Secrets From a Serial Entrepreneur and Angel Investor | Warren Osborn Interview

Alright, welcome back to the show. Today, we've got a very fun and dear friend of mine, Warren Osborne, on the show with us. Warren is an absolute serial entrepreneur. He has done, I don't know the number of businesses, but I would say dozens and dozens of businesses, many overseas, had an incredible entrepreneurial career. I actually met Warren, the first time I met Warren, was in high school, I was actually— we had a pitch competition, kinda like similar to Shark Tank, and we actually went on stage, we pitched an app idea, me and my buddy, and Warren was one of the guys after who came up and liked our idea, gave me his business card. I thought it was so cool to meet this really successful, great entrepreneur. He gave me his business card and said, hey, reach out to me, I wanna hear more about what you're doing and stuff. And that business, we never actually started. It was a business idea competition. We took— I think we took second. We came second in that competition. We were crowd favorite. And you guys had donated some money and stuff for the school. It was incredible. That's the first time I met Warren. And then later on, just a few years ago, met Warren again at a few different networking events and things like that. And it's incredible what he's been able to do. Currently battling Lou Gehrig's disease and is gonna win Lou Gehrig's disease as well. And we can talk briefly, talk about that as well. But anyways, with all that being said, Warren, welcome to the show. How you doing today? Hey, how's it going?

Great, great to be with you. I apologize in advance for my slurred speech, but that's part of ALS. I'm losing my voice.

That's okay, we can hear you loud and clear. So it'll be a little bit, yeah, if it's a little bit slurred, that's fine, but we're here to do it. So now you had one of the 11 fastest growing consumer products in the United States on the Inc. 500, you're the Businessman of the Year throughout, that was in 2013. I mean, you've done incredible stuff, Warren. So let's dive into it. How did you get started in your entrepreneur career? Let's talk about some of your early businesses and how you got started.

Well, my second business began after a tragedy. My first son was born And we had a $25,000 medical bill that insurance refused to pay. And so $25,000 34 years ago is about $75,000 today.

Wow.

Poor struggling students at the time, that was a big blowup. So I took on 2 full-time jobs, and I looked to start a business. Here's one, one point I want to make. Build on your assets. Build on your assets. So I had 2 assets. I had a video camera that we purchased on the way back from China from studying overseas, and I had a sofa that we got out of a dumpster. Well, high school graduations were coming up soon, and so I thought, well, high school graduations and the video camera, that means I'm going to record those and try to make money off of it. So that was the start of Osborne Video.

Hmm.

Now, it's a good thing I called nearly every school in the state of Utah because I recorded 13 high school graduations. One of those high schools purchased zero, another one purchased 100. And I got in the door by offering a copy to the school for free.

So you're, you're going around filming graduation ceremonies and then trying to sell them to the parents and students after, is that right?

Yeah.

Wow. Okay.

And I recorded them for free for the school under the condition that I got to pass out flyers. At commencement. So while I was at Roy High School, someone else— someone came up to me and said, thinking that I was just a videographer for a larger firm, and said, do you— does your firm do other production work? What my response was. Oh yeah, we can produce just about anything you want. Well, the good news is he said he was one of the directors for the National Junior Olympics, which was held at BYU that year. And so all Champion High School athletes from track and field were coming to BYU soon.

Hmm.

So I offered him to do it for free. But I would get the microphone every 30 minutes, and I would get a booth to pass out flyers. Well, I made a horrific mistake. I priced the videos at $14.95 each. That was the same price I was selling them to the high school for high school graduations. In hindsight, now that I understand price elasticity a lot more, I should have been selling them for $49.95 each.

So were you losing money then on the videos?

Well, that brings up a really good story which kind of catapulted the company. So we brought in about $7,500, and I spent about 2/3 of that buying editing equipment and spent the next 6 weeks editing the videos. Back then it was linear editing, not nonlinear.

Hmm.

So I had to pre-script the entire video. And then added it in sequentially.

Hmm.

Well, when I got done, I got bids to, to duplicate the video, and it took me 6, 7 weeks to edit the whole video, and the bids were $10 and $12. Well, I didn't have nearly enough money to pull that off, so what I did was I went and bought blank VHS tapes at Fred Meyer. Got a rebate, and then I went and rented VCRs from Hollywood Video, Blockbuster Video, Cougar Rental, and I ran them for a dollar a night and wired them up together with Radio Shack cables and duplicated all 500 videos myself.

Wow.

With my wife's help. Well, that was one of the best things that happened because without the failure, I wouldn't have pivoted into VHS duplication.

I love this story. So, and we're gonna keep going for a sec, but I wanna cut you off for a second of just the startup hustle and grind You first off, you got this big medical bill, huge pressure on your back. And number 2, I feel like a lot of wantrepreneurs right now, people that want to become— start their own business or just get into business in general, they're always looking for, well, I've got to be paid upfront, I need a check, I need to get a salary or commission. They got to figure out all the money upfront. You went to schools and to people and said, I'm gonna film for free. And you went with the free value-first proposition, made it a no-brainer. For a high school to say, yeah, let's have Warren come and film, why not? It's free. And then you said, well, hey, if I do that, can I pass out flyers or can I sell to the parents somehow and build a name for myself? I absolutely love that. I think it's a fantastic way to build reputation and credibility for yourself. And then that catapults you into the next thing and then it gets bigger and bigger. And yes, and I love that you printed 600 VHSs on your own. That must have—

Oh yeah.

Oh man, that's wild to do that, but I love, I think a lot of people that want to, like people that hit me up to work for me all the time, Bridger, can I come work for you? You might have the same thing. I go, well, maybe, let's see. They go, well, if I want to come though, you got to pay me a 6-figure salary and I need health benefits and all this stuff, and I'm like, well, I don't even know if you can do the job. I've had 3 people come to me and say, Bridger, I'll work for you for free for 2 weeks or a really low price, but once I'm going to prove that I'm the best employee you've ever had and you're going to want to pay me 6 figures. In about a month. And I go, okay, let's do it. And all those people, those 3, I've all hired and they're my top guys that work for me right now. And it's been awesome working with them. I think, Warren, you proved that 100% with what you just said and what you did.

Well, we stayed in the video production business doing infomercials, corporate training videos, and commercials. But the big money was in duplication.

Hmm.

So we started taking all the profits and buying VCRs. 2 years later, I had about 300 VCRs in the basement of my house. Then we moved into our first factory, quickly outgrew that, and moved into the next factory, which we built A 34,000-square-foot factory with Class 1000 cleanroom. Well, then we pivoted again and we bought 4 high-speed duplication machines. They were $400,000 per machine.

Wow.

And then we bought loaders and so we could duplicate at high speed. And we, we grew that business. We became one of the largest VHS duplication houses in the Intermountain West.

Geez, what year is this, by the way?

This is back in the early '90s.

Early '90s, okay.

And I sold the VHS I sold the business. It got to a point where I could see DVD coming and replacing VHS, and I didn't want to pivot over to that, so I sold the business. Which brings us to the next business.

Yeah, so what'd you do after that? So you sell the business, and I'm sure— did you pay off the medical bills as well? Did that turn out okay?

It really turned out okay.

Okay. So what happened next?

The next business, again back to building on your assets. By then I was an expert in VHS and production. In duplication. So I started selling packaging accessories to my competitors, and that business really took off quickly. Then I called AOL one day. They were doing 700 million CDs and, and CD packages a year, and I figured I could save them a lot of money. So they hired me as a consultant. Big mistake. I should have taken a percentage of the savings.

No.

I saved them $35 million.

Wow.

And I only made a few thousand because I was just working for, you know, like $1,000 a day. Well, while I was in China with them negotiating for them at factories that I introduced them to. I saw that the factories were just outsourcing the CD tin boxes.

Hmm.

And so I said, I think I can save you another $35 million on the tin boxes. I said, but this time I want to be your supplier.

Smart.

So that business took off like crazy. The first month I couldn't do more than 100,000 units. Within 6 months I could do 8 million boxes a month.

Wow, and you're supplying— this is AOL, correct?

Yeah.

So you're their tin supplier out of China and you've got that contract. Wow. And so, and then did you buy that company or did you find partners or did you just make yourself a middleman? How were you getting paid on it?

I was selling them directly to AOL and getting them manufactured at 3 different factories in Southern China in the Guangzhou-Shenzhen area.

Gotcha, that makes sense. And you speak Mandarin fluently, don't you?

Yeah, I speak Mandarin fluently.

I speak Mandarin well. I served an LDS mission in Taiwan.

That's where I served.

Oh, did you really? Oh, great. Wow, what years were you in Taiwan?

'84 and '85.

Geez, that's awesome.

What years were you there?

2014 and 2015. So Taiwan is completely different probably from your time you were there to when I was there, but I love Taiwan and China.

Yeah, Taiwan and China, they're awesome. So—

So sorry, yeah, back to the story. So you were the supply for AOL, The couple factories being the supply, you were selling. I'm sure you were making a boatload of money at the time. How did that turn out?

It turned out pretty good. Then one day AOL came to us and we were like one of 6 suppliers and they said, we're gonna cut this back to 2 suppliers. And we were doing about $10 million in sales, making $3 to $4 million in profit annually just off of AOL, plus we had other businesses.

Wow.

And then, so they said they were going to cut it down to 2 suppliers. We put in our bid, and we lost the bid by 1/3 of a cent. So we were effectively out of business. AOL was like 70% of our business at the time.

Hmm.

And so I went to our team, and I said this, and this is so important. I said, what does AOL really want? Do they really want just a cheaper box? No, they really want more customers.

Hmm.

I said, what can we do to make our boxes better, more creative, more artistic, so AOL will sell more? and get more customers. And I commissioned our entire team for the next few weeks to focus exclusively on making more creative, better looking, more attractive packages.

Hmm.

So over the next few weeks, we built like 60 new packages. We showed them to AOL and they would do a test. Well, we grew the bit— we started getting business back on the new packages because almost all of our new creative artistic packages blew away the previous generic boring boxes. And over the next year, we grew the business to $30 million in sales with $10 million profit.

Wow.

Just by focusing on making— we added innovation and creativity and art Artistic innovation to the packages.

So you— AOL doesn't give you the bid, business is done or effectively over, and you said, no, I'm not taking no for an answer, we're gonna figure this out. You rallied your team together, went back to AOL and re-won the bid. I think that's outstanding. I think most people would have just said, well, tough, you know. Shoot, we're out of business and we gotta— let's do something else. You went back. Was it just— what drove you to do that? Was it just sheer will and you knew you could figure something out, or why did you think like that?

Well, I'm an artist by default, which is one of the reasons I painted in my youth. I painted as an adult, and so I was driven to make A better product. So all we were doing before was supply chain management.

Hmm.

So then AOL started to die. We could see their death. So a few, couple years after that, we had to pivot again. So we said, okay, we're good at Creative packages. What are the biggest markets in the world for packaging? We identified 3: cosmetics, motion picture film packaging, and gift card packaging. At the time, the gift card market was the largest selling category in all of U.S. retail. But as far as accessories or packaging for gift cards, all that existed was Hallmark and American Greeting Cards. So people were just buying a gift card. And having nothing dedicated. So we decided to make 3D packaging for gift cards. Well, this business exploded. We became the number one seller of gift card packaging in the world. And it just took off like crazy.

So, and you were doing pretty much all the big names then were using you to do this for them? And you were out, still out of China factories and doing the packaging, same group?

Yeah, similar factories, similar assets, different category. We also went into the motion picture film business and started doing specialty packaging for them. So I made the Friends case, the King Kong box, the Matrix case. all types of specialty packaging for Hollywood. Then Hollywood—

Wow.

Then the Hollywood retailers started coming to us and saying, HDVD or Blu-ray is coming in the future. We want you to design packaging For that and try to win that. Well, there were many dozens of competitors trying to get this business. Most of them were just showing samples on the computer screen or on their printed PDF. We decided to make samples. And you can insert pictures of this that I can share with you after, so the audience can kind of see some of the samples. But we produced 6 or 8 different samples to show the Hollywood studios. We ended up winning a bid With Warner Brothers, they represented about 33% of the world's DVD production at the time. And we, we got a 5-year contract with them to duplicate and produce all of their high-definition packaging. We didn't know which one was going to win, Blu-ray or HDVD, so we produced the Blu-ray one in blue and the HDVD one in red, and then we just screen printed the logo on the outside. We ended up creating and patenting The Blu-ray package, and there's been over 2 billion of these made now worldwide.

So you own the patent on Blu-ray packaging, correct? Wow. How much, uh, just to give people kind of a range of how much revenue this company was producing You know, you're number 1 in the world. Like, what does that mean? And what are your kind of margins on per package?

Many tens of millions. Really good margins.

Wow, that's incredible. Now, during all this, correct, that kind of brings until today, right? You guys are— do you guys still do this today?

No, we sold the biz.

Oh, when did you sell?

We sold back in about 2006 or 2007 the Blu-ray packaging business to one group, and we sold, uh, Seastone, the gift card packaging business, to another group. Wow.

So you had— now this is now your second exit, correct?

Third. Third.

Okay, third exit. Because— and then during that time you started Braven Speaker, correct?

That was the next business.

That was the next. Okay, so how'd you get into Braven?

Well, I was sitting at my computer one day. Assessing the market, and, uh, I was looking at my Apple screen, which was made of aluminum, and I could see a speaker in the corner. I could basically visualize a portable speaker. Made of aluminum. So Apple monitor inspired me. Then I looked at the market size, and tablets and cell phones, smartphones were growing like crazy. So at that time I decided to add 3 things to a portable speaker to make it better than the status quo. That was a power bank, so USB port on a portable speaker, and we got a worldwide patent on that. Added aluminum to make it look more Apple-like, and then we added waterproofing later.

Hmm. Was Braven— were there already Bluetooth speakers out there at the time? Or were you one of the first to do it?

There were already Bluetooth speakers. Very competitive market. So one of my theories that I tell young entrepreneurs with building consumer products is make 1, 2, or 3 things The best in the world. And don't build on a white canvas. Build off the status quo and improve it.

That's what— So find and make something a status quo, something existing, but then find 2 or 3 things, build off of those, make them the best in the world. That sounds like that's what you did. You added a power bank. Made it aluminum and waterproof were your few things that you went after, is that correct?

That's exactly right. Let me tell you a story about the original name of Raven. Before Raven came about, the first name was Spar. S-P-A-R. Spar. That was the name. And I paid $80,000 for the domain name.

Wow.

Well, we went on the Ellen DeGeneres Show for Christmas, and we were one of the 12 Days of Christmas gifts, and she told everybody that this spa product was the hottest selling speaker in the market. This is before we launched.

Wow.

So she was a little bit exaggerative, but then our sales team went to Europe to a convention. We had like 50 suppliers that wanted to carry our product, and almost all of them said, but you got to change the name. Spar means budget or discount in German.

Hmm.

And there are like 12,000 to 14,000 Spar stores. In Europe, it's kind of like naming your product— making the hottest, highest quality portable speaker on the market and calling it 7-Eleven or Dollar General.

Yeah.

Then this—

So you're like, shoot, I've already paid 80 grand for this name. Now you gotta rebrand it.

Well, we had $700,000 worth of speakers built already, and when they arrived, the quality of the speakers was about 10 to 15% lower than the specs that we set. Our, our specs with the factory was For this price point, it's got to be the best sounding speaker. So the speaker quality was 10 to 15% below our standard, and we're— and we have a name that sounds like budget 7-Eleven. Not a good combination.

Yeah.

So I chose to take the speakers to the dump, and we literally threw away $700,000. Well, the next couple weeks, we focused on finding a new name. We went through thousands of names and finally came up with Braven. That's the way the name Braven came about.

Geez, that's crazy. I want to ask you for a second, for entrepreneurs that are— I've never launched a physical product similar to a speaker or something like that. To me, it seems very daunting. It seems like a lot of work and a lot of hassle, like you just mentioned, with the factory producing it, quality is less. What are a few insights you can give on somebody listening that, you know, if they want to start a physical product type of company, a few insights you can give them?

Well, the biggest insight is don't build off of a white canvas. Take the status quo and improve upon it. Google did that, Apple did that, and there's Amazon did that. Google didn't invent search. Apple didn't invent the cell phone. Apple didn't invent the computer. They just made it better. So that's the standard. Well, the next thing you got to do is when you're sourcing suppliers You're only as strong as your weakest link. If you have a weak link, and say the product ships on the ocean and the boat sinks, you're dead. If your factory produces a quality that's not great, You're dead. So I always tell young entrepreneurs to find 30 suppliers, ask them each dozens of questions, interview them. Getting the right suppliers is as important as getting the right Partners may be even more important.

For people looking to find a supplier, on that same note, you obviously speak Mandarin. You've been to Asia multiple times. What would you say for a brand new entrepreneur, how to go out and find those suppliers? Any suggestions there?

Yeah, you can— with the internet, you can find them easily. You gotta go through a qualification process where you ask them tons of questions, you interview them, you find out their expertise, their volume, their quality. You can go to Alibaba and find 30 suppliers for almost any category in an hour.

Okay. On that same note too, this is a question I've had from multiple people as well, and I don't know the answer. When you're setting up a physical product, let's say we've got a speaker and we want to— it's going to be— we followed what you did, we built off a blank canvas, we made a couple items. The best in the world design-wise. In your opinion, should you try to sell first and get customers first? Or do you write the, you know, $10,000 or $20,000 check to go manufacture them first and get them? It's kind of a chicken and the egg problem, right? Because you might order speakers, then now you're sitting on inventory, you can't sell them, but then if you sell them, Can you fulfill? Because it might take a month or 2 to actually get the product later. If you were talking to somebody that was just starting, what would your advice be?

Well, personally, what I did most of the time is I built the product first before having the customer, and then I went and sold it. One of the ways I sold it was with Z Stone and with Braven, is we would put them in a big box, a bunch of samples, and ship them to all of our potential customers, and then our sales team would call them. Within 1 to 3 days after the samples arrived. And we used that methodology to get into hundreds of retailers. We got in over 37 countries with Braven in the first year of business.

Wow, that's astounding to be that quickly. It sounds like all of your business as well, like just from your stories you just mentioned, but each business, it was like we started it and then it exploded. And then we started another one and it absolutely exploded. We started Brave and we were in over 100 countries in the first year. There's a lot of entrepreneurs that launch, they're making $100,000, $500,000 a year, they're doing okay, But they have a tough time from scaling from, you know, $1 million to $10 million or $10 million to $25 million. It sounds like you were able to do that multiple times very quickly with a lot of speed and a lot of, you know, a lot of velocity. Any thoughts on how to do that? You know, if you're an entrepreneur that has, you know, a decent business that's trying to look to scale, how did you guys do that so quickly?

You have to be tenacious. You have to be focused. You have to be in 120%. You have to make something the best in the world. Every one of these products had 1 to 3 things in Phase 1 that was the best in the world.

And just, and yeah, it sounds like you guys were tenacious, went all out and did that. I want to switch gears for a second. And sorry, real quick, I want to finish up with Braven though. Is Braven still running? Did you sell that business as well?

I sold that as well. Let me tell you about a pivot. We went after the higher-end market, about a $300 price point market. And Bose dominated that market. They had the Bose SoundLink priced at $299.99, and we were going to launch a Braven speaker to compete with it. You gotta know how you beat your competition. They were $300, we were $300. They would go for 4 to 8 hours. We would go for 20 to 30 hours. We had a speakerphone built in. They did not. We would recharge their cell phone. They did not. We could wireless daisy chain. 2 or 3 speakers together. They did not. We were water resistant. They were not. We were shock resistant. They were not. They were made of plastic and painted plastic and mesh. We were made of aluminum and silicone. They were very good, but ours sounded dramatically better. So we identified how we were going to beat the competition, and then we went at that, and that business took off too and exploded. Hmm.

Wow, that's, yeah, and back to the other question too on how did you guys explode, that makes sense, right? You're producing, you're crushing your competition, there's a good reason why you guys exploded. I want to ask you a few more questions on just general entrepreneurship as well. If you could talk to your 20-year-old self or maybe your son or daughter, granddaughter, whoever it is, and they're 20 years old or 22 years old and they're thinking Thinking about entrepreneurship, they're thinking about potentially starting a business, what advice would you give them?

So a few winning principles: focus. Don't do too much too early. So 1 to 3 things to be the best in the world. If you— if I spend all of my time and my team's time on 2 things to make them the best in the world, and you, my competitor, are trying to do 12 things, you'll get diluted.

Hmm.

So next, passion and speed. I'm the kind of guy that when I drive up to the mall, I run in. I'm always in a hurry. The average speaker would be building about 18 months from concept to production. We would do it in 3.5 to 4.5 months.

Wow.

Next thing, iterative innovation and technology. That's evolution. Build— don't build from a white canvas. Take the status quo and improve upon it. Next, identify a market. To your specific customer. Don't go market to everybody. Market to your dedicated customer. Next, packaging and marketing sells and builds the brand. So I would use high-end packaging for my products. Next, target major macroeconomic and human behavioral shifts. So the market for speakers, I went at that right when tablets were taking off. And smartphones were exploding. Next, you're only as strong as your weakest link. So if you do 98% of the things good and 2% completely fail, you'll fail.

Next.

Flexibility. You have to be willing to pivot and adapt. I've failed in almost every business. When you pivot, you adapt, you innovate, and you, you persevere, and you make it successful. I love—

or do you have any more on there?

No.

That was a good list. Those are good principles. The one you've mentioned this a few times, starting from a blank canvas. This is something a mentor— same exact idea. And you said evolutionary, and it reminded me. He said, don't make a product that's revolutionary, make a product that's evolutionary. Meaning, usually when you try to make a revolution, there's a lot of roadblocks. It's very hard. Look at Elon Musk creating an electric car. There were a number of electric cars before Elon Musk, but all of them in the— this is the '90s, kind of early 2000s, all got squashed somehow from big oil companies, whatever, that because it was a revolution, It took someone like Elon Musk 10 years to make Tesla profitable and, you know, that much willpower to do it. It's a lot easier, like you're saying, to make something evolutionary, something that builds upon previous things that customers already know, like, and trust. You're just adding more benefits, features, and trying to make it world-class like you mentioned. I think that's a fantastic way to launch a business.

Even Elon Musk subscribes to this principle.

Hmm.

I would say that 95% of the car is the same basic core principle as a gas-driven car. The brakes are the same. The transmission, very similar. Hmm.

I saw a thing, it was, I think you were right, it was about 90% of Tesla's car is made of other makers. Tires, aluminum, doors, windshield, really the only thing Tesla creates is batteries. And their small little engine, but that is outsourced as well to another group. Anyways, it's very interesting. I think you're exactly right. Warren, I want to ask you about ALS briefly here. Last time I met you and every time I've seen you or heard of you, everyone is like, man, Warren is a fighter. He's taking this thing on and he is going all out. And I know you've You've done a lot of study and a lot of effort, and it's been incredible to see how sharp and how strong, you know, you are. And you've had this for a number of years now. Give me a few of your thoughts on ALS and how you're going about it and beating it and the mentality you have to maintain while going at it. I think there's a lot of great life principles from just seeing your example of what you're doing. It's incredible.

Well, ALS, I had 2 neurologists tell me Congratulations, you hit the jackpot. This is the worst disease a doctor can diagnose a patient with. You lose your voice, your swallowing, your breathing, your arms, your legs. All voluntary muscles eventually go with ALS. The average 90% of people with ALS Die within 2 to 4 years from first symptoms.

Hmm.

So when I was first diagnosed, the doctors— I said to the doctor, I've been researching stem cells a lot. And the data looks very, very strong. What do you think?

Hmm.

And he turned to me and said, don't waste your money or time on stem cells or any alternative treatment. Well, as soon as he said that, that's not how an entrepreneur functions. So I decided to take, take this into my own hands, and I've done over 400 treatments, 67 stem cell injections. I've been to China twice, Costa Rica once, Guadalajara, Mexico, 15 times for stem cell treatments and also Florida ones. And I went hella skiing every year the last 3 years until this year up in Canada while having ALS. 3 years ago, I dunked a basketball while having ALS. Today, I can't even lift my hands up any higher than about this.

Hmm.

But I'm still walking really well. My shoulders are shot. My arms and grip strength are gone, but I've— 2 neurologists, world-leading neurologists, said they think that I've done more treatments than anyone they've ever heard about or seen themselves.

Are you still doing The stem cell treatments right now?

The last time I went though was November, so I'll probably go in again within the next month or 2. For a while—

Gotcha.

Right after being diagnosed, I did treatments almost every month, and I experienced an 8-month reversal where I actually got stronger over 8 months, and then the clock continued to tick. By the way, back to business.

Yeah.

Um, in all of my companies, I personally manufactured and sold more than 350 million consumer Consumer products over about 30 years.

That's absolutely outstanding. Yeah, it's your resume and thing. That's why I wanted to bring you on. It's just you're an incredible entrepreneur, incredible human as well, to do all— I mean, the number of events we already talked about today and everything. Warren, I want to thank you for coming on. I want to— last, last final question I just want to ask. This is your— I'm just gonna give you the mic for 2 minutes. If you had, you know, something you wanted to leave with the planet, with the earth, with people that are listening, for 2 minutes you got open mic. You can talk about whatever you'd like— religion, politics, life, family, whatever you want to talk about, business. You got the mic for 2 minutes, 2 and a half, whatever, however long you go, you can go. I won't time you, but the mic is now yours to kind of leave this audience with whatever you'd like. Whatever you feel like is most important, what would it be?

Go at everything double time. So I never put in 100%, it's always 120 to 200%. Have absolute commitment to what you go after. Go after it with passion. When there's a will, you find a way. Don't be irrational or unrealistic. Have an attitude of getting there no matter what. Go after something that you're passionate about, something that will make the world a better When you're hiring people, ask yourself, does this person sell well, motivate well, lead well? Does this person really have what it takes to launch a new initiative? That's probably what I'd share.

I love it. Those are— and you can tell from your life, and you've lived those, and those aren't kind of things you just say that sound nice. You've lived them and continue to live them. Warren, thank you so much for coming on today. I know you're a busy man, and you got— and I really appreciate you coming on. We'll talk soon.