026: Understanding the Mind of Your Teenage Son | Sacaiah Shaw

Grab a cup of tea or listen as you go, ladies. This is your hour with Dr. Zoe, your life and relationship coach. With encouragement, on-point insight, inspiring guests, health tips, and advice, Dr. Zoe helps busy women keep their mind in the game by redefining your superwoman. You're listening to the Dr. Zoe Show.

Hi there, it's Dr. Zoe, your life and relationship coach. If you are a woman, you've come to the right place because I believe that every woman has a superpower. And my job, my passion as your life coach is to help you find it, embrace it, and share it with the world. And ladies, stop trying to be perfect. Instead, work on thriving in the beautiful chaos that is your life. Yes, I said that. Beautiful chaos. You want some encouragement? Connect with me by texting the word join to 38470. That's the word join to 38470, and you'll get on my newsletter where I send out a lot of encouragement to all you superwomen out there holding it down. So I always start off my shows with a superwoman win and a superwoman bomb. This week, my superwoman win was that I took the time to to succinctly explain to my 11-year-old daughter why she isn't getting a phone. I had this epiphany while I was at the gym that sometimes we have knowledge as parents that we don't always pass on to our kids. So we get busy in our lives doing and taking care of them and meeting their needs and our work, and we don't always take the time to pour our wisdom and all the stuff we have in our brain into them. So my daughter wanted a cell phone. I said, no, not yet. And I gave kind of a peripheral explanation, but I realized that I really needed to take a few more minutes and clearly explain to her the logic behind my thoughts about cell phones, their purposes, the motivation for me to let them have one. And so now I'm really— and not really now, but I just have to remind myself that I'm purposing myself to share my thoughts and my deeper beliefs so that they can have a full understanding instead of just a mom says no, or even a mom says yes. And that's a big one. I want them to understand the deeper reasons behind my yeses, why I'm telling them, yes, it's okay to do that. I think they already think that I talk too much, so they might not be so happy with that. But I'm keenly aware of how little time I have left with my older ones. And I feel that there's so much information and wisdom and my beliefs to pass on. And so what a blessing to be a parent. So that's my mom win of the week is just having that ability or light bulb to really go back and make sure that I'm pouring myself into my kids. So today's topic today, well, I'm saying getting inside the mind of your teenager. Everybody else says the topic should be getting to understand your teenager. Is that what you said, Troy? Understanding your teenager, getting to know your teen. Yes. And that's important, getting to know your teen. But really, I want to go a little bit deeper and see if we can understand some of the thoughts and motivations behind teens. So for all of you moms struggling to communicate with your kid, I want you to just feel my virtual hug right now. And I'm excited to have my son, Sakaya, my 16-year-old son, on the show, and we're going to be talking all about getting inside your teen's mind. and how to best communicate with them, especially your teen son. And today I am going to— in case you did not notice, I did not talk about my mom fail. I am going to let Sakai share my mom fail today. I have to admit, I am a little nervous about this. So welcome, Sakai.

Thank you. I feel very welcome.

Sakai is an actor and singer, and he is an all-around awesome kid. He is a junior in high school. And so go ahead, Kei. Can you share with them my mom fail of the week? He didn't tell me what he's going to say. I kept saying, let me know what you're going to say.

I think what I'm going to say is, well, I'm going to start off with I got my driver's license this morning.

Yes, yes. I was going to talk about that, but we'll talk about it now. Kei got his driver's license this morning. It was so— I think I was more nervous maybe than you were. Woohoo!

Oh yeah, I like that. I like that. The studio applauds.

He got his license. And for those listening on podcast, you might not hear the applause in the background, but there's applause going on right now in the background on the show. Makes me feel

special.

Yes, you are special. And he got his license today. I was taking pictures and videotaping as he's like driving off with the instructor. I was waiting for her to tell me to stop, but I'm so excited. My baby boy, he didn't want me to say that because he's now a big man. Kai is now a licensed driver, and I'm going to be talking with you ladies a little bit later in the show about must-have conversations with your son as they start to go away from you and be more on their own. So anyway, Kai, my fail. I'm ready.

All right, so as I said, I got my license, and I've kind of been like hyping myself up this week, like talking about it and getting into it. And I think your fail is that you didn't let me have it. Like every time I would be like, Yes, I'm gonna have my license. I can't wait. You like have to peek your head around the corner and go, but you're not going to be free. But you have to know that anytime you do anything, I got to know about it. And I'm just like, can I have it? Can I have this? Like real quick? Can I just have this in my head?

You are right about that. You are so right. And you did tell me that too, when you were saying something like, oh, I wonder what the very first thing is I'm going to do. And what did I say? Well, first you need to understand that you need to always ask permission.

You can't do anything by yourself. You have to let me know what it is. And as for the first thing, there was like a wah wah wah.

Right. Listening on podcast, there's the wah wah wah going. Okay. So you're right. I will accept that and honor that. That is my mom fail. And the reason why, and I know you moms out there already know, but I'm going to explain to you, Kai. The reason why is because As soon as you start talking about leaving and doing something on your own, every like mom vibration in my brain starts going off and I go straight to worrying like, okay, let me make sure I— let's make sure he knows this. Let me make sure I told him about this. Maybe I forgot to tell him this. And so that's what happened. And so instead of me being present with you and your excitement about being free and driving off, I go straight into mom brain worry. And so I apologize for that. And I am very excited. I was just texting my friends saying, Kai got his license. And I actually said, I'm so excited for him. And I'm a little bit sad as a mama. It's bittersweet. And I told you that before because—

I remember that. Yeah.

What did I— I caught— oh,

tell that story. It was drama practice for a play I'm about to do. I'm about to be the lead Coalhouse in Ragtime at my school. And my friend Aubrey was going to take me home. And I called her and I was like, hey, could you pick me up? Because I got there late.

No, wait, we have to fix that. Okay, you got there at like 1 o'clock.

I got there at like 3:30.

10 minutes later.

I got there at 3:30 and ended at 4.

Right, but it was supposed to be like a 3-hour practice.

Because I thought it started at 3, but it started at 1.

Right, so drop him off, turn around, start my errands, get a call. Mom, I got to be picked up right now. Okay, go from there.

I called her, I said, hey, I got to pick you up right now. And she instantly goes into this whole complaining, you always want me to pick you up, this, this, and that. And then I said, okay, it's okay. Because my friend Aubrey came and she said, I can take you home. And I said, for sure. I called her back. I said, hey, it's okay. Aubrey's gonna take me home and everything. And she was like, oh, okay. I just want— and I was like, no, no, no, it's okay. I've just got a couple more days and you don't have to pick me up again. About 30 minutes later, she calls me back.

No, probably like 30 seconds.

I was thinking about what you just said about not having to pick you up anymore. And it made me really sad. And then I had to sit here on the phone listening to her be sad for like—

That is so true. And the thing is, and I explained this to you too, I wasn't complaining about picking you up. I was complaining that you weren't planning accordingly. So I have this idea, I'm going to drop you off and then I'm going to pick you up 3 hours later. And often I'll get a call from you 15 minutes later. Oh, Mom, I forgot this. You got to bring this back. Oh, it's the wrong time. I need you to turn around in the middle of everything you're doing. And come pick me up. That's what I was complaining about.

I would like to add, I get my forgetfulness from you.

Well, that, okay. That's true. That is true. But anyway, when you said that, don't worry, Mom, you're not going to have to pick me up in 2 more days. It did. It just, it was like a knife went through my heart and I was like, oh my gosh, he's not going to need me anymore. He's not going to need me to pick him up in just a couple more days. My baby's growing up. And yes, it did. I got pretty sad, but that's, you know, part of momhood. That's why I'm giving you moms virtual hugs right now, because this is difficult stuff. This is difficult

stuff. It's fun.

I know it's not difficult for the kids. I remember being a teenager. I'm like, why is my mom crying when I'm leaving for college? Why is she crying when I get married and go off? This is like exciting. I'm going on an adventure and she's boohooing. Now I know, I know why she's boohooing. Thank you for sharing your mom fail. I appreciate that. I accept it. And today we are going to be talking all about getting into the mind of your teenage son. And I know, Kai, you do not speak for all teenagers, but today you are going to be kind of a teen ambassador. And so I want to thank you for being willing to come on the show and speak for teenage boys out there who might not always have a voice.

I got you guys.

I

mean, you're probably not listening.

But this is real— really though, this is for the moms. It's for the moms to understand, how can I best communicate with my teen son? So what are the things that are important to teens that you feel adults just don't get?

Well, that you guys don't get is that all adults always say, I remember being a teenager. That's like the token line. I remember what it's like. I remember what it was like. Yeah, I'm just sitting here like in my head Could be. I think the main thing that adults don't get is that we don't have as much control as we would like to have over anything. Like, we got no control over literally anything. And adults are always over here saying, I remember what that was like. But you've had control since you moved out. And I haven't moved out yet. So I still have no control. So like, you're saying it from a standpoint of where you got it. And I'm still here without it.

Yeah, it's difficult. I get it. And you know what? You're right. Because honestly, we do remember. We remember how that felt. The problem, and this is the whole conundrum of communication between parents and kids, is that we remember what it was like. We remember all those feelings that you had, but we're coming from a different place now of having responsibility for you. And of course, we think about the things we did as teens too. And that scares us because we don't want you guys to do the things that we thought that we did when we were teens, because we want you to avoid those mistakes. And so I think that we say that, Kai, because we're trying to get you to understand that we do get you because we remember. But even though we remember what it was like, we still have to make decisions that you're not going to like. So what, what's a better way that we could approach you rather than saying, I remember when I was a teenager, I remember what that felt like?

Okay, well, like the way I see, I remember what it was like. Don't worry, you'll get it soon. I kind of see it as like, basically, okay, imagine 2 little kids. One has ice cream and one doesn't. And then one kid goes like, oh, you don't have any ice cream. Don't worry, the truck will be back next week. And then just walk away.

Aww.

That's kind of how I see it. And then I'm just like, well, I mean, okay. But like, I don't know, I think a better way to approach it would just like not like just kind of pass it off. Because like the kid who has ice cream doesn't care if the other kid doesn't have ice cream. He's just like, oh no, no, I feel you. I'm sorry you don't have any ice cream. And just go on, enjoy his ice cream. But I think it would be like better to, I don't know, just like—

Acknowledge that it sucks right now that you don't have ice cream.

Yeah.

And that it sucks that next week means nothing to you because you don't have ice cream right now. Okay, moms, did you hear that? So they don't want to hear you say what you think is going to help. Like, I've been there. Because I think that helps. They don't want to hear that. They want to hear, you know what, this is horrible and this sucks and I'm really sorry. And I know whatever, you know, if I say you're going to get it later, it doesn't necessarily matter to you because right now, right here in the present, this is hard and I'm just going to be here with you in this hard, sucky place and be present. Is that, is that better?

Yeah.

Okay. Okay. This is Dr. Zoe and we are having some interesting fun talk with my 16-year-old son. Zakia about understanding and getting to know your teen better. We will be back in just a minute.

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Hi there, it's Dr. Zoe, and we are back with my son Sekiya, and we are getting to know your teen, getting to understand the mind of your teen. I just can't help say it, I have to say it. So we're here with my son Sekiya. Hi, Kai.

Hi.

And we are talking all about teen stuff, and Kai just got his license today. Yay, congratulations! So Kai, well, actually, let's talk about what we were talking about a little bit on the break. I was going to talk about it a little later, but We were talking about approaching your teen because Kai and I were talking about this on the way here because he just got his license, and in my head I'm thinking, okay, he's gonna be, you know, out by himself. And I talked to you about, okay, if you do something stupid, right, you can call me immediately. I will not be upset, right?

No, see, that's That's like a loaded gun for me. Don't worry, don't worry. I won't get mad. Okay, I'll tell you what went on. See, like, your whole thing is like, maybe you won't get mad right then. And then a week later, you'll come back with it. And then, okay, so I wasn't mad then. But now I got you.

Now I got you. Really, I got you. And so here's the conversation we were having, because Troy just said that, and he has, I have to say, he has a 6-year-old daughter, not a teenager. And so Troy was saying that he's told his daughter, if you ever come to me and say, I need to talk to you, that whatever you say after that, you will not get into trouble.

I really like that.

And I do, I like that as well. However, and I guess this is the thing I need to talk about, is because I told Kai, I won't be mad at you, I won't be upset, I'll come get you, no questions asked. And then Kai said, will I get in trouble? And so my answer is, well, I don't know if you'll get in trouble, but there will be consequences. To action. So that's the question is, what does that mean? Because so if your daughter says, Dad, I'm having sex and smoking pot with this boy, that's what I needed to talk to you about. So you're like, okay, you're not in trouble because you came and told me I needed to talk. Does that mean that she can now go do that? Okay, so that's the difference. Yeah. Because a teenager— hold on— a teenager understands if I say you're not in trouble, but I don't want you Hanging out with him anymore. You see that as what? You just got in trouble?

No, that's not trouble. Trouble means— first thing I think trouble means for Zoe is the same thing it means in my head. You're about to yell.

I don't know if that's true.

You're about to get upset. But it's the thing of getting upset.

No, no, see, and that's why I said your daughter's 6, because I think as a 6-year-old, you're probably right. But that's why I want Kai to chime in on this. If there's a consequence, does that mean the same to you as getting in trouble? Exactly. And so that's why, Troy, I said, but wait, because that's why I say I won't be mad, I won't yell, I won't even ask questions then. But if there's something that I have to prevent you from experiencing that's harming you, there may be a consequence even though you— I won't be mad and angry.

Good point.

Troy is chiming in now because this is a deep conversation. He has got a 6-year-old daughter. And that is the thing, and I think that is the conundrum too that parents get into, because we want to say you will not get into trouble. And the question is, what does trouble mean? And so that is why I was telling Kai, look, you do something stupid, you call me immediately. I will be there. I will come pick you up, no questions asked. I will not be angry. We might have to deal with whatever in the world you did afterwards. I am not saying there will never be consequences for your actions. But I will be there every single moment and you don't have to worry about me being angry in the second. But I'm glad that we're clarifying that because Sekiya, what you were saying is that the consequence to you feels like punishment, right? Like you are in trouble.

Well, a consequence is punishment.

Exactly. So parents, when you think about that, I want you to recognize because you think, oh, I'm going to be that parent that tells my kid you can tell me anything and you're not going to be in trouble. But what you have to realize as a parent is that if there's a consequence that has to happen, the kid's gonna feel like, I just got in trouble and you tricked me. Someone just texted me in like, if I pick Kai up from a crack house, he's not in trouble, but I'm not letting him go back. And that is true.

Not in trouble.

And so that's what—

You're not going back to the crack house.

You're not going back to the crack house. And so that's a conversation. And so Kai, I know that's so hard because like I said, I'm trusting you, right? I'm giving you a car. I'm giving you free license to go out. And I want you to trust me that if anything happens, you can call me. And so how, how do we navigate that? What does a parent need to do to make you feel really comfortable that you really can trust?

I don't really know how to answer that. I'm not sure.

Because when you hear consequence, you think punishment, correct?

Well, most of the time, yeah.

And I guess that's why my question is, what do they consider getting in trouble? Because what we consider in trouble, they don't consider. So I think as parents, you need to make sure that you're paying attention to what that means and ask your kid, you know, so that they don't feel like you've lied to them.

Well, yeah, because parents don't get in trouble, so they don't like really understand the concept of trouble.

Well, see, that's not true. We do get in trouble. Like, I got a traffic ticket. Remember I got my ticket? I got— that was trouble. And that is the thing is that the trouble changes as you grow older. You know, it does not go away because we break laws, and actually our trouble is bigger. I mean, we can go to prison, right? We can get locked up forever for doing something really wrong. Oh, my gosh. But as a mom, of course, I want to make sure that he knows that he can call me anytime, that I am there for him, that no matter what in the world he does, that I am always there. And so, and just like someone else just wrote, everyone is talking about this, it is a law of physics, right? Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. And that is The reality of being an adult is that there are consequences to your action. But I think as, as moms, we want you to know that we want to be there to help you and save you if anything happens, and that we want you to always feel our love even though you do something dumb. Anything you want to chime in there, Kai? Because I still feel like that whole thing of, if you need something, call me, Mom. Well, I'm going to get in trouble if things aren't quite wrapped up, and maybe it never will be. And that's the little bit of gap between, you know, Parents and kids.

Okay, well, I'm just gonna go back to the consequences and troubles are 2 different things.

Because

I mean, I'm saying like this, if I get in trouble, say I get into a fight at school or something like that, right? I'm gonna come home and I'm gonna tell you first, Mom, I got into a fight at school. I'm suspended for 2 weeks.

Right.

Your response is then gonna be, well, he came to me first, so he's not in trouble, but you lost your car for 2 weeks. And I'm asking like, Where's the line of consequence and trouble? What's the difference?

What's the difference? Okay, no, I think that's a good question. What's the difference between consequence and trouble? I don't know. I'm trying to think of that because I think of trouble as like, I'm gonna be super angry. And maybe I'm thinking trouble is like a 6-year-old would think of trouble, and you're thinking of trouble as like, if I have a consequence, then I'm in trouble, right?

Well, I mean, if you're talking about trouble as trouble without consequence because you're saying trouble as just you yelling at me.

Mm-hmm.

And personally, the yelling I'm fine with. That's like just how you learn. It's the consequence part that I see as trouble because the consequence is what like changes something. The consequence is what like takes a toll on your everyday life or something you have to do because say I do something, you yell at me, that's your Person in trouble, but I'm okay with that. 'Cause like, but then if you yell at me and then take something else, that's something else like affects me physically. So that's my definition of trouble. So your definition of trouble is yelling. My definition of trouble is consequences.

Got it. Okay. Well, so then I guess what I'm saying is that there has to be a realization that there are consequences for actions. So no matter what in the world you do in the world, whether it's with me or anybody else in the world, that there are consequences for action. But as a parent, and I think as moms, what you want is for your kids to come to you so that you can help them deal with the consequences, so that you can make sure that they don't go to somebody else to try to fix something that might not have their best interests in mind. And I think that's probably what it's more about, is that we will help you. And if there are natural consequences that are a result of it, we'll be there for you, but come to us first because it will be easier for you if you come to us first. And I think the problem is, is that that's how we tend to think with a different adult brain. And yes, it would be awesome if our kids thought that too. But I think the whole point of this show is for you parents to understand what your kids are actually thinking and why they are telling you things and aren't telling you things because of what these things mean, right, Kai? Trouble is consequence. You don't want a consequence. You want to be able to do things, tell your parents, and then be like, cool, go on.

Well, when parents— I see the light bulb go off when you said the consequence thing.

So this is Dr. Zoe, and I'm here having some difficult teen conversations with my son, Sekiya. We'll be back in just a minute.

People ask me, how do you have so much energy? I am not a coffee drinker, but I love the benefits of matcha green tea. More antioxidants than coffee and a smooth energy, not the jittery kind, that lasts me all day long. Perfect for you super moms too. I have searched the world over for that perfect matcha for my smoothies, and I have found it at Kiss Me Organics. You can get it too at kissmeorganics.com. Enter the promo code DRZOE, D-R-Z-O-E, for 10% off and free shipping. Experience the smooth, healthy, organic energy of matcha green tea. KissMeOrganics.com.

Hi, it's Dr. Zoe. We are back talking about getting to know your teen and really understanding the mind. And that was the whole point of why I wanted to do this show is so that as you communicate with your son, and we're talking about teenage sons right now because that's who's here with me, my teenage son. is that you understand what they're thinking and what they're feeling when you're trying to communicate with them. And we were talking about consequences and telling your kid, you know, you can come and talk to me and I won't be upset or there won't be, you won't be punished and what the difference between that was. And Troy was talking about consequences too and that the consequence, you know, is for correction. And although, yeah, that is true, but the reality is that the consequence is a direct result of an action. And I think that's something that kids need to understand. It's not, necessarily a punishment. The consequences are going to happen in real life, and that's a direct result of your action. And so the other thing, and this, Kai, I guess I'm talking to you about this one, is I think the feeling that parents have is when you go to another friend, if something's going on, right? So something's going on in your life, you've done something stupid, or something dramatic is happening, and you go to another friend, we feel like It's the blind leading the blind. You're going to another kid who really doesn't know that much, and you're seeking advice from them instead of seeking advice from us.

Okay, well, I don't see— when I go to my friends to like ask them to help me with a problem, I don't see it as them leading me. I just like try to figure out what they do to see if I can like get another perspective on the matter while still like getting it from my point of view. Because if I come to you You're not at my same point of view. You're from the other point of view that like, I already know what you're gonna do. I already know what you're gonna say. I'm trying to go and see what someone who has my same perspective would do. And then I'm trying to like take those 2 different— like it's the same perspective but at a different angle. It's like I'm trying to see what they're gonna do. And then I think about what I'm gonna do. And then like out of these different options, I'm gonna like concoct the best answer in my mind.

Right. And so, like I said, when I hear that, I think of the blind leading the blind. And so my question then is, do you value the wisdom of adults who you feel maybe don't see your perspective?

Yes, I do. But at the same time, while I do value the wisdom, they're still not seeing from the perspective that I have. So even if I try to explain it to you, you're just going to keep coming back with the same wisdom from the same perspective, and I don't have The answer that I'm looking for. And so why do you think that—

We give answers to questions that you're not asking.

Yeah.

And so why do you think we don't have that same perspective?

Because we're simply just not in the same situation that they're in.

And the fact that we have been doesn't mean anything.

Well, I was too once, but I don't remember that.

You don't remember? So you can't help out a 10-year-old or a 6-year-old because you're not a 10 or a 6-year-old now?

Well, it depends. I mean, like, if a 6-year-old comes to me and asks me how do I deal with my friends at school, I'm at school so I can help them with that.

Okay.

But if a 6-year-old comes to me and says, I don't know, said something about, oh, I don't know, but I don't know, like 6-year-old, like what's a 6-year-old problem? What's a 6-year-old problem?

Well, it's probably gonna—

There you go.

Oh, okay.

If a 6-year-old comes to me and gets mad, my dad's trying to make me finish my food. What are you gonna do? I'll say, okay.

So you can't, you can't get her perspective, even though you remember what it was like to be forced to eat junk you didn't want to eat.

Well, you said, because, okay, look, I remember what it was like. I remember back when I was little, I used to scoot all my food to the side of the plate so it would look like I was done. But now I just eat my food because, I mean, I mean, I remember what it was like, right? But my perspective has just changed as I've grown.

Because, you know, you just gotta eat it sometimes.

And it's the difference between, like, say if I went from right now to being 32 with kids, like, I'd still remember my perspective from now and still be able to tell them my perspective from now. But as I'm growing up, changing my perspective as I grow,

right,

it's reasoning in my head why I'm changing my perspective so I don't have the old perspective that I used

to have. Okay, I get it. And so a 6-year-old would feel like, you don't get me. Exactly. And although you do get the 6-year-old because you remember, you don't really get it because you like to just eat your food.

Exactly. Because you know how I've had conversations with Sully?

Yeah, that's my 11-year-old daughter.

Yeah, she'll come to me and say, Mom won't let me have a phone. I'll be like, Mom didn't let me have a phone when I was your age either. But you don't understand. Nobody gets me. I get you. I was there, but I got a phone now. So—

and then I'll just—

OK, and so moms—

Sorry, I got to take a call real quick.

Right. And then also, I had somebody text in and say that, you know, obviously, Teenage sons have more than just one parent. And absolutely. And maybe we need to do another show at some point about teenage dads and their sons. But this, you know, this show is really about— because most of my audience is women. But if you are a man out there, I think it's the same information that you can take, really understanding what your kids are thinking when you're talking to them. And this has actually been really helpful for me because I think Kai made an excellent point That, you know, as he's talking to a 6-year-old, he can get it, but he doesn't feel it in quite the same way. But really what you're talking about, Kai, is maturity. You can look at their problem from a place of maturity and recognize what really has to be done, right? And so just like you were telling me, when you are a parent, you're going to be so much easier on your kid, right? You're going to kind of be chill, kind of let them do whatever they want to do. But if you take that same perspective of, like you said, the years that passed by, you can look and go, yeah, I remember. When I had to do that, when my mom did this, but you know what, you just got to do it, right?

That's true, and you might be right, and I'll let you know when I get there.

Yeah, well, I, I plan to be there, and I plan to be smiling at you and enjoying my grandchildren at that time. So, okay, let me ask you this, Kai. So parents freak out about sex, drugs, porn, and grades. What is your perspective about The freakout.

It's very unusual.

Why?

Well, I'm gonna go with grades first.

Okay, that's an easier topic.

Every time I come to you, like, okay, a couple months ago, back before I got my license, I was supposed to get my license in October, but I couldn't because my grades weren't like where they should have been. So I would come to Mom and I would like say my grades, I would have all A's, all B's, and then my math And chemistry would both be— so then I come to her, my chemistry would go up to a C. I'd go and be like, hey, my chemistry went up to a C, and I'd be excited. And then she'd say, great, but it shouldn't have got down in the first place. Oh, well, you know.

And Kai, you and I have had that conversation, and I don't know that I said those words, but I think that's what you heard for sure.

Well, it's like you might not be saying that, but that's what you're getting across.

For some reason, yeah, because You're right. So even though I was probably cognizant enough not to say those words, I think you still got that feeling. And yeah, I think that's a difficult thing that where parents are once again, that whole conundrum of we want— and we know your potential and we know what you can do and what's best. And so I forgot my question, but you were saying that's a difficult part about dealing with parents is that we want you to Or I should say I, because this is really talking about you and me there, right? Is that you want me to recognize and appreciate the gains that you do have instead of pointing out the places that you need to improve all the time, right?

Yeah.

Yeah, no, I think that's a good one because everybody needs encouragement. Everybody needs to be given a, you're doing a great job, and it's so important as parents for us to find those places where our kids are doing a good job and making sure that we're acknowledging them, Because sometimes we are so focused on, okay, let me make sure I'm steering them this way. Let me make sure that this is covered and they're doing this instead of really taking the time to acknowledge, okay, hey, you're doing really good here. I'm super proud of you and you're doing awesome. Right, Kai? Yeah. You need more of that. This is a good one for mama today too. So this is Dr. Zoe. I had so much I wanted to talk about today, but we are just, we're going. So we're gonna come back and we're going to keep talking. If I get the time, I'm gonna talk about best ways to approach your kid. But we're talking with my son Sakai. I think this is great information, getting into the head of your teenage son, really understanding how to best communicate with them. We'll be back in just a minute.

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Hi guys, it's Dr. Zoe back talking to my son Sekiya Shaw about being a teenage boy and dealing with your parents. And this is just encouragement for you moms and really just some insight into, you know, the mind of what a teenager hears when you're talking to them. Because it's like the reality, the reality is that it doesn't matter what you say in communication. And this is communication with anybody. The only thing that matters is what's heard. And so it's so important, and this is actually a reality check for me today, is to check what do you hear when I say that? Because I think I'm communicating one thing, and then your teen hears something totally different. And so we got to check that out. We got to find out what are you hearing when I say this? When I say consequence, what do you hear? So I was just asking Kai about those difficult conversations: sex, drugs, porn, and grades. Of course he took grades because that's an easier conversation. But, and I asked you this before, Kai, what is the best way for a parent to approach you to talk about things like sex, drugs, and porn? Because, and we already talked about grades a little bit, because those things are important topics that we parents worry about. And yeah, they're the freakout topics because we love you guys so much and we just want the best for you in

your life. Well, I kept saying before that there isn't a best way. There really isn't.

Uh-huh.

Like, I mean, I, I just don't think you should get mad. Like, 'cause like, first of all, you were the one who wanted to know. Second of all, uh, uh-huh. Second, I don't think, I don't, I think you should like listen to the first answer. 'Cause like a lot of the stuff, and sometimes dad would do this too, like he'd come up to me and he asked me, he'd be like, just, hey, like nonchalant, like, you'd be like, hey, have you had sex? And I'd answer, like, this was a while ago. I, I answered him. I said, no. And he goes like,

Okay, so you're seeing the questioning kind of look in, in the eye.

And then, are you sure? All right. And then just kind of forget it and it's over.

But that was the conversation.

And that was a pretty easy conversation. Right.

Okay, but you, you know who I am and the differences between dad and mom. And so the conversations between you and I have been A little different, correct? And something that— well, go ahead, I'm not going to talk to you.

Oh, I didn't know where you were going with that.

Well, I think because before the, the radio show we were talking about this, and you basically said that parents need to kind of just not ask those questions, right? That would be better if we didn't have those conversations. Am I correct?

Yeah.

Okay. And so I think that parents need to understand that that's the way kids feel. Do you think that is pretty much the way all teens feel?

I can 100% say that.

Okay, there you go. So that is information for you, and maybe you knew this already from being a teenager, and the reality is it is a conversation that they do not want to have. It is uncomfortable. Nobody wants to have it, and so you have to recognize that that is the case. But also, the reality is it is a conversation that needs to be had, because when we go back to the blind leading the blind, that is not where you want all of your kids' information to come from. is somebody else who doesn't care about them, who isn't an adult, who doesn't love them, who doesn't have the same beliefs that you have. And so it's still so important, just like I talked about at the beginning of the show, that we pour our beliefs, our wisdom into our kids, even though they don't want to have the conversation. And I think it's okay to start out saying, I know you don't want to have this conversation. Is that okay to start out like that, Kai?

Well, after that, I'll just like tune out.

Okay, so then what would be the best thing?

I know you don't want to hear me say this, I'm gonna be like, you right, and I'm gonna turn off.

So then what would be the best way? Because it has to happen. And I think that's the reality, is that I know as a kid you feel like, I don't want to talk to you guys about this stuff. But as an adult, remember that you're 16, the viewpoint with the 6-year-old, right? These are conversations that have to happen. And so here are— I'm going to run off, and then I have a quick question because we are running out of time. So I'm going to run off some of the best ways, and this is research-based, of course, to communicate with your teenage son. And so one of them is to give advance notice. Now, Kai's saying, don't give me advance notice, right? Because giving me advance notice is going to shut me off.

Oh, well, I'm not saying like— I'm just saying don't come up and say, all right, I'm going to make you talk about this. You don't want to hear it, but you got to, so sit down.

And so what if we said, OK, listen, We're gonna, you know, we're gonna talk about sex after dinner. So just letting you know. Or no, that doesn't work. Okay. Okay.

It just doesn't work. There's no way.

So the no advance notice, just like—

It doesn't flow with conversation. You can't just be like, all right, so how was your test? And they'll be like, oh, it was good. All right. When was the last time you had sex? It just doesn't flow with conversation.

Okay. So then Maybe no advance notice, just go ahead and just start the conversation.

Yeah, sure.

Okay, well, here's some other advice. Feed him. Feed your teenage son first before you have a conversation, because if they're hungry, they're distracted and not going to be paying attention. And that actually reminds me of today on the way here. We were talking and you kept saying, I am hungry, I want to stop and get something to eat. Did you feel better after you ate? Good. Okay, so the other one is ditch the lecture, and I think Probably you've talked a little bit about this today. Oh, Kai's raising his hand. Yes, yes, ditching the lecture. What do you have to say about that?

I hear enough of that at school. I don't want to hear when I get home.

Okay, okay. And so condensing your conversation into a short list of important points and allowing them to respond to the points, maybe, and trying as best you can to not talk at but talking with and asking opinions about. So Not how do you feel maybe right now, but how do you feel about this? And then controlling your emotions. And mamas, oh goodness, I know this is a hard one because there are so many times that your kid says something, especially when you have a teenager, and you do want to freak out. You do want to be like, what? You are screaming it in your head. And I have to tell you, there are so many times that that happens and I am like telling myself, don't freak out, don't freak out, don't freak out. Let's just talk about this.

Like what? I want to know now.

You know, I will tell you, like you told me, that somebody at your school had herpes. And I was like, what?

When did I say that?

I'm not saying any names at all, but you told me that.

I don't remember that.

Okay, well, maybe I don't remember, it was 9th, 10th grade. You told me that. And my reaction was to start freaking out. And just little things. I mean, anytime a kid talks about really adult things or things that are going on in their life, you told me about that, that everybody found out, everybody was talking about it at school or something like that. I don't know who it was. I'm not saying any names, but it was information that you gave me. Now you remember? There, see the light bulbs going on? Okay. And so that was like a freakout moment for me, but I didn't— I really think I calmed and I was like, oh, really? Interesting. Tell me a little bit more about that. Do you remember that? You don't remember it? Okay. So then I did a good job because I didn't freak out, right? So anyway, my point is, is that your kids are gonna say stuff that they see and they hear, and it's gonna make you wanna freak out. But you do have to work on controlling your emotions because they feel that and they see that and it's gonna shut them down immediately. Another good one for boys especially is don't just sit in the room and stare at them in the face and talk. Walk and talk, move and talk, talking in the car. Times when you're not just directly staring at them can help them open up a little more. And communicating indirectly, same thing, not necessarily just staring them down and demanding answers. And also using physical examples. So if their room is a mess or something's going on, instead of just saying, your room's almost always a mess, you can actually pick something up and say, hey, this doesn't belong here, can you put it Here instead, and also be aware of your son's innate competitiveness. And what this means is that you can challenge them. You can recognize, okay, you know what? Boys tend to be competitive. I think girls are competitive. I'm super competitive too. But you can use that and actually challenge them to do some things. And finally, allow time for follow-up. So many boys take hours, days sometimes to really after you've approached them about something to think about it. Girls are kind of like blah blah blah blah blah blah. Guys process it a little more, kind of have to go into a cave. And so allow them time for that. Don't always demand a response or demand an answer. So last but not least, Kai, and man, I feel like I'm, I've been on the grill today. I'm just going to ask you, what's the worst and the best? We're going to look some positive here too. Part of having a mom that's a therapist.

You're a therapist? No, I'm kidding. Um, the worst. The first thing you do whenever you meet any of my friends, I don't know if you noticed it, but whenever you meet any of my friends, the first thing you do is like grill them. Like, like you just judge them and like maybe you're not—

I don't verbally grill them at all. But in your head, in your head, analyzing them.

And then when we get home, when we get home, you look and you go like, I don't like them, or you can't hang out with them, or what's that kid's problem, or something like that. And then that's just like, it turns me off that

You feel like you can see me analyzing them when somebody comes up? Okay, I'll give you that because I think I analyze everybody. And so, you know, we might have to do a part 2 of this because we are definitely running out of time, but give me one positive, one good thing about having a mom as a therapist.

Uh, you talk to other people and get other ideas of like different I don't know.

Right. Yes. I talk to ideas and I get things of different kinds of stuff. Wonderful. Thank you so much, Sakaya, for coming on the show and being vulnerable and allowing us to talk to you and ask the difficult questions. If you are just tuning in, this is Dr. Zoe, and I am your life and relationship coach. And you can tune in every week on Tuesdays from 12 to 1 Pacific, 3 to 4 Eastern at LA Radio Now. For those who can't always listen live, check out reruns of my show on iTunes, Google Play, Libsyn, and YouTube. For I am your life and relationship coach. I help sometimes struggling superwomen keep their mind in the game by redefining your superwoman. If you know a friend who may benefit from any of our topics, please spread the love and share my show. And if you like my show, please show me some love with some stars. Connect with me at drzoeshaw.com or any of my social medias at the handle Dr. Zoe Shaw. Join my free newsletter and get a free copy of 30 Minute Life Transformation: The Secret to Getting Stuff Done by texting the word join to 38470. I look forward to speaking with you wonderful ladies on social media after the show. Have a super week.

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