What Employees Expect From Leaders in Today’s Workplace

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Contrary to popular belief, people don't leave jobs because of the pay. They do, but not as often.

Rare.

Right. It's not necessarily the benefits. I have watched people get crappy pay and crappy benefits at. But what do they have? An amazing boss.

Yeah.

Amazing leadership. They've got just. They. They don't go to work every day and think, what bus is going to hit me?

Nope.

Or they don't hope they get hit by a bus on the way to work because there's not this existential dread.

Yeah.

That so many people have. And in so many cases, when I hear no one wants to work anymore, I always think you just have misaligned expectations for you. Correct. Of what your employees should expect from you. Did I drag that out?

That was good.

Thanks. Thanks. We're going to talk about that today. Stay tuned. She's the CEO.

He's the marketing and operations guy.

If it's broken, you need the business fix. This is going to be interesting because you've kind of always been working for the same place.

Yes.

I have a ton of experience with horrible, horrible leadership.

I've watched other people do it wrong. I'm sure I've done it wrong, too. I know I've done it wrong, but.

Yes.

Yes.

I have been on both ends of that stick. I have done it horribly wrong myself. I've also been on the. The most. When I think back to when I've switched jobs.

Yeah.

It's been 90% of the time because of the boss. I had one that. I mean, this is going to be crude, but this will tell you the leadership. He would come over and fart in your cubicle and think it was funny.

No.

Correct. That is not.

Clearly. You did not have hr.

No, we did.

Oh, you did. Oh, gosh.

Very large company. Very large company. Right, right, right. This was 25 years ago when that was more acceptable. But.

No, that's never acceptable.

It'. But that's. That's why I left.

Yeah.

When I have leadership like that, that's What?

I know what your exit interview was.

I mean, that wasn't the sole reason. There were some other. Okay. But I mean, it tells you about the leadership there. What kind of leader, what kind of people do you have in leadership where they think it's funny to fart in someone's cubicle? No, people aren't doing that at your company.

No, we do not do that. It's not a thing. Not a thing.

I mean, considering there's H R in the title.

I know.

I'm assuming you guys don't fart ever until you just get in the car and go home.

I mean, I don't know. I can't tell you that or not. I can tell you that there's some things we do that are not fun.

That's sealed information.

Yes.

I figured for this week's banter we could talk. Farting.

Okay, thanks for that. That was great. Like, I'm dealing with my 13 year old.

Yeah, no, that's. Yes, you are. In some ways. In some ways you very much are. To me, when you hire someone, it's this implicit contract of like, look, they're going to give time, energy, loyalty, and in return they are going to expect certain things from you. And it's not just a paycheck.

Yeah.

Imagine that. I made sure when I wrote this that I put in one of the expectations is. Do you want to say it?

Clarity.

Very good.

Yes.

I figured I'd give you that word consistency and opportunity. Those are the other two. That to me, that that's what makes a good work experience.

Yes.

If it's clear, it's consistent and they've got some opportunity in it, that's how. That's all people want and the paycheck too. But that's kind of a given. There's some non negotiables in this that employees should be able to expect from their leader. To me, I want to hear your take on what some of those things are. And what, like, when you fulfill those things, how does that build loyalty? How does that make people want to come to work instead of like, oh, damn it, it's Monday.

Yeah. So I would say a few things. The first is, you know, before we even start with it, it's when someone chooses to work for you, they're not just accepting their paycheck, they're handing you something that's really sacred. They're handing you their time.

Yes.

They're handing you their energy and they're really handing you their livelihood.

Oh.

Because it is just. It is a paycheck. For them. But that paycheck is what supports their livelihood. And the fact that they are giving you their time is time away from their family is time away from other things. So I believe that there are a few non negotiables that every employee deserves from the person that is leading them. And we've talked about them before, we've talked about clarity, consistency and care in past episodes because, you know, alliteration is memorable and it matters. So I want to dig a little bit more into those three big ones and really kind of give you a little bit more through them. So clarity is really clarity of vision. So people want to know where they're going and why it matters. And it doesn't need to be a glossy 80 slide strategy deck. It means that you are talking to them and you're giving them direction and you're doing it in a clear manner. So you're going to paint the picture, you're going to connect the work to the mission. And we have, I mean we have a purpose statement of clarity and aui. We provide peace of mind by simplifying the complicated. We take two things that are complicated, HR and insurance. And we help make them simple for everybody to understand so that they can buy our products. And you show them how what you do in purpose contributes to the greater whole. Because when people understand the why, it's much easier for them to show up with purpose.

Yes.

And they show up with their purpose, not just their presence.

I love the fact that you kept the mission statement or the statement that you just said. Yeah, simple. It is like you said, not an 80 page slide deck.

You can't simplify the complicated by doing an 80 page slide deck. It's not work.

No, no, no. Keep it simple. Make it so it's easy to do.

Yes. So the second one is, is really honesty and transparency. So this is the trust builder or it can be the trust breaker, depending on how you do this. So employees do not expect things to be perfect. Employees don't want you to be perfect because if you're perfect then it's you're not human. And if you're not human, it means that you don't make mistakes and so that they can't make mistakes. So they don't expect things to be perfect. But they do always expect the truth. And so for that it's say what's really going on, even if it's hard, even if it's uncertain. I don't know is an okay answer in, in certain situations, don't make stuff up, don't sugarcoat, don't make things vague because it only creates confusion. And when you're creating confusion, they're looking for another place to spend their time. All right, People can handle hard news. What they can't handle is being left in the dark.

Now I, if I can, the the truth and the perfection piece.

Yes.

I like. Because if you appear perfect, you do not appear believable.

Correct.

And they want to know that, that you can be honest with them. And if you're right every single time, guess what, you're not believable.

Well, and studies have shown, especially with millennials, with Gen Z and with the younger, the littlest of the generation, Gen Alpha, I had to think for a second. My 13 year old's in it. Authenticity is really what's most important when they're talking about leadership. They don't care about your skills. They really care about is this a real person, is this a genuine person? Can I believe what they're saying? They want you to be authentic with you, with them.

100%.

Yeah. And then the third one I would say is again, we talk about consistency, but it's really fairness and consistency. Yeah. I mean culture is built in those moments when there's no one watching as a leader. And that means, you know, no special treatment, no bending the rules for your go to person. If the rules don't apply equally to everyone, including the leader, your credibility takes a hit quickly. And that's what I would say really as a leader is you've got to show up and model what you want to see. So if you're, and we've said this in another episode, like you, you better model what you mandate.

You know, you know which one I'm talking, which one I'm thinking of.

I know, I want to know which one.

The relationships at work.

Oh gosh.

The example that you gave that was golden was the couple that owns the business that mandates no dating in the business.

Yes. That's my favorite. That is. We talk about relationships in the work. No, we met here, we got married here, but no one else can find love. No, that's one. Another one is, you know, I expect everyone to be here at 8am on the dot, shows up at 10:30 like that. You can't do that. As the organizational leader, if, if timeliness is something that you are going, it's a hill you're going to die on, then you better die on it with your team and show up at the same time. You've got to be consistent. The other thing I would say is you Know when you lead with these things, you know, again, we talk about how people don't need perfection, but they do need predictability. And consistency really creates that safety. And safety is what allows teams to thrive. We have, I know we talk about psychological safety and sometimes people like, they give me a weird look. They're like, does it really matter? Yes, it does. Especially when you're working on innovation, when you're working on the potential of something that could have a failure rate, they've got to be able to know that how you show up is how you always show up. So being consistent in your emotions, being consistent in your language, being consistent in your actions, and being fair in how you deliver that consistency with your people. And so when you're leading with, with clarity, with honesty and with fairness, your team doesn't just perform, they really believe you. They feel seen, they feel safe. And they're far more likely to go that extra mile, not because they're afraid not to, but because they want to. And that's it. What you don't want is a group of people that are in fear of dealing with their leader. And like, what, what's the weather going to be like? With which way is the wind blowing? You want to make sure that it's, it's consistent. And remember, that culture isn't built on those perks. It's really built on predictable leadership. You showing up every day consistently with Clarity, being able to explain your vision, being fair and being honest and transparent is really what's going to help the organization move forward. And that's what makes people want to show up and work for you.

Foreign, Let's be honest. You did not start your business so you could spend your days buried in HR paperwork or Googling how to handle employee drama.

That's why I started Clarity hr, where your fractional HR team giving you real people, real support and real solutions. Whether it's compliance headaches, hiring struggles, or just needing someone to take the people stuff off your plate, we've got your back.

So if you're ready to stop using duct tape and hope as your HR.

Strategy and finally get some peace of mind, head over to clarity hr.com that's clarity hr.com simple, clear and here to help.

I'll give you a few seconds to go to the website while we get ready to get back to the show. It's funny you say the culture isn't built on perks. I've always said culture is not built on pizza, ping pong and pandering. It's just not.

No it's not. And as someone who runs an employee benefits company, I will tell you that people don't stay for the benefits. They don't. That's why we have the HR piece.

Yeah.

No, because we were watching it, and people are like, well, we have these great benefits. Why aren't they staying? And it's like, what else are you doing to help them?

Because you're terrible people.

You're not a good leader. I don't like having that conversation.

That's the difficult conversation.

But their health insurance is amazing. And it's like. No, it's not. People don't stay for the health insurance.

Yeah. Especially when you look at. Most people. Don't use it. No.

That's another conversation.

It is.

It is. So the challenge for a business owner. Josh. Or leader, making those expectations a reality. Right. So what do you use to avoid the breakdowns that lead to confusion, resentment, and your top person from exiting? I know you've got some good operational insights here. The.

The one is, I. I believe, like, ambiguity sucks.

We are in alignment on our first one.

Yes. Yes. I mean, this is like, I know what I want someone to do. Do they.

Are they a mind reader?

Right. Are they, like, did I give them an expectation for it? The biggest thing that I see, and there's two pieces to this, is one, I just kind of give a general destination. Like, I would say go to Cleveland. Well, if they end up on the far side of Cleveland, and I wanted them like, on the. In Playhouse Square.

Yes.

Why didn't I tell them go to Playhouse Square.

Yes.

So that, like, tell them, but don't tell them how to get there. Give them. Tell them exactly where we need to go and then let them do their thing.

Yeah.

That is that expectation that allows them to do their thing. But once again, they know exactly where they need to end up. I want you the center of Playhouse Square, right underneath the chandelier. They may take the train, they may take a taxi, they may take an Uber, they may take a bicycle, they may take a kayak. Who knows? Although that's hard on the street. But give them that. And then it's asking, how can I help? And what roadblocks can I remove? But once again, it's this clear expectation of where. Where do they need to go? And, like, exactly.

Yes.

Generally exactly where they need to be.

A good explainer of things.

Yes. And I didn't explain that very well, which is I. So, so ironic. On the flip side of that, when you ask them, how can I help? What roadblocks do you need removed? That there's nothing worse than going to your boss and saying, hey, I've got this roadblock. And the boss says, great, I'll take care of it. And two weeks later you're like, I still have the same problem. The boss is like, oh, I forgot.

Oh, yeah, I forgot about that. No, don't. Yeah, yeah. Because you just, you just sent the message that they don't matter 100%.

Anything, anything committed, you got to write it down, log, write down task list, whatever. And it needs a single owner. Don't be like, hey, this is a group project. Nope.

No, that. That statement of if everyone owns it, no one owns it.

Correct.

I hate that, but it's so true.

And I mean, think back to grade school when you had a group project in grade school. I guarantee you did it.

Yes.

Yes. I'm pointing right at you, Chris.

I'm watching my daughter do the same things. And actually I'm watching my son do the same. And I'm like, why are you doing the whole project? Because I can't trust this person to do it. I'm like, have you let them, have you even tried to let them do it? No. Like, okay, that's Madeline. Caleb's like, yes. And they failed. I'm like, okay, there's different level of expectations. My 13 year old will trust people for a moment. My daughter has no trust. It's like, you know, I, yeah, she'll get there.

Apple tree.

No, she'll get there. I mean, I, I was not far from that for a very long time.

To me, like, this is, there's so many programs out there. Asana Monday Trello, Google tasks.

Teamwork.

Right? Teamwork. There's thousands of these things that can help you, guide you through this. But the expectation is, is if something is said, it's got to get done. And your employees, if they come to you with something and you say, I'm going to do it, if you don't do that, you're done.

Yes.

That's it. Any trust, like, and the problem is, is that the trust, and this is one of the big things that your employees expect from you is that trust that we talked about. It takes so long to earn and so much of that can be eroded in one fell swoop.

Yes.

If you are Johnny on the spot 99% of the time and you forget once and you correct it on the spot, you're at 80%.

Yeah.

If you're Johnny on the spot 90% of the time and someone says, hey, we missed this, guess what, you're back to 10?

Yeah.

I mean, it, it. And it takes you so long to build that up. It. The, the. As I was writing this, it was kind of funny to me. Employees expect their organization to be organized. What a revelation that was. As I was typing this out, I'm like, they expect their organization to be, be organized. And I'm like, holy cow. And what, what was interesting about it to me was there's so many times where I saw a complete disorganization around me. In other jobs that I've been in where no one knew what was going on, there was things that kind of in limbo like, oh, we're waiting on this or. And you knew it was just disorganization.

Yeah.

And I was like, it was just funny. I was thinking about like their boss to be organized. And I'm like, no, it's an organization that they're in.

Yeah, it's a systems issue.

Right. But then I'm like, organization should be organized, huh? Yeah. Talk about your all time, duh moments.

Yes.

And that organization, that's what's going to deliver the consistency that people want. You talked about consistency? Yeah, 100%. If I walk into a shit storm, I want to know which way the wind's blowing. I worked for someone where, I kid you not, you could come in with data and numbers and everything and he'd be like, nope. Other times you could come in with just a sheer like, hey, I think we should feeling. And he would just be like, yep, do it. And you're like, and, and the, the complete lack of consistency. Not only in the answers.

Yeah.

But in the, like, the way he treated different people. There was zero consistency in the company. And because of that, it raised my anxiety level. I'm like, once again, the shitstorm analogy, Is it coming from the east? Is it coming from the west? I mean, there was times where you're like, okay, I don't know where it's going to come from. I'm going to pull my umbrella down. And it started coming up from the ground and you're like, you just not.

What I planned for.

Right?

Yeah.

It's that complete lack of you. Like, there's so many things that are unpredictable in business, and that's a big part of the reason why we're in business is to handle those things. Your interaction with your employees and your co workers should not be one of those things that's unpredictable.

No, that should make. That should be the enjoyable part.

100%.

That's why we're doing human Connection. I'm really like, yes, we want money because we do the things, but it's.

Also about human connection 100% and they should know like what to expect. It's, it's the, that's as huge. That is comforting for everyone. And we talked about fear last time. As business owners. A lot of the reasons why we don't try new things is because we have the fear of change. Well, if you put every single one of your employees in fear because they have no idea what your next move is going to be.

Right. It's not good. Right.

This is another one of those episodes I believe is stressing Chrissy out.

Well, I mean there's. Because it's, it's anxiety inducing knowing that that organization is not doing the service that it needs to and not just in service to its itself and being successful, but in service to the employees and the team members that are there. So that's the part that always makes me sad in the situation is like, you know, you probably have really good people that want to do good work.

And they can't now in that role. 1. I mean, I had the ability to affect a lot of change, but I didn't because I just didn't know how it was going to be perceived. There was no risk taking. There was no nothing. It was just go in and kind of muddle through the day and collect a paycheck. We could have done so many amazing things. But just. Yeah. The other thing is, is employees hate feeling stuck. Not everyone wants to move up the ladder and that's awesome. But most people want to grow a dead end job doesn't mean they can't get promoted. It means that they can't learn now.

Oh, I like that.

Yeah. I mean people should be able to learn and grow and, and get things from their job. What I worry about with this and employees can feel that this is a trap. You're smiling because you know I'm going, where I'm going with this is there's so many times where people like, hey, we want you to learn a new skill, ergo, we want you to learn how to do something new so you can do more work and we're going to pay you the same. That is a problem. That is what so many employees end up with on their lap. Don't do that.

Yeah, I agree.

There's, there's a reason why so many employees, when you try and give them something new, they're like, no, sounds like more responsibilities for the same pay. No thanks. If you are doing things to, to Help them get ahead. By golly. I mean, Nika are my editor. I send her videos occasionally. And I'm like, watch this. This can help you. Yeah, it's training her so she can get better at her job, so she can be more efficient at her job. That doesn't mean I'm going to send her 10,000 other responsibilities. No, no. It means I want her to have an easier time. I want her to feel better about what she's doing. I want her to feel more confident what she's doing. It so often it just becomes. And I've been in this situation, we're like, hey, we'd like you to do this. And ironically, it's something that someone that just left used to do. We're just going to take this person's job and we're going to split it off into four different directions.

And we're not going to hire.

We're not going to hire anyone else, because that's efficient. No, it's not. Employees look at that as a trap. So you need to find a way to let your employees or assist your employees in moving forward and in growing without it being like, hey, you're my dumping ground for a bunch of extra work that you're not going to get paid for.

Oh, completely agree.

I've been, like I said, I've been on both sides of this. I've been where they're like, hey, here's some tools that can help you become more efficient. Awesome. Love it. Here's learning something. Here's doing something. I ate that stuff up. When it's here's tools so you can do more stuff and still make the same amount.

Well, and I would say, too, as it relates to learning, if you want to foster learning in your organization, you have to be a learner, too. You have to be coachable. You have to be open to change, and you have to be willing to grow yourself on your leadership skill. When I see organizations that are struggling, oftentimes it is because the leader doesn't see the value in developing themselves and developing their leadership skills. Or like, oh, I've got it figured out. I'm like, what you did as a $3 million company is not what you can do as an $8 million company. And as much as you think you may have it all figured out, the people leaving with. With the number of people that are not staying and the fact that you're making the same mistakes and the fact that you're having the same problems over and over and over again leads me to believe that there Might be an issue. And I know that you don't think it's you, but do you maybe think we should think about it? Maybe. Might be you just saying. I maybe had this conversation a couple times.

There's a song about I'm the problem. It's me.

Yeah. I'm telling you. Yes, T. Swift, she's, she's right. And there's a couple times where I've looked at people and said, you know, it's okay to say that you're the problem.

Yeah.

I, I, I will wholeheartedly own that. Half the time in the organization, I am the problem. Or if something has happened or gone wrong in the organization, it's because I didn't do something. I didn't, I wasn't clear, I wasn't fair or consistent. I wasn't having, I mean, it's the things that I didn't do.

Yep. So no, I totally get that. The way to make sure that you train people.

Yes.

And not overload them and not just turn them into your dumping ground. To me, it's 30, 60, 90 day plans and there's a development roadmap. Here's what I think you can be doing in the, in the next year. Here's where I see your position developing. I mean, look, unless you're just stamping something out, jobs are changing so quickly with AI.

Exactly.

So to give them these tools, to help them with these tools, it. Give them the roadmap with that. So they can see that, hey, this is growth. To help both of us.

Yes.

Not just to turn you into dumping ground.

Well, and again, when you can, when you can have the conversations and be transparent with them about, these are the things that we're looking at. And then, and this is what's going on. I mean, we've talked about, you know, I don't know that some, that a robot's going to replace you, but someone who has the ability to use AI may replace you if you're resistant to change. And so as we're building some of these things, I think it's really important that you're having conversations. And also with your 30, 60, 90, this is why we have, you know, feedback. This is why we talk about performance. This is why we have performance evaluations. Hey, this is what we're doing. This is where we're going. This is why we show appreciation to our employees, or we coach them if we need them to do more or we need to have a different outcome. So it's, it's really, it's important that you're you're clear in the expectations and the communication that you're having. Again, also modeling what you mandate. So if you're, if you're doing.

Have you mentioned that before?

Yeah, a couple times. I want to keep doing it. Model what you mandate, people. If not, you need to call clarity because we're going to have to tell you.

We're, we're going to have to have that sweaty 10 minute conversation. No, I, Yes, I totally get that with this. Do they expect a perfect leader or do they expect a committed leader?

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Back to the show. Oh, I like this. So I would say that perfection isn't the goal, but predictability is.

Did that hurt your. The. Did that.

My recovering perfectionist brain.

I was about to say did that hurt 12 year old chrissy to say.

That perfection isn't the goal, it's being predictable. So your team doesn't need you to be flawless as much as I always want to be. I mean, they need a person who shows up. They need you to own your mistakes and they need you to keep moving forward and developing yourself so that you can also develop with them. Let me say develop yourself so you can develop them.

Yes. 100 everyone should be growing. If you're not, you're probably someone else is. And you may not be shrinking, but someone's going to pass you.

Yeah.

Be moving forward.

Yeah.

It's funny to me because like this is you've talked from the HR standpoint of documenting things.

Yes.

And this to me it's if you document the process, then it becomes very easy to document the result.

Yeah.

It's funny because this is like I document the process and you document the result.

Yes. Well, it is because you know Fairness is really felt when, when everyone plays by the same rules. And when you have documentation, you have documented processes, it takes favoritism off the table.

Sure does.

And then they say, how do we do things while in here? What do we. This is how we do them. This is what happens.

And part of that comes from that consistency.

Yes.

There's. You shouldn't. There's like, you need to, you need to find ways to grow. But in the same sense, when it comes to consistency, like, the example that I always use is, I believe I'm going on 12 years now. I have had eggs basically every day for breakfast.

Okay.

People know what to expect to smell in my house in the morning.

Fair.

But it's that consistency is there.

Yes.

There's certain things where you just have to be like, we want to grow. But there's certain things where you just have to be rock solid, consistent. And it's how you treat people, the fairness, those types of things. And what helps you with that?

Documentation. It is. I mean, you say documentation is dignity. It is. Because when employees know there's a clear shared way to succeed, it shows that leadership respects everyone's time, energy and attention. Attention. All of their contributions.

How often do you do like one on one meetings with people that are like, intentionally, like, not like, hey, we've got a project coming up. It's like an intentional, like one on one meeting where you're like, hey, let's talk about where you're at. Let's talk about where I'm at. Let's talk about, let's talk about your, our relationship.

So we do, we do check ins weekly, but we do a quarterly conversation. And anyone that has direct leadership in their direct leadership line, you are responsible at Aur and Clarity for having a quarterly conversation with your direct reports. It is not a, like, this is our meeting. We're going and we're having a meal, we're having coffee. Or for our virtual team members, it's more of a casual, how can I help? What's going on? Tell me things that I can do to support you, whether it's in office or out of office. That's the other part. Like, we've got some team members that are having some pretty amazing life events coming up and it's like, hey, are you ready? What's going on? So.

So it's not in a, it's not in a dimly lit room where.

No.

The spotlight on.

No, it is not. Those are called interrogations. We don't do that. Different career path.

It's funny, we have weekly meetings also where it's the. And I mean, it's fun. It's. In some ways, I find it a little bit funny because it starts the same way as the podcast. There's no hook. I'm not. I don't.

But there's banter.

There's banter at the beginning.

Yeah. There has to be.

How's things going? This is a relaxed conversation. I want this to be a conversation.

Yeah.

Not a. Not a. Like you said, interrogation.

No, it's rapport building. And you go with an agenda because sometimes you're of. If you're not good at modeling the conversation, then go with the agenda of the questions that you need to ask.

For a good question to ask people. Mm. I. I'd love to start with. And I do this in networking meetings a lot. What's something you're excited about this week?

Oh, I like that.

Because it's not. How are you. Because people are going to give you a bullshit answer to that.

Yeah.

If you say, what's something you're excited about this week? You're going to ask about something that they genuinely care about and that is the right way to kick that off and that is the right way to make them feel seen, heard and connected with you rather than just, what do you want?

Yeah. Well, and I would say too, I mean, if you want to keep your culture healthy, you don't outsource your feedback and your annual reviews. You do them yourself.

Yes.

Or the people that are direct reporting to whoever is in your management team is doing them yourself. You don't just send out the survey here. We're going to Survey Monkey or we're going to Tiny Pulse. So we're going to do like those. They have a place and a purpose, but they are not there. I mean, they're not there for one on ones because those structured one on ones, they create rhythm, they create loyalty, they create safety and being able to communicate. And it gives you accountability, too. In both directions.

Yes. Yes. Because you need that you do this. This is not what so many people realize is we've all heard the saying rolls downhill.

Yes.

And it doesn't.

Rockets to the top.

Right, right, right. There is a cannon. There is a poo cannon at the bottom of the hill. And although you have the elevated positions.

You'Re getting hit in the back of the head by it.

Yeah, right, right. Yeah. Because they're attacking from the rear, never from the front. It's. What's funny about it is, is we've talked about like some of these Expectations. And really the conversation is centered around making people feel seen, heard, making them feel like they have a future, making them feel like they're not just do that. Like they're not just a number. They're not just someone that comes in, punches in, does the thing, and then gets the hell out of there.

No, employees want to be seen.

Yes, they do. And for the right reasons, not just when they screw up.

Yeah.

What happens, like, what do you see when, like, people don't meet these expectations?

So besides the fact that turnover is expensive?

Yes, it is.

So I would say that when leaders don't meet expectations, people don't always leave, but they do disconnect. And, you know, we talk about quiet quitting. I feel like people don't quit so quietly, but it's lost momentum, it's lost questions, it's lost energy around or intensity around new ideas. So I feel like that can really. I mean, cost of failing to meet expectations can really be expensive, especially when you're unclear. I think a lot of times unclear expectations can even create resentment.

That's a huge one. I worked someplace where they treated everyone terribly. You would walk into their office for a meeting, they would. This is the classic one. They. We used AOL instant messenger. This tells you how long ago this was to communicate in the office. This is obviously pre slack. And they would send you a message, come into my office. There's two owners. No, come into my office. And I'd be like, what are we talking about? And they're like, just get in here.

It could be great or it could be terrible.

And it was always terrible.

Oh, no.

So you'd walk into their office and they'd be like, what was last week's numbers? I don't know. I mean, I think they were good. I mean, I glanced at him real quick, but I haven't gotten there. Well, why not? And you're like, well, had you told me what we were going to talk about? So once again, it was unclear expectations to prepare. Right. How am I supposed to do this? How am I supposed to. And I mean, once again, the randomness of the things they said, that was. That was a horrible work environment and what it turned me into. I was in charge of operations for the entire call center. So I'm kind of like, okay, is everyone doing the things that it. It's just enough so I'm not going to get yelled at? Sure. Okay. And I still got yelled at, but it was just like, whatever I got to do to get by. Whatever I can do to get a Check. And I mean, I was partially commissioned and I was still like, I just want to get my check and get the hell out of here.

No.

And that is that cost of the trust and not having the ex, like, not treating people the way they, they, the way they deserve to be treated on stuff like that. It was huge. I know. I costed them hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Oh, yeah. Because ambivalence doesn't, I mean.

Yep. I, I'm, I'm okay with it because of the way they treated me.

And I'm sure that most of the people in the organization were probably okay with, with half the performance that they needed to have because that's, they're, they're falling to the level of their training and you didn't give expectations. And when you treat people like dirt, they don't, they act like dirt.

What's interesting about that is this place in another place that once again, horrible management they have, they rest their laurels on. Like, we've got a number of employees that have 30 years with us or 20 years with us.

Just because people like being hostages doesn't mean they're good team members.

That's exactly it. And I'm like, you've got three people out of 100 that have been there longer than 10 years. Everyone else has been there less than two.

Yeah.

But they focus on those three because they're like, look, we're a great place to work because these people have been here forever. And what I'm going to refer to is our last episode. They just fear the unknown so much that they're like, oh, this is, this is fine.

Well, and when we talk about numbers with, with clarity and going into organizations, we'll say like, what's your turnover rate? They're like, well, we have some people that have been here for 30 years. And we're like, okay, that's great. How many people do you hire a year? 10. How many people do you have on your staff? 15.

Okay, there's a problem.

There's a problem. It's possible that your 30 year employee is the problem. It's also possible that you don't realize how bad your turnover in your culture is because you're just thinking, well, I've got three people that have been with me since I started and these other people are just here every two years. It's no big year. We just churn through them. That's what, that's what the economy is like. That's what most people are like. No, most people don't want to change jobs. They don't. There are certain things you're not supposed to do of more than one thing in a year. Move, change jobs, get married, have a kid. People don't want to do those things repeatedly.

Stressful. It is very stressful, actionable steps because we always like to talk about those. This, this first one, it's, it's got your word in it, so I'm gonna leave that to you.

So it's audit your clarity.

Just a smile you get every time you say that word.

Well, it's. Can everybody, can you say the purpose statement? Can you, can you explain as an employee what you do? I mean, why you do it? That's it. I mean, what's the number one goal? I communicate.

I love that. Do your employees feel that?

Yeah. Do they feel it?

Yep.

What about you?

Follow up. Use an instant list for all tasks like comm commitments. And as a leader, you are held to a higher standard no matter what it has to be done.

Yeah. I would say the next one is defining the next step. People need to know where you're going, whether it's the next six months to 12 months. You really need to give them, like, what is the next available growth step? Where are we going?

To me. Lead your own. Check in one on ones. Start reviewing your side of it. Don't just go to your employee and be like, hey, here's the things that you've been doing well and here's the things that you've been doing poorly. Get out of my office. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. It needs to be, here's the things that you're doing well. Here are the things that we need to improve on. Then it's, how can I help?

Yes.

Additionally, what else do you need from me? What can I improve on? This should be a two way street.

Yes.

If the employee says, hey, stop farting in my cubicle. Yeah, I had to bring that back into it. Sorry.

You did well. And I would say, what goes with leading your own check in is asking for the feedback. So asking your employees, you know, what's the thing that I could do better or what's the thing that I'm doing as a leader that makes your job harder? Yeah. Where. Where am I falling?

But I'm wonderful. I don't make anyone's job harder.

I'm perfect.

But I don't ever make it difficult for other people. I have no idea what you're talking about. What's the single biggest sign a leader is failing to meet the expectation for consistency towards their employees.

That's when your team really starts to. To double check everything you say.

Oh, that hurts.

Yeah. So if they feel they need a backup plan every time you say something or you make a commitment, that's a sign that you're not consistent.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That. Yeah. They should just know. They should feel it's going to be done.

Yeah. So what's the fastest way to formalize a path to growth for an employee without building a huge HR department?

Shout out to Clarity. Hr. You can call them in to help.

Thank you.

For, for me very much. Is a case of just like outlining things. Very simple. Here's a short little training program. It. This doesn't need to be this big, long formal document that everyone's going to sign. Just say, here's what I'd like. Here's what I'd like to help you with in 60 days. Here's what I'd like to help you with in 90, 120 days. And let's see where we're at.

Yeah. Have the meeting.

Yeah.

Summarize it in an email. Hey, we had this conversation because that's documentation.

Yep.

It's simple.

Yeah. You don't need to. I mean, you can call Clarity.

You can, but we're at. We're going to tell you the same thing. It can just be an email.

Can that meeting could have been an email.

Yes.

Probably would have been a lot cheaper. As the email to all our listeners. Be a leader. Step up.

Yeah.

Lead your team. Like, realize they have expectations for you. And it's, it's not, it's not unrealistic at what they're expecting.

It's not. It's really simple.

It really is. They expect you to be a decent human and be a decent leader.

Yeah.

And it doesn't take these massive skills to do this.

No. Just be a learner.

Be a learner, Be consistent, be fair and do what you say you're going to do. If you want to find more on this and past episodes, because we have some good. We have some good episodes.

We do.

They're all good episodes, really.business fix podcast.com. follow us on all of the social medias at the Business Fix review subscription. Please, please, please toss those out there. We'd love, love to hear from you on stuff like that. Next week we will be discussing what you, you specifically, yes, you specifically should expect of your employees. We talked about what they should expect from you. Now what you should expect from them. Do me a favor. Take care of yourself. If you can, take care of someone else, too, we will see you very, very soon, Sam.