Wreck the Room | Jody Friedman

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Welcome to another episode of The Profitable Creative, the only place on the interwebs where you will learn how to turn your passion into profit. I am your host, Christian Brim. Special shout out to our one listener in Helsinki, Finland. Yes, we are international. Helsinki, Finland. That reminds me of the line from Die Hard, but that's Just another, you know, where, you know what I'm talking about?

Remind me, because I love that.

Well, like, the, the, uh, they're, they're talking about the terrorists that have captured the hostages, and one of the news anchors wants to be real smart, smart. And they said, uh, they, we think they might have ties to Helsinki. And he goes, Helsinki, Sweden, or something like that.

That's right. Anyway, now here— now is that a holiday film for you?

Absolutely, it is. It is a Christmas movie. Um, I'm sorry, let me introduce you. Jody Friedman, welcome to the show.

Sorry. It's okay, thanks for having me. Good to be here.

Absolutely. Uh, yes, it is a holiday film. Um, strangely, the only one we seem to watch anymore, uh, is Christmas Vacation. Um, that's, that's our go-to Christmas holiday. Yeah.

Yes.

Yes. We went to a holiday party last week and it was themed Christmas Vacation and there was Christmas Vacation trivia and door prizes. It was a great time.

Oh, how fun. Yeah.

Jody, tell us a little bit about Jody Friedman Inc. Sure.

Yeah. I mean, I've— it's funny when I get the question, how long have you been in business for this company? I, I recently really started launching or branding myself as Jody Friedman, but Jody Friedman's been in business for as long as I can remember. So my business is I'm a speaker and I'm a coach, and I've been developing a program called Wreck the Room, which is about, well, how can I explain it quickly? Or I can sum it up. Essentially, we all have good and bad things that happen to us when we're younger. And these things that happen to us shape our identity early on. And the way I've operated throughout my life and viewed it is that these things that happen to us could be— are these bricks. Imagine bricks that you start building a room from. And brick one could be as simple as don't speak up. Who knows why? Maybe someone told you don't talk a lot or shut up a lot. And that becomes a brick. Another brick could be Love isn't safe, right? That becomes a brick. Another brick could be, I have to be perfect to be valuable. That could be a brick. And we all build these rooms that we operate from and we carry that forward into adulthood. Most adults are still operating from rooms that we built as children. And we never really learn, or they're really, at least as far as I've seen, there's no method to evolve and wreck that room so you can evolve and rock the new room that you're supposed to be in. So, my process, Wreck the Room, is about having the courage to tear down those walls and wreck the room and then step into or rock the new room boldly and with intention and from a place of internal power. Because when you do have these things happen to you when you're younger, without realizing it, you're giving away your power. And we have to reclaim that power and get it back.

So I can just tell from your gray hair, this isn't your first gig. So how did you get here? What, what, what things did you do before?

Yeah, well, I spent 20 years and I'm still working in the entertainment business. I was a— a long time ago, I was a struggling recording artist. And songwriter. And I worked at CNN at the time, worked at CNN for 7 years, starting in Atlanta and then New York, and then came out west. I worked on Larry King briefly for a couple of years back in '07, '08. And when I was at CNN in New York, well, the story goes, this is, this is the path. I was a songwriter, recording artist. I got a job at CNN. CNN hosted a talent show in 2002, because that was the year that American Idol was in its inception, was season 1 of American Idol. So CNN hosted something called CNN Idol. So I wrote a song about my job called the Prompter Song. I was a teleprompter operator. It was all about working your way up the corporate ladder from prompter operator to director. And I played it. I performed it at the Tabernacle in Atlanta, Georgia, in front of all the company executives. I won first place. It was $12,000 and the respect of my peers. And really what it did is it brought the whole company together and it was really, really cool. And that was the first time for me that I realized that I couldn't just stick to the traditional path, even though everything said climb the corporate ladder. And, you know, that's what society was telling me to do. It's what we're trained to do from a young age. When I wrecked that room and did something out of left field, that was aligned with who I was. So I spent the last— the next several years trying to find a way out of the corporate world, even though I had a good job. I did. Like, CNN was a really good job. I worked at Time Warner Center. We had beautiful views of Central Park. And towards the end of my time in New York, I transferred to New York. I had an opportunity to work on Good Morning America because I interned there back in 2000. It was a great opportunity, like associate producer role, you know, the perfect path for, for someone like me, a creative climbing up in news. But by that time, I, I really was at a place where I didn't want to work in news anymore. I was burnt out on it. It was being flooded with negativity. I never liked the news when I was younger. I didn't watch the news. Like, It was just— I mean, I'm a sensitive guy. So all that negative news just got to me. So I turned that job down at GMA, even though they're not negative news, they're mostly positive. But I turned it down because I would never see my wife and we just got married. And it was weekends and overnights. And the first time I made a decision that was more aligned with who I was and the path that I wanted to go down and what was important to me, which was family, building a family. So turn that down. And then my wife and I, we, um, we headed out west in 2006. But the impetus for that, again, moving in alignment, was when I was in New York working at CNN, I was still gigging, I was performing, and I was on the way to a show. And the executive producer of the show I worked on called Nancy Grace Do you know Nancy Grace is? I, yes, I do. She's a sweetheart. And her EP Dean Sicoli, he stopped me in the hall and started talking to me about music. And I have a feeling this was at Nancy's request. So I was Nancy's A2. I would get her mic'd up and bring her her coffee and whatever she needed to feel comfortable. And we became friends. And I think she nudged Dean to talk to me. And Dean said, you know, we need a new theme song for the show. So I said, well, I can do that. So I went home that night, I put together some loops and samples in GarageBand, brought it in the next day, and it became the running theme song for 2 years. So now I had quit my job and headed out west before this happened, where I received the royalties for that theme song. So we were on our way across the country., and I received $30,000 in royalties. It was more money than I'd ever made from my music. I mean, back in bars, if you're lucky, you can make $300. So it was eye-opening for me that I can make a living doing something I love. So when we got out west, I started my sync agency, my licensing agency, and then a couple of years later, started music supervising.. And since then, I've had, you know, I've licensed tens of thousands of songs. I supervised a lot of films and TV shows. I'm currently working on The Bachelor. I'm the music supervisor for The Bachelor franchise, and it's been really great. It's been a great run. In 2020, part of the Great Reset, Hollywood froze. I started coaching online, and I really fell in love with coaching, and it brought me full circle back to when I was younger and I was teaching. And that really fills me up. And over time, you know, you do something long enough, and I know a lot of people want to do what I do. They want to license their music, and that's why I coach musicians to do that as well. We do something long enough and it just becomes second nature. For me, I am what I've just learned, this thing about Human Design. Have you heard of this Human Design concept?

Uh, maybe. Keep talking.

Yeah. So, um, what I just learned is that I'm a, according to the Human Design concept, I'm a manifest generator. And what that means is, um, if I say something, this has been true for my whole life. If I say something out loud and I commit to it, I'm going to do this. I'm going to have this. I'm going to accomplish this. It happens eventually. It just happens. And there's, there's a certain type of people that, that, that works for, and they're called manifest generators according to this. Human Design. But part of what comes with that is jumping around a lot. And I do move around a lot. I wear so many different hats. Graphic designer, publisher, songwriter, uh, coach, speaker. Like, I can bounce around because I enjoy it and I commit to things. The negative to that is that oftentimes I spread myself too thin. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes. Okay.

This is, this is fascinating stuff here. Okay. So if I were to meet you in a bar and, you know, men always lead with like, well, what do you do? That seems to be the, uh, the way we identify ourselves and with each other. What, how would you describe it? What, what would you say?

It is actually one of my— I don't like that question because I don't like the concept. I don't, because I don't like the concept of painting ourselves in a box. But I get it. What would I say? I would say, well, I've worked in the entertainment business for about 20 years. I'm a music supervisor for The Bachelor, and I also speak and I coach, and I'm really a serial entrepreneur. I have multiple businesses.

That's a great answer. So do you feel like you would have ended up doing coaching if it had not been for the pandemic at all?

That's a great question.

I know, that's what I do.

I ask good questions. It's, I feel like because it feels so aligned with who I am, that eventually it would have presented itself in some way. I was already— part of what led to it was musicians, they'll always reach out to me, of course, wanting me to help them. And most of them are handing me their music, saying, please listen to this and put it in your project. But oftentimes I'll just hop on and talk to them. And I was, I was naturally wanting to help them and see what's going on. So I was already coaching, I just wasn't— it wasn't a business, I wasn't monetizing it, right? Um, part of it was also, I have to give her credit, my wife suggesting it to me. Um, at the time she worked for Kajabi, which is an online course hosting platform that I host my program through, and she just said, have you considered doing this? And when she mentioned that, like, that's a great idea, I'd love that. So I started it.

So, so who is your coaching, uh, and course designed for? Who, who, who's the ideal customer there?

Well, if you're a musician, we coach you at Elite Music Coaching. And if you're not a musician, if you're an entrepreneur, if you're a coach, uh, if you're a high achiever and you find yourself feeling successful on paper, you've done all the things, you feel successful, but something feels off and it doesn't feel like as you should. Like, by now you're looking at yourself and you're saying, why am I not fulfilled? Essentially, why am I not fulfilled? Why am I not feeling happy about what I do every day? If you're feeling that way, then it's likely you're operating from an old identity that you've outgrown. Mm-hmm. And a lot of people think there's something wrong with me. There's nothing wrong with you. You're not broken. You've just evolved, but you haven't built this new identity or designed this new identity that you want to step into. So part of my process is, you know, recognizing the identity that you've built, naming the room you're in, exposing the lie that you tell yourself. From whatever those bricks have, you know, built up. All those experiences, all those limiting beliefs, exposing that and then designing the new room that you want to be in. You know, what does your— what does your day look like? Where do you live? What does your week look like? What does your year look like? What does your next 3 years look like? Who do you surround yourself with? Who do you stop surrounding yourself with? What types of habits are you wanting to break? What types of habits are you wanting to implement? Uh, so kind of taking them through that step by step. And, and then once they've designed the new room and we wreck this, this identity that they've built, which is, you know, disrupting cycles and dismantling roles and reclaiming that power, finding out what that, what that power was that you gave away and learning how to reclaim it, take control of it. Then we step into the new room and we anchor that new identity through habit stacking and time blocking and other exercises that I take them through. It's really an incredible program, and it's, it's not, it's not a light lift. It's a heavy lift. So, um, for anyone who goes through it, it's, it's a lot of work. You got to do the work. But I have a, I have a system. We can get it done in 90 days. And possibly less, we could get it done in less, but I like to give people time to go through it and not feel like they're rushed to do everything.

Yeah, I think, I don't know this, but from the outside looking in and from talking to people like yourself on this program, I think there's a mythos around being a performing artist. Or being in the music or film industry about like what it really is. And then when people get on the other side of it, even if they are successful monetarily or professionally, there's a big letdown because it's not— it doesn't— fulfill them the way that they thought it would fulfill them, you know. And, and some people adapt, you know. I, I can think of, like, one of the original people that I can think of that really, uh, pivoted was Danny Elfman, um, who I listened to Oingo Boingo. That was my go-to as a teenager. I was, I was, uh, very much into alternative, although I don't know that I'd call Oingo go alternative. But then he, you know, surfaced doing the soundtrack to Batman, the first Batman. That's right. And, you know, completely changed from a performer to, you know, a producer. And, and, and I thought, you know, that had to take a lot of courage because you're, you're successful in something and, and then that comes with expectations. I You know, you're, you're, you're, you're performing, you're making money, then people expect you to keep doing it. Because a lot of people have vested interest in you continuing to do what you're doing. Sure. And, and so there's that pressure to continue and to be able to say, no, I think I'm going to do something different. That's, that's a tough challenge.

Now, did Danny continue at all performing? I know when he became a composer that he continued with Tim Burton and others. Did he continue performing as an artist after that?

He has. Last time I checked, and this is in the last 12 months, yeah, he has done a— he's performing live and doing a lot of his old stuff, but also some new stuff. Which, you know, that's also a challenge for artists because again, you kind of get pigeonholed into something and your fans expect, you know, like they want what they like. And then, you know, if you as an artist want to go a different direction, well, that's like, ah. And a lot of artists don't have the talent, frankly. I mean, you know, to go between, genres. I, I think back about like Linda Ronstadt is probably the OG of that because she, she was, you know, all over the board, uh, in genres. Um, you know, Prince was very successful at it, but who's got that talent, right?

Like, I mean, yeah, not a lot, not a lot of people. Yeah, I mean, Trent Reznor is another one. Trent and Atticus from Nine Inch Nails. You know, he was— they're now composing a lot. They Might Be Giants, you know, they had their, their albums and then they started doing children's shows and children's music. And, you know, it's part of being a creative is you want to adapt and you want to try different things and be creative. I believe what drives most creative professionals is impact, you know, wanting to impact people and You know, it, it's, um, you can do it from a stage, you can do it, you know, in a stadium, and you can do it behind the scenes, um, music and projects. So it's all, it's all related. And even non-musicians in the space, as you mentioned, some people get into the space and, you know, they want to make movies and they want to be impacted or impact people the way they were impacted. Through films. And yeah, I think sometimes, sometimes it's, uh, it's a lot— I don't know how else to say this— prettier on the outside than once you get in and do it and you realize, oh, it's not as magical as I— it's, it's better to experience it as a viewer sometimes than to actually make the project. And, um, I mean, I just as I produced my first feature film as a second producer, and I learned a lot. And it was, it was an interesting process. I did it because my son is an actor and I want to teach him how to produce because so he can cast himself. I think that's really important to succeed as an actor. You have to know how to produce. I believe that that's where it's, that's where it's headed, if not where it already is. So I learned about it and I'll probably do another one just to polish that skill set. But, you know, it's not— it's neat to see it come together. It's always enjoyable to see it come together. But there's all the grind that goes with it. I'm trying to get into film festivals and then trying to get a distributor, making sure you're not getting screwed over by the distributor.

And once you know, there's, you know, yeah, every business, every business has a model. Right? And, and entertainment in general is one of the most complex models that I've ever seen. Like, all the fingers in the pie, uh, is really— was really eye-opening to me, uh, understanding, you know, where all the money went. Um, how, you know, how do you balance the creative side with the business side? Like, okay, I need to monetize this. I need to make money at it. Like, like the coaching, like, you know, I, I enjoy doing this. Um, and I could do it for free, but like, how do, how do I get paid? Do you, so like, how do you, how do you approach that? But also, how do you decide what you want to get paid on versus what you want to just do for the fun of it or for free? Hey listeners, are you ready to turn your passion into profit? Then grab a copy of Profit First for Creatives. Click the link in the show notes to purchase a copy. And if you're not ready to make that full commitment, you can download a free copy of the first chapter. Check it out right now.

Well, I'm very fortunate that these days I, I'm very selective about who I work with and what I'll take on. I don't really— I tend not to work with people for free anymore. I value my time, I value my knowledge, and I value my skill set. And if someone wants to work with me and I feel like it's a good fit, then we'll work together. But I've also worked very hard at designing the life that I've wanted, and that involves, you know, working maybe 8 to 10 hours a week and spending time with my family and traveling a lot with my family. And, you know, I do enjoy working. Like, I was having this talk with my wife last week that there's a lot of You know, a lot of people drawn to this idea of, well, just, I would, I would, oh, if only I never had to work again. And in theory, that's good. But when you're not working, you're kind of on, I don't know, for me anyway, I need to be working. I like working. I like accomplishing things. I like earning money. I like building a business. I like solving the puzzle of it. I think I'm a rare creative in that I enjoy the business as much as I enjoy the creative part of it. So I view the business as an art itself. Music publishing is an art. Coaching is an art. Funnels and, you know, opt-ins and lead magnets and all of that, like that was eye-opening for me. It's like solving a puzzle, putting a puzzle together. And I really enjoy doing puzzles. So, that's enjoyable for me. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think you said you don't work for free. And I think that that's especially, well, no, I'd say universally. The idea of doing something for free, you know, even if it's something that is, very altruistic in nature. Yeah. Um, it sets up a strange paradigm because the reality is people value what they pay for.

100%. Yeah.

And, and so if, if you work with me and I don't pay you, I can't value value what you give me as much as if I'd paid for it. It's just not possible. It's the way the human mind works. And so, you know, a lot of people are like, well, I don't want to charge for what I do, but I think that's a false paradigm. Like, I don't, even if your intent is I want to do good, right? Like, well, great. Good, but get paid.

Like, it's not, it's not even, you know, if you don't need the money, you still, you still need to charge so that people will invest in themselves. So when they make that commitment, they're making a mental commitment to themselves. And I've played with different price points for different products. And the ones who get the most success are the ones who invest the most because they're showing up for themselves.

Yeah, absolutely.

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Okay, so we're going to go back to what you started with. With, with bricks and self-limiting beliefs, things that you experienced. What were the most challenging bricks that you had to get rid of?

Oh yeah. Good question.

Again, that's what I do, Cody.

I'm picking up on that. I like it. Well, I grew up in, in chaos. Um, my parents divorced when I was 6. Well, they separated when I was 6. They divorced technically when I was 8. Um, I lived in probably 16 or 17 different houses by the time I was 6 to 17 years old. And, you know, my mom, she was in an abusive relationship. And I remember waking up one night and I heard a loud noise and I had my He-Man pajamas on. I was, I was like a big He-Man fan. You remember He-Man, Masters of the Universe? Yeah, absolutely. You know, and which— Skeletor. Skeletor. And, you know, He-Man was like this average guy, but when he held up his sword, he, you know, he said, I have the power, and he reclaimed that power, and then he could destroy anything. Um, I heard that loud noise down the hall, and I walked down the hall, and I turned the corner, and my mom was Well, there was this, this giant of a man that she was dating at the time. And he went to punch her and he missed luckily and hit the drywall. And I locked eyes with my mom and she just said, Jody, go back to bed. And I think that, that moment, that was a brick for me of I need to protect my family. It instilled this role of the protector, which is good in some ways, but it also can lead to a little overkill of protection, protecting. Um, and then my mom, she, she moved far away to Washington. I lived in Florida, so she essentially abandoned my brother and I, moved to Washington. And my father was still with us, but, um, he started drinking, so I didn't really have anyone. And this was I was young and I learned to survive on my own at a young age. So the bricks for me were, if I want to build something that lasts, I need to do it on my own. Love isn't safe. I'm on my own. And the one place that I could control and find solace in was my achievements and my accomplishments. I played soccer. I really worked hard at being as good as I could be in that game. I was really good at getting good grades, taking tests. I graduated 4.8. I was summa cum laude with my degree at FSU. So I became the performer and the achiever. And literally then I started performing on stage with my guitar. And that was reinforced for me at that CNN talent show. And it was great. It was a great experience, but it really cemented something dangerous for me to live by. And it was this thought that if I'm not performing, if I'm not achieving, I'm not valued, I'm not loved, and they'll realize I'm not worth sticking around for.

Thank you for sharing that. I have another podcast called The Chris Project, and on that show we discuss, uh, entrepreneurial mindset, uh, mental health, wellness, um, and I've had a lot of discussions with entrepreneurs about those things that you're talking about. One of the conversations I, I had was with an entrepreneur who, uh, had a 9-figure exit, um, in his 40s. So generational wealth, right? Um, and got depressed because, like, what do I do now? Um, what I built is, is gone. It's somebody else's baby now. Um, wow. And, uh, he decided to go back and get his doctorate in psychology. And I recently had him on the show. He's— I, I consider him a personal friend as well, um, to discuss his, um, his work on his, his thesis, on his doctoral thesis.

Yeah.

And it was fascinating what he discovered, which he had, he had really kind of theorized, um, but hadn't— didn't have any concrete evidence to show it. But the, the thought is this, that entrepreneurs oftentimes are starting a business to solve their own problem, even though consciously they probably don't realize that, right? It certainly wasn't the case for me. I didn't understand that I was trying to solve my problem. But the longer you stick with entrepreneurship, entrepreneurship, the more you actually heal yourself.

Wow.

It provides that crucible that you can't find being an employee that forces you to address those problems. Now, the Chris Project I started because of a client of mine that took his own life. And so not, not everybody solves their own problem. Some, some people can't escape those demons. Yeah, but it is interesting to me and it has been my own experience and it sounds like it's your experience that this journey of entrepreneurship has allowed you to heal yourself, to fix yourself, to solve your problems?

Huh. I think that I began trying to solve my problem, but it also exacerbated the other problem.

Absolutely.

The performer, the overachiever. The perfectionist, all of those things get, you know, as you, as you, um, as your power grows, your, um, I believe your— I don't want to say faults, but your— the areas you need to work on, they grow at the same pace and they get bigger and bigger and bigger. Just like as you get more successful, if the things you haven't worked on also become larger. So that really changed for me when I lost my dad in 2013. My dad got sober. I moved out west in 2006 and we did a lot of work and we were really close again. And then he died and it was sudden. I didn't get to say goodbye. And after that, I fell apart. Like, all the success, all the achievements, they didn't matter. I was back to that little kid. Like, I was literally that little kid again, lost. Um, and that all changed for me when I, you know, I almost destroyed my marriage. I almost lost my family. And I came home one night, my wife—

the exact things that you didn't want to happen, right?

Exactly, exactly. And I, I mean, I, when I was younger, I promised, I made a promise to myself that I wanted a family. I wanted a perfect family, a boy and a girl. And but it wasn't the promise that I— it wasn't just about the promise of having a family. It was about redeeming the family that I had lost. And as I got older, the exact thing I didn't want to happen was staring me in the face. And that was the moment that I recognized I was able to look at myself and recognize the room that I had built and the room I needed to wreck. I started replacing behaviors and trying new things that I didn't feel comfortable doing because I wasn't comfortable being vulnerable. I thought I had to just be the strong one and protect and keep it together. And when I started doing those new things, replacing those habits with new habits, everything changed for me. So that was, yeah, that was when I really woke up. And am I still an entrepreneur? Absolutely. But now I'm living a life that's more aligned with who I am and working on things that fulfill me on a deep, deep level, not surface level. And not that there's anything wrong with chasing, you know, what you think you want to do. Like, that's how you find that path. It's how I found the path. I never imagined, Christian, that I would have songs in movies and trailers and TV shows. I never imagined in my wildest dreams that would happen, or that I'd be music supervising projects like the decision maker, putting other people's music in projects. It is a dream job and is fulfilling in so many ways. So, and now helping others learn how to do that. And helping others live in alignment. I will say that part of the reason I shifted over to coaching other high achievers in addition to the musicians— because musicians have been kicked down so much and rejected so much, it's such a heavy lift. There are so many blocks, there's so many blocks. And I wish every musician would go through this program and figure out what identity is keeping they're stuck in. Usually it's the waiting for approval room. As an actor, as a musician, you're waiting for approval instead of doing it yourself. Like, stop waiting and take action and do it yourself. That's when stuff starts happening for anybody really in any business.

But my, my daughter, uh, is a— one of my daughters, my younger daughter, uh, is a figurative oil painter. And I I remember, uh, when she had a— she was actually selling prints of her original work, and she had a TikTok, I think, that went viral. And she was getting so many orders, she was like, I don't know what to do.

And I'm like, incredible.

Stop, stop taking orders. Like, I mean, that's a simple fix. I'm like, if you can't fill the orders But that particular viral post also came with some extremely negative feedback. And, you know, I watched her struggle with this where she had success on one hand and criticism on the other for the same thing.

Yeah.

And I just said, I said, you can't, you can't you can't look for your validation and then not accept the criticism. So like, you've either got to not care, like not seek your validation there, or, you know, accept the commentary. Like, you can't have— you can't take the good without the bad, right?

Yeah.

Eventually, she got out of that space. She doesn't do that stuff. She's, you know, went a different direction, went for the galleries and that thing. But I think back about one of my conversations with Dr. Patel several years ago, and we were talking about— he made the comment, he said, you know, entrepreneurs don't have very good coping mechanisms. And I said, well, I've never heard it described in clinical terms, but I said, you're right. Like, they don't. And then I had this insight. I said, no. I said, in fact, I think for a lot of them, the business becomes their coping mechanism, which is a terrifying place to be because what you said, these characteristics amplify. And if you're an entrepreneur, there's this allure that you control all the variables, right? So you control who you do business with, who you use as vendors, who you have as employees. And so you can create this coping mechanism that allows you to not ever have to deal with your shit. Until, until it breaks, like it will. I mean, you can't avoid it, but, um, yeah. What, what, what say you to that, that, that the business is your coping mechanism?

Yeah. I mean, I always say that, um, people, you asked earlier, when they asked me, what do I do? I said, well, I do this, this, and this, but my boss, he's a real a-hole, you know, like, oh, I'm sorry. You have to deal with that. Well, I'm the boss. Yes. You know, and that's— it's true. Like, you, you set this standard for yourself. And as an entrepreneur, when you're building a business from scratch, there's this— what comes with that is everything's on the line when you go all in, like everything. So you're, you're saying yes, yes, yes, yes. And eventually, for me, I got to the point where I, I couldn't say yes anymore because I was so, um— and when you say no, especially that first time, it's scary because you're turning down business. Mm-hmm. But that's, you know, that's been really helpful for me is I focus enough on the yeses. I built a business that, you know, a multiple 7-figure business, and I need to say no. And still, I still get shiny object syndrome. I think that's pretty common with entrepreneurs. See things that I can do and I know I could crush it and do it well. Just because I can do it doesn't mean I should do it. And that's a mindset game as well. Mindset's everything in finding alignment and success and being in balance with those two things. It's all mindset.

Yes. And what I have found in my own journey, and I see a lot with others, that the characteristics that allowed you to be successful Eventually they turn into liabilities. That's right. And they impede you. To your point, like, you know, if you received validation from doing excellent work, that helped you build a business until it didn't work, right? And I'm talking about the success of the business, not your own internal validation, because To your point, it's like, well, I can't do anymore. And so then it becomes a liability. And most entrepreneurs, when they get to that inflection point, aren't willing to do the work, as you call it, to fix the problem.

Right. Yeah. Wreck what no longer serves you. Some things that, you know, got you that far are going to continue serving you, but there's other things that won't. And knowing that balance— being an achiever is not always a bad thing. You get— you achieve what you set out to do. But knowing that, again, knowing when to say no and knowing I shouldn't do this, I shouldn't do that, that did take work. It's still— it's a work in progress. I still work on it. I'm not preaching this from, you know, the top of the mountain. It's— I'm literally in the rubble with a flashlight saying, hey, let's, let's find a way out of here. What are you dealing with? Yeah. Yes.

Yes.

I mean, I went with a friend recently and he was struggling with some things and, you know, I'm just listening to him and tell his story and We were able to identify what room he was living in, in a conversation, and he's in the silent room. And that's a big part of it. It's really important to name the room. If you're thinking about this, if you're listening to this, uh, and you're wondering, well, you're starting to see what bricks you formed, and that's the hardest part, really figuring out, recognizing what you've built. But naming it is really important. When you name it, you can see it clearly, the you know, the safe bunker or the performer's room or the silent vault, whatever you want to call it, you name it. And then the lie that it exposes is usually, what lie am I telling myself? Well, if you're a silent one, then your lie would be, I have to stay silent to stay safe, to stay loved. Well, the truth is going to be the opposite. The opposite of that. I am loved regardless. If I speak, I'm still loved. If I— I'm loved if I express my, my voice and my opinions, I still will be loved and I'll be safe. It's— it sounds so simple, but it really is that simple. It's the opposite of the lie that you tell yourself is the truth. And when you start speaking that out loud and you commit to that, that's when you reclaim that power.

Become He-Man.

Yeah, just step into who you really are. Most people don't do that. Most people spend their whole life living, you know, unless they're by themselves, have a mask on.

Yes, there's, there's a great book I just finished, and, uh, the author Brody Waite is going to be on the Chris Project in January. The book is Great Leaders Live Like Drug Addicts, and it's his story. But you used the term mask, and he identifies 3 things that you have to do to be a good leader that he learned in addiction. And the first one is that, you know, as an addict, he wore a mask to show what he thought others wanted to see, right? So it wasn't his true self. It was a lie. But he did that to solve the second thing, which is you can't control the outcomes. But because he couldn't control the outcomes, he would put on a mask to basically deceive people to get what he wanted, right? Or what he thought he could get. And his solution to that in being a great leader is radical authenticity.

Radical.

Yeah. Being who you are regardless of what others may think. And as a leader, that's difficult because the expectation that people put on you as the leader is that, well, you know all the answers. You can solve this. You can fix this, right? And sometimes we can't. And it's important to be able to say, I don't know. I don't know the answer to this. I would also say, going back to what you were talking about beliefs, I had a coach, not my coach, but another coach explain this to a group of entrepreneurs. And the way he described it was very simplistic, and it just really resonated with me. And a lot of people, when you start talking about beliefs and feelings, they're not comfortable with that because it feels too squishy, right? Too woo-woo. But the way he described it to me was he said, think about it this way. Your brain works on programs. Most of it is subconscious, and that's on purpose because you can't function making all the decisions that you have to make in a day if you had to think about them. Right? Like, those are subroutines that are below our conscious level. Right. And I'm like, okay, that makes sense. Here's the problem. Those beliefs, those routines drive your conscious behavior. Right. And if you never take them out of your subconscious and bring them into your conscience and analyze, okay, why am I doing this? Why am I saying this? Why do I feel this way? Like, if you don't bring them into your conscience, you can't ever change the routine, right?

100%.

Yeah. And so that, that was a clarity that I'm like, yeah, that totally makes sense because that, that to me was like that appealed to the scientific part of it, right? It's not, you know, but regardless, you know, to your point, you have beliefs and you are acting on them. And if you don't like the resulting actions, if you don't like the outcomes, the only way you can change it is to go look at what those beliefs are that are driving that behavior.

What formed those beliefs? And usually they're not even They're formed by other people experiencing. 100%. Yeah.

You don't have any beliefs. You picked them up along the way.

That's right. That's right. Yeah. And you stopped asking yourself, well, what do I believe? Because of what society or other people told you, your parents' expectations, whatever it might be.

Yeah. As an, and as an entrepreneur, That again, if you, if you think about it, okay, so you start this business because you're trying to control the variable that you want to fix, right?

Yeah.

And, and then you, you start doing that thing, and then you have all of your beliefs and expectations that others have put on you, uh, your peers, whatever, your parents, like, this is what success looks like, right? And, and you can get 10, 20, 30 years down the road and you're operating and you have idea what you're doing, what you're doing. You're just there, right?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's, I mean, there's plenty of, plenty of millionaires, multimillionaires, probably, I'm sure billionaires that are looking around to like the example you gave earlier and realizing what, what am I doing? Why am I not fulfilled? And it, yeah, there's not, it's not a money, money won't solve that. Alignment will solve it. And I do believe when people work in alignment, they will have fulfillment. But finding that balance, being in balance and working from a place of your internal power is a challenge. It is a heavy lift.

And you have to do the work, which is the third thing that Brody Wade said. You have to do the work. You have to have the hard conversations. You have to, you know, You've got to draw the boundaries. You've got to, you've got to do the hard work.

That's right.

Jody, how do people work with you? How do they connect with you?

Yeah, they can go to my website, jodyfriedman.com. J-O-D-Y Friedman spelled like fried man. And they land on the website and there you'll see I have an application to see if it's a fit. Or not. And if it's a fit, then we can hop on a call, uh, and have a conversation and see how we can help.

Uh, I love that. And then if we want to listen to your work, we can watch The Bachelor. I told my wife, um, that if she left me, I was going to go on Golden Bachelor. Do you have any work? You're not working on that one, right?

No, I am working. Yeah, I'm working on all the, all the series, the Golden Bachelor just finished.

Okay, so I have an in. So I've got leverage. I'm going to tell her like, this is not an empty threat anymore. Yeah.

Yeah. That's good.

Yeah. Listeners will have those links in the show notes. Sorry. I hope my wife's not listening. She probably isn't. We'll have those links in the show notes. If you like what you've heard, please rate the podcast, share the podcast. Subscribe to the podcast. If you don't like what you've heard, shoot us a message, uh, tell us what you'd like to hear, and we'll replace Jody. Until then, ta-ta for now.