S4:E92🎙️LIVE with Carson V. Heady

Hi, I'm John Maxwell. When the top companies companies in the world are looking for trainers, speakers, and coaches, there's one name that stands above the rest, and that's Maxwell Leadership. Our certified team members have gotten proven results for companies all over the globe, and our reputation, I'm proud to say, is second to none. Some of our members have risen to the top of their profession, including the one you're going to meet today. I proudly introduce you to my friend, Bob Fabien Zinga.

Welcome to the Leadership and Success Podcast with your host, Coach BZ. If you need to develop into a better leader, this podcast is for you. If you want to achieve a greater level of success, this podcast is for you. His mentor, Dr. John C. Maxwell, said it best. Everything rises and falls on leadership. We hope to inspire you today and provide you with an insight that has the potential to positively impact the trajectory of your life. Welcome to the Leadership and Success Podcast.

Are we all set up for my golf trip next week to Jamaica? I think so, Mom.

Do you have a reliable broadband provider?

Yeah, Biden turned me on to something or another.

Biden? You know that guy is wack, right?

But anyway, he's supposed to be sipping mojitos on the beach. Well, I don't know of anything, but I've been too busy trying to figure out where that bar that Tom Cruise flipped bottles at in Conker.

You know what?

I think I know someone that I can call.

Hold on. This is Verizon.

Hold on. Yes, Verizon Wireless, St. Charles. This is Carson. How can I help you? Is this who I think it is? Yes, uh, I need a favor. I need a reliable mobile broadband provider for my vacation to Jamaica next week. Is this something you can help me with? Yes, we can. We can bring hope and change to your mobile broadband selections. Not only do our services work all over the globe, but they're faster than a speeding thunderbolt, more powerful than the locomotive of any other competitor, You'll be like, "Look, I'm on Air Force One, up in the sky, playing Angry Birds on a plane. It's super speed." For just $50 a month, you can add our 4G capability to any netbook, any mobile hotspot, any tablet, and take high speed up, up and away with you. With our streaming video, one minute you'll feel like you're courtside with Nicholson at the Lakers game, the next you'll be watching Sasha and Malia's recital. You'll get 10 gig of data with that plan and speeds between 5 to 12 megabytes per second on download. Uh, so I want to be able to stream videos from my tablet. Can I do that? Yes, we can. Alright, I want to Skype with Bill while he's picking out fine cigars.

Can we do that?

Yes, we can. Okay, I would also like to be able to surf the web anywhere with speeds comparable to what I get at the Pentagon. Can we do that? Yes, we can. And can't I do this with another service provider? Like AT&T? No, you can't. In fact, their network and customer service would be like kryptonite. So, uh, when can we get this set up? Well, sir, if you guys can excuse me, I'll be by shortly. Right now I have to go rule the air.

All right, yes we can! Today is going to be really, really fun. I, I am so, so grateful and excited to have this guest with me today. So before we get started with that, let's do what we customarily do here on the Leadership and Success Podcast. Let's have our moment of gratitude. So every single day we want to be grateful for at least one thing each and every day. As you know, part of the reason why we do this is because in the US military, about 21, 22 people, veterans, commit suicide every single day. And I believe it's not possible to be suicidal and have an attitude of gratitude at the very same time. So if you would, for just a moment, you can close your eyes if you can, put yourself in your happy place, And maybe take a deep breath and think about one thing you are grateful for today. And today, I think I'm grateful for the wonderful, wonderful weather we have right here in the Bay Area. And let us know what you are grateful for and type it in the comment. If you have a question for my guest, type it in the comment and let us know where you are coming from, what city, what state, and if you are outside of the US, what country. And also, I appreciate it if you can like the event and repost it in your feed. And tag people that you know who might benefit from this podcast. All right, let me do this introduction. It's just gonna take a second. But I think the man I'm gonna introduce you today doesn't really need any introduction. Carson V. Eddy is a best-selling author, award-winning sales leader, and managing director at Microsoft Elevate. He drives AI-powered transformation for nonprofits across the Americas. With over 25 years of experience at Microsoft, AT&T, Verizon. That was what I showed you earlier, a clip of when he was at Verizon. T-Mobile. He has generated more than $1 billion in revenue, trend leaders in 11 countries, and earned recognition as a Sales Hall of Fame inductee and number 1 social seller in tech. 6-time author of The Birth of a Salesman series. And the book today, and I absolutely want everybody to get a copy, is his latest book, This one here, unbeatable. So I think everyone should absolutely get a copy of that. So he's known for his mantra, control the controllable, pressure is a privilege, the show must go on. Actually, that is one of the songs that he is going to recommend that we listen to by Queen, right? The show must go on. And, um, Carson lives with art, with humility, and unshakable belief in helping others win. I am just so glad that we been able to schedule this. So ladies and gentlemen, without any further ado, please help me welcome Carson Heide.

Bob, it's awesome to see you. Thanks for having me, man.

So, so glad we finally were able to make this happen. This is going to be, I think, the finest, uh, show with we've ever had at the Leadership Success Podcast. To get started with, uh, on this, first on a serious note, uh, what are you grateful for today, Carson?

My wife. That was easy. Um, yes, thought of her first. You know, she's kind of the, uh, she completes me, right? She's, uh, she's my best friend, and, um, yeah, she's the light of my life.

Fantastic. And, uh, what is something about you that most people may not know about?

Um, well, I had a blink-and-you-miss-it cameo in the movie Fever Pitch, uh, really filmed in 2004 at the World Series. I'm a St. Louis Cardinals fan because I live in St. Louis and I've always lived in the Midwest. And I was at the game, at Game 4, when we got— wow— by the Boston Red Sox and they ended the Curse of the Bambino, what, the 118-year curse in St. Louis. Well, in front of me Jimmy Fallon and Drew Barrymore ran out on the field. And really, I'm there.

That is crazy. Okay, I'm going to have to watch that movie again and be looking for you. Wow. That is great.

Jersey.

Wow. Actually, before we get started, I think you have to tell us about this video here. Oh, goodness. What was that?

Yeah, you really dug deep, Bob. I have a feeling this is going to be the greatest podcast I've ever been on. So years ago there was a contest and, uh, it was basically to do a video of some sort and you had to do a sales presentation. And so, um, oddly, like, nobody in my region really wanted to enter. And like, I'm a big believer, you just, you go big or you go home. So we decided to go big and I had some creative guys that I worked with. And, um, I wasn't even a seller at the time, I was a regional manager. But we put that together. That won a local award and it got me into two others. I had to win locally, you know, like then I had to win regionally and I had to win nationally. And I ended up winning the national Verizon Rockstar Award. But that was— Wow. So, yeah, wild stuff. Good memory.

Like I say, the rest is history. This is just incredible. Actually, there is another— you have so many videos out there. You add so much value to your audience. Let me see if I can find it and play it and, uh, ask you about your thoughts on this one. Just a second, I think I have it, uh, on storage here. Let's see, let's see. Please be ready. Okay, here we go. This video, let's watch this.

This is for Sarah and Robin.

Oh boy. That is just wonderful. Because we only have 1 hour, I have to stop there, but this is just incredible.

Yeah, look, I'm willing to do anything for a good cause. That was a charity fundraiser and grab the mic. And I was just literally out in front of a store and trying to attract people and attract people. I did.

Wow. What an incredible, incredible journey. So your journey from a call center rookie to managing director at Microsoft Elevate. What a story. That's quite extraordinary. So what pivotal moment first ignited your passion for sales and leadership?

Necessity. Um, you know, I was one of those— I had no idea what I wanted to do with my life. And, um, things came easy to me in school. Um, you know, I'd skipped a grade, so I was actually like younger than everybody else in my class. And I was late to develop. I was interested in sports, but I was always the year— like the age group behind. And so, um, it was tough. Uh, you know, growing up was challenging. And so when I went to, uh, college because it was the thing to do. I didn't even declare a major until I was a junior. And so when I got out, it was like one of those things, like I had to figure out what in the world I'm going to do. And fortunately, a friend of mine had a relative that worked for AT&T, which at the time was Southwestern Bell, got me an interview and I went in. But, you know, there were 12 people in my graduate— in my training class, and only 2 made it out, myself and one other person. And it was because We were the only people who had nowhere else to go. Everybody else retreated to a previous role that they had done, and I was from off the street, so I had to survive. I didn't think I was going to make it. But you know what I gravitated toward, Bob, was that I had a penchant for listening to what my customers were telling me, and then how could I turn it into something where everybody won? The customer got what they claimed to want, I got something, and my company got something. And that kind of got me on the trail to sales. Plus, then I got a taste for what was possible, the money and the relationships that came out of it. Leadership was a, a natural segue because I, once I had mastered that role, I wanted to help other people put more food on the table and be better. And those were the things that kind of got me started. It's been a long, fascinating, rewarding journey, but the best part of it has been all the relationships. I met my wife in sales and obviously wrote some books about it that I love it so much. So that's what got me started and that's what kind of lit the first fire.

Wow, that is really, really incredible. And you often say control the controllable, pressure is a privilege, and the show must go on. I'm guessing that's probably the anthem of your life, that song by, by Queen. Can you tell us more about this kind of impact, the personal story behind that, the life lesson behind that mantra?

Yeah, I'll start with control the controllables. That was something that a manager told me back in 2013. You know, it really helped me to get more focused on what I could actually manage and what I could actually control, because far too often we get lost in the noise and all of the distractions and You know, the reality is there's a lot of things we can't control. Why worry about them? Why stress over them? Obsess over the stuff you control. Do it the best you can. Leave it all on the field and the result takes care of itself. The other element, you know, you mentioned the pressures of privilege. That is actually from, um, Doc Rivers in the Netflix documentary The Coach's Playbook. He says pressure is a privilege, and it really stuck with me because Constantly, you know, I work for arguably the greatest company in the world, and I get to do what I love doing for the greatest company in the world and for amazing customers that work in the nonprofit sector, right? So I'm doing what I love for arguably the greater good, and, um, there's always a lot of pressure, you know. There's goals and there's elements that we've got to get better at and grow in, and, you know, sometimes Pressure can be challenging, but I say it's a privilege. I get to do what I love doing, and, um, you know, I have everything I could ever want in life. It hasn't been all sunshine and rainbows, but, um, you know, by being resilient and by being tenacious, uh, I've been able to be successful over the long haul. And then The Show Must Go On, um, you know, in the pandemic and amidst some really challenging personal and career years. That song, I played it over and over every morning in between calls, before I went into tough negotiations, before I went into calls that I knew were going to be absolutely excruciating. I listened to that song and I almost— I just got lost in it because it made me feel like I could do anything. And what it's about, it's basically the show that sometimes we put on for everybody. Like, I'm a very introverted person. I often have to do a lot of back-to-back-to-back-to-back calls in this hybrid work world that we are now in. You know, a lot of times there's no commute, there's no break. I walk out that door and I got to be a husband and a dad, and I, I'm constantly moving. It can be exhausting. And the show must go on instilled in me this ability and belief that I could literally do anything at any time, and it gave me the strength to persevere during tough times. And it became the title of my fifth book.

That is really, really wonderful. Yeah, I believe on your fifth book, I believe you have someone in the circus, right? I think if I remember, it is quite inspiring. And I like how you weave in all of the storytelling. It's really very much encouraging. And when you say control the controllable, I am reminded of the Serenity Prayer. God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, The courage to change the things I can and then the wisdom to know the difference. That is, uh, right here. Wow, that's incredible. All right, so growing up in Missouri and working your way up through Fortune 500 company— Microsoft at one point was the number one company in the world— so how did your background shape your leadership style and resilience?

You know, it's interesting, Bob, because, um, you know, when I was younger and in my 20s and learning a lot of these things for the first time and I made a lot of mistakes, especially in my 20s and early— I was promoted very young. I was the youngest director in my entire organization the first time that I became a sales director. And it was all about me. I had to be the hero. It was like, look at me, look at what I can do, look at what I could achieve. And I rose very quickly because of what I could deliver and the way results over and over and over and over and over again. But the problem was I got blinded by that. I got blinded by my success. I got blinded by the illusion that these people that wanted me to promote them or, you know, whatever it was, were actually my friends. And so I had to fall. I had to fall hard. And that I did. I got laid off a few times in my late 20s, early 30s, and it just pushed me to the bottom. And I had to pick myself up, build myself back up, and realize too, in becoming a father—

yes—

and becoming a husband, that it ain't about me, and I'm not the hero of the story. It's how can I lift up and elevate everybody else around me that I touch because of what I do differently? And what are my unique superpowers and skills? How can I help others with them? But then also, how can I shine a light on their unique skills and superpowers? And I learned that through mostly my time over the last decade with Microsoft, which also has been very challenging. I mean, it's a, it's a hard company to work with, work at, because there's a lot of brilliant people that you're surrounded by all the time. There's a lot of expectations and you've got to rise to the challenge. There's a lot of change happening in this industry and in this business. You can't be married to any set of circumstances because the snow globe will be shaken up. And you've got to make sure that you can very quickly recalibrate around your new playing field and your new set of circumstances. And so it has taught me agility. It has taught me humility. It has taught me humanity and frankly, the criticality of being authentic and vulnerable. It's not the environment that I came up in. I came up in a one-call-close environment where if you told somebody something that you were dealing with on a personal level, it would be brought— it would be held against you. You. That is not the environment that I work in today, thank God. So, you know, that has been a lot of my learning and my leadership journey, and I'm grateful for every second.

That is really, really powerful. What a very inspirational story, because today at Microsoft, you have presented directly to the CEO, Satya Nadella, and led AI-powered transformation for nonprofits. So how do you approach leadership when the stakes are very, very high and the expectations are even higher. How do you do it?

At the heart of it is people. I try to make sure, because believe me, look, I've gotten on big stages and had conversations with my CEO and very large organizations. And what's interesting is, Bob, when I think about it, I still get nervous. Nerves mean you care. So nerves are normal. But how can you fuel that energy and that passion that you have for supporting and serving and bringing value to every conversation that you have? I always try to deliver a win to whoever I'm talking to, and that's the key element. And you can do that with curiosity, right? And I mean, especially when you're talking to an executive at a very large organization, you know, they put their pants on one leg at a time, just like I do. It's critical to figure out, like, what do you want your legacy to be? How can we or I help you better serve the people that you serve? And frankly, it's being willing to do whatever it takes to earn the right to be a trusted advisor. I've introduced executives at big companies to my friends at the competition before because I knew it was the right thing to do. I wasn't a fit, but guess what? Because they knew that they could trust me, the next time that they needed something, they knew they could come to me and I would give them the right answer as opposed to just trying to influence them to do what I wanted them to do. Or what would get me paid. I think the other thing is that when you're connecting with a leader, it's understanding what matters to them. What are the biggest problems that they're trying to solve? I have spent my career obsessing over two things: building community around what I'm trying to do and what my organization is trying to achieve, but also being a problem eliminator, which is what James Bond calls himself in the Bond movie License to Kill. I'm a huge Bond fan. If you're a problem eliminator and you go out and you solve the problems of everybody else that you meet, guess what? You're going to become— you're going to build a reputation of reliability. People are going to put the keys in your hands. I can't tell you, every move that I've ever made in my career has been because of relationships and reputation, but mostly relationships. Because when somebody needs something done, they call me.

That is powerful. I think you need to say that again. Relationship and reputation, especially for those aspiring to lead who are listening to you right now, I think that is really, really key.

Bob, I have the benefit of being able to connect the dots backwards at this stage in my life. You know, it's hard when you're in a moment and you know, you're in your 20s or you're like, you've just been laid off, which I've been laid off twice in my career, almost 3 times. And it's hard to look forward and connect the dots forward. You never know where things are going to go. But I can tell you this, I look backwards and I connect the dots backwards. And every meaningful move I have ever made has been because of relationships and reputation, but mostly relationships. When I got laid off back in 2010, what I did with that time, I applied to over 1,600 jobs, but I also wrote a book and I sent a message out to 968 agents and publishers. Well, I find 15 that would read my book, 6 offered to publish it, and I picked the one with the best distribution. It didn't light the world on fire, but you know what it did do? It made my resume stand out. Amidst all the other hundreds of people applying to the same job. And I got in the room. I was one of 30 to be interviewed for that job, and I finally got it. I got paid half, half of what I got paid the year prior working in the role that I got laid off from. But it didn't matter. I had to get back in the game, and I made a relationship there that led me to my next role. And I made a relationship there that recruited me to Microsoft. I would not be here if it hadn't been for that decision to write a book amidst the hardest period of my life, I wouldn't be sitting here today.

I think you need to tell us about that mindset. Even your book talks about it, Unbeatable. And I know there is another book that you recommend my readers read about the score takes care of itself. What is the mindset that we have to have when we are down, when we are laid off, when we can't find a job, when the economy seems to be going down the toilet? What is the mindset an aspiring leader needs to have in order to succeed. Tell us more about that, please.

So back in 2018, I went on a backpacking and hiking trip with my father-in-law and my brother-in-law through Rainier and the Cascades. And there were times where I looked up and I'm like, oh my gosh, I have to go up here. And there were literally times that I thought I was going to die. So I wondered if they like really didn't like me and they were trying to get rid of me. Didn't know. But what I learned in that experience, Bob, was that I couldn't control my thought about going up that mountain. But what I could do is I could— I have 3 daughters, so I've seen the movie Frozen way too many times. Yeah, Anna says, do the next right thing. I could land the step in front of me. I could do the next right thing as best as I could. And if I— I noticed that if I landed the step right in front of me over and over and over and over and over again, eventually I'd look back and I was at the top of this, like, mountain, and I'm like, Oh my gosh, look at this amazing view from up here. That's the same with life. In even your lowest moment, even if you've got to shrink it down. Like, I was completely alone and abandoned during this time. Like, these people that claim they were my family and friends, they didn't give me the time of day. And so it was really hard for me to just pick myself up and do the next right thing. But I did it, and I just willed myself back into the game. And what it did is it taught me not only what I was capable of, but also the power of resilience and just the mindset of becoming unbeatable. It's really all about no matter what happens to you, you've got to figure out, okay, what is the current set of circumstances and what is the next right thing that I can do the best I can? And if you do that over and over and over, you are unbeatable.

That is really something. And again, it goes back to your mantra: control the controllable. Pressure is a privilege and the show must go on. You have to keep moving forward. That is so powerful. Now, you've helped generate over $1 billion in revenue for your social selling model. What key principle makes that model scalable and timeless?

I do the opposite of what most everybody, every other seller does. That's why. So I'm a huge Seinfeld fan. There was an episode where George Costanza decided to do the opposite of every inclination that he had because he felt like he was a loser. And then he, he becomes a winner. He gets a job with the Yankees. He gets a pretty girlfriend. Like, I did the exact same thing. I started listening to what customers were saying was the reason that they didn't want to talk to me or to my company. I started understanding, like, their frustrations. Like, they're like, hey, I'm already investing. I don't even know what I own. Um, I don't want to buy anything from you. So I started building this methodology where I would reach out saying, hey, let me talk to you about things that you're entitled to, resources that you're entitled to because of your significant investment. I want to help you win. I want to, you know, take that, that approach. But it was a data-driven approach. I realized the controllables that I could control— the quality of my prospecting message, the quantity of my outreach, and the consistency by which I executed over time. And I obsessed over those things. A lot of salespeople reach out to one or 2 or 5 or 10 executives in a company. My biggest deal, I reached out to over 500. I had over 200 people that met with me and I got so ingrained in there. I built such a groundswell of influence. These guys weren't even thinking about us. They weren't even doing anything with us. But I met with the president because of a LinkedIn connection request, got in his office, came in, built a relationship, brought in some really smart people. Got out of the way so that magic could happen, made sure that things kept going. But amidst a pandemic and 7 C-level changes in that organization, my team and I were so entrenched because of the LinkedIn work that I had done that when the deal died, they knew that they had to do something with us. And I had so many different stakeholders like wanting this deal in that company because of the projects that they were going to get out of it that they forced it to happen. And it's based on that. It is a probability, and I call it my Moneyball approach. It's kind of like the Brad Pitt movie and the book about, you know, baseball philosophy that the Oakland A's employed 20 years ago, where we know we can't compete with the big budget team, so we're going to make data-driven decisions and we're going to put people on base. And in my case, if I reach out to as many key influencers as possible with the best message possible I do it over and over and over again. I am statistically guaranteed to win and have been. I've won every award imaginable. I'm probably the least technical person at Microsoft. I feel that way sometimes, but I've been wildly successful and I've trained this methodology in 11 countries and presented it to my CEO because it's probability-based. It is guaranteed to win.

That is really something. In many ways, I feel like you don't have to be a salesman to sell. I think everybody should be a salesperson, if not only to sell yourself, like on your resume or a job or whatever opportunity. I showed that to you in the green room earlier. Long time ago, I was a solopreneur and I had a business. I was partnered with Microsoft. So I'm a Microsoft Small Business Specialist, very, very proud of that. Microsoft actually taught me how to sell. What is selling? Is a process, right? It doesn't happen just by chance. And I think it's also about caring people. Is there something you can say to someone who's watching right now? They don't really know much about selling, but they want to become a CSO or a senior military officer or something. But anybody watching, how they can be a better salesperson so they can, you know, I think, add more value and have a better life experience.

We're all in sales. The most important sales that you do are up here with the people that you care about sometimes internally. I sell more inside my organization to get internal stakeholders in this massive behemoth of a company to care about my customers' projects and to get resources and funding and things of that stature than I ever do with customers themselves. Mostly the time, honestly, Bob, what I found most valuable for my customers is my ability and desire and willingness to demystify, uh, you know, everything that's available to them, uh, to be very transparent about what they can do or arm me with that's going to be most advantageous for them and helping them navigate, um, you know, uncertain waters. I mean, there's investment dollars and projects and technical architects and all these resources that are here, and if I can be super transparent with, hey, let's go help Let me be your evangelist. Let me be your advocate and go sell your story internally so that I can unlock the coffers. It's my job to get— I'm part of an organization that invests $4 billion a year into the nonprofit sector. And I tell my customers, it's my job to get your piece of the pie. Let's go get it.

Awesome.

And that's the key. It's not like— I think sales gets a bad rap sometimes. People have negative connotations of sales because they've worked with terrible salespeople. And, and don't get me wrong, like, I don't think there's always malice intended. I think bad sales leadership can beget bad sales culture. It starts at the top. You've got to have great sales culture to empower and enable leaders and frontline sellers to be successful and effective. And, you know, telling them to go sell more widgets or beating them to death with a spreadsheet about their pipeline, that ain't gonna do it.

True, true. Wow. So you are already a best-selling author. Let's see if we can sell more of your books. This one, Unbeatable. So, uh, let's see, in this book, The Legend of a Salesman, on Firebrands Fiction, we've lived experience. So what inspired you to turn your professional journey into storytelling?

So, look, I've always wanted to write. And, you know, I used to write stories when I was a kid and write stories about my friends and I going to outer space or time traveling. And, you know, when I was at AT&T, I wrote in a newsletter and I found myself writing about topics like sales and leadership. And so I wanted to blend the two. And so I decided to write a book in 2009. It was called Birth of a Salesman. And I didn't know the ending, though. And then I got laid off and then I knew the ending. So what I did is I created a fictional protagonist named Vincent Scott. He experiences a lot of things that we all experience in sales. And in Birth of a Salesman, he was in his 20s. And so Unbeatable, I decided to revisit Vincent. Where would he be now? What has he been doing in the years since? And so it's his entire journey from start to finish. So I really tried to structure it in a way, Bob, where number one, there's a lot of great sales books out there, I'm not trying to compete. Unbeatable is the story of Vincent Scott from rise and fall and rise again. And The Show Must Go On is basically my entire demand generation Moneyball billion-dollar playbook for everyone to read, including my competition, because I love the sales game so much that that's my love letter to sales.

Wow. Talking about Vincent Scott, the protagonist, So he faces moral dilemmas in this book that mirror real-world leadership challenges, actually. So which of his struggles resonate most with you personally?

Well, a lot of our struggles are very similar. So I think it's the constant reinvention. You know, I think what's challenging sometimes, Bob, is we get really— we fall in love with our set of circumstances. Right. Nothing good or bad lasts. And there's a positive and a negative to that, right? Like, bad stuff will change. It does get better. But at the same time, like, when you're riding high, you always got to be ready. Like, at some point, yes, that's going to change. You're going to get the, the curveball, the unexpected catastrophe, and you've got to be able and willing to adapt and pivot and adjust and evolve amidst all of that. If Here's the other thing. I'm an old grizzled sales guy. I've been doing this 25 years, right? But I literally had a manager tell me a couple of years back, Carson, you are the new kind of seller that people need today. And you know why? Because I am, if nothing else, I focus on resources that are available and I'm gravitating toward— I get like a doctor who, if they were still doing archaic ways of surgery that are 20 years old, they would become obsolete today. If you're a salesperson or a sales leader and you're not embracing AI and how to best leverage it to work with your team and master sales for your organization and help your customer to research, to, you know, construct email, to connect better, like you're done. You're going to be passed up by somebody else who's going to be doing that stuff. And I refuse to be passed up in the sales game. I have to stay at the top of my game all the time. And that is what drives me.

That is really powerful. I'm glad that you mentioned AI because it is changing a lot of things for so many industries right now. So I do see the intersection of artificial intelligence, ethics, and human connection evolving in sales leadership over, let's say, the next 5 years.

Wow. I don't know. I like— it's hard to predict what things will be like in 5 years because you look at some of the advancements that engines like GPT-5 have made over the last even 3 months. The quality of responses, the caliber of videos that can be created with people. I was on YouTube the other day and I'm seeing like people putting Elvis Presley in Star Trek and it looks legitimate. Like, yes, it's going to be like in 6 months.

Look at the world we live in. Wow.

It's incredible to me. And you know what's interesting at the heart of it though, Bob, it still comes down to people. Customer executives are not ready to go completely without a trusted advisor. Now, organizations may need salespeople differently. They may need less salespeople. They may need less sales managers. There's a lot of things that I think we're toying with because AI can do a lot of the functions that we've historically had to do. I literally saw a demonstration today of a tool that has been created that does in minutes what I've been manually doing that nobody else would do because it's time consuming. But what I've been manually doing for 10 years to get massive amounts of leads. And now it can be done in minutes, which is great because that frees up more time for me to go talk to customers. But what's going to be different? You know, one of the books that has changed the game for me over the last couple of years is the book The Jolt Effect by Matt Dixon and Ted McKenna. And I had Matt on my podcast Mastering Modern Selling, uh, maybe a year or so ago. This book changes the game because what it instills is it's not about fear of missing out. It's about fear of messing up. We have to risk the buying party's decision to go with us. And it isn't just one buyer. We can't just rely on one relationship in an organization that you've got to have a groundswell of influence. You've got to earn the right to be a trusted advisor. And that's what it's all about. It's how do I de-risk this customer's decision to go? They're not married to status quo. They're not married to their current path of inadequacy or average mediocrity. They just don't want to be the person that made the decision to mess up. They're worried about losing their job. And if you show them that you're going to be there with them before, during, and after the change, help them with the change management, you understand what they deem to be the risk. You've got to be curious. But if you can do that, you can do anything.

Wow, that is very, very powerful. All right, we're going to go to the second segment where I mostly focus on leadership lesson. What do you think is the greatest lesson you've learned so far?

The best lesson I've ever learned so far about leadership is that it's really all about listening and staying at the pulse of what matters to the people that you want to matter to. I have a sphere that I obsess over, and it's basically my boss, my leadership, and then my direct reports, the people that I support and serve, my colleagues. And when stuff gets insane, Bob, I shrink my sphere and I ask myself, is my boss good? Is my direct reports good? I'll pin chats with those folks. I get blown up every day with instant messages. In Teams and emails. But when stuff gets crazy, I focus on my sphere and I really lean in. I also grew up in a leadership environment where it was all about the business. I literally kid you not, I had a manager 20 years ago that called me every morning and quoted Gordon Gekko and would say like, this is your wake-up call, pal. Go to work. And he acted like Gordon Gekko. And flash forward till now, Like, it's not like that. I had a manager that I worked for and I followed around for 6 years, and she was the best. And she basically instilled in me that you may have a one-on-one with somebody that is derailed in the first minute because they are grappling with a personal crisis. They're burnt out. They need to be heard. And that's good. Let that happen. Let that one-on-one be derailed because the business comes second. The people come first.

Wow. That is very, very powerful. And actually, I've seeing you do it in practice in your life when we went through this horrible pandemic, you made a lot of videos where you were reaching out not just to your folks, but I guess to everybody out there who would listen to you. Very, very encouraging. You talked about shrinking the circle and making sure that your people were okay. Nobody was gonna lose their job. People who need to get promoted will get promoted and people need to take time off with their family if they needed to and all of that, but just showing empathy. So how important is it to really truly value people? Because I'm sure you've had some bosses, maybe you mentioned one where they would say, hey, how are you doing today, Bob? And then they don't care what my answer is. Go back to work. And it's like, I know that you do not care, but there are some few bosses who really, really do care. And like in the military, you would go through hell for those people. So can you tell us more about that?

We have a leadership mantra at Microsoft, and it's model, coach, care. Model the right behavior that you want people to do. And look, I apply this to parenting as well, right? So I'm always trying to model this for my kids. Coach, so show the right ways, preach the right ways, you know, talk about the big rocks, the big picture things that need to be focused on, help people develop a ruthless discipline around their schedule so that they can apply the investment of time and energy and resources to the right things and care, genuinely care. Like, it isn't about asking, how's it going? Okay, now let's look at this spreadsheet. It's, you know, hey, like, so-and-so on my team, I know that such-and-such happened with a member of your family. Like, tell me about that. Are they okay? Is there anything that you need? If you need to step away at a moment's notice, you let me know. If there's a call you need me to jump in on, like, we've got to have each other's backs. And look, I try to be a culture builder. I try to build a destination team that everybody wants to work for, that people know that they're going to be not only valued and seen and cared about, but also promoted. You know, whatever it takes to, like, demystify. Like, I try to spend so much time with my team to help them really understand their their confusing comp structure or how to get a level promotion. Or, you know, if you feel like you've mastered your job, how to get you to another team, even if it means that I got to go hire somebody or to get my top sellers more at-bats to do more stuff. Like, I want people to feel empowered and enabled to do more and to be their best selves at all times. And I think that's really what it's all about, to invest in people.

You are absolutely right. I think whenever I retire from the Navy, that's one thing I will miss a lot, that esprit de corps. So you've had such an incredible story and everything that you've done, all of the awards you have received. What do you think is the secret for your success?

Bob, I'm a very blessed man. There is no secret. I'm a nobody. I'm just an average gentleman in the Midwest, United States, who just refuses to stay on the mat. I am a man of faith. I am a, you know, servant leader. I am constantly looking for ways to add value. And I would say there's a reason that that poster is up on my wall. Rocky Balboa. There's a quote up there. It ain't about how hard you hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward. How much you can take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done. It's not about him or her or, you know, whatever anybody else has going on. It's all about you and your choices. And if there's a secret to success, that's it. Just don't ever give up. You know, you and I both have an affinity for Think and Grow Rich by Napoleon Hill. And in that book, he teaches us that most people find success on the other side of where everybody else would have given up.

Mm-hmm. Wow, that is powerful, powerful. Thank you, thank you so much for that. Now, who do you know that we should know? Who are some of the thought leaders, people that you are following we should know about?

Yeah, you know, right now, like, I'm really into Mark Manson, The Subtle Art, and he uses some choice language, so I won't quote the whole thing, but he's also got a podcast called Solved and really dives into the art and the philosophy and, um, you know, really the why behind a lot of things. I'm spending a lot of time studying, like, understanding myself, understanding the dopamine addiction that I've had for so long, understanding the reason why, like, we gravitate toward the things that we gravitate toward. Like, I became addicted to winning, um, which is okay and it serves me well in my career, but like, when you're not winning and when things are down and out in your personal life, like, What are you gonna do? You can't just be a bump on a log. Like, really trying to understand that. Simon Sinek, I've been studying a lot of Simon Sinek and understanding some of the things that he talks about around team culture and some of the case studies of businesses that he does, but also of leaders. Those have been where I've been spending a lot of time. Plus, I'm always studying the greats in sales, Jeb Blount, Mike Weinberg, who's right here in St. Louis. He's an amazing mentor of mine. I'm always open and eager and willing to, to follow, you know, those that have— that are studying humanity.

Wow, wonderful. So if you could choose 3 people to have dinner with, they could be alive, dead, or mythical figure, who would you choose and why?

Jesus Christ.

You don't have to say why for that one.

Next, Sean Connery and Elvis Presley.

Wonderful. Sean Connery, I really loved him when he played James Bond. I think he's the best James Bond actor ever, in my opinion.

But he is, he is the best.

I think he kind of inspired me to, uh, John Bonneville too, because I know it's fictional, but he was an intelligence officer in the story.

That's true.

Yeah. And I'm an information warfare officer in the Navy. But anyway, really, really cool. Wonderful.

Thank you for your service.

Thank you. I appreciate that. Okay, let's talk about books, books that you recommend. You told me in advance. So there is this one.

Why? First, Breakout. I like approaches that challenge normal and average. And first, break all the rules. Basically just says scrap everything that you believe to be true. You got to change it up. You got to do it differently to get different results.

It is really wonderful because I was talking to Professor Amira Berger before I talked to you. And that's one thing she said. She says everything that we have today has been constructed, therefore it can be deconstructed. And trying to kind of find your own way. Very, very powerful. What about this one?

Yeah, so huge 49ers fan. I live in St. Louis where we can't keep a football team. So when I was a kid and my parents would travel, sometimes when they traveled without me, I'd stay with my, my, my aunt who lived in the Bay Area. And so huge San Francisco 49ers fan. They're off to a great start this season, thankfully. But Bill Walsh, he was the mastermind, like the winning formulas that he would create and the way that he would map out a game before it was even played. Um, the philosophy of this, Bob, is, you know, don't worry about the number. So many people, they worry about the results or the widgets or the gap in their pipeline, and it ain't about any of that. It's about what is my addressable market, what is my opportunity, what is my North Star, what's the right process to get there. The numbers, you know what they do? They help you diagnose your process. I might need to tweak my process and Here's the other thing. You don't ever overhaul your process. Like, if you're in a slump as a golfer or as a baseball hitter, you don't drastically make changes. You've got to get back to the fundamentals that make you successful. And so focus on the fundamentals. Obsess about people and process. Score takes care of itself. Do what you're supposed to do. Turn over every rock. Leave it all in the field. And you're either going to win or you're going to learn. And you will know, you'll have no regrets. You'll know that you did everything that was possible. And I've done that. I've never worried about a number a day in my life. And powerful.

Yeah, in the Navy we say back to the basics. That, that is, that is so, so true. You mentioned Start With Why, Simon Sinek.

You know what I love most about this one is him talking about not only our addictions to dopamine, but also like some of the business case studies and how leaders came in and either did things that they shouldn't have done or did things that they should do differently, and it made a difference. But it starts, you know, what is my why? That's got to be your fuel. And frankly, finding the why of others is the ticket to great leadership.

We already mentioned that one, Joust Effect.

Yeah, it just changes the game when it comes to— it was written after the pandemic in a, you know, the hybrid world where we can study what the data from all these calls that are happening virtually and remotely. And so That what that data was telling us was customers don't care about messing up, or I'm sorry, missing out. They care about messing up. And if we can help de-risk the decision, they'll go with us.

Wow.

With a competitor's strengths, so often we go toe-to-toe with competitor strengths. That's ridiculous. You're gonna lose. Go toe-to-toe with your competitors' weaknesses.

Wow, powerful, powerful. And this one, winning Yeah, oh my gosh, like, so Tim Grover—

I'm obsessed with legends. I love studying legends. And while they're all flawed, because we're all flawed, one of my favorites is Michael Jordan. And, um, you know, greatest athlete, greatest student of the game, greatest competitor ever.

Like, the GOAT.

This guy did to win and improve. Tim Grover was his trainer. He also trained Kobe Bryant and Charles Barkley and many others. But like the philosophies that this guy puts in there, like, man, it's incredible. I realized when I read this book, I am addicted to winning and that's okay.

Yes. And you mentioned Mark Manson earlier.

Yeah. Oh my goodness. What I love about Mark Manson is like that finding that discipline and why we worry about and think about some of the things that we do worry about. But frankly, the criticality of drowning out all that noise and really being focused in our lives. He does so much research, and that's what I love and respect about his work.

That is really powerful. And finally, you mentioned this one.

Oh, man, this one's great. So Viktor Frankl and his experience in a concentration camp during World War II and the just absolute loss of every ounce of humanity and what that does to a person. But then he emerged on the other side of it. Like, you know, abandoning any hope or thought that you will live or survive and knowing that you're— everything that you care about is gone, and then emerging on the other side of that, and he becomes this, you know, renowned writer and speaker. And, um, just that perspective, like, to be able to separate from everything and really realize what matters and, you know, just get grounded in, like, the human element, um, Sometimes to win, we have to lose. And I mean, this is a guy who literally lost it all and came out on the other side. It's very eye-opening.

That is quite powerful. So let me ask you this then. If you only had one day to live, what would you have liked your final contribution to be?

Wow. I would want, you know, I go back to the, uh, the Maya Angelou, like, how did you make people feel? I would want everybody who knew me to have at least something that I did to make them feel special, especially my parents, my wife, my kids.

Yes, powerful. And if you had to solve one problem when you wake up in the morning, what problem would that be?

My goodness. It, you know, it's hard every day to wake up in a world that feels so at odds with itself. And I think sometimes the news and social media can shine a light on things that were probably already there and that were always there because there's always been conflict. You know, I would want everybody to feel purpose, valued, safe, seen.

That is powerful. I think that's, that's really what a good leader does, make everybody on the team feel purpose, valued, safe, and seen. I believe it was Oprah Winfrey, she said she's talking to the best people, kings and princesses and president and ministers, and also to the regular folks. But she said one common thread among all of them, even when she interviewed people like Nelson Mandela, he would come back and say, how did I do? Was I okay? You just want to feel the purpose. It was value. He would say, and same, and every, every, everybody, everybody does. And if you can do that as a leader, I think you're adding a lot of value. Wow, that is very, very insightful. Thank you so much. So we are coming toward the end. We have about 6, 7 minutes left. So thank you so much for being so generous with your time. How can we add value back to you? For one thing, I want everybody to please purchase your bestselling book. It's going to be unbeatable. Everybody needs to have that. What else?

All proceeds go to the Michael J. Fox Foundation for Parkinson's research.

I didn't know that. That is wonderful. Thank you. Anything else my audience can do to add value back to you?

No, you're doing it. Connect with me. Share what you're struggling with. Share what's working for you. I'm always learning. You know, I think that's the amazing part of, you know, getting to a place where you have clarity. I think there's benefit to getting older sometimes and accumulating and racking up some experiences is that hopefully with that comes some wisdom. And it's often the wisdom that we know relatively nothing. And so I'm always on a journey to learn. I love to get book recommendations, podcast recommendations. How are you learning? How are you sharpening the axe? Because that'll help make me better too.

Wonderful. Thank you. Thank you so much. All right. So is there a question I should have asked you that I didn't get a chance to ask?

No, I don't think so. Bob, this was a lot of fun. I think you're, you're amazing and I appreciate what you do and how you do it. I'm grateful for our connection. No, I think, you know, when I think about our topic and topics for today and really how you frame this up, I think success in leadership is all relative, right? Because a lot of people are going to have a different definition of success. You know, some people are chasing money, some people are chasing fame, some people are chasing power. But really, for me, it's always been about impact and outcomes and how can I really empower others to be successful or to live a better life. Um, you know, and it's, it's become more and more personal as I've gotten older and I've got kids. You know, I want my kids to be not only proud of their dad but also to learn from the mistakes that I've made and the trail that I've tried to blaze. You know, we're all on this earth for a relatively small period of time, so success is relative, and, um, we can't take any of the earthly treasures with us. So, you know, I want to leave a positive mark And I think that personally is success, is the legacy that you can leave and the positivity that you can bring to the world. That thank you that you give today, or that calling out someone for recognition amidst chaos or pressure or deadlines, that positive thing that you do for somebody else today might mean all the world to them, and they're going to carry that with them for the rest of your life. So make meaningful investments in other people. That's my definition of success.

That, that is so powerful. And also, by the way, most of your books are complimentary with Kindle Unlimited. I don't know if you had to do it on purpose, but that's really great. People don't even have to, to spend money to read.

That's right. I didn't write them to make money. I wrote them because I felt like I had something valuable to say and I wanted to start conversations. I wanted to help other people learn. I mean, thank you. I made a ton of mistakes and But I've also stumbled upon some success and it's all out there for everybody to read.

Wow, that is really, really great. So to finish, then I think the most important question I'm going to ask you is if you could go back and give a piece of advice to your 17-year-old self standing at the edge of this incredible career you've had, what would you say to 17-year-old Carson?

I'd say hang in there. You're going to make it. You know, when I was 17, I was depressed and I was struggling. I was a high schooler. I was scrawny. I was out of place because I had skipped a grade. I didn't have a lot of friends in my class, and I just felt like I was behind. I had no idea what I wanted to do. I was a late bloomer. I was like the ugly duckling, right? So, um, I was depressed. And, um, honestly, it was a couple of friends and, um, the first time I saw a James Bond movie, uh, that pulled me out of that. Because then I was like, oh wow, I can act like I don't care about anything, and I can act cool, and things started to come to me. And I don't know, but I would tell my younger self, hang in there, it gets better. And I'd probably show my younger self a picture of my wife and kids and be like, you know what, man?

Wow, that is powerful. Okay, to end this, it's gonna be a lightning round, so don't take too much time to think. It's going to be really, really quick. One word that defines great leadership, one word.

Selflessness.

Okay, morning routine or practice that keeps you grounded?

Workout and coming up with my daily non-negotiables.

Okay, you have to tell me more about that non-negotiable.

Yeah, so every morning when I'm in the gym, it's, uh, you know, my 5 non-negotiables that I have to get done that day. Um, you know, I get so many emails, so many messages, I have to do those 5 things or that day is not a success. And as I, I mean, I may cross off the last one and 6 o'clock, right before I walk out this door to dinner. But I got to get them done.

How do you come up with those 5 non-negotiables?

You know, you just— when you're not— when you're separated from everything and you're like working out or you're like grinding or whatever it is, like you— there's clarity. And I just know like, okay, wow, I really have to get this done.

Wow, that's amazing.

I know that I need to land this deal by the end of the quarter. What's the step that I need to take today to push that down the line? Like,. But I craft those 5 things, and before I get sucked into the minutiae of the day, I do those things.

Okay, for those listening, especially aspiring leader, this could literally change your life. Because I think in life, what usually happens is we take care of anything that's an emergency, even when it's not important at all. So busy, busy, busy, busy, but we don't actually get anything done. But when you focus on your non-negotiable, what is important but may not be an emergency, but if you take care of those, then it's going to move you, uh, forward toward—

Climbing your mountain is, remember, a series of steps. You got to take a step every day.

Yes. Wow. So being able to know what those things are before you get into the game where it's so busy and so many distractions that you forget to do what, what really matters. Thank you so much. That is, that is huge. All right, um, a book or quotes that change your life.

A book that changed my life, or a quote?

Don't think too long.

I'm gonna say the Bible.

Very good.

So many times, and it's, it's always where you got to go back. It's the source code.

Classic. I think mine too. Who inspires you most today?

My mom and my wife and my dad. Like, my mom more than ever, because she is like, she's She's unbelievable. And my wife more than ever, because she's unbelievable. I just don't know how they do the things they do.

That's wonderful. And the last one is, finish this sentence: leadership is a privilege. That's true. So what did you want to be when you were a kid?

A writer.

And you are a writer today.

Bravo! Good job.

3 adjectives that describe you as a child.

Ugh, talkative, creative, and selfish.

As an adult?

Improving, learning, serving.

Wow, what a transformation! And finally, what is one word that represents our shared experience on this podcast today?

Illuminating.

Wow. I think I'm, I'm just grateful, thankful. I know we've been trying to make this happen for a while, but you've really taught us a lot. Thank you, thank you so much. Really appreciate that, Carson. And, uh, what I, what I will do, I'm gonna play the entire clip now of you singing. I didn't want to use too much of your time. I asked you for, for 1 hour, so I really do appreciate that. So your clip is gonna take us on today. Thanks, thanks again.

Thank you, Bob.

Wow, everybody, you've heard this. This was Carson Eddy. What a masterclass in leadership and salesmanship and really caring for people, which I believe this is what leadership is all about. I'm gonna have one more podcast today. My buddy, my friend, my shipmate, Commander Tony Grayson, uh, is a submarine CEO retired. He's going to be joining us in about, uh, 30 minutes or so. It is going to be wonderful. You do not want to miss it. This is really, you know, military leadership at the highest level. We're gonna be trying to get all of the leadership lessons he is learning, how we can put them in practice no matter what your industry is. Okay, like I promised, I'm gonna play Carson's full video of him singing. That's going to be the end. So I hope to see you again in about 30 minutes with Commander Grissom. See you soon. Oh man, this is too good.

This is just too good.

Oh my goodness.

Gotta put some feeling in it. Next level, Carson, take it to the next level. Oh man. Oh man. Oh man, I can't believe you did it.

Thank you for listening to the Leadership and Success Podcast with your host, Coach Beezy. If you like what you heard, please subscribe to our channels and come back for more wisdom nuggets on how you may develop into a better leader and achieve greater levels of success. Leadership is the most critical skill. The world will always need leaders to lead others, deploy the next disruptive technology, or execute a business strategy, you may as well decide on counting yourself among the 21st century leaders. See you right here next time.