Dividing Marriage Roles | Dave and Ashley Willis

Hello and welcome back to the Naked Marriage podcast. We are Dave and Ashley Willis, and on this podcast, we address the truth about sex, intimacy, and lifelong love. And you guys, we are continuing in our series about the seasons of marriage. And we have the most precious couple. They're honeymooners, and one of them actually works for exo. So you're getting kind of a behind the scenes look at some of our team here at xo. But they have such wisdom to share with you.

Right, sweetie?

Yes. You're gonna love today's episode. We're so excited to have Christian and Madison with us, and we're gonna have a fun conversation about the honeymoon season of marriage. So let's dive in. Well, like we said in the intro, we are so excited about our guests today for part two of the honeymooners section of Seasons of Marriage, rather. And of course, part one, we're talking solo, Ashley and me. But part two, every one of these, we're gonna have an interview with someone in that season. Today we've got our co worker Madison and her husband Christian, who are still, still honeymooners. You can still see that new marriage glow on you.

It looks amazing. It is now.

We're thrilled to have you guys here. So thanks for being here.

Thanks for having us.

Thank you.

So first year, you guys are just hitting that first year mark. Just celebrated your first anniversary a bit ago. What's life like right now? Tell us at all, like, you know, what, what's been unexpected, what's been great, Maybe what's been difficult. We'll talk about all of it. So just start wherever you want.

Yes.

You want to start?

Yeah, man. We've been married for about a year and a month now, and so there was way more that was unexpected than we expected. Like, you know, realistically, you go into a marriage, you're like, okay, I have to expect that. It's not gonna be perfect. It's not gonna be amazing. I think that was a logical to go into it, but we lived really close to each other when we were dating, and so we kind of thought, oh, this is going to be Easy. Live like 3 minutes within each other. So we go our separate ways at night and spend the whole day together, and we get to live our apartment the way that we like it. But there were a lot of surprises along the way. But it's been a lot of fun. What do you think?

I feel like for me it was an adjustment just with like the small things and like, sleeping in the same bed to figuring out our morning routine and getting ready for work. In the morning. Like all of those things really caught me off guard. And so I feel like just that adjustment took longer than I thought. As far as us in our tiny 700 foot apartment and we had a dog and being able to figure out, like, how we gel together day to day and then make sure that we're prioritizing one another every day instead of getting stuck in that, like, easy, like turn on TV after dinner and just kind of hang out every day. And so I didn't realize how easy that is to fall into.

Oh, yeah, definitely. Now with the dog, did you all get the dog after you were married or did one of you have this dog?

We got it when we were dating.

Yeah.

Oh, when you were dating. Okay. But this was a joint decision. And what kind of dog is your dog?

She's like a boxer mix.

It's mostly a good question.

Yes, right. The mixed breed. We have a mixed breed dog as well. And let me tell you, we did the same thing when we first got married. We got a dog because it's like kind of like your first child. I mean, it really is. And how was that adjustment? Because then all of a sudden you're taking care of a living being together.

Yes, well. And it's who's going to take the dog out and who's going to have to go out in the rain and when it's snowing and all this stuff. And so that was a big thing. I heard from someone that they had shifts and so, like I had the morning shift and so I would get up in the morning and take the dog out and then he would have the night shift. So then I wasn't like walking the streets of downtown Fort Worth. So that was, that was a good adjustment that we were able to figure out pretty quickly.

Yeah, you guys are better than us.

Yeah, you guys figured it out.

Figured it out that quickly?

We're still figuring it out. I know we need to be learning from you guys.

We had a little bit of an advantage. We went into marriage listening to you guys, so.

Oh, my God. Well played.

That's right. Well played.

I love it. Well, tell you what, I'm just going to ask a series of random questions and you say, which one of you is more this? Like I'm going to say, for instance, like, who's messier, who's more this, who's more that? And both of you have to answer honestly. So you can either say me or her or him. And we'll see if. If you're on the same page. And we'll also learn some things about pressure. Right? Yeah. This is unplanned.

This is just like a Newlywed Game.

Yes. Yeah.

I'm just excited. I'm just excited to see where this goes. So which one of you is cleaner Madison?

Me.

Okay. All right. Nice. Same in our house, man. I am a slob.

No, you're not.

I'm a slob.

You just don't see the mess as easily.

Right? I can live. I have a high tolerance.

High tolerance.

All right, which one of you is more of a night owl?

Me, for sure.

Significantly more night owl.

Yes.

I can't stay up past midnight. Yes.

10.

Yeah. See, we're.

Yeah.

Yeah. That's how big?

The same way I gotta get my eight hours.

Oh, yes.

I set a clock on when I need to go to bed.

I'm with you.

Yeah, Totally with you.

And I feel like I'm losing it life if I go to bed that early. Is that how you feel?

Yes.

Yeah. He feels like he's missing out at midnight. I'm like, trapped.

Like, I'm missing out of sleep at midnight. That's what I'm missing.

I know for sure.

All right, that's good. Okay, which one of you. Which one of you is more of a morning person?

Probably me.

Yeah. You require lessons.

Nice.

He's just weird, I think.

Wow.

Yeah.

That's amazing.

I don't even like mornings. I'm like the weird person that like a mid afternoon you are dating.

It's the same midday.

It's my prime.

I peak midday. Yeah, like, that's. That's when life got a little caffeine.

I've had most of my day under me.

You don't have to be night owl or morning person. It's midday. What about us midday people?

More than midday people. Now, midday, are you tired?

Usually around like 2 o', clock. I'm like, all right, time for a nap.

He's you. Wow.

Like an inverted thing. Yeah.

We've literally talked about that whenever, like, since we started listening to y'.

All.

I was like, the gender roles are a little reversed in this situation.

Yeah, well, it's not gender specific.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Personality different, though. And that. That's something to navigate in marriage, too. Is that. Did you guys. I mean, did you know that just from talking in the dating and engagement phase? Or did you find that out when you were married?

Probably more engagement. When we kind of started seeing that.

Okay.

Yeah, because he would want. And then that was a big adjustment, getting married. And then he'd want to stay up late. And I'm like, I'm going to bed. Turn off all the lights.

I feel kind of bad.

Right.

I want to go to bed with you, but I'm not tired.

Yeah. I'm on wake.

Yeah. It's tough to navigate, like. And every couple navigates that kind of stuff.

Yeah.

Right. And it's just part of it. And it's just part. Because God has a sense of humor, and he puts us with somebody who's different on a lot of levels. And their wiring's not wrong, and yours isn't wrong. It's just how you are. And then you gotta. You figure out how to just. How to. How to make it work. So, like. So, like, what are the things? And you don't have to get personal here unless you want. You know, feel free. Like, I overshare all the time. But what. What are the things that I guess caused tension maybe unexpectedly in that first year? You know, it could be little things or bigger things, quirky things, but just the things where you guys have kind of, like, you know what? That's.

That's kind of different when it comes.

That's really annoyed me to the point where we're gonna. We're gonna have a spirited conversation about this.

The dishwasher was a big thing.

There we go.

I'm, like, anal about how I want to load the dishwasher.

Yeah, yeah. He's got, like, a whole system. Things go in certain rows.

It's gotta. It's gotta look uniform, and it's gotta be loaded to the max occupancy.

I see.

Yes.

All right.

Yes. Makes no sense.

I was actually proven wrong, though, because that actually makes him not get as clean, so.

Oh, really?

There was that way.

We had to lessen. We had to come up with a new strategy of not filling it to the brim. And it washes better, but I would just throw it. I just throw it in the. He, like, hand washes it before he puts it in the dishwasher.

And that was like, I want it spick and span.

That was foreign to me.

I know. I'm like, why am I putting it in a dishwasher?

And if it's dirty, I'll just run it again.

See, I'm the same. Yeah. Now, I did this with towels, too. And remember, like, I would be like, well, if we didn't get it in the dryer, just wash it again, you know? And Dan's like, this is wasting, like, a lot of energy and a lot of water. And so he's really Johnny on the spot, getting the stuff. So I get it. It's like you have different ways, right?

The stuff that you care about, like. Cause like, I don't care at all about a lot of things, you know, like, but when the washer is done, then whatever else I'm doing, you stop. I need to stop because I need to put that stuff in the. That stuff has to go in the dryer. Like, for some reason that. And I think because early on we got lazy about it and like, everything had like a mildew smell.

We wash it and then we would just. Your parents and my parents keep rewashing.

Stuff because it would sit there all day. And so. So now. Now it's like I'm listening all the time for the little ding. Like, the washer's done. And it could be in the middle of anything, you know, I mean, the middle of like for long or play, you know, like we're. We're like making out and it's like. It's like, you know, hot and heavy. And I'm like, no, stop washing machines.

My Spidey sensors are going up.

Wait, wait, I'll be back. And I've got to do it. So it's just funny. Kind of the things that we each in our quirks develop, that's more important, like how you load a dishwasher or little things like that, but being willing to laugh about stuff.

Exactly.

Keeping your sense of humor. What was it like? I guess what were some of the big adjustments of just living under the same roof, adapting to one another's styles, bringing finances together, just kind of practical, day to day stuff like that. How's that been?

We.

I feel like we're still learning a lot. We have figured out like, budgeting wise and talking about it, like, yes, we. I think for the first like four or five months of our marriage, we just kind of like had this, like, okay, we share our finances. Like, our paychecks go together. And then we just didn't talk about what we spent or like, how much we should be spending. And so we've done, like, better, I would say, as far as creating a budget and talking about it, like, how much would we want to spend on groceries this week? And being verbal about it because I. We are so polar opposites just in that way. I hate spending money and I can't. And I feel guilty for it. And I have to tell myself that it's okay. And Christian can justify any purchase.

Right. They're like, it's money.

Right? Right. Like, we need this. We need this. I need this new Xbox. I need this. Yeah. And so those kinds of things were a huge adjustment for us. And I think talking about it was a huge thing that we, like, realized is helping us.

Communication is key. I mean, that those of you who are listening and watching and who are honeymooners or maybe even engaged, you've got to communicate about your finances. Like, that's the best thing you can do, is just getting on the same page. And that was a struggle for us, too. But when we started out, literally, we had nothing. So it was, like, not much to argue over, but you know what I'm saying. But we had debt, and that can cause a lot of friction in marriage. And so we were kind of climbing out of debt in the beginning of our marriage. But then once we climbed out of that debt, just trying to stay out of debt and get on the same page, it's something that. It's a continuous conversation, because it's not like you arrive and all of a sudden.

No, no. Yeah.

Every season, always. We're always talking about it, but I feel like talking about it is, like, continuously is so much better than falling into these arguments. Because I think a lot of couples fall into the trap of, like, ask for forgiveness, not permission, you know? Cause they just. It just burns them to have to talk to their spouse about money they themselves have made. But when we look at it, like, well, God gave me this body, the lungs and the air in my lungs, this job that I have and this money I'm making is his anyway. And as a married person, I'm putting this with my spouse's money as well. I think when we really look at it through that perspective and talk calmly, like you guys are talking about it, really, it's just so much healthier. Right. And you can not feel this tension.

Towards each other or, like, secrets and, like, I don't want to tell him about this. Yes.

No. That's a huge trap. Huge. And there's all these gifts about the secrets, like the Amazon boxes and hiding them and stuff. And I know that's funny on the surface, but that is not good marriage advice. Right. I mean, it always comes out. It always comes out. And I'm like, this is not good. I mean, I know we can joke, but I'm like, don't. We shouldn't do that. Like, we shouldn't hide anything from our spouse.

So.

Yeah.

So wise.

Yes.

Yeah. You gotta be naked.

Well, I've learned a lot of these things the hard way. So, like, a lot of our things we've learned in our honeymoon season, we're kind of trial and error, just kind of navigating.

This is something I learned in the honeymoon thing. I learned that even though we share everything there is, if it's Ashley's food, I shouldn't touch it. No, here's what I mean. Like, she's great. She shares everything. But, like, one day early on, we'd gone out to eat. I think we probably told this story. But we came home, and in a box, she had brought home the rest of her food and put it in the fridge. And we didn't go out to eat very much. So this was like, she was saving this. She had a plan for it. She was thinking about it all day at work. And I came home before her that day, and I'm like, what do we got? And I opened it up, and I'm like, oh, yeah, that looks good.

Nice little snack.

Nice little snack. Yeah. And I ate that thing. Didn't think a thing of it. I'm just like, yeah, it was food, and I ate it, and it was great. And then she came home, and she was like, oh, it's been such a long day. She opened the fridge. She was like, where's. Where's the food? And I was like, oh, yeah, that. I ate it. She was like, I was gonna. I was just. Just forget it. And she, like, stormed up.

I was really upset.

She was really upset.

I wanted that meal, whatever it was. And I know I just had been dreaming about it all day or something, I guess. Poor Dave. He's like, well, it was just. I thought we shared everything. And I'm like, we do, but I just really wanted that.

Yeah. Yeah.

You know, I know. And I think, you know, as far as being honeymooners, too, figuring that kind of stuff out. But also, I think the biggest, like, a big thing that is a sticking point for couples is divvying up the roles. Okay.

Yes.

Like, who cleans what, who? You know, who's cooking dinner? Like, how have you guys navigated that?

That's good.

Oh, I went in thinking we had it down. We did a pre marriage course. And I was like, oh, all you do is, like, divvy it up. You're doing laundry, you're doing trash. Christian was like, I don't want to do the dishes in the trash. And, like, all the lame ones, you know? And so that was something that I think was hard for us.

And also not sticking to, like, what we agree on. Like, okay, I'll take care of the trash if you replace the bag. Not sticking to it. Like, it's like, it's a strict regimen, Right?

Exactly.

Or I cook. You need to do the dishes.

Yeah.

There are times that I'll do the cooking and the. And the dishes. Like, just. Cause that's how I want to. I want to serve you that night. And yes, it's a matter of sacrifice. And I mean well.

And I'll be too ambitious and I'll, like, do it all. And then I'll be like, you didn't.

Even out the toilet.

You couldn't even take out the trash. I did all the dishes. He's like, you did not have to do all that. You know, and I'll just, like, go clean crazy. Or like, he didn't fold the towels the way I wanted him to. And so then I'm just more frustrated that he did it. Like, why? That was just extra work. Now I have to go in and redo it.

Now, do you fold it in half or in the three Fold, of course, the right way. Okay. Yes, right way.

Just be thankful that they're folding.

Right?

I mean, yes, for me, I'm like, if it's a wad, it's still going to work the same. I'm about to just wad it and pull it out and then hanging on a hook and. But see, that's ridiculous because she is so precise. I like the threefold and I've learned that she likes that.

And, well, and this is so funny. We have shared this a long time ago on the podcast. But, like, so I, you know, I have my. The laundry is always taken to the hamper, right? We don't have piles. And Dave, like, one day I was cleaning, and I am a clean freak. I mean, the towels in the washer were like. I don't know why. It's really not with my norm. Right. Letting it get a little mildew. Because I really am like, anal about my house. But I noticed how I was cleaning something and I went and I spotted this little pile under Dave's side of the bed. And I was like, I look under there. So immediately I'm like, oh, it's dirty clothes. And I take it and I washed it. And I guess he came when it was in the wash cycle. And he's like, looking around and he's like, where's my pile? And I was like, oh, I don't know why you were storing dirty clothes under your side of the bed. And he goes, sweetie, this is my not quite dirty pile.

It's not quite dirty.

And I knew if you saw it.

Not quite.

You think they were dirty.

How legalistic to think it can only be clean or dirty. Like, there's a wide range in the middle. And so, like, if I'm gonna put on some gym shorts and I just wear them around the house for a minute, but then later, I'm gonna go run or something, I, I, I don't want to throw those shorts away. I can reuse those. So I hide them under the.

Oh, yeah.

Or like a water cup, you know, I'll have, I'll take, take a drink of water. And then I'm like, I'm not done with that. But I don't want to keep carrying it around. So I'm just going to set it here and then, and then I'll come back and I'll have it in it briefly. But it's like, as soon as I turn around, it's gone. It's gone.

I'm like, where's the house?

I was using, I was using that. And so we laugh. But, like, you know, we just learned to embrace each other's.

Kids know this. It's like the ghost, the cleaning ghost. Like, it comes through gone. Because if I don't, I mean, we, you know, we've got four kids. Steph piles up. So I'm like, okay, we're gonna take this, Take this. But all the time he's like, where, where was that? And, and so I think his thought was, well, she doesn't see, won't be taken away, you know.

But anyway, so I discovered the pipe.

Yeah, it's a lot, you guys.

Well, we shared a closet. We had this good exercise. It was a huge closet. But that was our first, Our first apartment that we just had was a big closet that we had to share. And so his whole side had piles of. I wore this for two seconds. Clothes. Yes.

I took the dog out in this. I can't put it in the hamper yet. I can wear it tomorrow when I go run.

This jacket I'm gonna put on in.

Two days when it comes off.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Saving water money. You know, I don't want to throw it in the washer yet.

Right.

That's smart. Strategic.

There was almost like an invisible line of tape in our, in our closet.

There was that.

Okay, you don't, don't. I'm still using this. And then her side was, like, perfectly clean and picked up and, yeah. Organized.

But, yeah, that's, that's very much.

Yeah, very much. You've shared over the years.

We have shared closets.

And I do because for me, my clothes are color, color coded. Like I have like a color so I can find it easy. Right. And Dave, it's like he has his own system and that's okay. And I am okay with that. I used to be a little more anal than I am now. I've had to relax over the years. He's embraced literally just years later. We have these four boys. Two of them are teenagers. The other day I was going through their rooms and they pick up their rooms, but they don't deep clean them. And so it was ready for a deep clean. And I literally open Connor, our 15 year old's closet and instead of putting, he always is good about taking his laundry from the stairs that I folded and putting them away. Okay. He has put them in a pile. Literally. You guys, I'm not even joking. It's like nothing is hung four feet tall. Nothing's hung. You know what I did, like, old Ashley would have been like, oh. And like hung everything up, put it in the drawers and I just went, clothes. 15 year old can handle it. Yeah. If it's, if he's gonna look clean and it's fine, whatever. So I feel like I've come a long way. Like I'm trying here because I used to get really upset about those things, but I would literally be upset all the time if I like.

So I've had to grow. I've had to grow.

We all, we all grow. And I've, we've.

Oh, it's taken.

I've gotten less, less caveman esque, you know, so we help each other.

You're very good.

Come back to you guys. Like, I want to know, like, what, what are you talking about now? When you look ahead to the future. Right? So now that you've, you, you've got a year of marriage under your belt, you're looking ahead to potentially starting a family or. I mean, what are the, what are those goals on the horizon now? Those big decisions that, that you're talking through right now? And again, you know, don't, don't share anything if you don't want. But I'm saying, like, whatever you'd like to share, I'd be interested.

Next question, please. I don't feel comfortable right now, honestly. A lot of what we're talking about is kind of just where we are. Like debt, debt and paying that off that. And I mean, we're really grateful. It's not like we're not swimming in it, but it's. It needs to be taken care of.

Yes.

And so taking care of that because we want to, we want to Save you to save money so we can get a house eventually.

Oh, yeah.

And so, yeah. Even if it's not the market that we want to do it in right now.

Yeah.

We want to start building our assets and being able to, like, have that option at least.

Sure.

And so.

Yeah.

Because once we get a house, we get another dog. There you go. That's our. That's our goal that we want.

That's really good.

Yeah. And that's a big. I mean, it's a big dream, like buying your first home together. That's a huge dream. So that's awesome. And so you're kind of trying to get finances in a row and just, you know, working through that debt. And I know that can feel overwhelming, but it is also. It's a good exercise in working together. It really is. And once you get there, I mean, it's like, it's gonna be so sweet, you know, and that you've navigated that together. I wanna ask this. And again, you guys can be as open and honest as you'd like to be. Cause we totally respect any boundaries you wanna put in place with this question. But we shared on our previous podcast about how in law relationships and parental relationships change when you get married. Has that, you know, has that been something that has been a little tricky for you guys? And I know that it's a slippery slope.

I know it's been less tricky than I expected it to be.

Well, that. That's awesome.

Yeah.

We also have a very unique situation. My parents are missionaries in Guatemala. And so going. Spending Christmas with my parents is usually not as much of an option anyways.

Or they come to the States. You know, we try to really prioritize that time with them.

Sure. Yeah.

And so we can't really do the even toss of, okay, we spent five days at my parents. Let's go spend five days with your family. And so I think balancing that and our families are completely different. So he came from all boy family. He has a brother, and then I have. And then I have a sister. And so we came from. We came up from a very different. And that in itself, like sharing a bathroom with my sister compared to sharing a bathroom with a boy, huge adjustment. And going to each other's houses, like, his family will sit around and watch the cowboys play for hours. And I'm like, no, my parents, you go home, there's a schedule. We're cooking dinner on this night. We're gonna go do this on Saturday. And so just that in itself was an adjustment and being able to Appreciate visiting the other person's family, you know, and how different that is.

I love that you use the word appreciate, because I think coming from a posture of appreciation and honor. We talked about honor in the previous podcast. That is so essential. And I can see just on your faces as you're talking about each of your families that you have, that you do, like, you wanna honor both your families, and you do appreciate them, and so you feel that support. I can tell you all feel supported. Would you say that's true?

Oh, absolutely.

Yeah. And, I mean, that is such a blessing, you all. I'm so. Yeah, I'm so glad to hear that, because that is. I think that's a goal for so many. And navigating. But it is tricky, especially, I mean, your parents are abroad. Do they ever. Do you feel like they ever get jealous of the time they have with her family? Because I think that would be.

Absolutely. I know that's a struggle for my mom, and I feel for it because they moved there when we were in college, and so I know a lot of the times she feels like she's missing out on stuff. And we work. I mean, we always hope to be able to go to Guatemala for Christmas, but, I mean, it's just so difficult. And luckily, another big difference with our families is like, my entire family, like, aunts, cousins, uncles, second cousins, all live in the same town.

Oh, wow.

Which is not super common anymore. And so Madison has been a major trooper through meeting my entire family.

Yeah.

And so because there's so many names to remember, there's, like, one side of the family is crazier than the other, and it's just.

Every family's that way.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

Yes. Yeah.

Crazy uncle, whatever.

She's really impressed me in that. In that category of just how. How she's, like, so willing to just go and put herself in that situation and be like, yeah, meet your family. It's fun. So the chaos is. Is entertaining.

Yeah. Very different.

Yeah, I love that. And different doesn't mean bad. I mean, different can be so good. And you can learn, you know, because you're really making your own family unit. So you're gonna take a little bit from your family's of origin, but you're gonna. It's gonna look different. It may not even resemble either one of them as a whole, but, like, you know, you're making your own family unit, and I think that's exciting, you know?

Well, and even that was hard with, like, I think of, like, Christmas traditions and stuff, and I'd be Like, like we got our first tree this past year and everything together. And I had. My mom, when I moved out, gave me a whole box of ornaments that I had. And I got an ornament every year for Christmas. And that was something that she said. So when you have your house, you have. So I'm like hanging up my ballerina and like my soccer one and like all these childhood ornaments. I'm like, all right, Christian, like, where's. Yeah, where's your ornaments?

Put them up on the tree. I was like, looking around for them, called my mom. I was like, where are my ornaments?

I'm telling you, Boy house, you know.

Love me, mom at boy house.

I'm telling you, it was so different.

I know I made a lot. She's like, those are mine.

Yeah. She was like, I'm not giving you those.

Yeah, those are mine. Yeah.

For Mother's Day. Uh huh. You know.

No, I totally get that. It is literally the same. Like it's. It's so different in a girl household than a boss. But that's really neat. And then you're gonna start buying, you know, you have maybe a doggy ornament. You guys have your doggie ornaments represent. Exactly. So you're forming your own. And when you get that new house, there's a new house ornament too. Like the first home.

And then someday all those baby ornaments.

I know, all the ornaments, you'll have more than you even need.

It's so fun.

It's crazy.

I wanna ask one more question before we end, because I wanted to get to this. People ask all the time as honeymooners about couple friends and how they make couple friends. You know, that's a huge question. I mean, we probably weekly get emails from people who are like, we heard you guys talk about couple friends. But it feels so elusive. It feels so hard. What do you guys think about that? And how do you make couple friends?

Well, I would say we kind of lucked out because a lot of our friends, so we met in college and our roommates were dating each other and they got married a couple months before us. And so like, that in itself, like, we just had a lot of friends in college that just got married or getting married around our time. And so that's been a huge blessing to be able to have those couples that we're able to connect with in different ways.

That's huge.

Yeah. And even just the connections through work and like Madison meeting people here at EXO and becoming really close with them and me meeting their spouses and just getting Close to them. And honestly, we also got lucky with just friends that conveniently moved to this area after they graduated, just like we did. And so just. But honestly, the biggest thing that we've been trying to implement is just getting plugged in.

Yes.

And whether that be at church, whether that be just at a. Like a local event, just, you got to get plugged in. You're not going to make friends if you're not getting plugged in and. And putting yourself out there. And so.

Which is scary. And I think that's where, you know, depending on your personality, it can be scary because you feel like, what if they reject me? I think there's that inner middle schooler that never goes away in all of us.

Yes.

And I mean, even I'm 41 years old, and even still, Dave has to remind me. He's like, if you don't, you know, if you never ask, you never even know what they're gonna say, you know, So, I mean, I think all of us have that, but I feel like every time I've. I've put myself out there, especially with couple friends or even just individual friendships, even if it doesn't quite work out, I never regret the fact that I tried, you know, and so what I hear you guys saying is try, you know, find a small group at church or, you know, if those, you know, you see on Facebook or Instagram, those old college, you know, mates kind of move to your area, reach out. You know, odds are they really want a friend. So I think that that's such great advice. That's awesome.

Definitely. And it's nice to do it with your spouse. Like, as corny as it is, like, I don't have to go into small group by myself and, like, find someone, like, we can go in together as a team.

We go down. We're going down together.

That's right.

We're in this till the end.

Yes.

I love that. That's such a great reminder.

So good, guys. You are. You are awesome. And I'm so excited for you to just, like, the adventure that you're on and what God has in store for you. And so thank you for sharing this, and I even hope, like, today's interview, you're looking back on this many years from now, you know, showing your kids, like, look. Look how young we look. Oh, man. But really, truly, Madison, thank you for the amazing work you do here at xo.

Yes, thank you.

You're such a vital part of the team. Christian, thank you for. For coming and sharing your wisdom and your heart and you two are just an amazing young couple. And. And for those who are listening and watching today, I hope this was an encouragement to you. I know. I know it was. And if you know anybody in this season of Life, or maybe Preparing, maybe they're engaged, they're preparing, this would be a great episode to send out and to share, because I think this conversation and the wisdom you guys shared is going to help a lot of people. So thanks for being here.

Great.

Thank you.

Thank you for having us.

Thank you all so much. And we will see you all next time on the Naked Marriage podcast.