The Difference Between Employee & Entrepreneur: Jimmy Owens

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Welcome to another episode of The Profitable Creative, the only place on the interwebs where you will learn how to turn your passion into profit. I am your host, Christian Brim. Special shout out to our one listener in Snohomish, Washington. Imagine having that when you were in kindergarten and trying to learn your address. I don't know if that's even a thing anymore. Maybe they don't. Anyway, joining me today Jimmy Owens of Design Tunnel. Jimmy, welcome to the show.

Hey, thanks for having me.

Appreciate it. Uh, for those of you listening to the podcast, uh, you, you don't know, uh, I will share with you that Jimmy looks like a famous actor slash rapper slash burger joint owner. I'll let you fill in the gaps there.

Yes, that's all I got.

Uh, I, when I met Jimmy in person, I, I said, does anybody ever tell you that you look like— he goes, like, what? And I'm like, oh, never mind. And then he joked with me, he said, yeah, all the time.

I think I actually pulled out my camera phone and I said, like who? Because usually, yes, usually you're trying to— usually I record everybody asking me if I look like Mark, or if, uh, if I ever get told I look like Mark Wahlberg. Yeah. So I always record them and then I send them to my friends, and my friend was like, man, still still getting it. Yes.

Yes. Have you gotten that all your life?

Well, uh, yeah, I think like once I— for some reason, like maybe like when I started driving, okay, maybe because I got out more. And so like ever since I was like 16.

Yeah, you are his doppelgänger. It is weird. It is weird. So tell the listeners, uh, what you do there at Design Tunnel. Yeah.

Um, I mean, our, our main focus, if I met you networking, uh, video production and podcast creation. Video production for like commercials, training videos, you know, any— anything special effects, animation. But I would say video production, podcast.

And you've been doing that how long?

Um, well, I think a good solid 10 years. Okay. Yeah, 10 years. I mean, it's 2025, so, um, good solid 10 years, and I've been in industry for over 20.

Okay, and how long have you had the space?

Uh, we've had our— the space that's behind me, um, for over 10 years.

Oh, the whole time?

We've been— we've been in this building for over 10 years. Um, our company, uh, Design Tunnel, it's 2025, we— March of this year was 14 years in business.

Oh, congratulations! That's impressive. Thank you. Thanks.

Okay, so every day still feels like day one?

Yeah, in some ways, yes, some ways. Hopefully the good ways.

So that's a good way.

Different, different, but good. Going back to being in the industry before you started this, what did you do?

Well, I went— I mean, how I got through college, I waited tables. And how I got to college was through manual labor, working at a dairy farm for your vehicle to buy your first vehicle. Right. You're like, I was like, I'm going to college. This is, I can't do this my whole life. And so, you know, I always had a pretty good knack for twisting something into kind of like memorable, like, you know, like one-liners or little funny sayings or something like that. And, you know, kids would catch onto it. I'd recognize that as I was growing up that everyone would start saying the things that I would say. I was like, that's kind of weird. And so that's why I liked advertising is because advertising remind me of those one little pieces of information that you say that can get stuck in people's mind. And so, um, you know, I wish I would have went the marketing route, uh, but my math, uh, ACT score wasn't that great. So, you know, we run away from pain. So I went ahead and went the easy route and went towards what I knew, which is ideas. And, uh, so I got the advertising BA.

So Uh, what did you do with that before you started Design Tunnel?

Um, you know, I've really never like dove into like ad agency, uh, like, like ad spin. Let's, let's hit like a campaign and ad span, like big ad agency stuff like they were teaching us in college.

That would have required math.

Well, a little bit, yeah, but that was still, that was still very strategic, you know, and I don't think I was really like on my strategic, um leg of life yet. I would say today I'm on a very strategic, strategic growth path. Um, and yeah, so anyways, I was a graphic designer out of college. Okay, got an advertising BA. I, I got a job as a graphic designer. Uh, I fell in love with ad copy and layout class and being able to create those one-liners and turn them into actual visuals for people to be like, oh, that's what you're talking about. Uh-huh. Yeah. So I got to create the visuals. And so, um, I was a print designer for about 3 years where I learned a ton about the print industry and, uh, was— became very fluent in that. And after that, I got into animation back when Flash was still a program. Yes. Flash, Flash animation. And, uh, you know, I love doing that. And then I got my first freelance video client, bought myself a DSLR., Canon camera and all self-taught video and audio and lighting.

So why did you make that switch from working for someone to working for yourself? What was that process like?

I know it wasn't like one thing, but, uh, I'm gonna blame it on stupidity.

Okay, well, yeah, yeah.

I mean, ignorance is bliss. It is. It's great when you don't know everything. And it's all working. Um, and so, you know, looking back at it, at the, at the salary that I had, at the amount of work I was doing, man, I had a cake job. I had a cake job. It was easy. All we had to do was make really cool, fun stuff to entertain, right? You know, and that's what we did. And, you know, as an employee, you're like, I need more money. You know, you know, you're not And, uh, you know, today I have a whole different insight to, to how I used to think, right? Yeah. And it was like, man, you had it all wrong, right? Um, but I also know that I'm the type of person that I get bored if everything's too— if it's too repetitive. That's just how I'm, you know, like I'd never make a great doctor because I wouldn't want to do the same heart procedure all day.

You could be an ER physician. Yeah, they see different shit every day.

Yeah.

Yeah. You have what stuck where? Okay.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. Uh, so, okay. I, I, there's a lot there that I want to unpack with you. So what would you say were that, that you remember were the most shocking things that you didn't know as an employee that you learned going to the entrepreneur route?

I think as an employee, you're just like, you're like, man, they must have deep pockets to really afford all these people.

Yeah.

But you have no clue what that pressure feels like to get that revenue.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I— there's, there's this idea out there of financial transparency for your employees. Like, you know, companies that share all of their financial information with their employees to let them know how they're doing. And one of the complaints about that is, or the reasons why you don't want to do that is because people don't understand the numbers. And so like you can say, well, you know, we hit $5 million in revenue last year and you're sitting there as an employee saying, well, I didn't see very much of that. So, you know, but they don't understand what goes into that $5 million.

Right? Um, no clue what it takes to— yeah, they didn't realize that it took money, that some of that money to make the money.

Yes, and all the equipment and all the overhead and of course all the employees. It— yeah, I, I think you can share that information with your employees if you do it in a simplified way. Um, I think it's more important honestly that, uh, employees understand how they contribute value to the company, you know, and, and, and that their compensation is tied to that so that they— I mean, because that's the most important thing, right? Is if, if they want to make more money, they have to make the company more money, right? And, and sure, yeah, that may be that they need to get different skills or, you know, work more hours or, you know, do their work better, whatever. But like Being able to tie in for an employee, I'm paying you $50 grand and I'm billing you out at $100, and that's how I make my money. That, that I think is, is good information to share with, with employees. Okay, so my, my next thing in that regard was you said stupidity, and then you talked about how you, you had it all wrong. What, what did you have wrong?

Well, I mean, I, I wanted to quit my job. I didn't want to quit my job. I was just, was going to quit eventually, right? And, um, anyways, I went ahead and quit it, and, uh, I, I just want to be a graphic designer. I want to do graphic design out of the house, right?

So what, what were you thinking that you were gaining by quitting then? I mean, like freedom, or like what?

I just thought I could make more money.

Okay.

Yeah. I just thought I could make more money. It really wasn't even a flexible schedule. I was just like, I was like, I can do this. And I don't know, it just seemed easy. It seemed easy to get clients and it seemed easy to, but, and I had no clue on what it really took to get a client.

Right.

They'd always just, when you're, when you're like, sometimes when people are working in our industry, it's kind of like you, you can stay busy with your, your side hustle freelance clients because all you have is a certain amount of time. But when you're trying to like fill up, right. You know, 160 hours of your time, and then you've got employees. I mean, that's a, you know, that's 320 hours or so a month. Yeah. Well, you got to start figuring out a process for that. How are you going to get more work? You know, that becomes a problem.

Yeah. I mean, the, the, uh, founder of Boston Market spoke at an, uh, EO event I was at. This 80-year-old Boston Italian immigrant, so you know, I could barely understand him. But he said, business comes down to two things: either getting the business or doing the business. You know, getting the work, doing the work. That's it. And his second statement was, more business, more problems. No business, no problems. And I'm like, mm, yes, that's some sage wisdom there. So yeah, it doesn't matter what your business is. It's finding the work, finding the customers, finding the clients, and then getting it done. And that's all business runs down to. It is simple, but it doesn't mean it's easy. Right. And one of the things I see with early stage businesses is they get caught bogged down in the work. Like they get the work, then now they're doing the work, and then they're not out marketing or hustling, and then the pipeline dries up. Yeah. And finding that balance between how much time am I going to put into marketing and getting new business versus how much time am I going to spend doing the business.

And not even that. I mean, steps before that, it's like they may not even have a good marketing message.

Well, yes.

Yes. I mean, it's just so deep, so fast. I think it's easy to get bogged down.

Did you— I mean, and I find this with, with a lot of marketers, kind of like the, the cobbler's kids have no shoes, a lot of marketers do a piss-poor job of marketing their own business. Did you run into that?

Oh yeah, yeah, we neglect our, our stuff the most out of everybody's because it doesn't pay, right? Well, but it does pay if you, if you do it right and you get clients off of it. So, you know, it's, it does, but it doesn't. It's kind of up to you and, and what you're willing to invest in. So today we're willing to invest in it. Able to.

Yes, it does help to have some, uh, cushion there, either operationally or financially, to, to work on the business, not in the business. Uh, have you read, uh, Gerber's E-Myth? Yeah, great book. I, I recommend to all entrepreneurs. And, and essentially, it's, it's a simple concept of, of setting aside, uh, a portion of your time to work on the business. That might be on the processes of the business or the systems or the people or the marketing messaging or, you know, whatever it is that's not actually doing work to make money. It's kind of like the investment in the future of the company. Yeah.

Yeah, I guess where I'm going with that though is like, so I said, so let's say I set aside time. Well, I still don't even know where to start. Okay.

Right? Tell me more.

I think that's still going to be like, I mean, I think that's still going to be some of what graphic design, video production, animation, whatever it is, whatever that company is, we can still set aside time, but it doesn't mean that we're working or like trying to work on the right things in the right order.

Right. Well, and does that tie in with, with what you said about you now are thinking more strategically?

Oh yeah, yeah, so definitely tell me a little bit more about that.

What, what does that look like for you?

I mean, we actually have team meetings about strategic development and have days set aside, and yeah, we are executing those things now.

So, so go deeper into that. What, what does strategy look like in your business? Like, is that, uh, well, I'm not going to put words in your mouth. What, what does that look like?

I'm going to say, I'm going to say it's just having a plan. Having a plan and how to execute that plan. That was something that we've been missing for a long time. It's like, hey, I got this idea. Well, you know, it may not work, but we need to try it and execute it. And we can keep talking about it, but I think all businesses have ideas and we get stuck in some of the ruts that we're in. And it's hard to like say, hold on, let's really take a day off work and have a team meeting and let's get some markers out and, you know, lay it all out on the table. Like, what I say when we think of this, and you say, and what we think of these things, and let's make a plan on brain dump, and let's figure this out. Yeah, right. And I think that's hard to do. I keep thinking, like, in my mind, whenever I'm talking about, like, what— we're a small team, so I think whenever you're at—

how many, how many are on there?

Uh, consistently about 3 or 4. Yeah. And some of our employees. So, um, but like, I just think of a smaller team, and sometimes a smaller team, uh, may not know those questions, the questions to ask.

Yeah. And that lands with you, right, as, as the owner? Yeah. Uh, having the right questions to ask. And I, you know, one of the pivotal points in our business was when we implemented EOS, the Entrepreneurial Operating System. And when it was described to me by, by another entrepreneur and he had implemented it in his business— he was in construction, completely different business. Okay. But as he described it and what it had done for his business, I'm like, oh yeah, that's what we need, some of that. And when, when I was talking to the individual that would professionally come in and implement that in our business. He said, you know, your communication, when you add one person to your team, it doesn't just add one layer of complexity, it actually doubles the complexity.

Yeah.

And he drew it out with me, like the lines of communication, and I'm like, Oh yeah, it does. And so like, even if you have 2 people on your team and you add a 3rd, it's automatically twice as, twice as many lines of communication, twice as many opportunities for misunderstanding, etc. And you can see where you can get to a team of 4 or 5 pretty quickly. And then all of a sudden, no one's on the same page. And, and it's like, yeah, which direction are we going?

Because everybody's in turn. Yeah. We all interpret things differently, right? Well, I thought you meant this. I said, I told these guys, as long as there's communication, we have a job around here.

100%. And I think it was the CEO of Samsung. It was a large electronics company. And he made this comment a long time ago. But, you know, somebody asked him about his job and he said, my job is to communicate. And he said, I have to communicate over and over and over and over again. And I know from my own self that that used to frustrate the hell out of me as the leader of the company. Like, I thought I could say it once and everybody would understand it and get in line and go along. And that's just not reality. Yeah. You got to say things 5, 6, 7 times before they really understand. Oh. It's not that they're trying to not understand, it's just it's clear here but it's not clear there. Yeah. You ever had that experience?

Oh yeah, yeah. I mean, I'm a prime example of it. I mean, I hear stuff differently and I guess I gotta, I gotta take in information multiple times. Totally.

So I, I also think, and I'll get your opinion on this, like when you say think strategically, I think you said it's just having a plan, and I think it is as simple as that. Like being proactive, like doing something with intent as opposed to being reactive. Like we got this work, okay, we need to get it done, or we don't have any work, let's go find some work, or there's no money in the bank, so what are we going to do? You know, like just reacting to the situation in business as opposed to saying, okay, I want to have $100,000 in the bank as working capital. I want to go out, I want to make sure I've got a cushion, right? And that's your goal. And then you're being intentional about it and you're figuring out, okay, what are the things that I need to get to that point? It could be, I want to get to the point where I'm working no more than 40 hours a week or I want to take off a month in the summer or whatever it is that you want out of your business, it's doing it with intentionality. That to me is being strategic. Would you agree with that?

Yeah, totally. Yeah. I mean, our goal here is stability and recurring clients.

Yeah. And I see that as a, you know, because a lot of creatives do project work. That's one of the things they struggle with is that, you know, it's a chicken or feathers. But I think you nailed the solution. It's repeat customers, right? So you're not having to go develop new relationships all the time. Yeah. Every customer may not be buying from you this quarter or this 6 months, but or even this year, but they're buying from you multiple times.

Yeah, that's the goal.

So how do you, what have you done that's worked strategically to get those recurring customers? Well, billing helps. Yes.

You gotta bill them. I'm just joking. I'm just joking. You know, I would say that's something that we're really working on right now. Maybe that's why I'm talking about it, you know, that's, uh, because that's something we're working on right now. And, um, I just think you have to, beyond like today, um, you just have to remain approachable and a knowledgeable source for them, right? They also, they need to know that what it's like to work with you, how you take care of them, how you solve problems. I mean, not, Not everything's a super, I'm gonna say a cakewalk, you know, not everything's a fairytale ending project. And how are you gonna deal with those problems when they arise, be that on your side or with, you know, on their side? Like, so I think it's, it's customer service, it's being a knowledgeable source. And, uh, more importantly, I think in all of that, they're not gonna come back to you if you do crappy work. True.

No, that's table stakes, right? Like you gotta have that to get in the game. But to your point, yeah, well, no, I don't think so.

I hear a lot of people trying out. I hear a lot of people trying out, like, well, I'm going to go over here because, you know, he's a college videographer, needs some portfolio work, and I just start to cringe.

I'm just like, he's getting paid in those experience bucks instead of real bucks.

Yeah, yeah, it's just, you know, and, uh, I hear those conversations and Yeah, they do need experience, uh, but I don't think it's how you want to treat your brand.

No, I—

like, your, your brand deserves more than that. And that's where my advertising comes in, you know. Like, I love logos and I love brands and I love marketing products and services.

But has Delaina told you she's rebranding Core? She— oh yeah, that's rolling out the end of June. So I'm, I'm curious. Okay, you'll have to critique.

I'm Uh, well, let's continue.

I'll have her send it to you. I've seen some of it. I'm like, when she first started talking about rebranding, I'm just like, okay, you know, but, you know, yeah, I just, I hear rebrand and I say, well, that's exactly what my thought, and the question in my mind was, is it going to move the needle? Like, is anybody going to buy from us because our logo is different. But, you know, brand is so much more than that. And I think what Delaina came to the conclusion was, after looking at our clients, like our clients' websites, our clients' messaging, our clients' logos, she was like, we don't look like they do. And we need to look like they do. We need to resonate with them. And I'm like, okay, I can buy into that. And what she came back with, I was like, yeah, you nailed it. Like, I would never have come up with that. I never would have thought, you know.

Okay, well, I can't wait to see it.

Back to the whole customer service thing. I was thinking, I think it was Ritz-Carlton did a customer service survey and they basically rated guests, you know, had them rate their satisfaction with their stay. And they segregated the ones that had had a problem, like the room wasn't ready or it wasn't clean or, you know, had a bad meal, whatever. Um, and of course Ritz-Carlton is real big on customer service and they strive to solve the problem, right? Um, and what they found was that the customer satisfaction of the people that had problems that were resolved were actually higher than the customer satisfaction ratings of the people that didn't have problems.

And to create more problems—

don't suggest that. But I do think, I think your point is extremely valid. Like how you solve those problems is very important to your reputation, your brand, and your customer loyalty. Absolutely.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that's what we've, we really focus on is, you know, let's just pretend all we have is our name to do business on. Well, we want that to be a good name in the community.

So who is your ideal, uh, customer? Who do you, who do you want as clients of Design Tunnel?

Man, I hate when I get asked this question.

Why?

Because I, I feel like we have a lot of different areas that we've served.

Yeah.

And we have a really good portfolio for all the areas I'm about to mention.

Okay, let's hear it.

Um, I mean, so a business that's wanting graphic design that's not on Fiverr, you know, you want good quality design that you can, um, have revisions done on, or you want kind of consistent look, you know, like your brand matters. Um, we like, we do billboards, vehicle wraps, business cards. I mean, like the brand. Um, so a really strong graphic design, um, style, you know, of client. Um, I would say one common thing that all of our clients have, or that they have in common, is, um, they care what they look like.

Not like me. I obviously don't care.

Well, they, they care about the quality, right? So if it's, you know, the video feed, you know, if it's the final, the final commercial, the videos that we touch and we create are— they're not going to be like unusable in a month. Like the videos we create for people, like they're still using the commercials and it's like 3 or 4 years later, right? You know, because, because it's clever enough and it's cool enough and it's done well enough. So commercials, we've done a lot of work for hospitals, physicians, and clinics. Okay. We've done a lot of training videos. Okay. And, you know, a service that we've been doing for over 3 years now is podcasting. So podcasting from the ground up, help you create your show. You can rent our space or we can produce it for you. And it's just not this one over my shoulder here. Right. Um, you know, we have like this little wall over here that you can see, the wooden wall, and we have a lot of stuff over here too. So, um, our clients like creativity. They want to look good.

Well, let me rephrase the question then. What do you—

what is it? Sure. Sorry, that's not—

no, no, it's a— I would say, uh, a typical answer.

Yeah, yeah, that's why I hate the, the—

okay, so let me—

yeah, because I'm not—

let me, let me put it— the question to you this way. What is a common problem you solve for your customers?

They need videos created.

More specifically?

I don't know. You're going to have to tee it up.

I don't know. So the reason why I'm going down this line of questioning is not to trip you up. It's illustrative of what I see. I saw it in my business. I mean, I think it's fundamental to every business. And I think the longer a business is in business, it becomes harder to see because of your experience and what you, what you think you know versus what you don't really know. And the question is this, what problem do you solve for your customer or client? And the clearer that you can be on that in, in defining the problem as they define it, not with—

yeah, in their, in their terms, right?

Right. Then understanding this, the solution that you provide to that problem and the value it has to them, because only they can establish the value. You can't. Right. That, I think, is the key to business. I think, you know, it gets muddied and confusing sometimes. But if we know what problem we're solving and what our solution is worth to them, then we have the keys to the gate. Hey, listeners, are you ready to turn your passion into profit? Then grab a copy of Profit First for Creatives. Click the link in the show notes to purchase a copy. And if you're not ready to make that full commitment, you can download a free copy of the first chapter. Check it out right now.

Yeah, well, so our, our clients don't know how to run the cameras that we have, right? They don't know how to do lighting. They don't know how to get good audio. They don't know how to get good audio in the Oklahoma winds. They don't know how to edit any of it or master any of the audio or do any of the animated graphics, you know, or even start a podcast, much less publish it sometimes. So there's a lot that we fill in the gaps for.

Well, so let's stick on the video for a second. Why do you— why do most of your customers want video?

I mean, they want it for different reasons.

I mean, what's a primary one?

Yeah, I mean, so like a commercial, they want commercial created. Yeah, commercial.

And the commercial is for what intent? What— why do they want a commercial?

To sell or educate, right?

And so I think the being able to define, quantify for them maybe the difference between a bad commercial and a good commercial. And all of the elements that you spoke of go into that, right? Lighting, knowing how to use your equipment, the editing. But then you bring in this extra layer of like the copy and the hook and the create that, you know, zhuzh that you bring to the table. The difference between you producing a commercial versus the college videographer student— as our experience, it is experience, but it's much more than that. I mean, to me, it's, it's like you create something that's memorable, that has impact, that causes a reaction, which makes the sales register metaphorically ring, right? And that, that is— I think that's what's missing in a lot of marketing today is, and you seem to have a very good grasp on it, is that they don't— marketers don't understand their customers' business enough to understand the impact that they make, right? Because if you're making a commercial and it lands right, You're going to be very successful. They're going to be very successful. But in order to do the commercial right, yeah, you got to have the technical elements, but you've got to understand their business, who their customer is, their messaging, like their value proposition, all those things too.

Yeah. Well, I mean, that's what, you know, people, you know, that's why people have a video producer, right? They're supposed to be able to take all the information get the right visuals, make it happen, you know. And there's different levels of that, the video producer side. And, uh, I mean, I definitely recognize there's a difference between us. And everybody has their own, you know, I would say everybody has the same vanilla flavor, but everybody's vanilla is just made different.

Some use that cheap imitation stuff, and then some of them buy that stuff at, uh, like Sir LaTob has. Yeah, I bought some real vanilla extract at Sur La Table. That shit was expensive. I was like, are you kidding me?

Too much vanilla tastes bad, by the way.

Yeah, you don't use much. Yeah, like 5 milligrams, teaspoons, all you really need in it. Yeah.

Um, yeah.

Okay, let me, let me pivot here. Um, starting your business, what was your your biggest, or one of your biggest challenges that you had to overcome?

I mean, I still think I'm— I am the problem. I think I am the, the hurdle.

Tell me more.

It's just me, man. I'll just get in the way, right? If you don't know what you don't know, then it's easy to stay stuck in that rut. Like, we gotta talk about that rut earlier. It's easy to stay in the rut. It's hard to— so I think it's just like I think you have to, like, for me, I have to get Jimmy right with the world before Jimmy can, like, um, excel in other areas. So, like, when I'm, like, trying to improve on myself daily, then I'm able to improve on, like, our business, or, like, the next system, or the next process, or, you know, how are we going to level up. So if I'm not going to go around and ask myself why all the time, then I'm never going to be able to to do that.

Congratulations. I think you unlocked the secret to, uh, successful entrepreneurship, because I can tell you that I was 48, 50 before I learned that lesson. Like, I didn't know I was the problem. And, and, you know, human nature being what it is, it's always easy to blame others, whether it's your employees or your customers or the marketplace or whatever. But my experience with myself and my experience with, with other entrepreneurs is 90% of it is between your own two ears.

Yeah, there's something I heard earlier this week, and it was not at a church, it was somewhere else. Um, it was, uh, the guy said he had an acronym for ego, so it was Etching Out Good.

Mm. Okay.

Right. Except he said, I just, I just ad-libbed that. Uh, he actually said etching out God. It wasn't at church, but, um, while I was sitting here thinking, you know, of my creative brain, I was like, I can use the word.

You can use the word God too. That's totally fine.

Yeah. You use God, you know, good or God. But I think that is, that's a great way to look at ego. You know, am I keeping my ego in check? And, you know, just because you're making money doesn't mean that you own the world.

Yeah. And to me, I think it's easy to measure success in a business or as a business owner financially. That's an easy way to track, keep score, right?

Yeah.

But for me, that just doesn't resonate because I, as a creative myself, the money is secondary. And I know I hate it when people say, well, money is not important. That's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying that money is not important, but, but if I have a choice of, you know, 5 different things that I can do, um, I don't look at how much money potential there is first. I look at what resonates with me. What do I want to do? What excites me, right? Yeah, that's the first thing. If it doesn't check that box, I don't care how much money I can make at it. I'm not interested. Yeah, yeah. And, and Yeah. And to follow up with your EOG or ego, EGO, what helped for me?

And yeah, I think I said I did it backwards, didn't I? I just realized I just— yeah, yeah. I'm going to tell everybody I'm dyslexic.

That's totally fine too.

I—

and I'm not, but I did have an author on the show that had Tourette's and I didn't know that he had Tourette's. Until he showed up on the show. It's a fascinating interview. You need to go listen to it. I can't remember his name off the top of my head. I'll send you the link. Anyway, is this of like, okay, how am I contributing to the problem in whatever way? I mean, like, even if in my mind it's a small piece, like, I'm only a very small part of the problem here. The rest of the problem is everybody else. But I, how am I contributing to this problem. And what I realized is most of the time it was the opposite. I was most of the problem. You know, your employees, your team, your customers, your vendors, they're all reacting on what you do. So you have a tremendous impact in going in and doing that introspection and say, why Why am I behaving this way? Why am I saying these things? Why am I doing these things? You know, even if they're not necessarily bad, like, why? Why? Why is a great question.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, that, that question, I think, slows me down. It has slowed me down over, you know, makes me a really good designer. But it can slow you down, right? Yeah. You're like, the, you know, like why or how, or how can we make this better, right? You know, is this something that someone else would have made, or could they have made it? You know, if they can't, then we're ready to send it, right? Yes.

So I like that. Yeah. Okay, I'm going to pivot again. Um, where do you think that your company is going to be in 3 years? I used to say longer term, but with everything changing as quickly as it is, I think 3 years is a stretch as it is. So what, what do you, you know, strategically, goals, what, where do you want your company to be in 3 years?

Uh, full-time podcast crew running podcasts every day out of the studio, full-time video production crew running video production out of our production van.

Why do you, why are you so high on podcasting?

Um, I think it's a great way to create content. It's a great way to create content, connect with the audience. It's a great way to network. Uh, it's just very versatile, and I think it's, I think it's one of the cheaper forms of video.

Yeah, I, we chose audio only on ours only because I didn't want the expense or hassle of video editing and lighting, etc., etc. I agree. So like, if you do audio It's pretty inexpensive comparatively to get into, but I think everything that I've read— and again, I started this podcast with no idea what I was doing. I had been on probably 4 podcasts. I didn't listen to podcasts, but I said, you know, I'm going on these podcasts to promote my book. I don't like any of the conversations I'm having, so I'm going to start my own. But I didn't have any business intent to it. It's not like, well, okay, we'll have this and it's going to generate this kind of revenue. I didn't even think about that. But what I have learned in the 9 months that I've been doing this is that I think the most important thing is to keep doing it. Like, if you're not committed to do 100 episodes, um, and, and just have that in your mind up front, like, I'm— I'll look back and measure success after 100 episodes, um, you're, you're setting yourself up for failure. Because if you're, if you're just going to do a couple or even do 25, you're not going to see the results that you want. Whatever. I mean, unless you're just, I don't know, Joe Rogan or something. Yeah, you don't look like Joe Rogan.

Yeah. But no, no, not even close.

Would you— what would you say to, to, to someone that was considering starting a podcast? Does that— does what I said sound true?

Or— yeah, I say set expectation, what you think success looks like. Like, what are you going to call success? Why would you keep doing it?

Yeah. And for me, it was about having those conversations. Like, I love having these conversations. I like hearing people's stories. Um, but, you know, more importantly, I think that other people can benefit from hearing those stories. So, you know, I don't talk about core on here. I don't give like tax or accounting, you know, tips and techniques because who the hell wants to listen to that? Um, I'm, I'm about the people and the stories because I think that's fascinating. And, and as long as I'm doing that, I'll keep doing it because I enjoy it.

Yeah, we, uh, so our first, um, podcast client was ourselves.

And, uh, uh, what is your podcast so we can put it in the footnotes?

Um, Behind the Unicorn, uh, and it started at the podcast table right back there. That's why— that's how we got that. That's why we started that table. And, um, I wanted to— I went to a local event and, uh, this guy spoke and He was talking about selling your business. And I was like, he's like, any questions? And I got back in my, in our production van. I was like, man, why didn't I ask him what videos could make your company sell for more? Right? And so I called him up and said, hey, I really wish I would have asked this question. We're considering doing some podcast services and would you be my first guest on our show? Nice. And so our very first guest on Behind the Unicorn is Hank Bacchus, and he answers the question, what video, you know, can you make, or what videos can you create to sell your company for more? And so yeah, he was our very first one, and that's why we created the table. And then it just kind of keeps morphing into that. I mean, it just keeps morphing.

Yeah. So it's Behind the Unicorn, the unicorn being The valuable business to sell?

Is that what the unicorn is? No, behind the unicorn is the guest on the show is the unicorn. So if you're on the show, it'd be like, Christian, tell me what makes you a unicorn. What makes you tick? Why are you you? Like, what's your unicorn power?

You know?

Okay. And then, so we talk about you and you get to talk all about yourself. And then, which is hard for people to do, but Uh, it's good. I mean, everybody's, we're all different, but there's usually a few things that really makes us different, right? Um, and anyways, I was about to tell her, telling you what makes mine different, me different. But, um, I want to hear it. And then a life hack and a business hack. So it really is business oriented. Um, there's been some stuff, some shows on there that aren't too business oriented, but we always have a life hack and a business hack., and it has been like people that I've known or some people I didn't even know. And talking about like expectations of the show, our expectations to say we're going to keep doing this is if our YouTube channel has more subscribers than it has videos. That was our expectation.

That's a good one.

That was our expectation. We currently still have more subscribers than videos. And, uh, now, um, I don't care how many subscribers we have because Um, that table has turned, like, people come into the studio. It's a great way to network. I enjoy the networking part of it so much that I don't even care how many subscribers I have.

I love it. And have you seen any impact that you could attribute to your podcast in your business?

100%. Yep. And that's another reason I don't care. That table has turned to money. Like, people rent the table. We film at the table for other clients. It's a great way for us to create content. And, you know, we've gotten referrals from tagging people being on our show, you know, so we've closed business from the however, how many episodes we have up there. At the time of this recording between you and I, we haven't even done a podcast recording for Behind the Unicorn and probably a good, it's getting close to a year.

What?

I know, it's— we're about to pick it back up. We're about to pick it up this month.

Um, well, I can tell you an exceptional guest who loves talking about himself.

Who?

Me.

Okay, right on.

Yeah, yeah, slot me in there.

All right, cool.

I'm all about that, that Toby Keith song, I Want to Talk About Me. Okay.

All right, well, um, so we— the reason that we haven't made, um, any content is because Design Tunnel only has so many overhead dollars. Yes. And so what we were doing was we took our time or we was like, hold on, let's reset. We're getting podcast clients. They're having these questions.

You're actually making money with this.

Right. And so what we have done is we have, we now have a podcast calculator. We have, you know, we have our podcast page on our website that we created examples of our work. About 8 to 10 podcast videos that people need to know that can help them give themselves a, and a more accurate calculation with the podcast calculator. And so we're defining those services is where we spend our overhead dollars.

You just have to set aside some of those for yourself. Well, that ties it, that ties it right back into what we talked about at the beginning.

Yeah, I know.

Yeah, getting the business or doing the business, that's it. Yeah, absolutely. Jimmy, how do we, uh, how do people find Design Tunnel if they want to learn more about what you do?

Um, we're really active on Instagram, LinkedIn, um, Facebook. We're there too, but I would say we're really active on Instagram currently.

And a face like that, of course you're on Gram.

It's not about me.

No, no, no, I haven't looked at your Instagram channel, but it's got to be Wahlberg all over the place.

No, it's not all about me. It's just behind the scenes or, yeah, some, some content.

Um, you're missing out then. You're missing out on an opportunity. Yeah, get those abs in shape. Do some, uh, you know, they're in there.

They're just hidden, man. They're just hidden. Um, you know, the point of the, the videos is because I, I do have a, a plan to ask him to be on Behind the Unicorn. Mark Wahlberg. That is one of my goals, to have him on the show. And, you know, I was like, hey man, I hear people, people say you look like me all the time, you know.

See what he thinks. Well, you can bump my slot for him if you get him on the show. You can, you can bump me.

Listen, I'll have all these videos to show him that people saying, hey, you look like Mark Wahlberg. I'll have all these videos to show him to say, come on, man, be on the show.

I, the I think it's a brilliant strategy. Listeners will have those links in the show notes. If you like what you've heard, please rate the podcast, share the podcast, subscribe to the podcast. If you don't like what you've heard, shoot us a message. Let us know what you want to hear and we'll get rid of Jimmy. Yeah.

Until then, DesignTunnel.com. That's the best way to get a hold of us. DesignTunnel.com. You can, you at the top of our website, you can text me, you can call me, you can schedule a Zoom meeting or book a tour.

Or get a selfie if you want.