Why You Can't Say No (And How to Finally Mean It)

Hello everybody, and welcome back to The Advisor with Stacy Chelemi. Today I'm really excited because we have Christoffel on the show. He has his own podcast on our show, so you have to check out his episodes because they're truly amazing. They're just life-changing, um, advice that he gives throughout, um, all his episodes. And he teaches about all the different areas of life and how the brain, how the heart, and how the gut play a major role in our everyday decisions, our everyday behaviors, and how we do things from the moment we're children to how we become as adults, how we could actually balance all 3, and how that could actually be a huge impact in our life. He is, he, he, he is a transformational coach. He has a website, it's The 3 Brain Intelligence, and you're going to learn more about him now, uh, than, than ever before because he has a great topic that he's going to dip into today, and it's all about the, um, the mind, the heart, and the gut, and how all 3 of them play a role when it comes to setting boundaries, when it comes to making friends, when it comes to actually getting into your own shoes and becoming your own person. And Christoffel, today is a great episode. I was really excited when you talked about it. You talked about what the heart needs and really understand what your brain also needs. and also how the gut plays a role in that and how the gut is a really big source when it comes to boundaries and how boundaries play such a big role in our life and actually can change our lives for the better. So for people who don't know you, can you tell a little about yourself and what you do?

Yeah. Thank you for being here again, Stacey. Always a lovely moment to see you. And so my smile is there when I see you.

Yeah.

For people who don't know me, You already said my name. I say I have multiple roles or jobs in my life. So I'm a clinical hypnotherapist, psychotherapist, uh, teaching and teaching that. I'm an international coach and a certified master coach for the ICF. So one of 2,000 master coaches in this world. I'm a visiting professor at the IE Business School and at Georgetown University, uh, in Qatar. So yeah, all different roles and actually what they all combine. And actually, that's what you said. How can we, yeah, in my big world, how can we make this world a better place? And I know it's a huge sentence.

Mm-hmm.

Uh, uh, I was just writing actually a little article and the, the sentence popped up from Michael Jackson. Let's start with the man in the mirror. And that's actually also how to make an 8 billion beautiful world actually now step by step, human by human, person by person. And I just had a pre-talk about, hey, let's talk about boundaries. Let's talk about, say, how the heart connects with emotions and how it connects. I think, oh, that's a beautiful topic actually to talk about. I know for the people don't know, it's now Easter period in time. So that's a reflection period, at least for the Catholic world in Christianity. And that also connects right away with that idea of, hey, how can we make, say, actually really put our boundaries in there and what can we do and what can we not do in life.

Mhm.

And as you know, I just wrote down a sentence and, and it actually, it, it brings down the whole concept of setting boundaries. And the sentence we, we both came up to, so I just lend it, borrow it for you. If somebody cannot accept your no, They don't deserve actually your yes. And if you talk then about boundaries, that's all where it is.

Yes.

We all, and I say we all, somewhere have a belief that to be friends with somebody, to be accepted by somebody, we have to say yes to their needs and to their ideas and to their suggestions. Meaning actually putting our own needs aside. And it makes totally sense when you think when we were little kids, that was actually, uh, was our survival strategy. Because if you don't say yes to your parents or to your caregivers, you have an issue.

Yeah.

Living on the street when you're 5 years young is not really a survival strategy. So you're, as kids, we bound ourselves into, say, the, um, logical, non-logical are reasonable, non-reasonable needs of our parents. And somewhere, based on the biology, how actually our memory system works, we start believing them. They are true, what we learned in that day.

Yes.

And in those days. And biologically, it means actually don't only get stored in our beautiful head as a memory story, but they get emotionally stored in your heart and in your gut. As a survival strategy. And then we are, and then we are 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 years old. And what do we do? We still are somewhere using a strategy to please our parents, but now we're pleasing the rest of the world, everybody around us.

Mm-hmm.

Hence, somewhere we get stuck. And we discussed earlier what kind of Horrible things that actually give to your health. And before I keep on talking, so hey Chris, oh wow, you derailed totally left or right. I'd just like to say, if you don't listen to your own needs, so you don't listen actually to what you want and actually dare to express it, short term, actually more long term, you're actually doing the worst thing for your own health.

Yes.

What we discussed, if you don't take care of yourself, you don't set your own boundaries or needs, what happens biologically? It's really interesting. So I said you have a head, your brain in your head, that's, you know, logic, and it knows actually time. Your heart and your gut not. But where is our immune system located? In your gut. I think now by the almost Everybody knows, and we talk about the gut microbes and gut bacteria and probiotics and all this kind of stuff, right? But what happens, say, if you're pleasing everybody except your own needs? Your gut system, your gut brain actually, but isn't actually a brain, starts learning actually almost to shut down a little bit. Okay, I cannot take care of myself. And secondly, If I have to take care of everybody else, it means I'm not safe if I don't do that. So somewhere activates a system van be on the lookout, be prepared to adjust, to fight, to flight, to to freeze, to adjust. Now that system even is only five percent because we're not messed all anxiety or all depressed, but on a Small level. It means there's an elevation of cortisol, adrenaline in your blood system. The adrenal glands are chook chook chook chook pushing it out. What happens if you're more cortisol and adrenaline in your blood system? One, as Bruce Lipton says, your cells can only do one thing. They can be in a rejuvenation production state or in a fight to flight response, or they close down. It means actually. Uh, your— all your body cells are actually producing not on 100%, but say on 80%, right? Uh, the mitochondria, who are actually your energy producers and much more in your cells, actually also don't work properly based on the cortisol and adrenaline impulses they get, right? What is that doing? It means your glucose levels, uh, are being affected. Your insulin, uh, system is being affected. And short-term, long-term, all kind of horrible, what we call now chronic diseases, are actually sooner or later popping up from obesity to diabetes 2 to insulin resistance to even horrible diseases from up to cancer. And I'm not the only one who says that. Go to Dr. Gabor Maté. Read this book, When the Body Says No, and you see all the scientific evidence there, right? So actually, when we come back to your first simple question, hey, why is, why is setting boundaries so seemingly normal or good? It actually is the most healthiest thing you can do in your life, right? Of course, besides eating, sleeping enough, and all this kind of stuff. But just in a relationship thing, this is the most healthiest thing you can do, right?

Right.

So that was a 5-minute synopsis of the whole story. Sorry, Stacy.

No, not at all. You know, what role does the mind play when it comes to setting boundaries and it comes to being able to, you know, take control of your life? Um, you know, what part does the— what does the mind need?

If you think about the mind, that beautiful thing in between their ears, But it is actually, um, creating an awareness and an understanding that you could— that depends which research you read— that 95% of our belief system and our habits are formed in our, what they call in psychology, the imprint period, the first 7 years of your life.

Right.

And before the first 7 years of your life, our beautiful brain— of course, we can ask the question, when do we learn the concept of time? So what is last week and what is next week? We learn that around year 7. So before year 7, actually what we experience in life, there is no cause and effect analysis in time. The cause and effect analysis is only done in now.

Yeah.

So just imagine a story. Uh, one of your parents is in the morning explaining during breakfast that he, that he or she's a little bit nervous and upset about having an extremely important talk to the boss and with some important clients.

Yes.

And, but still the whole atmosphere is good during breakfast.

Mm-hmm.

Then your parent comes home and is totally grumpy. Uh, you see him say hello and Snaps at you and says, what the hell are you doing here? Did you make your homework? No. Well, go to your room, make your homework. And by the way, you make it totally messy. The little kid, of course, totally stressed and thinks, okay, uh, my homework, there's a mess. Oh, daddy doesn't. But by the way, there is no mess because everything looks clean here. By the way, I did my homework. So I think that he just doesn't love me. Maybe because I have not the right shirt. Maybe I said something wrong to him. So they, they only learn, say, in self-reflection in the moment why they are wrong.

Right.

And if they don't find the solution, they think they are wrong. Oh, maybe I'm not lovable. Just imagine, because they cannot grasp the concept, by the way, Did my daddy or mommy now say this morning, um, they were really nervous and already a little bit anxious about an important meeting with the boss and clients? Oh, maybe that went a little bit wrong and now he's— they're just bursting out to me. You just get, oh, that's— oh, it's not about me. It's actually because, oh, they had a hard meeting. Okay, then it's okay.

Yeah.

Up to year 7, we don't have that concept.

Mhm.

So all the things we learned before 7, and that is now, that is, uh, just count the days, that is 7 times 365 days, that is something like 2,000— no, this is more, 2,700 days.

Mhm.

Almost 3,000 days we had a daily experience of these emotional patterns of our parents that we never put in place but just thought this is it. This is how life works. So what's the role of your head? Because that's where you started, is to start understand all those patterns I learned are actually not how it is now. That is actually how I needed them when I was just a little boy or little girl. Okay, let's just reevaluate which ones are totally outdated and I can put, uh, in a waste bin.

Mm-hmm.

which one maybe could be recycled if they're really a bit washed up, and which one should I really make new for myself?

Mm-hmm.

So our head is extremely important in the logic to start understanding it's not about me. It is about a really old useful coping mechanism I learned when I was now 5, 6, 7, 4, 3, 2, 1 years young. Now that's where our head plays a huge role to start understanding that. And that also makes sense, right away. If you think about, if you think about the normal memory, where does it stay? In our beautiful head. Right. Oh yeah, I know last year I visited, I say Malaga in Spain. Oh yeah, I visited Malaga in Spain. Oh yeah, I saw that, I saw that, I saw the castle. Okay, just a story, factual, no memories. But the moment there's an An emotion connected. Oh yes, and there was that horrible taxi driver who just wanted to rip us off because he thought we were we were tourists. Well, I live already seven years in Spain. Now, where do we feel the emotion? Actually, not in our head. We feel the emotion in our body, and most times in our head or in our gut. And that's actually where the memory is stored. So our head is actually a beautiful portal to come over here. where is the memory stored? Or where's this belief stored? Or where's my habit coming from to do this? And the moment there is a physical connection, so we can observe a physical connection or notice a physical objection, we know, oh, okay, so this is not a logical process. This is an old system that is now trying to run the show. Okay, let's Be aware, old system is coming up because actually that's what's happening.

Yeah.

When your body, your heart or gut stepping, it means an old system is stopping. That's an emotional system that is stepping up. And let's call it an emotional system because your heart or gut produce in that moment that memory connection. And in that moment they actually think because they only live in the now.

Yeah.

Oh shit, we live in the same moment. Okay, let's produce the same kind of hormones and neurotransmitters because this is the event again. Yeah, I'm talking to Stacy about the taxi driver. Oh wow, Stacy is the taxi driver. And right away all the neurotransmitters start to fire, start to release, and all the hormones are getting in my bloodstream. Well, we all know, Stacy, the last time you were a taxi driver was probably never. Yeah, but that's, that's how our body works and our mind works. So that's the role of the head to really create that awareness. What is happening in me? And the possibility to start observing it. Is it old cheese or is it new cheese? As once the book was written.

Now, when it comes to the heart, you know, a lot of people work off their emotions and they make decisions off their emotions and sometimes they set boundaries, but Everything has to be balanced. And if people just work with their heart deciding on decisions throughout, and it's based on their emotions, isn't that going to help? That's going to hurt a lot of people because instead of being balanced and using the brain and using the gut, they're just working with the heart and they're reacting that, that, you know, you know, that fight or flight type of thing. You know, they feel that emotion in their heart. They react and they might set boundaries. They might say something. And you find that a lot in today's society too. It seems like people are more reacting off their heart and a lot of people are reacting off of fear too. I see in this society that's causing a lot of negative things to happen in our society as well.

You cannot be more right, Stacey, in this part. Um, a lot of people follow their heart and it makes sense. And it right away makes me think for all the people who are just like me, sitcom fans and watch the sitcom Friends, they still probably know Monica in Friends. And Monica had a huge fear of actually being rejected. She was really a pleaser in her cooking style, in her friend style and other kinds of things.

Mm-hmm.

And so she's really and metaphorically portray of actually how a lot of people do that. And even there's a scene where then the parents of Monica and Ross are at home and they're starting to say things they did wrong when they were young.

Yeah.

And both are adults, Ross and Monica, and actually feel totally ashamed and embarrassed and take this, the role of a little kid again when they talk about, I don't know, that they were, that Ross was reading the Playboy and that Monica was actually ill, all the pie. Like we're 6, 7, 10 years old again. Yeah. Coming back to the heart, um, what is our most essential need when we are born? To be taken care of by our parents or our caregivers.

Yes.

If our parents or caregivers don't care about us, then we have a huge, huge issue because we don't survive.

Yeah.

No baby of, uh, half a year can survive by themselves. Somebody has to take care of them. Mm-hmm. Yeah. To start taking care of ourselves, we have to be at least 6 years old.

Right.

Okay. You see it in the slums in Cambodia, of all the kind of things. But this, I would say, don't have a look there. Yeah. Where younger kids are always being taken care by older kids, otherwise they don't survive. We, we need something at age 5, 6, 7 to start taking care of ourselves. Um, in a horrible way, by the way. Real self-care starts when we are at this lens and above 15, 16, 17 years old. So coming back, so we're born with a hardwired system in our heart to bond. And your heart releases also oxytocin, what is actually the love hormone, the bonding hormone.

Mhm.

A female woman who gives birth have a huge splash of oxytocin. So at least they love the child after 24 hours of, of, of, of birthing or, or having a C-section.

Mm-hmm.

Um, so biologically we are hardwired to connect and to bond. And that makes sense. Only it has a period of time when it is extremely needed for survival. And after that, it's just nice to be connected.

Yes.

Yeah. Not every person on this earth we need to be connected with to survive. And there's 8 billion. So now start shaking hands. The next 2,000 years are busy. So it doesn't make sense. So our, our survival needs are not so much connected anymore with bonding.

Right.

And for your social environment, yes, it makes sense because you have a longer life and all those kind of things. You have happier life. So for that part, it makes totally sense. But for essential survival, primary survival needs, you don't need it. Only because we are raised with it, what you just discussed also before, for the first 7 years, we think it's normal to be bonded and to stay connected. And especially, and then comes a horrible beautiful thing, um, I think everybody somewhere heard that sentence in their life: be a good boy, be a good, be a good girl, take care of your brother or your sister. Be a good boy, be a good girl, Do the dishes, bring out the garbage, whatever. If that's an incident, it's okay. If you hear that almost for every task that has to be done, we talk about conditional love, conditional bonding. That means you are something if you do something.

Right.

You are a good girl, Stacy, if you listen to me. You are a good boy, Christoffel, if you bring out the garbage. Now, if that's the sentence we always hear, then I have a belief system that I'm only a good boy if I bring out the garbage and wash the dishes and take care of my brother and I don't know, do everything. If I don't do that, I'm not worth it to be loved.

Mm-hmm.

So what will be then my reaction if I have that belief system wired in me when I'm an adult? If I don't please everybody and don't do what they say and don't take their needs first, I'm not worthy to be loved. So we don't set any boundaries anymore.

Right.

We just push them away. If at the other hand, we are born and raised mainly with, you know, um, I will use my same example, otherwise I'm teasing you, Stacy. Uh, Christoffel, uh, we love you as a son, but by the way, the cooking you did was really horrible. I learn at least I'm worth loving. By the way, cooking is not my specialty. Maybe I should just call a service somewhere, call a restaurant and let it be dine-in.

Mm-hmm.

But it doesn't do anything with my self-esteem. So later in life, I know I dare to say no to you, Stacy, because it will not affect my long-term relationship with you. Because, okay, I say now once no, but it doesn't hurt. So that's a really healthy thing because then I dare to set boundaries. What I actually started at the beginning, I dare to say no. So they also deserve my yes.

Right.

What I said in the beginning was actually the opposite in that part. But that's the sentence. If I can say no to them, they deserve also my yes. That's an extremely healthy position.

Yes.

If we come back to our normal society, um, pitifully, I say I'm, I'm a dad, so I can talk about myself. You don't get a book or an, or an, or a course over or something else how to be a good dad. What are actually the things you should and shouldn't do? What's the best way to educate your kids? You can now, they go on YouTube or whatever and see some influencers talking blah blah and all kinds of crazy stuff.

Yeah.

But there is no real rules how to work with them. And by the way, before we become a daddy, there is no exam if you're actually mentally fit to become a parent.

Yes.

For a driving license, actually, you have to do some driving license, some lessons, and you have to do an exam. For becoming a parent, you only have to forget your condom. And that is, and that is, by the way, if you forget it, it's not a skill. It's what we call stupid, actually. And so based on the failure, you can actually pass your exam.

Yeah.

Now, I don't know how you were on university or high school, but it never happened to me that if I failed my, my, my, my grades, I got, I still got my diploma or passed.

Right.

That connection was not there. But becoming a parent, it can. So, and it is not a blame, but it also means that And I talk to myself as a parent, we're actually not actually ready to be your parent totally. Because where do we get our knowledge for what we hear from friends, maybe from our parents, or what we didn't like from our parents, maybe from a, a, a, a caring unit for, for, for, for, for kids where we, where we do the, the, the, the child nurses and the child doctors. We hear some advices.

Yeah.

And if you listen to their, if you go to different countries, because I lived in, I live now in Spain, I lived in the Netherlands, in Australia, if you would listen to the 3 advices they give about children raising, you hear 3 different kind of stories. And in general, maybe are, they have some similarities, but also a lot of differences.

Yes.

Yeah. So there is also not a universal law or rule. How do you educate kids? But, but biologically, every kid on this earth is the same. It doesn't matter if you're born in Japan and Netherlands, Spain, uh, uh, the States as a baby, you are the same. Maybe different color, maybe different shape, maybe different weight, but biologically you're totally the same. And it is totally true because a sheep cannot make offspring with a dog because they have different kind of races.

Yeah.

We are all the same. We can reproduce with everybody on this earth.

Right.

It doesn't matter if you're green, purple, yellow, big, small, or whatever, as Lady Gaga was singing. So we're all the same. So also the universal lessons, how we educate our kids, could be the same, only it's not happening. And as I said, almost nobody gets a real education how to become a good parent. And by the way, did you solve your own luggage you have on your shoulders and carrying with you? Your own childhood, your own bullying on high school, your own failures, your own I don't know whatever you had. Right. So hence based on your beautiful question, it makes a world where a lot of people actually don't dare to set boundaries and like to please people.

Yes.

And I say I love to say the sentence: If you can say no to your friends, they deserve your yes. If they Cannot accept you. No, please ditch them from your WhatsApp, YouTube, and social media, or make them really acquaintances.

Yes, 100%. And I think that's what people have to realize is that, you know, if someone is not willing to accept you for who you are, and they're not willing to accept you when you say no, they're truly not your real friends. They're just, you know, and they're just being fake friends and for their, their, they're there for a purpose, not because they care.

Yeah. Like, and, and now on social media, I'm just thinking about, because I've heard it recently. So all those people give you likes or give you, do you think they're really your friends? Do they really think you can call them at 11 o'clock at night and say, hey, by the way, I got an issue with my, uh, with my worm border. Can you help me out? Probably they'll say, who are you?

Mm-hmm.

Now you gave me already the last, on my last 20 posts, you gave me a like and you posted some nice comments about me. Now I can tell you they will not help you out with getting warm water, right? Yeah. So it's also making the distinction from who are really, who are really that people you can call or actually deserve it.

Yes.

To be in your inner circle. Or beating your circle.

Yes. Now, what are some of the common signs that indicate that we need to set boundaries for our health, and how can we recognize them early?

Signs? Now, I would say what is not. But the moment really you don't sleep enough, and because you cannot fall asleep or you wake up too early, that means you have things in your mind that you cannot solve. And most times it is about relation, about, say, this has to do something. Where are you? Um, actually also weight loss, weight gain, especially weight gain, because it means somewhere you're doing something that you cannot say no to. Also, let's call it eating healthy is setting boundaries.

Yes.

Uh, you can take one, uh, um, um, um, say, uh, chip, You don't have to finish the whole bag. You can take one chocolate. You don't have to finish the whole bar.

Exactly.

Yeah, there's also a boundary setting. Um, now, if you go to a doctor and do a blood test and you see that you have elevated numbers, then you really have an issue there.

Yeah.

But also the things, say, if you're feeling, uh, sad, lonely, misunderstood, um, Extremely tired because you're thinking about what everybody else needs. Mm-hmm. Yeah. You feel that actually you don't have a voice.

Yeah.

And in conversations, you come aware that people actually don't listen to you. Mm-hmm. Or they dismiss you. And there are, and from, from serious physical signs to say that, now you could say the less serious signs in normal conversations where you actually come aware, hey, by the way, Do I really matter? Yeah. And I said the last part, do I really matter, is in all the conversational kind of things. The first part is actually, it is actually a result of that, that your body is going to give signs. By the way, your levels are not healthy. The funny— no, no, no, not say the funny part is, but most times when you do a blood test, they test your cholesterol and I don't know, your B2 level and your they don't test so much whether your cortisol levels or your hormone levels are not so much tested. But that's actually almost much more interesting to become aware of what's happening with those kinds of things.

Mm-hmm.

And a good sign is when you, um, uh, let's say when you feel is when you have the need, um, You could say to do a slightly addiction kind of habit. You like to fill up, say, I call it always a void or a pain with something else. So, you know, shopping makes me feel good. You know, that ice cream makes me feel good. You know, that extra Chardonnay makes me feel good. The sentence that makes me feel good means actually you need an external thing to make you feel good.

Right.

Um, did you ever see your dog asking for you, could you please give me, uh, an extra hamburger because I like to feel good? No, dog feels good because it just feels good.

Yeah.

Everything inside us is in 500 million years of evolution, beautiful designed to feel healthy, good, and okay.

Mm-hmm.

The moment you need an external to make that happen, you mean somewhere is pushing your buttons or you didn't listen to your own boundaries and your own needs.

Yeah.

Like if you're really hungry because you didn't have breakfast and lunch, right? Then actually it's also a sign because you didn't listen to the need of food.

Mm-hmm.

But you can do that on purpose. We call that intermediate fasting. But you know that somewhere. But if you just had your breakfast and think, you know, why wouldn't I take, say, a tea or a coffee and I just take that beautiful piece of chocolate that I still have? And by the way, the cheesecake from leftover yesterday, there's also fit, feels good next to my teeth, then you know something's wrong with you.

Yeah.

So there are little signs that just makes you the moment, and then the sentence is the moment you need something external to make you feel good, then you know you breached your own internal boundaries.

Right. That's, that's very true. That's very true. Now, how do you, how do, how do emotional and physical boundaries differ? Like, why are both crucial for maintaining over what, overall well-being.

That's good. Then the physical boundaries make sense, I would say. But that— I know that makes sense. Let's do a simple metaphor. Just imagine, Stacey, we both are going to run a marathon. I don't know how your running skills are. So this is a guess. Maybe you're a pro runner and you say, oh, Chris, that's easy. But in general, I think we both would say if we have done that, that the next 2 weeks we probably don't get out of a chair and don't walk anymore. Everything is sore after 42 kilometers. At least I talk about myself. I'm a swimmer, not a runner. So let me swim a kilometer, a few kilometers, I'm okay. Let me run 40 kilometers, probably next 2 weeks I walk like a 90-year-old. So maintaining your physical health fits in that metaphor. If you don't maintain your physical health, actually you have a huge setback. What's happening if you don't maintain your physical health? Actually, It's breaking down. It is, it is like never putting maintenance to your car, right? And if you don't do maintenance to a car, it's a no-brainer your car will break down sooner or later, serious or less serious. It's the same as a body.

Yes.

So they say that's the simple one. My mental health is so extremely important because that's the slow I would say the slow killer. Physical health is a little bit quicker killer. Go two months only to fast food stores, do a blood test, and you will come aware your cholesterol levels are high, sky high. You you gained already probably eight pounds or eight kilos, and you look like crap. Excuse my word. You know, physical health is extremely easy to to come aware of. Drink too much one one day. And, you know, you have a hangover the last day. So, yeah, physical, you see a quicker, uh, result of it.

Yes.

Mental health is, is, is a slow burner. Mm-hmm. Because mental health, you can be, say, uh, 10 years crashing your boundaries before something happens, before you get something like a, a burnout.

Yeah.

Or you get elevated cholesterol levels, cholesterol levels before actually you get a fatty liver. Because research shows if you have chronic stress, that actually your adrenal glands, so your glands on top of your livers get more, they get fatty. So they start producing actually less of all the beautiful hormones we need. Your liver gets fatty, your thyroid actually gets, gets clutched. You have more chance actually on, on, on cardiovascular diseases. But those are all slow killers.

Yeah.

So your mental health is not right away showable. Therefore, it's almost much more important to take care of. Because the moment you notice it, you're almost already falling down the cliff.

And that's from stress.

And that stress, but it's a stress. If you look biologically, stress means you have elevated cortisol, adrenaline levels. If you make it simple, it's a little bit more, but, and sometimes also testosterone levels. That's about stress. Is actually from depression to anxiety and everything in between. Stress is actually when you don't listen to your own needs and start doing something what is not quote quote good for you, what is not in service of you. Drinking one liter of severe alcohol like whiskey, vodka, or whatever kind of thing, drink one bottle that is not healthy for you. So you see why the response. say everything that's mentally not healthy for you has the same kind of effect. And mentally not healthy, it means when I push my own boundaries. And if you do simple, hey, you know, I'm going to help my, uh, my parents-in-law to, I know, to hang up some, some, some paintings because, uh, they cannot do it because they're old. Oh, by the way, I actually want to go to gym now. You miss once gym, nothing happens unless you make a huge discussion about it to your partner. It's is your parents, parents-in-law. Why should I help them? And blah blah blah blah blah. You make a huge stress. Then it can become really a stress topic which you cannot release anymore.

Yeah.

But if it happens always, you're always helping somebody else without your needs. Because even helping too much is a stress, is a stressor. So the strengthening of stress within stress is an Coming from a negative event that is painful. You have to run away from a lion. The old story, oh, you have to run away from a lion. That's stress. Yes. Stress is also doing extremely good things for others that actually you don't want to do.

Yes.

So you do extremely good things, but they are not good for you. That's actually a stressor.

Yeah.

So it sounds almost paradoxical, but that is what's happening in your body. Because it pushes away your own needs, and your body will respond on that. So your mental health is extremely important, and that's I love the free brains in that part. To listen, what do I need? What are my needs? And are they now say put aside for a single event, and that's okay, or are they pushed aside for chronicle events. I cannot be who I am. I cannot follow my own needs. I cannot follow my own biological reasoning.

Yeah.

And that's a stressor, even though you do the most amazing things.

Very true.

Because if you think about it, and it's a beautiful, horrible example, if you talk about the caregivers for, say, um, what you see in elderly couples when they take care of, say, now, of, of your parents.

Yeah.

It's extremely good thing. You help your parents who are maybe having dementia or, or Alzheimer's or whatever.

Right.

Or, but you push away your own needs.

Yeah.

Then sooner or later you will get a physical issue.

Right.

Although you do an amazing good thing for your parents.

Yeah.

So you're praised by everybody around you. Oh, you're such a good daughter, Stacey. You do such an amazing thing. Oh, how sweet you are. I would love to have you as my daughter. You take so much care of everybody else. You're the best daughter ever. And deep inside you think, you know, I would love one day to have just a day for myself.

Right.

And that sentence, I would love to have a day one for myself, is an extreme stressor inside yourself. So stress is not only that you have to fight or that you have to flight.

Mm-hmm.

That you have to compete.

Yeah.

Yes, it is also that, but not only. It is actually when we were starting about this, actually doing things chronically that is outside your own boundary system.

Yeah.

So that's why mentally health is in my importance even more important to take care of. Because the moment you notice and really notice, it's almost too late.

Right. So true.

Yeah, because it's so true. And I think about it because I was working with somebody who was in burnout. And I still remember that he said to me, Chris, I really did not see this coming. I know I was working hard. I know I was working overtime. I know I had a big life and I know I was divorced. But, you know, I was still doing my gym. 3 times a week. Physically, I'm extremely fit. I did my blood test, all this kind of stuff. My sugar was good, my glucose was good, my cholesterol was good. All my blood, all my blood numbers were actually good. Yeah, I still got a burnout, Chris. How did it happen? Yes, because your cholesterol doesn't say right away something about the burnout. A burnout is actually you push your body outside always your comfort zone. In one moment, the body says, "I'm extremely tired. I just ran a marathon or three in one row." You know, do it by yourself. Don't do it anymore. Yeah. Yeah. So that's it. Mental and physical health.

I love that. Now, can you share a personal experience where setting boundaries actually helped improve your health?

Absolutely. I had a burnout actually twenty. A little bit than 20 years ago. And so I was working at a training company, number one in Europe. I was a partner, uh, was leading a team, was coaching some, uh, the, the, the people have issues in the company. I was coaching, had my clients, had actually also divorced behind myself. And I thought I could do everything. I was in that moment also doing water polo. So I was physically extremely fit. I was almost like the guy I just described.

Yeah.

And I did not put my boundaries. I did not say to the company, by the way, um, guys, I just got a horrible divorce behind me. Actually, if I look at my own schedule, um, I have my kids, uh, so many days a week. So I have to squeeze that in by taking care of them because they're also really young. So before and after school time. So after school time, I cannot do the work we always did. So I do it during nighttime, by the way. That means I sleep actually 4 hours. Maybe we could discuss how I could temporarily change a little bit my responsibilities because I have too many on this moment. I didn't put my boundaries because I was praised for all the amazing things I did. Oh, Chris, do amazing sales. Your sales, you're in the sales top 10 of the whole international company. Oh, by the way, you also run the best team in the Netherlands. Oh, wow. By the way, your clients are amazing. Oh, by the way, um, the people you coach who always have difficulties, they're really doing great. You're doing great. So by the way, you also run the coaching faculty in, uh, the sales faculty in our company. You're doing great. So I only got praises for all the things I did. So there was never a stop, right? They actually asked more. So I didn't put my own boundaries.

Yeah.

I ended up in the hospital actually with an almost exploded, uh, appendix.

Wow.

Almost. Now it exploded on the moment they cut me open. So that was, you could say, right, wrong timing. Let's, we just discussed what it, what it was. When I called my sis, she said, oh, I'm so happy. I said, sis, I would have thought about a different response. I just said my appendix was removed because it exploded in the moment they put a knife in me. Could you explain me again what is good about this? She said, it's really good. I said, explain me please why. This officer said, because I thought you had a heart attack. Duh. How do you mean? She said, Chris, the last year you've been running like crazy. So I was really worried about you and that probably now hit the heart wall. So I'm happy that you only just, just your appendix is out. Make you just suffer. Thank you, sis. Love you too. I'm, I'm now tired. I'm going to sleep again based on anesthetic.

Click.

Anyhow, I learned after that moment, okay, I have to learn actually to express my needs.

Yeah.

And I thought, by the way, that I was doing them, eh? So I had a huge blind spot to express my real needs.

Yes.

And what I learned from it, I did when I was younger also the Olympic triathlons and I love sports. Water polo is just like rugby or ice hockey. It's, it's quite a tough sport. If you see the, the trainings you do, it's, it's you swim sprints until you almost vomit. So you go through all your boundaries during the trainings.

Right.

In the training for water polo, maybe that's good.

Right.

If you take that Principle to real life about your work, your personal life, then it is extremely unhealthy.

Right.

So I run my life like my life was a water polo game. Now that doesn't work. So I thought, oh, I thought I did my boundaries. No, no, no, Chris. Yes, your boundaries actually, as long as I don't vomit, I can still swim another 25 meters. That is really nice in a swimming pool doing water polo training. That's not normal if you do your work or your life or other kind of things.

Yeah.

So I had to learn myself.

Oh, wow.

And there the head brain steps in again. We've talked about very—

Yes.

What, which system am I actually running? And I was running my life like I was doing water polo training.

Yeah.

And I thought, okay, you have to express you. So I really, after that, learned to become, to say no to clients, to other kind of things. I cannot do that anymore.

Right.

I, I quit actually also the company, started my own company and thought, you know, in that company, probably I will never find the solution because they didn't understand. So I start my own company and decide, you know, I only work 4 days now based on my divorce. Uh, I take projects that I like and that I can and that give me energy.

Yes.

And, uh, I accept that I have, uh, maybe less money and that's totally okay.

Mm-hmm.

And I set my boundaries there. What do I really, what do I really want out of life?

Yes.

I'm now a young parent, divorced. What is now important for me?

Exactly.

Is now, say, a beautiful Porsche important for me, or actually that I see my 3 young kids and actually also have a decent sleep of 7, 8 hours? Let me think about that half a millisecond. Oh, hey, I choose actually for my kids and 7 hours sleep instead of the Porsche. And the moment I did that, it all came good again. So yes, from personal, I know extremely important how it works.

Yeah, that's amazing. Now, if you had to take today's conversation, you really wanted to pull out some important factors that you really want the listeners to understand. What are some things you'd like to emphasize about today's conversation and the things that we talked about?

Well, I would say let's go back to the one-liners because I know one-liners stick. So one of them, what I love, what I learned If you say to everybody yes, you get short-term friends and maybe massive amount of them. If you learn to say no, you get long-term friends.

Yes.

As I said, if they cannot accept your no, they don't deserve your yes. That is really, I would say, a sentence that you should stick on your computer, on your iPhone, on your whatever Samsung phone, because let's not put one phone there in, in the chart. But okay, Do, do they accept my no? Do they deserve my yes? That's one actually I would say to everybody.

Right.

Secondly, look, look at the signals.

Mm-hmm.

At the moment, you like to have something extra. It is because I came aware that when I was, say, heading to my burnout, I love to have, uh, extra energy.

Mm-hmm.

So, and because I was so active in sport, It didn't show in my physics, but I love to take, say, extra sugars in my coffee or just, no, just, just really, I could take a spoon of sugar and put it in my mouth because it gives you right away a glucose spike and it gives you an energy boost.

Yeah.

And nobody ever said, Chris, I know actually eating raw sugar, what the hell is wrong with you? Nobody said it. And I was not Aware of it, right? But actually, those are signs that if you go outside your normal pattern of food pattern or the kind of pattern that you need something, that actually something is wrong because you're taking externals to stay healthy or to keep yourself sane. My own system was not in balance anymore, so I was putting all kind of extra stuff in me to help me to balance.

Right.

Your body doesn't need. All kind of crazy externals to balance. So those are really signs. And the third one is, if you look at the water signs, how's your sleep? Your sleep is one extremely important measurement how good you are, because it gives you a right away check on your mental health. Disturbed sleep, crazy dreams, not falling asleep, waking up too early. Nightmares, it means something is happening. And of course, if it only happens once, you can go away. Full moon, no moon, that's okay. But if it happens, yeah, but people are affected by full moon. But if it happens, because I'm rather affected by full moon, I know if I have creation dreams, ah, full moon. But if it happens the whole month, it's not full moon. It means something else is happening. And the third check you can right away do Je opent er maar, oh, look in your cheek. Oh, je kan voelen op je tong dat is een beetje less gross. En als je voelt dat je hebt soms een imprint of je teeth in je inner cheek, you know you're stressed.

Right.

Because then during the night we do, we clench our jaws and that imprint is seen. In your inner cheeks, and most people don't know it. Is the easiest check you can right away do. Also, after you finish this podcast, you're not driving a car because that's really unhealthy to do driving a car looking in your inner cheek. You can you can put your tongue there. Just check with your tongue. Do you feel my teeth there? If you feel your teeth there, it's a sign. It means something is not balanced.

Wow.

Right away, I would say. gear down and start checking what is not balanced, which of my needs actually, actually am I not listening to, which of my own boundaries am I breaching?

Yeah.

And the funny part is, if you go to the dentist and you ask it, hey, by the way, how's my inner cheek? Most dentists know, right? Because that's what then they will say, oh yeah, no, your imprint of your teeth is really in your cheek crease, by the way. You probably have a lot of stress. You, you, you're chewing, uh, on your own teeth. Oh well. But the funny part is most dentists don't say it proactively because they're not trained psychologists. So they don't like to put something in you. But if you ask them, they will. Why do they confirm it? And so the easiest check, keep in your mind, let's go back. Easiest check, check your inner cheek.

Wow. You know, I used to get that. I haven't gotten it lately, but every once in a while I would, I would get that and I'll be like, hmm, you know, And I, you know, I would wonder, oh, I was chewing on my gums. You know, I was like, you know, what is that? You know? And, uh, and I never really, I didn't, I didn't correlate it with, uh, stress, you know?

But it is, it is because the same if you would massage your jaw muscles and it is tense or pain, it means there's tension in there. And these are the tension points of your own body. Also, a dentist knows that. But that's right away that, you know, oh wow, okay, something is happening in me. And then that moment, you know, you're breaching your own boundaries. You're not listening to your own needs. Something is happening in your life. Yeah. And if it happens once in a while, can happen. Everybody, someone, every car gets sometimes a flat tire. Doesn't have to do anything with maintenance.

Yeah.

But if your engine stops every second drive, you know there's something wrong. That's a huge difference. Yes.

Wow, that's great to know. Now, can you tell everybody about your services and things that you provide?

Yeah, that's so if people say, oh, well, I liked actually what Stacey and Chris were talking about. I just invite you to go to my website, 3 Brains Intelligence. There you find me, you find, uh, my books, You found podcasts also from Stacy, the links to that. You found ebooks that are just free to download. There are even some, um, some, some recordings to relax your own mind. And you can even find training to become, to learn about 3-brain coaching and how you can master actually how you can help people to align their 3 brains.

Yes.

It says in that, but the podcast, uh, the ebooks and my book, I will say, are, I'm Dutch, are the cheapest options to learn.

I love that. Where can people find your books now? On your website? But can they go on websites?

Yeah. And if you go to Amazon, you type in my name, and I know it's a Dutch name, Christoffel Sneijders, or Three Brains Intelligence, or the book title is on this moment Relationships: Which Brain Is Talking? You find it and boom, you find the best book actually to Boost your relationships and get actually the toxic ones out.

Oh, I love that. I love that. That's amazing. This has been awesome. I really enjoyed this conversation. So many people struggle with putting boundaries in their life. And, you know, and so today was an excellent conversation because we really were able to understand how each part of our brain plays a role in that and why placing boundaries in our life is so important and how to actually balance our life for overall health. So we I learned a lot in this conversation, and I really thank you so much for coming on the show today. I love when we do our talks. We have a great time, and I learn so much from you. You are just an amazing individual, and I love how you bring neuroscience into it and how, you know, how much we don't realize, but how much neuroscience actually plays a role in our life. You know, if we looked at it from a scientific view, we can understand a lot about ourselves and why we do the things we do, why we react the way we react, and ways that we could actually change it. So you're amazing.

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Thank you, Stacy. See you next time and have a beautiful Easter weekend.

Oh, thank you too. Thank you so much. And you have a beautiful Easter weekend also. Bye-bye.