My Spouse is Lazy | Dave and Ashley Willis

Welcome to the Naked Marriage podcast. We're your Dave and Ashley Willis. And on this podcast, we address the truth about sex, intimacy and lifelong love. And part of that lifelong love aspect of the podcast, we're in a series called Opposites in Marriage. How do we love each other for life when we're opposite? In some areas. And in the past, the past week, we talked about introverts versus extroverts, and that was a good episode. Check that one out if you missed it. And today we're going to talk about another important dynamic that impacts almost every marriage in one way or another.

That's right. We're talking about when one spouse is a high achiever or super driven and the other is just more laid back. They're just not, you know, they're more easygoing about life and don't necessarily consider themselves to be goal oriented. That can be a big, you know, a big struggle when you're that kind of opposite pairing. And before we dive in, I want to tell you guys about something that you may or may not have heard of, and that's our premium subscription. We want you to have the kind of podcast episode that you want. And if you love listening to this podcast but you don't like the ads, then you may want to sign up for our premium subscription. All you have to do is go to nakedmarriage.super cast.com and you just sign up there. You pay $5 a month and you get ad free episodes as well as additional bonus content that you will never hear on the Naked Marriage podcast. As it is, you have to be a premium subscriber to hear that. And so if that's something that interests you, sign up today. Now let's dive into today's episode. All right, I'm exc to continue in the four part series where we're talking about opposites in marriage. And today it's the second part of the series talking about when one of you is a high achiever and the other is not so much a high achiever and you're just more easygoing and not worrying about achieving anything really particular in life. And this can be a hard dynamic because those of us out there that are high achievers or maybe what some refer to as overachievers, you know, we have a plan, right? We have a plan. We have goals, probably have had a plan and goals most of our life. And you know what you'll find is a lot of times like we're talking about this entire series. Opposites many times attract in marriage because we Sometimes as a high achiever, will go for someone who's maybe not as driven as us because they don't feel like a threat. And so we can have someone, you know, honestly, we're kind of maybe seeking someone who's not so much, you know, gonna maybe threaten us, but also who can maybe support us. I mean, that's what you'll see a lot is you're like, I wanna find somebody who's more easygoing, who can really cheer me on. You know, that's what you see in a lot of these dynamics. Not always, but I think there can be a rub that happen. And we're kind of on down the line in years of marriage and maybe we're falling on maybe some times where there's financial pressure or just different changes in life that we're experiencing. That thing that you found attractive and that you really loved about that person becomes something that you don't like because you're like, why can't you work harder and achieve more for the sake of this family or whatever? And the easygoing person might be like, why do you have to be so obsessed with your work? Or why do you have to be so obsessed with these goals? Why can't we just live and enjoy life? And so again, neither one is wrong here.

No, neither one is wrong. It's like, it's how it's celebrating how each of us are made, but then also be willing to serve the other one. And there's so many stories about this. You know, one, I heard a story about an executive at a huge company making tons of money at the top of his career. But he had promised his wife, who was more easygoing and like, she's like, I'm gonna support you through this busy career. But the kind of the trade off is you're gonna retire young, so you've got plenty of money to do it, and we're gonna have our time to just enjoy life and to slow down and enjoy family. But he was so hard driving that he kept extending that like, no, I need to do this, I still wanna achieve this, I need to do this. And finally got to a point where she just asked him point blank, like, when is it gonna be our time? I feel like it's always been your time and I've supported that, but when's it going to be our time? And that was kind of the wake up call for him. And he went into the office and at the very top of his career, he chose to step down. And I heard him share about this at kind of A conference, talking about these sorts of things and how learning to slow down and really embrace that time together and embrace his wife's rhythm, which he realized was not a weakness at all, but a strength. Because where he had been driven and achieved a lot and that was good, her being more, I guess, you know, laid back in some way really had made her more relational. And all of the strong relationships in their family were a result of her being. And so that was a strength that he leaned into the relational aspect of things, which is really the most important part of life. Another example, I think about some friends who again, and the woman can be the hard driving one and the man can be laid back. But in this particular example, again, it was the man who was kind of really driven and the wife was much more laid back and just more relational, I guess. And this guy was thriving in his career, doing really well, but just constantly grabbing the next thing, the next thing. And in the midst of that, he actually had an affair. And when all that kind of came crashing down and they were in counseling for all that, trying to heal and rebuild trust, she for the first time talked about this hard driving, ambitious, achieving nature in him, which originally had been part of what attracted her to him. She liked that about him. But now she said, I find myself afraid of that part of him because I think that that ambition is what led him away from us in the first place and caused him to stray in the first place. And this became a conquest. And. And it was really a wake up call for him that he had lost sight of what mattered most. And so God puts in us the tendency, the drive to be an achiever or the tendency to be more laid back and relational. And all of that's important. And it's all part of the balance of just how God makes us. But every personality type can have potential weaknesses if you take it too far. And the driven person can become obsessed with achievement to the point of sabotaging relationships or even their own health. The laid back person can take that to an extreme and become completely detached from work and achievement and end up becoming very lazy to the point where it can cause. It can harm their health and it can cause resentment to a spouse that feels like the other one's doing all the work. And so people write and say, how do we deal with this? Specifically in the marriage where one. I think when most people write us in this scenario, it's when one person feels like, I'm doing all the work, yes, I'm doing all the work. And this is the deal Like, I do the work outside the home and then I come and do the work inside the home and my spouse is just dead weight and I'm just, just paying the bills and they're just milking it, you know, on the phone, watching tv, doing whatever they're doing, and I'm having to be the only adult in the relationship and it causes so much resentment. And the other spouse says, well, I just feel unloved and like nothing I do is appreciated. And so, sweetie, what do we do with that dynamic?

It's so hard. You know, you were talking about two stories where the man was the higher achiever. I know many where the woman, like, you know, a lot of times we will hear from women that have full time jobs outside the home and then they're also doing all the work inside the home.

Yeah, you got to still be the housekeeper, the childcare, the cook.

Exactly. And they feel like they're burning at both ends. And they, they loved their husband's laid back nature in the beginning, but I think they thought, well, once children come, that's when he can kick in more and we can be more partners and things like that. And what they found though, is that, you know, sometimes he's not like, he's not getting it. And here's a scenario I see a lot of times, especially with women who are high achievers, is they will, they won't necessarily give their husband a chance to step up, to do those things that she really does want him to do in the home and even outside the home. And so like, for example, you know, like, there's one couple I know where the woman goes and works all day. She comes home, you know, she's the one that's getting the kids. She comes home, and before he can even make dinner, she's already starting dinner. And before he can even help the kids with their homework, she's doing it. And then she lashes out at him and is like, well, you didn't even do this or you didn't even do that. And he's like, wait a minute, I'm just wrapping my mind around this schedule. You didn't give me a chance, you know what I'm saying? And she's like, well, you didn't want a chance. You know what I'm saying? It's like, you're just lazy. And so then there's just this narrative and we tend to fall into what we think, you know, our spouse expects of us and what others expect of us. And so that, you know, I just know couples where that's the dynamic. And they're just kind of running around in circles. And I've known some divorce over this because they just get to the point where the overachiever convinces themselves, well, I can do it all on my own.

And I am already doing all on my own.

I'm already doing it. I'm just gonna go do it.

And we gotta be so patient with each other. I recently saw a T shirt that's kind of related to this and it's so was so funny to me. And it was a guy wearing a shirt with a tool on it. And it said, if I said I would fix it, I will fix it. You don't have to keep reminding me. Every six months. Every six months. And so I think the timeline is what kind of gets us frustrated. And the one that's more laid back is like, well, I'm going to do it, but you got to, you know, let me do it on my time. And the one that's maybe a little more driven is like, it's unrealistic. Your timeline is unrealistic.

Six months, Come on.

Like, we've got to get this done.

Yes.

And so just figuring out that pace that works for both of us because it's really a pace issue. I think a lot of times, like, the more driven person is just going to want to move through life at a more aggressive pace.

Right.

And the more laid back person is going to say, no, we got to stop and smell the roses. I mean, we're not really living when we're hard charging, we've got to slow down. And there's an ebb and flow in that where there's a season maybe for both.

Oh, yeah, definitely.

And a time for both. But some of us are just prone to always move slowly and some of us are prone to always go quickly. And when we're married to our opposite in that way, figuring out that rhythm, learning to slow down for the fast one, learning to speed up for the slower one, and being patient for each other and supportive of each other as we go. That's really the, that's really the crux of this whole issue.

It is. And really, especially when it comes to this kind of opposite pairing, we can really help each other to be more balanced. You know, in this one especially, I feel like the higher driving person can really help to kind of put a fire under that person who is more laid back. Because, you know, I've seen sometimes this dynamic where especially you're talking about retirement where there's this high achieving person and then they do get it to a point where one can maybe retire or slow down a little bit. And then that laid back person is given a chance to make, maybe go after their dream. And sometimes they've gotten so used to being more laid back and just going with the flow that they're like, it's okay, I don't need to do it. But that higher achieving person is like, no, now's the time to go to school, now's the time to go out for that job because we're both supporting each other. You can do it. And so they can kind of teach them something in that way. But on the flip side of this, I feel like the laid back person can help encourage that high driving person and say, listen, you're missing out on what life is really about if it's only about a goal. Like, you know, those, those numbers can't love you back. Like that chart, that gold star on the chart, that trophy you're getting from work, even that high salary can't love you back. And you can't get the time back with your spouse or your children. So you don't wanna miss out on the relationships that mean the most to you in your life. And so it's good to have that reminder that we need both. We need to. And the Bible talks about this. We need to work hard to provide for our families and to live in this world and to also use the gifts that God's given us. But we also, we need to really show that we trust God to meet our needs even when we're not toiling away. You know, there's a lot of verses about that and about rest and about rest, right? Because rest. And I heard, I heard an awesome. I was reading a book actually about, it was actually about the creation. It was talking all about Genesis. And I remember this part, it was talking about God resting and how, you know, on the last day and all that. And how after creating and how rest is really, you know, for us as his creation, it's really a form of worship because it's showing God that we believe that he can take care of us. Even when we're resting, even when we're not doing a thing. He's loving us, he's taking care of us. And I think for those of us who are wired to be more driven, we really struggle with that. Yeah, really struggle with that.

You know, like it's a survival thing. I think about my great grandfather who was one of the hardest working people I ever knew. I mean, I was just still a child when he died. But you know, he and his wife raised nine children. They had a farm. They had to grow their own food. And working on a farm, especially back in those days, starting even like in the Great Depression era, you just had to work every day to have food. Right. And in his early years, he wasn't a Christian and he worked seven days a week. And when he became a Christian and understood what the Bible had said about rest and specifically a Sabbath, that God had said one day a week, don't do any work. Trust me with that day, rest, recharge, worship, reconnect with family, that was a huge act of faith for a guy that was used to having to work nonstop as a survival thing to trust God when there was work to be done and say, there's always more work to be done, but Lord, I'm going to trust you and I'm going to give you that day because you tell me to. But how he found that as he trusted God with that day of rest, that everything continued to prosper in some ways even more so. And he was at more peace and reminded that God's the one who's really in control. And so we still need to work hard and God blesses those efforts. But I think that there are scriptures in the Bible about work, and they're there to challenge those of us who are more laid back and would prefer not to work, really. And then there are a lot of scriptures about rest because there are those of us who are so driven that we're prone to work all the time and even find our identity in work. And rest is what we need to be reminded of to trust God and realize that our identity isn't found in this work. We're not impressing God or earning gold stars with him by just outworking everybody. And we need to embrace rest. So for all of us, there are scriptures in whatever we're facing to kind of help challenge us in whatever area that we're out of balance.

Exactly. And I think sometimes people are extremely driven and career oriented and really just trying to make the money because they've experienced poverty.

Yeah, they never want to go back.

And we've known people like that where when you've really experienced true poverty, you just never want not only for yourself to experience that, but your kids and your wife and your husband. Like you don't want, you don't want anyone else, especially those that you love, to ever feel that way. And like in people that we've, that we've walked through life with very closely, that you could just see that's why they are the way they are. Because they're like, I just never, ever want that to be me again. And I've heard them say words like that. Some of our earliest friends as a married couple, that was their story. They both grew up in extreme poverty. And especially for the times they had both just barely had anything. I mean, barely made it day to day with food. And both of them were extremely driven. And I remember there was a discussion for them when they started having children. The wife really wanted to stay at home, but I remember he just said, I am so sorry. I can't even take that risk. I mean, I get the beauty of making that choice, but I just can't risk us ever having any, like, even a hint of not having enough. Do you remember that?

Yeah.

And it really, it wounded her. It wounded her, but she did not. She really had that calling on her. Like she felt called to stay home, but she did work. I mean, cause she wanted to honor, you know, what her husband was asking her to do. And she was glad. She's a hard worker.

Oh, very hard worker. Yeah.

You know, any stay at home mom will tell you we, it's hard work. I mean, my goodness. But you know, she wanted to get a paycheck because she didn't want her husband to worry. And she herself had grown up in poverty. And so they really had to, they really had to work through that. And it was a hard. It was a hard thing for them. And so I just think, think about that, like, am I trusting God or am I, like, am I kind of. And when I'm talking about, you know, the overachiever achiever being driven, this is like, if it's to maybe an extreme where you're not willing to bend a little bit because of the fear of poverty, I would just, you know, talk through that with your spouse and say, you know, this fear's making me spend less time with the family. And it really comes from this place of my childhood where we didn't have enough. And I just don't want that to be us. But I want to trust God more. I want to trust that he is our ultimate provider.

Yeah, that's so good. And so hopefully in this conversation between you and your spouse, just talk about what are those areas where you feel like things have maybe gotten out of balance in either of you or in your lives as a couple? And then maybe what's the root of that? Like, are you so driven because of those same reasons? Like, I'm just so afraid that we're going to end up poor like I grew up and. And I just want to work around the clock to make sure that never happens. And for those hard driven people to say that that work is admirable. But realize your family can do with less of almost anything if it means having more of you. It's good to be a provider, but you also have to provide yourself.

Sure.

And if all that provision is happening in your absence, then that's out of balance. And for the spouse that maybe is so laid back that they're not really achieving anything and maybe to really take a hard look and say, is there more that I could be doing to support my spouse and support this family?

And to use the gifts that God's given you.

And use the gifts God's given you. Yeah. Because he's wired you up to do things and to serve and to make an impact. And that could potentially mean to make income. But even if it's not a vocation to serve and work inside the home and outside the home and to talk with one another about what that looks like, how you can best support each other and, and celebrate each other's God given wiring without trying to change each other in the process. And this is part of the lifelong adventure of marriage. And you just gotta keep having these conversations with a lot of patience and love. And I hope this sparks some good ones in your marriage. So, guys, thanks so much for tuning in. Join us next Monday as we continue on in this series about opposites in marriage. And don't forget to tune in Wednesday as we answer one of your questions on a special Hump Day Q and A episode. We'll see you then.