Darryl "DMC" McDaniels on Legacy, Vulnerability, and the Transformative Power of Art and Music

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Living a life in full is a conversation you always wanted to have with that person who gave an amazing TED Talk or the author of one of your favorite books, or that inspirational Olympian you always wanted to know more about. It's graduate level conversations with those making a difference in the world and in the lives of others. This show brings you new ideas and approaches so that you can live a life in full. I I'm your host Dr. Chris Stout and I hope you enjoy this episode. This episode is brought to you by the nonprofit I founded, the center for Global Initiatives. The center is an all volunteer organization so there are no salaries and thus all tax deductible donations can go to the work. While our key country partners in Tanzania, our work is global and generally focused in the areas of education and healthcare. We also help others to get their nonprofits started or augment others project based initiatives. It's our goal to open source humanitarian intervention and to help make it easier for others to do more good in the world. We are proud to have been ranked a great nonprofit every year since 2011 and to have achieved a Platinum level rating by Guidestar Links in this episode's show, notes will take you to published articles on our outcomes, a number of helpful tools and downloadable resources which are all free always. Please Visit us at CenterForGlobalInitiatives.org and be sure to watch our video at Patreon.com DrChrisStout to learn more. Thanks. Welcome to another episode of Living a Life in Full. I'm your host, Dr. Chris Stout. Unless you've been living under a rock, you most likely have heard of Darrell DMC McDaniels, the driving force behind his legendary band Run DMC. Darrell's 40 plus years in the music industry has made history by selling over 40 million records and over a billion streams. As part of the first rap group to appear on the COVID of Rolling Stone and featured on mtv, he helped redefine music, culture, fashion and language, leaving an indelible mark on American history. His influence on popular culture remains profound. In 2009, he was inducted into the Rock and Roll hall of fame. In 2016, he received the Grammy Lifetime Achievement Award, recognizing performers who throughout their lifetimes have made creative contributions of outstanding artistic significance to the field of recording. His music career remains iconic. His new album America, featuring collaborations with rock and hip hop legends including Chuck D, Mick Mars, Duff McKagan, Joan Jett, Sammy Hagar, Ice T, Travis Barker, DJ Jazzy Jeff, Bumpy Knuckles and Blacktop Mojo. What you may not know is that in 2021 Darrell published his first children's book, Darrell's Dream through Random House Books for Young Readers in partnership with Nickelodeon. He is a co author of 10 Ways not to Commit Suicide, reflecting on his journey and struggles with mental health. In partnership with you Will Darrell advocates for mental health support, particularly for men of color. As a person who has always known the importance of paying it forward, Darrell has been active in his community and is a philanthropist with many charities. He continues to inspire and innovate across multiple creative and philanthropic domains. In 2023 he launched another DMC venture, Darrell makes Cookies, featuring his signature chocolate chip cookies and Darrell Makes Comics is a comic book company he founded. Blending his love for hip hop with his childhood passion for adventure, his comic company's first full length graphic novel debuted in 2014 with an annual release following each year. Darrell's journey has led him to advocate for adoption and foster care, as he highlighted in the 2007 Emmy winning VH1 documentary My Adoption Journey. In 2006, Darrell Co founded the Felix Foundation Pardon me? The Felix Organization, a nonprofit with a mission to enrich the lives of children in foster care. Since its inception, the Felix Organization has served over 18,000 children, many of whom have attended Felix Camp. Felix, a unique summer sleepaway camp designed to serve this population, and even more, have participated in Felix Forward, offering a variety of year round enrichment opportunities and events within a caring and supportive community. Beyond adoption, Darrell's philanthropic efforts extend to various sectors, including his role on the Hip Hop Public Health Advisory Board where he advocates for health awareness and his involvement with the Garden of Dreams foundation which supports children facing adversity. His contributions to youth adoption and mental health advocacy have earned him numerous awards. Darrell and I met for the first time at a recent event in New York City where we were both awardees and I came to learn more about the complexities of an amazing artist, humanitarian and person. So I'm glad to be able to have him on the show. Welcome Darrell. It's great to reconnect and have you on?

Hey, what's up, Doc? Thank you for having me here. I appreciate this.

Absolutely, absolutely. So in the intro, I hit some highlights of your work and your life, and I want to do a deeper dive and exploration about a number of aspects. So maybe the best place to start would be in Hollis, Queens. Could you set the stage for us from those early days?

Yeah. I grew up in a place called Hollis, Queens. It was a lower middle class suburban area of queens in the 60s and 70s and early 80s. It wasn't like Harlem and it wasn't like the Bronx and it wasn't like do a debt die bets tie across the whole neighborhood. We had a little blocks and corners, but me, Darryl McDaniels, I went to Catholic school my whole life. Was a straight A student. I love comic books. Had both of my parents in the house. Byford was my father, Banner was my mother, my brother Alfred. And I was just a kid that spent most of my time reading comic books. And the fact that I was always reading comic books since like I would say second grade, it made me an excellent student. So school was easy to me because in kindergarten, when I first saw my first comic book, I believe it was a Batman cover. And just the way the art jumped out at me, I felt something to my whole body and I was like, what is that? This is incredible. So, you know, I would hold my brother's hand and we would walk to the candy store or the drugstore because that's where they sold the magazines and the comic books. And I would get the comic book and I would just look at the pictures. Kindergarten to first grade. But by first grade, I said, you know what? I'm going to pay attention in school to become a great reader. So I could understand what in the world Tony Starks, Professor X and Reed Richards was talking about. So my life in Queens, my parents always worked. My father, he was a boiler man at the MTA bus depot. He didn't drive the buses, but he worked at the bus depot. All the buses would go in and out all day. They always worked 8 to 12 hours, you know, every day. My mother was a nurse, but they paid for me to go to every school I went to. I went to elementary Catholic elementary, Catholic High school and eventually made it to St. John's University. But growing as a up as a kid, you know, I wasn't that kid that was in the streets because my mother was like, when that street light is on, when you see them street lights come on, you have your butt in this house.

Good for her.

Yeah, I had to have an imagination nations. So, you know, my neighborhood was beautiful, though, because I wish communities still had this going on on my block. My mother was your mother and your mother was my mother. So everybody was very connected. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

All the parents looked out for the other kids. And I think that was the beauty of keeping most of the kids on my block away from the drugs, away from the gangs, away from the negativity.

Nice. Yeah. It's that those are unfortunately such a bygone era. But, yeah, I think that that whole sense of community and shared responsibility and probably all the. The love that you guys felt, you know, with. From family and from that kind of, you know, proxy for family called neighbors. So.

Yes, somewhere. Somewhere along the line, Doc, that left the neighborhood.

Yeah. Yeah. And a lot neighborhoods as well, too, so. Well, how. So I get the. I. And I was also a big Batman fan and DC Comics and Marvel and

what I was more the reason I love dc. Let me just say this. I love dc. Batman, Flash, Green Lantern, Wonder Woman. Because I. I was. I was an artist. I learned to draw by second grade, so I would read the books, draw everything I saw. Read the book again, keep drawing. So I would recollect, draw, recollect, draw, recollect, draw. But I was a huge Marvel fan because of this. Remember, I was the kid that when you see that street light come on, you got your. You gotta have your butt in this house.

Right.

But Stanley was brilliant. D.C. was great, but Gotham and Metropolis wanted to be New York. Stan Lee did something amazing. He just put the superheroes in New York. So, Chris, without leaving my room, I learned about the place I lived in. I learned about Hell's Kitchen. I learned about Harlem. I learned about the Lower east side. So Stanley was able to teach me about New York City. All the places that I heard about and read about, all the places I seen on the news and read about in the newspaper with the headlines, I was able to learn about my city right in my bedroom. That's why I gravitated.

That never. I never. That never occurred to me. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Like with Daredevil and Kingpin. I mean, you. You know. Yes. Yeah. Wow.

You learned. You know, I learned about 42nd street, and I saw the Statue of Liberty. I saw the Empire State Building, I saw the Twin Towers without leaving my bedroom. So. And I got to meet Stanley two times.

Oh, man.

Yeah, I did that purposely, young man.

Oh, what a. That must have been amazing. How. I gotta take a sidebar. How, how did you and Stan cross paths?

What a, what a wonderful experience. When I met, when my friend convinced me to start my comic book company, I discovered this was God sent because it was a way for me to get in all the Comic Con. So all the Comic Con. Stan Lee was like just, just the God of all the Comic Con. So I got to meet him and tell him, you know, I grew up in Queens, New York. And one of the beautiful things I told him was like, you know, Peter Parker. I was able to relate to Peter Parker not only because he was from Queens like me. Like when I found out Spider man was from Queens, it wasn't make believe no more. But also when you look at Peter Parker, he was this awkward, educated, nerdy, geeky kid that happened to be Spider man and that kind of reading Spider man and seeing Peter Parker being like me. Oh, wow, he's educated.

Yeah.

So it's cool to be smart. You can be a superhero. And it led me to say I don't have to be in a gang to be cool. I don't have to steal and lie and cheat to be cool. So I told Stan Lee that. He was like, I guess I created a monster because now you're this, now you're this superhero on a microphone. I said, oh, you discovered my secret.

Yeah, your superpower isn't so secret.

Exactly.

That's great. Well, that's a good segue. Let's discuss your music. You've said that you are influenced by a number of styles, a number of artists, but your personal 4 foray into forming Run DMC was more so rap and hip hop. Tell us, tell us about that.

Yeah, well, I guess as a little kid, music in my house, because of my parents, it was Al Green, Marvin Gaye, James Brown, Aretha Franklin, you know.

Yeah.

So that's what I heard as a kid. But I'm a kid, all I cared about was comic books. The greatest movies ever made, which was the 1930s. Bella Lugosi, Boris, Carl. Oh yeah, you know, those were phenomenal movies.

Yep.

Comic books. The, the early Japanese black and white Godzilla films. The Flintstones and the Jetsons, you know, Prehistoric and the Flint Future.

Yeah.

Adam's Family, Brady Bunch, the monsters. So yeah, I was a child of pop culture.

Yeah.

But my imagination, things that sparked my imagination was my only interest. So music was in my house and going into the 70s, coming out of the 60s, going into the 70s, music in my house, you even listen to the. It was AM stations. So my father would listen to the so called rock or white AM station. And then he would listen to the black or soul plaque station. But a phenomenal thing happened when 77 WABC in New York City, they did something amazing. They played the black and white music together. And I remember it was DJs like Dan Ingram. Dan Ingram, Harry Harrison. And I remember being a little kid listening to the Radio 77 ABC. And I'm like, you would hear the Jackson 5 slide family stone, but you also would hear Crosby, Stills Young and Nash. You would also hear Proko Harem, you would hear a Resa Flower Franklin, but you would also hear Janis Joplin and Joni Mitchell, you know what I'm saying? You would hear James Brown, but you also would hear Queen and Elton John and the Stones. And it was something about the folk rock in the rock or what people now know as classic rock that I gravitated to. But it was really because of school because, you know, a lot of the soul music was a About love.

Yeah.

Outside of Gil Scott Heron and Curtis Mayfield and songs like that. And even Marvin Gaye, who was known for sexy soul love songs, he made the song what's Going on?

Yeah.

So. But it was more of the folk and the rock songs, you know, like Crosby, Stills Young and Nash. Bob Dylan.

Yeah.

Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, John Fogarty and Credence. They were singing about society, social issues. And a lot of the folk in Iraq songs would say stuff like Fogarty's President, Fortunate Son. I would hear president and government and mayor and what's going on. And I was like, I know about those things. I learned about those things in social studies. I learned about those things in history. But then the more and more I started paying paying attention to the folk and the rock songs, the two things that really caught me with soul music was beautiful, funk was beautiful. All the disco was beautiful. But on a lot of these rock songs, the instruments that they use, like the drums and the guitars and harmonicas, the drums of rock music was way louder than the drums of soul and funk. And it was like. It was like superhero music to me because it was so powerful. It was like the Hulk, but more, more, more. So the thing that attracted to me it was they were singing about stuff I was hearing in school. Then it led me to paying attention to songs by Harry Chapin and Jim Croce.

Wow.

Which were like storytelling songs in the way these folk artists would tell their stories, in the way Neil Young and Fogarty would tell their stories. It came off to me like I was reading a comic book. So I think that was my connection.

Yeah.

So I never wanted to be in the music business. This is all I had with me. Those, those folk songs and those rock songs from the radio that I could relate to. You know, songs such as Bad Bad Leroy Brown, Baddest man in the Whole Damn Town. Better than old King Kong, Leave Me in a Junkyard Dog. And, you know, Harry Shape is Cats in the Cradle. It's like nursery rhymes and superheroes and comic book and TV show characters. So I had all of this in me along with my imagination and along with my education. But I had no way to let it out. So I remember disco being hugely popular, right, in New York City. At Hollywood, you know, you had the CEOs and the athletes and the actors and all of Hollywood, all the famous people, all the rich people from Hollywood was coming to New York City to go to this place called Studio 54. And, you know, most of the young people in New York City, first of all, we know we wasn't getting in Studio 54, right. We wanted to know what in the world was all the rich people doing. Now, even if you look at entertainment today, it's the Rolls Royces and the diamonds and the jewelry and the private jets and the planes. It was just like that in the 70s. But we couldn't put our finger on why in the world is Hollywood, what the hell, Hollywood want to come to New York City? Because even though we had Studio 54, we didn't know what was going on in there. But who would want to come to New York city in the 70s? It was crazy. Until Mayor Giuliani Giuliani brought Disney to 42nd Street. 42nd street was a mad house.

Yeah.

Of drugs and sex and porn. And it was crime. It was like crazy. So we thinking, why is Hollywood state in LA have the sun, you have beautiful, you have Rodeo Drive. Why all these people come to New York City? So the young people here in the city was kind of confused. But then we found out, oh, the DJs playing music, they come in the dance. Now, we wanted that, but we had no resources. We had no real estate. We had no money. There was no way of getting in Studio 54. So disco became hugely big. And as this is documented on Chris, two of the biggest rock bands in the world at the time wanted to make disco records so they could get in Studio 54. If you want to know what I'm talking about, I'm talking about Queen, who was at the top of the world when it came to rock. In the Rolling Stones, Queen made another One Bites the Dust. Don't, don't, don't. Because they wanted to get in Studio 54. And by making those records, they got in the Rolling Stones, if you remember, they made Miss, you. Walk Through Central Park Screaming After Dark. And it's crazy. Yo, what is going on was huge. From the Bee Gees to Donna Summer to Even the Traps, you know, the soul groups was making Burn Baby Burn. Yeah, just go with Burn Over. So this was huge. But then I remember being a kid, being around 12 years old when I woke up one morning, and overnight the whole world was going, disco sucks. And it died. But then, you know, just saying, another man's trash is another man's treasure. When they threw disco away and the records started going away and all the disco started closing, that's when hip hop was coming up. Because what had happened was the young people here in New York who was living in the death, darkness and destruction and poverty and crime in New York City. We put two and two together. We was like, yo, they go into that disco and they play music and it's heaven for five or six hours. So when they threw disco away, we grabbed it, took the turntables, the vinyl records, the speakers in the disco missile to the streets of New York. We didn't have no. We didn't have real estate to do it in. So you know what we did? We popped the light pole open, plugged up our equipment and stole electricity from the city of New York. Free to put on our own disco in the streets. And the only reason we did that was for two or three or four hours. We can have heaven. We don't have to deal with the crime and the poverty and the drug dealing and the gang banging, watching our mothers, fathers, aunts and uncles and all the grownups around us struggle to make ends meet. But we can have a release. So everybody in New York, Chris, started doing disco in the streets of New York. And for the listeners there, if you listen to all the early rap Records, even Run DMC says 1984 on a song called Jam Master J that we did about our dj, we said we got the master of the disco scratch. We just did it in Aurora, a raw free formed more spontaneous fashion. The Fat Boys, for instance, one of the biggest hip hop groups in hip hop in the early years, before they were the Fat Boys, they were the Disco 3. So Chris, this disco thing starts happening everywhere, and everybody's doing it. There was DJs, like, Cool Herc, who's like the Godfather of hip hop. DJs, like, everybody knows Grandmaster Flash and the Message and the furious fob. So everybody's doing this hip hop thing, then we're doing it in the streets. The Sugar Hill Gang comes out with the first record. So when the. When Rapper's Delight came up by the Sugar Hill Gang, it was kind of like a transitional period for the art form and culture. We took this thing called disco. We made it our own. And by utilizing this is key, the records that we were hearing on the radio, we took those records to funk, the soul, the folk and the rock records. We. We call it sampling. But literally we stole the music that was already made being played on the radio. And we part when nobody was talk and we put our own stories there so our voices could be heard.

Wow.

That was behind. It wasn't to be fans, it wasn't to be money. Start a new genre culture. This was our way of life. It was more of a. It was a more way of communication and it was more of a way of saying, okay, it's. It's death, darkness and destruction in our communities, but we use our imagination to create these fun records where everybody's eating and we're dancing and we're rapping and we're singing and we're breaking dancing and we're doing graffiti, you know, we're doing art. It was almost like hip hop was like almost the. The comic books jumped off the comic book pages and went into every street, community, park, basement in. Through the graffiti, even though it was wrong. Every wall in New York City.

Yeah. Wow. It was really sort of like the start of the soundtrack for that era as well too.

Yes, 100%. So when that happened, you know, the greatest period for hip hop is the period before Rappers Delight, which a lot of people don't know about. There's a lot of people in hip hop currently, not just a lot of the listeners, but there's a lot of people who are in hip hop in the music business that have no idea what the culture's about. So the thing that happened was everybody was doing it. Everybody was DJing, MC and break dancing and doing graffiti. But when Rappers Delight, when Sylvia Robinson, who was the R B singer herself, one of the records that she was famous for was a record called Pillow Talk, which played in all the discos too, and all on the radio. But when she put the Sugar Hill Gang on record, it was a transition for us because now we are able to do what we saw every Saturday. Every kid, every Saturday in New York City was this. At 12 o' clock on a Saturday, you Watch Soul Train with Don Cornelius. When Soul Train was over at 1 o', clock, you turn right to channel 7 and you watch American Bandstand with Dick Clark. That was our lives. In addition to watching the Jetsons and the Flintstones and Bugs Money and Looney Tunes on Saturday mornings. On Saturday mornings, 12 noon, Soul Train, 1 o', clock, American Bandstand, where you could see everybody being played on the radio. So once rappers alike got to record, it eventually would lead us to radio. So that being said, when rappers alike came out, my partner Joseph Simmons, who people know as Run in the group, he was already a professional rapper in New York City before Rappers Delight came out, because he was the protege of a rapper called Curtis blow. So at 15 years old, runs already already a professional rapper. The world just don't know it yet. It's always in his brother Russell. Russell. Russell Simmons. Joseph Simmons brother Russell was managing a lot of the early hip hop groups. So he him Run being a pro, Joseph being a protege of Curtis Blow was always in his brother Russell's ear. Russell, now that they make a record, let me make a record. Let me make a record. Let me break a record. So like I said, everybody was doing it. All of these records start coming out, you know, Curtis Flow had the brakes and Chris Christmas Rapid, which was actually the first Christmas record before running MCs Christmas in Hollis record. And then you have the message, you know, which is the most. The message is the greatest rap song ever. I think you had a soul sonic force for Africa, Bambada, Planet Rock, all of the early stuff. So Joe, he's 15 years old and his brother's here. Let me make a record. Let me make a record. Let me make a record. He's doing it really. Not throughout the year, only during the summertime when school's out. When school's out, one can go and tour with Curtis Blow. But when the school semester starts again, he's a kid, he's in still in elementary school at this time. At this time, I'm noticing before Sugar Hill Gang, when you heard the live performances of a hip hopper, if you heard a DJ and a rapper, they would be rapping over all the music that was playing on the radio, right? If you had a lot, this is before rappers alike, so around this time you could tell stories of who you are over music. So maybe in a comic book, in my imagination I go, I'm going to be the most powerful entity in the hip hop universe. I shall be easy D because it's easy for me to write these Raps because I'm a smart little kid and I'm like, Samir. So going on, I'm writing a little rhyme. What it was like. It wasn't to write songs. It was more like me to have a diary. I would just write about what my mom's was doing, what I was doing as a school kid, what I like to eat. So eventually, every day, these pages of these rhyme books is filling so fast. But me and Run, we went to the same elementary school, but he was always in the other class. And the thing that brought us together was this. We was. We was it. We was at the only Catholic school that was still in Hollis, Queens. You know, it was St. Pascal Bailon elementary. The nuns and the priests there was like, we can't abandon the little black kids in the neighborhood. There's so much potential, potential here. And they held on for as long as they could. So Run was in. Run was in 81, I was in 82. What had happened that changed this and this changed history. We had one little basketball court in the schoolyard. Because remember, Doc, if you got your uniform on and you in a Catholic school in the hood, you gotta make it home, take off your uniform and put on your play clothes so you fit in. Because if you get caught with that uniform, right? Oh, your life's gonna be miserable.

That's right.

Yo, the. The public school kids were so, so mean or misinformed, but this was so mean. They would look at me and go, oh, you got a uniform on, you go to Catholic school. This is what they thought. Your mother and father is rich because they pay for you to go to school. So if you wasn't smart enough to put your. Your quarters in your sock when they search your pocket. I mean, for years I went to Catholic school, from kindergarten to eighth care. For years, I don't understand. By third grade, you should know how to navigate this jungle. You know what I'm saying?

Right?

But the thing that happened in eighth grade was in eighth grade, we had one basketball rim where we could stay after school and play ball in the yard. In eighth grade, I wonder if he's still alive. Maybe he'll hear me, hear me say this. In eighth grade, a new student comes to the school. His name is David McEachern. I'll never forget this. And David McGeechen. He was about. Well, to us, you know, we eighth graders in elementary school, to us, this new kid comes to school and he's tall like we. Like, why did you wait till 8th grade to switch schools? You had one more year, stay where you was at and then go on to high school school. But in the middle of the year, this. This kid named David McEachin comes. And for us, he was tall like Kareem Abdul Jabbar. So to us he was like 7:2. Like he was the giant in the school. He might have been. He might have been six, three or two. But to us. So long story short, Chris, this is funny. David McGee takes upon himself to dunk on the only basketball rim in the Catholic school kids yards. And he breaks the rim immediately. We all cry. He just ruined our afternoon curricular activities. Now we can't go to the other park and fit in and be normal like the other kids unless we go all the way home and put our uniform on. But then there's Daryl McDaniels. Remember I had the greatest parents ever. Hold up, kids. Do not worry. My mother and father are the best parents ever. I have a basketball rim in my backyard. Oh, that was like a lifesaver. So now after school, we would leave school, go to my backyard and play basketball. So on any given day, it's 15 to 20 kids in my backyard. One day, Joseph Simmons shows up by itself. And I'm like, joe, where's everybody else at? And it was one of those things, doc, where, you know, Joe was like, well, Doug is on punishment. Remember when kids would get on point?

Right, right.

He got to go straight home from school. Sheridan got a doctor appointment. This other kids got an eye appointment. So it's just me and Joe. We play basketball during all of this time, my brother, who's already graduated from eighth grade, he's already in high school. Him and the older kids, my brother and his friends, they were already getting the turntables, like the DJ equipment. So we had DJ equipment in my basement. And I was dabbling with it, I was writing. And my brother would be like, yo, don't touch my equipment. And what killed me about that was we did a comic book sale, Chris, to get the equipment, me and my brother. Yeah, me and my brother, we had a problem. We didn't sell weed. So, yeah, it wasn't even weed then. Reefer. Let me, let me. If you sold reefer back in the 60s and 70s, you had some money, you know what I'm saying? Motorcycle. Get a bike. So me and my brother, when my brother's friends, Anthony and Booby, they had jobs, so they was able to get the disco DJ equipment immediately. My brother, he comes home one day and he says, yo, Daryl, we got to get a couple like Everybody else. And just from the look in his face, I knew he where he was going. We want to do a comic book sale.

Oh, no.

And he made me sell all my comics. I mean, my attic was full of spider everything. So we got this equipment now, and I'm dabbling with it. So Joe comes over my house this day. It's only him. Let's play basketball. Here's where everything hit the fan. This is where fates and destiny steps in. One of the rules. When I was younger, remember earlier I said my parents always worked? So they were always gone from eight in the morning to four at night. Eight in the morning, four, always gone. So one of the rules was, when there's no adults home, you can't have company.

Huh?

But this particular day, it's just Joe. We would get out of school 2:10. My parents didn't get home till 4pm so this day we played basketball. It was only like 3:10. So usually what I would do is I would go in that. People gonna love this. I would go in the house, get the jug of ice water and the Dixie cups, and I would come to the back door, give each kid a Dixie cup, fill the cup up. This particular day is just Joe Joseph Simmons itself. I say, you know what? My mother and Paula ain't come home for another hour. You can come in to get the water. So I bring him in my house to go in the basement and wait. When he goes to the basement, he sees me and my brother's turntables.

Oh.

So I come downstairs, he goes, do you do this? And I go, nah, I don't. You know, that's like my secret thing. No, I can't let nobody know, you know? It's almost like, no, I'm not Spider Man.

Right? Yeah. Or he's made it to the Bat Cave.

Right, right, right. Yes. I actually let run in the Bat Cave. Right. So he asked me if I'm Batman. I go, no. But then he goes, well, my brother is Russell Simmons. If you ever seen the flyers and the posters of the disco DJ MC Hip Hop shows. My brother, he manages and he promotes all those parties. So now I'm a little open. I'm like, yeah. And then he goes, yeah, I am the son of Curtis Blow. And I'm like, what's that? He says, well, I'm the protege as Curtis Blow. Every summer I go on the road and I get to rap with Curtis Blow. So now, besides Catholic school and basketball, me. Me and Joe found another thing to connect. So what we used to do after this day was we would leave school, play ball for a half hour, and then go in the basement and DJ together.

Wow.

But one day we're down in the basement, and usually when I knew Joe was down, coming to the basement, I would hide my rhyme book while I was writing my rhymes because it was like my. It was like my diary.

Yeah.

But one fateful day, I forget to put it away, and it's my turn to DJ. I'm DJing, and I look over at Joe and he got my. My book in his hand. So I run over there and I try to grab it from him. He's like, what's this? What's this? You know? Now he know he's on his uhhuh. And then he says, no, calm down. And he said he was reading it and he says these words to me, this is in eighth grade. I'll never forget. He goes, d, this is really good. Then he says, whenever my brother lets me make a record, because remember, I'm telling you, all of this time runs 15 years old. And his brother's here, let me make a record. Let me make a record. Russell is saying, no, Joey, no, Joe. You too young. But then Joe, he had it on his mind, he gonna make that record one day. But then he says to me, deep whatever. My brother lets me make a record. I'm putting you in my group. And I look at him and go, what in the hell? I don't really do this. You Curtis Flow, Grandmaster Flash, Zulu Nation. Y' all guys really do this how? This is just a hobby. He just pointed at me and he smirked. So we graduate elementary school, eighth grade. We graduate, we go to two completely different high schools, right? He goes to Andrew Jackson High School in Queensland, which was about five minutes from Hollis. Me, on the other hand, at the time, my best friend was this guy named Douglas Ace. We went to St. Pascal's from kindergarten to eighth grade together. So then we decided, yo, we're going to go to Rice High School, which was an all boys Catholic high school in Harlem. We said, that's where we're going to go for the next four years. So for four years, me and run at different school, different high schools, but, you know, we seeing each other in the neighborhood, doing the thing that kids do. So I voted Rice high school for four years. In the 12th year of rice High School, I was the class of 82, June of 82. I graduated August 82. The phone rings. It's Joe A.D. what's up? What's up, Joe? He goes, Remember, four years ago in eighth grade when I told you, if my brother lets me make a record, I go, yeah. And if I get a chance, I'm putting you in my group. I go, yeah. He goes, grab your wine book. We're going to the studio to make them. In June, August of 82, me and Run went and recorded our first single called it's like that and that's the Way it Is, which was a record about how the community and the conditions in New York City and all cities were. And then it was always A side, B side. In those early years, remember, disco records was a side, B side, side. So the A side was our social commentary record. It's like that, and that's the way it is. Talking about the world. And the B side was a song called Sucker mc, which said, if you don't rap as good as me and Joe, you're a sucker mc. Oh, here I sit with you because of Catholic School, David McEachern, Disco and Jovi, a man of his word.

Oh, man,

that's crazy, right?

That is crazy. Oh, my gosh. Well, and that. This is a perfect segue. I mean, gosh, thank you for sharing that story. That is so crazy in so many different ways. So now I'm gonna. I need you to fact check me, because I knew about. It's like that. So that was released like around 83 and then. So.

84.

84. Okay, so now. Okay, continue to fact check me. So I think.

No, no, 83, you're right. 83. 83.

All right, well, here. Here's where I may mess up. So.

Yes, like that Suck of season was 83.

Okay.

That was our first single. Yep.

Yeah. So then that was it. In 97, it got remixed by Jason Nevins into a 10 inch vinyl. Okay. And then.

And that was so powerful. It took the Spice. Here's a quick fact. Musically, the Spice Girls, remember how huge they were? They were number one on the UK charts for like 30 weeks.

Yeah, yeah.

Run DMC, Jason Nimmons is like, that comes out. And we were the force that took the Spice Girl out at number one in the uk.

Oh, my gosh.

In the uk. Wow.

Well, I have. My research says that that that sold around 5 million copies worldwide.

Yes, it was huge.

Made it the best selling single of all times. And then in 2008, it ranked 40 on VH1's 100 Greatest Hip Hop songs. So it's all from. From. From that guy breaking that. That hoop back in elementary school.

Yeah, exactly, exactly, man. And you know, even when I speak to young kids. I said, don't be ashamed of the things that you like for your imagination because you never know what it could do for you.

Yeah, here, here, here. Well, you know, from what you were talking about too, of like the whole disco thing and then the equipment and sampling and mixing and things like that, like, and, and you guys, you in particular and Run DMC as a band were known for breaking down barriers in a variety of ways, musically, etc. I didn't know about the, the Spice Girls, which is actually pretty cool. But you guys famously mixed like with Aerosmith and, and Walk this Way. How did that come about? Was that. Was Rick Rubin part of that or how.

What? Yes, yes, yes, yes. Rick Rubin, you know, the great producer Rick Ruby. Now it's a tongue twister. What people need to understand is Walk this Way isn't the first rock rap record. The first rock rap record was a record called Rock Box, Excuse me, which was on our first self titled album, Run dmc. The Rockbox song was the song which got hip hop on MT tv. But the reason why we did rock rap was we was rapping over rock, funk, R B, disco, folk, rock, classical, whatever had a dope beat and good music. The DJs would use that for the rap of the rap over. So when we made up, we came out with our first single. It's like that circumcise 83, 1984. We came out with a second single, Hard Times, Jam Master J. And then we took it upon ourselves in 84 because the whole world was saying, okay, we'll give you all these singles that are y' all doing that. Y' all are doing like the disco records. But the whole world and all the music critics was there's no way anybody wants to hear a whole album full of hip hop in this rap stuff. So Run DMC in 1984 we released a self titled Run DMC Hip Hop Album with Rockbox as the single. We did a video for that that gets us on MTV now. Everybody was like, oh, you can't do it again. So then in 85 I get mad because like I said as a kid growing up, you know, Michael Jackson, Change Brown and everybody was cool. I didn't like the fact that people was trying to segregate music because I grew up listening to a state, a station that played black and white music and then just call it black and white, man. They just called it good music. So we heard everybody doing it. So I said, you know what, I'm going to write a song Called the King of Rock. Like, I'm not going to call myself the King of Rap because you. You're looking at that like that's something low. I said, I'm gonna write a song called the King of Rock. And my. My. My intention was to have Elvis Presley and Mick Jagger chair and all the rock guys bow when I walk in the room. So 85, we do a self. We do an album called the King of Rock with the single King of Rock and Rockbox and King of Rock actually worked. It started to change the atmosphere in the music business. So in 86. 6, we say, you know what? What was one of the. Our favorite rock beats to rap over? It was this song. This is funny. It was this song on the album with the toys on the COVID and all. Me and Run knew it was number four. We didn't know the name of it because our dj, Jam Master J, would scratch the name off the label and the record so the rival DJs wouldn't know what music he was playing like. So me and Run just knew, yo, let's sample or let's steal the album with the toys number four. That album was Aerosmith's Toys in the Attic.

Huh.

So we were sampling Toys in the Attic. Rick Rubin, who became our producer at the time. Rick is just brilliant. He says, no, don't sample it and talk about how good y' all on the mic. Remake the record over the way the band originally did it. And at first, me and Running want to do that because we want to talk about us. I want to let the world know how great I am, but with a little. With a little collaboration for this collaboration, a little cooperation for me and Run and Jam Master J, Joe's brother, Russell Hustle. And Rick was saying, y' all gotta do this. So we decided to do the record over the way the band originally did it. But here's why it made history and changed music while we in Run. Because me and Run had never heard the full record, or if we did hear the full record, we never paid attention about it.

Yeah.

Because at that time, we just wanted the first few seconds with the drum beat so we could talk about us. Like, you know, we had heard the record on the radio, but it was something that wasn't something that we was going out to buy and listen. Right while we were learning the actual vocals of the record, Rick actually called over to Boston. Now, remember, Errol Smith at the time was gone. They were over.

They were. They. You resurrected them? Yeah.

I mean, yeah, they were like, done y. So Rick calls them and says, hello, my name is Rick Rubin. I know you know who Run DMC is. We want to do your record, Walk this Way Over. Do you want to do it? So imagine Aerosmith real.

Who.

Who is this? And Rick goes, my name is Rick Rubin. I know you know who Run DMC is. I'm producing them. We are doing your record over. Do you want to do it? So Steve and Joe Perry at the time, now, remember they were making. They were working on that album that had. Dude Looks Like a Lady of Angel. Phenomenal record, but nobody cared. They were humble and kind enough to go, yeah, man, we heard of the Run DMC guys. We like what they're doing. Let's do the record together. So we go in the studio together, we do the record. The record comes out so good. They say, yo, we're going to do a video. We do the video. Of course, Aerosmith's already on mtv. Run DMC just got on mtv. They put the video on mtv and the whole world changed. Literally.

Yeah.

What that record did was. And people tell me this all over the world. I've been to every country. I could go to somebody, somewhere I haven't been yet. Since 86, when walk this Way Drop with Aerosmith, I get this every time I go. They go, dmc, don't you know, when Steven Tyler took that microphone, it knocked down the wall that was separating y' all in the video. It didn't just happen in the video. It really happened all over the world.

Yeah.

From Asia to Germany. Musically, J. Black people and white people going together. Now, the reason why it was able to happen was when people was channel surfing on mtv, they go, what in the world is the hip hop guys Run DMC doing with the Rolling Stones? And then the aerospace fans who knew it wasn't the Rolling Stones, it was, what in the world is Aerosmith doing with it? The reason why it was so shocking, but it did move something. I mean, it gave birth to rage against the machine and lit biscuit corn. Like everything that music is doing with collaborations of different genre is because of what Run DMC and Aerosmith did. But the reason why it worked prior to that. When you look back in music history, everything that is powerful and perfect about all us as the human race is always in front of our faces, but we refuse to ignore it. It's only the arts that bring these things to light. Because of Aerosmith and Ready FC working together, we were able to look back and say, oh, it was already being done. What do you mean? When you look at the Beatles. The fifth member of the Beatles was Billy Preston. He was known as the fifth Evil. Even when they did their last show on the roof, they had to have Billy Preston there.

Wow.

When you look at Bruce Springsteen in the east street bed, Clarence Clemens, the black man playing the Sat. Right, Muddy Waters. There's a video where Muddy Waters is performing in England and the Stones keep. Mick Jagger, Keith Richards are in the crowd like little kids in Muddy Waters calls them up on us. So all of these things was always there for us. That's why I Walk this Way was the game changer. Because you saw Run DMC and you saw Aerosmith together.

Huge. Just. Yeah. I mean, really pivotal moment. Pivotal moment. I just stumbled across Sing for the Moment as a mix with Aerosmith and Eminem, which. I don't know how long that's been out, but I just. I just tripped upon that one.

Because they use Dream On.

Yeah, exactly. And did you.

And hip hop is good for that because Grandmaster Kaz, Grandmaster cast from one of the greatest hip hop groups ever. He says hip hop didn't invent anything. We reinvented everything. All the music that we were hearing, our mothers, aunts, uncles, grandmothers and grandfathers listening to, we took that music, and it. By that music is this existing but music being in existence. It gave us a platform to tell our stories. And we didn't have to have permission. And we were able to use the music. We was able to use art. And it. Art allows you to not have to ask for permission to be heard or be seen. You know what I'm saying? And when you do it like that, beautiful things happen.

Yeah. Have you seen that? What you're saying reminds me of just a beautiful, beautiful scene. I've probably rewatched it four times at this point. I'll probably have to watch it again after we've talked. Have you seen the movie Sinners yet?

Yes.

Do you remember that scene in the juke joint where. Oh, it's gonna make me cry talking about it. It is so moving to go through. I mean, the way they shoot it, the way the music. Oh, my gosh.

And then it shows that all of this is connected.

Yeah. Oh, my God.

Africans. The Indians.

Yeah.

They brought the hip hop in there. The whole key to that is all the same thing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm saying it's all the same thing of different expressions. It's like when we was doing this, you know, once we did the Run DMC thing. You remember the. The punk rock group or rap group Hip Hop Group, the Beastie Boys. Before Eminem, there was the Beastie Boys. And when the Beastie Boys. Rick Rubin was the producer and DJ for the Beastie Boys. Once Rick started producing us, Rick, Ash, Jason, do you think these three white Jewish punk rock guys from Manhattan, do you think they can make a hip hop album? Jay, the black hip hop DJ that's at the pinnacle to throw sitting on the throne of hip hop. Says the Rick. Yes. And by Jason, why not? A couple of months later, License to Ill comes out by the Beastie Boys. But we were already doing it. When. When you look at an artist like Billy Joel, remember his song We Didn't Start the Fire? He was rapping segregation, integration. We didn't start the fight, like I'm saying.

Yeah.

For us to do Walk this Way Over, Jay had to say, don't sing it like Stephen Tyler. He's doing what he do. Take those lyrics and rap them the way Run DMC would. Backseat lover. How do need to cover Talk to My Daddy, Say, it's all like, it's all the same things. And, yeah, like, all my Jewish friends, all my European friends, all my Asian friends, all my African friends, we talk about the music, the songs, the comic book, the stories, the TV shows, this commute. It's all about communication. And when you look at the Beastie Boys, they're punk rock and hip hop, rock, pop, folk. It's different sounds, different deliveries, different things, but it's all coming from the same place.

Yeah.

So Walk this Way was like, oh, we get it now. We were already doing it, but a lot of us were afraid to do it because we thought of what people would think. And, you know, everybody trying to stay in their own lane, not realizing, I don't care if it's Italian food, Chinese food, or Jamaican food, it's all still food.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's so good.

Well, that.

That's. Maybe this is a good segue from one of the things you talked about with your image of. Of being the King of Rock. So I want to talk a little bit about your. Your memoirs. So thus far. Because I think there's probably more coming, but thus far, you've written two. The first in 2021 was entitled King of Rock, Respect Responsibility in My Life with Run dmc, which Will Smith, very cool. Did the introduction to, and more recently, 10 ways not to Commit Suicide, a memoir, which I recently just finished, and I'd like to discuss it with you. But before we get into that, I want to first share what a couple of other notables have said about it. Chuck D, a public enemy, said DMC's must read memoir ventures into uncharted territory for all musicians, period. Not just hip art, hip hop artists. His honesty about his feelings easily makes this book an achievement that ranks alongside his hall of Fame rhymes. Queen Latifah said. Daryl DMC McDaniels is a deeply talented artist who has much to teach us. I applaud his courage and compassion in sharing his personal story. 10 Ways not to Commit Suicide is an inspiring read for all audiences and Darrell, I have to agree. It was moving. It was a great work. I learned a lot that I did not know. I have to tip my hat to you about the honesty and transparency about a lot of your, pardon me, very dark moments. And I didn't know that you had lost your voice and been diagnosed with spasmodic dysphonia. So maybe start with that. Tell us about that and then let's go from there.

Right, so this all started with. All right, let me sound like this. In 1993, the same thing. Rundy. This is funny too. In 1993, the same thing Run DMC did forever Smith somebody did for us. Pete Rock of the group Pete Rock and Seal Spoon. Pete Rock is one of the greatest hip hop producers ever who was like everybody else after us. Y' all inspired us to be this from. From Ice Cube to Ice Tea to Pete Rock Naughty, but to Eminem. Eminem actually did our Rock and roll induction hall of Fame speech. So in 1993, run DMC from 83 to 93, there was nothing more powerful than run DMC. But we gave birth to everybody from Tupac to Biggie to Naughty by nature. To him, everything that's going on is because of us. So we were well respected and we were the OGs. We were the pioneers. Everybody called us the reason why, but we wasn't participating as much. So Pete Rock and Seal smooth Pete Rock at the, at the height of his his reign, he goes, I want to do a song with Run DMC and we're going to do their first song over Sucker MC Seas. So he produces this record called down with the King for us and me and Run rapped on it with him in cl Smooth. That record put us back on a chart, back on mtv, back on the road. So here we are now. And. And literally, because they did that for us, everywhere we went, you know, people was calling us the kings. But now, Doc, everywhere we go, people literally bow and be Running J Walk in the room. Wow, we are ashamed. Do that. No, they're like nowhere bowing. And people would literally kneel and hold us up on a pedestal.

Wow.

When that happened, I don't know why I got depressed, suicidal. I remember the day the down with the King video came out. And down with the King, everybody from Redman and Method man to Eazy E came to show up and give us love.

Wow.

When the video dropped, I'm going, here I am back on the chart, back on mtv, back on the road, back on the radio. Why do I want to kill myself? And I didn't know what it was. So I started with the depression. And like people say, like it's known what manifests internally will start to manifest on the exterior. Right. So I get depressed, I don't know what it is. And then my voice just starts leaving. So now that my voice is leaving, I'm depressed. Oh, I forgot to add that prior to down with the King coming out in 1990, I was diagnosed with acute pancreatitis.

Oh, right.

I had to stop drinking.

Yeah.

I was drinking in the, in the hood. There was a brand called Old English 800 and they would make these 40 ounce bottles of it. It started with 32 ounces and then they started selling so good, it was like, we're gonna give them 40 ounces.

Oh, wow.

So some people in the neighborhood was drinking two and three. I was drinking a case a day. So that should have been a sign something was wrong with me. But the problem with it, with that, and in a lot of communities, a lot of harmful, destructive behavior is celebrated in our communities. Meaning the guy or the girl that has sex with everybody, the guy that beats everybody up, the guy that takes the most shots. In my situation, you know, it's normal to drink three and four. 40s DMC, Daryl, he drinks 12. Let's salute him like it's a great feat. So because of that, in addition, and this is 1240 ounces during the day, I'm still going out, night, I'm still on tour. So now I'm hanging with Jack Daniels, Jim Beam and Johnny Walker.

Oh, geez. Wow.

24 hours a day. So in 1990, I get acute pancreatitis. I get in the hospital for a month and a half. I couldn't take it internally. I had to have everything done intravenously.

Wow.

When I heal, fortunately my liver was good. And that my liver was good. My pancreas was, wasn't damaged. The doctor tells me, son, we're going to let you go home now, but you have two choices. And I'm like, what's that you can drink and lit, you can drink and die on, drink and live. So, Doc, I did good from 90 to 93. I'm doing good now. I am back at the top of my game and I'm depressed. I didn't know what to do. So my voice starts leaving. And. And you gotta understand, at the time when I first got depressed, even though I'm dmc, the mighty DMC who walked this way in his Adidas and tell the world how tricky, tricky, tricky life could be, I didn't know what to do. So the depression comes on, my voice starts leaving Chris. So then your mind starts going, oh, you can't rap no more. You have no purpose here in this universe. Because imagine from. From the day I got out of high school, I've been. This has been my life right now I can't do the thing I think I was put here to do. So now the suicidal thoughts come in. Oh, so I get depressed, my voice leave. Now I'm suicidal. And then the feeling that I have in me is going, if I die tomorrow, people know what the DMC guy did. And I'm dealing with all of these emotions. And then I go, just in case I kill myself tomorrow, I want people to know who the DMC guy is. So I decided to write the book, which is the second book, which turned into ten Ways. I mean, no, the first book, my adoption, not my adoption. I decided to write the book, Respect, Responsibility, King of Rock My Life, and run dfc. So what happened was people know what me running Jay did. I know I'm born May 31, 1964. But just to make it more interesting for the reader, I want some details about the day I was born. So I called my mother up. Now, looking back, I should have said, mom, I'm depressed. I don't know what's going on. But you know, the whole situation, stigma with mental health.

Right?

You know, I don't want to trouble her. I'm supposed to be strong. Men don't do this, the whole thing. So I didn't bother about going down and telling my real truth. So I go, mom, I'm writing this book and I know My birthday is May 31, 1964. I need some details on, you know, the day I was born. How much did I weigh? She told me what time. She told what time I was born. She told me what hospital. She told me. Thank you, Mom. I love you. I love you too, son. And hang up now. This is crazy, huh? An hour goes by, the phone rings. It's my Mother and my father, just because I asked these questions, they go, we have something else to tell you. I go, what? I'm depressed, I'm alcoholic, I'm suicidal. To go, we have something else to tell you. I'm thinking they're going to go, well, when we gave birth to you, when I gave birth to you, there was a power outage in the hospital. When we gave birth to you by candlelight. I'm thinking it was going to be one of those stories.

Right. Yeah.

We have something else to tell you. What? Well, he was a month old when we, we was. You was a month old when we brought you home. And you're adopted, but we love you. Bye.

Click.

So imagine no voice.

Oh, gosh.

Press suicidal. So immediately when I had heard that, that, that, that revelation. Somebody get Johnny and Jack and Jim in here.

Yeah.

I started drinking again.

Oh, gosh. Oh, wow.

So I didn't even have an opportunity to deal with the suicide.

And you're, you're like, you're in your 30s at this point when you hear 35 years old. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Gosh.

So not know. Even though, like I said the crazy things, I'm dmc, not knowing what to do. Self medication let me go back to the thing that worked. You know what I'm saying? For me.

Right. Yeah.

But that I'm not supposed to be drinking because I have pancreatitis. Subconsciously, I found a way to kill myself.

Right. Yeah.

I didn't have to step on the third rail. I didn't have to hang myself. I didn't have to shoot myself.

Yeah.

All I got to do is just drink this and I'll die in peace.

Yeah.

I won't have to deal with what I'm going through.

Yeah.

But in the midst of that, I just found out that I was adopted. So that even didn't get worse.

God. So step.

Yeah. Imagine what I was dealing with.

Well, and, and I think. So that happens. And then, you know, the, the struggle kind of resumes. And like, then you lost Jay and then shortly thereafter, your dad was. Is that all kind of proximate to this time about the.

Yes, it went like this.

Oh, it just kept.

Yes, yes. This was crazy. Oh, I get depressed. I get, I get depressed. I lose my voice. I get suicidal. I find out that I'm adopted. Chair master Jake is shot, killed in. My father dies. So imagine where I was at. And all during this time of self medicating, I'm driving my wife crazy. I just had my son. My son was born in 93. And it's crazy how life works. All of this hit at the same time. So my wife is going crazy. She's mad at me because she's going, excuse my language. You ain't supposed to be drinking because you have pancreatitis. And you got me and your son.

Yeah, yeah.

So, you know, I'm in an alcoholic stupor. She's over and over telling me, go to rehab, go to rehab, go to rehab. And she can't do it no more. And, you know, my friends is telling me, you know, my management, my friends, that I grew up in the music, but go to rehab, go to rehab. But I'm like, no, I'm. I'm okay. Because I got Jack Daniels Champion and Johnny Walker.

Yeah. My treatment team.

Yes.

Yes.

Imagine what I was going through. So I was going on and on and on and on, my wife screaming at me, telling me, go to rehab. And then of Leo Cohen, who used to be my road manager during the rise of the whole red DMC see kingdom, he is now the head of Def Jam Records. He's this big record exec. He's telling me, go to rehab, this and that. Boom, bang. And it was just crazy. Like, it was ridiculous. And then it just got to a point where I said. It got to a point where my wife goes, daryl, I. I think you should. I think what's going on with you is there's an emptiness in who you are as your identity. I think you should find your birth mother. And I'm like, oh, hell no. I don't want. You heard the records, like, in Christmas time in Hollis, Queens. I, like, I didn't know at the time that college wasn't the beginning of my story.

Yeah.

The way we started this talk out and what happened with that, My wife's in my ear, you should find your bro. I'm thinking that'll help you. That'll fill the void. Because when. When down with the King came out and I'm back on the road, I'm back on the radio, I'm back on tour, and I'm back on the charts and doing everything I was doing for the last 10 years, there was something that was missing. And when I look back, the missing piece is this of Daryl McDaniels. One of the greatest rhymes is a. A 1 minute, 30 second record on the album. Raising Hell with Walk this Way and indeed is where I go. Son of Byford, brother of Al Banna's. My mother runs my pal. It's McDaniels, not McDonald's. These rhymes or darrows. Those burgers are Ronalds. I ran down my family tree. My mother, my father, my brother and me. Okay? That's my truth. But the missing fact to who I am dmc, I'm the King of Rock who walked his way in his Adidas. Tell the world how tricky life can be. I didn't know life was so tricky that there was another part to my identity, the fact that I was adopted.

Wow.

So all of this happens. Down with the king. Jay getting shot, farther dying. Now I'm alcoholic self medicating this and that. And everybody's telling me, go to rehab, go to rehab. My wife is telling me, you know, maybe if you find your birth mother, this will help you in some way. Maybe that's the missing link to you. So it wasn't until a friend of a friend heard that I just found out that I was adopted a week earlier. This friend was meeting with his friend, who was a lady who knew she was adopted since she was 14, but she was in the process of searching for her birth parents and she kept hitting dead ends and she was depressed. So this one friend was like, I don't know. And I love the way this came about. I'm going through all of this. And they just said it was actually, she's a casting director in la. Her name is Sheila Jaffe. And if you want to know who she cast, she cast Sopranos, Entourage, Travolta, Mark Wahlberg. Like, she's a big casting director at this, this, this time. She was doing a search for her birth parents because if she wasn't getting away, she was depressed. So this her agent friend who I was meeting with because my manager, Eric, wanted me to, to. They was like, my manager, my publicist was like, keep them busy, keep them working. Because even they didn't know what to do.

Yeah, yeah.

So they're trying to get me to do this movie. But then when the agent that I met with found out that I was depressed because I just found out that I was adopted, he goes, I don't know how this possibly could help thee, but just somebody I think you should talk to. And I didn't know this was like therapy. I didn't know this was like, this was hands on training of how therapy works. So all he did was introduce me to Sheila. And all me and Sheila did was go to lunch one day and speak about being adopted. And it was one of the greatest things that could ever happen.

Wow.

And then Sheila goes, she goes, oh, Daryl, by the way, Mark Wahlberg, one of her clients. Once a month, Mark Wahlberg gives us his offices in Santa Monica, California, where we go in and we have Adoption Anonymous meetings. And I was like, what's that about?

Wow.

It's just adopted people from all walks of life, all nations, all race, creed, religions, races and colors, we just go in a room and talk. So I go to these Adoption Anonymous, we go to about seven of them. And in the seventh one, they asked me, d don't you want to know who your birth parents are? And I go, nope, don't give me. I'm trying to heal right now. I was trying to stay far, far away from that. In addition, with my wife in my ear, I think you should find your birth parents. Something came upon me to say, okay, you know what, I gotta go. And I didn't want to. I should go look at seeing who my birth parents was. The catalyst. This is very powerful. The catalyst, Chris, was this. In the Adoption Anonymous meeting, another adoptee said, well, there's this famous adopting lady who's not a celebrity, she's just famous because she said this. She said the reason why an adoptee should should search now, you don't have to your life, you write your story. Nobody else can write it for you. And I have many adopted friends that said, no, I don't need to know because, you know, I'm good and that's it. Right. But this would blew my mind. You got to remember, I'm a comic book brain. Like I imagine everything I do in life is me pretending to be a superhero. So the thing that was a catalyst to me being healed was this, this lady in the Adoption Anonymous meeting goals. The reason why an adoptee should search besides medical. And this is key now, my father Byford, when I was filling out job applications, my father had diabetes. So when I would fill out of diet, I would write diabetes. That was true.

Yeah.

Because I didn't know my whoa. Real birth father and birth mother were so she. The reason why an adoptee should. You don't have to should be size medical. This is so powerful, Chris. And I go, what? Why should I do it? You'd never start a book from chapter two. So I was living my life. My run DMC journey from day one in Hollis didn't include chapter one.

Wow. Wow.

So when I came back in 93. Three and something hit me. There's something missing to this room. It was the fact that there was a chapter one to my existence. When she said that to me, I remember what my wife said, you should. I think you finding your Birth should help you. And then my fellow adoptees being instigators, you should do it. I said, okay, if I'm gonna go down chapter one, I gotta be of sound mind. You know the saying sound mind and body saying, is it sound body and mind? Because if the mind ain't right first, yeah, the body reacts to that. So I said, in order for me to go find my Chapter one, I got to be a sound mind and body. So the first thing I have to do is go to rehab to get sober. So I went to rehab to get sober. But it was in rehab, I found my super superpower. And that was this thing called therapy. So all of this trauma, all of this mystery, all of the. All the elements from. From David McEachin Breaking the Rim to me being brought to Hollis, the meat run by Fred Pana. Disco. This is crazy. Disco hip hop all prodded me so I could find my chapter one. And it made me realize to this day, you know, first to go gold, first to go platinum, first on the COVID Rolling Stone, you know, take the Spice Girls out of number one. First non athletic entity to receive a major sports endorsement from the Adidas Corporation. And I'm not even an athlete. All of those things are cool. But my. My story made me realize that the Run DMC stuff was just a setup for what I was put here to do. And my greatest achievement is I'm living, breathing proof that you can beat and defeat whatever it is that you're struggling with. And more importantly, no matter how bad, dark, effed up, or traumatic your story is, you are perfect just the way you are. So I want people to hear my story. I want them to listen to the records. I want them to get the children's book, the comic book. I want them to get both of the books that I've written. Like I mentioned, I gotta write another one. Because my memoir is my story up till now, right? Usually it's up, I'm dead, so. Still got more that I'm doing. But I represent that. That all of us have a beautiful story and all of us have a reason to be alive. And that is this. Not to be the best guitar player, best basketball player, not to be the billionaire, not to be, none of that. Just everyday people who are kings and queens and royalty. Because their story, their existence, what they've been through, the hard times and the good times, you can save a life. That's what I represent.

Beautiful.

But my. My story had to come the same way. This is crazy, too. I didn't know this until I meet a friend who says, demon, I saw your story, man. And, you know, I know that you love hip hop and comic books and you can draw and all of that, but he says to me, the guy that made me start my comic book company, Daryl, makes comics. He goes, you really are on some superhero stuff. And I'm like, what you talking about? And Chris, he hit me with this. This is after he. I came out of rehab and I'm in therapy and I'm talking about it. And the reason why I'm so. The reason why I'm able to talk about it this way is one of the things with hip hop, when, from the. Not from the music business standpoint, one of the things that you could never do with hip hop, we have a saying, keep it real. So when I got out of rehab, people would see me, yo, I see Run, I see Russell, I see this, I see that. You know, I see Joe with his kids. Because my. My partner Run after James To J got shot and killed, my partner Run had a successful reality TV show for 10. 10 seasons, or run House. So people knew what Run was doing. But for 10 seasons after Jay died, DMC disappeared. So hip hop has one of these values called keep it real. So when I get out of rehab, I was in rehab for a whole month, right? I get out of rehab and I go back to 7 11. I'm back in the airport, I'm back in the gym. First question to people is, dmc, where you been? Why you ain't no Run House? What's going on? Number one, the reason why I run dmc, the reason why Run DMC ain't together is because J, Master J passed away. The reason why Run DMC ain't together is because J, Master J passed away. And my joke is that, you're gonna love this. I tell people this, Chris, Run DMC will get back together if this happens. What? What? What? Run DMC will get back together when the Beatles get back together, Everybody, when I say that today, laugh. And that happened. No, but you gotta understand, the group is Run Dipsey and Jam Master J. Yeah, this was, you know, John. And you know what I'm saying?

Yeah, yeah.

So I say that. But then they go, so what's up with you, Be? And I go, well, I was an alcoholic suicide, a metaphysical spiritual wreck who found out he was adopted at age 35. Chair Master J got shot, and I got out of rehab and therapy. And then they go, what? Their minds are blown.

Right?

You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

So when I Share that. What I'm trying to do is. One of my greatest raps, is this. If you remove guilt and shame from your situation, you remove the pain of going through the struggle to better or heal yourself.

Yeah.

Like, whatever happened to you is painful. But if we take guilt and shake, we shouldn't be ashamed of being alcoholic. You shouldn't be ashamed of being on meth. You shouldn't be ashamed of being a force kid or adopted kid at home. When you remove your situation, your situation, but it doesn't define you.

Exactly. Exactly.

Remove guilt and shame and. And people go, that's really deep, D. Yeah. Because this is what I'm talking about. Nobody in this world feels ashamed or guilty to that. When I see you, Chris, you know, at work or whatever, if you're a family member, whatever, if I see you, I'm not ashamed that I don't feel guilty to go, yo, my tooth is hurting. Because if I say that to you, you're gonna go, yo. Go to the dentist. If I say, yo, Chris, I just got out the gym and I think I did something wrong, you're gonna say, yo, go see the doctor. Go see the chiropractor. And I'll never forget this. And this is what I'm talking about with mental health. You know, sex addicts, gambling addicts, alcoholics, meth, whatever it is, ocd. All the stuff that goes with mental health that people think is weird. Number one, everybody goes through something, but number two, I'll never forget this. And this what makes it easy for me to talk about it without guilt and shame, I'll never forget. Let's go back to the beginning of this discussion in second grade, right? I'm sitting there. Ms. Peterson, she noticed something's going on with this kid, Daryl McDaniels. And I'm not knowing what's going on, but I didn't find out until one day my mother comes pick me up, right? I'm standing there being all normal, and Ms. Peterson goes to my mother right in front of my face. Ms. McDaniels, can I talk to you for a minute? What? Yeah. Yes.

Okay.

What's. What's up, Ms. Peterson? I think there's something wrong with Daryl. So, you know, a little second grade, I look at my. Miss Peter said, what? What the hell? I can draw. I got my comic book. Ms. Peterson with no shame goes, I think Daryl needs glasses. Because I noticed when I look at him, he's quitting to see the blackboard. And my mother did that. My mother took me to get an eye Examination. And that's the reason why Daryl makes glasses. A flaw in me, a weakness that when I started making my Rack records, I would go on DMC in a place that to be. D's for doing it all of the time. M's photo rhyme stat or mine sees for cool. Cool ass compete and rumble. Say, D, why you wear those glasses? I would go, all right, So I could see. So you know what I'm saying. So the same way you would tell me, yo, D, go to the dentist, go to the car, go to the eye doctor. It's the same way people gonna start noticing the people around them. Friends, family, co workers. All day we see people. You know, you work with people for 40 years, 30 years, three months, you know, years. And every day you ask, yo, how you doing today? And they go, I'm all right. So we gotta look people in the eye and say, yo, if you ever need somebody to talk to, I'm here for you. Because you never know what they're going through, but they're guilty and ashamed to tell you because they might think you might think they're aware.

Yeah.

So me being like, yeah, I'm an alcoholic, suicidal, metaphysical, physical, spiritual wreck who found out he was adopted at age 35. My friend got shot and killed in. My father died, but I went to rehab and I went to therapy, and I was able to do something about it. So keeping it real will save a life.

Yeah.

So if we're not guilty and ashamed, remove the guilt and shame, and you remove the pain of what you're going through. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

And that once you remove guilt and shame, it allows you to heal. Removing guilt and shame doesn't heal you automatically because you still got to go through the journey.

It opens up the process. And it. You know, I think it's the yin and yang of it, too, because as you talk about it from a point of bravery and commitment, about transparency and honesty and keeping it real, it's also the other flip side of it. It's its responsibility to whoever else is in our lives to not be judgmental, to be accepting, like your wife, you know, to be so loving and supportive in a way, you know, a tough, loveish kind of way. But, you know, I think that's. That's huge.

Yeah.

Like.

Like in the book, when I first started drinking after I found out that I was adopted, my excuse was, I'm celebrating. I'm burping and hiccuping, and I'm pissy drunk going, I'm celebrating to Celebrate the new revelation of my newfound beauty identity. My wife, she said, emma, effort. I'll never forget this. I remember this from the day she said it. And it hit me at my core. She said, emma, effort. You're only drinking because you can't emotionally deal with the fact that you just found out she was adopted.

Wow.

And that was something. No therapist, no PhD because she kept it real. That's why, you know, bullseye close to you, you know.

Yeah.

And. And I look back, I was like, you know, when I got to therapy, I realized therapy did two things for me. Reminded me of stuff that I said to myself that I didn't listen to and reminded me of all the stuff that other people said to me that

I didn't listen to. That's good.

Now therapy allows you to sit there and listen to it and be honest with yourself.

I love it.

But that's so crazy that. Oh. What I was going to say about the comic book. So my friend calls me. I got the courage now, Chris, to talk about. Yeah, I'm an alcoholic. This Naboo bag. My friend who made me start the comic book because he said this. He said, d, you could do the same thing you've done with your music all these years. And I'm like, what that? Inspire, motivate, and educate while you entertain. His name is Riggs Morales, and this is funny. He was actually Eminem's A R over at Shady Records for Eminem's record company, who inducted me into the Rock Roll hall of Fame. He was actually part of Eminem's rise of his kingdom.

Wow.

But then he says this to me, and this is. This is going to send chills to everybody. He says, d, you really are a superhero. He said, when I heard the Run DMC Records, and I looked at you with your glasses and your hat and your gloves and your Adidas suit and your Adidas and your gold chain. It was like he was my superhero, the way he was dressed up. But then he hit me with this D. This is crazy. You are actually like what she was attracted to in me as a kid. I said, what you talking about? He said, don't you know most superheroes are adopted or in a foster situation? Oh, Superman.

Yeah.

What happened to me is what happened. Clark, sit down or something. We need to tell you we got your parents. We love you very much. But imagine being told from another alien this and that. You would sit here. Batman. Then he started hitting me with this. Then he hit me with Batman saw his mother, father murdered in front of him.

Right.

Most of us are. TR Superman saw his whole world destroyed.

Yeah.

But still was able to serve a purpose.

Wow.

Batman's mother and father murdered in front of him. And still to this day, today, he'll catch the criminal, but he won't lower his emotional, physical, spiritual self to their level. He won't kill him. He'll just catch him going back in jail, but he won't. Lord, then he hit me with this. This is the killer one. I grew up in New York City. When I found out that Peter Parker was from Queens like me, the reason why I shout out my hood on the record isn't because it's a hip hop thing and I'm repping my hood. When I found out as a kid, Spider man from. From Queens like me, it was real. He hits me with this D, your idol, Peter Parker. And I'm like, what you talking about? Peter Parker lost his parents, had to be raised by Aunt May, right?

Yeah.

So, Chris, everything that I saw in the superheroes wasn't just because that I like the way the art looked. I was just like them. And then my therapist says this to me. She says, dc, your subconscious had a connection to Batman, Superman and Spider Man. You came from the same situations they did, but you didn't know that. Yeah, you thought it was just being educated and smart and geeky and nerdy. That was part of it. But you didn't even know about that.

Wow.

Characteristic. And then she said this. What got you through all of those times before you started depending on alcohol? Something outside of you to give you strength? Because I started reaching for the alcohol in. In rehab, I was diagnosed with suppressed emotions. I was using the alcohol to suppress my true feelings because I didn't want to deal with them. She said outside of the alcohol and all that, you was reaching for that, thinking that was empowering, giving you power, like the hope, but it was taking it away from like, kryptonite. But since she said this, what got you from falling into the pit of depression in the early years, before you started depending on Jack Daniel, Shim Beam, Johnny Walking, all English I was like, what? She said this to me. Don't you know most of your records that you made that are heard around the globe, they start with two of the most powerful words ever. And I'm like, what? I am? She said on your first record, you said, I am DMC in the place to be. I'm going to St. John. You went to St. John's University on your other record, said, I am the son of Byford. Brother, you said, I am the king of rock. Said, I am the microphone master. You said, I am the devastated mind. You said, I am Daryl McDaniels. Yeah, you say, I am Daryl. You can call me Darryl. She said all of those I ams.

Wow.

Emotional spiritual affirmations that didn't allow that darkness from your situation to seek in. When it started seeking in after you couldn't drink no more, it opened up, you know, it's almost like. It's almost like a. A Greek story where, oh my God, he's about to kill himself. Poseidon, run down Mercury, run down here, run down and reveal to him here, Daryl, don't jump by because you're the son of a God. You're a cult of microphone. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah. Wow.

So crazy. But when my friend said that, he said these Spider Man, Batman, Superman and the whole. And what's crazy, Cindy? It's not just humans that go through it. He said the Martians. Look at Luke Skywalker.

Right? Yeah.

There's something going on with pop culture that are just telling people their truths in a way. That's why we become fans of stuff.

Yeah.

You're so attracted to stuff because we see ourselves in it. So my hip hop story is. No. My hip hop musical career journey is no different from the journey of all the superheroes that I've fell in love with. Because most superheroes are dealing with so much trauma in their life. But you're still able to find purpose

and a way to heal and helping others too. I want to. Are you good for time? I have a couple other things I'd like to circle back to. Okay, awesome. Good. Well, a couple of things. I mean, you've also kind of teed these up nicely. You mentioned meeting with Sheila Jaffe, and I know that you guys co founded, I believe, if again, fact check me, that you guys co founded the Felix Organization. So I want to talk about that and maybe to tee that up, share the story about the impact of. And again, this gets back to the whole music and. And you can't really separate genres and all, you know, how music impacts us, etc. You are very much impacted by Sarah McLaughlin song Angel. So talk about that in the context of, you know, the adoption and Felix Organization and share those stories.

Yes, that was the revelation of the purpose while I was struggling. You know, everybody's go to rehab, this and that, this and that. I'm thinking I'm killing myself while thinking of killing myself. So I come home from Europe and you gotta understand I can't rhyme no more. But I had to keep doing the shows with Running J so I could get to check to make sure the bills are paid. But I'm going out there every night feeling like crap, you know, Running J are helping me. They're doing the vocals with me, and I ain't got no voice. But people are so happy to see us all moving together. You can't tell unless you listen, you know? And I meet people and say, mandy, I saw you on the 94. I couldn't hear one word you were saying. Then I tell them why and all that. So I come home. Oh, this is a beautiful story. This is one of the reasons that I said, I know I'm really not meant to be here. And it's is. It's stupid, but it makes sense of why I should really commit suicide. We coming home from Europe, and my travel agent calls me. A travel agent of the last 30 years, dependable travel agent ever. She knows everything about us, but for preference and everything. So she calls me. Now, you gotta remember, I'm suicidal. I'm depressed. I have no voice of alcohol. No. She calls me and she says, daryl, I got really bad news. And the way she says it, I'm thinking, somebody died. Right?

Right.

She goes like this, no, I done moved from Queens and I'm living in Jersey. I'm married. I got a kid. So she calls me, says, daryl, I have really bad news. I'm like, oh, my God. What is it? What is it? She says this. There are no flights into Newark. You got to go to jfk. So right away, my stigma, stigmatized mental health frame goes, see, you gotta commit suicide.

That's. That was the trigger.

Don't want to go to JFK if you live in Jersey. So I gotta fly in the jfk. And now that just lowered me to my lowest point. I get the jfk. She's like, the driver will be waiting for you with his sign. I get to the, you know, baggage claim, the driver's stand. How you doing, Mr. McDaniels? Boom, boom, whatever gets the bag. We get in the car, and we driving out of jfk. There's about three lights to jfk. So I'm in the back, head down, thinking I'm really killing myself because this is the last straw. This is proof from God that I don't need to be on Earth, because this sums it all up. But I could feel this energy on it today, top of my head. So I would look up, and every time I would look in the driver's rear view. I could see that he turned his head. So I put my head back down. We driving a little bit, I feel this energy. I look up, I catch him again. So he turns away. So on the third light, I said, you know what? I'mma keep my head up. And I'm gonna keep staring at the rearview mirror. So he sneakily tries to stare at me again because it's DMC in his back seat.

Yeah.

So when we lock eyes, he turns to me and says, dmc, please don't get me fired. And he says this to me. As a little kid, I had one of the worst lives ever. My parents really sucked. But the thing that got me here to survive is I would take your cassette in my Walkman in my room and I would listen to your music. Wow. It helped me survive the worst job, whatever. But your music saved me. Oh, can I get a picture? Oh, my God, I forgot about. I'm alcoholic, I'm depressed, I can't talk. I go, that just hit me in the heart. And I go, man, that. Not only could you get a picture, I'll give you an order. He's like, really? Don't tell my boss. I said, I would never do that. So now he's up in him and he asked. He's. He's open now. We connected. So he goes, can I turn the radio on now? And I'm like, yeah. So he turns it to Hot 97, the hip hop station in New York. That's the last thing I wanted to hear because I can't even rap no more.

Sure.

And I'll go turn into anything except that. And the way I said it was like, turn it. He said, oh, okay. So he turns it to light fm. I'll never forget to say, he turns it to light fm and all of a sudden I hit his beautiful angelic piano. And then I hear this angel voice say, in the arms of an angel. And I hear Sarah McLaughlin's angel. And some in me something. He says, d, even though you're at the worst right now, because something this beautiful exists, it's good to be alive. So for one whole year, all I did was listen to Sarah McLaughlin's English Angel. I got home and I said, you know, I'm not telling my wife what's going on. At the time she had the movie City of Angels with Nicholas.

Oh, sure.

And that was the song on the soundtrack. So for me here in the car, I go home and every time I would say something, if it's food or if it's a Music or so my wife will go get it for me. So I went home and I was like, honey, did you hear that record by Sarah McLaughlin? Angel? Yeah, I really like that song. You know you that watch the. She goes, yeah, I want to watch the movie. Because she's into those love dramas, relationship dramas, she's into that stuff. So I'm like, this is a plus, win, win for me. I said, honey, I really. So she goes out and buys me the soundtrack. And then she buys me Sarah McL. She buys me the album with Bill's Building a Mystery. She buys me the greatest hits. So for one, for one whole year, I'm listening to Sam McLaughlin. At the end of that year, my manager Eric says, D him and my publicist is trying to still keep me working. So they go, yo, we got, we got tickets to go to Clive Davis Grammy party. Now I'm like, I ain't going nowhere. F. Clyde Davis. I can't even rap no more. I'm not doing this and everything, convincing me, you gotta go, you gotta go, you gotta go. And then my manager says, he looks at me and says, man, I work really hard to get these tickets. And something he said he done sold his soul to the devil to go to 5 Davis. This corny little Grammy party where all the biggest stars in the world are going to be. I care nothing about that. And I'm telling him, all I want to do is sit in my room and listen to Sarah McLaughlin. He goes, you can do that while we get to la, go to the party. We go to the party, we get to the party. I said, I'm going to do a once around a room and I'm going back to my room and he's trying to be the manager. Do the red carpet, whatever, whatever. And I start the countdown. You got. I stopped being an hour. 59, 58, 57. So he walks away frustrated. I'll never forget this. Alicia Keys comes in. Oh, Daryl, how you doing? And I'm in my head, I'm going, well, Alicia Keys still likes you, even though you can't talk in your worthless piece of crap. That's a good reason to stay alive. Buster Rhymes comes in, he comes over to me, D, I love you. Just he giving me love. And I say, even Buster still likes you, even though you can't rob me or worth the detail. Now, people love when I say this like this. Stevie Wonder comes in, but he don't see me. His boy, his guy sees me. So Stevie Wonder's walking in and the guy, his guy looks at me and his. I could see in his eye, the guy's eye. Oh, shoot, that's dfc. So I see, I, I, I, I. I could read his lips. He whispers to Stevie, yo, Stevie, DMC's over there. He wants to beat you. So Stevie goes, sure. And they walk over to me, and Stevie Wonder comes over to me, man, you guys run dmc. Your music was so powerful. Like, Stevie is just like, you cats. I love what you're doing. And Stevie walks away. Countdown. I'm at two minutes left. Eric's gonna be mad at me. Guess who walks in. Sarah McLaughlin.

Oh.

And I see her. Some in me says, d, go over to her, what you've been doing for the last year. So I walk over to Sarah. She sees me coming. She's like, oh, run dmc. I love you. She starts going edge tricky to rock around. She does what everybody does. They sing the song, walk this way, it's Turkey. And she says, yo, I really like what you guys. Whatever. And then I go, Ms. McLaughlin, before you go, I just want to tell you the name of the song is Angel. You sound like Angel. People say you're an angel, but you're not an angel to me. You're God to me. Because I listen to that record every day. I'm depressed. I'm in the one emotion. Like, I just give it a whole spiel. And she's looking at me like I'm crazy. Like, okay, I didn't expect that. But then she says this. She goes, thank you for telling me that, Daryl. That's what music is supposed to do.

Oh.

She walks away. Three years later is when I find out that I'm adopted. So her music was part of a soundtrack. And in the midst of all this crap, I would just put that song on. And for those three minutes, it'd be all right. So fast forward to me meeting Sheila, right? And going to adoption. And Sheila just says this to me. She says, daryl, we were very fortunate, you know, regardless of us being foster kids being adopted and not being. We were very fortunate because along the way, outside of our birth parents getting us here, there was people put here to get us where we were supposed to go. And then Sheila goes, what about all those other kids that might not get adopted who are in the foster care system? So we go, yeah, they deserve the opportunity to be the people that they were put here to be. So originally, me and Sheila wanted to start the Felix facilities. Now, you might ask what that is. There's a show, there's a film with Ben Crosby As a priest called a boys town, where the Catholic church gives the orphans their own little city to grow up and go into adulthood, you know, without the privilege to assistance or whatever, you know, they would be the God. So me and Sheila said that's what we're going to do. We're going to build FELIX facilities that's going to give the foster kids life skills before they turn into 18 and get aged out the system. Let's not wait until they're 18 and 19 and then go, what do you want to do? What do you want to be? It's $5 in a sandwich. Go figure it out on yourself. Let's start them as elementary school kids. Let's find out who wants to be photographers and dancers and scientists and start now other kids and put them in that direction. So Sheila was good friends. You're gonna love this story too. The listener's gonna love this too. Sheila was good friends with Michael Lang, the guy who created Woodstock, the original one, the guy that pulled that up. She said, if anybody can make things happen, it's the guy, my friend Michael. So we go to Michael Lang with this idea. We're going to build these FELIX facilities in every city and state in America. And it's going to be a learning center, it's going to education and recreation that we're just going to give this. Michael goes, the guy who started Woodstock, he goes, guys, it's a wonderful idea, but you need to start smaller. We disappointed. What do you mean we can do? No, no, I'm not saying it can't be done, but you need to take baby steps. So we, you know, we, we mad and this. Why don't you just start with a sleepaway camp? What you talking about? Like Willis, Like Arnold and Willis.

Right, right.

He says start with a sleep away camp where you could get the kids in the sleeping with all the different foster kids, get them at a sleepaway camp for a week each where they can see that they're not the only ones. Like, because he was like down. When you found out at age 35, what did you think? I was like, yeah, you're right. When I found out I was adopted at 35, I, I act and knew I was the only adopted person on the face. Sheila, when you found out at 14, because she found out when she was well with it, I felt like I was the only. But then you find out there's a billion of y'.

All.

So let's get the kids in the same place. That's, you know, some of the foster kids Never left the block. They don't know what grass is. They don't know what a mountain and a lake and rock climbing. Wow, nature is. Let's get them. Therefore we can give them that. But while they're there, say, what is it that you want to be? Oh, I want to be a dj. For that week you get DJ lessons. I want to be a dancer. For that week you get ballet lessons. I want to be a photographer. For that week you get photography lessons. So it was Michael Lang, we call him the father of Felix, who said, start with a sleep away camp. Give the kids a life changing experience, but while they're there, pour something into their lives. So 20 years ago, Sheila in me we started to Felix organization. You can find more information about Camp Felix, which is a sleepaway camp for foster kids to give them guidance, life skills and just let them be who they are regardless of their situation. So felixorganization.org but it was the Sarah McLaughlin record that when she said, thank you for telling me that, Daryl. That's what music is supposed to do, it made me remember what the guy in the car said to me. Tmc, your music got me through the roughest times of my life. And then when she said that, I was like, whoa. And then what? My friend Riggs Morales, who was my partner for my comic book, he said, d, the reason why you should do a book, a comic book is I'm like, why you could do the same thing you've already been doing with your music for 40 years. Inspire, motivate, educate while you entertain. So everything was so connected.

Absolutely so. And that you're very good about segues and teeing up. So I mentioned in the intro about Darryl's dream and I think when you and I had lunch together in New York, you mentioned that another edition or a sequel or the next version of that is coming out. The fill us in. What's. What's that? And what's the timeline?

Daryl's Dream is a book. It's a story about me in the third grade. It deals with bullying, respecting each other and having kids understand you don't have to be like everybody else. So A Daryl Dream is a story about me in the third grade wanting to say my poem. And all other kids don't think poetry is cool, but I go do it anyway. I get a standing ovation. Now all other kids want to do poetry.

You.

They want me to teach them. I could have said no, but I said, no, okay, I'll teach you. Even though you didn't think I Was cool. But I ain't gonna teach you to do it like me. I'm gonna teach you to do it the way you want to do it. So the book is called Daryl's Dream to let kids know whatever it is that you like. Powerpuff Girls, Star wars, everything that's so called corny is actually your superpowers. So we did Daryl's Dream to teach kids that dreams do come true because of you. If it's your dream, you don't need permission to be or whatever it is that you want to be. You get teased, bullied, and picked on. But the bullies don't realize they so busy looking at you, they ain't looking at the. The. The power that they have themselves. So we did Daryl's Dream. The next book is. Well, there's a book before the second book. The second book in the Daryl's Dream adventure is called Daryl's Desire Decision, which is now the third book. But it's a book where Daryl, as a young kid has to make a decision between right and wrong. But in November, looking at my music catalog and things that brung people together that you wouldn't think bring people together the same way Run AMC brought Adidas and hip hop together and created a whole new fashion genre. The same way Run dmc, We got together with Aerosmith and created a whole new music genre. I have a song called Christmas in Hollis, which we did for a very special Christmas, where all the proceeds went to special Olympics, which had a great purpose with Bruce Springsteen, Whitney Houston, Run dmc, and a whole host of others.

Wow.

I got a song in there. And on that song, I got a rhyme. That was Christmas time in Hollis, Queens. Mom's cooking chicken in collard greens, Rice and stuffing, macaroni and cheese. Santa put gifts on the Christmas tree. So I do this rhyme about my Christmas, you know, growing up in Hollis, Queens. And when I walk in the mall, Jewish people, Muslim people, Asian people, it don't matter where they from, they scream the ride at me. I said, you know what? I'm gonna do a book called for this holiday coming, and we're gonna drop it in November called Christmas in Hollis, showing my Christmas. But where Daryl, he. He needs new glasses because they break. And when he goes to the eye doctor, put on these glasses, they show him the Jewish traditions, they show up the African traditions, they show them the Muslim traditions, they show them the European traditions where everybody has different music, food, and all that. But it's the same purpose, caring about one of each other. Sit down with Your friends and family and having a good meal.

Wow.

So I took my Christmas and Hollis story that was already in existence and I'm using it to teach the kids. This is why we should respect and have love for one another. Even though we have different customs and traditions. When you look at it, it's all the same stuff. Stuff. So that book is called Daryl's Christmas in Hollis is coming out in November. And then at the top of the top of next year, we're going to release Daryl's Decision, which is back in school and he has to make a decision between right and wrong. So the reason why the, what's really cool about that is the reason why I started doing the children's books is I was going to schools, elementary schools, and talking to kids about, you know, educated education, comic books, art, hip hop in my story. And about, I would say maybe nine or ten years ago I spoke at these two teacher schools and what's beautiful is they are now principals in their districts, but I spoke at their schools three or four times and it was narrow. You should do a book. You should do a book. And I'm, you know, I don't want to make money off of doing good. I do it for the heart. And they said, no, no, it's not about that. Daryl, he said, if you do a book, you can get this book in so many kids hands and you don't have to be there, you can still touch these kids lives. So I actually did Daryl's Dreams with the two teachers. I said, here's the deal, I'll do the book but y' all gotta help me because y' all are on the front line with these kids every day. So y' all can tell me how to direct my story to relate with them. So their name is of Shawnee and Johnny Warford Field. If you look at the books, their names are on there. So we did Daryl's dream. Then we thought of, yo, let's do a book for the holidays that'll bring kids together and then let's do the book of Daryl's Decision. So the plan is to have a series of 10 books, you know, Daryl's Dream. Then we have the holiday book which we could, you know, promote every holiday to the kids. But then Daryl's Dream, Daryl's Decision, Daryl does, you know, Daryl's, Daryl decides like

that's going to be great.

Different situations for the kids.

Oh, I love it.

So I had to do it. I had to just. Excuse me one more time. I had to do it with educators to show that I can use my art to assist parents, teachers, and educators. So that the way. The way I work with Adidas, the way I work with Arrow Smith, if we all work together, we can do some phenomenal things that help everybody.

Yeah, you really. I mean, part of your DMC could be. Daryl collaborates with many.

My son, he does it all. He's like, daryl makes chocolate. Oh, I did the Daryl makes cookies I just released. I hooked up with a coffee company in Montclair, New Jersey, called Paper Planes Coffee. We just did Daryl Makes Coffee. My son is like Daryl's magnificent collaboration.

There you go. Oh, that's great. That's great. Well, I mean, your. Your creativity, your humanity, the things that you do, you know, for others in such a, you know, generous kind of way. The way that you've impacted so many lives, you know, just by your music, by your art, by your, I don't know, your love, really. We've covered a lot of territory, but is there anything that we've missed that you'd like to add before we wrap up today?

Oh, no, not really. I think what's the one thing that I want to get across is that I was speaking in Cleveland one time at Barnes and Nobles when Darrell went on 10 ways first came out, and this lady had brought her son to. To hear me, and she done tried everything with him, you know, and he was just falling. Kept falling off the rag and get sober. Go right back. So she was like, I'm taking you, you know, and she already done killed the kid by telling her how great run DMC and in that era of hip hop is. So her last resort was, you're coming with me to see Daryl. He has a boy book, talking about his struggles and all that. So, you know, I'm doing the Barnes and Noble thing, and I'm talking. You know, he's sitting there and I'm thinking, he's not listening, but I could tell. And he's staring at me like he don't care. Yeah, but he's listening. And I. And I do what I just did with you at the end of that, when it's time to sign the books and, you know, take pictures with people, she comes up on the line. You know, his mother's a fan. We grew up together. So while we're there, she says, I brought my son. You know, he's been struggling with some things. So he asked me and she to her thing was this. He was like heavy metal, great guitar player, this and that, great songwriter, but he was never getting nowhere. You Know what I'm saying? And maybe that was part of why he turned to drugs. I'm supposed to be Ozzy Osborne, but why the world is keeping me from that? But you never know. It's probably something, so many other things, but that probably was one of them. So I was standing and he says, Mr. DMC, because you know, I'm old now. You know, if I was 25, 30. Yo, DMC man says Mr. DMC. Give me one reason why I should be alive now. You thinking I might go, oh, because you're going to be. You're a great guitar player. You share your talent with that. I didn't know what to say for something be said. Not my story or any so called celebrity story. The reason why with all your struggles and all your pain and trauma, the reason why you're, you should stay alive is your story, not mine. Could save a life. And he just gave me this look like that's crazy. And then like you can see his whole demeanor change.

Wow.

You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

So I think the lady, I see the lady, you know, a couple of months later because I'm in and out of Cleveland and stuff like that. And I'm like, yo, how's it going? She's like, yo, so far so good. He's doing really good. And I'm like, what do you mean? What is he doing? Well, he's giving guitar lessons. Kids in the neighborhood. So he probably realized, you know, maybe I will never be Ozzy Osborne, but if I, if I'm able to play every day and help others.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You know, and he's playing in his local band, you know, he's, he's in a local band right now, you know, doing the sleep in the van thing.

Yeah.

But it gave his, you know, you, you have a purpose.

Yeah, beautiful.

You know, those little things. It's like when Sarah McLaughlin told me, I'm thinking because I'm the devastating mic controller king of rock is why I'm on this microphone. But when Sarah McLaughlin said thank you for, for telling me that, Daryl. Because that what music is supposedly, of course it's fun, of course you get to go to Hollywood, but there's a deeper purpose in your existence or to position, you know, and it doesn't matter if you're an athlete or, you know, if you're a celebrity, whatever it is, if you're, you know, you, you, you, you, you, you, you own the milk company in your neighborhood. You know, I did. I meet people who says, man, it wasn't my accomplishment of having a success, successful business. I said, I had this one guy who has a pasta company and. Oh, this is funny, Chris. This one guy who has a pasta company. Me. His company is called ovo. Ovo. Okay. But he wants to do Daryl's macaroni and cheese dmc because I rhymed about it on my records but lost restart.

Sure, yeah, that was in the Christmas.

I didn't think of that one. But it makes sense because I go, mom's cooking rice and stuff in macaroni and cheese. So he wants to do Daryl's macaroni cheese. But he said his father told him, son, I'm so proud of you. Not for having a successful business and being a CEO. He said, I. I'm so proud of you because I came here to visit your fact factory and I'm looking at all the lives you impact.

Oh, boy.

All of these people that have jobs that can take care of your families. That's the minute thing. So whether it's music, whether it's what you're doing, you know, what you're doing is I look at it, if we are not ashamed to have conversations, because conversations bring about connection. Connection brings about collaboration, and it's collaboration that brings about transformation. Yeah, that's the hope that now, when I look at all of that. Yeah, now all, all the art, all the music, all the discos, all the genres, all the different people, all the different stuff that we collaborate into a presentation is the thing that brings about transformation for every person and not just the person doing it. Inspiration is a two way street.

Yeah, yeah. It's, you know, I. I run a nonprofit and I tell you there is very little. I mean, I have, I have a lot of things. I'm very happy in my life. But the joy that comes from, you know, just giving and feeling like, you know, and not doing it and actually not even kind of doing it for that. I mean, I kind of become a nerd and I do the work and then all of a sudden it's sort of like, I'm surprised that someone's like, oh, this really helped. You know, it's like, yes.

Yeah. What? Right?

Yeah, yeah.

What's amazing, because then you think about the times that somebody did it for you.

Yeah. Well, you're. You're not only the king of rock, you're the king of pay it forward to Darryl. I think.

So you have to. Oh, we all have to be hope in motion. Because a lot of us have hope. But let's take that open in motion. Yeah. I'M working on a song. This might. It might be because of what it means to me. Might be. I mean, tricky is wonderful. Walk this way is incredible. King of rock is cool. Rock is cool. But I'm working on this song called. Because so many people get to that point in life where they think there's nothing to live for. They have nothing else to give. And then I thought about hip hop culture, where these kids in the Bronx had nothing, but they was able to take the funk, the rock, the pop and the disco that they threw away at poetry, dance and art, through the graffiti and break dance, Listen to it, and it became everything. I'm working on a song and I want to sound the. The music to be evil. Like Simple man or Mr. Fantasy. Hey, Mr. Fantasy. Which is at the beginning of. Beginning of end game. But the words is even when there's nothing, there is something to use. Even when there's nothing, there is something to use. Even when there's nothing, there is something to use. You can still do something. When there's nothing you can do. And I was like, wow. Oh, I love that.

Yeah.

You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

You're sitting around, there's always something that you can do. When you think that there's nothing you can do, you can always still do something. And it, like you said it for the foster kids, what I'm finding out is, look, adoption. I love my mother and father because they kept me. And the reason why they was able to keep me because my birth mother gave me up so that I could get where I'm supposed to go. Adoption is a huge thing. Foster care is a huge step. But to serve these kids, these kids, and I'm talking about not just forced orphans, underprivileged kids to homeless kids. We have a responsibility to all these kids because just because they're in a messed up situation doesn't mean they can't be the next great me and you. Entertainers, journalists, doctors, Lord. But one of the things that I find out with through this foster care and adoption stuff that I'm doing something that's really powerful is just mentorship, where, okay, you might not be in a position to adopt or be a foster person, but you could find one kid and be a friend to him and say, you know what? I'm taking to a movie, I'm gonna take you to a play or whatever. Yeah, but this would be a Sheila. Find out. This is the life. Game changer. Sometimes when we go into certain places, we talk to kids and the kids feel like, there's nobody there for them. What works as a kid is, yo, here's a number. You can call me anytime. And they'll look at you like, anytime. You can call me anytime. And even if they don't call you, get their number or, you know, get the counselor, the facilities number. What Change. What. What I found out how I impacted a lot of kids is just, oh, let me check up on this kid once a week. I'm rooting for you. Yeah, I'm here for you. How you doing? Yeah, just doing that. When they hang up that phone, it makes them say, wow, this person cares about me. Maybe I should play hooky. Oh, this person cares about me. Maybe I should go try out for the team.

Yeah.

So it's just being there is. So it's more valuable than diamonds and gold?

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Yeah.

Oh, Daryl, man, this has been awesome. This has been awesome. So thank you so much for taking the time to be on. What. What are some of the best ways listeners can learn more? Get your books, things like that. We can put them in the show notes.

I have King D on Instagram, I have at King dmc, I have at DMC Cookies, and I have DMC makes comics. So you can follow me on Instagram, King dmc, DMC Cookies, and DMC makes comics.

Got it. Okay, we'll make sure we get that.

I gotta put the last plug in. Yeah, for everybody. When it comes to music, Daryl makes cookies, Daryl makes comics. But of course, Daryl still gotta make that great music. My new single coming out in November. Drum roll. People gonna love this. The song is called she Gets Me High. It features DMC and Sebastian Bach on vocals, Travis Barker on drums, Mick Morris for Motley Crew on guitar, and the incredible Duff McKagan from Guns n Roses on bass. Oh, man, it's a fun song that brings those five different generations of hip hop together.

Wonderful.

Make it something. In the midst of all personal, social, spiritual, emotional, political and religious turmoil that existed on this earth since the dawn of time. I think this record she gets behind, featuring DMC, Sebastian Bach, Duff McKagan, Travis Barker, and Mick Mars, is going to make everybody smile, hug each other, and have cookies and milk.

Hear, hear. We need to get it licensed to be our intro and outro music.

We can make that happen.

All right. Good deal. Oh, well, thank you, my friend. I feel so fortunate that our paths crossed in New York. And what a difference between what you were describing as Times square in the 70s versus, you know, Times Square when you and I were just there. So it's been wonderful. I just again, have to tip my hat and salute you. The transparency you have about your journey, the things that you've been able to overcome, the giving back through the Felix organization and other things. We'll put those in the show notes as well, too, for people that want to learn more and get a part of that and donate to that. So making the time today again, just as speaks to your generosity of, of heart and soul and love. And I really appreciate it, my friend.

No, thank you for having. I mean, it's a reason that we met so that we can have this connection and conversation.

That's good. Yeah, yeah. Good karma. Good karma. The universe spoke to us.

Yes, exactly. And hopefully what we're doing here is knocking down walls just like Steven Tyler did and walked this way.

Hear, hear. All right, thanks so much, my friend.

Thank you. Anytime you need me, you know how to get me, man.

Will do. You're on my speed dial.

I appreciate you so much. Keep up the great works.

Likewise, likewise.

And I'll see you soon. I'm sure we'll see each other again.

I suspect that is very true. Yeah. Looking at our calendars, I think that's going to happen.

Yes, sir.

As a reminder, listeners can read a summary of this episode and access links to the show notes via my LinkedIn Top Voice Companion article, along with past gifts as well. I hope you enjoyed this conversation as much as I have, and I hope it will help you in your journey to living your life in full. Until next time. Living a Life in Full is a production of Stout Media, a subsidiary of Gordian Knot Elf LLC Assistant Producer, Gracie Wong Music Dan O' Brien Executive Producer and Host, Dr. Chris Stout. To learn more, stop by our website at lifeinfull for show notes and please recommend us to your friends and subscribe on your favorite platform. And as for the obligatory disclaimer, this podcast is for general information uses only and does not constitute the practice of psychology, medicine, intracellular or other professional health care services, including the giving of medical or psychological advice. No doctor patient relationship is formed. Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, I take conflicts of interest seriously. For all of my disclosures as well as show notes, please see livingalifeinfull.org podcast and my LinkedIn profile. Thanks. And until next time. Marketing is hard, but I'll tell you a little secret. It doesn't have to be. Let me point something out. You're listening to a podcast right now, and it's great. You love the host. You seek it out and download it. You listen to it while driving, working out, cooking, even going to the bathroom. Podcasts are a pretty close companion and this is a podcast ad. Did I get your attention? You can reach great listeners like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn Ads. Choose from hundreds of top podcasts offering host endorsements, or run a pre produced ad like this one across thousands of shows. To reach your target audience in their favorite podcasts with Libsyn Ads, go to Libsynads. Com. That's L I B S Y N ads.com today.