Steps to Building a Healthy In-Law Relationship | The Naked Marriage Podcast | Dave & Ashley Willis

Welcome to the Naked Marriage Podcast. We're Dave and Ashley Willis. On this podcast, we address the truth about sex, intimacy and lifelong love. And today, we're continuing our conversations about In Law relationships, inspired by our brand new book called Married into the Family the Not so Secret Guide to In Law Relationships, which you can now get wherever books are sold. I recommend the audiobook. I think that I just love it. We had so much fun recording that, and I really think this book could be a game changer in your marriage and in your family. And today we're going to talk about the delicate but important issue of how to rebuild relationships once they've been injured or possibly even broken.

That's right. And this is so important because we've talked about toxic kind of descriptions of unhealthy in laws, but we also need to talk about, well, how do we rebuild when we've lost trust or when we've gone wrong ourselves? And so we're going to talk all about that and we hope that you get a lot out of this episode. Let's dive in. All right. Well, you guys, I hope you're really getting a lot out of this In Law series. It's a great, you know, even writing this book was a great refresher for us. I think this is something where you never arrive.

Oh, sure.

Because there's new seasons that come. You know, something we haven't even talked about yet is sometimes, you know, as your parents are aging, even how that relationship changes as you begin to care for them. You know, there's a lot of different seasons of the in law dynamics that we have to address. And so on today's we're going to give you a bird's eye view of how to heal your in law relationship when maybe it's been fractured. And so we're really excited to talk about this because this is something we've lived through and continue to really make sure that we are, you know, fostering a relationship that is healthy. And so we wanna talk about, like, if you feel like you, you know, you listen to the five toxic traits in laws, you've, you know, you're totally agreeing with, you know, yes, this is a hard thing to navigate, but you're like, you know, Dave and Ashley, what do we do to make things better? And we wanna give you some practical tools to do that.

Yeah. First off, we just want you to know you're not alone.

Yes.

And you can get through this because we went through a time that Ashley just alluded to that things were so difficult with some of These relationships, that it was the toughest thing in our life by far. I mean, it was the dark cloud hanging over us at all times. And it felt hopeless. It felt like it's always going to be this way. There's always going to be this tension. We're never going to have peace and joy in these relationships, which we so desperately wanted. And I think honestly, they wanted to. We were just all coming at it from these different mindsets and we didn't know how to find that common ground. But we got there. Thank God, we got there. And now, I mean, I can honestly say, like, we every relative we have on both sides of the family, we genuinely enjoy not just love them, because love isn't a feeling, it's a commitment. We already had that, but enjoy them. We enjoy being together. And you can get there too. And that's a big reason why we wrote this book, Married into the Family. And that's what these episodes are all about. So it's hard to give kind of a one size fits all how to bring healing. Because every situation is different.

Right, right, right.

You know, and kind of the levels of woundedness are different. The healing, you know, just on your body, if you get a scratch on your hand, you know, you heal it with a band aid, whereas if your arm gets severed, you know, that's a different kind of healing. Right. There's different levels. Right. We know that physically, but relationally it's the same. Like if there's just been some minor wounds that have happened, that's one thing. But what do you do in those situations where there have been some deeply hurtful things said or done, some big breaches of trust, where maybe you had to put boundaries in place or even kind of separate from that person completely for a time just to create some healing. And then how do you navigate a road back to having a relationship with them and where do you start? And there's so many different kinds. You know, I think about my own grandmother Ruth, my grammy, who just passed away a year ago. She was almost 90. We love and miss Grammy, but her mother in law, my great grandmother, who's a woman that I also knew and loved. Their relationship was really tense. And the reason why is because my grandmother Ruth was the first one to marry into that family. She married my great grandmother's oldest son. So she was the first daughter in law. My great grandmother came from a very rigid background in terms of her religious conviction. She didn't believe women should wear makeup. She, you know, just believed in like long dresses, no makeup, like she had a bunch of rules, just a bunch of rules for everything. And Grammy, you know, she came from a family culture where, you know, they, she loved the Lord, but she came from a Methodist family where it's, it's like, you know, she wore just normal, she wore makeup and was a cheerleader and, you know, you know, dressed fashionably and all these things.

A beautiful woman.

A beautiful woman, yes. And my great grandmother from the beginning really made her feel like just a hussy, to use one of the old, the old words that they would use, you know, like it's cheap and tacky and made her not only feel not welcomed, but really, you know, rejected just because of, you know, her being who she was. And Grammy had such a wonderful heart and pure faith and all these things, but she entered into this family culture where her mother in law instantly, you know, made her feel unwelcome. And we talked about some of those, some of those things last time and again. My great grandmother was coming from a place of her own convictions, but she let her convictions turn into judgmentalism, which is never okay. And it created tensions kind of throughout, really throughout their life. And I think in later years there was some reconciliation there. But I just kind of throw that story out because I saw the pain that, that caused my grandmother even, even as an older woman, you know, even after my great grandmother had passed away, there was still woundedness that came from feeling rejected, from feeling like I never was really accepted into the family. And so when we can make it our mission to make sure that, you know, we're not dying with these things undone, right? We're not going to die and leave a legacy of any kind of brokenness or our own misguided convictions or pride, allowing there to be woundedness that's not resolved. We've got to go first sometimes to be the one to say, listen, I'm sorry.

Right?

And that's the first step in healing any relationship, I think, is often just doing the self assessment and saying, what is it that I've done here to contribute to this and how can I apologize for it? Like, I'm sorry for the attitudes that I've had. I'm sorry that I did this or that. And I just want you to know, like, I love you, I respect you. I know we're different people, we have different convictions. But I want you to know I love and respect you and feel a deep sense of loyalty to you as part of this family. And we need to make sure that we're saying those things we do and.

More and saying it is important. But I also think we have to follow it up with actions because I think a lot of times why we have a fractured in law relationship is usually because trust has been broken. Like we feel like they're going to go talk about us behind our back. Just like with Grammy's mother in law, she felt like this woman's going around talking about me to her friends and people in town. And it's just, even if you don't know those people, it's just hurtful to know you're being talked about in a negative way. And so yes, we need to go and say those things. But also being willing to be with each other. And I know this can be awkward when the trust has been broken. And I think it's important though to really bring yourself out of the comfort zone and to try to be that olive branch that is saying, like, let's give each other a chance. Like, you married someone I love and so I know they love you and I'm gonna do my best to show you love, even if my feelings aren't there quite yet. Cause you said love is a commitment. And so we have to overcome our negative feelings by moving in those actions. And this is like I remember years ago and I've mentioned this before, but in this context I'll talk about it again. In my counseling when I was going through my anxiety and depression, I would always talk about like, well, I feel this, or I thought this. And she'd say like, listen, your thoughts are important and God can renew your mind and replace those negative thoughts and assumptions with his trut. But before you get there, take the actions you know are the right actions to do. And they will be like train tracks for your mind because your actions are going to lay those train tracks and then your mind will follow. And gosh, that's just really stuck with me. And I just thought, and there's neuroscience behind this, you know, like literally those automatic thoughts you have are making like a, like a trail in your brain. And for you to chart a new path about how you think about your, your in law who hurt you, I mean, you might have every right to, to not trust them. I'm not saying like automatically trust them, but you can give a new thought to say, like, I'm going to give them a chance. I'm gonna be smart because trust has to be earned by consistent actions. But I'm gonna put out that olive branch. I'm gonna forgive them, okay, and allow them to re earn my trust. But I'm not Gonna let these thoughts get the best of me because, you know, we have to take those actions to go to that person and spend time with them, like, give them a chance. And sometimes, you know, it's really awkward at first. Like, I'm gonna own that. It can be the most awkward experience where you' people raise my spouse right.

Out of my spouse. Come from this crazy.

Not my favorite. Yeah, like they're crazy. They're not fun. And you can start having those thoughts again. But you can, you can reckon with yourself and say, God help me, I love my spouse. They raised this person that I love. I'm gonna give them a chance and.

I'm gonna honor them because one God tells me to do it right. Honor your father and mother. And that applies also to your spouse's father and mother. Honor doesn't mean you agree with everything they do.

You might never agree with everything they do.

You might never agree, but you can still give them honor and respect. You do those things. Just be courteous, be respectful, see the best in them.

And on the flip side, you can do that as parents honoring your daughter or son's spouse, you can do the same thing.

Yeah, like this is someone God's brought into our family. Just like God brought your own biological children or adopted children into your family, and you accept them and love them wholeheartedly and completely, despite their flaws because they're part of your family. We have to see those who marry into our family in the same way that they're of part. Part of this family. And yeah, there are parts of them that, you know, that I might disagree with things that they do wrong, but I still love them no matter what because they are part of this family. And they need to know that I have that sense of loyalty and commitment to them and that I love them no matter what. And then for all of us, whether we're talking about the in laws ahead of us or, you know, the kids generation in laws, I think for all of them, we need to have the compassion of realizing that all the things in that person that. That really annoy us or that offend us to try to believe the best and say they're not actively trying to hate me. That all of those things in them that are broken, it comes from a place of brokenness in them.

Exactly.

It comes from a place of woundedness in them. And all of us are broken and wounded at different levels. And all of us have some blind spots and some things that God's still refining in us. None of us have arrived. And so I think we have more compassion for people in their rudeness or in their ignorance or in whatever it might be when we realize, okay, that's not fully who they are. That's an area of brokenness in them that God's still working on. And I still have those areas in me. And I want to have grace and compassion in those areas instead of just labeling them and defining them like, oh, this person is just who they are. In their lowest moment, they're just a jerk, or they're just this or that. And thank God that the Lord doesn't do that for us. He sees us at our worst and still loves us and redeems us and gave his life for us. And we need to treat people not how people treat us, but treat people how God treats us. And God treats us with grace, forgiveness and mercy, even on the days when we're unlovable.

It's so true. And I just want to clarify here too, that we're not telling you to go take a tongue lashing, to go take a beating, so to say, from your in laws, like, just take it. Like, we're not saying that you have to put boundaries in, in place because, you know, you're not meant to be a doormat. We talked about that. Be a peacemaker, but not a doormat. And how we're not doormats is we still put out the olive branch saying like, you know, under these circumstances, which are boundaries, these boundaries, I'm still here when you want to talk. I'm still here, you know, when we can, we can, you know, get on a kind of, get on the same page, so to speak, where we can, we can say, you know, offer forgiveness, say we're sorry, say things that need to be said in a healthy way, maybe even go to a family counselor. I mean, sometimes it gets so dark, sweetie, that you have to go to a family counselor. Like, I had a dear friend of mine share a story with me that things got really rough with some of her in laws and they were like, we literally don't know what else to do. And I think through their church, they found out about a mediation, a mediation place. This is different than our mediators here who work specifically with married couples. But this was a mediation facility that worked specifically with families and they were Christian based and they met with his family. And everybody basically wrote down first, and I love this, they wrote down first what they thought was the problem. And then the mediator said, okay, now go back and rewrite it, because this is, you know, it's probably not in a Nice fashion, because they're just getting out all those nasty feelings. And he's like, I want you to rewrite this in a way that can be received. Okay? Get down to the brass tacks of what the real issue is here in a loving way. And they all, basically, they all had to sit in a circle and they each read their piece. Like, what. What it is, how they feel about this situation. And then the family came together and they said, okay, you know, they listened to what the mediator had to say, and they said, now, let's write down some ground rules for our family. Let's write down ground rules that we can all agree to and say, like, this is how this is. This is how we're going to proceed as a family. If we have a problem, we're not going to do xyz, but we are going to do xyz. Like, this is how we're going to approach that problem. Like, we're not going to have a family text where we don't include this person and just, you know, talk how nasty they are. We're not going to go and Pl this on Facebook and say, like, look at my terrible in law or whatever. And I just thought that was so brilliant because I think that we need more things like that. And I remember my friend telling me this whole story. And she said for the first time in years, we felt like, okay, we have a game plan. And everyone agreed to it. And she said over the years, it was like a decade ago. She said, over the years, we've had to bring that out when things get real tense again. She said we would, in our family text, we'd say, let's go back and look at, you know, part one point A. We're doing this right now. Let's not get into this territory again. We need to do this instead. And I just love that because. And it may sound cheesy to some of you watching and listening, but you guys, sometimes it can get so rough that we need a contract like that. Like, because they all signed it, they.

Agreed to it, we need to know, like, I mean, if you guys are sports fans, imagine trying to watch a football game or a basketball game if there weren't any boundary lines, right? And if. If everybody involved was playing by their own set of rules instead of one standard set of rules. The only reason why sports make sense at all and have any structure is everybody on the field is playing by the same set of rules. We've agreed on where the boundary lines are. We've agreed on what it means to score. We've agreed on, like, what the roles of each player are and what penalties are. And if you don't have that, then it's just absolute chaos. And it's the same thing in some ways in family relationships. If there's no clear boundaries, if there's no set of ground rules that people are agreeing on, then it's just chaos. We're all playing a different game. And of course, everybody's going to feel like they're losing. And maybe that would help you. We have mediators here at Exomarriage that can help you and your spouse certainly work through things. And then there are family counselors and other mediators that can help you as a group do kind of what Ashley described of sit down and really work through things. And I know it sounds awkward, and if you already have a tense relationship, trying to, like, sit in a circle and work things out just sounds like torture or exhausting. Exhausting. Yeah. But it doesn't have to be. It doesn't mean it's going to be easy. I don't want to sugarcoat it, but it's going to help you move past these areas where you're stuck. You don't have to stay stuck is the thing. And if you're willing, sometimes just getting to the other side of your comfort zone and doing something that feels a little uncomfortable now might be the very thing to help you get to a permanent place of health.

This is so true. And I would say, too, there are circumstances where this is what you want. Like, you're listening to this, you're watching this and thinking, oh, my gosh, if only my family would come and do something like this with us, that would just solve it all. That would be like, the end all, be all. And we'd finally, like, have the kind of relationship I want to have. But I know and have from experience, I know that sometimes you're just going to have family members that will never do that with you.

It's true.

They will not.

They have maybe say no.

They'll say, no, we don't need that. Maybe they think they don't need it. Maybe there's a stigma attached to going to a mediator, counselor or mediator or counselor. I mean, whatever the case may be, be. Maybe they just never agree to go. And that's their choice. They have that choice. That doesn't mean that you can't do this even with your spouse, because you guys can come together and collectively set, like, what are your boundaries? What are those ground rules that you want to abide by. And you guys can cling to that and you guys can make sure that as far as it depends on you, you are living at peace with them. And living at peace with them requires setting those boundaries. But it means, like, you're not speaking harshly to them like that. Instead of allowing a phone conversation or maybe a conversation in person to get to the point of people cussing at each other or like yelling at each other that you say, what? Listen, we're gonna come back together. Like, we are going to go ahead and leave because we don't want to say something that we would regret. And we certainly don't want to hear something from you that we know is going to really be hurtful and you're going to regret. And so let's come back to this. Like it take. And we can do that. Like, that's one of the things we can do to make sure that we can maintain peace. But it takes us doing that together. And so there's a lot of different ways to achieve kind of more peace in your in law relationships, but it's going to take first. The first step is you and your spouse coming together, praying about this. Make sure that God is the foundation. Because, you know, we were talking about sports. The referee is God. Okay. Like we come back to the Bible and what God has to say, right? He's the ultimate referee. Right. He's the playbook. And so, but if you have other teammates, so to speak, but they don't want to play that game, right? They're like, they don't want God in the. As the referee. They don't want the word as your playbook. That's where it gets complicated. But that doesn't mean that you and your spouse still can't go by that playbook and still can't make sure that your foundation is the Bible and that you're. You're trying to have peace as far as it depends on you.

Yes. And I love that verse Ashley referenced. As far as it depends on you live at peace. Sometimes again, you're gonna do all you can and they're still not gonna live at peace with you.

Exactly.

But if you will, you will stay, stand on God's word and say, we're gonna do everything in our power to live at peace. We're gonna be honoring, we're gonna be respectful. We're gonna treat others the way we want to be treated. We're gonna, we're gonna do things God's. It will usually, even if that other person is being rude and rebellious and unhealthy just by you consistently making the healthy choice. It will create more peace most of the time and oftentimes it will be the difference maker and eventually them coming around. But even if they don't again that's not on you. All you can do is your part. I think that verse is Romans chapter 12 verse 10. But I encourage you for homework to read Romans chapter 12. It's just one short chapter in the Bible. You could read the whole thing in five minutes and it is a roadmap for how to live healthy in relationships and in all parts of life. It's just an amazing chapter of Scripture for practical living and that would be such an encouragement to you. So check that out Romans chapter 12 and check out our new book Married into the the not so Secret Guide to In Law Relations Relationships. I think it's going to make a real difference for you. Thanks so much for tuning in guys. We'll see you next time.