How To Make Menopause Easier

Hello, and welcome back to the Naked Marriage Podcast. We are Dave and Ashley Willis, and on this podcast, we address the truth about sex, intimacy, and lifelong love. And you guys, you've asked for this, you have emailed us about it, you have commented on Instagram about it, and we are finally having an episode about menopause and marriage. So be ready. And we have the perfect couple to interview about this, and Dave is going to tell you all about them.

Menopause and a word you might not have known yet. Manopause? What's that, you ask? Well, just wait. You'll see. We're so excited to interview our friends Kenny and Heidi Drury. They are part of the team here at Exomarriage. They are two of our mediators, which are the folks that are on the front lines meeting with couples right here at the exocenter in South Lake, Texas, marriage capital of the world. And also they're available to meet via Skype and those sorts of things. They do an incredible job encouraging couples. And we have been talking to our team about just the need for having a conversation around menopause. Like, Ashley said something so many have written in, something that we're trying to prepare for as well, and I'm like, well, let's not just talk about it in a theoretical way. Let's talk to someone who's in it and willing to share their story. And Kenny and Heidi are so, so awesome and real, and they're willing to just come and share what they're walking through right now. We're honored to have you guys. So welcome to the podcast.

Thank you, guys.

Thank you so much. I appreciate it.

Definitely pleased here.

Yeah.

Thrilled to have you guys here. So.

So.

But before we dive into the menopause part, we always ask, have people tell us their love story. How did it start? Where'd you meet?

Oh, dang.

Oh, my God.

So start there. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, we were. We met in a bar. There was a brewery she worked at, and I did my payroll there, and I'd go there and have a couple beers on Friday, and she was a server. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Heidi is. What she said.

Yeah. There's a whole story behind that.

There sure is.

Yeah. But, yeah, we've been together now going on 18 years. We're a blended family. I brought three boys to the marriage. Kenny brought. Or no, I brought two boys. He brought three daughters, and now we have seven grandbabies.

Whoa.

Oh, my goodness.

It happens quick, too.

Yeah.

I love that.

Good for you. That's amazing.

That is so awesome.

And you guys Have. You know, you're such an inspiration. You've helped so many people here already.

Thank you.

But like we were talking about beforehand, menopause is no joke, right? I mean, it changes things and it can be a challenge for the woman, obviously physically, emotionally, in all ways hormonally and for the man, which is the manopause referring to. We're walking through this together, so we just wanted to hear your story and to hear your experience and to hear whatever insights and advice you would give for couples who are in it, who are preparing for it. So, yeah, we just want to learn from your expertise. So tell us what took you by surprise with menopause or what? You know what, I don't even want to put words in your mouth. You just tell us about menopause and we'll start there.

Well, I came to menopause differently than some women. I had a partial hysterectomy when I was 35 years old. So they removed part of my parts, but I kept my ovaries. So that's the part that creates all the fun hormone flashes, hot flashes and all that stuff. So I was warned that I might start to go into it earlier. I'm now 53, but I would say in the last, probably four years is when I've really, really noticed a difference. I've always been a warm blooded individual, always ran hot. But I'm talking about, you think Texas is hot? These hot flashes are no joke. Oh man. And I would say for me, my hot flashes, and I would assume everybody's symptoms obviously are different, but mine come with almost an adrenaline pump. So when I get them, I feel like fight or flight turns on and I get anxiety on top of it. So it wasn't just like I need to fan off and cool off. It was I couldn't sleep at night because I would go into fight or flight right before bedtime.

Yeah.

And that was the worst. Go to lay down.

So then you're never rested?

No.

Well, that's. Yeah, that's a whole nother ball of wax of the menopause. Your sleep cycle's off. I'll wake up at one or two, ready to start the day, really. And then about three or four o' clock before dinner, I want to go to bed. So my whole sleep cycle was definitely off. So I think the lack of sleep, the hot flashes and then no woman loves to gain weight. So that's really been a real struggle for me. I grew up dancing. Like, I know you did too, Ashley. So I danced for like 20 years played sports, never had a problem. I could eat anything. And of course, grandma at a young age was like, someday, sweetie, you won't be able to eat whatever you want. And I was like, whatever, Grandma.

Right.

But it's true. The minute those hormones change, your body completely changes a lot. Like pregnancy. But it's been, what, five times harder to go back to, like, premenopause weight. I call it, like, baby weight. So it's just. It's just. It's not fun at all.

Wow.

Yeah.

Yeah, Go ahead.

No, I mean, I know it's a lot. And this isn't to, like, scare anybody, because it is part of life.

It's a natural part of life, too.

A natural part of life. But we wanted to have this episode so there could be understanding. Because a lot of times couples will write us. A lot of times it's. I mean, it's the husband or wife, and they'll just say, like, help me. Because this is not only affecting, you know, like, the wife will say me personally and how I feel, but my relationship. Because, you know, sometimes women will say they'll have rage because it's making them feel so bad. Or even. Even, like, in the bedroom, things are kind of off there. And so then there's this frustration between them because it's not working like it once did because she's, you know, the hormone change or the menelaudis, and they're like, I think I've done something wrong. My wife is so frustrated with me all the time. I don't know what to do to help her. And it's not that they're, like, blaming her, but they're just like, this is over my head. I don't know what to do.

Because men, we want to be fixers.

And that's exactly it.

I don't know how to fix. I don't know how to help.

Right, right. So I think both men and women often feel inadequate. And like you said, Heidi, there's a spectrum of symptoms, and some it's, like, more severe than others. But I do think that every woman, to some extent, is going to experience some changes, you know, hormonally. And even, like, I have yet to meet a woman in menopause who hasn't had some change in her body. And I think it's interesting, too. It hits in a time of life, too, where the change in our body, it just feel. We feel it even more so. Don't you think?

Yes.

And then that can. When we don't feel as confident, that even affects our marriage, because we just. We aren't in a good place. And so I would love to know, kind of in the midst of this, what are some things that you feel like have worked in keeping your marriage strong, like, going through this time of your life?

Well, first of all, prayer. Okay. Yes, absolutely. I think we learned years ago from Jimmy. One of the things that we have done even before we had menopause is before our feet hit the ground in the morning, is to really pray. Holy Spirit, give me your fruits so that I'm not living out of the flesh. And it's really important now more so than ever, ever. So that's the first thing. And just open communication, because you tend to want to just feel like it's your issue. And I heard Lynette and Sean this morning on Instagram even saying, like, when one of you is suffering, really, the marriage is suffering. We're all suffering. So open and honest communication, obviously, has to be there, too. And I think, especially for the husband to understand. We don't want to feel this way.

Yeah.

You know, like, I'm not choosing to be grouchy. I'm not choosing not to be sexually intimate with you now. I'm not choosing to not be happy with myself. I feel so out of control. So for him to understand that and to have empathy for that's been a huge thing, man.

Empathy is so important, Right?

Yeah. A big thing for me was just learning how not to take it personal, you know, because it's like, I know I didn't do anything.

You know, I don't think I did.

I don't think I did. Did I leave the toothpaste cap off, socks on the floor, so I'll just walk through the house? No, I'm good.

But you're like, where is this rage coming from? And a lot of times it's just like you said. I mean, physiologically, stuff's going on, and you're like, I don't. You know, I know that sometimes I've heard some women say, like, listen, I get it. I am not pleasant right now, but I just don't. I can't seem to control this. I want to, but I can't, you.

Know, right now, actually, you know, I've never, of course, been through menopause, but I experienced a lot of hormonal changes related to a thyroid issue. And while that was. While we were trying to navigate that, my hormones were all over the place. My serotonin, in my mind was. My testosterone was gone, and I was so, like, I was not myself. I was frustrated all the time, I couldn't snap out of it. I even said some of the same words. I get that I'm not pleasant right now, and I'm trying to snap out of it, and I just can't pull myself out of it. And thankfully, Ashley was so tender through that time and really set the bar high for how I hoped to be when she experiences hormonal changes. But we walked through that. I mean, it was a process. It is a process, and it was a fairly long process. And thankfully it came through that. And there was medication and stuff to help. So all that to say. I think there are different things in life that can happen to either spouse where health or hormones can get off and we can just not be at our best and we need to be really tender with each other in those moments. But the thing about menopause is it's something, you know it's coming. It's something that is going to happen. Unless you've had a hysterectomy or something where, you know, all at once things are totally removed. But even then, you still have stuff. Even then, there's. There's. Even if you got a full hysterectomy, there are still massive hormonal changes and physical changes. It just kind of happens faster, I guess, instead of. Instead of more than the natural process of menopause. And this is not. There's nothing wrong with you for having menopause. I think sometimes our culture has maybe made women feel like there's something wrong with you because you're going through this. Like, this is the most natural. This is a very natural but difficult part of life. And those who are listening or listening like, well, how. What can we do? Want to talk to those who are in it, but to those who are maybe preparing for it. Right. Like, if you could rewind the clock a few years before all these changes started and give yourself some advice to prepare. Give your husband some advice as he prepares. And what would you say to yourself? What would you say to yourself? Because some people are listening and they're not there yet. And they're like, we just. If there's anything we can do physically, emotionally, in terms of our relationship, whatever, to enter into that with the right mindset, we want to do it. So what advice would you give?

Yeah, Well, I think, first of all, you have to be your own advocate. And it's very shocking to me, even now that I'm in it, that every doctor has a different opinion. There's so much information on the Internet, like, which hormone is good which is bad. And a lot of that information conflicts with each other. So you're like, I don't know, if I take this, will I get cancer? Will I not get cancer? Is this going to help? Is this not going to help? So kind of be ready to be like, getting your PhD in menopause is what I like to say. Because you have to kind of, like, be told this is what you can do, then research it, ask people for their opinions. But it doesn't have to be the truth for you. It's just. You're just kind of finding out what works for you. Everybody's hormones and metabolisms are different, so everybody deals with it different. I think just have an open mind, and you really have to know what's right for you, your family and God. You know what I mean? So being in prayer about it and somebody else, what works for them will probably not work for you, or it might work for a little bit and then it changes. So just being flexible, patient, and that is probably one of my least. I'm not very patient.

That's on both sides of the fence.

I can relate to it.

I can relate.

Yeah.

And as a guy, just be prepared for a cool house, you know, have blankets. Like I was telling Dave earlier, you know, I got my Ugg boots. I'm probably the only guy in Texas that wears Ugg boots during the summer.

Bundled up in Texas.

Bundled up in Texas with a blanket. I can. If I'm going to be on the couch, I got a blanket.

And.

Yeah, and sometimes I'll get up and sneak it up a couple degrees and.

And I.

All of a sudden the clothes come off because she's like, the thermostat.

I will have to say I'm not convinced that he's not partly happy with menopause because, yeah, we're in empty nesters, obviously, so that's amazing. But I don't wear a lot of clothes these days because it's literally everything makes me hot.

What's awesome is I'll turn around. I'll be doing something in the kitchen. I'll turn around.

And it's like, hello.

I like this part of menopause.

I mean, I would. It's nice for him, but that part is just like. I'm like, don't touch me. I'm sweating. And you sweat from the inside out. It's not. I mean, you can see when I'm warm, but usually it comes from within. You, like turned on the furnace from the inside out. So he. I'm just like, all right. Whatever. Enjoy, enjoy, Enjoy the show.

I get the show, but I don't. I don't envy it.

Well, what are the things that he has done that have been most helpful to you? Because for the guys listening and they're like, I want to be supportive. You know, like. But again, when we were fixers, and this is something we can't truly, like, fix, but we want to be supportive, so what has he done that has been really helpful, meaningful?

Well, first of all, again, prayer. I mean, covering me in prayer has been huge. Not taking it personal and accepting apology when I have to apologize for being snappy or not myself and just being willing to go to appointments with me. I mean, yesterday he went and picked up two medications for me at the pharmacy. I would say, yeah, just being a support in those little things. Doing the dishes, extra, taking anything off my plate, that would make me more irritable.

Right, right.

And acts of service is my love language anyway, so that he gets double points, you know. Yeah. In the win column. So I would say those are huge.

Nice.

You know, what I hear you saying is just knowing you're not alone in this, really having a true partnership mentality, and I love that. And I want to say this real quick. This podcast, we have conversations with people talking about their own experience. And so we're not doctors here. And so you need to consult your doctor about things and counselors, whoever, you know, those professionals in your life. But, Heidi, I would love to hear what has worked for you, like, what things have brought you relief. You know, any kind of thing you want to share.

Yeah. She even brought some with her. She's got some portable fans.

I have the hot flash fan. This is for church and places that you need to be a little more quiet. And then I have the. You know, the one that hangs around the neck.

Yeah.

I found this one at a. At a. Like, a swap meet. I saw it, and I went, perfect for free, giving them away. And then that one there, I went into Rite Aid, I think, and picked that one up. She was sweating like crazy. Yeah.

Money well spent.

Yeah.

And it's like, on hand.

On hand. And the thing is, with these, if somebody else is cold and you're not, you don't have to go torture them.

So true. Yeah.

Just handy tools like this. And there's a variety of them on Amazon especially, or in your local store, you can do that. Exercise is really good for me, but not the typical exercise that I would have been used to back in my 20s and 30s. You actually have to slow it down. Weights is really good for building muscle. But you have to be less aerobic, which is really hard for me because that was always my favorite thing to do. So I find just walking. We love to walk together, so just being together, walking works really good. If I had a walk in freezer, that would be amazing. I think we should remodel the house, right?

Or just go to, like, Costco and.

Hang out where they're going with.

You have no clue, dude. It is. He's like, see you in a minute. And I'm like, no, you won't. Yeah, no, you won't. I'm gonna be in here, be here.

In the milk section, be in the milk bag.

So that's helped. And then I finally had to make a decision where I couldn't be, like, this tough girl. I had to go get medication.

I was gonna ask about that.

Yeah. Cause I didn't want to. I just put it off. Put it off. But it got to the point where I just felt. Felt like an elephant would sit on me on top of being hot and whatnot. So I went and had all my labs done, and they started looking at everything. And for me, I am still ovulating very irregularly, which is hard to tell because I don't have regular menstrual cycles. But they have to take blood work, so I still don't need estrogen. But the testosterone cream they started me on, and then progesterone, and then they recently just put me on thyroid. Because for about five weeks, the testosterone cream was working amazing. I literally within two days, looked at him and said, I'm sorry. I didn't realize how unhappy I had been. It was like having. It's like having pms, like, kind of constantly. And so for about five weeks or so, the cream was working great. And then, literally, it just stopped.

Like a switch went off.

Like a switch went off. And really, I guess sometimes the absorption rate of the cream can slow down. So I've gone back, had more tests. They put me on thyroid, because that's a little low. And I'm looking into the pellets. So that's my next option. And I have an appointment in a couple weeks to go get that, because.

Ashley's done the pellets.

I have done the pellets. Now. I did it. This is interesting. When I was in my 30s, and I did it for the energy, because we got all this. We went to a DO A doctor of osteopath, which. Do you know what I'm talking about? Sometimes do the more wide spectrum Tests. That's who discovered Dave's Hashimoto's. His thyroid disorder. But when we were doing all that with your thyroid, she was like, well, what about you? Let me do your labs. And I had some things that were off. And so I did the pellet, but only with testosterone. Now, in your case, they probably would. Well, you said you don't need estrogen quite often.

No, I don't yet. So we'll go for a while until that. Yeah. So it's just the testosterone.

So just the testosterone. Let me tell you, I felt great. I mean, I can't even think of any bad side effects for me personally.

And I will say that I really enjoyed it.

I second that. Yeah, it was great.

He was chasing me around.

Well, the testosterone cream is like, yes, amazing. So I'm just saying, it's like, I'm in my 20s again.

No. Dave was like, please never get off this.

Please don't stop.

That's how I felt.

This is amazing. He would even joke and be like, I'm not a piece of meat, but I like being a piece of meat.

Right. You know, I have feelings, too. I'm not just for sex.

Well, I didn't notice it so much until it stopped working. And it was like all of a sudden, the flood came back, went, oh, yeah. Oh, I remember this.

Yes. Yes. Well, because you get up in your. You just get busy with life, you know, move. Our kids had finally gotten all out of the house, and, you know, and so now it's just a lot more free, too. So you'll. You'll experience that someday.

I know, I know.

You guys, I'm telling you.

No, I'm gonna be naked all the time.

He's so excited.

Seriously, it's the best.

It's not overrated.

We love our kids and we love our grandbabies, but I'm telling you, it's so freeing. Yes.

One of my best friends, they're also in their early 50s, just now became empty nesters. And she said that. She said, ashley, it's even better than I anticipated. And she's like. And I love for my college students to visit, but I'm like, can you not on this day? And they now know. She's like, they know that we're having our naked time. And it's like, you know, we're enjoying our empty nester time, so don't come home yet. Okay.

There's this welcome ad on Amazon that I'm gonna get, and it says. It says, knock first. We're probably naked.

Yeah, I know. You're probably gonna get that as soon.

As the last one is out.

We used to have code words. I don't know if you guys have that. Code words. And if a candle. Usually that was the kid that was Yankee Candle before Yankee candle was popular. But we had a code word and ours was, would you like to go do laundry? Because no child ever wants to fold laundry. Wants to fold laundry. So they never followed us into our bedroom.

That's right. They hate laundry.

They hate it.

That's brilliant.

So you want to clean the bathroom?

Yes.

I mean, just use something like that. Kids will go the opposite direction.

Yeah, I'd love it. I've been wanting to clean the bathroom all day.

They're like, I'm not doing this. We always just say we're getting ready. And so. But that's way more creative. We need to take a. Yeah, we're.

Gonna go fold some laundry. Yeah, they'll avoid it because they still.

We're folding laundry. Give us a minute.

Are you guys done folding laundry?

Can't find the socks.

Taking you a while in there?

No, I love it.

These are all such great tips.

These are great, great tips. And listen, we want people to be able to connect with you as well. Because, you know, like I said at the start, you're part of this team. You're one of our mediators. And if folks are dealing with things in their marriage, menopause related or not, I mean, you guys are qualified to help people. Any issues, like want to make sure you give you an opportunity to tell folks where they can find you if they're interested in that.

Well, absolutely. So obviously you can go to XO the website and if you need help, you can hit marriage request form and do it that way. Or Kenny and I each have our own email address here at exomarriage. So just our first name. Heidi. Or kennyxomarriage.com Perfect. Yeah. Yes.

I love it. And you guys are just a wealth of knowledge. And you're so, you know, you really are so relatable and personable and you're just.

Thank you.

I mean, and you're fun. Like, those of you who know the curling iron story, if you don't know, look it up on YouTube. You all sent the best response to that. They did a picture acting like you're reenacting the crown. It's really.

It's one of my favorite.

In your own way, of course.

You guys are just so fun.

I mean, that's.

That.

That was my favorite day. I was. That was like my favorite message.

It was hilarious.

And she's doing this.

It's the best. It is.

Oh, my gosh.

But. But definitely look them up. Heidi and Kenny. They're awesome.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

And we're praying for you guys, you know, through the season and beyond, and we come with the prayers for all that you do.

Oh, thank you so much. It's our pleasure.

Well, and thank you guys for watching. We love and appreciate all of you. Do us a favor, share this episode, because I promise you, there is somebody, even if you're not yet there, there are people in your life who are in this season, and they need this encouragement. So share this. It'll mean a lot, and we'll see you guys next time.