Hobby to Hustle: Building a Predictable Video Production Business | Ryan Koral

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Welcome to another episode of The Profitable Creative, the only place on the interwebs where you will learn how to turn your passion into profit. I am your host, Christian Brim. Special shout out to our one listener in Washington, D.C. Uh, the District of Columbia is a fascinating city. If you haven't been, I highly encourage it. Wouldn't want to live there though. Uh, joining me today, the infamous Ryan Corral of Tell Studios and Studios Sherpas. Ryan, welcome.

Christian, thanks for having me, man. Was— is this episode sponsored by Washington, DC, like the travel bureau or something like that?

No, no, uh, although I should reach out to them and ask.

Yeah, because after that little intro, I mean, have you been to DC? I have. Pretty recently too.

Yeah, um, my— I've only been once. I went, took a family trip, and my, my favorite— there are two things that we did that were my favorite. The first was, uh, the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier and the Changing of the Guard. That was just chilling. And, uh, then actually the Archives, uh, and seeing the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence. I got chills at both of those. So yeah, what was your favorite?

Hmm. I went to the National Prayer Breakfast most recently, and the people that you meet at this event is pretty outstanding. And I did get to be in the same room as the President of the United States. So that was— I've never been in the same room as the president. So check that off the bucket list.

Where do they have that meeting?

I was at the Hilton, the same hotel where Reagan was shot back in— okay, I think '82. Yeah. So yeah, but yeah, it's a cool event. But yeah, I don't know, uh, there's— I mean, there's so much cool stuff there.

It's— yeah, now you could spend weeks. It is, it is fascinating. All right, so tell the listeners who don't know you— I don't know who wouldn't know you, but tell the ones that don't know you who you are and, and what you do.

Maybe, uh, unless it's just all the listeners for my show that listen to your show. Hopefully it's more than that. Um, yeah, so those people should— you better know me if you listen to my show. You better know who I am. Uh, yeah, so 20 years ago, a little over 20 years ago, I was working at this little Christian college in Metro Detroit, Michigan, and I had convinced my boss to buy me a video camera and a computer so I could start making videos, which was kind of just this like little barely a hobby thing starting in middle school, making zombie movies and transitioning to even dumber things throughout high school. So my boss bought me this stuff to help promote all the amazing— I mean, my life was changed at the school. And I thought if I could tell stories like mine, it would make it a lot easier for the school to essentially sell what it was that they're trying to sell to get more people to come to their school that would be right fit students. And faculty and staff. And so I started making videos for the school, and I was doing it like a lot. And I realized, I'm like, I just want to make videos. This is amazing. And, you know, it's one of those things where I could stay up till 2 in the morning editing, and I just— it didn't, it didn't feel like work. It was exciting. I was just learning how to use the equipment. And, and eventually, in 2004, I left the college and started my own video production business. And I had no idea what I was doing. Didn't, you know, hadn't started a business before, but my wife and I were newly married and it was just like, hey, let's try this thing. And we were just talking about this yesterday. I had to replace, you know, I was on salary at the university and I had to replace my salary. That was the goal. She was still a student. So we were, you you know, poor, young, you know, just all the things. Nothing to lose. My salary—

what's that? Nothing to lose.

Nothing to lose. Uh, so the, the salary that I had to replace was $22,000 a year, which is the equivalent of $11 an hour. And I thought— I just thought, I'm like, I think I can do this. And looking back now, I'm like, I would have had to been completely terrible at video to not replace my $11 an hour salary. And, uh, yeah, so anyway, it's through, uh, friends and people at the church that we went to in the college, I was getting contracted by, you know, just different people in our network. And then eventually, a stranger hired me and gave me a check for $300 for a little video for his son, who was trying to make it to the Olympics. And, and I was like, oh my gosh, this is, this is like a real thing. And then I shot a wedding for $500 for my friend who was a photographer. And that was amazing. And we kind of, I say we, I decided I was going to go all in on wedding films. And I did that for about 8 years hardcore. And got to travel all over and meet amazing people and shot some weddings for as much as $25,000. And that was really cool. And then as we were having kids, I was like, man, I don't want to keep working on weekends. And I had this vision for our lives that didn't require me, really, it didn't require me to work 40 hours a week in my business, period. And so I realized that I could take what we learned in storytelling and video production into the world of business. And so we started working with businesses and telling their stories, and that's what we do today. I mean, it's been— we kind of rebranded in 2012, and now we're Tell Studios and have a team. We have a studio and still get to do some traveling and meet some cool people, but it's a lot different than our wedding days way back in the day.

So you've— if I'm not mistaken, you have kind of come full circle back to working with universities again, correct?

Yeah, yeah. So we made an announcement, I think it was 2 years ago. We built this whole brand around, uh, higher education. I mean, my— we were approached, I think, 3 or 4 years ago to create this documentary on this basketball coach at the university that I graduated from. And it was amazing because he was the guy who I knew his son after I graduated high school. I knew him way, a long time ago. And anyway, this basketball coach introduced me to— he saw some potential in me or something. He introduced me to his boss, who was the president of the university. And I sat down with the president of the university, and I basically was like, I'd love to come to school here. This is like private school. It's small Christian. I didn't grow up with any of this background, but I was so hungry to have this new faith and whatever. But I knew I could not afford an education outside of the community college that I was paying for on my own. And they paid. He made a way. I ended up getting the President Scholarship. I went to school there for 4 years, lived on campus, and I left, graduated with no debt. And so when the school approached me like 4 years ago and said, hey, we've got a donor that wants to do a documentary on this basketball coach, would you guys like to do it? I'm like, are you serious? This is the guy who saw something in me and made it possible for me to come to school here, of course. So we did this documentary. And through that process, I did a lot of reflecting and realized like, this is where my life was changed in this, in this space. And then my son, who was, I think, a sophomore or junior at that point, I'm like, I want him to experience what even a taste of what I was able to experience in, in college, because we hadn't been pushing it on him at all. And as I'm finishing this documentary, I was like, no, if we can help him extend his childhood and be in a place where he's got professors and a community of friends that he's learning and growing with, we really want him to have that opportunity. And then I said, let's build a whole brand around this. And so we did that. And it was one of the biggest mistakes I think I've made in the past few years.

Okay, tell me more.

Brand is strong. It's beautiful. I worked with a very generous and talented guy, Scott Hohmann. A very amazing individual. Uh, we launched this brand. I launched 20 episodes of a podcast, uh, to help just build that market, what we were doing. But while we were doing that, like near the beginning of the launch, I was like, we were having cash flow issues. And here I am, I'm like launching this new brand. I've got Tell Studios, our main production brand, and then I've got Studio Sherpas. This is my, thought leadership brands. You know, I've got my podcast and mastermind and all of these, you know, digital courses and all this stuff. And here I am starting a whole other brand that was really very similar to Tell Studios but had a new name, had a very, very specific focus for the niche that we were going after in higher ed. But I was just like, oh my gosh, like, I've got to go back to the well. I've got to go back to the place where I know we can make money. As I'm like, you know, trying to build network relationships and land gigs with other higher ed institutions. It was kind of this like, Ryan, what are you doing? Like, if you— and I read so many books and listen to podcasts and all these, you know, different things. Niching down is one of the best things that you can do. But the way that we niched down at the time that we niched down, it wasn't a good time because we weren't cash healthy, cash positive. We just were not in a good spot for me to spread myself so thin to be working in 3 brands like, I mean, Christian, for me, I just realized, I'm like, who do I think I am that I can like, you know, just start a business and it's gonna be successful? So it was humbling. Uh, you know, if you go to our LinkedIn, it's still on LinkedIn, but I don't talk about it. I don't promote it. We don't push it. Um, cause, cause really I just said, I want to build my product, my main production business in a way that it could be sellable.. And in order to do that, I've gotta spend more time and energy building this thing out. I definitely see a space and a place for me in the world of higher ed, helping, serving, make, creating video content and, you know, being hired by universities and stuff. But I've really gotta get my main business in a spot where I'm very comfortable. We have more predictability and all that. So that's where, that's where I've been spending the last couple of years and it's a little humiliating to like, tell everybody, hey, we're doing this thing, and then to kind of go back and be like, you know what, that one wasn't actually smart, so we're gonna go back to what we know, uh, we can do.

Yeah, if you're not willing to be humiliated, entrepreneurship is not for you. Uh, but that's interesting. So have you done work with other universities since then? Hey listeners, are you ready to turn your passion into profit? Then grab a copy of Profit First for Creatives. Click the link in the show notes to purchase a copy. And if you're not ready to make that full commitment, you can download a free copy of the first chapter. Check it out right now.

Yeah. Yeah. Uh, we have, and, um, and it's been great. I think a little bit has come from my intentionality of like reaching out into that space. I mean, most recently, we're working with an association that works with colleges. And we're doing, you know, all the— I did a workshop with them a couple of weeks ago. So we're still in that space, which I'm thankful that we have stepped into that space. But to think of managing the social media in all the— in you know, continue the podcast and that brand. And then thinking about Tell Studios brand and the marketing that we need to do there. And then thinking about the Studio Sherpas brand. I'm like, what? I'm not— I don't have a staff of 10 people, right? I've got— I do have a staff, but, you know, I've got to grow slow. And yes, I'm a quick start. That's like one of my superpowers and also one of my greatest weaknesses. But I just realized in launching that, I'm like, okay, Ryan, like, hit the pause button. Let's go back and let's let's really build this thing out to where it can run without you. And we were there 2018. This business, that's when I launched Studio Sherpas, or no, maybe that's 2016. But I was in a much better place where I had a team surrounding me and our whole team, you know, and the way that we do business is completely different since COVID and all that. So yeah, definitely. So I think delegation is good.

So was COVID the reason why things changed that the business went from low touch to clunky?

Yeah, I think this year, I'm not one of those people that's going to blame like, oh yeah, it was because of COVID now business isn't great. And maybe it's because I'm like eternal optimist or whatever, but I just don't, if anything, I'm to blame. To say like back in 2016, '17, '18, '19, that I wasn't making strides to, to build a better business that could run without me and to create predictability, to create packages for corporations, for businesses that were just like, hey, package A, B, and C. Like these are the things that we always do that we do super well. My team knows what these are. We've got processes in place. We know how to sell them. We know who wants to buy them. If I would've done that back in 2016 when I read the book Built to Sell by John Warlow, then we'd be in a much different place today. So since COVID you know, we, our team got smaller, we got more efficient, and I learned a ton. But it's, you know, our normal clients that had been work we'd worked with for years, they weren't working with us. And so I think it's like, people have much greater access to be able to make their own videos now, you know, than pre— I don't wanna say pre-COVID, but as the years go by, the, the equipment, the gear gets better, it gets cheaper, it gets more powerful. And now we've got AI, so there's a lot more ability and people are just more willing to show up with video. So, but they don't wanna pay, you know, $20,000, which is what we were used to charging clients for the longest time. And we didn't create affordable packages because I was— I kind of had an ego and, uh, I'm like, well, we did $25,000 wedding film, so why am I going to do something that's less than $10,000? I, I said stuff like that and I, I, I wouldn't create packages that were less than $10,000. But this morning, you know, I find myself— I'm at the local Chamber of Commerce coffee networking thing where if you asked me 5 years ago, I'd said don't go to Chamber of Commerce, like, that's— you're not going to get the kind of business. And for me to find people that would spend $20,000 at a Chamber of Commerce was typically— it was a waste of my time and energy. But now that we have packages that start at— I don't want to say $500, but we do have some stuff that would cost $500. But $2,500 all day long, and your local real estate agent or insurance person can afford $2,500 if he or she knows that it's going to provide some results for them. So we're in a much better spot today, and I'm really gung-ho to build out more predictability, which I know what that means, and it's to create more price. I don't wanna say aggressive because these are, you know, $2,500 package for us is a very profitable project for us at the same time. So that's, that's how I'm spending my time these days.

Yeah. There's, wow. There, there's a lot to unpack there. I, I, I think, I think I want to go back to where you started with you perceived yourself spreading yourself too thin and taking on too much. I think entrepreneurs in general, and creatives probably worse, struggle with that itch. And it's, it's, uh, it's an itch that does not go away.

Yeah.

And I have seen over the course of my work as an entrepreneur this ebb and flow where things, things are going smoothly, cash is in the bank, not working a lot, and then you're like, Okay, now what? I'm, I'm bored. Um, right. And so you start looking at other things and you take your eye off the ball. You get distracted, you waste time, you waste money, you waste energy, and then your business suffers, right? And then you're like pulled back into it, right? Um, I, I think we have to acknowledge as entrepreneurs that we have to have a problem to solve. Like, that's, that's just who we are. And, and if our current business isn't, uh, giving us that challenge, yeah, um, it's a dangerous place. Um, I just recently— I, I joined my first mastermind, uh, uh, with, with Perry Marshall starting this year. And I was just in Chicago last week at, at my second roundtable meeting with about 20 entrepreneurs, very different businesses, very different stages, experience levels. It was, it's a pretty interesting group. And I did my presentation on what I thought I wanted to do, which was— please don't laugh at me. Too late. I was like, okay, the business is running smoothly and I've got all this time and I feel like if I start tinkering in the business, I'm actually going to be counterproductive. Because I've hired these people to do their job. And if I start going in there and tinkering, it's, it's going to mess them up. And what I want to do is I want to put together a bunch of accounting firms and roll them up. I don't want to buy them or run them, but I want to find the right ones, put them together. And oh, by the way, I think I want to buy a marketing agency because accountants are really awful marketers, and that could give me deal flow to find the right accounting firms to, to do in this roll-up. And, uh, Bob Regneris, uh, who's going to be a speaker, uh, one of our speakers at, um, the Creative Revolution that we're going to have in October, he He looked at me and he said, I had this visceral reaction when you said agency, because I actually drew it on the board. And he said, I got physically ill. And I'm like, okay, okay, maybe this isn't the path that I should go on, right? And the funny thing was, I'd been talking to my business coach about it, and I really had been trying to rationalize why to do it. Like, I'm like, this is not my passion. I really don't like other accountants. I don't, I don't really want to deal with them. Um, but I kept rationalizing why this was a good thing, right? And so when Bob said that, I'm like, okay, clearly I'm— this is not what I need to be doing. And thank God that I had the humility to say, okay, this is not, this is not the path to go down. And so I came back and I started over. But I guess what I'm saying is your story resonates with me because it's my life. And I think it's most of our listeners' lives. Like, that's just who we are.

Yeah, when in 2016, when the seed was planted for this, the Studio Sherpa's education brand, uh, my team at the same time said, Ryan, you have to stop booking projects. We're too busy. We're, you know, it's— we don't— it's crazy town. And all I'm thinking is like, I want to make more money. Like, this is working. Like, whatever I'm doing. So I said, okay, I'll, I'll just start this other business over here. This is all me. So anything I do over here, like, you know, you're gonna tell me to stop, like, nobody's gonna tell me to stop. I'm just gonna keep, you know, doing this thing until I don't have the bandwidth and, or come back to, you know, bounce back and forth between both businesses. And fortunately, like, I feel like it was the right timing for that education brand. Uh, whereas like, you know, with Enroll Films, our, our higher ed brands, like that was not the right timing for where, where I was at and what was required of me. But I saw last year, I saw Alex Hormozi on Instagram, you know, talk about every person, every millionaire typically has 7 different sources of income. And he's got 7 glasses and he starts taking a pitcher of water and filling up all these glasses. And he's like, you know, you think that, oh, you get— you start this business and it's going okay. So then you're going to start another business and then that one will go okay. Then you start an Airbnb thing and you make some money from all these different things. But if you didn't— and he's putting a little bit of water in all these things. He's like, most of the people that are millionaires have taken that first idea and, and he takes all this water until the cup is like overflowing, overflowing, overflowing. He's like, that's when it's time to start this next thing because you've got systems, processes, predictability, all the things in that one. You've figured it out. Not just like you've, you got lucky or you, you had some consistency, but no really rhyme or reason as to like how or why. And once that, you know, millionaire, figured that out, then they moved to the next one and they did that same thing until that one started overflowing. And then they, you know, they find a new team or, you know, have a new idea and then they do the next one. And that was a total game changer for me. It just made me think like, who am I to think I've got, you know, this isn't this one over here, I'm gonna start another one. And, and none of them are overflowing. Like they're, you know, providing a good income sometimes, most of the time, you know, whatever, but it's still roller coasters, no predictability.. And I'm like, what the heck am I doing? So that was a good wake-up call for me. And to actually say, okay, I'm gonna just hit pause on this thing. You know, I'm not ready to shut it down because the branding and all that stuff is so good. But just to get it out of sight, out of mind. That's what I had to do in order to really focus.

Yeah. And I think, again, when it starts When you start talking about systematizing and processes, most entrepreneurs are like, "Mm, I'm out." And managing people, that's another one that a lot of entrepreneurs just balk at. They don't want to learn how to be a leader or how to be a coach. They don't want to work on their skills. And they're like, "So I don't want to manage people." And I guess, you know, the business, I think this is a very true axiom that the business is going to grow to your limit. You made the comment earlier on, you said, you know, I'm the problem. And I think that if you're not achieving what success is for you in your business, that's the first answer is I'm the problem.

It's good.

Not, not the customers, the clients, the employees, the economy. It, you know, it's me. There may be external factors that contribute to it, or— but most likely what it is is my reaction to it. So, you know, I love the fact that You had a model where you charged, you know, 5 figures and you were successful with it, but you noticed that the market shifted. And so you came back and you didn't die on that hill of saying, well, no, we're only going to do this type of work. You shifted and you said, okay, this is what the market needs now and this is what the market will pay for, how can we make money on it? And you could have, had you not had the humility, for lack of a better term, you could have died on that hill. But, but, you know, your business did not stall at that point because you had the self-awareness to say, no, we can pivot here, we can modify what we're doing and, and continue forward. But It starts with you.

Yeah, yeah. I'm grateful I'm in a mastermind. I pay for coaching, and the people that are in the mastermind that I paid to be a member of, they want the best for me, and they're also not afraid to tell me the truth. Just like your guy was like, oh yeah, I want to vomit, Christian, right?

That's what he said.

All right. And so as I talk about what I want for my life and my business and all this stuff, to have people say like, well, like you might wanna think about your business differently then. If this, you know, if you want to do video production, if you want to have this agency, then maybe pursuing $20,000 projects and north of that, that maybe that's not the best way for predictability. Maybe there's, maybe there's another way. And so as you know, I'm pitching, uh, you know, I pitched an $800 video last week, uh, which is hilarious because I'm like, what, what, what are we thinking?

You're gonna get back to that $300 you first got paid, right?

Exactly. But, but back to my point, you know, I tell people all the time, like, why do you want to book a $100,000 job? Because when the six-figure jobs that we've booked, most of the time— not all the time, but most of the time— those require— there's way more stress involved, there's way more moving parts, lots more stuff can go wrong. Those projects last a lot longer. Our margin on a $10,000 job versus a $100,000 job is way higher. The percentage of money that we're keeping on a $10,000— in the, in the stress level is way lower. Like, we can totally jack up a $10,000 job. Um, I can't afford to mess up a $100,000 job. Like, I just— there, no mistakes can be made. And so when I got past that, so, so fortunately to have other people that could help me see what I wasn't seeing, because I wish I could take credit and just say, you know, I saw the writing on the wall. I'm, I'm seeing some writing on the wall, but to have people help me understand, like, dude, like, you, you should probably consider a different way, uh, to, to build this and to build predictability. And here we are. I feel like now that people are finding out that, oh, we have this $2,500 package, we have the $5,000, like, right, let's, let's have a conversation. Like, oh, Cool. And then in the meantime, you know, last week I booked a $19,000 job. Um, so that stuff can come, but I don't want to rely on the $20,000 gigs to carry us through.

Yeah. And I think back when I, I, I actually bought a franchise, uh, when I started my business that, yes, there were accounting franchises. And, uh, in my, my, uh, training, uh, the Speaker was telling us, he said, you know, you want cookie cutter. And he was talking about accounting, which, you know, we had a very specific thing that the franchise said you did and you didn't stray from that. And his comment was every time you try to stray from that, or add on to it, you're actually taking money out of your pocket. He said, you just want this. And, you know, that is a truth that still holds true. Like, you know, the, the, the secret to success in business is having what you're calling predictable, uh, predictable results. And if you keep trying to do a whole bunch of different things, it's real hard to make money at it. Yeah. I think one of the things creative entrepreneurs struggle with a lot, especially in the videography space, but even in the marketing space, is that predictability of income because It's project work, right? And so a lot of times it's like, well, I did this one thing, now I got to go get another. That's true. But if you've got a really good offering and a deep target market, you just need to build a marketing process and system around it because it's out there. The predictability is there. You just got to have the system in place where you're marketing and you've got lead generation and you got sales calls. And, you know, I mean, like, that's what's— it's not necessarily recurring revenue, but you've got a whole, a whole bunch of sales options.

Yeah.

Would you agree with that?

100%. Like, the, the most predictable that our business ever has been was when we did wedding films. And I wanted to pursue high-end luxury weddings. And so I knew I need to talk to all the photographers. I need to hang out with all the high-end photographers, all the high-end wedding planners, all the high-end venues. Uh, I knew that what, what our blog posts— this was back when blog posts were like, that, that was the thing. I knew what they needed to say and who they needed to appeal to. I knew, I just knew all of the things. So I knew exactly what we needed to do when it came to marketing. I could create something, we could create a trailer right after a wedding. I know that I would send it to the couple, send it to their family, the, the bridesmaids, groomsmen. And I just knew our, our views would skyrocket, it would get shared, and somebody from that party, somebody from that wedding would reach out within a week or two and say, hey, uh, we saw what you did, uh, we've got a wedding coming up, uh, or we're going to pass your name along. That just— it always happened. Then we transitioned in 2012, we start this corporate brand. I'm thinking I'm going to do the same thing that we did for wedding people, couples,. But then I was like, wait, shoot, what, what industry? Like, cuz small business is not an industry, right? Medium-sized businesses is not an industry. No. So it was, it was just like, you know, just another humiliating moment of like realizing like, I don't, are we going after law firms? No, we're not going after law firms. We're going after law firms and 8 real estate agents and manufacturing companies and, uh, robotics and marketing agents. You know, just like anybody who's got a pulse that everybody needs video. And then it's like, okay, we'll create some marketing content around that. Or what networking events do you go to to meet these people? And then I would go to events, but I'm just like kind of meeting everybody and anything I'm saying is just like, hey, we need, we do video. So if you need video and that doesn't hit like it does when you're hanging out with high-end, you know, luxury photographers, wedding coordinators, and you say like, oh yeah, those are our people. Like we just, you know, we just came back from, St. Bart's and just did this. Oh, wow. You went to St. Bart's? Oh, did you do it? Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay, cool. We're speaking the same language. It resonates. It makes sense. Step into, you know, corporate America and doing video for businesses, and I was just lost. And so I fell out of love with creating social content because I didn't know who I was talking to. And all of those years where if we would have picked a niche, oh my gosh, like things, if we would have picked a niche and then we would have come up with a very clear offer 'Hey, here's the video or the suite of videos that this niche needs.' Oh my gosh, dude, I mean, you and I would be on my private jet right now doing this podcast recording, and the moral of the story would be a lot different than it is today.

Yes, yes. And I, I would echo that as well. I spent 20-plus years by defining my target market really demographically of a certain business size. And I thought that I had a target market. And like, I resisted that definition of a niche. And I think, I think for most entrepreneurs, where that comes from is this fear that if I limit who I do business with, that somehow I'm going to limit my opportunities. When in reality, it's just the exact opposite. The more general you are, you're limiting your options because— and the people that do end up buying from you because you have not specialized in your solution or your market are more likely than not going to see you as a commodity. And it's going to suppress your price. So yeah, I think I— we defined a target market when I was 51, so after 30 years in business. So, you know, there are lessons to be learned. The quicker you learn them, the more successful, and happier you'll be. Hopefully you'll listen to Ryan and my experience.

That's right. So since, uh, defining your target market, would you say that— are you seeing results that like are positive results and like, yeah, this actually is working?

Yes, yes. It's not been as quick as I wanted, but that's because You know, like you were talking about with the wedding, um, shoots, you had to build up a reputation and a network effect with all of those. I mean, think about it. I mean, how— who's at weddings? People that are going to get married. I mean, they're, you know, there are other young people, right? And so, uh, you know it, it, it took us a while to figure out, okay, where do we need to be and what is the messaging that we're, we're going to do? And then what are the solutions we're going to offer, right? I mean, those are— and even, even there, like, so we, we have a, we have a, uh, A bunch of people— I don't say a bunch of people— we have a lot of people that come to us and they say, well, we want you to work inside our QuickBooks or Xero or whatever accounting software they, they have. And, uh, that's a non-starter for us operationally. It's, it's just, it's kind of like if someone shot a video and then brought to you— brought it to you and said, can you make this pretty? Right? Yeah, it takes more effort on our part to do it that way than for us to do it ourselves. So we've always just said no. And, but there's this like, well, why don't we develop a service offering where we do that? Like there's always that, because there's a market demand for it, right? And telling people no and saying no, is a critical skill to learn because as soon as you start saying yes outside of that, you know, narrow definition that you've been successful at, you just start drifting off. It doesn't take very much. Yeah, but that— it's compelling. I mean, it's, you know, Yes, I've been there.

I think I'm there right now. The coach that I've been working with on dialing in this new offer, he's like, okay, so we're going to dial in this offer and then you're going to sell it and you're going to keep selling it. You're not just, you know, you're not going to get like 7 nos and then you're going to create something new. We're going to just keep— because this is— this will sell. I'm like, okay, okay. I'm like, oh, create this. Actually, like, I know a good add-on and another way that in another market we can— he's okay, bro. Like, just stop. I know, I'm like, yeah, okay, this is my greatest strength and my greatest weakness.

Yes, yes. And I think that is also a great lesson to learn is that your strengths can be weaknesses. And for me, one of my characteristics is stubbornness or persistence, depending upon the context, right? And, you know, those things that help us be successful initially in business oftentimes end up being problems later on. And being able to say, okay, well, this characteristic served me well to get to here, but I'm going to have to set it aside in order to move forward. That's a challenge. And I've often said the last 8 years of the business that since I peaked, I lost all my passion. I left the business for a couple of years. And then got drawn back into it and said, I'm going to change the business fundamentally because I can't keep doing it the way I was doing it. Yeah, the last 8 years and all of the self-work that I had to do and all of the changes that I had to implement in, in people and in, in the business was harder than the startup. It was harder. And, and, you know, I understand where people reach a certain level of success in their business and they're like, you know what, I'm good, I'm not— I don't need to go any further. Yeah, um, because it's, it's work. It's not— I mean, some things are easier, uh, based upon your experience, and, and, you know, hopefully you've, you've, you've built up some cash reserve to— but But, you know, it's still work. And I think that to your point and your situation with the technology changes, I don't think standing pat is going to be much of an option for people anymore. Like, I don't— I think the days of getting to a certain level of financial success and operational success in a business and you just coast. I don't think that's reality anymore.

Yeah. Yeah. At least not in my world. And so I'm not getting ready to just hang out and ride the success of— it's really, I mean, with AI, anybody that's in the creative space at all, there's a lot more to this than just providing pixels or, you know, whatever. Like, we got to be helping our clients think differently and guiding them. And, uh, so being, being ready to pivot, it's like, I think it's currently the name of the game.

Yeah. And, and I, I think about all of these technological changes and tools, and, um, I, there, there's a lot to discuss on that, but I think the prevailing thing to me is that it makes everybody— everybody gets shiny object syndrome with new technology, right? And so I'm sitting there saying, well, oh, I don't need to hire a videographer because I can make my own content.

Yeah.

Okay. The example I use is 25 years ago, QuickBooks came onto the scene and built an entire multi-billion dollar business on the idea that you don't need an accountant, you need QuickBooks. And right, and in reality, I mean, I'm not saying that everybody that's just using QuickBooks by themselves is like pissing money away, but they're only using a fraction of what they could be doing with the software. And what they are doing, they're probably not doing it correctly. In other words, QuickBooks didn't make them a better— didn't make them an accountant. It didn't make them a bookkeeper. But they think so. And the same thing, I think, is with AI and all of the, you know, okay, now I'm a writer because ChatGPT can— no, you're not. You know, It's maddening.

Well, and ChatGPT says like, no, this is great, great job, Ryan, this is— this sounds amazing. It's like, wait, is it really amazing? Like, because I mean, okay, cool, yeah, it sounds good, feels good, thank you. I mean, you said so, ChatGPT, so I'm gonna publish this.

Yeah, I, I had— I, I've been wrestling with large language models for 2 years since they came out, and just trying to figure out how, like, what is this tool? Like, how can I use it, right? And, uh, another guy in my mastermind, uh, who this is all he does, um, he described it as, you know, think of it as an external hard drive that has all the information ever humanity ever curated, and it gives you additional processing speed. So, so if you think about your brain as a computer, it really, it really is just more horsepower for you. Yeah, right. But it doesn't think. It, it does not have the creative impetus. It does not know what to do. You still have to direct it. Right. And that, that was like, okay, that I, that's, that is an understanding that I can work with because I kept trying to figure out use cases like, okay, well, how do I solve this problem with AI or an LLM? And that's just the opposite way to go about it is you have the answer. Right? How can you use the tool to make you more efficient, right? 100%.

That's good.

Agree. Awkward pause. Is that plant alive?

Uh, man, I hope not. Is it moving? Because if it is, then I should probably get up and run out of here.

No, but it is not a living plant. It is a plastic plant.

As far as I know, yes, it is a plastic plant.

I love it.

I mean, I'm in a very closed, uh, little home studio currently, no windows.

Okay, so it wouldn't survive.

Yeah, probably not.

Tell me a little bit about Studio Sherpas, what you do there.

I currently am focused on helping filmmakers, video production business owners build more profitable businesses with more predictability. Uh, and again, it's like, wait, Ryan, you just were talking about, you know, you're trying to build predictability in your own business. Yes, but remember how like the, the cobbler doesn't, uh, have time to make shoes for his kids because he's so busy working with clients? So I know that all the things, I know what I'm supposed to be doing, so it's way easier and way more effective for me to tell other people what gaps they have in their businesses. But I do take my own medicine. I think that's how you say that.

Specifically— Cooking, whatever.

All of that stuff. I mean, I've hired a business coach. I'm in a mastermind so that I can have accountability in taking my own medicine, right? As the CEO, I don't have anybody else that's on equal ground as me in my business. And so to, to have somebody in, in, in 2017, 2018, 2019, I did. I had, I had a, an operations chief of operations person and I was accountable to that person, even though at the end of the day I was still the boss and, you know, could fire that person if I wanted to. But I just knew that as I wanted the business to grow, like I needed to have that accountability and I needed to be focused on our quarterly and our yearly goals. And now, you know, currently I don't have that role in my business, so I'm like, I've I gotta do something. You know what is more affordable than hiring a chief of operations person? Let me hire a coach. It's not cheap, but it's also way less expensive than a COO. And hey, here's my goals, this is where I want to get, so let's create a path to get there. And, uh, so I'm doing this stuff and I'm more excited about the direction that the production business is headed than I have been in a long time. Uh, and it's— it, it is a very exciting time for us. So anyway, the, the work inside of Studio Sherpas is essentially me taking all of the things that I'm learning, the, the failures that I've made in my own production business, the successes. You know, we've hit a million dollars multiple times in yearly annual revenue, and, and I make a good living in our production business. And so for me to take those things that have worked and to tell other people, teach other, show people, hey, here's what I've done, here's what I'm doing, uh, here's what I stopped doing, here's what I'm starting up again, Uh, that it's just been a fun outlet for me. And it's also like in, in some terms, some ways I'm learning alongside of the people that I'm teaching. Uh, so my podcast, the Grow Your Video Business Show, which you've been on, you've been to my events, uh, that work is super fun and fulfilling because it's not just an opportunity for me to get experts to come on and talk about different ways that we can grow our business, but I'm sitting there taking notes. I'm like, oh, this is really So selfishly, since I have my own production business, I'm able to take those things and apply those to my business and then help other people that are in a similar position for them to be able to grow too. And the most fulfilling part of that work is when people message me and say, hey, I booked my first, you know, $10,000. I booked a $60,000 job. Again, our mastermind just booked a $60,000. Couple in our mastermind just booked— or they pitched, I don't know if they've closed it or not, but a $300,000 deal with a client that they were ready to throw the towel in their business. And it's amazing to see what sticking to it and listening to advice and encouragement from the mastermind has led them to. So that work is so fun and fulfilling, way different than the fulfillment of delivering a video to a client. That can be fun and that can be fulfilling, but to actually work with people and help them create predictability, have financial successes, that's been pretty cool.

Yeah. I think that having somebody outside of yourself, a coach, therapist, I prefer coach, a peer group of some sort, a mastermind. You have to get outside of your own head. Yeah. And it's not just the business health, it's your own mental health, because I think entrepreneurship can be very lonely. It can be very isolating, and it can feel like a terribly dark place sometimes. And, uh, having those groups, those resources where you can get out of your own head is critical. I, I mean, like I said, even, even if you're just starting up and, and you don't have the money to pay for a coach or can't join a mastermind, you know, finding some like-minded entrepreneurs— they don't have to be in your industry, um, you know, but, but somebody that is can walk that journey with you and you can share experiences and share struggles and even wins. Because a lot of times it's hard to share your successes with non-entrepreneurs because they look at you funny. Yeah, I think it's critical.

Yes, it's been— I mean, the mastermind that I pay to be a part of, it's— you got all sorts of entrepreneurs from all different kinds of industries, a lot of authors, some coaches, agency owners, and to be able to get different perspectives, super duper helpful. And then even in the, you know, the mastermind that I lead that's currently all filmmakers, some might think like, well, aren't you, you know, you're all competition, you're all doing the same thing. Like even there, everybody's taking notes and everybody has like their own experience or insight. And there's things about that. It's like, it's really nice that we're all in the same industry. So fortunately for me, I'm, I've got my feet in a couple of different spots, one where it's all sorts of different kinds of businesses, and then another one where it's all the same kind of businesses. So I, I get to benefit and see the, the advantages of both of them. But I think to your point, get out of your own head. Don't just rely on something like a conversation with ChatGPT that will tell you exactly what you want to hear, but in a much more eloquent way. But find, Find people that want success for you and surround yourself. You know, community is so crucial for— I mean, really, for living a more fulfilled life, sharing, uh, struggles, frustrations, wins, all of that stuff. But finding other people, uh, that, that really want the best for you and that are going to speak truth and, and help you and figure out or just be a listening ear, right? That kind of therapy is something that we all need. And to take the time out and sometimes to invest money helps us to show up and helps us to actually do the work.

100%. If you don't pay for it, you don't value it. And that's one of the things that I learned as a coach is that You pay money to your coach, not for them, but for you. Because if you don't pay the money, your attitude about it is, is not the right attitude. Yep. Absolutely. We all need the Bob Regnerus in our world that will say, you, what you just said makes me want to vomit.

So, right.

Yes. How do people find more about Tell Studios and Studio Sherpas?

Well, we try to make it really easy. Tellstudios.com, studiosherpas.com, those two places. I'm on LinkedIn. That's where I post the most. Post the most. Ooh, there's a— so my last name is Corral, K-O-R-R-A-L. So not spelled like the other kind of coral, but sounds like coral. So Ryan Corral on LinkedIn. I do some more personal stuff on Instagram and whatnot. And then I do have, you know, I've got the Grow Your Video Business show if you're a filmmaker. That you, you should at least listen to a couple of episodes. Absolutely. The guests that I have are amazing. Sometimes I actually say some things that might allude to almost being amazing. But yeah, just that's a great place for filmmakers. And if you're curious about, you know, video production or anything, we've got a lot of stuff on our Tell Studios site and, and we We're continuing. I'm launching a cohort here very soon for business owners that know that they should be showing up on video that have 8 million excuses as to why they're not. And I'm trying to get help those business owners who believe in their mission to show up and to share my success and just being top of mind on LinkedIn and having people say, I mean, I ran into a guy on a cruise a few weeks ago over spring break. He's like, Ryan, And I was like, stop. I'm like, what? It was like the last night of this cruise. And, uh, it's this guy, I was like, he sort of looked familiar. He's like, he's like, hey, he's like, I got your email this morning. I was like, email? I'm like, oh, he's like, yeah, I'm on your list. And I had an email pre, you know, programmed to go out while we were on this thing. He's like, man, your content's great. And, uh, so my point is you don't have to be anything special. It doesn't matter. You definitely have competition that's showing up and that's probably gonna have stuff that's better than you. But what's most important is showing up and creating consistency. And the beautiful thing about video is it can live 24/7. So even if you fumble over your words or you don't love what you look like, I always tell people that your mission is more important than your mug. And in showing up on video, you can really create— begin to create connection with your ideal audience. And people tend to be very forgiving. We're not forgiving of ourselves, But when people see you showing up on video, they think to themselves like, wow, I don't have the courage to do that. The fact that she or he is doing that, that's pretty cool. And you're just one step closer to, to connecting with them or connecting with them on a deeper level. So anyway, I'm launching that cohort pretty soon, so you can follow me on LinkedIn and get more details on that stuff. But yeah, lots of exciting stuff going on. So find me anywhere. And I live in— I love it. Come hang out.

And it's beautiful up there. I have been.

It is, especially now.

Yeah. Yes. Yes. I don't know so much in January, but yes, this is a good time. Listeners, we'll have those links in the show notes. If you like what you've heard, please subscribe to the podcast, share the podcast, rate the podcast. If you don't like what you've heard, shoot us a message and tell us what you want to hear and we'll replace Ryan. Until then, ta-ta for now.

Ah, that's funny.