of what I want my clients and my students to focus on. Like, focus on the credibility that it brings into your brand, focus on the authority that it gives you because you created your own platform and your own stage to be able to share wisdom and content on, focus on the network that it builds. Like, my show's all about networking. And I get the question all the time, hey, Travis, what's your number one networking tip that you've learned through 600 episodes about networking? And without question, beside, like, you know, I could go into generic networking, but my number one practical answer is Start a podcast because it's easily the been the biggest needle mover for the people that I know and have relationships with now has been getting my foot in the door and having a conversation with them on a podcast first and then building a relationship moving forward. So having a podcast is good for your network like I was talking about earlier, it's great for keeping you accountable to learning things. You know, I ran a show on networking, so I felt like I owed it to my audience to bring them the best content around networking or else how would I expect them to share my content or like an episode or tell their friend about it if I'm not putting my all into making sure that it's really good content. So I consumed the best books and I would listen to the best interviews and read the best articles about how to work and how to build better relationships. And so that became my number one accountability partner in making that a big skill set of mine, which is building relationships and connecting people together and being a, a bridge between groups of people and, and being able to get some of the top guests in my industry on my show by using the skill set that I was learning by running the podcast. You know what I mean? Like it's a kind of just all works for each other and helps and it helps to continue to push you forward. So there's so many other reasons to have a show besides just the one that most people think is the reason to have a show. And that to me is, that to me is what makes it worth it in the meantime. Because I do believe at one point like I'll have a show that has 2, 3, 4, 5 million downloads a month and at that point you can do whatever you want. You know, any publisher in the world would die to help you publish your book for you and give you a fat book deal. Any stage in the world wants you to speak on their stage because you have a built in audience of people that you can put a couple ads out to that helps them put butts in seats, right? Like it becomes a real asset that you can wield as a connection tool, as a way to get, you know, more book deals, as a way to get your value and information out into the world, as a way to get, get booked on more stages and continue to solidify yourself as an authority in your world, which then allows you to be able to raise your prices, spend more time with your family, bring in the best talent you can do whatever you want when you have that built in distribution of audience members. And that's the long term benefit of it. But most people give up seven months in because they haven't experienced the long term benefit of it because it's by definition a long term benefit and it won't come to you in seven months. But since most people are only focused on that and not focused on any of the other things I just mentioned, seven months in, they give up. And then, well, now you just guaranteed that you're never going to have that audience, you know what I mean? Because you just gave up. They're not going to find you now. I guarantee you that. So that's kind of my thoughts on it. It's just that definitely monetizable. You just got to come at it with the right angle.

Does your wife listen to your podcast?

You know, that's a good question. I would say she has listened to my podcast, but I wouldn't. I don't think she's a regular listener. I doubt she's listened to an episode in a while.

You know, I do something every morning. Every single morning I either do a webinar or I do something or the other. And my family is somewhere around, but they're like, they just pick up the keywords from here and there. And so, you know, I think the biggest advocates come, they support you in everything that you do, but the advocates, the real fans really come from outside. So I just wanted to reconfirm that because if you said your wife is listening to every single episode, I would have brought that up as an issue in my family very soon. Okay.

Nope, nope. You're good, man. You're good.

Okay, lovely. So, Travis, just last two questions. Tell us about the software company that you have and how it's helping people.

Yeah, so it's called Guestio. I mentioned before that the thing that I kind of got known for in my circles was getting the best guests in my industry to say yes to an interview on my show. And a lot of other people struggled with getting those people, same people, to say yes. And so they'd asked me about it and the real answer is it's just takes a lot of hard work, a lot of cold reach out, a lot of persistence, and a lot of follow up. That's real. That's the real answer. It's a lot of work. And so most people either don't have the time to do it because they're running a successful business already, or they just don't want to take the time to do it. So we ended up building a software marketplace platform called Guestio where you can go create a free Guestio account. Build out a profile and you can start searching through our catalog of guests, like high quality guests for your show. There's a whole paid marketplace. There's a whole free marketplace. You can go on there, start booking people totally for free. Right now it's free to set up an account, it's free to book people that are free. And then some people will have a price associated with the interview if they're have more demands on their time or have a crazy schedule. So you can go on there and book some of those people as well. But it ends up kind of being that shortcut because it took me months to get some of the people that are on Guestio right now for 300 bucks for an interview. It took me months to get them to say yes. Whereas you can go to Guestio right Now, pay them 300 bucks and get them to say yes immediately. So there's, there's definitely some, some, some time efficiency and shortcuts that we've built into, built into the site.

That is fantastic. We're going to link up the guest and the registration page and all the details in the description because I genuinely believe when people are watching this episode, it would be incomplete if you didn't actually go and check out what this can go do for your podcasting journey. Also, we have 126,500 people on our email list. We're going to blast this out to everyone, let them know that there's a service like that that exists and there's a very cool family man behind the project. So that'll be a nice, you know, sort of add touch to it. So what about to. For me to grow my podcast, is it also advisable that I be on other people's podcasts?

100%. Yeah. It's like the biggest needle mover for numbers on your show. The best way to convert any new platform followers, regardless of the platform, is to do more on that platform. Meaning that if you want more Instagram followers, then do more on Instagram. If you want more Facebook followers, do more on Facebook. If you want more people on your email list, do email list swaps and things like that, because you know that those people are going to be highly engaged because that's the platform that they found you on and they engaged on it to find you. It's the same thing with podcasts and maybe even more so because none of the other platforms connect directly with podcasting like they do from a Facebook ad to your email list. It connects properly, it integrates extremely well, but it's not super easy to get podcast listeners to translate from Facebook or Google Ads. So the best way to grow your show is by getting another podcast, because that's the only real way that, you know, somebody's an engaged podcast listener is if they listen to your show. If they. If they found you after listening to you on a podcast. And plus, like, the people that listen to your show, Avi, like, they like you. They trust you. They know you, right? So if you're bringing me on and telling your audience, hey, this Travis guy's legit by bringing me on, and if anybody from your audience goes, hey, I'm gonna go check out Travis's show because I like him, then they're like, that. That. That. No, like, trust ascension happens almost immediately. So the. The. The. The traffic that comes from the podcast by being a guest on podcasts, it might not be. It will to some of these other, you know, traffic sources in terms of the volume of numbers, but in terms of the quality of the person that actually sticks with you and becomes a true, like, listener and fan of your show, that. That quality is going to be so, so, so much higher than any other platform because it's such a deep, level, intimate platform. Like, somebody's still listening to this interview. We've been going for, what, 40, 45 minutes, like, over a half hour talking. So they've gotten the chance to really get to know who I am, and they don't resonate with me. They're not going to check out any of my stuff, which is fine. But if they do resonate with me, they're really gonna like my stuff because they already know that they like me. You know what I mean? Like, they didn't just see an ad pop up with a picture, and they go, hmm, do I like this Travis guide? Let me do some research. It's like, well, they've listened to me for 45 minutes. They probably have a good understanding of whether or not they're gonna resonate with me and my message. So by this point, they've already kind of made that decision. If anybody comes over, even if it's only five people, those five people are probably way higher quality than running an ad campaign and getting 100 people to sign up your email list. You know what I mean? So it was. It's one of the most effective ways, I think, to build an active and engaged audience.

Lovely. On that note, Travis, if people. When people. The people who want to listen to you, where should they go and which are the channels they should follow you at?

Yeah, I mean, the podcast is great. I put out four episodes a week. A lot of it's around networking, relationship building and bringing on amazing guests to talk about those conversations. So you can find it@travischapel.com for build your network and it'll pop up, you know, four different links that you can go check out if you're an Apple user, Android user or whatever. So travischappell.com byn for the podcast.

Lovely. Fantastic. This was an amazing journey. We still have five minutes, but I want to save that to have a private conversation with you after this. There was so many golden nuggets, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7. So thank you very much. This, this has been fantastic. I normally have two or three, but then I have so many and like I said, I have a coaching call after this. So I was like, wow, the way you explain things about how the story, how to be intentional and, and you know, the aim. Small, Ms. Small loved all of those. And so, Travis, this has been fantastic. I hope to stay in touch. This, this was fantastic. We learned so many things. We're going to summarize it. Talk about your software over here. Talk about everything that you've done so that more people in our community can connect with you. I will highly, highly recommend everybody who's watching this. I'm also going to be playing this in our Thursday Entrepreneur cause where we have 200 entrepreneurs coming every Thursday, 7:30am Vancouver time, 9pm India time logging in as part of our membership community. And we either bring in a live guest or we bring in a recording. So this recording is definitely going to be played in one of the Thursdays in February itself. So all of you people, if you're watching the recorded version, once again, go to the link, follow this gentleman. I have a very strong feeling you're going to love the family man behind the scenes and the podcaster. And if, if you are wanting to start your podcast journey or any entrepreneurial journey, do you have to choose your route? And I think the podcast route through Travis would be highly, highly recommended. I would definitely endorse this gentleman. Thank you all for watching this. My name is Avi Arya, father of two girls, six dogs, husband to a superwoman, a streetcar racer turned hotelier, now social media marketer and founder of Internet Moguls, signing off for now. Thank you, Travis, foreign marketer and founder of Internet Moguls, signing off for now. Thank you, Travis.