Timeless Wisdom - Life, Love & Marriage

November is National Family Caregivers Month. 1 in 4 Americans is stepping up to help older loved ones with everything from meals to bills. Family caregivers spend thousands out of their own pockets each year, and too many have to quit their jobs to keep providing care. Working families can't afford to wait. It's time to care for America's caregivers. Learn more at aarp.org/careforcaregivers. Paid for by AARP. Welcome to Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager. Hear thousands of hours of Dennis's lectures, courses, and classic radio programs. And to purchase Dennis Prager's Rational Bibles, go to DennisPrager.com. Professor Tom is going to sit in for me when I'm off because he's odd enough to do so. He has enough practice. Yes, exactly, there you go. Well, I'm very delighted you're here. I really am. This exact— I shouldn't even say this because it'll get out, but I'll say it because, you know, I say everything I think. I am— this excites me as much as, you know, I want people to get married, so I'm happy about the single seminars, but this excites me more because I'm a big fan of couples. And of trying to help couples in their marriages and in their lives. And I have so much to tell you that I'm gonna actually get right into it, 'cause I really wanna get your feedback. I really do, actually. I'm gonna learn a lot from you too. Let me just tell you at the outset, I don't have any better answers than you do, okay? All I have are good insights, but answers you have to supply in your lives, in your way, in the unique chemistry that you and your spouse have, or partner if you're boyfriend and girlfriend, have come here. I don't think everybody's married here. And you don't have to raise your hand. If there are any threesomes, however, I would like to meet you afterwards. I am curious. I'll learn a lot from you that I don't know about. But I, you know, it's very— when I left the house this morning, so my wife was laughing, which she often does, sometimes with me and sometimes at me, and she was just— because we have, you know, laughing about the fact that here I am going to come to hundreds of couples and offer hopefully some wisdom when we have the same problems every other marriage does. You know, that's why she was laughing, and I'm laughing too. So I want you to know this does not come from someone who comes home every day to the Garden of Eden. I have a normal, good marriage, okay, with the emphasis on both good and normal. And normal means sometimes it isn't good. By the way, as soon as you know that, your marriage gets better. Half of coping with what goes on in marriage is to know that the tough times are normal times. I'm sure there are couples who have never argued, for example. But to my— that's right. Or no, what did my wife say today? She said she had a— she said we do— we never argue. She said we have intellectual disagreements, or something to that effect. It's not true, we argue. But she was just making light of this issue. But— excuse me, because I'm still getting over— Propax is great, but I still am getting over something. I want to make that clear. Gotta keep my credibility. You don't know, every time I sneeze I think, "Ah, I've lost credibility. People aren't going to get Propax." It's very difficult. Anyway, So please understand, that's the reason— you see, if I had a marriage that I thought never had any issues, I couldn't well talk to you, because I'd be coming from another planet, as it were. Or if I were only married a year and, you know, we still looked into each other's eyes and fell apart while doing so, and, you know, couldn't stop groping each other, which— I mean, I still can't stop groping her, but that's a separate issue, but I'm male, but that's so— That I'll talk about, as you can expect, in part of it too. But in any event, the, uh— I come from a normal marriage, a good marriage, and I've also been divorced, as you probably know, since everything about me is known, to my wife's everlasting regret. She said, "Is there anything you don't tell on the radio?" And it was hard for me to answer that question, 'cause I couldn't come up with something I hadn't said at some point on the radio. But in case you didn't know, I was, I've been, I was married for 5 and a half years in my early 30s. I married first at 32, and then we divorced, separated and divorced 5 and a half years later, and I remarried exactly 2 years later, and now married for, let's see, '88, so 15 years, 17 years together, almost 15 years married. So I have— I've really run the gamut. I had a fairly long singles life. I had a divorce. I mean, I've— so this comes from real life. By the way, it doesn't mean that there are people who haven't experienced this who don't have wisdom. I have never felt that, for example, Catholic priests could not come up with good ideas about marriage just because they were celibate. In fact, it's Catholic priests who came up with marriage— what is it called? Encounter. One of the great programs in the world, which all religions and non-religions have adopted. So I can only say, in general, it helps to have gone through it, but it doesn't mean that if you went through it you're wise, and it doesn't mean that if you didn't, you're not. So those are some of the preambles. Now, if you're taking notes, it's not a bad idea, though I do want you to know I am recording this. Digitally. You know me and technology. And, uh, so, and, and it'll be available, uh, you know, basically this week if you're interested in having it. I want to give you some, uh, some thoughts about marriage here. And by the way, one thing, remember, I, I didn't start this couple's idea primarily in order to talk about marriage. That's what really was requested of me by the station as a result of talking to you who signed up. I really wanted more than anything is for you to meet each other. Because, and I really, I know that I sound like the proverbial broken record, couples need couples. Couples need couples terribly, and I'll explain why further in this talk. And I want you to have time here to, you know, mill about and meet one another. And obviously you can't meet every other couple here, though it wouldn't even hurt if perhaps there'd be a way that you could have some ongoing contact. You know, maybe by age range, because there usually couples tend to be friendly with those within a, I would say, a 10-year radius of their age. Is that a fair statement? Most couples are friends with couples who are somewhat, you know, in their stage of life. So maybe that would be a real helpful thing, because that's the real reason that I ever thought this up, was to— I have this mission to save humanity, so I want to help as many people as I can. And this is one of those ways, hopefully. Okay. This is no order of importance. This is simply how I listed these. Every one of these is important. And I'm sure, this I do believe, at least 2 of the following points will really help you. If they all do, we're all the richer for it. But I really believe at least 2 will. Okay, number 1: a marriage either gets better or it gets worse. That may sound simplistic, but it isn't, because a lot of couples think that you can just roll along in neutral. You can't. By the way, this is true for all of life, not just marriage. Either you get better at anything or you get worse at anything. Nothing can stay the same. Nothing. And it is so important to know this with regard to your marriage. It's very easy to coast along, and then you coast right into divorce. It is, it is an effort. You must work on making it better. That's why I believe in periodic checkups with marital counseling. You don't bring your car in after a crash. Then it's too late. It's crashed. Maybe it can be repaired after a crash, and I do believe that marriages can be repaired after a crash, like infidelity. I do believe that. But you prefer not to have a crash, or not to stall on the freeway. You prefer to have your car in tip-top shape. So you bring it in every certain thousand miles, correct? To have an oil and lube, and to have a checkup, and so on. And after 6,000 or 10,000 miles, a more serious checkup. You might want to consider that in your marriage, because as good as you feel it is going, since you are both complex human beings, infinitely complex, there may still be things— there probably are— that with a neutral third party, you would be more likely to open up. In somebody else's room, where the only task is to talk about yourselves, no fun No cell phones, no pagers, no business, no children, nothing. Just the two of you to talk about the two of you. Something may come out, just as at a checkup on your car or a checkup on your body. Why do you go if you're healthy to a doctor for a checkup? In case, you know, there is a little polyp on the colon, you want to get it before it becomes cancerous. To use a silly metaphor, in case there's a polyp in your marriage, you, you might want to go for a checkup. If you have a better way of doing the checkup with another couple, even yourselves retreating and talking about your marriage, fine. Whatever you do, you do. But you can't coast. It's extremely, extremely dangerous. And it's not romantic what I'm saying. Get romantic ideas out of your minds. If you want a good marriage, Romantic ideas— I don't mean romance, but romantic ideas, wishful thinking like Hollywood sets— are very injurious. You have to work on it. I never— I'll never forget a bachelor friend of mine when I was just, uh, early in my marriage, and I had a bachelor friend, and I told him, you know, you really have to work on your marriage. He said, well, that's crazy. I work all day, and then I'm going to come home and work again. This turned him totally off from getting married. You know, the point is to come home and not work. But the good Lord did not make life easy, and so you have to work at anything that you want to be good. Why should marriage be different? Now, if it's a constant struggle, that's a bad sign. Work and struggle are not the same, by the way. Work is work. I mean, I work very hard at my, at what I do, but I can't say that it's a struggle because I enjoy it, because it's meaningful to me, and so on. And anyway, you know the difference between work and struggle. So let me summarize point 1: either it gets better or it gets worse, it doesn't stay where it's at. And by the way, this is true, as I said, about one's entire emotional, psychological, and professional life. You can't coast in life. That's just a law of life. Anything gets better or it gets worse. Number 2: No human being in the world can fulfill all of what you want. No one. I'm not sure 7 different people can fulfill all of what we want, but certainly one cannot. And we invest a hope. There is— this is a romantic hope that we have when we marry or when we meet someone, when we fall in love. We have this romantic hope that somebody will in fact fulfill all of my needs. Or since we find it very hard to distinguish between needs and wants, all of our wants. It can't be. I learned early on my wife is just not that passionate about stereo systems. Just, that's the way it is. I'm giving you a trivial example, but would I really like my wife to be as excited as I am about preamplifiers? Yes, I would like it. But very early on in my marriage, I made peace with the fact that she doesn't. It took her longer to make peace with the fact that I don't like taking long walks. This is a very painful subject in my marriage, I just want to tell you. I don't even mind treadmills, but for some reason, taking a walk, unless there's a purpose to it, and sometimes what I did was I would take my camera And she said, "You know, you don't have to do something with a purpose. You can just walk and talk." Now, I don't mind sitting and talking. I don't mind lying and talking. I don't mind standing and talking. I don't like walking and talking. Now, I suspect that among the men here, I am not alone in that. I don't know. Now, I have a dear friend who loves taking walks with me. With his wife. I hate his guts. I do. He sickens me. But, uh, he really does. And whenever it comes up, I, you know, I want to punch him because I, I look like, you know, my wife got a raw deal. But somehow or other, she has more or less made peace with that fact. But let me tell you something. Now, here's an interesting thing. In fact, I'm going to mention this on the radio tomorrow. This is unbelievably embarrassing. I admit it. But, you know, I tell it all. By the way, the beauty of saying everything is you never have to wonder, "What did I say or not say?" That's one— you don't have— truth is utterly liberating, because you never have to wonder what story I told. But anyway, this is really painful to tell you, but I— last week, I learned to ride a bicycle. I mean, it's painful to think that until 54 years old, 4 and a half, I didn't know how to ride a bike. Now, part of the reason is I grew up in New York City, where all you learn is how to ride the subway. You don't learn how to ride a car. You don't learn how to ride— I mean, I learned to ride a car, but later than most, not at 16 like a Californian, because you— there's no— what, first of all, there's nowhere to bicycle to, and you'll get mugged on the way there anyway. So there was no real purpose in doing it. But still in all, now my wife has periodically mentioned, wouldn't it be nice if we went bike riding together? Now that instead of walking— that is exactly right, see? And she's— she was right about that. And I finally said, this is ridiculous. So I got on a bike last week, and lo and behold, it was not nearly as complex as I thought. And, uh, sure enough, um, I now ride a bike, and we're going to go bike riding together. So she'll meet one of her desires. Now, I want to tell you, since she's not here, though I would tell you even if she were, she has another long list beyond that. The long list is going to be one of the biggest deals that I'm going to talk about. We're going to get there. But in any event, please understand, nobody can meet all your wants. It's just not possible. Your wants change, your wants are idiosyncratic. You would have to marry you. Really, you would. You would have to marry a clone in order to have all of your wants met. But if you met a clone, clone, you would detest that person. The point is, you didn't marry a clone. You married, you married, for all intents and purpose, an extraterrestrial. Men are from Mars, women are from Venus. I have always disagreed with that because it implies they're from the same solar system. It's just not true. We are from different galaxies. Different universes. There may be, you know, parallel universes is the new theory. Men and women are so different, it is amazing. It is— the divorce rate is not amazing, the stay-together rate is amazing. Really, that's how I look at it. That's how different we are. And I will talk about that in a moment. But please understand, your spouse cannot meet all of your wants, so you have to figure out What is really important that he or she can meet? And what can I live with that won't be met? And that's the reason God created friends. So I have male friends who love stereo systems and go with me to the dealerships to hear the difference in frequency response of two different speakers. So I am perfectly fine with that fact. Or whatever it might be, that this is my desire, these are hers, we get together on other areas, and there's some not. Now, some have to be met. You have to figure out— now, it's best if you do this prior to marriage, obviously— but what are really your needs? And you'll find, by the way, that your needs is a much smaller list than you ever thought they were. There aren't that many needs that we really have. There is a huge list of wants, and it's an endless list, and I will come to that. But nobody can really meet all of what we want, and that is part of the reason that people who divorce easily divorce. Now remember, I don't believe everybody who divorces divorces easily, and I'm not speaking of my own. I felt this before I was divorced, and I have talked about this, and a lot of traditional people don't agree with me on this matter. I do believe that a bad marriage— I mean a truly bad marriage, not a marriage with problems, but a, what I would call a toxic marriage, where people are becoming worse human beings, embittered human beings, and after prolonged attempts at making it better, it is not right for those people to stay together. Interestingly, by the way, this is just a side thought, a friend of mine once made the observation that the people who were, and in general that he found, the couples who were most accepting of others' divorces tended to have the best marriages, and the people who were least tolerant of people divorcing tended to have not such good marriages. And he felt that there was often a psychological reason, therefore, for why some couples were particularly angry about others divorcing, because they were so angry in their staying together. Why should anybody get out of the prison that I'm in? Because misery loves company. So this is a very fascinating issue. Others have religious reasons, that's a separate matter. But in any event, that is something I do believe. That is why you need two types of friends. You need a same-sex friend. Women really need a girlfriend, because your girlfriend is going to talk to you about the stuff that your husband's eyes start rolling as if they're comatose. They go right up there. You watch their eyeballs, they're starting to recede. And then you say, "Honey, are you listening?" Right? Is there a woman here who has not asked her husband that? Honey, are you listening? To which he says, of course. And then he recites the last sentence. We're all good at— he could not recite 3 sentences ago, but the last sentence, it's like a little mini disc recorder that only has, that only has, uh, one sentence, uh, time frame. There are things you want to talk about that most men are not aching to talk about. It's just the way it is. And there are things about your marriage you might want to talk about to a girlfriend, and it's just because you have to talk about it. It's critical to talk. People need to talk. And so you need a girlfriend for that. There are things that a girlfriend will want to do that most guys won't want to do. And the exact same thing holds for a guy. He needs boyfriends. It's a fact of— a fact of life. My male friends, when I was single, they saved my life. As a married man, they saved my life. They are as valuable to me as anything in my life. I am a fanatic on the issue of friends. You hear me talk about it on the radio a lot. It cannot be overstated how important friends are. And couples need couples. So you need— the man needs a male friend or two, the woman needs a girlfriend or two, and the couple needs couples friends. You need couples friends because you're a couple. Now the trouble with couples friends couple's friends. It's tough enough to find one friend, right? A girlfriend for the woman, a boyfriend for the man, a male friend for the man. Boyfriend sounds funnier than girlfriend, so, so male friend. And so it's even tougher to find a couple's friend because a couple's relationship— remember, in two individuals relating, it's only two things that have to work. A likes— has to like B, and B has to like A. But if you have couple AB and couple CD, look at what has to happen. A has to like C, A has to like D, D has to like A, and C has to like A. So that's 2, that's already 4. Double it because of the other direction. 8-way liking has to take place. If only 7 exist, you can't have a couple's friendship. You see? That's why it's very hard to make a couple's friend. But it doesn't matter. It is a search that you should be on. It will enhance your marriage immensely. Couples can get lonely. And it is no reflection on your marriage. One person can't be your perfect companion. It's just, it's not meant that way. One of the reasons people divorce is that they overload marriage with expectations. It's too heavy a burden. It's like asking your car to deliver a truckload of goods. It will collapse under a truckload. A car is good for 4 or 5 passengers. It is not good for tonnage. You need a truck. You're asking marriage to take a tonnage of things that it can't take. We want our partners to be our best friends, our best communicators, our best lovers, our best intellectual companions, our everything, and be a good parent to our children, and endless and so on. We are asking often too much from our spouse and our marriage. We have to lighten the load, and one way that you lighten it is with fun. Friends, where— and, and it, it helps your marriage. Now, the greatest help for your marriage with a couple's friend is if you can discuss your marriage with your couple's friend. That's very hard. People will talk about anything. People will talk about their incomes and finances. They will talk about their children's problems before they will talk about their marriage, because it's embarrassing to people to admit into a problem in their marriage. It's sad. It's sad because everybody has problems. And the beauty of mentioning it to a couple is that they look at you and say, you too? You have that problem too? And then you start to laugh. The moment you could laugh at a problem, the problem is semi-solved. It is when it starts to weigh on you as, oh my God, woe unto us, We have a uniquely troubled relationship. When you find out that it is not unique at all, that 95% of women are walking around thinking that they don't have enough intimate talk time with their husband, and 95% of men are walking around with their complaints, which I'll get to in a moment, then you realize, wait a minute, this, this is just— this is the way it is. It's okay, it's okay. And so it is critical, and that is why I wanted this seminar. And, and, you know, and I want you to— I don't know how you can do it, there are so many of you, uh, you know, maybe you should put up a placard, um, we're really nice, you know, just, and another one, we're really, really nice, we're nicer than them, or I don't know. Okay, next. So nobody can fulfill all your needs. Number 3: Do you remember the single stupidest motto of a movie? You know, mottos— movies often have slogans. The dumbest in my lifetime was from— what was the movie? Boy, you folks really know me, I'll tell you. I really don't have to speak. I really should just take questions. Love Story. Thank you very much. Being in love means never having to say you're sorry. So stupid, only Hollywood could come up with it. Being in love means always having to say you're sorry. Why would we say we're sorry to strangers in an elevator, but not to someone we love? It is beyond my capacity to understand. Why is that even a romantic dream? You never have to say you're sorry? You always have to say you're sorry. You have to say you're sorry to your children. How's that? If your parents had said they're sorry to you, you would have been a happier child and a happier adult. Those would have been better than "I love you" if they would have said that to you. I— you see, I see you, by the way, while I speak. You see me, but I see you. You should see the number of people who go like this when I mention that. It's a very painful topic to a lot of people. We should say we're sorry to the people people we love. We hurt their feelings. Why wouldn't we say we're sorry? I love you so much. I'm even sorrier than when I inadvertently touch the elbow of someone in an elevator. Oh, excuse me, I'm so sorry. We're nicer to strangers than to people we love, almost always. It's terrible. It's terrible. It doesn't make sense. It's a, you know, I once asked my wife on this issue, she said, "Well, look, you're the man I love, so it's on you that I dump all of my problems." I said, "Thank you very much." But she means it in the sense of, "I could be intimate and open and free," and I'm saying, "But wait a minute, you would never speak like that to somebody else," as I have my stuff with her. And this is a typical couple's thing. And she's right, by the way. She should feel free to say what she feels to me. Otherwise, what did she marry me for? In order to tell this to a therapist? Obviously. On the other hand, I want to be— my feelings need to be considered too. That I'm not the dumping ground for all of that, any more than she's my dumping ground. And husbands think that of wives. They come home from the office, they're miserable, and dump it all on her, and, you know, like she didn't have a tough day too. And so you have to be aware of the difference between dumping and intimacy. Look, it's a tough struggle, let me tell you. No, it's tough work, not tough struggle. It's tough work. But you do have to say you're sorry. That's a very big help. Number 4. I have a feeling that this applies more to one sex than the other, but you tell me whether my hunch is accurate. Criticize as little as possible. If we had— who did it? If we have a door prize, you get it. Did you do it? Who did it? You're terrific. That is very funny. The guys clapped and one woman had the guts to go, "Boo." Exactly. That was awesome. Well, my friend Bruce Hershenson, I've mentioned his line on the radio often, "In the beginning, God created men and critics." Now, let me talk about women as critics. By the way, is it a fair generalization? You see, it's tough because you're sitting with your spouse, But it's just— nevertheless, if the husband is more critical of the wife, raise your hand. 7. Okay. All right, there are 350 of you, 7 raised their hands. Equal? All right, raise your hands if it's equal. Another 7. Okay, fine. I won't even ask the other question. I don't want to start marital rifts here, that was not my point. Women tend to criticize more than men. And now, I have theories on this, why this is. Why do women criticize more? I have a feeling that deep in the most primal little girl part of a woman, no matter how mature and wise she is, she still wants a knight in shining armor. She basically wants her man to be perfect. The guy wants his wife to be a beauty, and she wants him to be perfect. That's the primal parts of our things. You don't want your husband to be perfect, and he turned out perfect anyway. You see, it's very close. You have a good marriage. No, but this I do believe. I think that that is, that is part of it. Look, here's a, here's a physical example. If you, if If the husband, you and your husband are going out and he's dressed up, don't you pick the slightest piece of lint off his jacket? Something that he would have missed under torture. He would not have noticed he had that thread coming from his shirt or his jacket. I feel really like a baboon when my wife comes at me. Really, that's how I feel. What she finds on me is amazing. And at my size, you know, 6'4", there's a lot to find. But really, I do believe that that's part of it, why the woman would like her husband to be pretty much perfect. Whatever the reason, that may not be fully accurate, or at least I think it's accurate, but it may not be the full explanation. There is— now, I want to tell you, wifely criticism is great. And I mean this sincerely. This I won't say to my wife, and I will not let her hear this because I don't want to encourage it. But the truth is, it is great, and I'll tell you why. A lot of men walk through life with a somewhat inflated sense of themselves because men's egos are very important, and they are stroked and need to be stroked. That is very true. So when you come home You get a sober dose of reality. A wife— now here, here is the thing. Now all of this would apply to a husband too, but since it's more often in that direction, let me put it this way. A wife has a balancing act, and so does a man. We both have balancing acts. But a wife's balancing act here is you must criticize your husband. You must, absolutely. But you have to know how to do it, and you have to also make it— put it in perspective that you still think that he's the greatest. Okay, that's very important then, because he will think you've lost perspective and all you notice are his flaws, and then he's deflated. You don't want to come home to someone who thinks you're a jerk. I mean, that's for either sex. I, I know, I know one marriage that broke up because the man was hypercritical of his wife, and I counseled them personally. I'm not a professional counselor. Personally, and they stayed together longer because of my talking to them, but when it finally came out, there was no way he would respect her. She had lost his respect as a person. As a person. Then I knew it was over. That's the only— by the way, that is among the only things I would say are guarantors of the end of of a marriage, that each has to respect the other. If you lose that, everybody falls out of love, everybody gets angry, everybody has everything. But if you've lost respect, there's no— I don't think there's any way, any way back. I think even if you've lost trust, there's a way back to re-earn trust. But if you've lost respect, it seems to me— and, and I know in my own case, I— my respect for my wife is enormous as a human being, as a woman, And that is a very powerful thing that helps through any of the vicissitudes of marriage. Now, criticize— this came actually from a friend who I called before my talk, said totally stream of conscience. I called a friend on the other coast. I said, totally stream of conscience, I'm gonna give a talk to couples about marriage, tell me what comes into your mind. The first thing he said, criticize as little as possible, and he added a very good point: and only the act, not the person. Remember I said you have to know how to criticize? That's critical. It's one thing, you see, to pick, you know, you spoke wrong at this dinner party when you said this, or, you know, but to generalize it as you are a loser 'You can't talk to people,' or 'You can't,' 'You don't,' 'You this.' As soon as you generalize the person, then it's a terrible thing, and he will become defensive. And then what men do when they become defensive— and this is part of the reason— part— there are many reasons men don't talk enough— is they close up. Men are not— they don't start out open. If you've had sons, you know this. It is not natural to boys to open up with their feelings. Girls, you can't shut up, as a general rule, right? If you've had a daughter and a son, you know this. Daughters ramble on. My wife actually would pay my stepdaughter when she was very little, she would pay her, reward her, for having a limit on talking. Did you ever have that with a boy? I mean, boys, I will never forget, this was one of my great moments. You may well have heard this. My older son, he's about, oh, 7 years old, 6, 7. We're sitting in the car, and I was really serious, and I said, "David, listen, it's very important that you sometimes just open up with what you're feeling. So I want you to close your eyes, think very hard. What is it that you are most feeling?" And he was always such a good boy, and he did what I said, He closed his eyes and he goes, "I'm thinking, I'm thinking. Dad, I'm feeling that I really, really want an orange Slurpee." I never again. That was it. I learned my lesson. It was the stupidest thing I could have said to him. That is not how you open up a guy. I don't know how you open up a guy. I still don't. But that's not the way. But I know how you can close men down. Men get closed down when they think that you don't think well of them. So you have to criticize within parameters of understanding. You are still my knight. But knights can be better knights, can have more shining armor, if you will, if you would only do X or Y, or at the moment. And to say it calmly, not to generalize, "You are a—" We know not to do it to children, right? We say, "That's a bad thing," not, "You are a bad kid," right? That's an elementary rule to tell parents. Why would that not apply to a spouse? You're wonderful, but this was a mistake. Okay. Oh, he had another good piece of advice on this one. Broaden your critique when you're not angry. During anger, be as controlled as possible to the specific act that you're criticizing. During a calm, good time when you're sitting down to talk, which hopefully every so often you will, then you could say, "You know, I wanted to talk to you, I'm not angry at all, things are fine, but about some things that you tend to do." Then you can broaden it. You were with me? But at the moment of anger— because men respond worse to anger than women do, as a general rule, okay? That's just the way it is. And so, at the anger, try to keep it to the specifics. But I've always believed, with criticism in any event, I believe this is true for the way you deal with the macro. Remember every year I say New Year's resolution? This year, for every letter of complaint you send to a company about service or something, send to another company a letter of praise. It is easier to complain and criticize than to praise. It's just one of our human foibles. This is true for all of us. So think in your mind, the ratio of praise to your partner to criticism should be a good one. Maybe 3 to 1. I'm just making up a number. But that's very important. Keep that in mind. Gee, I did criticize him, but did I tell him how well he did in this area or that area? Or even a generalized, you know, I just want you to know I never lose sight of what a wonderful dad you are, or what a wonderful provider you are, or how wonderful in bed you are. I don't know, whatever you want to make up. I mean, whatever you believe. I was— it was a good joke. It was a good joke. Okay, number, uh, what are we at? Number 5. Okay, this is, uh, this is very tough one. This is— I've given a talk on this alone and written this up. This is actually written in my book of essays, Think a Second Time, which is my favorite of my books. You know, I love all my books. I have a favorite because that's 44 essays on 44 subjects. One of them is, is on this, and it's titled Men, Women, and Insatiability. The, the essence of my book on happiness is that we have to battle our nature to be happy. And the thing that we most have to battle is that our nature is insatiable. Whatever we want, we want more of. Whatever we most want we want even more of. So, I first learned this from my own life, but I also learned this— I observed our third child, our youngest child, from birth. This was the order of words that he spoke. His first word was "mommy" or "mom," "ma." His second was "dada." And his third was "more." We want more from birth. No child has ever said, "I've had enough cookies, thank you so much." Right? You don't say it to yourself. When you stop eating dessert, it is almost never if you like dessert. There is a slight sliver of humanity that doesn't like dessert, another group that I hate. And in any event, most of us like dessert. If we don't eat more dessert, it is only because we know we can't, because it has bad consequences, not because we don't want more dessert. So we never stop wanting more. We, in the sense of more, we are identical at 50 as at 5. There is no change. Human nature doesn't mature. The mind matures, character matures, but not nature. Your nature is to want more. Now, I believe that men and women have an insatiability in similar areas. We all want more dessert, we all want more money, We all want more attention and so on. That's universal. But there are two areas, one area for each sex, where I believe there is a built-in insatiability that is a cause of a lot of possible friction in a marriage. I'll deal with men first. Men are, in For the most part, let me make something clear about everything I say. As you saw when 7 people raised their hands, nothing applies to everyone. Okay, we all need air, that applies to everyone, but anything psychological, there will always be exceptions. So if this doesn't apply to you, you know, hum a tune until I'm finished. I am certain this applies to the vast majority of men, period. I know men really well. I make that brazen assertion. I talk to men's groups, I talk to men, men open up to me, I know me, so I'm certain of the following: Men have an insatiability in the sexual arena. Now, understand though, here's the problem. It's not insatiability in terms of frequency, although that can be, that is a possibility. It's insatiability in a more dangerous arena: variety. This is a very painful subject. When I talk about male sexuality to men and women, I can see women's faces and they get depressed or sometimes just reject what I'm saying. It's very important for men to know women and women to know men, and to know where we can solve things and can't solve things, and men need to know themselves. I could give you a talk, and have, just on the issue of men and insatiable sexual nature vis-à-vis variety. But there is a very simple proof. And the proof is The pornographic world, where $11 billion are spent, $10,986,000 of which is spent by men. The whole point of it is there's a new body to look at. That's the whole point, which to a woman is bizarre. I mean, what, what is the new body? You don't even know her. It doesn't mean any— that's the whole point. You don't want to know It's just a new body. Know her? What, are you kidding? Know her? It's just a new pair of legs. It's new breasts. It's new face. New whatever it is. It's new. It's another. If men didn't need variety, Playboy would have issued one issue and gone out of business. Men would have bought one issue and kept it forever. Right? Why come out every month? But that's the whole point. Miss April is boring in May. So long, Miss April, I have seen you enough. I want Miss May. And Miss May, and now Miss May of the week, or Miss May 11th, Miss May 12th, and so on. That is the way men are made. It doesn't matter how beautiful the woman in his life. And the great example for that was the famous English actor, I won't mention his name because I don't gossip, but you all know the story, who was, his live-in girlfriend was Elizabeth Hurley, voted on the internet the sexiest woman in the world. So here's a man whom many men consider the sexiest woman in the world, comes to Los Angeles, leaves her back in London, comes here, Dennis Prager for a shoot or whatever and picks up a prostitute on Melrose Avenue. Was it Melrose or Sunset or whatever it was? Okay? Is that amazing? And with all respect, she was not a beauty. And I mean, I hate to say it, but, you know, compared to Elizabeth Hurley, a woman had to look at this and say, say, I don't understand. He has the sexiest woman alive, and it doesn't matter though. It's another female, period. That's the way we're made. There's nothing we can do about it. We can control it, but there's nothing we can do about the fact that that's what we yearn for. Okay, Hugh Hefner is the uncontrolled male. Okay. A male with no, with no such controls. Who puts controls on the male? The wife, the society, the religion, a whole host of things. So men, you have to understand that you will always have this burden in your life. That is the way you are made. That is it. Your wife can't fulfill that. She can help you, and I will talk about that, but she can't fulfill it. She can't become another woman every night. Well, some try, by the way. No, I'm not kidding. They will wear something different tonight. I'm a hooker. I'm a nurse on Wednesday. You know, I mean, you know, no, really, there are— I've known couples. It's not my— in my case, but I've known couples where, you know, this has happened. And that— listen, I truly believe whatever works in your bedroom is terrific. I have, you know, there's a— it's a non-issue to me. Whatever works, works for you, and that's it. But the point of it is men have to know that no matter how sexy and wonderful and giving their wives are, that there is this element of insatiability. Insatiability is a literal term— cannot be satisfied. Now, where is it in the woman? It is certainly not in that arena. Women are not thinking, oh, I need another pair of good male legs. To have another chest to rub. Oh, this is what I yearn for. Where is Mr. May? Okay, there is no Mr. May. There is no Mr. April. This is not women. This is— that's what I mean, we're different, different universes, especially in this arena. But women do have as deep an arena, and not all but most, where they have an insatiability. And that is, just like a man can— will never be satisfied with X number of women, a woman will never be satisfied with X amount of intimacy. I have never met a woman who has said, my husband and I are totally sufficiently intimate. I seek no more time with him. I seek no more intimate discussion with him. I am perfectly satisfied in this arena. Such a woman may exist outside of Camarillo, but the, uh, in the real world, women are saying as an overwhelming rule, we don't have enough time together, we don't have enough time to talk together, we don't have enough intimacy. But my theory is, no matter how much time together and no matter how much intimacy, most women would want more. More is their yearning in that arena. And, and there will be always— again, men will have to make peace with their physical burden, women will have to make peace with their emotional burden. And, and that is the way it is. He can't fulfill— that's why you need a girlfriend. You want to open up about all of these things. First of all, I think if you had a guy who was as interested in every detail like that, he would come with a price, because it isn't male to be that interested in every detail of your day. I know you want to share every detail of your day with him, but no man wants to know about all the details. Not just from you, from anybody. They want to know basically, did you die today? Were you struck by a car today? That's important. Men are bottom-line oriented, not details. Women remember whole conversations. Men barely remember they had them. When a man hangs up from a call and the woman asks, his wife asks, "Well, what'd you talk about?" What does he answer? That's right. I never have to tell an audience what the men answer. To a woman, the notion that he could say, "We spoke about nothing," is utterly incomprehensible. She heard words come from his mouth, and she is sure that someone was talking on the other end. So something is awry here. You could not have talked about nothing. My wife looks at me like that. It's not possible that you talked about nothing. But there was no dramatic piece of data for me to remember. See, if I was talking to a friend and he told me he had a heart attack, I would remember that. But if he didn't have a heart attack, that's what I said to you. Did you die today? These are very important elements. We are bottom-line oriented. Women are detailed. They did this experiment. It was fantastic. Some university put college student males and college student females individually in a room alone. So they would have a college girl for a couple of hours alone in a room, college boy alone for a couple of hours. Then they would ask them privately, "What did you think about?" The men thought about sex and sports. The women, you know what the women did? This was the men book. I yawned when I read about the men. But this was fascinating, because I had no idea what the women would answer, but as soon as I heard it, I believed the experiment was accurate. The women reviewed conversations that they had had. That was a fascinating study. Women do review conversations. So he said, she said, and he said, and then I said, and then he said, and then I said. To me, this is an ability— I am awestruck by women's ability to recount conversations. I have actually taken now to writing notes every so often. When I know my wife will want me to reconstruct, I take notes. Because I just— I know that I won't remember it. It is as simple as that. Yes. Women don't have to take notes. They're like living stenographers. It's like there's a court reporter in their brain and they remember dialogues. The trouble with women is they remember dialogues from 14 years ago. "I remember what you said." "I said where?" They remember what you wore. My wife remembers what she wore the day we met. With all respect, I don't. I don't remember if I was nude or dressed. I assume I was dressed. Because I walk around dressed, but that's all I remember. She remembers what kind of shoes I wore. She remembers my car. I don't remember my car. This is— women have these memories. Now, all of this is by way of explaining that we have different deep insatiabilities. So here's what you do. A: each sex has to make peace with the fact She will not— she cannot— not will not— no matter how forthcoming she is in the sexual arena, she cannot fulfill all my fantasies, all my yearnings, all my— it's not possible. No matter how giving and intimate my husband is, he cannot meet all my intimacy desires. Okay, now having said that, each having made peace with their burden, There is, however, ways in which both can help the other, wherein a woman can be as giving as she can be in the sexual arena, and he will presumably, and should, and usually does appreciate it. That's its own discussion. And by the way, here is the thing: you don't have to be a beauty to be sexually satisfying and helpful to your husband. A lot of women think, "Oh, I don't look like a model, therefore I'm doomed." It's not true. It is not true. That is why I'll never forget I did a show once on lingerie, and it was, uh, why is so much lingerie sold? And not every woman wearing it is a model, but it is, to a man, it is— a lot of women are not thrilled about lingerie. I mean, they wear it because their husband likes it, but they're not thinking, "Oh, I can't wait to put on a garter belt," okay, or whatever it might be. But if— but what if— within bounds, I mean, there are areas where a man will make requests that a woman has a perfect right to say, "Sorry, that just turns me off." But within bounds and being flexible, it is a statement of love to your husband, to try to be giving in that arena. And he should take it as such and then work, work through that with you. But these are areas that just people have to know that they will never meet again. As I began in the beginning, all your needs cannot be met. Many can, but not all. Next, what am I up to? 6? Patience. If life doesn't teach you patience, you will die early of a heart attack and ulcer. You learn it from children, certainly, but you also learn it from your marriage. And the patience in marriage is a very simple one. The patience in marriage is to know that you wait out some bad periods. You have to do that. It is normal Just as a ship on the sea is going to hit storms, your marriage is going to hit storms. It's normal, and you have to sit back and say to yourself, I have to wait this out. We'll do what we can, but it doesn't mean that it is over the marriage. It doesn't mean I have to call a lawyer. I have to start fantasizing divorce, though probably everybody in every marriage at some sometimes thought about what would it be like if I divorced or separated or what have you. That's perfectly normal. Don't panic. Almost all of the stuff is normal, but you need to wait out times. I have known couples who have had years of— a year's period of bad times and now are more in love than ever. And now if the years turn into decades, It strikes me as there is a real case to be made for a divorce. I don't think that it's right for good people to have life imprisonment, and a truly bad marriage is life imprisonment, and it's not right. But having said that, know that there is an inevitability. Don't say things you will regret during the bad times. Just go through life. Placidly and awaiting. It, it may not even be rational. It may not even be something the person did. How do you know you're not going through something? When women go through menopause, it's not a change of life. When men go through midlife crisis, it's not a change of life. How do you know it's the other person? It is very often quite possibly you who are the one who is going through the tough times, and therefore the marriage is going through the tougher time. Your, your spouse may be oblivious to this. You may be oblivious to it. My friend who I spoke to, he said, here is my lesson, the biggest lesson I learned in marriage. I learned that I'm a lot moodier than I ever thought I was when I was single, and that my wife is a lot moodier than I thought she was when we dated. And there's a lot of truth to that, because when you're single, you don't know when you're in a bad mood. 'Cause there's nobody to tell you you're in a bad mood. You just think you're normal and the world stinks. Right? But when you're married, all of a sudden there's a mirror in front of you at all times. And you realize, my God, I am in a bad mood. So it may well be you. People go through different things in life. It may not have to do with the marriage. Maybe things at work are tense. Maybe the children are causing issues. And let me tell you, children cause issues. Very rarely do children make marriages better. Okay? Children may be a cement in marriage. You can't leave because you don't want to leave for the children's sake, and so on. But they don't make marriages better. If your only issue is a happy marriage, don't have children. I am all for having children. The trick is to have a good marriage and children. I am passionately pro-children, and, you know, I'm crazy about the 3 that I have. But if you're purely selfishly interested in marriage, the case for children cannot be made. I mean, I talk to couples on the air, you've heard them, and privately, you know, my line on this is, God has a sense of humor. That which is created by passion then kills it. About how, uh, how many couples in New York, hot-blooded, young, dynamic couples, have almost no sex? And it is because she works comes home dead. He works, comes home dead. And they have a child. And every— and, and they're too dead. And especially often she, she was, you know, she was absolutely happy to have sex when they were single and carefree, or where they were married and no children and still carefree. And now there's a child, and children You can't say to a child, "You know, in 2 hours I'll be right there, no problem, Daddy and I have to make love." It just doesn't work. You can't make love while a child cries. In fact, you can't do anything while a child cries. I think we are programmed that way. Oh, well, there is one exception: men can sleep through a child's cry. Thank God. Yes? Children come, and, and that's why I'll tell you, this is where you've got to redouble your efforts in whatever way you can. Back to the sex issue, because that was what the issue in this New York article was about. The psychiatrist that I once interviewed on this, Dr. Mommer, agrees with this, but it was not he who was the one that said this to me, said, uh, sex is a very small percentage of marriage, but, uh, it can ruin the rest of it. And so it is important. And again, you feel you coast along, you both love the baby so much and you're so excited, but that physical intimacy is very important. And you, you know, something has to be worked out If it's getting a babysitter, if it's going to a hotel— you may have to leave your own house to make love when you have a new baby, or 2 babies, or 3 babies, or what have you. But this is all under the heading of patience. Please understand that there will be rough times. Please understand. And, uh, 2 more. And then I'm done. Oh, ask me afterwards, okay? But write it down, don't forget, because if I take questions in the middle, I'll never get through. So thanks for, for understanding. Excuse me, my friends. All right, uh, the next— this is just an interesting insight. How many— I'm going to ask you a question because this I don't think will, uh, upset your spouse if you answer honestly. So I have to know what I can ask you and get honest answers. I want you to think now, if there was a problem that you had vis-à-vis your spouse— well, maybe you won't answer honestly, but I'll give it a try— when, when you first married, or even that you knew of before you married, raise your hand if it is no longer a problem. What is— I always get 7 hands no matter what I ask. Is that, uh, raise your hands if it's still a problem. Yes, if there was a problem that you had, uh, that you thought you felt identified with your spouse before you married or when you first married, do you feel that it is still there in your marriage? Raise your hands. Well, alright, so we have about 25. Others are not raising— maybe the— I'll give you an example, alright? Maybe an example will help you. Another friend that I asked about this said, "Look, when we dated and in the beginning of our marriage, my wife was always late. She's still always late." That's an example of a problem that existed early on and didn't exist. Is, is the question now clearer? Okay. If that is true for you, a problem that was there is still there, raise your hands. Okay, so at least half of you are raising your hands. As a general rule, now this is what I tell singles, this is really only to tell you in a sense of giving you some calm. A very important thing when you marry is identify identify what you, as best as you can, what the flaw that you perceive, it may not be, but the flaws that you perceive in the person. Everyone has flaws, even the person you're madly in love with. It's hard to identify them when you're madly in love, which is part of the problem of being madly in love. It's blinding. It is literally blinding. But it is a very good idea to figure out what flaws you can live with and what flaws you can't live with. And once you know you can live with, the odds of that person changing are next to zero. By and large, the way you come into a marriage is the way you remain in the marriage. You can get better in, in many areas, but usually Usually somebody who spends a lot early is going to spend a lot later. And you have to figure out behavioral ways around these issues or to accept those issues. A lot of women, I think, you know the old saw, it's a brilliant proverb, as it were. Women want their men to constantly change. Men want their women to never change. And there's a lot of truth, a lot of truth to that. So you have to know that there are certain parts of that person, that's the way, that's whom I married, they married me with my bag of stuff, and that's the way it is. You could work on it, and it is good to do so, but just know that it stays. And finally, and this is a big one, and this is a painful one to some people, but I believe in this very deeply: never take the other person's fidelity, or even permanence as a spouse, for granted. The way people treat each other when they're dating is constantly to win the person over, and then over the course of time, some sooner, some later, What sets in is a take-for-granted, "I don't have to win him anymore, I don't have to win her anymore." And that's wrong, in my opinion. I don't believe in unconditional love for adults, as you've probably heard me say. Only children get unconditional love, and only dogs and cats give it. Not cats, dogs. I like cats, they just don't give unconditional love. That's all. But the, uh, this, this point is very important. It is not right to take your spouse for granted. That is one of the reasons I do believe that divorce must always be an option. I don't want you to always think, no matter how I act, he's going to stay. No matter how I act, she's going to stay. I don't think that that's right. I think you should feel And it's exciting to feel that way. There should obviously be a certain comfort in marriage that doesn't exist in dating. We agree. But at the same time, too comfortable may not be so good either. Too comfortable is brother and sister. When you were dating, there was a discomfort, a certain tension, a sexual tension, emotional tension, whatever. That's not a bad thing to keep. And to have the belief that, wait a minute, I just can't, quote, let myself go. I still need to earn his love. And he— you need to earn her love in whatever way it is. She needs to be dated. She needs to be courted. I'm not the greatest at this. Don't, don't, don't think that I'm preaching from perfection, okay? My wife believes that I am not the most romantic of husbands, and she's probably probably right. But more so than some, I just want to make that clear. I don't want to give a totally negative view of me as a husband. But although I don't know at what level— also, I think if, you know, I think she'd start laughing if I, you know, you know, if I set up one night a candlelight dinner with flowers and a strumming violinist, she would have me hospitalized. I mean, it's like my mother's It's an old line with my mother. My mother says, you know, if you'd ever— if you called more often— and I call at least once a week, but she always says, if you called more often, I would faint. That's— and my answer is, that's why I don't call more often. True violation of honor your father and mother, but anyway. This is just very important. Try to remain desirable, and that's— there are many, many ways— and show that the other person is through the time of a marriage. Never take anything for granted. That— those— there are so many more arenas of married life, but let me just say this in case you didn't know: it is the best institution for our growth for our longevity, for our health that has ever been invented. With all of these problems, think of yourself, unless you are in a toxic relationship, think of yourself if you weren't married. Well, it's a fantasy. You know, women who think, "Oh, all the freedom I would have. I wouldn't have to make him dinner all the time. I wouldn't have to put up with his dirty socks. The house would be neat." Yeah, and you'd have no partner in life. You'd come home and you would have a very neat house with you. And men think, "Oh God, if I were single, oh my God, all these beauties are out there." I'll never forget one friend of mine had a great line on this. He said, "Dennis, it's amazing. The day I got divorced, divorced. I wondered, where did all those beautiful women go? When a guy is married, all he sees are these— every woman is a knockout. Then all of a sudden he's single again. Where did all the knockouts go? It's all— there's a lot— we play a lot of tricks with ourselves. And, and you— who doesn't imagine? There's no a husband or wife after a number of years who hasn't imagined, "What would it be like if I were single?" So what do most singles do when they get divorced? They look to get remarried. Right? They're not thrilled to be single. They're, in fact, they're dying to find somebody to live with. And I've done shows, "Do you regret that you got divorced?" And, you know, and I am pro-divorce when necessary. So I have no vested interest. Fascinating how many people called up and said, especially women, because women file for divorce more than men in our society, said, "I was an idiot. I was just an idiot. I don't know what came over me. I threw a really decent guy away, and I haven't found anybody since." It's very common. I had no idea what calls I'd get. I thought maybe get no calls, maybe just people all are thrilled that they got divorced over the course of years. And some people are and should be, there's no question. But a lot of people don't understand what, what happens. You go out into the singles world, it's not the happiest place to be. It isn't. Life is a challenge single, life is a challenge married. But it's better to have the challenge with somebody committed to you, with you committed, building something larger than me. And yes, I do need a critic when I go home. And she's not just a critic, she loves me and she respects me and she adores me, and I know that. But I do need a critic because it's very easy when everybody's calling, "Oh, Dennis, it's such an honor to talk to you," and "It's so great to talk to you," and "I love you in this," and I'm coming, "Hey, hey, this is Dennis Prager at home." And my wife, you know, immediately reminds me, and my kids do too. It's a great thing of having kids. I am not Dennis Prager to my kids. I'm Dad, right? As it should be. As I've always said, a man has no charisma in his own house. It's very, very important. Marriage is extremely important. See, I haven't made a speech, the case for marriage, to you. You're married. But I think couples do need a speech, the case for marriage. Sometimes you need to hear once again why it is so good that you're married, why it is so important, why the person in your life is a treasure in your life. And it's very important to remind yourself of that. You know, we go through life, it's a tough voyage, and to make it with somebody who's on your side with all their idiosyncrasies and flaws is the best way to travel through it. All I hope is that I can make that voyage a little easier for you. Thanks very much for listening. Thank you. Thanks a million. Thank you. Okay, I appreciate that a lot. Now listen, you've been seated a the whole time. What do we want to do here, Elyse? Do we want to have a little break of 15 minutes? Yeah. Okay. Now, by the way, when are they— make it 15, because it stretches. 15 minutes, okay? Because I want to have as much time for Q&A, and I want you to have time to meet each other. Will they have time to meet each other? They're not kicking them out of the hotel. That's really important to me that you do get to talk to each other. Meeting. So you have something you want me to do right now? Pick a name? What do they win?

Now that we can go ahead and break, and then, uh, well, during the break I'll do some raffle prizes just for fun.

What do they win though, out of curiosity?

Oh, there's all kinds of goodies. There's tapes, there's books, Stephen King books, which is kind of fun, his new, new latest book. We've got, uh, some Burke Williams gift certificates.

Oh, thank you. Did you go ever go there? Yeah, this is one of the perks of my show cuz I get to try out the sponsors. I even had, uh, Purina dog food the other day. It was— I thought it was— I thought it was delicious actually. The, um, but no, this is— this was awesome, the Burke Williams thing. Fantastic.

And we'll have two grand prize drawing, or for the winners we'll have two grand prizes each 2 nights per couple at, uh, she took my picture, I'm taking her picture. Um, a resort in India.

They'll get the prizes for that. Hold up, before you go, I want to take the different rose pictures. This is digital.

Yeah, I use them all.

Okay, hold on, I need it.

2 separate cameras, said this is the best camera ever, and he said, I saw them fly out the store. Fly out the store.

Yeah, but if you want to spend a lot, this is a very good camera. All right, see you in, uh, so it's, uh, see you 3:15, please be back in. Okay. Yes, let me just figure around how I did this. That's 3. Okay, give me 5 seconds. It's working. Okay, I think that says 4. You know what, I'm going to stop it. About how, uh, how many couples in New York, hot-blooded, young, dynamic couples, have almost no sex. And it is because she works, comes home dead, he works comes home dead, and they have a child, and every— and, uh, and they're too dead.

And then we'll have two grand prize drawing, or for the winners, we'll have two grand prizes, each two nights per couple at, uh, she took my picture, I'm taking her picture.

Hold up, before you go, I want to take the different rows' pictures. This is digital. Yeah. Oh, I use them all. Okay. Dennis loved it.

Hold on, I need to— what?

No, yeah, but if you want to spend a lot, this is a very good account. All right, see you in, uh, so it's, uh, see you 3:15, please be back in. Okay. Yes, let me just figure out how I did this. That's 3. Okay, give me 5 seconds. It's working. Okay. I think that says 4. You know what, I'm going to stop it. And especially, uh, often she, she was, you know, she was absolutely happy to have sex when they were single and carefree, or where they were married and no children and still carefree, and now there's a child and children. You can't say to a child, you know, in 2 hours I'll be right there, no problem, Daddy and I have to make love. It just doesn't work. You can't make love while a child cries. In fact, you can't do anything while a child cries. I think we are programmed that way. Well, there is one exception. Men can I can sleep through a child's crying. Thank God. Yes. Children come, and that's why I'll tell you, this is where you've got to redouble your efforts in whatever way you can. Back to the sex issue, because that was what the issue in this New York article was about. A psychiatrist that I once interviewed on this— Dr. Mommer agrees with this, but it was not he who was the one that said this to me— said sex is a very small percentage of marriage, but it can ruin the rest of it. And so it is important. And again, you feel you coast along, you both love the baby so much and you're so excited, but that physical intimacy is very important. And you, you know, something has to be worked out. If it's getting a babysitter, if it's going to a hotel, you may have to leave your own house to make love when you have a new baby or 2 babies or 3 babies or what have you. But this is all under the heading of patience. Please understand that there will be rough times. Please understand And, uh, 2 more, then I'm done. Oh, ask me afterwards, okay? But write it down, don't forget, because if I take questions in the middle, I'll never get through. So thanks for, for understanding. Excuse me, my friends. All right, uh, the next— this is just an interesting insight. How many— I'm going to ask you a question. Because this I don't think will upset your spouse if you answer honestly. So I have to know what I can ask you to get honest answers. I want you to think now if there was a problem that you had vis-à-vis your spouse— well, maybe you won't answer honestly, but I'll give it a try— when you first married, or even that you knew of before you married. Raise your hand if it is no longer a problem. What is— I always get 7 hands no matter what I ask. Is that, uh— raise your hands if it's still a problem. Yes, if there was a problem that you had, uh, that you thought you felt identified with your spouse before you married, or when you when you were first married, do you still feel that it is still there in your marriage? Raise your hands. Uh, well, all right, so we have about 25. Others are not raising— maybe I'll give you an example, all right? Maybe an example will help you. Another friend that I, that I asked about this said, look, when we dated and in the beginning of our marriage, my wife was always late. She's still always late. That's an example of a problem that existed early on and didn't exist. Is the question now clearer? Okay, if that is true for you, a problem that was there is still there, raise your hands. Okay, so at least half of you are raising your hands. As a general rule, now this is what I tell singles, this is really only to tell you in the sense of giving you some calm. A very important thing when you marry is identify what you, as best as you can, what the flaw that you perceive— it may not be— but the flaws that you perceive in the person. Everyone has flaws, even the person you're madly in love with. It's hard to identify them when you're madly in love, which is part of the problem of being madly in love. It's blinding. It is literally blinding. But it is a very good idea to figure out what flaws you can live with and what flaws you can't live with. And once you know you can live with, the odds of that person changing are next to zero. By and large, the way you come into a marriage is the way you remain in the marriage. You can get better in, in many areas, but usually somebody who spends a lot early is going to spend a lot later, and you have to figure out behavioral ways around these issues or to accept those issues. A lot of women, I think, you know the old saw, there's a brilliant— it's a brilliant proverb, as it were: women want their men to constantly change, men want their women to never change. And there's a lot of truth, a lot of truth to that. So you have to know that there are certain parts of that person— that's the way, that's whom I married, they married me with my bag of stuff, and that's the way it is. You could work on it, and it is good to do so, but just know that it stays. And finally, and this is a big one, and this is a painful one to some people, but I believe in this very deeply: never take the other person's fidelity or even permanence as a spouse for granted. The way people treat each other when they're dating is constantly to win the person over. And then over the course of time, some sooner, some later, what sets in is a take-for-granted, I don't have to win him anymore, I don't have to win her anymore. And that's wrong in my opinion. I don't believe in unconditional love for adults, as I've— you've probably heard me say. Only children get unconditional unconditional love, and only dogs and cats give it. Not cats, dogs. I like cats, they just don't give unconditional love, that's all. But the, uh, this, this point is very important. It is not right to take your spouse for granted. That is one of the reasons I do believe that divorce must always be an option. I don't want you to always think, no matter how I act, he's going to stay. No matter how I act, she's going to stay. I don't think that that's right. I think you should feel— and it's exciting to feel that way— there should obviously be a certain comfort in marriage that doesn't exist in dating. We agree. But at the same time, too comfortable may not be so good either. Too comfortable is brother and sister. When you were dating, there was a discomfort, a certain tension, sexual tension, emotional tension, whatever. That's not a bad thing to keep. And to have the belief that, wait a minute, I just can't, quote, let myself go, I still need to earn his love. And he— you need to earn her love in whatever way it is. She needs to be dated. She needs to to be courted. I'm not the greatest at this. Don't, don't think that I'm preaching from perfection, okay? My wife believes that I am not the most romantic of husbands, and she's probably right. Uh, but, um, more so than some. I just want to make that clear. I don't want to give it— I want to give a totally negative view of me as a husband. But although I don't know at what level And also, I think she'd start laughing if I set up one night a candlelight dinner with flowers and a strumming violinist. She would have me hospitalized. I mean, it's like my mother. It's an old line with my mother. My mother says, "You know, if you called more often," and I call at least once a week, but she always says, "If you called more often, I would faint." And my answer is, "That's why I don't call more often." True violation of honor your father and mother, but anyway. This is just very important. Try to remain desirable, and there are many, many ways, and show that the other person is through the time of a marriage. Never take anything for granted. That— those— there are so many more arenas of married life. But let me just say this, in case you didn't know: it is the best institution for our growth, for our longevity, for our health that has ever been invented. With all of these problems, think of, of yourself— unless you are in a toxic relationship— think of yourself if you weren't married. Well, it's a fantasy. You know, women who think, "Oh, all the freedom I would have. I wouldn't have to make him dinner all the time. I wouldn't have to put up with his dirty socks. The house would be neat." Yeah, and you'd have no partner in life. You'd come home and you would have a very neat house with you. And men think, "Oh God, if I were single, oh my God." Oh my God, all these beauties are out there. I'll never forget one friend of mine had a great line on this. He said, Dennis, it's amazing. The day I got divorced, I wondered where did all those beautiful women go. When a guy is married, all he sees are these— every woman is a knockout. Then all of a sudden he's single again. Where did all the knockouts go? It's all— there's a lot— we play a lot of tricks with ourselves. And, and you— who doesn't imagine? There's no husband or wife after a number of years who hasn't imagined, what would it be like if I were single? So what do most singles do when they get divorced? They look to get remarried, right? They're not thrilled to be single. They're— in fact, they're dying to find somebody to live with. And I've done shows, "Do you regret that you got divorced?" And you know, and I am pro-divorce when necessary, so I had no vested interest. Fascinating how many people called up and said, especially women, because women file for divorce more than men in our society, said, "I was an idiot. I was just an idiot. I don't know what came over me. I threw a really decent guy away, and I haven't found anybody since. It's very common. I had no idea what calls I'd get. I thought maybe get no calls, maybe just people all are thrilled that they got divorced over the course of years. And some people are and should be, there's no question. But a lot of people don't understand what, what happens. You go out into the singles world, it's not the happiest place to be. It isn't. Life is a challenge, single Life is a challenge married, but it's better to have the challenge with somebody committed to you, with you committed, building something larger than me. And yes, I do need a critic when I go home, and she's not just a critic. She loves me and she respects me and she adores me, and I know that. But I do need a critic because it's very easy when everybody's calling, oh, Dennis It's such an honor to talk to you, and it's so great to talk to you, and I love you in this, and I'm coming— hey, hey, this is Dennis Prager at home now. And my wife, you know, immediately reminds me, and my kids do too— it's a great thing of having kids— I am not Dennis Prager to my kids. I'm Dad, right? As it should be. As I've always said, a man has no charisma in his own house. It's very, very important. Marriage is extremely important. See, I haven't made a speech, the case for marriage, to you. You're married. But I think couples do need a speech, the case for marriage. Sometimes you need to hear once again why it is so good that you're married, why it is so important, why the person in your life is a treasure in your life. And it's very important It's important to remind yourself of that. You know, we go through life, it's a tough voyage, and to make it with somebody who's on your side, with all their idiosyncrasies and flaws, is the best way to travel through it. All I hope is that I can make that voyage a little easier for you. Thanks very much for listening. Thank you. Thank you. Okay, I appreciate that a lot. Now listen, you've been seated the whole time. What do we want to do here, Elyse? Do we want to have a little break of 15 minutes? Okay. Now, by the way, when are they— make it 15 because it stretches. 15 minutes, okay? Because I want to have as much time for Q&A, and I want you to have time to meet each other. Will they have time to meet each other, they're not kicking them out of the hotel. That's really important to me that you do get to talk to each other and meet. So you have something you want me to do right now? Pick a name? What do they win?

No, we can go ahead and break, and then during the break I'll do some raffle prizes just for fun.

What do they win though, out of curiosity? Oh, there's all kinds of goodies.

There's tapes, there's books, Stephen King books, which is kind of funny his new, new latest book. We've got, uh, some Burke Williams gift certificates.

Thank you. Did you go ever go there? This is one of the perks of my show because I get to try out the sponsors. I even had, uh, Purina dog food the other day. It was— I thought it was delicious, actually. The, um— but no, this is— this was awesome, the Burke Williams thing.

Yeah.

This has been Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager. Visit DennisPrager.com for thousands of hours of Dennis's lectures, courses, and classic radio programs, and to purchase Dennis Prager's Rational Bibles.