What Gives You the Right

Hey everybody, it does help if I press the Right button. I admit it. Welcome to the Dennis and Julie podcast. Dennis Prager and Julie Hartman. We talk about life. This is a very real program. I've never co-hosted anything in 40 years. I'm not a snob. This is proof that I'm not. But I found the right person. I'll tell you something very touching, Julie. So I was just in— here it goes, ready? LA, Orlando, Atlanta, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Chicago, back to Philadelphia, and then to Vermont in 12 days.

I would be in a coma. Seriously.

God has blessed you with energy.

I would be hooked up to an IV. In a coma for 10 years.

And by the way, and did my show every day.

I know you did.

Right. Just for the record.

And obviously you spoke.

Right, I spoke.

And met millions of people.

Right. But the reason I'm mentioning it is, and I hinted at this right before between us, but I want everybody to hear it. I get a lot of beautiful things said to me and they all are very meaningful. But I, I don't think anything is more meaningful than when somebody comes over and says how much they enjoy our podcast. There was this woman, young woman in Vermont, and I don't have a radio show in Vermont. I'm not on in Vermont. Just was speaking about this, and like everything else in my life It's wonderful and frustrating because I know that if millions and millions watched this or heard this, it would touch a lot of people in a good way.

I understand that frustration now that I'm in this world because I feel like I just want to take a giant bullhorn and—

that's right—

speak to the entire— I mean, obviously I'm so grateful to have the platform that, that I have and we have, but I agree with you. I just wish that we could reach more and more people because it's healthy. It is.

Especially when they tell me that their daughters—

oh, I've gotten so many emails recently. And by the way, I also get a lot of lovely, lovely emails, but my favorite ones are when people talk about Dennis and Julie. And I've gotten a lot recently from mothers who say that they play it in the car with their daughters and that their daughters are really liking it. And I think especially young women is a demographic that we conservatives need to reach. So I'm glad to be a part of that.

So I just, I wanted to share that with you and with the audience. It's very touching. You, since the last time we had our podcast, had a pretty interesting experience.

I certainly did.

Take it away.

So I went to Washington, DC, and I was there for a conference that was hosted by Hillsdale and the Hoover Institute. I know I say this all the time, but I just have to say it again. All of the conservatives that I have met are just the loveliest people.

Oh, I wanna talk about that when you're done.

Just truly the loveliest people. So this conference had about, I would say, 30 to 50 conservatives, either writers or professors or you know, what's the word I'm looking for, researchers, people who write policy papers. And we were together for about 10 hours at this conference. So I really got to know almost everyone there. And they were just, A, the smartest, but B, the truly most kind people I've met. So the conference was about the decline of the university. And I definitely want to talk to you about the conference. But another very exciting thing that happened, as Dennis knows, and Dennis wanted me to share with the audience, is that I got to meet with Justice Clarence Thomas when I was in DC. I went to the Supreme Court the first day that I was there and had a 2-hour-long meeting with him, which was truly one of the most extraordinary and meaningful and memorable experiences of my entire life. He is just— I was talking about how the people at Hillsdale are such nice people. Clarence Thomas is the epitome of a just deeply gracious, kind, warm person. It was a joy.

He is so kind. I know him for many years and his wonderful wife. He is so kind that you can forget how brilliant he is.

I actually said that to him halfway through the meeting. I said, you know, I just want you to know that I obviously admire you because you're a brilliant scholar, but above all else, I really appreciate your strength of character, your dignity, your, again, your warmth. He has this really fun, vivacious laugh, right? That's just like a roaring laugh. And he has a way of making you feel like you are, you know, the most important person in the room.

So he is a person— you'll like this. So there are people that I know, not public figures necessarily, and I have said about them If anybody dislikes this person, it is solely a commentary on that person. That is how I feel about Justice Thomas. If you differ with him, I have no issue, right? But if you dislike Clarence Thomas, then there's something wrong with you. See, I believe that Donald Trump was a great president, but if you dislike Donald Trump personally, I don't think you're sick, you're weird. But if you dislike Clarence Thomas, there's something wrong with you.

He doesn't have, and I love this, I've said multiple times on this program that my least favorite quality in a person is arrogance. If someone has even one hint of arrogance, I immediately don't like them. Clarence Thomas has none of it. I mean, he was sitting there, I'll never forget this, and he has this candy jar on his desk, in the seating area where we were sitting. And we were talking about inflation. And I was saying, sometimes, you know, what causes inflation is a bit difficult for me to understand. He takes out a nickel. He pulls a Twix bar from his, you know, candy jar. And he's going, so if the price of this Twix bar is this one nickel, but then you put two more— and I'm sitting here going, Justice Clarence Thomas is trying to teach me about inflation using a nickel and a Twix bar. And I just think that's so him. There is not— he never gave the impression, oh, I'm too, you know, intellectually above this to talk to you about this. He's just a regular, just a regular person.

I'm so happy you had that. You had that.

Well, he's my hero, as you know. He's one of the people, for good reason, has influenced me the most.

And do you know how I know him? You do. I'll tell everybody though.

It's a great story.

So when he was being incredibly unjustly attacked when he was nominated for, by the first George Bush, to be on the Supreme Court. Ironically, I was giving, oh no, it wasn't Hillsdale, so it's not ironic. I was giving a speech at Heritage Foundation in Washington and it was on C-SPAN and it was in passionate defense of what was obvious to me a great man. And he contacted me to thank me. I mean, that was amazing.

Isn't that nice?

It was remarkable. He didn't— I don't think he knew me from Adam. He just saw me on C-SPAN. Anyway, that's how it started. So I want to react to something you said, which is pretty much what we do here for the whole podcast, is react to what the other said. So about conservatives being nice and smart. So this was a very important development in my own life. I grew up in a Jewish ghetto, really a ghetto, in Brooklyn, New York, where in New York everybody grows up in a ghetto. West African ghetto, Puerto Rican ghetto, Jewish ghetto, Catholic ghetto, Italian ghetto. It's still— it's actually ironic. They think they're the worldliest people in New York, but in many ways they're the least worldly people. That's what I believe. Anyway, I grew up in this Jewish ghetto, so my contact with the non-Jewish world was the mailman. And by the way, I actually used to interview the mailman.

Really?

Yes. 'Cause I was so interested in non-Jews, 'cause I knew as a child I was in a cocoon. Well, it's my nature to get out of the cocoon. So anyway, so when I got older and started speaking around the country and meeting all these non-Jews, obviously, and realizing, God, there are really a lot of nice ones. And I'll be totally open with you, this you would not know. In this sense, there's a— I think there's a Black and Jewish parallel that a lot of Black kids grow up thinking, you know, whites are racist and all this. A lot of Jewish kids certainly then grew up thinking, oh, the non-Jews are anti-Semitic. It was just not everyone, obviously, but This was right after the Holocaust, after all, just within 20 years.

Would your parents talk to you about that?

Or your— No, my parents, interestingly, I have very different— my father volunteered as an Orthodox Jew to join the Navy. That's extremely rare. Yeah. So I had, I had, I, my parents were not cocoonish. My world was. So then later Your realization came true because of course I was raised never, never leftist. My father hated the left, but liberal, liberal in the good old days when liberal was something you could be proud of.

Respectable.

Yeah, respectable. And then I met all these conservatives and I had your realization. I mean, not everyone, there's no such thing as everyone of anything. But how many were just nice? So you will love this. Do you know my story about my Black Uber driver?

No.

Okay. So this was my last column, which proves you didn't read my last column.

I read most of them.

Oh, this is very painful. So, just actually—

I watched your recent fireside chat.

Okay, I'm glad you did.

And I felt happy about it because we talked in the podcast, I believe 2 or 3 episodes ago, about what are conservatives conserving? And I was saying we wanna conserve the principles of the American founding, and Dennis did a very nice extension on that in the fireside chat. So I really, I liked it a lot.

You could say you, Dennis sounds like third person. Third.

I know I was actually rewatching a podcast.

That is so funny.

And I switch in between.

I know. 'Cause you were talking to me. Oh, I get it. I know.

And when with Amala, when Amala was here, I thought as I was watching it, I hope this isn't confusing for people because we were saying you, but we were gesturing towards each other. So if someone listening could see.

Oh yeah.

So anyway, apologies if that was the case. Not an issue. Go on.

So I'm actually glad you didn't read the column because I spoke about this as well on my radio show. So you will— you'll love this. So in Philadelphia, my colleagues, my Salem radio colleagues and I spoke to 1,200 people. That was a very big turnout in Philadelphia at this big venue called the— I guess the Fugue, not the Fugee. F-U-G-E. I don't know how they Fugue is musical, maybe the Fuge. So anyway, there was no chance for me to rent a car in Philadelphia. I always rent a car. So I took an Uber, and there's a Black driver, and he started talking to me. So let's see, it was something like this. So what do you do? I go, so I go, I give speeches. Interestingly, just as a parenthetical thought, you have no idea how often the person that I say that to, a stranger who doesn't— obviously doesn't know me— will not say, 'About what?' Wouldn't you think?

It is so interesting that you say this. I don't want to sidetrack you, but I have had the same experience with people.

Oh, tell me.

I will.

Yeah, I'm not going to get sidetracked.

Go ahead. Yes, when I'll be in an Uber, or, you know, we're both talkative people. We like— we like to Yes, meet strangers. Whenever I strike up a conversation with a stranger, they ask me what I do and I say, oh, I'm an on-air host, or I, you know, I have a talk show or something, and they'll just go, okay, cool, right? Look, not always. I would say about 70% of the time that's the reaction. 30% of the time people go, no, it should be zero proportion.

Yes, my analogy is if I said to somebody, I I'm a major league baseball player. Wouldn't you think they'd say, what team?

Yes, of course. You know, I always thought that that was because they don't want to get into an extended conversation. Like if I'm—

Yeah, but natural human curiosity. You don't have to get into a conversation.

It's a very interesting point and one I've noticed.

I teach speeches. Isn't the next question, oh really, about what? Or I write books. Oh really? Like what?

What do you think it is?

A genuine lack of curiosity.

Yes.

I'm sorry to say, it's not a matter of not wanting a discussion. It's a genuine lack of curiosity. It's not human to people like us. If somebody said to me, I didn't know I write books. So, oh really? What? I know. Okay. Anyway, so this guy goes, so he goes, what do you do? I give speeches. I didn't know what answer to give. I run a big, you know, video site, a radio show. I write books. So I said to him, because I was going to give a speech, so I thought it was the most logical. He goes, oh, on what?

Good.

Exactly. So this is my thinking. I'm going, black Philadelphia, the guy's overwhelmingly likely to be on the left.

Yes. Get ready.

I don't want— I can't lie because I think it's wrong to lie.

Yes.

On the other hand, I don't want to just make it obvious he and I differ in my opinion.

Also, he's driving your car.

Yeah. No, no, I wasn't worried about that. You want me? Yes. Even though, let's say, an Uber driver doesn't want to crash.

Or someone who's making my food. I'll think, okay, you're making my food. I've got it.

Okay. I'm not that worried. It's just I don't want to have tension in a car.

Of course.

So I gave an honest answer but could go any direction. And I said, the collapse of Western civilization. That's what I said. And I was thinking, this will definitely end the conversation.

That's like your ethical monotheism.

Oh, totally. Exactly right. So it was of that genre. So I go, the end of Western civilization. And then he goes, Man, are you right? This woke stuff is going to kill us. This censorship of free speech. And he goes on and on. And I'm thinking, holy crow, I won the lottery. I know a Black Philadelphia Uber driver just volunteers how bad it is from the left.

Yes. So then what did you— did you say more?

So did I say more? I wanted to kiss the guy. Did I say more? You're cracking me up. So I say to the guy, holy crow, you could give my speech. So then— and then I go, hey, wait a minute. Given that's how you feel, why don't you come to the speech?

That is, by the way, that is classic Dennis Prager.

That is because I did it with the Afghan Muslim in Washington.

No, you— that's just classic.

So thank you. It is. It is, though. You're right. So I say, why don't you come? I'll get you in. You will love this. This is really a classic story. I then said to the guy, not only will I get you in, but I will introduce you, and I promise you a standing ovation from 1,200 people. And he came, and I introduced him. He got two standing ovations from 1,200 people, and the spotlight shone on him. Oh, it was an OMG moment.

Imagine he comes home to his wife.

Oh, I I would give money to know what— how he related that evening to friends and family.

You know, I have been thinking about this a lot. Not only the— what you first raised, that few people ask the what about question, but also I've been thinking when I meet strangers and my job comes up, how should I handle it? Because like you, I don't want to lie. But on the other hand, sometimes I don't want to get fully into it and I don't want to create a tense situation. So I've actually been meaning to ask you off the air how you handle it, because it's It hasn't been difficult for me.

That's what I do about life. I talk about men and women. I talk about happiness. I talk about politics. I talk about religion, but I always throw in politics because I don't want to be dishonest.

Right.

But, but, but, well, all the others are also true. It's true for you too.

Well, the decline of Western civilization is a really good answer.

Is it?

It's a really, really good answer because it doesn't, it doesn't overtly say conservative.

You're right.

But it, but for those who know, that's right. It's a total indicator. So the reason why I—

this is why I love her.

But it's true.

She gets every nuance of the point.

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How the hell did you end up with a middle seat?

Okay.

What, did you book it the day before?

See, I'm telling you, I am convinced that my mom pays you, A, to ask about my dating life, and B, now I'm convinced she paid you to ask that question. My mom gave me such a hard time, deservedly so.

Excuse me, that is as logical as what do you speak about.

I did. I booked it really late. And I knew about the conference. My mom has said to me probably 100 times in the past week, "Well, that's why you don't book it late." So trust me, I am aware. I booked it late.

I got a middle seat.

So it came up, you know, on my flight, because on my flight there I was reading a Clarence Thomas book, and people on either side of me said, "Why are you reading that guy?" So that was interesting.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Let people know. I don't want that to fly by.

Yes.

So you were sitting next to people of what color?

They were both Black.

And they saw you reading Clarence Thomas's autobiography?

Yes.

And said to you what?

Said, why are you reading that guy of all people?

That's depressing.

I will say something about that, but first, just so I don't forget, I want to finish this point. The reason why I am more forthcoming now than I was maybe a few months ago about the nature of my job is because if I find that one outlier, like the Black Uber driver in Philly that you had, it makes all of the difference to have that connection. And I want to bring them into what we do. Because then, let's say I'm sitting next to someone on a plane, and I strike up a conversation with them and happen to find that they're conservative, then I tell them about the podcast, they've met someone from the Dennis and Julie podcast, you kind of bring them into the world.

So you like the Western civilization line?

I love that line.

It's totally right.

It's brilliant.

It's code.

It is totally code. That's precisely what it is. I love it.

That's the proverbial dog whistle. We finally discovered a dog— that's a conservative dog whistle.

That is so funny. We should come— I know we're saying all the time we should come up with lists for this, lists for that, but we should come up with a list of conservative dog whistles.

That's so right.

So back to— because it really is an interesting thing. I talked to you about it on the phone and your wife Sue. We had a fascinating discussion. So yes, I was in the middle seat on the way to D.C. I was sitting in between two Black people who were part of a larger group on the plane that was going to the Howard University homecoming that weekend. So they were really— we honestly had a really fun plane ride. They were super nice. We were talking about, you know, their jobs and families, and the woman next to me is trying to write a book. So we were having great discussions. And so I was reading Justice Thomas's autobiography. I read it a few years ago, but I wanted to obviously refresh my memory before I was seeing him the next day. And then the woman next to me said that line that I repeated. She said, why are you reading Clarence Thomas, him of all people? And then the guy on the other side of me kind of chimed in and said, yeah, I've been wondering that. Now what's interesting is that I actually took the COVID off of the book. A, because I do that, like seriously, just whether or not it will be political or whether or not I may get a comment about what book I'm reading, I take the COVID off because it's just physically easier to handle the book with the COVID off. But also, I just wanted to read the book without a conversation. But they, I guess, were looking over and they saw at the top of each page, you know, my grandfather's son, Clarence Thomas. So I said, I responded to them and I said, because he's a remarkable person. He's a remarkable scholar, but above all else, I mean, do you know what he's been through? Do you know how he grew up in the segregated South in Georgia? And when he was about 8 or 9 years old, his mother was so poor that she couldn't afford to raise him and his brother. And so he lived with his grandparents. You know, I started telling the biography and both of the individuals on either side of me had no idea. That Clarence Thomas grew up in the segregated South or that he had this really—

Well, it's unfortunate.

Really crazy story as such.

Studying in force is my line. We know so much more about them than they know about us.

We meaning conservatives and they meaning liberals.

We read them, study under them, watch them, hear them. They don't study under us, watch us, or hear us.

No, they were, They were stunned. By the way, I have brought this up with a few of my peers from college. I actually think that few of them know that Clarence Thomas is Black. What? I know it seems weird to say, but they just hear about the justices or they read, you know, Clarence Thomas voted to overturn Roe v. Wade. And I Seriously, sometimes when I bring up Justice Thomas to people, I'll say, well, you know, he grew up in the segregated South, and I can see their eyes kind of going, what? He's Black?

That's fascinating.

I promise you a lot of people at Harvard and a lot of higher ed places have no idea that he's Black.

What the average college student, even at the most elite, don't know?

Oh, you know what I've been testing too in the past few months? E pluribus unum. I am telling you, Dennis Prager, and it's anecdotal evidence, as is the Justice Thomas. Yeah, I am telling you, every single person who I have asked, every single person does not know what it is.

And I haven't even had one. If you'd have asked this 50 years ago, they would have known.

I know zero, 50, let alone people from my high school too. I was very lucky to go to a very elite private you know, academically rigorous high school where you are supposedly supposed to know this stuff. None of them know it.

Yep.

If you did a survey of my grade, I think I would be the one person who knows.

It's on every coin. Just so people know, this is not obscure.

Yes, it's on every coin.

Yeah. So I got onto the Uber driver story because—

Yeah, I'm sorry.

No, no, no, there's no sorry. I said I'm not gonna get sidetracked. Don't worry about it. About conservatives being nice. When I said to this guy, you're going to get a standing ovation, I— that is worthy of its own little discussion. First of all, why was I sure of it? And secondly, why did they do it? I was sure of it, and why they did it is really the same answer. The conservatives so deeply appreciate when anyone outside of the white Anglo-Saxon Protestant community shows up. I'm a Jew and they're incredibly appreciative.

Yes, that is very accurate.

And I, and I have always known that. I actually ended my essay, if you're, if you're a Black individual and you're feeling a bit unloved, show up at a conservative conference.

Totally. Well, you, you have a saying about what is a happy Black person? A Republican.

Yeah, that's right. Exactly. By the way, so my— I ask every Black conservative, every single one, a caller to my show, a guest on the show, an Uber driver. How does your family regard you? Oh, that's fascinating. Every single one. Every Black who's ever appeared on— not appeared, just come on my show. And including just callers who were conservative. Not every black who calls is conservative, but I asked the black conservatives. And every— virtually everyone has the same answer. They think I'm nuts. They just think I'm nuts. So then I said, what about— do you have children? He said, 4. I said, how do they regard you? He said, they're all conservative.

Oh, God bless. God bless.

Maybe you should meet him.

Maybe I should.

I didn't take their numbers. I made them.

I mean, I'd love to.

Absolutely. I would love to too.

I know. I know.

If those—

I wish I could meet every single person who writes into me, or every person.

I know, it's very true.

Yeah. Well, I, I just, I think especially because I was reading Justice Thomas's book, and, and, you know, that, that, um, response that he gave at his 1991 hearings about how this was a high-tech lynching for uppity Blacks who dane to disagree.

Yeah.

Or, you know, that's what it was. It was. And I rewatched his documentary. That was such a powerful thing to say. And for the life of me, I just don't understand why more people don't see the discrimination against Black conservatives for what it really is.

So there is a woman, a Hispanic woman, congresswoman, and she's not in the Hispanic caucus.

Mayra Flores.

Yes.

Yes.

So, so it's so deeply racist. So it's not a Hispanic thing?

It's so racist.

Well, it's, forgive me, it's really not racist ironically. It's, well, it is and it isn't. You're not Hispanic if you're conservative.

See, I think that's racist.

Okay.

I think it's, I think what they were trying to do to Justice Thomas and what they, you know, they call Candace and Larry Elder and Carl Jackson Uncle Toms and, you know, the traitors. And what that's essentially saying is what President Biden said before he was elected, if you don't vote Democrat, quote, you ain't black, right? You— it's the most racist thing to say. You're not a real black person if you disagree with me. You're only a real black person if you're a Democrat. That is really, really racist.

So this you would not know. And I don't— I'm with my crappy memory on names. It's amazing I remember it. There was a woman senator from Texas in the 1990s, Kay Bailey Hutchison. Gloria Steinem, one of the matriarchs of feminism—

who was honored at my Harvard graduation. She was given an honorary degree at my graduation, and the Prime Minister of New Zealand was the commencement speaker.

Oh, that's right. She said Kay Bailey Hutchison is not really a woman because she was a conservative. So you're not a woman if you're a conservative woman. You're not Hispanic if you're a conservative Hispanic. You're not a Black if you're a conservative Black. So it's interesting, does it apply to Jews? So am I not a Jew because I'm a conservative Jew? I wonder what liberal Jews would say.

You know, I have a lot of liberal Jewish friends, or people who were once my friends and now not really. And whenever I would talk to you about them, excuse me, them about you, I never got the sense that they didn't think you were, quote, a real Jew. I actually got a little bit of a sense of, obviously they would never admit this, but that they knew that you were way more serious about your Judaism than they were.

Oh, interesting.

Maybe that's—

No, no, you may be right.

I speculate that that's part of why a lot of my liberal Jewish friends had such hostility to you, because again, this is just speculation and I could be very wrong, but I got the sense that they have felt a little bit insecure about their Judaism, their relationship with Judaism, that they're not taking it seriously enough. And then you are so the opposite of that. And relatedly, me reading your Torah commentary was very threatening to them because I was even taking Judaism more seriously, or religion more seriously, and I'm not even a Jew.

That's right.

That's my little observation. But as far as conservatives being nice people, as you said, obviously you can't paint any group with a broad brush. But I was thinking recently, I feel like now that I have become conservative and I'm introduced to this world, I feel like I'm a part of a club. Not a cult, but a cool club that people at, you know, the average student at Harvard would never know about. It's this great community of just highly intellectual, America-loving people. And it's almost like you're just speaking the same language when you're around fellow conservatives. There's more of a sense of camaraderie and mutual understanding. Than in the left-wing environments I've been in. And I just think to myself, as I was at the Hillsdale conference, I was thinking, my friends don't even know what they're missing out on. They have no idea the quality of people, the quality of ideas that they are removing themselves from because they just think it's not worth it. They're so wrong.

I've been in both worlds, obviously.

Yes, I mean, I straddle both worlds every day.

And you too, right? The intellectual level is incomparable.

It is. It truly is.

And I say this, I certainly think it about the moral level, but I say this knowing that they think they own the intellectual arena.

Do they? I mean, they definitely do, but it sounds just so absurd to me now that I'm in this world because it's not even comparable.

That's why they don't debate us. As a general rule. And if they do, they just yell.

I have been— I mean, growing up in Los Angeles, going to liberal schools and going to a very liberal college, I feel like I'm one of those unique people that has really been in extremely liberal environments and extremely conservative environments. And I've noticed that in the liberal environments, people's personalities are very much affected. It's all about affect, or really it's— people tend to play up their demographic characteristics. And so I think I mentioned this on a podcast before, but at Harvard, you know, whenever a speaker would come in, the speaker would almost always be positioned as like the first Black woman to do X, or the first trans person to XYZ. And then the whole panel discussion when they'd be interviewing that person is like, what advice do you have to other trans youth? Or it would always surround the demographic. In the conservative space, it surrounds the ideas. People's personalities are not that they're an XYZ woman or this or that. It's, what's my area of expertise that I have to offer you? It's just, it's a totally different ballgame.

You would think at this point, haven't they run out of firsts?

I know.

It's become so narrow. Well, they keep adding and adding and adding. Exactly.

Yes.

The— what was the latest? The first intersex something. Did you see that? No, the person had, uh, what they call it, ambiguous genitalia. Can you imagine making an announcement about that? I mean, the first person with ambiguous genitalia to be a quote or whatever it— whatever it is. Who cares?

But then, and also, I think, wouldn't that person with ambiguous genitalia feel kind of embarrassed that that's their only claim to fame?

They're never embarrassed. It is not a human reaction that's available on the left. I'm always amazed by that.

I know, that's a very good point. And I was thinking about this because, as you know, I don't love to refer to or talk about Harvard on air. At times, obviously, like I was just talking about, when I speak to my peers and it's relevant to mention where those peers come from, it's a good thing for me to say. But I try very hard to avoid it because embarrassed is not the right word, but I don't want to be known as Julie Hartmann, the student who was at Harvard and became conservative and was brave and spoke out about it. That's not how I wanna be known. I wanna be known as Julie Hartmann, standalone person who has good ideas and who's intellectual. Like, I would be embarrassed if someone said, oh, and you're the Harvard— like, it doesn't matter that I went to Harvard. It matters who I am.

I so identify. It cracks me up. People know I have a— apparently I have a react to Julie smile that people—

I know, I love it, and I see it.

It's great. And I don't— I don't even— I'm not aware of it, but it must exist.

I'm sure I have a react to Dennis smile.

Well, thank you.

So we both have react to Sean smiles.

People often ask have asked me, why didn't you become a rabbi?

Yes, I was wondering that.

No, that's a very logical question. I studied as much, almost as much as a rabbi studies, more than many rabbis have studied. I know Biblical Hebrew extremely well. I lecture in Hebrew, and I've taught it my whole life. And I consciously, I thought about it, but I consciously thought, including PhD, I consciously thought, I want to be Mr. the rest of my life. I never told you this.

That's a really good reason.

Not doctor, not rabbi, not, not any title. I'm just Mr. or Dennis. So you will, you will, you will take my ideas or you will reject my ideas.

Yes.

But it's not coming from because he X, Y, or Z?

Yes. You know, I had it— again, of course I just said I don't like to mention Harvard, but in college there was someone who asked me, literally just approached me in the dining hall and said, Julie, can I ask you a question about your work with Dennis Prager? And I had no idea who this person was. I said, of course. You know, I always welcome the few times people would talk to me. Usually people didn't bring it up, but she said to me, you know what What qualifies you to talk about the things that you talk about? Or frankly, what qualifies Dennis? Because Dennis has really just made a career off of his own ideas. What master's degree did he get in XYZ? Essentially, what gives him the right to speak about these matters? And first of all, I thought it was such a revelatory question because We live in this world, especially in an environment like Harvard, where you have to be a specialist or an expert in something in order to speak credibly about it. Everything is just reduced to rational arguments and has to be backed up by science and proof and XYZ.

So this is very important.

Right.

They're not honest about that because if you have—

Of course, there are many exceptions.

Well, no, if you have PhDs, no, The exceptions are this way. You have a PhD from Harvard, a master's from Cambridge, and another PhD from Berkeley. If you differ with them—

Exactly.

The credentials are meaningless.

Right. And also the way that there are, I said there are exceptions, is that they talk about things like they are the experts on it all the time, like gender. Many of them, I mean, you don't need to study gender to be an expert on gender, but they talk about so confidently that gender is a construct and that there are, you know, I think the latest count was 38 different iterations of gender. I'm like, well, you're not a PhD student. You didn't study this directly. But I just thought it was a really interesting thing to say, not only because of this, it was indicative of the overly credentialed professionalized world that we live in, but it actually just made me think, wow, you really, again, I don't know how eloquently I'm going to say this, and maybe it just sounds more profound in my head than it will out loud, but you really have made a career just on on your ideas. I say just as if it's— that's right, but it's so powerful.

Yeah, one, one would think that, like, you, you just were—

my point is, I'm not expressing it very well, but you were born with such wisdom and such insight into life that you can just, you know, and hopefully I'm going to be able to do this, talk about that insight and that wisdom, and you haven't again studied anything. I mean, obviously you read and you do research on your own, but No, I, I studied a lot, but, but it—

there's no degree to show for it, right? I left graduate school, right? But it wouldn't have mattered if I had a PhD from— I went to Columbia— if I had a PhD from Columbia, it wouldn't— it wouldn't matter.

But people nowadays dismiss the idea that you can have that original idea, original ideas and good insights without going to professional—

oh, it's worse than that. During the, the lockdown, which I opposed from the beginning, and I was right, during the lockdown, the scientists who opposed the lockdown— this, I followed this so avidly. So if, if let's say a biologist or, uh, doesn't matter what, would say the lockdowns are medically useless and spectacularly harmful to society and children in particular, Very common response was, well, he's not an epidemiologist.

That's the world we live in now.

That's right. But it's, it's used as a tool.

It is.

That's all it is. It's a battering ram.

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Go to pragerforhillsdale.com.

And Justice Thomas actually recommended that I read that. So what was my point? Oh yes, so I love to read about it. I'm by no means an expert, but I would say that I'm pretty well-versed in most things pertaining to constitutional law. And again, I was talking with a peer about this, and they said to me, well, you didn't, you know, why are, I was having a debate about the Supremacy Clause and federalism, you know, how I think that many liberal states have undermined the Supremacy Clause by not following the principles of the Constitution above federal or state law. And the person responded to me, well, how are you equipped to make this argument? You didn't go to law school. And I'm like, this is just— I can promise you, I'm not trying to sound cocky, but I probably know more about this than someone who did go to law school because law school is so terrible.

I'll give you proof, another proof that that it's phony.

Why do we need to be experts?

That's right, that's right. And so I remember vividly a full-page ad in the New York Times decades ago. I don't know, 100 Nobel laureates, right, protest capital punishment. So wait, you get a— you gotta— you got a Nobel Prize in physics. Why, why would we take you seriously on capital punishment? So They use it when they want it.

Right. And they dismiss it when they don't.

If you differ with them.

Yes.

Who are you? You're just a physicist. Why are you commenting? Let's say you are for capital punishment.

I have gotten to the point, as I know you have and many conservatives have, where I am actively wary of people who have many degrees next to their name. I obviously don't— I try not to judge people in advance, but instead just listen to them and then make my judgment. But if I hear that a speaker is coming to my school with, you know, a joint JD/MBA and then a master's in XYZ, I think that they probably don't have a lot of rationality or that they don't think clearly.

Well, so I go further. I assume if you're a professor in the social sciences, I assume you're a fool. Right. I know for a fact that some are not, But if I have to make an assumption before I meet you, I assume you do not think clearly and have mostly foolish ideas.

Right. This is a great segue into one of the things that I wanted to bring up at this Hillsdale conference that I went to. As I mentioned, it was about the decline of the university, and so there were professors who were there in a variety of subjects. They also had a student panel, which is the panel obviously I spoke on. And there was a point that Professor James Hankins made. Professor Hankins actually is at Harvard, of all places. He and Harvey Mansfield are the last conservative professors at Harvard, and Professor Mansfield is retiring at the end of this year. So Professor Hankins—

How old is Professor Mansfield?

Mansfield, as I call him, because we're friends, we're close, is 92.

Right. And the other one?

Professor Hankins, I think, is in his 60s or 70s, probably 70s. I'm so happy I got to have— I actually never took a class of Professor Hankins. I met with him about a possible thesis that I was going to do, but I got to take Harvey Mansfield's courses and they were life-changing. Anyway, Professor Hankins was the keynote speaker at this conference and he was talking about why and how the universities have declined. And he brought up two really interesting points that I'd like to share with you and our viewers. The first one is, he said, in the 1990s, our world really became increasingly globalized with the advent of, you know, the cell phone and the internet. That it became globalized in such a unique way that universities no longer were just national entities, but became international entities. A, like Harvard Business School, for instance, has programs in India. You can, you can go to Harvard Business School in India, or you can go to Harvard Business School in a European country. And also, relatedly, the, the, um, the student body has changed because now things are so globalized. Harvard used to be a school that had primarily American students, and now it has, I think, a quarter of its student body or something, you know, in the double digits is international. So Professor Hankins was saying that's why there's no longer a Western Civ requirement, or that's why you're not, they're not teaching the students American values because it's really no longer an American university. And I thought that was a very good point 'cause that—

Yeah, but it's absurd.

Right, it is absurd.

Yes.

But he's—

No, the point is totally valid.

But he's characterizing what happened.

Well, it's worse than that. You know the famous statement of a young, Youngmi Park.

Yes. Oh, she's sensational.

She is.

She is so bright.

Well, I have— I've had her on a fireside chat and she claims, and she's right, I mean, I believe she's right, she heard more anti-American propaganda getting a master's degree at Columbia than she did in North Korea. So what happens is you— so you have all these foreign students coming to anti-American universities.

Yes.

They pick up disgust with the West and America.

Yes.

When they come from India.

It's so— it is so true. I know several international students who started off coming to Harvard with kind of an awe that they were in America and an appreciation for it, and then they go to these classes and their friends are liberal and their professors are liberal, and all you hear is about how systemically racist and terrible America is, and then they adopt that idea. But, but anyway, that's That being said, because I've wondered, you know the question of how did we get here fascinates me. Not just how did we get here, i.e., the university has declined, but how did American society become so decrepit and woke and has allowed these corrosive ideas to take hold when 50 years ago we were a pretty traditional, conventional, law-abiding society? And I think the globalization point is a really good one. We're no longer our schools are no longer American schools. And the second point that he brought up is related to this first one. The university has now tried to be so many things to so many people. You have all of these XYZ studies programs, racial studies, gender studies, you have colleges of arts and sciences, you have a million master's programs and a business school, law school, like universities have just tried to fill so many holes that they've forgotten the reason why universities exist, which is to make yourself a better citizen and a better person. So it's no— like, and it just made me think, when I was applying to college, I wasn't thinking that I'm going to college to become a better American or a more informed American citizen. I thought I was going to college to honestly get a credential. So Those are the main insights.

Yeah, well, they were good insights. That was why the public school was founded originally, was to make you American, and especially all the children of immigrants.

I have got to read up more on the history of public schools because you said that to me the other day on the phone and I thought it was fascinating. So they've only been around for about a century, right?

No, more than a century. I don't know exactly when they start, probably the middle of the 19th, but a lot of people didn't go then.

Right.

But universally more of the 20th century, which was fine if they— look, I always tell the story, my grandparents, my father's parents, both came from Eastern Europe, from Russia, Russia, Poland. They only spoke Yiddish. They were, you know, they were classic first-generation immigrants. They were Orthodox Jews. They had no— it never occurred to them them that sending their child to public school would in any way, shape, or form—

I know—

have their child learn anything other than their values as Orthodox East European Jews. And, and, and now an American sends their kid to school to learn the opposite of every value that they treasure.

One of the most— I think one of the most brilliant points points that I've heard— well, I read it actually, so I should say that I've read in the past year. I think I've mentioned this before. It's from John O'Sullivan, who is a British speechwriter for Margaret Thatcher. He had this excellent point. It's true of public schools, it's true of higher ed schools, it's even true of something like the LA Times, which 100 years ago was one of the most conservative right-wing papers in the country, and now it is To say he's left, I mean, to say he's left-wing is an egregious understatement. But John O'Sullivan had this brilliant, brilliant theory that any individual, group, or society, institution, really anything that is not actively practicing conservatism, like every single day vigorously pursuing a conservative way of life, will naturally drift to the left because that's just in most societies, the natural drift of things is leftward. Certainly in this society, because our media and our schools and everything, all the influences around us are left.

Wouldn't you love— I wonder if you ever fantasize this— that you got an hour to speak to all of the students at Harvard?

Well, that's how we started the conversation about the bullhorn. I just wanted— yeah. Oh, trust me, I I would love that. I would get booed off the stage.

You know, you know what you might want to write? You should write, if I could go back to school—

well, that was my senior speech.

That's true.

My senior speech that I gave was, which is on YouTube for those who haven't seen Clarence Thomas. So yes, he did. Which is—

how do you feel about that?

Oh my gosh, I mean Try. I mean, I, my life is a dream. The fact that I get to do this show with you, the fact that I got to meet him, the fact that I get to, you know, meet so many just wonderful, so God-fearing people. It's a dream.

Since we mix the macro with the micro, you can't stand arrogance.

Yes.

And, and I can't as well. In fact, when I encounter it more than revulsion. I have just— I have contempt. It's like, you got to be serious. You're arrogant.

I know.

You got to be— you got to be kidding me. So you, you don't have that. And if I'm allowed to say, I don't have that. So I have said to you on a number of occasions—

I know what you're going to say. I was about to bring it up.

So bring it up.

Dennis said to me on the phone several times, he said, you know, just one day, one day, one day, like Not even one scene, just one, one day period, and then it can be over. I would love to be a hothead, or, you know, I'd love to be a prima donna. That's what you said. Yeah.

What does it feel like?

What does it feel like?

I know, to think you are this hot piece of whatever.

I would love to know, because all I do is walk around beating myself up all day. So I would, I would love to have just even an, you know, an hour of the day.

It's a very interesting question. One that's plagued me more recently than ever in my life: how much is our value system and how much is our nature?

I know we've brought this up, and it's worth bringing up again because it, it's something I think about a lot too.

Because I don't have to fight the urge to be arrogant. I have to fight the urge to be lazy. I have to fight a lot of urges, but But that's not one of them. I, I just, it's not appealing to me.

Well, I was thinking about this recently in, in the context that, you know, this is, this may not come off the way I want to, but I'm going to give it a try. People always tell me that I'm brave or that I think clearly, and I am obviously so grateful for that. And I try to really accept the compliment because as you know, I'm hard on myself and I convince myself, no, I'm not brave. No, I'm not this. So I, I really try to accept it. But there's another part of me that goes, this is just— this is just the way that I think. Isn't it kind of obvious that this makes sense?

So why haven't you told me that? I don't say on the air, like, why am I getting credit for that? I am getting paid well to say the obvious. That was my line for decades. Sometimes when I, you know, I'm preparing for time to say that, that there are two sexes.

I know, I know.

Is now a heroic act.

Well, look, a thing. I mean, you don't just say the obvious. You really talk about high-level, in-depth intellectual things, as I hope I do. But still, my point is exactly what you're saying. Perhaps I could walk around arrogant like, "Oh yeah, I'm so brave," or, "Yeah, oh, I'm so this," but I don't think I deserve any credit for that because it's just so obvious to me to behave that way and do that. So I really think you've really alerted me to the power of one's nature because I'm also convinced that when I talk to people who would say that they are liberals, and I could spend hours, as I have, putting out the most rational, nuanced, well-thought-out arguments, and there's still something inside of them that is not willing to see what I'm saying and not willing to accept it. And I think it's a personality trait or a character trait.

When a person says to me, I want you to know you've changed my life, and I get that a lot, and I'm very grateful for.

I always say, as you said to me, as I said to you, as—

because it's true, you get half the credit. What about all the people who hear this and nothing happens?

Because I— well, it, it's something I struggle with because I do see people, again, friends I have, and I'm friends with them for a reason, you know. I— they're, they're really good people, but sometimes I'll talk to them about issues pertaining to politics or the decline of Western civilization, and they don't get it. And I'm like, I know that, I know the kind of person you are. I know that you have the intellectual and moral capability to see this, but you don't, and why? And it frustrates me because I'm like, I know you.

I'm not sure you'll ever come up with the answer.

Do you have that too with people?

Oh, it drives me crazy.

You just wanna shake them and go, this is not you. The you that I think I know would be able to see that whatever I'm telling you is— I don't understand, to be honest, I don't understand the Trump hatred.

I understand Trump dislike.

That's true.

I understand this dislike is not hatred.

Yes.

I don't understand it. I know, especially from a conservative. You— everything that you claim you wanted for America, he did.

Yes.

And you hate him or you voted for Biden. Forget my own politics. I don't understand your thinking.

Right.

Do you, do you care? Why do you hate him as much as you do? And I, and the, there is no coherent answer.

What do you think it is?

I don't know. That's my point. What you just said, I'm confirming.

I have a theory.

Yeah.

Because I know that you were saying that, you know, sometimes you just, you can't figure it out with people actually with the specific Trump derangement system. I do have a theory of, or should I say system? Syndrome. I do have a theory about that. I think that expressing hatred for Donald Trump is a socially sanctioned form of expressing anger. I think that, at least I have observed, that people who have such fury and rage towards Trump have things in their own lives that they're deeply unsettled with or things that they don't want to admit that they'd like to change or are bothering them or that they can't they can't speak about publicly. And so again, channeling their rage towards Donald Trump in a conversation is a way for them to blow off steam that may be elsewhere but is being sublimated.

Hmm.

It's sublimated anger.

So when you said socially sanctioned, yes, I didn't think you were going to come up with the anger. Oh, I thought socially sanctioned moral superiority.

Well, that's— that is certainly another component that I do believe.

Well, but see, you show if you're a conservative, it's your way of saying, I don't think about politics first, I think about morality and character.

Yes, totally. It's sort of a conservative's way of virtue signaling.

I think that's true.

And the thing I also do—

but I don't understand why that is all that satisfying.

I know, I know. Well, Well, you know, I talk to a lot of family members and friends about Trump, including ones who are conservative. And the thing that gets me is I'll say, look, they'll bring up, oh, well, Trump is so mean and he's so, you know, he doesn't have good manners and he said this and he said that. And obviously I can't dispute that that's the case. But what I'll say is, as Thomas Sowell so brilliantly articulates, there's no solution in life. There are just trade-offs. And I really don't understand how people who share my values can't look at Trump and realize, okay, if we were designing a perfect world— I would vote for a candidate that wasn't as personally abhorrent, but there's a trade-off. And again, perhaps, I certainly don't mean this to sound arrogant myself, but is he—

Which book does he say there are no solutions?

Oh God, maybe—

'Cause that's such a great line.

It is a great line. I think "Discrimination and Disparities." He has wisdom, Sowell. Yes.

Do you know that what percentage of Harvard seniors heard of Thomas Sowell?

Oh, I was speaking to a friend the other day who doesn't know that Eibler, Bassoon, Thomas Sowell, anything pertaining to America or conservatism.

Ask them, name one conservative thinker.

They'll say Ben Shapiro. Uh-huh. Or you. But I'll say not, I mean, obviously you guys are thinkers as much as you are talk show hosts, but I'll say, you know, someone outside of the media realm. Milton Friedman, for instance, could people name? Probably they could name Milton Friedman, but I mean, Victor Davis Hanson, right?

They don't, they don't.

Or Heather MacDonald.

Or Heather MacDonald.

Barry Goldwater.

Or, you know, Tom Sowell.

Tom Sowell. Yeah. So no, they, they can't.

But we know all of theirs.

Right. But isn't that point that, that it's a trade-off? Isn't that just obvious? Again, I'm so sorry if this is not, if this is coming off in an unkind way.

It should be obvious when you hear it. Let's put it that way. Right. It took a Tom Sowell to make that line.

Right.

But once you hear it, you should, oh yeah, of course that's true.

Right. Well, again, it's just your point that you say over and over, and it can't be said enough, we don't have any wisdom. We don't. That's what it is. And it actually circles back to what I was talking to you about with the person who said, well, what qualifies you or Dennis Prager to speak about these matters? You don't have a PhD, you don't have a master's. We live in this world that is so, professionalized and credentialized.

And anti-common sense.

That's what it is.

Why isn't the answer, 'cause we make common sense? Tell us where we're wrong. The issue is not qualifications. Did Aristotle have a PhD?

But there's, my point is that there's something desiccating and there's something desiccating about an excessively cerebral academic way of looking at things. You think that you're actually getting to a point of rationality, but you're actually not. It'll limit— when you're picking apart things so, again, academically or in a professionalized way, you're, you're just becoming more irrational. As a recent college graduate, I know the importance of an education that teaches critical thinking and prepares you for the real world. That's why I encourage anyone considering higher education to consider The King's College. The King's College is a Christian liberal arts college with classes in New York City and online. Their core curriculum based on politics, philosophy, and economics teaches students how to interpret, question, and apply the most important texts throughout history. Whether you study business management, philosophy, pre-law, humanities, or one of the other majors and minors offered by the King's College, you'll become the kind of thinker that's on the road to leading with integrity. Graduates from the King's College have even gone on to other prestigious schools like Harvard, MIT, and Georgetown. The drive that is instilled in graduates of the King's College is what sets them apart from other students. So what are you waiting for? Apply to the King's College today for free at tkc.edu. That's tkc.edu. That's actually one of the things I talked to Justice Thomas about, about how the fact that so much of these corrosive, crazy woke ideas come from classrooms and conference rooms. Yeah, it really is unique to elite academic environments where you can sit and say, well, maybe gender is a construct, or, you know, maybe we should upend XYZ. They, they think that these professionals are so rational, but actually the professional environment fuels irrationality. And fuels the antidote of common sense, because all you do every day is postulate and pick things apart and make interventions.

When I read a New York Times columnist, 99% of whom are woke, left, not just liberal but woke, they will often, you know, on the internet they will have a hyperlink, right, where you click on it and you see. So for example, as noted, and then they will cite some study or some source. So I often click on it because I find the idea preposterous. So I'm curious, where did you get this preposterous idea and what are you backing it up with? And invariably it's just another left-wing column or a left-wing source.

I know.

So they— it's all a circle. It's a magnificent circle.

And you talked the other day on your radio show about Google. The amount of censorship and the amount that they bury conservative stories is absurd. I was on the phone with your wife about a week and a half ago when I guest hosted for you and we were talking about Biden's pardon, President Biden, I should say, his pardon of those who've been convicted of marijuana possession. And whenever I have questions about things, I call Sue because she's a human dictionary, researcher, research powerhouse. And I said, I remember reading in the Wall Street Journal that Jason Riley wrote an article about this subject. And she said, oh, I haven't read it, let me look it up. Doesn't come up on Google. I could remember the name of the article. The article was Biden's Marijuana Pardon Won't Free a Single Inmate. That was the title, I could remember it word for word.

But Jason Riley's the Wall Street Journal.

I know, but Sue was saying she didn't read it in paper, so she says, oh, I'll just look it up right now.

So she types into Google Jason Riley No, no, I'm saying he's Wall Street Journal to say how bizarre it is that that didn't come up.

Oh, oh, okay. I understand.

Yeah, that's mainstream.

It's mainstream. Wall Street Journal put the exact title that I remembered. Couldn't find it. Didn't come up on the first page. Didn't come up on the second page. Didn't come up on the third page. We had to go to the Wall Street Journal website. Thankfully, we both have subscriptions and find it there.

This is true. That's why I'm so happy that Elon Musk has bought Twitter.

Is he still going through with it?

Oh, you know, he bought it. He already fired all the heads. I spoke today. I spoke on my radio show about my joy at all of these people being fired. Normally, I don't speak that way. I know you don't, because I don't want people to suffer. I want them to suffer. These people have so hurt this country, the people who run Twitter, Facebook, and the like. I want them to suffer because it's very rare in this world that there is justice in this world. Usually you have to wait for God to do it in the next world. So the fact that they're all fired— of course they have millions and millions of dollars, they're not hurt, but at least they have no position of authority now. Maybe they'll all move to Google, maybe they'll all move to Facebook. Or YouTube. That's obviously a possibility, but they're not at Twitter. They can't continue to ruin the country. That people accepted the fact that a former president of the United States could not have a Twitter account— I know that is third world corruption, pure and simple. I want to tell you something that I don't think I've said to you, and I mentioned it on the radio show. It was very painful So in the synagogue that I founded along with two, two dear friends, we make a prayer for America. It's part of the service. And the last week, the last Sabbath that it was read, that begins with something to the effect, oh God, bless the United States of America A beacon of liberty in a darkened world. So do you know the story?

No, but I can anticipate what you're going to say.

It was not said. The reader, a dear friend of mine, the reader omitted it, and he was right. We're not a beacon of liberty anymore.

No, we're not.

Worse, do you know there was no country in the world world as, as, as destructive to children on this trans issue as America. England has basically shut down its operations in hospitals with regard to affirmative care to kids who say that they're the opposite sex. Norway, Sweden, Finland, Spain It's— they look at America as sick. These are the— and these are all liberal countries, not conservative countries. They look at us as sick, and they're right.

We don't live in the country that we think we live in anymore.

Well, we don't think we live in it. We don't live in the country that was all of American history. It was a beacon of freedom. Beacon of freedom. It is a beacon of corruption. That's why, by the way, the book that you cited to me that so moved me, that you loved of my books, Still the Best Hope— remember the subtitle about its American values, why the world needs American values, not America.

Oh, that was—

I was very, very clear about that.

One thing that we should really talk about, and we have talked about how it's unwise, and I believe you even said a sin to despair. I think you said in the Torah it's a sin to despair. But I have a family member who is very conservative, and he thinks like us. He's just brilliant, and I adore him. And he called me yesterday. I thought it was— it really broke my heart because I could understand what he was saying. He said, you know, Julie, some people can just ignore what's going on around us, how rapidly things are deteriorating in this country, but I can't, and it's really affecting my happiness. He just said, because look, you raise this question all the time. It's a really interesting one. Is it worse for those who knew an America and now see that it's gone? Or someone like me who, I actually would say I sort of knew an America, but most of my life I haven't known the one that you, My family member who I'm talking about, he knew a great America. And he just said, I feel like, he said, my parents have died. I've had other of our relatives really rapidly deteriorate mentally or physically. And he said, this is what it feels like watching this country. He said, I feel a similar kind of sadness as I felt when another family member died. And I understand, I do walk around or whenever I drive and I even just from work back to my apartment and see the homeless people on the side of the street and the litter and all these people walking around on their cell phones and there was a storage ad the other day and it said like they store, we store, he store, like they were doing different pronouns with the word store for storage. It just feels like everywhere you turn. There's another signal that America is again not the country that it once was. And I understand how it's really affecting his happiness because it's affected mine too.

The only solution in terms of personal happiness is to compartmentalize. I learned this from the sinking of the Titanic. The compartments were supposed to be independent. So that if water entered one, it didn't enter another, but the compartments broke down. That's what I do. I fight and fight and fight, and then I enjoy my personal life.

And another thing I, I've been thinking about recently is that it's really, really hard for me to be friends with people who would vote Democrat, and I remember I was talking with someone about it recently and they said to me, boy, isn't that sad that a friendship has to end over politics? And my response is, it's not really politics anymore.

It's not politics.

It's not politics.

It cheapens the issue.

It does cheapen, and it's what you said, it literally is Western civilization on the table. It's not Democrat or Republican on the table or left and right. That's not what it is anymore.

Of course not. We were Republican or Democrat, could always be a friend with someone who was. But right now we believe if you vote Democrat, you, you may— you're not consciously doing this unless you're a leftist, but a liberal voting Democrat is voting for the party that is destroying my country. If I'm wrong, then I deserve to be punished. But if I'm right, then you understand.

Well, they deserve to be punished.

Well, that's right. Okay, the President of the United States has an— on national television has an interview with a man who says he's a woman to promote this among young people. I know, 300,000 kids, 17— what is it, 17 years old to 20, or 17 to 25? 300,000 in 2020. twice the number as in 2017. And now this is 2022— say that they're transgender. Every one of them is a tragedy. It is a tragedy. If you deny that that is a tragedy, you're sick.

I know.

Well, that you can't be the opposite sex. You cannot be one. You can look like one, act like one, take their name. You can have a different pronoun, but you are not it. It is a tragedy if you think that.

I know. And I've been thinking a lot about the people who, the kind of middlemen in this who know that so much in this country has gone awry and yet, excuse me, they're not standing up. And I, again, I've said many times, I understand I get paid to espouse my values, but this is a do or die situation that we're in. And I was also thinking, you know, It's not just that we should stand up, it's our obligation to in a free society. If you read the founding, if you read the Federalist Papers, they talk extensively about the way that they designed the government is, and certainly this is in the Constitution, is such that the people, the government is by the people and for the people by the consent of the people. And we have an obligation to intervene and speak up if that government is no longer functioning by those standards, by the standards that we all agreed to when we signed the contract.

You're acknowledging to fight?

Yes, we do.

Like they did on Normandy Beach?

Yes, we— the Constitution was the contract that we all signed. I mean, not all of us directly, obviously, but we as a nation signed to become a union. And part of that contract is that we are obligated to stand up if it goes awry. So I view that I view my standing up, to use very corporate terms, as a fulfillment of my contract.

Be very interesting to see what the elections bring.

Oh, I'm telling you, again, this is a very unpopular thing for me to say, but I have to speak the truth. After reading Molly Hemingway's Rigged, I am very skeptical that we can run elections without major improprieties.

Well, two things that have nothing to do with cheating, theoretically. The destruction of Election Day by the left— there's no longer an Election Day, there's an election 6 weeks, which is a tragedy and unfair and in itself corrupt. In Pennsylvania, they didn't see how bad the Democratic candidate is from his stroke, and half of them already voted before that debate ever took place.

It's evil.

It truly is evil. So they destroyed Election Day and they did another thing. I don't know why any honest liberal cannot acknowledge this. There is much, much greater chance of cheating with machines than with paper ballots. Why did they get rid of paper ballots? Answer that question. Yep.

And that's not even mentioning the media bias, which is—

No, nothing. Just mentioning 2 neutral facts.

Yep.

There's no longer an Election Day and we no longer have paper ballots. Why is that good for democracy, which they say the right threatens?

Well, this keeps me healthy. Seriously, this podcast does. I— when I was talking to that family member, I recognized how lucky I was because as much as this gets me down, this is so cathartic. And I feel like I'm moving the ball forward, even if it's just a quarter of an inch. So I recognize that I'm very lucky.

Next time we'll talk about your dating life. The, the monthly update. It may be short.

Well, maybe there is a monthly update.

Oh, that'll keep them coming.

You know, you know all my updates.

Well, I do, but they don't.

That's true. So he's going to feign like he doesn't know.

I won't feign. I just want to hear it from you.

Okay, that's a next time situation. But in the meantime, you can reach me at julie@julie-hartman.com. That's my email, and I really, really try to respond to as many of you as possible. But even if I can't, I read each one of them. And you can also follow us on social media @dennisjuliepod. That's on Instagram and Twitter. And Dennis and Julie Podcast on Facebook. And look out for Timeless, my new show, which is launching in 2 weeks.

That's exciting.

I know, and I'm right here, so you can't get rid of me. We share a set. I'm actually a little concerned when I start recording Timeless, if you're in the room, that I'm just gonna start laughing.

I think that's very healthy.

I may have to excommunicate you from your own set.

All right, everybody, see you next week.

Bye, everyone.

You got time, you're on the man bay, and everybody wants the same. Everybody wants the same.