Should Entrepreneurs Scale Their Business Forever? | Michael Keenan

What we solve is helping the client create that scaled program, but keeping everything on brand, right? Like, it doesn't sound like it just got spat out of ChatGPT. It doesn't sound like it was passed through a low-quality writer. And that's, that's the problem that we are solving at the moment.

Welcome to another episode of The Profitable Creative, the only place on the interwebs where you will learn how to turn your passion Into Profit. I am your host, Christian Brim. Special shout out to our one listener in Lehigh, Utah. Been many towns in Utah. It's a big state. I don't remember Lehigh, but thank you for listening. Joining me today, Michael Keenan of Peak Content. Michael, welcome to the show.

Hey, Christian. Thanks for having me. I'm super excited to be here.

Absolutely. So what is Peak Content?

So what is Peak Content? It's actually an interesting time to be running, like, managing Peak Content right now. I am the founder and we have a team of about 50 freelancers at the moment. Okay. And we manage editorial content for software companies. And so if, you know, if any of our listeners here have been on LinkedIn or if they're in content in any way, shape, or form or search engine optimization, they'll know that the industry has been very complicated since the onset of AI, right? And we've been facing a lot of challenges. But one thing that, you know, for me, that's always been kind of a theme that's carried through my years of being an entrepreneur has been adaptability. So we've been taking the past 2 years really to adapt to the new landscape. And yeah, we're still rolling. So still happy to be involved.

Yeah, the sands are shifting. That's for sure. I described it to somebody else. Yeah, somebody on my team is like the fog of war. We know explosions are happening, but we're really not clear who's shooting at who and who's surviving or not. It's a wild time to be alive for sure. So how did you get into content?

Yeah. And I do want to say, one thing that I would like to stop seeing since we brought up the people firing at each other is I would love to stop seeing SEOs and agency owners fighting with each other on LinkedIn because no one really knows what they're doing just yet. We're all figuring it out. So everyone hang tight. But yes, how I— everyone, all of a sudden everyone was friends and now everyone hates each other and they're fighting for to see who sounds the best on LinkedIn. LinkedIn to get more clients. But anywho, um, how I got, how I got to the agency today was actually, it may have been 10, 11 years now. Um, I kind of, growing up, I was always a little like rebellious in the sense of, not like I was getting arrested and things like that, but more I was cutting—

you should have been arrested.

I probably should have been arrested. Okay, you know, I won't, I won't say these things publicly, um, because the statute of limitations has run.

No, That's fine. Statue's around.

Thank you. Um, but I, for example, like, I would cut out of school to go to work. Um, so I guess that is something illegal for the employer, not for me. Um, but, you know, I worked off the books and stuff like that since I was about 12. Um, and so I always had a passion and kind of the drive to make money for myself. Um, and so I did the standard, right? Like, I went to high school, I went to college, university, um, in Albany, New York. And I was living in, I worked in service industry for a long time. And then a friend of mine that I was living in Portland, we were talking and I was like, I just don't wanna work a job anymore. You know, like I wanna do something for myself. I wanna be in control of my time and my money, which the being in control of time thing was, that took a long time to get used to being on your own because you realize that time, like things drag you, you know. And I started, um, he recommended me going on Upwork actually, um, and just, and I was like, well, what am I good at? And he was like, I don't know, you should figure it out. So I did like some customer service work, I did like freelance stuff, I did like freelance writing. I was making $25 an article, um, and it kind of took off from there. It started writing these $25 articles. I would be, I would be traveling in a van, sitting in a bar, paying $5 for a beer when the good times were, and typing out these articles for a couple hours. And I'd probably drink as many beers as the article would earn me, but I was in control of my time. So it was exciting, you know. And the story kind of takes itself from there. So I was in my van for like only 6 months, and then I got a good gig working out of New York. So I went home, I'm from New York originally, and I was getting paid like $35 an hour, I think. So that was like a big, big amount of money at the time too, the most that I was earning at that point. And that, it's a week, it depends on how deep you want to go because that, that was from there it took off. That's kind of where I learned SEO. That's where I learned how to, you know, like write strategic content that earns sales. And it's kind of snowballed into freelance writing, into this, uh, agency that, that is growing faster than I was expecting it to.

Yeah, yeah, content. Wow, I have a lot of thoughts on, on content. I mean, I started— well, I mean, I started marketing before digital was a thing, you know, before content marketing was a thing. And of course, then the advent of SEO and are you writing content for humans or are you writing it for the bots and how do you marry those two things? And now the whole LLM, uh, search layer that is, you know, further, further modifying it. And, you know, I, I guess you call that technical writing because like when I'm writing like a Substack post or something like that, I, I'm not thinking about discoverability, right? I'm just of like writing what I think and trying to make it as good as I can for the, the human. Um, what, what, what is your take on that as far as content for humans, content for machines?

Yeah, so kind of the premise of my— the agency itself was built around both, right? So writing content that's good enough so humans enjoy reading it and they act on it. Because in the space that I'm in, which I mean, most people, like everyone in business, right? Like we're trying to get actions from these content, like from the content. And so the premise of the agency was built was kind of like as a, all these like mecca agencies out there, these like massive, massive ones that have 100+ staff and work with other vendors and everything. I had noticed in the market that they were producing kind of like what I would not, what I would consider not great content. Like it was just for machines, it was just for SEOs, just so they could keep adding more and more blog posts to this company blog every day. And so when I created Peak Content, it was based on the premise of like, well, we're going to actually invest more in the writers and the editors and less in like account executives and like paying, paying, you know, like senior managers and everything to, to manage content when we can kind of just build a more lean system and focus more on the quality of writing. And that's, that's been my— and the thing is, is the writing— good human writing still gets picked up by search. So it's just the space right now is getting more difficult because a lot like brand reputation goes into it. And there's a lot of more signals coming out from like LinkedIn. And other social platforms that are contributing to if you get found in AI search. But again, we're adapting with the times. But so my premise is like, I'm always writing for the human first, but we do have to add kind of like the technical indicators and the things that need to be done so it is optimized for like an AI search engine or Google, which maybe Google is an AI search engine now, basically. But so that's kind of my take on it. And I do stand by that. And we're not finding that clients want anything different. They still want good content. Even if the content is placed not only on search, maybe they're using it more strategically throughout their newsletters and sharing it on social media, which are things that have been true in content for 10 years, Rao, right? Like write something and distribute it.

Yeah, I just had this strange flashback, uh, back when I started optimizing for SEO, and I remember like having to physically underline, uh, the, the word in, in the article.

Uh, yeah, obviously bolding, underlining.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, and it always just felt like this just does not seem right. It doesn't flow like— yeah. So that, that I think that's a, an art in and of itself is being able to combine those two things for sure. So, um, you said that you've been doing this as an agency for a couple of years, correct? Yeah. Okay, so, uh, what, what would you say your biggest lesson in the last two years— like, if you're going to go back and tell your to your younger self, hey, watch out for this, uh, this is, this is going to be something you need to know, what, what would it be?

So what I would say is, and I was just, I'm reading a book about Shintoism and I found this saying in there, and I'm not going to get it word for word right because my memory doesn't serve me that strong, but it's the one thing I would say is like, be be a stone, a wet stone amongst the waves of chaos, right? So being able to stay like present and calm and aware of the things that are going on, because what I've learned was, and it doesn't matter whether I was freelancing or I was subcontracting as a freelancer, which is like led into agency life, or even running the agency, is you can't predict everything and shit's always going to happen and you just have to be there and be ready to, to solve the problems and get your hands dirty and make decisions on the spot. And so like that idea of, right, the stone and there's always waves like crashing around it, you just gotta be a whetstone and chill, you know, and enjoy it and enjoy the road because I think a lot of these like problems that arise and they could be like a client communication issue or something even like more minuscule, like an article, something went wrong in one particular article. Just fix the problem, own up to it, and find the solution moving forward. I've always found that that helps keep face and also holds you accountable for, for your own actions. Because at the end of the day, when you're running your business, even if someone else makes the mistake down the chain, you're at the end of the day the face of it and responsible for it.

Yeah, that's probably one of the hardest lessons I, I had to learn as an entrepreneur was being— was getting comfortable with others' mistakes that, that, you know, I had delegated and then having to own the outcome regardless. That's a hard thing for a lot of entrepreneurs to get past because they have a skill and they're good at it, and then they reach their limit of what they can do. And so they realize they've got to get something off their plate. But if we sit there and micromanage it and quality control it, you can call it whatever you want, but like you're still in the equation, then you really haven't solved the problem. You're still the bottleneck, right? So, so being able to just hand that over and own the outcome regardless, that's— that was a tough lesson for me. Hey, listeners, are you ready to turn your passion into profit? Then grab a copy of Profit First for Creatives. Click the link in the show notes to purchase a copy. And if you're not ready to make that full commitment, you can download a free copy of the first chapter. Check it out right now.

Yeah. And, you know, Christian, I've been— that's something that I learned too. And I always learn, like, what I've— one of the things that I always stand by too is bringing good people with you wherever you go. I've been working with some of the same people for 8, 9 years now in different capacities, in the best capacities that work best for them. But I'm always bringing the best people along with me and vice versa, you know, like, they're like, I bring them with me, but they'll bring me with them to other places too. If they, if a client may need an agency, you know, or there's like an investment possibility, you know, and they think of me as an option, like to, as an investor. It just being kind, right? And like, and focusing on and bringing those people with you that you trust. Because you also learn, I mean, it's the same thing in life and friends and stuff like that. But people aren't always trustworthy. So if you can find someone that you have that relationship with, where you both trust each other, you'll take this, you'll go down on the ship together. All right, I'll play the violin as someone I used to play, by the way. But I'll play the violin as we're going down together. Those are the kind of people that you want on your team when you're growing a business or not always growing if you just like your business. And I don't think growth inevitable. I don't think endless growth is always the answer, but in your business practice, however that may be.

No, I agree. I mean, growth for growth's sake usually ends up not where you want to be. You usually end up working harder and making less when you just try to grow. That's, that's for sure. So who is your ideal customer? You said you worked with software. What, what, what specifically? Like if you're, if you're going to pitch me on who your ideal client is, who is it?

Yeah. So my ideal client is a big-ass company. I'll leave it there with that. And they already have internal processes and marketing teams. And they come and we come in as a support to existing programs. So we do have strategists within our teams, but we're coming in less strategically and more for scale to help these clients scale. So they're ambitious. They're not startups because I just— I, in my experience, like working with startups has always been challenging. So I'm much more comfortable coming into a place that already understands what they want. They just need the support to get there. And they know that content is like an actual business asset and not just like we're doing it because we have to do it. You know, there's a reason behind why they're scaling a content program. And so yeah, so that's my ideal client. Real product, strong marketing team, and a need for scale.

So the, the follow-up question to that is, what problem do you solve? You, you kind of implied it there, but what if you were going to say in, in your clients' customers' uh, words, what problem do you solve?

Yeah, so in a program that's scaled where you're producing, you're probably, you could be publishing 100, 150, 200 pieces of content a month. There are so many moving parts as you could imagine, editors, fact-checkers, QA, product insights, SMEs, internal house, right? Like all of their staff that's managing the program. And it's hard to produce according to the brand's guidelines, just to keep it, you know, as big, like their style, their guidelines. The messages that they want to put out there. Those things are hard to scale. So we have our systems in place and we work again, like I still invest the same amount of money in writers as when we start. And that's something that we agree on is like having good writers that we don't, we don't outsource. We don't go find the cheapest writers just so we can take more profit. It's actually like the opposite. Like I will sacrifice the profit to the profit margin to find better writers so the agency can support and look better to, to the client. And so did I answer the question? So yeah, so it's like creating that— this— what, what we solve is helping the client create that scaled program, but keeping everything on brand, right? Like it doesn't sound like it just got spat out of ChatGPT. It doesn't sound like it was passed through a low-quality writer. And That's, that's the problem that we are solving at the moment.

So these companies internally have a team of writers already, but they, they don't want to bring on more staff to scale for a period of time. Is that accurate?

I don't— I can't speak to anybody's— I can't speak to any client's position on their headcount and how they choose to manage that, but They're coming, they have content, they have editorial teams internally, and they bring us on to help scale the program.

And the business model is a price per piece, or how is it that you price your work?

Well, it depends on how involved we get into the process. This is where it's actually kind of fun. At its core, yeah, we, for simplicity, we just bill per, we have tiers and each tier has a different price based on how much work needs to be done within the tier. And that is how, that is, that's the baseline pricing. And then there are, depending on what is needed, like for example, if a client wants to hire, like if a client wants to, actually, I don't know if I could say that. I'm sorry. That one. Yeah, that one. I, that's something I don't know if I can like publicly stand. So we'll just leave it at that. But there are other options in terms of like, how do I describe it? Shit. Some clients also need further support outside of like a per piece, like maybe they need help with managing a calendar, right? Or managing, managing another, like managing vendors, right? Like managing a whole separate set of vendors, or maybe they want to do hiring through you. There are also other, other options, which you can scale into with clients.

So how do you scale? Like if, you know, you're helping others scale, what does that look like on your side?

So I don't scale actually. I keep a limited roster on purpose. And that's also because the, again, like the reason that I built Peak Content was I never wanted a mecha agency and I don't want like a team of account executives and I don't want a board and I don't want any of those things. So I like a smaller business. And again, like we just— like we brought up before, like growth for the sake of growth. I have a very comfortable life. I'm very happy with my life. And a lot of it is attributed because of like the business that I have. So we keep a very— all of the relationships that we have with clients are long-term partnerships, right? Like they're usually 6 months, a year, 18-month engagements. So that provides the stability. But the roster is limited. I mean, I don't think I've ever taken on more than 5 or 6 clients in, in a year, um, through the agency. I've taken on more as that as a freelancer than I have as an agency, but I realized how much I hated it when I was freelancing and subcontracting and having to deal with all these clients. Um, and yeah, people have asked me the same thing, like, why not scale? I've, I've been asked to merge with other agencies before. Um, that's something— that's an option that was on the table, and I considered it, but I'm, I'm a happy person where I am, um, and I don't see the need for, for endless growth.

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Would it be safe to say that you designed the business to serve your needs?

And the client's needs. But yeah, I would definitely say I designed it.

Well, for instance, you choosing not to scale serves you, right?

Yeah, totally. Yeah. No, I'm just busting you. But no, for sure. That's the whole reason that I got into like doing entrepreneurship. I don't know how you'd say it, right? But that's the reason why I started this whole journey was because I wanted to design my life around work. I never wanted work to like dictate so much of my life. And I'm sure, as you know, as someone that is an entrepreneur and runs their own businesses, there's like a real beauty in like the phases that you go through. Like sometimes, you know, you got to work some nights and then you're like planting, you're planting the seeds and then sometimes you can harvest the seeds and you can take like a little, not a break break, but you like, you can relax a little bit. There's like waves, sometimes it's like heavier and then sometimes it's lighter. But yeah, I would say overall the business is designed exactly the way that I want it and it complements my life. You know, we, my partner and I, my husband and I, we travel wherever, whenever we want. We can go here, we can go there. I'm not bound by the business.

And I think that's important to do because I know for myself, I think on the surface, if you ask me, are you building the business you want? I would have said yes, but I don't know that I really was sure what I wanted. Um, and, and I, I think being intentional about building the business is, is an important step that a lot of entrepreneurs miss, and they, they end up with something that doesn't serve them. And it, you know, it kind of becomes the tail that wags the dog. Like, it's, it's like I'm, I'm being led around by the business requirements rather than it serving my needs. So Kudos to you. What are some of the financial challenges, if any, you've had in owning your own business?

Well, this doesn't apply specifically to the content agency, but I have other businesses. I know we feel like the focus is mostly on on Peak Content so far. But I also own an investment company, small as well. And that is, that does angel investments and also has like a stock futures trading arm. And then real estate portfolio that I have here. So I have a lot, like we were saying before, you know, like when you have to solve problems and be the rock, that's because like in every day, like there's just waves coming around all the time. So I really had to learn how to be a rock. And so I wouldn't say like the agency itself, the model's pretty lean. And because I'm working with— I only have contract— I only work with contractors. So it's just me. I'm the only employee. And then obviously, like, there's different levels, for lack of a better term, of like who I place, like who I trust, right, what to be done. But, you know, like, I've had, you know, Peak Freelance in the past, which was also a writing community. We struggled with profitability through and through, right? Like just making the thing profitable. That was a financial challenge because Elise Barnsley, who was my partner in that business and still is my trusted confidant today, we put in a lot of money, of our own money. And we kept like, we believed in Peak Freelance so much. But we could not find a way to make a community like that profitable. And it eventually, like, now it just kind of like runs itself on a free tier. And our involvement is not there. It's still an entity. It still exists. And sometimes there's a post on LinkedIn. But yeah, that was one financial challenge was actually like thinking about like, at some point we had to say, all right, we're putting too much money into this thing. Like it doesn't work. You know, like the business model doesn't work. And whether, whether the model doesn't work, or we're not a good fit for the model, both are okay. You know, but at some point we have to accept is like, we've been dumping so much money into this business, and we're not seeing any returns on it. And to the point where like sometimes that company like was not returning anything, like not even earning revenue, right? But it's still, we were like, we were kind of like, we believe in this, you know, like, and we tried and we tried and we tried. And it just kind of fizzled out. And, you know, like, life happens, you know, like, like Elise. Elise is building her family. I, I was moving into other businesses and looking at other investment opportunities, and we kind of just agreed to, like, stop putting so much money into that, that company and just accept what it is.

Um, how long was that process that you worked on the community, would you say?

Before you finally said, "Enough." Well, we finally just said enough, like last year. And I think this, the community was started around COVID. So it was a long time.

Okay.

All right.

That's fair enough. Yeah, no, we tried. I believe you. Yeah, we did believe in it. And I still believe in the power of community, but I, we could not figure out a way. We hired employees, we worked with interns and vendors, and we tried different revenue streams, just couldn't make it work. And that's okay. Um, but that was definitely, uh, yeah, if that answers the question of, uh, financial issue.

I am curious. So how did you get into angel investing?

Yeah. So there was a point in time where before the— remember when we had like 0%, 1% interest rates or whatever, like the Fed rate was somewhere around there. All over LinkedIn was like VC, VC, VC. Like everyone was becoming a VC. And everyone, it was like the coolest fucking job you could have, you know? And fortunately for myself, like, I don't remember what year that was. The agency was incorporated in '22. So my timelines are off, but whatever it was, whether it was the agency or I was scaling with subcontractors into the agency, the business was doing good and my cash flow was heavy. So I was like, let's, look into like investing and like angel investing, right? Because like everyone's a VC and now I want to be a VC.

Okay.

So I think, I think in one year, I think I cut like 7 or 8 checks, like I got to put capital across like 8 investments. And I, this was another financial mistake. I hated it. I hated it. I could not stand But, and maybe it's just because like I'm not a VC, you know, like I'm just—

Had you done that before?

No, no, I've never done that before. I just saw on LinkedIn that it was like the cool thing to do if you had, if you had extra money to invest and, you know, like I had maxed out my retirement accounts and I was like, all right, well, I got extra money to invest. So I have a partner in that age, in that agency, in that company. It still exists. But we've scaled down like the angel investing side. We still have some investments that are just kind of like future. We're hoping it works.. But the gist of it is that I absolutely hated angel investing. And I'm just not good at it. And it's again, it's something that I'm okay with. And that's kind of just like a quick sidebar here is that some— I've done so many things with like, in the world of entrepreneurship. And I think for me, if I have to like self-reflect and say what is like what has helped me get to where I am today, it is that it was trying so many things and failing at so many things to— and learning like which things to invest your time and your money and your energy and your emotions into. Um, because not everything deserves the same amount of all of that.

No, definitely not. I mean, I don't know if you've read Mike Michalowicz's Profit First, but You know, that was his experience, was he had built two businesses and sold them and made some money and then ended up being an angel investor and going bankrupt. And, um, I believe it. Yeah. And, and, and his, you know, that's— that was the birth of Profit First, was just, there's got to be a different way to do this. Because he wasn't making a lot of money as he was building the businesses, he was just making money when he sold the business. And I think of this axiom that I heard a long time ago of like, you know, you make all the money in your business and you lose it in someone else's. And that kind of speaks to the intrigue of investing because I've done that too. I was not— I invested in a couple of actual VC funds. They were not angel investor funds. They were VC funds. I was just an investor. I did not manage. I wasn't involved in selecting the companies or anything like that. But I'm going to tell you, it was a little bit of the getting FOMO, like getting to participate in something that could be big. And I think I got my money back. I think that was about it, which I consider to be a good win because I didn't lose it. But It was an interesting journey. Yeah, the thing about investing, especially when you're investing, I think it was Warren Buffett that said he doesn't invest in a company he doesn't understand. And I think there's some sage wisdom in that when you, you start putting your money into something else is, do you understand it? And, and then I think about what, uh, Robert Kiyosaki said about in Rich Dad Poor Dad, and he was talking about investing in like the stock market, is that, you know, understand you don't have any control over it. Other people are using your money and they're making the decisions, and you know, you usually get a return on that. But, uh, it's just different layers of, of your involvement, your accountability, your risk. And, and I think for most of us, we're, we're better served putting our time and energy into our business rather than going off and trying to do others. At least that's been my experience.

100%, man. And that's funny you said that, because the minute that I realized that and I cut out like I got— I did. I wrote off what I could write off. I exited myself from where I was able to exit right away, and I just took some losses and whatever. And I started focusing just— I was like, all right, like I literally, I wrote out an entire list of everything. I'm even talking like individual company investments through like, you know, like, like the stock market. I listed every single, every single money that was out. And I was like, what is wasting my time? What's pissing me off? What do I hate? What do I love? And what's making me the most money? And I just started and I went through and I scratched out everything that was in like the lower 3 tiers. And then the 2 tiers that were left, there was like a very few handful of things left. And I was like, this is what I'm focusing on for the next couple years. And that's it. I'm not, I'm not even thinking about, I sold individual stocks. I just put them into funds. And also like the thing personally is just because I also have the LLC for the futures and options and stock trading. So I have exposure to those things, but I don't actively— like, I'm not an active manager of them.

Yeah.

But yeah. And so like, I was like, all right, like Peak Content, very good model. I like doing it. I enjoy the people that I work with. Let's focus on that. You know, like the trading company, the futures. I love that. I'm not— I'm personally not great at it. But I am good with making business decisions that affect it. And the team that we have over there is very good at it. And, you know, so the thing— there were some things that I couldn't get out of that I'm stuck with, like some real estate. But, you know, you live and you learn. So we're going— we're figuring— we've just got to figure those things out. That doesn't— as you know, like, it doesn't always— you can't— not everything happens at once, right? Like, it happens step by step. And yeah, and I have to say, like, not even, not even like profit got better, but it did. But I was happier, you know, like I was more aware during the day, like I wasn't drained because my phone is ringing all day long and I'm pulled into a Slack message and an email and then this and that. I'm trying to get things done, but I can't. And then I'm working till 8, you know, then I walk. And so when I got rid of all the, the, the bullshit, and like started listening to myself and not listening to like what you should, what I should be doing. I also, to note, like also like I don't have Instagram, I don't have Facebook, I don't have Snapchat or TikTok or any of those. I have LinkedIn for work because I, at one point I was also, I'm just tired of people telling me what I should be doing. And that also led to me scratching out all those investments. But it made me a happier person. It made me more of an aware person. Of my life, of my partner, of my business, you know, my dogs, like, and my family. And that was a good lesson. It was a hard lesson because I think, you know, like, you define so much of your self-worth when you're wrapped up in businesses and your business or whatever. It becomes like part of your identity and your self-worth. And cutting those things out, you're like, well, who even am I? If I'm not Mike who deployed 8 checks, you know, like, who gives a fuck? You know what I mean? Like, who cares how many checks someone deployed?

No, you know, like, you're exactly right.

I'd rather deploy less checks and like be able to go for a walk at 5:30 with my dogs than be working till 8 o'clock at night. You know what I mean?

Absolutely. I was having a conversation on my other podcast earlier this morning, and he was talking about his second go-around, his second business. He started with the— these are my words, not his words— he started with the end in mind. Like, he already had the exit planned of what that would look like before he started building the business. And I'm like, yeah, that is sage advice because even if you don't sell it or exit it, it gives you clarity on what it is that you're trying to build. And what it looks like. And if you build a business that is saleable, it's always easier to run. Like, if you, you know, Built to Sell is a great book if you haven't read it. But like, I don't remember the author's name, but I mean, conceptually, you should never build a business that you wouldn't be able to sell. Like, it should— because if you build it to sell, it's going to have processes, it's going to make money. It's not going to have, uh, you know, all of the, uh, hair on it that, you know, a lot of businesses do. I mean, most businesses, if you said, well, uh, show me your finances, you'd be like, no, I don't want you to see that, like, right? But if you've got a— if you've got a business that you've built to sell, you're like, sure. I mean, you know, you're not to everybody, but like, I— you'd be comfortable saying, yeah, this is this is what my business is.

Yeah, I actually love that. And for my next business, I will take that, I will use that framework for my next business.

Yeah, he said he spent like months, like actually meditating on what the end looked like. And he really, he started with the personal impact, not the business impact, but like what his personal life was going to look like at exit. And I thought that also fascinating because that again just kind of pushes you back into designing the business for what you need, not it becoming the tail that wags the dog.

Yeah. No, I love that. And I definitely am an active practitioner of meditation every morning. And also in the idea of visualizing that, what, like visualizing your future, you know, and again, I apply that to business, but you can use it across anything that you want to get done in your life.

Yeah, and I think what he said, which I deeply resonate with, there is no— for an entrepreneur, there is no segregation between the personal and the business. I mean, like, that's a false wall. Yeah, you know, one affects the other and vice versa. So you have to be cognizant of what you want personally from the business as well as what you want the business to look like. I mean, you can't separate those two things, I don't think.

Right. And you need to consider if you want your business to be your life, like if you want that life. Right.

100%.

Yeah, like one thing I don't think anyone downplays it, but they sometimes skip over it is like, it takes a lot of hard work. Like it's, it's, it's from, from the outside, you're like, ah, like this guy made this beautiful landscaping business, his life must be so great. And it's true, it might be, but he probably put in 10 years of hard work, maybe 3 years where he was working 6, 7 days a week. And that's not the case for everybody. But it's It's like, it takes hard work and it takes dedication to yourself. So yeah, so like visualizing the end goal, that's what keeps you going, you know? I was like, all right, like this is my end goal. So I can do the things that I'm not so— there was a, I forget who the author was or what, but this idea of doing things that you don't actually like doing helps you, like helps with growth. And sometimes, you know, it's like, I don't wanna, like that happens in your business all the time. And I actually, sometimes I even look for those things. I'm like, oh, I really don't want to do that, but let's do it. You know? Um, and, and you do, I don't know, I don't know how it changes the brain, but there was some, like, there was some brain changes that happen when you do something that you don't like doing and it's slightly challenging. Um, and that's literally the life of a business owner, you know?

Yeah. But it has a purpose. You're not just like going and digging holes in the ground because it's hard. You're, you've got a purpose behind it. Yeah, absolutely.

You're looking towards a future that you want, you know, a future that we're saying like you visualize that you want to manifest, whatever you want to call it. But it's a life that, you know, it's a life that you're designing for yourself as you go.

Yes, being intentional. That's my catchphrase, being intentional.

I like that.

Yeah. Michael, how do people find out more about Peak Content if they want to know?

Yeah, um, you can just head to the website, uh, contentbypeak.com, www.contentbypeak.com. Um, the way—

Is peak an acronym?

No, no, it's like the peak, the peak of a mountain. Okay, all right. Um, was the idea— is the idea behind it. It actually came from Peak Freelance, the writing community. Um, like, I really liked the brand, um, of like the, the idea of the mountain peak. Um, and yeah, so That's where, that's where you'll find it. Um, the— I had a mentor at one point, and this is why like Peak is not very public about anything. Like, we don't do marketing, we don't do— you won't— like, I don't even think we have a LinkedIn page. Um, but my mentor, who is in a— was at the time like very similar to the model that I have now, maybe a little smaller, um, he had taught me the value in being less visible and like working through like relationships and referrals. And that's for a whole nother conversation. But that's why the only place that you can learn about Peak is on the website, because I don't talk about it very publicly. Sometimes I mention some things on LinkedIn or whatever. But we've survived and thrived without having to like be so public-facing. And that's because of how much effort and attention goes into every client relationship that we get referrals. And I don't keep a waitlist. Like, if we're not opening to clients, we're not open. And, you know, you let, you let them go because, again, it is what it is, you know. But so that's, that's— and I've kept true to that, like, for the majority of this journey. And yeah, just, I'd rather people talk good behind my back than like me, like yelling out to people all the time on social media.

So I love that. Listeners will have those links in the show notes. If you like what you've heard, please rate the podcast, share the podcast, subscribe to the podcast. If you don't like what you heard, hit the little mail envelope and shoot us a text. Tell us what you'd like, and I'll get rid of Michael.

Until next time. Let me know on LinkedIn too. Tell me why you didn't like me.

Tata for now.