How Do Filmmakers Build Community in a Changing Industry? | George Ellzey Jr

Audiences now connect with people instead of brands. We've seen the shift, especially on social media, how companies are now having founders become more forward on their social media presence, or studios or execs are engaging in social media because audiences are, are scared. They are They're not trusting of established institutions anymore.

Welcome to another episode of The Profitable Creative, the only place on the interwebs where you will learn how to turn your passion into profit. I am your host, Christian Brim. Special shout out to our one listener in Delaware, Ohio. Oftentimes I see cities duplicated in other states. Never seen a state duplicate another state for a town. So congratulations, Delaware, Ohio, and thank you for listening. Uh, joining me today is George Elzy of Cottage Grove Productions. George, welcome to the show.

Thank you for having me, Christian.

Absolutely. So why don't you give the listeners a, a brief CV of what you do?

Sure. Um, so in a nutshell, I am a director and screenwriter. I recently graduated with my MFA in directing from DePaul University in 2023. Congratulations. And from the success of my thesis project called Cottage Grove, I founded a production company here in Chicago with my producers, and we are creating original content in the city, mostly my projects at this time, but eventually we will branch out into movies and televisions and web series. Um, so that's who I am.

Why the name Cottage Grove?

I have deep connections to the name. Um, it's based off a street here in Chicago. Okay. Um, I was raised in Chicago. Um, I went to school, high school, on Cottage Grove. So I went to all-boys Catholic high school called Hells Franciscan High School. RIP, it is no longer with us anymore. Um, but that street just has a special meaning to me. Like I said, I went to high school there, but then also my grandmother lived right across the street from my high school. Nice. And so I was learning, growing academically, but then I spent a lot of time with my grandmother after school, um, helping taking care of her when she was ill. And so funny enough, you know, 10+ years later, I returned back to that street with another real-life experience. So my MFA thesis film was based off a moment I had with my estranged father, who I had not seen post my parents' divorce. So I was like an infant. But prior to reconnecting in 2019, he wasn't in my life. And somehow or another, funny enough, through YouTube, because of one of my projects, his girlfriend found me and we reconnected. And so in 2021, he had a stroke and I picked him up from University of Chicago and took him to a Walgreens to get him some supplies. And it was the first time my dad and I spent time together in a confined space. And it was on Cottage Grove. It just had such a big impact on me and my identity and manhood that I named my film after it and my production company as well.

I love that. I love, I love that, you know, I, there are these things, these themes that weave through our lives, which The quote I had from Oswald Chambers was that life can only be understood looking backwards, but it has to be lived forwards. Yes, but, but being able to look back and see that, that theme that's woven through your life, I think is really important and, and the impact that it has on us. So I love that, that you have that that insight and that drive around it. So what kind of productions do you, do you focus on?

Yeah. So going to the name, although it's very specifically Chicago, one of my producers coined this slogan that all of our stories could happen right around the corner from where you live. I wrote the project to really show the beauty and challenges of the South Side of Chicago that I did not see in film and television. But with our projects, mostly again, my projects at the moment, it has a very specific location or identity to the works, but it has a universal themes that anyone from any place around the world can connect to. So Cottage Grove is about a son and father reconciling, or Another project that we had made previously called "Buzum" is about two sisters reconnecting after their mother dies on the South Side. So it has the specificity of a location, but again, I think it's— the beauty of our work is that anyone can come to it.

I love that. It's actually a theme I just finished writing my novella.

Oh, congratulations!

Thank you. Uh, I, I'm in the process of selecting editors. Um, originally— okay, I'll give you the background on this story so you understand the context. So, um, I'm Choctaw, my wife is Choctaw. I grew up in Oklahoma, uh, not really identifying as Choctaw. As a matter of fact, in my family they would do a survey every year at school asking if you had Native family, because I guess the government got funding for it. But I remember asking my dad, you know, aren't we Indian? And he's like, no, we don't. We don't know. We don't do that. And so, like, there was this strange disconnect from that part of my heritage. I got hired as a professional witness in tribal court in Mississippi, which is where the Choctaw are originally from. And so I go there and I go to their tribal court in their facility on their reservation in Mississippi. And I'm like, huh, I didn't even know, guys, you guys were still here. Like, I thought all of you all got moved to Oklahoma. And that's, you know, I knew the Choctaw tribe in Oklahoma, but I didn't know there was a Choctaw tribe of Mississippi. And it planted the seed. I'm like, I wonder how that happened. Like, because I really didn't know any of the history, right?

Unfortunately.

Fast forward many years, and I'm talking to a local producer, film producer, who had put together a screenplay for a period film set in the Civil War. And we're kind of chatting, and I'm like, he was potentially doing some work with some of the tribal film departments here in Oklahoma. And it prompted this thought. I'm like, You know, I, I had this experience about the Choctaw that stayed in Mississippi, and I have this idea that they were like, fuck the feds, and they were hiding in the hills, and they were like these rebels, right? Okay, didn't want to get relocated. And I'm like, I think that'd be an interesting story to tell, right? And we— so we just talked about it. I'm like, so then I am like, well, maybe I should write a screenplay. And so I went and I did research on the relocation of the Choctaw tribe. And it wasn't what I thought. Unfortunately, it wasn't, you know, Rebels in the Hills, but it was a fascinating story. And I was looking around and I'm like, there's no film that has been produced about the Trail of Tears or set in the Trail of Tears. There's lots of documentaries on it, but there's no— there's no story. And so as I start to write this screenplay, I'm like, this shit is hard. I don't— I don't know how to do this. So then I was like, well, maybe I'll just write a novel. And then as I start writing it, I'm like, we'll go with a novella. And it took me 2 years to get that done. But I don't know really where I was going with this, except— oh, I know. Okay, so I've set the stage for this. What I was connecting to Cottage Grove and the stories you were talking about is that one of the themes in this novella is what is your identity? And really your identity, we usually identify strongly with where we were raised and who, you know, that impacts us. But that the reality is it is the people that we're, you know, the people are more important than the place, although the place is what we identify with.

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

So I guess I say all that to say, does that resonate with you with what you do?

Oh, yeah. I mean, given the current landscape of film and television, how everything is shifting, audiences now connect with people instead of brands. We've seen the shift, especially on social media, how companies are now having founders become more forward on their social media presence, or studios or execs are engaging in social media because audiences are scared. They are— they're not trusting of established institutions anymore. And so what I am focusing on with my own projects and my team is like, how can we lean into our identity to foster community with our audience? Because if you can do that, have a very loyal client base or community that is behind a project for film or for business, any business aspect, I think that's where the return comes from. People invest in other people, not necessarily products. And that's what I've just been working with my team is like, how do we, how do we navigate this new landscape of film and television? Because with streaming services changing, film festivals not being a viable source anymore, and now the creators are really having the power to create revenue, how will we distinguish ourselves from other people?

Hey, listeners, are you ready to turn your passion into profit? Then grab a copy of Profit First for Creatives. Click the link in the show notes to purchase a copy. And if you're not ready to make that full commitment, you can download a free copy of the first chapter. Check it out right now. Yes, it also— that resonates with me around this theme that I've been working on. And I'm sorry if you're listening to this episode and I'm talking about this subject again because it seems like I've gone back to it the last several episodes. Is this idea that now that content production, whether it's audio, written word, video, sure, the cost has been driven down to essentially zero. I'm not gonna— right, um, anybody can create anything they want. There's this, uh, a tremendous amount of crap out there And the, the need for a human curation of that content to say, yes, it's worth my trust, it's worth my time, it's worth my money to watch or read or listen to them. That's the piece that I think is missing. Like, and that sounds very similar to what, what you're trying to do there is that you're— you may be producing the content, but it's specifically curated around a specific community.

That's true. Going back to specificity of story, that's where you build audience. Like, when I created Cottage Grove, I knew when I was writing it, I— the first page I dedicated to brown and Black boys who need their dads. Mm-hmm. And so that was my thesis going into making that short. And it's also stuck with us when we went into post-production and marketing. Now, what I found was through that specificity of the story, the theme rang out truer. So even though I was writing for Black boys and brown boys for their dads, I've had, you know, white older men come to me crying about the story. Latin men, Asian men, and even women talking about their parents' relationship. And so I realized, like, okay, that is the key. How can each project that we make from Cottage Grove Productions be hyper-specific, but really allows for that universal theme to come out?

Yeah, because you can, you can dissect that a lot of different ways. It's a very interesting, uh, thing that's coming up to me that right now is that the hero in my book is an orphan. And I find that very odd having this conversation with you.

Okay.

You know, that there's like, oh, okay, looking different. Yeah, right. Um, But one of the things he struggles with is like, what is a man, right? And, you know, like, that's a whole separate thing. You know, that's a component. But it's also like, you can explore the— how does the lack of a father impact a daughter? Because that's a completely different impact, right? Same in some ways, but like, Yeah. So curating and focusing on that, you've got, you know, a plethora of options.

Very much so. And I think it's going back to just like, for any business models, like, what is your impact for your audience? Like, how do you want to change their lives? With this product, with this movie, with the services you're offering. And that's what I, we have been trying to figure out. Like we are a relatively new company. Like I said, we started in 2024 mainly out of just like, we had so much momentum with this short film and realizing that post-strike, —writer's strike, that the industry was not the same. And those pipelines for exposure and the next step up in the career wasn't happening. So we really thought like, okay, how are we going to move our careers forward as a team? Well, we have to rely on community. And what we found is like if we make community impact or stories that have community impact, then audience members will follow us more diligently and more loyally than just going to a film festival or just putting something out on a streaming platform. It's somewhat similar to like the early 2000s indie boom, both music and for film. They really had a grassroots movement. That galvanized people to break new actors and directors and screenwriters. But through, you know, the 2000s and 2010s with the integration of streaming, we lost that. But now we're getting back to that again. But it's more of a Wild West with the integration of social media.

Yeah. And that, that kind of is a nice segue into the, the business conversation because we've talked about the passion. Part. Yeah, sure, we got that. So then like, okay, how do we make this a business and how do we make money on it? And it sounds like you're still working through that. And I think here's the reality. I think all the businesses, whether they're creative industries or not, are experiencing some of that shift, right? Like, it's a question we as entrepreneurs all have to ask. And I think you nailed it with your initial question, what's the impact you make? Um, I, I phrase that, uh, as what problem do you solve? Now, entertainment is an interesting thing because, you know, it, it, most people wouldn't look at entertainment and say you're solving a problem, um, but you, you foundationally are, right?

Yes, we're building community. In—

well, yes, but just think about it like, why do people go to the theater and watch a movie, right? Like, what is it that they're getting from that that they'll trade their dollars for it? Um, and, and that, you know, that is foundationally not what you are, right? Like, you're not, you're not looking to be in theaters on a thousand screens, um, because that's not I mean, it may evolve into that. Yes. That's not what you're— that's not the problem you're trying to solve. So if I were to phrase that question that way, what problem are you solving?

That is a great question.

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Our team is focused on creating cinematic experiences that you don't receive at a traditional theater. Meaning having smaller gatherings or small, smaller local screenings for our film, but making an experience and incorporating dinners with our movies if it ties in with the themes, having not therapy sessions, but like body exercises that go with it. Because I think audiences are tired of the same old, same old. They go to the theater and they pay like $30, maybe $40 if you can count parking and concessions and stuff like that. What is the return on it? And that's what we're trying to think of, like how— what is the return of experience for an audience member? Not just like seeing the movie, but what are they getting from it? So are they getting a dinner? Are they getting community from this? Are they learning something about themselves that they didn't know prior to? I think that is the new wave that filmmakers should lean into. Yeah.

Yeah, I think one of the things, you know, people— I don't know so much in cinematography, but a lot of creatives, designers, marketers, videographers are like, uh, terrified of AI. And, and, you know, I can understand what, what their fear is, but, but I, I think really what you hit on is the empowerment of the technology, is, is that it allows us to do things that we couldn't do before, not not necessarily replace us, but I guess what also came to mind, and I'm gonna try and tie these two things together, was Angel Studios, okay? Yes. And, you know, I don't know a lot about them, but I have observed, and I'm like, this is very interesting, because they tapped into a community, uh, uh, I would say primarily Judeo-Christian, uh, watchers, and they gave them content that they wanted, right? So it's a very big and broad community, right? But I'm sure they didn't start there, like trying to, to make The Chosen, or, you know, a, a— that's not where they started. Right, right. But, but this, this idea that— oh, I know, I, I— this is how I was going to tie it in. What, what you're creating with what you're describing is something that AI can't touch, and, and it's, it's an experience, right? Uh, the experiential economy is 100% insulated from AI. Because you can't replicate it. And so I think leaning into that absolutely makes sense. I think very much so.

Audiences are hungry for in-person connection. We see the rise of— since like 20— what was it? 2007, like the rise of vinyl again. And it really started bolstering again in 2014, 2013, really. People want to experience things together in more customized spaces. So like in Chicago, they have vinyl listening parties and it's hard to get a ticket to go to those experiences now because they realize, yes, you can listen to music by yourself, but how can you share that with one another and how that births community post-COVID? Our society has been like destructured and, um, fractured, if you will. And I don't think the same practices of breaking a movie of like a press junket and sending it straight to like AMC+ is going to work anymore, right?

Well, it'll serve a certain niche, but, but, but what you're— you've identified is that that is not the trend. That's not where— right, I mean, there's always going to be people that want to Sorry. There's always going to be people that want to go see a Marvel movie, right? Like, sure, I want, I want to do that. That's that. But that's not the itch you're scratching.

But it won't present, it won't break new voices. Like, we'll get another Marvel movie from like Safdie Brothers or, you know, Ryan Coogler, which is great. But early 2000s where we had Sundance or Tribeca or South by Southwest, was a really, you know, leveling playing field for filmmakers to present new work and to get attention. Now, that's not the case. Unless you go through a lab or you have an industry connection to, you know, rally that into your next project, you're not getting exposure. So instead of chasing after these antiquated models, Yes. We're doing something that most studios are trying to do, is like get butts in seats, building audiences, getting ticket sales. And if we can do it on a smaller scale and do it consistently, then we don't have to rely on, let's say, Paramount or, you know, Warner Brothers to hand us something. We can go into a deal potentially, I'm just speaking hypothetically, with partnership and statistics that show, oh, we have done this, you know, over a year with these small experiences and there's a viable audience for it, as opposed to just like, here's a script, let's put A-list talent in there to make this project. It becomes very cyclical. And that's not what I'm interested as a business owner, as a creative.

Yeah, because those, those institutions were developed around, like you said, an old model and they're hard to kill, right? I mean, and there's a lot of momentum behind them, but I equate them— people are going to say I'm crazy for this— a lot, a lot of these, these models in the content space, and I would even throw YouTube and Facebook and these mega platforms in there is that they're, you know, Facebook is what, 20 years old? Like, it's an old model, right? Yeah. And they, they have not adapted well. But the, the, the, the replacement hasn't really shown itself yet. And I'm not saying that it's a replacement that is a new Facebook. I'm talking about the replacement is something entirely different. And I would put— I would equate that to Kodak was— Yes. Is the best story, right? Like they made money for a long time selling film. And when digital came, they were not able. It's not that they didn't know that it was new and that, you know, they attempted to move into that space. But what— what— what— why they failed is because they made so much money off of the film production, you know, manufacturing the film, they couldn't let it go. No. And I think that's what, you know, these legacy industry models are going to be stuck with. You know, they can't— there's a reason why Netflix is trying to, you know, merge. There's a reason why Amazon bought MGM. It's because those models are now on the decline. Yes. And that's why they're merging. That's why they're— because they understand that they can't grow it organically anymore.

Very much so. And that's why even with those deals, they're still fighting for theater runs. But I feel like they're still missing a gap on that. Yes, we still— I still love going to the movie theater. But it has to— that experience has to change.

Um, yes, yes. And Netflix, Netflix saying, well, we're going to change the model of how, you know, how we release films, you know, and all this and that. And I'm like, no, you, you guys are still stuck there. Like, you're, you're still stuck in the old model. And it's, it's hard sometimes to look at these megaliths of, of companies that make all these hundreds of millions of dollars and say, oh, that's a— that's on decline. But, but that, that is the reality, I, as I see it.

Yeah, I, and that's where I think the market has allowed for content creators, independent filmmakers to really push through on our own. And using TikTok, using Instagram, using, you know, going back to like analog ways of like communicating with people, you know, I, um I was recently at a screening for an event, and I got, like, a handwritten invitation to it. And that just sparked such joy in me that I wanted to go to that event in the middle of a Chicago snowstorm. I found my way there. And again, it goes back to that personal touch of just, like, this film or this project is specifically for you. And you're invited to it. And I think one thing that we've been trying to— well, we've been applying into our own work is like we have to invite our audiences into the work, into each film. It's not enough just to publicize it. What is that invitation to our audience?

Yeah. And there's a lot of different ways that you could do that. You talked about, you know, events around the event. So a dinner, a group session of some kind. But it didn't have to be coincidental to the thing. It could become a series. It could be, you know, and it— I mean, like, the ideas are limitless, but it starts with not being focused on the old model.

Yeah. And then just being consistent with it. Like, we are not— since we are early on in our stages, we're not doing a lot. Christian Brim, we're like, what we do very well is like, we make stories that are for Black and brown, specifically our Black community on the South Side of Chicago. And we are going to screen them on the South Side of Chicago and consistently do that. And what we found, our numbers have been raising of attendances. We've built community trust. Good word of mouth press from that, as opposed to trying to like, all right, we're going to screen everywhere around the city. That's not feasible. That's not sustainable. Um, well, it's not the problem you're trying to solve.

Like, and not— yeah, but the people, the people on the North Shore don't give a shit. I mean, like, why would they go see it, right?

But that's like the pool for, I guess, trying to be everything to everyone but nothing to no one. Yes. And it's like, that's We're not— that is, that's a very common resources for it, you know.

That's a very common allure of, of trying to be everything to everyone regardless of your business, but that's a recipe for disaster. Um, you become nothing for no one eventually, you know.

And I mean, um, shout out to my buddy Armand. Like, that's— we've been having several conversations about that. Specifically with his series Filmmaker Fridays. Like, he has it once a month for filmmakers at one location.

You need to get— I've been offering to come up there. I may just have to show up. I've offered to do a presentation or a speech. I don't know. I don't know the format. I don't know. But I guess I'm just gonna have to come up and experience it. And maybe then— Because here's what it is for me and switching it to our business model. We have targeted as our target customer the creative professional, right? Well, what we know about the creative professional is that you have to be present to be relevant. Like, you, you can't use the traditional, uh, models of marketing to reach people like you. Yes, right. I, I can't, you know, do Facebook ads or YouTube ads or, you know, the— it's, it's very heavily community driven. Yes. And, and so, you know, that, that, that's, that's an example of doing exactly what you're doing, only in a different space.

That specificity again is like, I'm trying to get my uncle to come see my movies, and using him as a profile, it's like, well, how does he receive information, or what is that invitation to him? Well, he reads the local paper from the South Side. Well, we need to be heavily integrated in that paper or have a, you know, presence in the community to do that. So it's just like understanding who your customers are, so whatever those are, and then attacking ways of getting them to your place. Yeah.

Yes. I mean, that, that's the thing, is there's the, the marketing landscape has shifted foundationally. Oh yeah. Um, you know, it did 25 years ago with the advent of the internet, and it's changed again now with LLMs, but the principles don't change. It's who's your target customer, what's your messaging, and what are your channels, where are they? And that will not, cannot change.

No, it won't change. So I used to work in marketing for Broadway in Chicago post-undergrad, and we would often break new Broadway shows they went to New York. And it was always a case study around like, how do we bring Black audiences to come see this Black show downtown? And a large part of it was just like knowing the historical element of the city, the current state of those neighborhoods and those demographics and what reaches them. And as opposed to what you think is the method. So we can't say the show, but they have this marketing plan and they ask my opinion, like, what do you think of this, George? I'm like, well, that's not going to happen. Where are you advertising? Oh, we're doing buses and trains. I'm like, okay, yeah, they'll watch it, but they won't rely on that messaging. You have to go to their community centers. You have to go to their churches and religious organizations. You have to go to the schools. You have to go to the liquor stores and grocery stores to get the messaging out there. Um, but that information comes from actually being in that neighborhood or specific— wherever your customer is, you have to be on the ground with them.

And I'm guessing they didn't listen to your advice.

They do not.

And that show did not do well. Right. And that's— here's the reality. As business owners, we have a real bad habit of turning inwards. You're still new and you're hyperfocused. Yes. And so maybe you won't get to this point, but if you're in business long enough, It's real easy to ignore the customer. I mean, and it's not intentional. It's not like we don't care about the customer or we're not trying to take care of the customer. It's that we get inward focused on how we're doing things and what we're delivering and the mechanics of running a business. And you just lose sight of, well, what does the customer think? What's their perspective? What's in their head? I think it was Jeff Bezos that famously had an empty chair at all of their board meetings or all of their team meetings, and it was for the customer. And that was just to remind them of like, okay, what does the customer think? We all have our opinions, but what does the customer think? Yes, they had, they had the benefit of having a potential target customer, uh, involved in their marketing plan, and what did they do? They ignored— they didn't listen to you. That just seems stupid to me.

Well, it happens more than, you know— yeah, it happens a lot. Um, but I think at least for where my mind is and what I see 5 or 10 years from now for our our production company and staying here in Chicago, it's like we have to stay on the ground. If we're in, you know, we right now, the team and I, we meet virtually and we meet at like small, you know, work sharing spaces and on the South Side. It's like if we starting on the South Side and work share spaces, then we have to continue being in those spaces to keep in touch with our customer.

Yeah. Yeah. How do people find out more about what you're doing at Cottage Grove?

Yeah, so they can go to our website, which is cottagegroveproductions.com, or all social media platforms. I am hyper involved on social media. I'm not— I prefer not to be on social media, but we are in the space where you have to be. You have to be forward. Again, to build the trust with the audience. So on all platforms, on the website, and yeah, they can reach out, DM us, leave us a comment.

Perfect. Listeners will have those links in the show notes. If you like what you've heard, please rate the podcast, share the podcast, subscribe to the podcast. If you don't like what you've heard, shoot us a message, tell us what you want to hear, and I'll get rid of George. Until then, ta-ta for now.