Dating Successfully as a Single Mom | Dr. Duana Welch

Grab a cup of tea or listen as you go, ladies. This is your hour with Dr. Zoe, your life and relationship coach. With encouragement, on-point insight, inspiring guests, health tips, and advice, Dr. Zoe helps busy women keep their mind in the game by redefining your superwoman. You're listening to the Dr. Zoe Show.

Good afternoon or evening or whatever time it is wherever you are listening. This is Dr. Zoe, and I apologize, we got started a little late today, technical difficulties. We have our guests from Florida, I believe, and hopefully our audio will be good. But I'm Dr. Zoe, and I usually give this crazy long introduction, but I was working out a few days ago and I was listening to my podcast because that's what I do. I listen to all the podcasts I love when I work out, and I was thinking, will she just shut up and get on with the show? And then I realized, okay, wait, I can fix that. So I'm fixing it. So if you're listening for the first time, and you want to find out what my show is all about, thanks for tuning in. It's a live radio show, and I also podcast it. You can hear my producer Troy Rawlings in the room. If you're a woman, trust me, you've come to the right place. I invite you to listen to my other episodes where I drone on and on about what this show is about and how you can get ahold of me. If you're a guy, and especially if you love a woman, I'm sure there's relatable stuff here. Maybe not today, because we're going to be talking about single women and dating and maybe perimenopause, but certainly on other days. So welcome. I'm excited to have our guest, Dr. Dwayna Welch, author and coach who applies social science research to your love life. We're talking today about dating as a single mom, and man, this is going to be good. Duana, welcome.

Oh, thank you, Dr. Zoe. It's so nice to be on your show.

Thank you so much. And I'm glad that we can hear you. We had some technical difficulties. And you are from Florida, correct?

Actually, I was born in Texas. I went to get my PhD at the University of Florida. I taught in California, then I taught in Texas again, and now I'm in Oregon.

Oregon. That's right. That's right. I knew Florida was in there somewhere. So you are a coach and a social science expert, and you use your knowledge to help people succeed in their love life. Of course, like I said, we're going to be talking to single moms today about dating. Much love to you single moms out there. You often have it all on your shoulders and you're doing it all, and you guys are the real superwomen. And we're going to help you ladies out today. So you write about relationship advice based on science and not just opinion.

Yeah, when I was single— and by the way, I was a single mom myself, so these are topics that are very near and dear to me— I initially got interested in social And dating because I wasn't— as somebody once told me, my picker was broken.

Ah, yes.

I kept getting in these relationships that were just train wrecks and getting out of them, fortunately. But I started learning about social science of relating because I wanted to have better relationships. So, I didn't actually set out to be an author or a coach. That happened kind of collaterally after I had helped myself.

I see. Great. Okay, that makes, that makes a lot of sense. And your picker was broken. You don't know how many times I have heard that in my practice. My picker's just broken. And then a lot of single moms have this assumption that because it is that there's really no hope, and that they're always going to make the right choice. And so sometimes they just give up. So what kinds of things can you tell single moms to help them in that process?

Well, I'm going to say some stuff that may be a little bit uncomfortable for us to acknowledge, but—

That means it'll be good stuff.

To stay single as a mother is almost to guarantee, if not poverty, then a struggle. I was at a party the other night here in my neighborhood. I have the most partying neighborhood I've ever lived in right now. And this woman was saying how, you know, all the kids in our neighborhood do good things and they don't get in trouble and this, that, and the other. Before things got too smug, I said, well, as we look around, I'm the only person here who's gotten remarried. Everybody else is married to their first partner and they're raising their kids with that person, and they are able to give their children, therefore, the very best start emotionally and financially because they've got a marriage that is working out. And so, you know, unfortunately for those of us who've been single moms, that's not how it worked out for us. But I will tell you, a lot of women make the mistake of thinking, well, I'm just going to stay single forever and that's going to solve my problems. And they find that they're often very lonely. They find that they're often very put down by other people for being lonely. We're kind of told in the United States that we need to be islands unto ourselves, we need to be self-sufficient, and that if we need love, then we're weak. And, you know, really, all the attachment theory research— and there's so much of it, it's such a hot thing right now—

Mm-hmm. It shows that it's human to

need other people, and it's especially human for adults to need another adult. And by the way, it's especially human to be an adult who needs another adult while you're raising children. It's a really hard task. And as you know, I mean, kids are very expensive to raise, and it takes a lot out of you emotionally, and it's just— it's much harder than it needs to be if you're single. But the flip side of that is that if you don't pick even more carefully as a single person than you did as a single parent when— than you did when you were single and childless, your children can pay a very high price, up to and including their deaths. This is very serious stuff.

So are you saying that you think that all single women should get married?

No, no, I'm not saying that. I'm not going to make any broad pronouncement about what everybody should do other than that everybody should be kind and respectful even when things aren't going their way.

Okay, but that everyone should recognize, and I've said this before, especially talking to single women who have a desire to get married, but have this energy and have this kind of mantra of I don't need a man. I've talked before about that same topic that actually we do as humans, we do need connection, and that we were made, you know, to complement each other. And that it's okay to recognize and admit that, yes, We do need that partner. It's not weak to say that. So is that kind of what I'm hearing you say?

Yes, exactly. We really are hardwired to need other people, and we're hardwired especially to need a partner who witnesses the history of our lives and helps us kind of retro-parent ourselves, give us the love that maybe we didn't get when we were younger, and help us to give the next generation the love that they have to have to sustain themselves and Even if people never planned on having children, they would experience the need for intimate connection. And some people are given the gifts early in life of parenting that gives them a firm, I guess, launchpad to do that from.

Right, a good foundation.

Other people are not as fortunate, and we have to learn it. But it is learnable. That's the good news. It's learnable, and it's worth doing. And you're so correct that when people have an idea that, you know, I don't need a partner, I'm just going to do all of it on my own, unfortunately, if If that comes across as having a chip on your shoulder, it's going to be off-putting.

And I think it often does. And so the question is, how do women balance that when you don't have a partner and you have to do it all by yourself? You need to kind of lift yourself up. You need to shore yourself up. And sometimes those words in some ways feel comforting, that I don't need anybody, I can do it on my own, because you're self-encouraging, right? So how do you balance that part? Because you are doing it all on your own with recognizing and being open

I think we try to be the best people that we can be and have the fullest, richest lives with the most support that we can have while simultaneously treating our search for a mate with the same degree of seriousness we would give to looking for a job. Not waiting for it to happen, but actively participating in our own success and working towards it.

That's great. I love that. And I think that just like any journey, even on, you know, any journey that you're going on personally in your life, you have to love you now. You have to be willing to embrace and accept and love where you are, because this is the only life you have this moment, right? But then also be willing to be open and recognize that you do maybe want something different, or you are working towards change. And that's a balance, because you've got— it's a balance to be present and open, you know, at the same time. And I know a lot of the things that you talked about too is getting self-confidence in dating.

Yeah, I want to just go back, just backtrack to something you just said. Sure. While it's ideal to love ourselves at every moment, and that's definitely psychologically healthy to strive for that, what I see a lot in my practice with single parents and with just single people in general is people who feel like they should love themselves now, but they don't really, and they feel a lot of guilt and a lot of self-loathing. It's kind of ironic. I hate myself because I don't love myself.

Yes.

When I was a single parent, while I recognized intellectually that I had a lot to offer and that I was a worthwhile human being and I deserved to be on the planet and I was a good mom and all of that, I still didn't like being a single parent. I was still really unhappy. I was still really lonely. And I struggled with guilt about that. I think only the single parent kind of can understand, and maybe, maybe especially the single mom who's got If she has almost entire charge of the children, which was my case. I think that it's a club that we don't necessarily want to belong to, but it's a club where other people kind of don't totally get it, that we're probably not going to be completely happy with where we're at at the moment, and that's okay. Ironically, I think as soon as we acknowledge that we want something that we don't have yet, and it's okay to want that, that we're hardwired to want that, we still need love. I think that improves our lives, actually. It makes us more willing to do the hard work. The downside of encouraging people to be completely self-sufficient and to be happy where they are before they get that relationship is that that's not really how most people work. We're so hardwired for a need for connection, and single parenting is so lonely that it actually sometimes just winds up making us feel worse. It's okay to feel crap. While you're going through this.

Okay, I'm listening. And I'm, I'm just kind of processing what you're saying. Because I hear that it's okay. And what I'm hearing is it's okay to grieve. It's okay to grieve the loss of the dream, to grieve the loss of even the present of what you want to have in the present. But there has to be a point of movement.

Just to be lonely, even if it's not grieving per se, it's okay. I remember the hardest time for me And it's funny, I've had people come to me through my book. I wrote a book called Love Factually, with an F, which is the first book that uses science instead of opinion to take men and women through every stage of dating.

Mm-hmm.

And I write in there about what it was like for me as a single mom when I would— that time between when my daughter would go to sleep and when it was time for me to go to sleep. And those hours were agonizing for me. And I've had so many people reach out to me to become my clients because they said, You get it. You understand. You're not going to tell me to just be okay with where I am because I'm not okay with that and I don't see myself being okay with that. And what I say to them is that discomfort is your gift. It's the gift that's going to make it where you will do the work to find a good partnership, not a partnership where your children are at risk, not a partnership where you are taken for granted, or a partnership where the person will never commit to you. A full, real, genuine partnership where you're going to be willing to walk from relationships that don't work for you.

I love that. So to use that discomfort for motivation, just like other things in your life. Okay, so we are getting ready to go on break. And we are here with my guest, Dr. Dwayna Welch, talking about single moms and dating. We have a lot more to talk about. So I will see you guys in just a minute. People ask me, how do you have so much energy? I am not a coffee drinker, but I love the benefits of matcha green tea. More antioxidants than coffee, and a smooth energy, not the jittery kind, that lasts me all day long. Perfect for you super moms too. I have searched the world over for that perfect matcha for my smoothies, and I have found it at Kiss Me Organics. You can get it too at kissmeorganics.com. Enter the promo code DRZOE, D-R-Z-O-E, for 10% off and free shipping. Experience It's the smooth, healthy, organic energy of matcha green tea. KissMeOrganics.com. Welcome back. This is the Dr. Zoe Show, and I'm here with my guest, Dr. Duana Welch from LoveScienceMedia.com and author of the book Love Factually. Did I say that correct, Duana?

You did. Thank you so much.

Okay, you're welcome. So we were just talking about being a single mom looking for love. The necessity that you said of being able to sit in that place of uncomfortability, of wanting to have a relationship and recognizing that the loneliness is okay, and maybe, maybe even using that for motivation to get out there and seek love. Am I correct?

Absolutely. Yes, that's it.

So let's talk about then when you're in that place and you know that work needs to be done, what is the work and how do we do it?

Well, some of it is the groundwork you do before you start to head out to meet someone. For example, a lot of us who've been single parents don't feel like our self-esteem is where we'd like it to be. And, you know, there's never been a perfume called desperation.

So— That's a good one.

So, you know, obsession, yes. Desperation, no.

Right.

You know, I remember having a feeling sometimes that, you know, I didn't want to come off as desperate. And so here's the summary of something that I hope will make all of you who are listening feel better. You don't actually have to feel awesome right now. You can fake it till you make it. There are literally hundreds of experiments in a subset of psychology called social psychology that show that if you act as if you are confident and happy, you will appear to be and actually come closer to really being confident and happy.

Yes.

Basically, I know we all think, oh, you know, I would run if I felt like running, but But the truth is also, if we start running, we'll feel like it. Our actions change our feelings, not just the other way around. So don't wait to feel like dating, start dating and you'll feel more like it. Don't wait to feel confident, act as if you are confident and you will feel more confident.

Yes, you are right. It actually creates chemical changes in our brains that increase that motivation and desire. So thank you once again, that's science. Acting as if does work, not just in terms of how you appear outside, but also how you feel inside. Thank you for that. Any other tips? Well, thank you. In terms of confidence. Sure.

Yeah. Another thing that people will often say is— well, actually, they don't often come out with it quite this way, but my read of it is, I am filled with self-loathing, and I am filled with loathing for my ex. And that is keeping me stuck. Almost no one says those words exactly, but the metacommunication is there. So I'd like to introduce some ideas from a scientist named Everett Worthington, who studied forgiveness and what that is and why it's necessary.

Please do.

Yeah, so Dr. Worthington, he did a series of studies where he studied what forgiveness seems to be at its core, and he studied whether he could teach people to forgive and whether it change their life at all. And what he found was, yes, yes, yes. He could identify what was central to forgiveness. He could teach people to do it, and their lives did improve. And then after he'd done all that, a couple of people broke into his mother's apartment and murdered her.

Oh my gosh.

And he was called upon to have to forgive in a very— a way that most of us fortunately will never be called upon to have to do. And he applied what he had learned about forgiveness, and he forgave these young men who killed his mother. Now, how did he do that? I hope that almost— or even none of us have anything that serious to forgive with ourselves or our ex. But whatever level of forgiveness we need to engage, we still need to engage it. So I'd like to talk first about some of the reasons that we don't forgive ourselves or our ex. Which basically are, they don't deserve it, and if I forgive them, they can come back and hurt me again.

Right.

Those were the big reasons that people don't want to forgive. They feel like that creates an open-door policy. So in a sense, all the people that you may have come across in your practice, and I've come across in my coaching, who didn't want to forgive or said, I can't do it, part of that makes a lot of sense. I mean, if you see it through the eyes of someone who has been badly, badly hurt, Of course you don't want them to come back and do it again.

Well, also, unfortunately— go ahead.

What's that?

Well, I was going to say another one that I see in my practice that's probably more of a subconscious, uh, motivation is once you forgive, then the connection is gone. And yeah, I always talk about— and I've talked about this on the show before— that the emotional divorce happens at a very different time than the legal divorce. And as long as you are holding on, that emotional divorce sometimes never happens. And that's part of what you're talking about with forgiveness.

Yeah, there's a scientist named Judith Wallerstein who found that a lot of children of divorce were not past the divorce even 20 years later. It was still negatively affecting their lives. That wasn't invariably true. The parents who divorced and had a more businesslike relationship with each other, who realized that, you know what, we're still family even if we're not still together, we're going to We're going to act on these children's behalf as a cohesive unit, and we're going to show them love, and we're going to love our children more than we hate each other. Those children did fine, but that was not most children. A lot of parents mistakenly thought that if they ended the marriage, they would end the relationship, and it didn't happen. So you're right. What happens a lot at an unconscious level is people are still trying to work out their stuff. And the reason to forgive is not because your ex deserves it. It's because you do. It's because you deserve to be, and your children deserve it. They deserve— you all deserve freedom from bitterness and vengefulness.

Got it.

The feeling like you want to hurt another person is— it can really fuel a lot of action, but it's rarely action that's going to help us, and it's going to hurt our kids. And, you know, today is all about single moms, and we don't want to hurt our kids. We want our kids to thrive. This is something I have never said on any show before. I've, I've been inching up to it years, but I left My ex because he could not get over his addictions and his behavior was dangerous consequently. He was a good man with a bad problem. Divorcing him did not end our relationship, it merely changed it. I still had to deal with co-parenting with someone where I genuinely felt it was not safe for my child.

Absolutely.

I still had to do that. And so I still had to go through the process of forgiveness. That piece of paper doesn't end the relationship. When you have children, that relationship is forever. So it's really important, regardless of how hard that circumstance is, to be able to forgive. But what is that? There's only 2 things forgiveness comprises, and thank goodness this is all it is: letting go of your bitterness and anger and your desire for revenge. Just letting go. It doesn't mean that you have to say that what they did was no big deal. Right. If you have to forgive something, it is a big deal. It doesn't mean that you have to let the person back in your life. I have forgiven my ex, but I do not want him back in my life in that way.

And so for the mom who's dating, that would be kind of step number 1, is making sure that before you go out there and you start the dating process, that you've worked on the forgiveness aspect.

Yes, it's really important to, because otherwise your bitterness and your desire for revenge is going to seep over into your new relationship. Right. And really poison the well. You know, I remember a date that I went on with a guy that— oh, we just met for coffee, but he started talking about his ex, and he was speaking of her so really hatefully. I mean, he was filled with vengefulness and bitterness, and I had a visceral physical reaction to how—

Angry he was.

He was. He was so— he was beyond angry. fury. And I said to him, you know, it, it sounds— I mean, I felt like pushing myself away from the table. I really— it was hard to be there. And, uh, I said, wow, it sounds like it's been really, really difficult co-parenting with her. It sounds like it's been really, really difficult going through that divorce. How long ago was this? Dr. Zoe, it had been 10 years.

That is exactly what I'm talking about. Yes, when it comes to the emotional divorce, it hadn't happened.

Yeah. His life had been ruined. So his anger at his ex was not protecting him.

Right.

We feel like when we're in the middle of not forgiving someone, we feel like it's protecting us. It wasn't protecting him. It was hurting him. It was probably hurting his children. He was so angry. And so, how do you do it? It's easy to say forgive, but what did Dr. Worthington tell people to

do?

Well, he found that There's no forgiveness without empathy. So you have to see the event through the offender's eyes.

I was—

so whoever it was, whether it was us or someone else, whoever the offender is in the situation, we have to see it through their eyes, which is not the same thing as condoning or excusing the behavior. He had to see the murder through the murderer's eyes.

Right. And if you can understand— and this is such a hard one and so important when it comes to forgiveness, especially in relationships, or, you know, when you're finished with relationships I say it and it's hard for a lot of people to comprehend, but every behavior makes sense in its context. And so if you could put yourself, like you said, in that other person's shoes and recognize the context of their life from birth to the point that they made that decision, you could understand how that person with that personality, with that temperament, with that life experience would make that choice. So thank you. That's a very good first step in working on forgiveness. So after you've forgiven, Or after you've gone far on that forgiveness journey, what would be the second tip for a single mom who's really out there looking to have— to find love?

Make sure that you give yourself permission to want love, because a lot of people will tell you that you have to be strong and happy on your own first, and that doesn't feel good. So you don't have to be strong and happy on your own first. You can fake it till you make it, and you can use whatever level of dissatisfaction you have with being single, if you do. Now, some people may be happily single, and that's fine.

But if you are dissatisfied with it,

You can use it as a motivator to treat dating as a part-time job. And so, that would be my next tip after, you know, kind of adjusting your outlook is to adjust your behavior to really be serious about this. Treat it as seriously as you would a search for a job because according to science, this is a lot more serious actually than a search for a job. A job, you can quit, you can leave, you can get another job. A partner, hopefully you're not going to be quitting, leaving, and changing partners just a whole lot while you have children.

Right. That's certainly the case.

Hopefully, you're going to interview carefully from the outset in such a methodical way. And I know this doesn't sound romantic, but that's because really, romance didn't get a lot of us where we needed to be, frankly. I'm not saying that your life will be devoid of romance. The last thing my husband said to me last night before falling asleep was, I love you so much. I'm saying that that can't be the sole focus anymore. So, when I was single dating, I did treat My dating, I did what I'm telling people to do because I had read the science and I treated my dating as kind of a part-time job. My mom would take my child one afternoon a week. And on that afternoon, I was running a PR firm at the time and I could arrange my own hours. So on that afternoon, I didn't work. I went to a Thai restaurant and I sat myself down and every hour and a half a new guy walked in the door and I interviewed him.

That's awesome. Okay, I'm going to have to take a break really quickly, but we are talking here with Dr. Duana Welch for you single moms dating. And right now we're talking about treating dating like a part-time job. And we'll talk about that in just a minute. People ask me, how do you have so much energy? I am not a coffee drinker, but I love the benefits of matcha green tea. More antioxidants than coffee and a smooth energy, not the jittery kind, that lasts me all day long. Perfect for you super moms too. I have searched the world over for that perfect matcha for my smoothies, and I have found it at Kiss Me Organics. You can get it too at kissmeorganics.com. Enter the promo code DRZOE, D-R-Z-O-E, for 10% off and free shipping. Experience the smooth, healthy, organic energy of matcha green tea. kissmeorganics.com. This is Dr. Zoe, and we are here with my guest, Dr. Duana Welch, talking to you single moms about dating. And Dr. Welch, I love what she said, that you need to treat your dating like a part-time job, ladies. This is serious business now. It's not, you know, teenage high school dating. And I know you know that already because you've been in the, in the mix and you know what's going on. So, Dr. Welch, can you talk a little bit more about How you treat it like a part-time job?

Yeah, absolutely. For those of us who are or have been single moms, we don't have a lot of time to date when our children wouldn't be involved. And I really encourage you, until you have a pretty high degree of trust with a man, not to get your children involved. Very unfortunately, a major study out of Canada showed that the most likely cause of severe sexual physical abuse, and even murder of young children was when mom was living with or married to a man who was not biologically related to the children. That is not to say that all non-genetically related males will hurt your children. It is to say that picking the wrong one can have serious repercussions for everyone in your family.

That's true.

That's true. So, You're not going to want to bring in— hopefully, you're not going to want to bring in men into your children's life before you have a chance to see what his character is like. But you're also going to want to screen carefully enough up front that there are a lot of people you just don't even wind up meeting, which is why I think you and I are going to do a future segment about internet dating and how to do that. I'm a big advocate for internet dating because research shows that it works.

Me too. Yes, it does.

It works. It not only brings people into your life, but actually, you're more likely to be more happily married Albeit slightly more happily, if you met that way than any other way, according to a large-scale national study that was recently published. So

I'm so glad you shared that. I'm going to be sharing that with one of my clients now who I'm trying so hard to convince to, you know, venture out and internet date. And so many of my women clients are just against it. So I'm going to cite that study. And so I want to go back to what you said about, you know, waiting to introduce. So a lot of women will ask me, what's the time period? Is it 6 months? Is it 3 months? What's the time period? How do you know when to introduce them to your kids?

Really, it's, you know, I have people ask me the same thing about a lot of things. When do you have sex? When you do this? When you do that? It's not a date on a calendar. It's a feeling, according to the pacing of the intimacy of the relationship. Do you know this person well enough where you feel like you are invested enough, and they are invested enough that they want something serious with you? You want something serious with them, and you need them to meet your children to see whether they pass muster. If it's not at that point yet, then get a babysitter and continue treating dating like a part-time job. And don't just date one person at a time either. You know, I described going to that Thai restaurant and every hour and a half somebody new showed up. I had one guy get really angry at me about that. He called me and he said, you know, I left, I went outside in my car and there you were. Let's forget for a moment that he was basically stalking me. That was not cool. But when he called and told me that, I set him straight. I said, look, I am a single mom. My primary goal in life is to raise a healthy, happy human being. And I am interviewing for the most important position in my life that I have to offer, which is life partner. I am not going to date one person for half a year here and another person for a year there and another for 3 years there to see if it all works out. I'm going to interview lots of people and see who is the best match who also wants me. And if you're not okay with that, that's okay with me. You can go and date somebody else.

You know, it worked for you. And I actually, I actually really love that approach. It's very logical. And it makes a lot of sense. I know that some women may feel like you're taking the romance out of it. And, but the reality is, is like you said, that can come as well. And that will come. And the reason why internet dating—

Romantic, just because I opened myself up to meeting a lot of people, as if it were a job. interview does not mean that I married someone who is cold or unfeeling or unromantic, nor that I am. It just means that I stopped waiting for the romantic fantasy where some guy swoops in on, you know, his horse or his Mercedes or whatever, rescues me. And I took an active role in my own happiness, and I didn't leave it to chance anymore.

Well, and you're right. And the reason why internet dating does work so well is that people first figure out if there's any common ground before they even have that first date. So whether you're taking a quiz on eHarmony or whatever you're doing, there's that first interview process that happens that's not romantic at all. And that's one of the reasons why it is more successful, because you're already connecting with somebody that you know there's some level of connection with. So wonderful, wonderful. So the big tip is treat dating like a part-time job. And I work with, with single women all the time, and I help them develop— listen, you need to have a You need to have priorities. You need to have the deal breakers. You need to have the easy things that, you know, you see that good, I'm gone on to the next one. Do you also prescribe something similar to that?

Absolutely. In fact, a chapter of my book is devoted to internet dating. Another chapter is devoted to basically loving yourself into a great relationship. And a big part of loving yourself into a great relationship is having appropriate boundaries and knowing what your boundaries are. So you start by making a list of everything that you could think of that you want and don't want, and then you put it all in positive language. language what you do want. Like, I didn't say no alcoholics. I said, live a sober and responsible life, because your brain thinks of what you tell it to think of and it ignores the word not. So, if you say no alcoholics, your brain's like, oh, alcoholics. So, you have to give your brain what to search for. And then, you separate your list into must-haves versus wants.

Yes.

And this is the thing about the must-haves. If they lack even one must-have, you must not. It's a deal breaker for a reason. So, you know, for example, I met a really nice man who told me that he'd been in recovery for a couple of years. I can't go down that road again.

Right.

Even though he probably is an amazing human being, and I do wish him well, and I hope he has found the love of his life. And even though I know a lot of good marriages are made with people who have succeeded with their recovery and stay in recovery, I would always be waiting for the other shoe to drop, and it wasn't going to work for me. So, you know, knowing yourself intimately and making that list and sticking to it That's the big thing.

That is the big thing.

That list is gonna help you in so many ways. You know, I get letters, especially from guys who've made that list and then written to me afterward and said, I thought that list was so dorky, but I did it. And I figured out that there was a woman I already knew who had everything on my list. And now I'm marrying her.

Wow. That is pretty impressive. I know for me, the biggest struggle I have with women in my practice is that we make the list and then they don't stick to it because it's like, but I like him and he has everything, but I know this one little thing. And they convince themselves that that one thing that they had their deal breaker list that somehow they're going to be able to make it work. And that for me is, is one of the most frustrating aspects, is not sticking to that list. But at least at first you have to make it.

Yeah, I really work with clients— I hear your frustration, I share it by the way, Dr. Zoe. I really work a lot with clients at the front end of the list challenging them. So I, I'll say, I'll point to an item and I'll say, so if they were politically conservative but otherwise they were perfect, you just kick them to the curb? And if they say yes, I say, okay, then when you meet someone, if this is part of who they are, I'm gonna insist that you kick them to the curb. I'm gonna insist that you say goodbye.

And not only that, but you also have to ask those questions. You get those deal-breaker answers up front. You don't wait, you know, for weeks or a month or so before you start to ask the deal-breaker questions when you've already got emotions involved.

Correct. I know it's not emotional. I know what people want to do now is is have sex first, fall in love second, and then ask the hard questions if they ever ask them. But that is the research-proven path to heartache. The, the way that really works is ask the questions quickly, let yourself go emotionally with someone who fulfills what you're already looking for, and it's going to work.

I love that. Thank you. That is an excellent close for this conversation, Dr. Welch. And for you single moms out there, I know you're struggling. Take some of this advice. So my takeaways from this are: number one, make sure you've forgiven your ex. Number two, embrace where you are right now. It's okay to be lonely. It's okay to be in that place that you're not necessarily comfortable with. Work on my this one's mine. Work on loving yourself in that place. Number four, date like it's a part-time job. And number five, ask those deal breakers. is upfront, immediately, before you even get started, before you even meet, if that's even possible. So, Dr. Duana, how can people get ahold of you?

Well, they can find me at lovefactually.co. They can get a free chapter of my book and they can see how to send me an email if they want. You know, the other thing is if they just want to go straight to Amazon or iTunes or wherever, it is available in audio and paperback and ebook. But I answer every letter I receive. So, if anybody out there is inspired to write to me, I will write back.

Awesome. Thank you so much for joining us today, and I look forward to having the online dating conversation. So thank you, Dr. Welch, and we will see you again some other time.

Thank you. Absolutely. The pleasure's been mine.

Okay, and so we're going on break real quickly, and I'll be back. This is Dr. Zoe Shaw with the Dr. Zoe Show in just a minute. People ask me, how do you have so much energy? I am not a coffee drinker, but I I love the benefits of matcha green tea. More antioxidants than coffee and a smooth energy, not the jittery kind, that lasts me all day long. Perfect for you super moms too. I have searched the world over for that perfect matcha for my smoothies, and I have found it at Kiss Me Organics. You can get it too at kissmeorganics.com. Enter the promo code Dr. Zoe, D-R-O-E. Z-O-E for 10% off and free shipping. Experience the smooth, healthy, organic energy of matcha green tea. KissMeOrganics.com. Hi guys, this is Dr. Zoe. I am back. We just had a discussion with my guest, Dr. Duana Welch. So glad that she was able to come and talk to single moms about some great tips. So if you are just tuning in, I'm Dr. Zoe and this is Real Talk where I answer questions from my listeners. Please reach out if you have some questions you would like me to address on the show. All the questions are anonymous, and I take your confidentiality very seriously. Now, this one isn't actually a question from a viewer, but I just wanted to talk about what it means to be a strong woman. And since I didn't give my whole introduction, this is probably a good time to do that. My favorite movie since I was a teenager was Steel Magnolias. It's so dated today, but I was really struck by the amazing strength of those very feminine women. And it struck me to that day, that dichotomy, and it's really influenced me. And I've always been drawn to very strong women, and I've always been curious about their stories and how they develop that strength. And I'm not talking about the women who have to or feel like they have to compete with a man. This personally drives me crazy. Why compete when as a woman you have so many gifts that are special to being a woman. It's okay to embrace those differences, and that doesn't take away from your inherent equality as humans, ladies. In fact, I would go so far as to say that when you try to overcompensate to prove your worth, it lacks authenticity. Now, of course, I'm going to acknowledge I'm a product of, you know, feminism. All of us are, you know, right now, the women, we're a product of the women's rights movement. And so we reap those benefits that women before us had to fight so hard. And I recognize that, and I appreciate But what happens is when you're fighting a battle, you've got to swing the pendulum way far because you're in, you're in battle. But now at some point, that pendulum has to be swung back to the middle. And the reality is, is that we have a unique strength in our femininity. And I feel like so many women feel like they have to lose their femininity in order to be perceived as strong. And I view femininity as ultimately stronger in its core than masculinity. And I'm not saying that to put men down. I love That men are physically stronger and in some ways logically stronger than I am. In fact, I prefer it that way. And I'm not saying that, you know, they're logically stronger in all ways, but I prefer it that way. I love that my husband towers over me and he can physically defend me if necessary. And men have that drive. They have that drive to protect and defend, and there's safety felt by women when we know we are protected by our men in that way. I know that doesn't sound feminist, but it's a truth. And I think that we can hold both of those. And I know structurally that we women have a strength that is almost superhuman when it comes to our internal structure and core psychological and physiological makeup. And this has been proven time and time again in research. When you look at sick or preemie babies in the NICU, being a female actually gives you a significantly better chance of survival across all issues NICUs than being male. I learned that when I— when my daughter was in the NICU. And the nurses told me about that. I started reading studies about that. And why? It can't really be explained except that women are structurally stronger than men. So when you hear those stories of women lifting cars to save their kids, that's where our human strength, our superhuman strength comes in. Because physically, of course, that should be impossible. But bottom line, we have so much strength. And it's specifically rooted in our femininity. And we have to embrace our strength and not see it as separate, but rather integrated in our femininity. And that's why I have this show and why I do the work I do to help women find their strength, their superpowers, whatever you want to call it, rooted in their femininity and share it with the world. We don't have to compete. We need men and they need us. We were created to complement each other. We sometimes see the world differently, and this is a good thing. Remember that old saying, if you guys both think the same way, then one of you isn't needed, or something like that? Let them shine, and we can shine too. Men get a bit of a bad rep these days, and I want my teenage sons to be confident in their masculinity and to find strong women who are confident in their femininity. And also, we need women. And I think Dr. Welch was talking about that today, basically how as humans we need each other. But women also need women desperately. That's why I had my first show on the topic of friendship and women, because we don't really operate that way in a society as much in the way that we were designed to as a community of women who support each other. We were designed to rely on each other, and that's why we need friendships as women even more today, because women friendships tend to be so competitive, and that's not really how it was designed to be. And I find That the majority of women in my practice do not have a strong social structure of women in their life, and without it, women just don't do as well in life. So that's my couple of cents today. Embrace your femininity, support other women, because we don't need to compete with each other. So next up, I do have a question from one of my viewers, and the question is, should you be friends with your kids? This is a really good one because as a mom, I struggle with this as well because we love our kids. We love them and we want to connect with them. And I think that line can get so blurred easily and you just don't quite know, is this friendship? Is this mom? Is this— what is this? And so my answer is yes and no. Any of you guys know about a Venn diagram? So if you think of a Venn diagram where you have 2 circles that intersect, There should be some overlap. So remember the statement, people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care. And that applies with any relationship anywhere in the world. People don't care how much you know. So if you're trying to impart knowledge on somebody, they don't care until they know how much you care. So what is a friend? Friends are a group of people that tend to have the same notion about ideas and life. You are not your child's friend. You are your child's teacher. Authority. They don't have the same notion about life as you do. Why? Because their brains are still developing. You hear them talk to their friends, you read their texts, you read all this stuff on social media. They don't think like you do. So that's why they can do some mind-blowing stuff that makes perfect sense to them. And so usually when parents say they want to be their child's friend, what they're really saying is that they want their kid to like them. And here's the other thing, you should never ever rely on your child for friendship. And this can happen, especially if you have a seemingly very mature child, This happens a lot with single moms, that a mom will lean on a child for emotional support. This is always wrong and it's unfair, and I believe it's akin to emotional abuse. Even if your child seems like they have the capacity and capability to deal with your issues, they don't. I promise you, they don't. You've got to let your kid be a kid, and you got to go find someone else to lean on or get a journal, because I see kids all the time who have to take care of their parents, and that's not their job. yet until they're old and emotionally able to handle it. It's emotionally damaging to lean on your kid. So you have to balance by letting your kid know that you care, which means, yeah, you do fun things with them. Yeah, you connect with them. Yeah, you are their friend. When we look at that Venn diagram, that middle part is the connection part. That's where you do have a friendship and a healthy relationship with your kid. And those other parts of the circle, your child is their own child. They're their own person with their own friends, and you are your own person And with your own friends. So simple answer, yes and no. So this is the Dr. Zoe Show, and I am just thankful that you guys are here. I hope we got some, some good tips for single moms today. Tune in next week and every week on Tuesdays from 12 to 1 Pacific, 3 to 4 Eastern at laradionow.com. For those of you who can't always listen live, check out my reruns on iTunes, Google Play, Libsyn, and YouTube, where I am your life and relationship coach. I help sometimes struggling superwomen keep your mind in the game by redefining your superwoman. If you know a friend who may benefit from any of my topics, please spread the love and share my show. And if you like the show, please show me some love with some stars. Go on to iTunes, review it, give me some stars, and connect with me at drzoeshaw.com or any of my social medias at the handle Dr. Zoe Shaw. You can also join my free newsletter and get a copy of 30 Minute Life Transformation. I look forward to speaking with you wonderful ladies on social media after the show. Have a super week.

You've been listening to the Dr. Zoe Show, Redefining Your Superwoman, with your host, Dr. Zoe Shaw. Don't forget to sign up for her monthly newsletters to get encouragement, tips, and Skills for keeping your mind in the Superwoman game. Connect with her now at www.drzoeshaw.com. Tell your friends and subscribe to her podcast on iTunes. Join us next time for another edition of the Dr. Zoe Show.