3 Brains Coaching - How To Align Head, Heart & Gut For Better Decisions? Life Coach Nizam Insights

Great, got it.

Hi, Christoffel, how are you?

I'm doing great, Nisam, and how are you in, I assume, hot India?

I'm fine too. Thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to interview you. So, friends, let me brief a little bit about Christoffel. So Christoffel comes with 32 years of experience in coaching, training, and consulting. And, um, he has, uh, you know, coached, trained people from Europe, Middle East, India, Asia, USA, Australia, you know, 10,000+ people in small training groups and face-to-face. And he's also a psychotherapist, clinical hypnotherapist. Master in NLP, Reiki, author, which we'll be going to know more about it. Just, I'm keeping it short though. There is a lot about him. He was an associate professor. Oh my God, lot, lot, lot. So let me keep it short and straight away get back to Christoffel. So Christoffel, how did your journey begin into so many things and You are like, how did you get started as a coach?

I think just like almost like Buddha would like to say, the longer life you have, the more experience you can obtain. So I'm just part of it. If I hear myself, I hear you say 32 years of experience, I think, oh yes, that's true, I'm getting, say, quote unquote old. 32 years ago, how do I became in this? Because I studied commercial engineering. So you could say, how come, how is it possible that commercial engineer ends up being a coach and therapist? Actually, in all my life, I always had an interest in people. As being, say, bullied at school, I learned to know from, hey, I have to look at people and see if they're safe or not safe. And from my own upbringing, always, now we all do it as kids and parents to come over here, how's mommy and daddy and my sister, how are they actually interacting? And somewhere that's one of my qualities. Never knew it was my qualities, but I thought it was normal. So when I was, say, somewhere in my beginning of my 30s, me and the owner/director of the company where I was marketing manager decided that it was better that we would have our own ways. That's a nice way to say you got sacked. I made the decision, what do I really like to do in my life? And I knew a behavioral training company number one in Europe. And I thought, I'm going to work for them. So I still remember I called them and said, okay, I'm going— what, guys, I'm going to work for you, how does it work? And of course there was something like, thanks for that, you like to work with us? The answer is no because we filled our applications, etc. I said, I don't mind your answer is no, but how can I work for you? Because that was my question. Long story short, after 2 months they said, if we cannot really kick him out of our office, we just have to hire him. So I became part of that team and then really my journey started and got a massive amount of training because as they were number one in Europe, you got 60 days of training in your first year to become a trainer.

Oh.

So I was really swamped with education and I really felt on my place that you're a life coach in some sense, so I think you can relate to it, that it's somewhere for some people it gives a really warm feeling if you see that somebody else Has a better life, is helped, achieves his or her goals, just has a smile back on their face. Something that appealed to me right away. Hey, it's so nice to see that somebody says, "Thank you, Chris. I'm doing better in my job," or "I had a great whatever." So that started my journey. During the journey, I came aware that although I thought I knew a lot, that still people could not be helped. On one moment, I ran. After ten years working for the company, I get a burnout. And I thought, I work now ten years for this company. I'm one of the seniors. How can I get a burnout when I think I know so much? But think I know so much, not feel I know so much. That burnout learned me that I'm amazingly good in thinking and actually pushing away my pain because I love sports. Did Olympic triathlon when I was younger, and there you have to adjust the pain. Otherwise, you will never swim, run, and bike. So what I thought was good in sport, I adjusted to all my life. Pain is part of the game. Now, if you have emotional pain, it's not part of the game. It means do something now. So in my burnout, it came over here, hey, I don't listen to my feelings. And that opened a new spark. Okay, if I don't listen to my feelings, how can I learn to listen to my feelings? But what does it mean for my coaching and training work? So I learned NLP, hypnotherapy, haptonomy— that's something like the art of feeling in Holland. I thought, if, if it happens to me, it means it will happen to a lot of people. And I saw it around me. Burnout now is something like 14% of the workforce in Holland. I saw that last week in the newspapers— are experiencing it. So 1 out of 7 people In de werkverster Holland, are experiencing burnout signs. So that means what I had 15 years ago is rather quote quote normal, although it's not normal. And so I specialized more in it, and 10 years ago I moved or emigrated to Australia. And then I really said, you know, I love already therapy. Let's make it also my job. So I studied more in clinical hypnotherapy and psychotherapy. Became a therapist and specialized in depressions, trauma, abuse, and those kind of stuff because I thought, of course, smoke stop smoking and weight loss is fun and alcohol addictions. But it is so nice if we really can help people who are really say quote quote having a huge burden on their shoulders and don't and cannot smile anymore. The trauma work made me aware what I already knew had the body never lies. Okay, if the body never lies, how can we communicate with our body? Because probably you know, we all know we have a conscious and a subconscious. And the subconscious is actually— Nazim, I ask you, where's your subconscious? Where's your unconscious stored in your body or mind? Do you know?

I, I think this, this body is my unconscious mind.

I love your answer, Nisam, because you're so beautifully right. If I would ask that in Europe, in the Western world, they will probably say, I don't know, it's somewhere, and they would point at their head because that's how we're educated in the Western world, not you in India. And so, and that's actually not there. There is no subconscious or unconscious mind in your head. It's much more in your body. Based on that, I became aware we have actually, we have a heart brain physically Scientifically proven, 100 brain cells, 100,000 brain cells, sorry. And we have a gut brain, the second brain, Marco Gershwin, 500 million brain cells in our gut. And of course their objective is how to get the whole intestines organized and how to get the heart organized, but also memory about us.

Yeah.

If you do heart transplant, you could even transplant memories of a person. And this document so many times. The gut is the only part in our body that can actually live independently from the whole body. So when I became aware of those, I thought, if they are real brains, they memorize, they make decisions, then probably they could be really close to our subconscious. And if we never coach or work on people from to ask, hey, what does your heart really say? What does your gut really say? and don't listen to it, then we, we stay, we stay stuck in all the other things. Now that is a long story of the whole journey of 32 years, what brought me actually where I am now, from, hey, we can solve for our coaching clients easily their topics, and even for therapy clients, we could do amazing, quick, and successful work if we really tap into what are the memories in your heart, what are the memories in your gut. connected to this topic. And if you then can get a disconnection from the emotion and the memory, then 9 out of 10, it's solved. Because we both know, why do we have an issue? Because we push an emotion, most times a negative or painful emotion, to a memory. If you can just memorize it and don't have a negative emotion to it, you don't have an issue anymore. Yeah, that's a long story short. I will, I will stop talking because otherwise you think, hey, Chris, stop talking. But you can hear it's my passion, it's my passion. This is really my passion. I see that people can change.

I, I, you know, the beauty of your conversation was you covered almost a few of my questions where I was about to ask about.

Sorry, Nazim, that I answered all your questions. So we can dive deeper on what you'd like to know.

Okay, so most of the coaching models, it's more about thinking, thinking, thinking, logic, logic, logic. Yes. And certain, if we get into therapy, therapeutic work, it is more of an emotional work.

Yes and no. I say I once saw this, I saw a description of Robert Dilts. Robert Dilts is an NLP guru, I'd say in the world seen as one of the best 5 NLP teachers. And he once described it, and I find it rather nice. It is not— therapy is most times working in the past, coaching is more working in the future.

Yes, I agree.

If you make it somewhere black and white, Yes. Now, what's the interesting of that concept? That how can you live in the future if you will not accept and recognize your past? Because we are actually— now, we are our present, but our present is built up of our past. Everything that we have been eating the last 7 years defines us now. If you had a bad meal yesterday you can talk about, okay, let's talk about the future, but if you're now sitting on the toilet half of the day, it will not happen. So then what happened yesterday has a massive impact on today. So for me, if you look at holistic management, you cannot say let's just talk about the future or let's just talk about the past. That should be, in my opinion, this should be integrated.

Yes.

Like yin and yang. So when I talk about coaching, I said, yes, we have to think about the future, But how can the things that happened in our past can be somewhere disconnected or make tangible so we can actually be in control of them so they don't define our future anymore?

True.

So that's my catch on it. And just if you look just at therapy, let's solve the issues from the past, for me is also not the right idea because it should be somewhere connected with the topics here for the future.

Yes.

Yes, so for me, I see it rather as an integration. Having said that, I know that ICF and the EMCC as coaching institutes or associations make that strong line between coaching and therapy or counseling. Now, for me, if I work with a client, I said, for me, the client is the most important thing, the person is the most important thing, and the person comes not for me for coaching, the person comes not for me to therapy, the person comes to me To find a solution. So that's my take on it.

Thank you for that differentiation, Christoffel. So my question was, certain, you know, let us not use the coaching or therapy. There is some logical work happens, sometimes only emotional work happens. Here, your coaching process where you use head brain, heart brain, and gut brain. So individually, could you please explain how do we, how does, you know, head brain differ from the heart brain? How does heart brain differ from gut brain? And what is the best way to integrate it?

A beautiful question, Nizam. And it's also to clarify, it makes sense because for me it makes so much sense, those 3 brains. So In a simple explanation, our head brain— let's go from top to bottom— is our logical brain. If you now think, why do we have a head? What's the most characteristic of our, say, let's say, our head? It is unique in the fact that it knows present and future. And the only part of our body that knows future prediction is our logical head. If you get an— and knows the past, we can only remember really physically the past and address it in our head. If you think, why do we have such a big head or a big brain? It's actually to remember all our past so we can do a better prediction for the future. Because why would we have something between our ears that is taking 23% of our energy consumption on a daily basis if it doesn't make sense nature-wise. Nature does not do stupid things. Nature evolves extremely smart. So the only reason we have 1.5 kilos between our ears that is consuming 24— 23% of our energy is because it helps us to predict the future better. What's the benefit of predicting the future better? Better survival means. If you know that yesterday what you did was not smart, you could do better today. If today is better, you can analyze, hey, what did you do yesterday? What did I do today? How can I make it even better for tomorrow? That's the reason why we have a head. So it's actually our logical process. And in decision-making, it's number 3 in the list. If people say, how do you mean 3 in the list? Authority-wise is number 3. It's almost impossible for your head to overrule the other 2 brains. If people say that's not true, I always say, then just imagine all the things that you have a feeling for and stop them. So then if your head would be the strongest, you would not have any trauma in your life because you would just say, forget it. Don't think about the fact that you were beaten up, betrayed, Misjudged or that kind of things. Just forgive everybody. Forgive all the people who did you wrong. And I think we all know forgiving people who did you wrong is hard, but logically we could. But then people say, but emotionally I cannot. Yes. So your head is number 3 in decision making. Your heart is number 2 or number 1. It depends how you like to define. Your heart is about us. And where do you feel love, Nizam? in your heart.

Yeah.

Your heart is having 3 hormones, actually now more, but 3 hormones that affect our life. That's oxytocin, it can produce oxytocin, it's love hormone. It can produce dopamine, it's the reward system for learning, and it can produce norepinephrine that puts you in action. So hormone-wise, your heart is all about love and action. And it's, as it is, number 2 in a row. Number 1, it can only be number 1 when we sacrifice ourselves for love, like Leonardo DiCaprio did for Kate Winslet in the movie Titanic and let himself drown and Kate Winslet live. Like every parent who sacrifices him or herself for their kids, that's when your heart is stronger. Now we come actually to the brain that is in charge of us. Always, that's our gut brain. It's the, it's the oldest brain. Already 500 million years ago when we were still creatures in the sea, we had a, we had an intestine. If you look at the smallest bacteria in this world or a one-cell organism, what does it do? It gets energy or food in, does his or her process, and poops it out. That's actually the smallest living organism. It does not create poetry, it does not write poems, it does not create movies, theaters, it doesn't know how to make podcasts. It knows how to eat, how to poop, and how is the little survival thing. And we all evolved from that. Our gut is actually the brain that is in charge. And the only thing your gut wants is me, myself, and I. How can I survive? What is good for me? And I don't give any care about somebody else. And it makes sense because if you're a one-cell organism, you don't think, oh, my other cell organism also likes to eat, let's give him something. No, it is me, myself, or I. That's an extremely simple brain but extremely strong. And why is it in charge? Because survival is the strongest thing we like to do as every living entity. That's where your gut brain is in charge. But this is a simple thing. It just thinks about me, myself, and I, simple things. Now your heart and your gut, in differentiation from your head, does not know tomorrow or yesterday. And if I'm— what do I mean with that? If you fall in love, you don't think about the consequences about your loved one. You just think, oh, she or he is amazing.

Butterflies everywhere.

You don't listen to the warnings of your parents, you don't listen to the warnings of your friends because you think you know that she's— she or he's the best. After 1, 2, 3, 4 months or years, you come aware, oh shit, I should have listened to them. They saw what I did was not seen. But your heart is blind and does not think about consequences. Your gut brain the same. You just think that's not true. How many— what's the percentage of obesity in this world? Maybe in India less, but say in the quote-unquote developed world, say the Western world, 1/3 of the population to 50% of the population is obese. We all know obese leads to diabetes 2. Diabetes 2 is actually extremely unhealthy and it is life-shortening. So there is no reason you should get obese for survival means, but your gut brain doesn't think, oh, If I eat this, I get obese. Your gut brain just thinks, I'm now hungry, this is now sweet, this is now a lot of sugar, now it brings— now it brings more energy, more energy now is good, stuff it in my mouth.

Okay.

If your gut brain knew tomorrow, there would not be obese. But your gut brain just thinks, what is good for me now? And if you like to see that, look at, say, a dog or a pig or animals in the wild, they eat the prey as much as they can. They don't think, hey, I just got a zebra, let's cut the zebra in 5 pieces for today, tomorrow, the day after. And hey, a lion would say, I eat as much as I can until I say burp and almost comes out of my ears, then I stop. Because they never know what's there tomorrow. That's how your gut brain works. If you make this all this physical in coaching, because that's your question, that means if you coach people, logically you can say, yes, yeah, I know, I make my action plan. If you don't ask your heart, does your heart think it's good for you and good for the environment, the people you connect with, your heart will sooner or later say, I stop.

Okay.

Your gut brain even is quicker and says The day after or the week after already, is this good for me? What now? Missam decided. Nah, it's not good for me. You know, I'll send a message upstairs. I veto the project. I veto the idea and stops. Hence why people who made all the resolutions from the first of January stop us in one to three weeks because their heart or the gut says terminate is not a good idea. Is not. Connecting this, what's good for us or what is good for me. Now, so if you coach people, if you don't make the check if your heart is in, if your gut is in, in 1 week or 2 weeks or 3 weeks, they stop their action plan. Now, I hope this clarifies in these 2 or 3 minutes without getting in totally lecture of 1 hour. Okay.

And so you have, based on these 3 brains, you have authored a book.

Yeah. Yes, I will. Yes, this one. I show you once.

Yes. So please tell me more about this book and what inspired you to write this book.

A few things. If you Go back to 3 brains.

Yes.

Actually, it helps us to make a whole person, to make aligned decisions. If you now make it simple, if you only think making decisions of your gut brain, you get— you create an egocentric world. That's me, myself, and I. Say, if you look at some presidents of the countries and the former president of the USA as an example, you will see what the gut brain president does. Me, myself, and I, and I don't care about people. God brains bully people. God brain create toxic environments in companies. God brains will kick out the people who are good if they are not in their line. God brains create an actually unhealthy world. If you're only heart brains, then you have extremely sweet world, but you will not come somewhere because we only think about each other and we forget that we also have to live. If you only have head brain people, you come in the world of almost the IT world and the surgeons. Logically makes sense, but you create something like The Matrix where robots are the boss. So all of them are not the most healthy combination to create a world society on. As I told you in one sentence, I've been bullied when I was younger at school. So I know the consequences of when your school kids or your Supposed friends are gut brain people. Now, bullying, abuse, sexual abuse. Now, I sometimes I see say in your country had the outrage when there's again a rape done. And for me, that is something like unbelievable, but I know it happens. People who rape can only rape when they are totally in the gut brain. Because the gut brain is for food, reproduction, and eat and drink. You can only rape somebody if you disconnect from your heart, because if you would see the person as your daughter or as your beloved one, then you could never do that. So you have to disconnect your heart. So my deeper intention to write the book, you think where I'm heading to, is actually to create a better world where bullying is out of this world, where we don't have to have rapists anymore. where men and women are actually the same. We don't talk about masculine and feminine and put 2 camps on there, but start seeing that maybe we're different, but we are equal. A man is not better than a woman, a woman is not better than a man, we're the same, only we are different. And that makes sense because yin and yang have different colors, but you need both to make it happen.

Yes.

So my deeper intention was I'd like to spread the word, let's use 3 brains to make this world a better place. In that idea, how do I do that? Because it's a huge mission. How can I make that happen? So I thought, and I still remember this, 3 years ago, I was sitting during the night, I came away, I should put it in how men and women actually work with each other or deal with each other in a relationship, because almost everybody has a relationship and give insights. How can we make at least the most thing most people want in a relationship Less toxic or more happy. So now from that idea, I started to write how does the 3 brains then apply to relationships. And I write about more men and women. And I still think it's— now I think it was maybe not the best title because it demonstrates men and women. You could say it's more about relationships and to help people to become aware, hey, if my partner, or am I more head, heart, gut brain? If they are there, what should I do with it or not do with it? To give people all an insight, how can you make better relationships? And what to do if your partner is really a gut-brain person? What should— what to do if your partner is really a head-brain person, or just head, or just a head-brain person? What are the little concepts or techniques to deal with them? You can have if they are more like this, or if they behave like it, and there's a difference. You can be a heart-brained person and sometimes react from your gut brain. It makes sense if you're angry. How do you deal with that? So that was the whole idea about writing the book with the passion. Let's create a better world. Let's make decisions with 3 brains and how we in our day-to-day relationships we have with our partner, kids, or parents, or even employees or colleagues, do it in a better way. That is the whole big vision and big mission behind it. So I know it's a huge statement, but it's still what drives me. And that will drive me because now in this moment, I'm busy with the second book. That's more 3 brains, say, and leadership transformation. How can you become the best in what you like to do connecting with the 3 brains? How can you transform yourself to better be a better leader, be a better person? How can you really connect with yourself in that part and work with people? So, and the more that fits more with the business individual world, based still same on the same concept, let's make this world a better place.

Wow, that's, that's a beautiful vision you have, Christoffel. And, uh, Christoffel, so based on this 3-brain theory, you have You started offering coaching certification as well. So could you please tell about how different is it from different other, other coaching trainings and what is the benefit again?

It's a good question. In the same concept to make this world a better place, I thought I'm a coach and I'm a therapist and I'll deliver therapy training. I thought We have 40,000 professional coaches in this world who are somewhere ICF member. Every ICF member need to do every 3 years an update of their credentials. So it's a huge market to be trained. And I thought, but coaches are the closest to help people to become better. And I thought, if you now really like to influence the managers, the people you work with, kids, people at home, people in the workplace, people in relationships like you doing. I thought if I provide coaches the tools of the 3 brains, they can spread all that concept around the world. So then my prior vision, let's make this world a better place, goes easier. So in that case, okay, I created training and what makes it Unique or different. I teach coaches one, what's the concept of the three brains? So what do they do and not do? What I explained here shortly: logic, us, and me. But also, how can you come aware when you talk to somebody and they talk about the topic if it's more their head brain, their heart brain, or their gut brain that is connected to the topic? Which brain is actually in favor of this topic? Which brain is actually stopping?

change. Okay.

Because if you know which brain is stopping the change, you can work on that brain. Is it logical? Is it us? Or is it me? So I teach them how to identify which brains are in charge and are blocking. And from there, techniques, okay, say this is happening, what can we do? And then, then it works on 5 ways the brains can work together. They can still have, say, a normal preference. As you could check on my website, do the 3 brains preference test. Are you more head, heart, or gut brain person? Totally okay. And then we start communicating, then we help the coachee to communicate with the 3 brains. Hey, what does your heart say? What does your gut say? It could happen that one brain is, say, is in charge based on the belief system. I should be a good boy, boys should not be cry, I should work much harder than the rest. Failure is not an option. All those kind of beautiful belief systems that keep you somewhere stuck. If that's happening, okay, how can we get that belief system out of your system so the brain can look brighter again? Because if you think I cannot fail, then every topic you discuss is looking through that fence there. That will make your own life really hard. If that is out of your system, you can say hey, there are also different options. Then there's a reason why your brains could be blocked because, say, a highly impactful event that can be trauma or even a happy event. A traumatic event from abuse makes sense. If you ever are physically abused or sexually abused, there's a trust issue 9 out of 10. Makes sense. So if you don't get that out of the system, the brain will never open up. And your heart will never open up to people anymore or your gut. So then we give some little coaching tools. How can you work with that? So without becoming a therapist, still how you can bypass it or somewhere make it loose. With the objective, let the 3 brains talk. And the last one, the last 2 ones are actually when the brains have a conflict. That's pretty bad. That happens when you go and you like to have, say, you go to a cafe and say, no, I like to have a little bite. Then your healthy brain says, maybe hyper said, let's take something healthy. And your gut brain says, oh, do you see that sweet savory little pie? Take the pie. And you said, no, no, no, I should actually go for a carrot. That's actually when your 2 brains have somewhere discussion. Now, how can you solve that? I give, so I give tools and techniques how to solve those kinds of discussions or blocks in there. Now, why is it so freaking unique? Up to now, every coach she had in my training, if they're on ACC level, MCC level, according to ICF standards, have something like, I never had things like that, I never experienced like that, and wow, I solved massive issue, massive on my own issues. Because what I love the most, actually, I have to say that a little bit recognition that an MCC coach comes in my training, 30 years experience, And it comes where, wow, like we all have topics in our life. Now finally there's a tool I can tackle them in the coaching way. So I don't have to go to psychiatrist or psychologist to solve it. In the coaching way, I can now work with it. And that they just love it. And why I say MCC is because they have so much experience, so they know what's out there. So that, and that's what I really love, and that they then walk away actually and when I do a supervision with them, that they say, Chris, I was talking to a client, the client was totally stuck. I used what we learned and it totally opened up.

Wow.

And that is so, that's what I love. That makes Unique Minds unique because up to now, if you make it black and white, there are 2 kinds of trainings in coaching world, more logical training skills, more questions, deepening questions, understanding questions, blah, blah, blah. Or maybe somatic training where you go more in the gestalt or somatic work, movement and those kind of things. But none of the trainings in this world are actually, okay, you have 3 brains, as I said again scientifically proven, let's use that somatic or questioning skills on those 3. Let's make the intangible tangible. Let's make the subconscious tangible and really work on what's driving us now. That makes it unique. And up to now, everybody who ever followed my training or read my book or works was like, wow, I should have known this earlier. I would— long story short, so that's why I also am so extremely passionate about it, because I see every day massive successes and actually creating happiness and wellness in people again. People start smiling again. And just like you, you have a beautiful smile on your face, Enzo. But a lot of— probably, you know, if you look outside, a lot of people looking with a grim face because something in life is still on their shoulders and putting pain in them. Now, if they walk away and they can start smiling for the first time in 5 years, it's just amazing. And I see so many people now using these techniques and it's happening.

Wow. That's amazing. And you also have certain, you know, certification program for leadership level also, where you are integrating again the same concept. So how is it helping people at managerial level or at the leadership roles?

Beautiful question, actually. So now, if you just think what I said about toxic leadership, toxic leadership actually gut-brain leadership. Where the leader says me, myself, and I. And so actually is using his people or employees to get the best for him or her. If you start training leaders to use all 3 brains, not saying what you do is wrong, but okay, let's utilize all 3 of them. What will happen is that they will start listening to their heart, they start listening to their head, and their decisions become more integrated and in their decision they think about what's good for me, what's good for the people, what's good for the company, what's good for the environment. And they will learn much better at this. The second thing is they will create more inner health and happiness with themselves. Although that's always a second question they have, or actually not the concrete question, most of them say, you know, I feel much more at ease, I feel better, I lose weight. I don't have that sore neck anymore. Hey, I don't have that sore hip anymore. Hey, I feel better in my body. So they create actually that stress goes out their body because if you are more only heart brain or only gut brain for the wrong reasons or only head brain for the wrong reasons, it will create that your parasympathetic sympathetic nerve somewhere gets in the fight-or-flight response. If you think the world is a place you have to fight, Your whole body says, I will fight, and it creates a sympathetic nervous system. You can never relax anymore. And although we say, yeah, that's life— no, because every predator like the lion or the shark knows how to relax after the fight. We humans, because we also have this, we don't know how to relax anymore because we don't listen to our body. Because after a fight, we could relax. But this one stays there and thinks, okay, you had a fight with ABC, what happened there? And I still dislike ABC, tomorrow I'll get back to him. And by thinking you will get back to him, you create again that stress in your body. There is no lion in this world that thinks, you know, I got bitten by that, I don't know, gnu or by the bison, tomorrow I will bite him back. That lion just thinks, okay, you got bitten, okay, that's why I'm shooting. Let's do something else and forgets it within 2 minutes. But we don't forget, so we stay in chronic stress. And chronic stress, now that's an open door. But stress is actually disease number one in the world. If you have massive stress, sooner or later your body will say, no, I give up. So now that's a long story short. But leaders will become better leaders and toxic leadership will be gone. And actually their lifespan in the company becomes longer because most managers are now like to have success because then they can survive. And when you get that survival mechanism out of them, they start thriving and life becomes much easier in their company because they're not working from fear or anger anymore, but they work actually from happiness. from wellness. So long story short, that's somewhere where it heads to.

Awesome. So, uh, relationship, you have a book like for— then there is this coaching model, then this is a leadership. So it's amazing, uh, you are, um, you know, it is an integrated, uh, thing now offering holistic coaching instead of just logical, just emotional, just character.

Yeah, so what is my passion actually? Because now it's— you're looking at the company, that's me, myself, and I. What I would love is to educate people like you or other people who would say with their own qualities are spreading the world. So I would love to say that there are people who are also start trading this. I would love to start people doing workshops about this, not only me, so that somewhere we could create around this world ambassadors of change, but then in a change in a happy way. So that's my next step, passion, to find, say, some people from, hey, Chris, I would love to learn it and I'd like to train it or like to coach people on it. I actually like to spread the word and educate people in it because if you just coach people on it They will not spread the word with me. Okay, help me to start spreading the word. And of course, it's not only me that I'm saying the truth, and probably will people will bring and say, hey Chris, maybe you should do ABCD, let's change it. I'm always open for that because I don't know everything. But I would love that somewhere almost a global community is created of people who are somewhere like-minded, said, hey, how can we bring this to the coaching leadership Personal world to make this world a better place because I believe sooner or later it will happen. Just now, and so that's why I'm extremely happy to be in your podcast because maybe somebody or you or somebody else listens and says, Chris, I'd like to be your trainer in India or I'd like to be the trainer in I don't know the people listen to you. They could say I have the money or don't have the money. If I have the money, of course, it makes life easier. that don't have the money, Chris, I don't have the money, but I give you a proposal that you will say yes to it. 'Cause my passion is not, it is nice to become rich, but my passion is not to become rich. Money follows the passion for me. So for me, if I can create a group of the same passionate people, then we all get somewhere at the end, our meals paid and our house paid.

Excellent.

As once a person said, you can only live in one house in the same moment. So why would you like to have 10 houses? Yes. So for me, that's the thing. So for me, for all your people who are listening to me, Sam, if you have a passion, but you just heard of it and say, Chris, I'd like to start helping you to spread the word, connect with me and, or do it financially or give me a great offer how you can make it happen and make my heart tick. En het tik, en dan sommigen als een magat tik van: oké, dit is wat je, wat we, we, we'll get back from it. Wat is your benefit, my benefit, our benefit? En ik ben altijd open te luisteren naar dat. Want in onze westerse wereld, quote quote, het is easy te betalen voor deze soort dingen. En als ik een westerse mindset heb, dan zou ik zeggen: oh, dit is niet duur. Maar als ik even ga van Holland naar Spanje, is er een andere prijsstek. Als ik ga van Spanje naar Romania, there's a different price tag. If you go from Romania to India, there's a different price tag. So I always say, make it happen and convince me why we could make it happen. I'm open to that. So that's— thank you for broadcast— let me broadcast this message to find some, I would say in a happy way, disciples, or people also like to join and make this world a better place with an extremely highly effective And proven concept.

Yes, yes, it is indeed. Now, uh, this, this has to reach out to different areas. Like, let's say a manager is trained in this concept, or a therapist, or a coach, or a counselor, so they can integrate and really do a very deep work with their clients and on self as well.

It is. So the best compliment I got now a couple of weeks ago is when one of the coaches had in the training, she gave the book to one of her clients who's a manager. I had a coffee with the manager because the manager works in Madrid and he came with my book and said, Chris, this is freaking amazing, this book, it's awesome. I'd like to give a workshop for all my 50 people.

Wow.

On that moment, I got the opportunity to actually educate 50 people or give an insight to 50 people how it works. And in his little business unit, people are getting the insight and say, hey, I'm more head-brain oriented, so could you give me logic to this? Hey, I'm more heart-brain passionate, so I talk of course about my passion. So people start, one, communicating better and start understanding better, but also come over here, hey, this decision is made actually based on logic. Do we feel passion for this? And they start actually making the decision-making process 3-brains oriented. So you see that little light sparking up. I think that's, I would say, the best compliment I get. And right now I think that that's what I'm looking for— ambassadors for creating great leadership, great coaching world, great personal work.

So very good.

People out there want to listen to Nizam's podcast or webinars. And secondly, Join our beautiful mission.

Yes, thank you, Chris, for all your time. It was wonderful communicating with you. And and you know, the the moment I reached out to you, you happily accepted, and I was so so much excited. Like let people get to know. Like guys, there is no only head head head. Enough of logic logic logic. It's much deeper, deeper, and you're much more than what you're thinking you are.

And it is so interesting because I started with Buddha. For me, if you talk about India, you somewhere— and you is India— is the source of actually spirituality and going into your body and actually talking about the wholesome. And I say that the Western world be captivated actually the logical. world and we are spreading the logical world. So for me, I always say India is somewhere one of those little beacons, just like Tibet, and we actually already have so much wisdom inside you. I would say really start believing that you have the answers because you are in that part much more advanced than we Westerners are.

Thank you.

So I feel, I feel honored to be part of you Thank you very much, Chris.

And let now many people become aware of your beautiful book and coaching programs and training programs, Chris. So thank you once again, and it was wonderful talking to you.

Thank you for being there. And I just became aware we love the same color. We have a green shirt there. So without making any prior commitments with someone, like, we already are in sync.

Yes, that's good, good observation. Yes, thank you.

Thank you.