Connecting the Dots between Skincare, Hormones & Mindfulness with Dr. Kiera | Ep. 45 (Audio Only)

Welcome to my podcast. I'm Dr. Nicole Cain, a naturopathic doctor with a master's in clinical psychology and a former anxiety sufferer turned anxiety freedom rebel. Welcome to the get your life back podcast. You are in for a treat. Today I have with me Dr. Kira. Did I say your name right, honey?

You did, you did.

Good, good, good. So that's really good. So Dr. Kiera with me and I saw you originally in an interview with Dr. Trevor and the conversation was so good and so interesting. I was actually not intending to say on my phone, but just hearing her talk with you, I really resonated with what you were bringing to the table. And so from that moment I was like, okay, Haley, who's my branding expert, I was like, Haley, we got to get this brilliant woman on the podcast. So thank you for being here. Oh, that's the sweetest.

Thank you. I'm excited to have a conversation.

The thing that I especially loved and what I, I'm really excited to bring to the listeners is how you bring together menopause, skin and mindfulness. And I have to say I have not encountered many doctors who are able to bring all of those pieces to the table and speak about them from a really educated yet philosophically broad and open hearted and open souled perspective. And it felt like such a, such a breath of fresh air to hear you speak about those things.

Oh, I'm speechless. Now.

I'm going to ask you a ton of questions about that and as we get started, what I do want to make sure that everyone who's listening does is you're going to want to follow Dr. Kira's account. So you're going to want to make sure that you get on her Instagram. She's Also on Facebook, LinkedIn, she has a link tree that has a ton of amazing free resources which we'll make sure to include in the show notes and of course her website. So if you're listening to this and you're somewhere where you're not going to be a traffic hazard by pulling out your phone, I want you to open up your Instagram and I want you to put her information in there and follow her account. It's D R K E I R A B A r r. So Dr. Kira Barr and then her website is the second place you want to go and that's Dr. Kirabar.com and so make sure that you do that and then you're going to be able to get access to all sorts of wonderful stuff that she'll tell us about. The thing that Doc that I'm super excited about that you have going on is the seven ways to relieve stress in less than seven minutes. And so I'm going to ask you about that, but if you don't mind, can I just brag on you a little bit and read your bio to the audience?

Sure.

All right, you guys, this is so amazing. I admire Dr. Kara. I marry you so much. So her bio blending Science with Soul, Dr. Kira Barr turns conventional methodologies on their heads to empower women worldwide to stress less, enjoy life more so they can pursue their passion, purpose and experience more pleasure in their life. An accomplished double certified physician, speaker, coach and mind body medicine expert, Dr. Kiera created the skinny dipping method to help women strip away the layers, holding them back to reveal their inner resilience and radiate their true beauty. As a medical advisor within the personal care and tech communities, Dr. Kira Barr is dedicated to providing the most cutting edge and innovative solutions for women. And her work has been featured in mind, BodyGreen, Better Homes and Gardens, Reader's Digest, Glamour, Self, Oprah Magazine and more. So welcome, welcome. Thank you so much for being here.

Thank you. It's a pleasure. I'm excited for this.

I was wondering if you could tell us a little bit about your story and what brought you into this wonderful blend of menopause, skin mindfulness and helping people on this platform.

Yeah, I'm laughing because it's not a glamorous story. It's basically when your mess becomes your mission. And I went into dermatology, at least I thought I went into dermatology because I couldn't make up my mind. I loved internal medicine, I loved histology, and my dual certification is clinical dermatology and dermatopathology. Setting skin on the surface as well as on the cellular level. And dermatology was this wonderful blend of internal medicine and pediatrics and surgery and histology. And you could do aesthetics. And so I never had to make a decision. I could do it all and I love that. But what I realized as my health began to fall apart and I had to really do some self reflection, I realized why I chose dermatology is because starting in my childhood, I felt so uncomfortable in my skin. I was made fun of for what was on it. I was bullied for and called names and realized that our skin could be such a source of shame and embarrassment. And I internalized that and really became the compass from which I navigated every decision. If people didn't like what they saw in my skin, then they probably didn't like, so I became a people pleaser and really just, you know, all the woods, all the coulds, all the shoulds. And on one hand it allowed me to do well in school and become a doctor and all the things, but on the other hand, it really made me pretty miserable. And ultimately the focus of my career when I was in practice was skin cancer and melanoma. And ultimately I had to diagnose myself with the very thing that I was treating. I had to diagnose myself with melanoma. And it turned out when I looked at everything that was happening in my life at the time, I was running ultra marathons, I was working in academics, I was trying to juggle my kids, my skin was changing, changing moles all the time. Ultimately that one that was really atypical. But I was bloated and I had worsening pms and my periods were lasting for weeks and weeks at a time. And my hormones were just a mess. And my doctors weren't understanding, they weren't connecting the dots. And really what it was was stress. It was stress. It was the physical stress of over exercising. It was the emotional stress of not being aligned with who I was, what I was doing, and being in a work environment that wasn't conducive to supporting me and my health. Just the skin cancer was a wake up call. But that was just the tip of the iceberg. And I thought, okay, I feel like I'm at rock bottom right now and I'm a physician and I don't know how in the world to help myself. How is the average woman supposed to understand how to navigate their own health? And that really led me to more of an integrative and functional approach. What I realized with my hormones, how I wound up with in menopause medicine is I. The stress shifted all my hormones out of balance. But I was entering perimenopause and I didn't even know it. I didn't even know what that was. And again, I'm a physician, granted dermatologists, who, you know, we weren't necessarily focusing on hormones per se, sex hormones per se. And so that idea of stress and how it disrupts our overall health and well being, but especially our hormones and our sex hormones and mind becoming aware, that mindfulness component that's kind of connecting all those dots for me, because what shows up on your skin is a reflection of what's happening in your life. And my skin was sending me huge messages and signals that what was happening in my life was not serving my overall health. So that's kind of a long winded explanation of like, when shit hits the fan, like, you figure out how to pivot, get it together, and then pay it forward.

You did it in a unique way where you created an integration of these different parts. So I love to study ego state and internal family systems. These are trauma informed philosophies we use in psychology. And what they speak about is the formation of an ego state in response to something that's painful or difficult or traumatic. And so, for example, you had this younger self and she had these skin expressions and felt. You used words like there was bullying and there was shame and there was a lack of confidence. And so this part of you developed, and what's beautiful and fascinating about your journey is that you didn't ignore her as you began the process of healing and recovering.

So.

So that part remains, and we've seen in the brain science that these parts can be lodged in areas of the cortex that are non verbal and non logical. It's just the way that we feel. And then you have these experiences as you get older and you're making all of the right choices for all intents and purposes. Right. You're running a marathon, you're eating right, you're doing all of the things, and yet you're still noticing that your symptoms are there. And now you have these perimenopausal symptoms and these menstrual irregularities on top of it. And so these could be argued as different ego states.

Okay.

Our hormones are out of balance. We need to communicate this. So this is my job. I'm the hormone part. And then you have the other part that was producing all these other symptoms that you're describing. Right. And so you have these separate, distinct ego states and probably lots more because you're a human being. And what I admire about the work that you do is that you didn't just focus on one. We call that like the identified patient. Right. It's like, okay, skin is the problem. How can I make the skin better? But rather you had this wisdom to recognize that your symptoms were expressions from your body, from your mind, from your spirit, that the way that you were in your life wasn't what was serving your soul. And I'm curious a little bit more how you were able to integrate and bring together all of those parts of yourself.

It's still a work in progress, I will not lie. Yeah. I think I've always been very aware of when my, when I was in clinic and academics, how significant when people would show up with acne or psoriasis and the impact that it had on their. I remember one boy in particular, he came in really bad acne and his hair was really long over space and he didn't look up, he didn't make eye contact. I know there's a lot of controversy out there about is Accutane safe. It is a godsend for individuals who really have failed all other therapy. As we began to treat him and as his skin improved, his hair got shorter, he started to make eye contact. He actually had a levity about him and we could finally laugh together. And this was before all my health challenges. And he just, I thought of him a lot. Like it impacts us how we feel in our skin, how we look, what we see impacts how we feel, how we feel impacts how we, we look. And we always think about this top down approach like it's our brain, right? That there's these connections and communication in our brain and this hypothalamic pituitary, adrenal access and it sends the signals and the stress hormone and all the other. And our skin is receiving those signals and then responding. But what most people may not appreciate is that our skin has the same mechanism. We have an HPA axis in our skin. Our skin can produce the stress hormones, it can produce adrenaline or adrenaline and some of our sex hormones. It not only perceives stress, but it can create that similar response. Having that understanding that it's a two way street. And the science and the literature that supports the impact that mindfulness and tuning into how we are feeling can dramatically improve the clinical appearance of our skin too, which affects how we feel. I mean, it's just fascinating, just synthesizing that. I don't know if any of that makes sense, but it's just like from my own experience of how I would feel badly when I would see things, but seeing it in other people and then finding that there's actually evidence for this really made it so important for me to share and help people redefine what skin care really is. Like, you cannot exfoliate away your anxiety. You cannot get confidence from a lotion or a potion or procedure. Like we really have to understand what's happening within us and pay attention and not judge it and understand that your skin is like this amazing thing, right? Most people look at their skin and they're like, it's sabotaging me or it looks terrible or it's a source of like what the is happening. And I would invite everyone listening to look at your skin as your greatest ally. Your skin is sending you information yes, you're breaking out and it's before a big event or before a big date. And it's, it's unfortunate and it's terrible timing, but it's also sending you a signal loud and clear that it needs something from you. And we need to look at how you're living, how you're thinking, how you're moving, who you're spending time with, what's in your environment, what are you putting on your skin. All of those things matter. And that when you are paying attention and offering your body what it's asking for or what it needs. And sometimes we do need coaches and doctors and other support system to help us understand that. But your skin can be your greatest cheerleader, very crappy confidant. It will tell all your secrets, but it's the gossip that you want to hear because then you're empowered to do something about it.

So, yeah, there's so much brilliance. I feel like you have all these wonderful, I don't want to like, one liners, like your skin is your best gossip. Is that, Is that how you word it?

I would say it's your greatest cheerleader, crappiest confidant.

Crappiest confidant. I love that and I love the reciprocal relationship that you're talking about because I feel like it's really balanced. You shared this really, really profound story about this young man and how while your skin is. And I want to talk more about this, about how your skin is producing stress responses. I didn't know that. That's fascinating. So I'm gonna come back to that in a moment. But I really don't wanna miss the. The point that you made about, yes, doing the work to get to the root cause, to hear the voice, to look at your life, to look at that mind, body, relationship that is important and shouldn't be ignored. And at the same time, there is a way that we feel when our skin isn't looking clear and feeling good. And so sometimes using things like Accutane, even though it's not necessarily getting to the root cause, it can be life transforming and it can create that space.

To do the work 100%. And that's why, you know, it's an integrative approach and integration. And I actually have stepped away from the clinical. I have, I'm certified in integrative dermatology, but I refer a lot of that out to my colleagues because I really do love more of the trying to dig a little bit deeper and strip away the layers. That's really what skinny dipping is. About. And that's the hard work, right? Not many people want to go there. It's a lot easier to put on the lotion. It's a lot easier to get a little Botox, a little filler. But here's. Here's the thing. Shifting gears just a little bit to the aesthetic. You know, there's statistics that the average American woman spends upwards of $250,000 on her appearance over her lifetime. That's a shit ton of money. And then if you look at the doves, statistics, like 96% of women don't feel beautiful. So here's the disconnect, right? That is a ton of money. The vast majority of women don't feel beautiful. And why is that? A lot of it is how we've been socialized, our society, for better, for worse. Like, I'm not, you know, anti procedure, but it's the intention behind it and understanding why we're doing it and digging deep and understanding what thoughts are going through our head that are driving us in that direction. But we have to do that work in order to get a return on that investment. And so there are times where something like Accutane or Biologic may be necessary to create that bridge or aesthetic procedure, like Botox, for instance. There are great studies looking at Botox and depression. And I was administering Botox. I use Botox. I had the reason why I got Botox in the first place years ago is because I hated my job and I had tension headaches, so I needed to relax those muscles. But I will 100% be an advocate for someone if they want something like Botox to relax the angry elevens, if it means that they stop scowling at themselves in the mirror and stop beating the crap out of themselves and have a kinder, gentler conversation, because that's where the healing begins.

And your cells are listening.

Your cells are listening.

So if you can help, like the angry elevens, if you can relax those muscles, you look in the mirror and you see my face looks so much happier. I feel good about it. And then the cells are like, oh, I hear this message. And then your cells respond. And so I was curious, and I know this is going a little bit off of what you and I had intended to talk about, but you're so full of wisdom, and I was wondering if you could touch just a little bit more on the stress response in the skin and how the skin can actually, you said, produce its own hormones.

It's fascinating. It is so fascinating. So the skin actually does have its own HPA Axis. So when we are stressed, our body prioritizes survival. And so the goal is to generate cortisol, the primary stress hormone. And we know that cortisol is terrible for your skin. When cortisol levels increase, cortisol breaks down your collagen and your elastin, which gives your tissue that youthful, plump appearance. The result is more fine lines, wrinkles, and skin sag. It also prevents wound healing. When you're stressed, it's not your imagination that your skin is breaking out. It is because cortisol stimulates those oil glands and producing sebum, that is one of the four primary components of what drives acne. There's so many more. When cortisol elevates, as I mentioned, it's like a domino effect. So the neuroendocrine system, there's the HPA axis, your adrenals creating the cortisol, and then you've got the HPT access so your thyroid hormone can get out of whack. And then your HPG axis, your gonadal, your sex hormones, all your hormones have the same building block. So if your body's prioritizing cortisol, all those other hormones are taking a backseat. And so that impacts your skin significantly. Within your skin itself, it can generate that cortisol. It can generate the epinephrine and the norepinephrine. It has that synthetic adrenal medullary system. It's just fascinating. When those hormones are created, then it triggers this cascade of inflammation. It's like a double whammy. Your skin's producing it, your brain's producing these hormones and signals. And. And so your skin is just, like, getting beaten up. And so it's not that we are stressed. That's the. Like, stress is part of life, but it's learning how we respond to it and learning how we can be empowered to help modulate the stress response so that our skin actually has an opportunity to repair, regenerate, and serve the function that it needs to serve, which is, you know, regulating your temperature, protecting you from infection, and, you know, repairing from the environmental damage, like ultraviolet radiation and air pollution. So I don't know if that actually answered your question, but.

It'S so fascinating. And I have this, like, urge to dive in even more with you. But I'm sure our listeners want to hear all my questions. But what I do want to really emphasize is it can be kind of a vicious feedback loop where you're stressed, and then your hypothalamic pituitary adrenal access is responding to adapt to that stress and then your skin is responding and so then your skin is producing its own stress hormones, which is impacting your skin, which then impacts your emotional well being. To clarify, can the cortisol that my skin produces actually impact my physical experience of stress like.