HOW A MASTER SALESPERSON PROSPECTS IN B2B SALES AND SELLING

Today, people think prospecting is all about personalization and relevance. They're all good ingredients, but there's so much more to it. There's more than just sending a sequence, making a cold call. What we need to do is learn how people want to be approached by salespeople. And today we've got a master prospector, somebody Who is not only good at it, but loves doing it and is going to share his approach. And you've probably heard a lot of this stuff before, but it's not connecting. Get yourself ready to really understand the connection here. And the connections are that you build up a conversation. You don't pitch. Because if you're the person Who's pitching, you're finding interest. You're not creating it. And we're in the creation business. Today, people, if they have interest, they're probably gonna find us long before we ever find them. So that's, you know, trying to find the needle in the haystack. If it's working for you, keep doing it. But if it's not, go to b2brevenue.com and check out Start the Conversation, Get the Meeting. Because this is what I teach. I teach you how to do it through email, phone, social, in person, however you want to do it. But I teach you how people want to be approached. It's about building a conversation, starting where they are and building them up to where you want to be. But let's get into the interview.

But before—

let me tell you a story, a sad story, but a common story. On LinkedIn this week, I saw a sales development rep post a video saying, what's all this talk about having these AI role plays? Let's just get on the phone and make the calls. We'll learn that way. And it's like, well, how would you learn that way? You know, trial and error. There's a little bit of learning with that, but that's not deliberate practice. That's execution. That's playing in sales. That's your income. That's a potential customer that's on the phone that you're experimenting with. And what is the logic there? And then there was an even more disturbing comment on my video about brevity. Felt it was micromanagement. And I'm like, it's the opposite. Of micromanagement. Micromanagement is telling you how to do something and then making you do it while they supervise you. This has given you the freedom to learn and experiment and play without the risk of losing deals. And it just kind of— there's this mentality on the rep side that we, we're perfect the way we are. Look, if you don't have this mindset that for you to make more money, you must become better, you're not going to make it in sales. I'll tell you why. Because most people today have the mindset, oh, to make more money, I just got to find a better job. Well, that can work. I'm not arguing with it, but It can also backfire. You can make it less, you can make the same, but you're gonna have a ramp. But that is not always the only solution. The one you have total control over is you. You. How much you sell generates how much you make. Once you have that ownership and how you do— how do you sell more? I need more leads. Well, go and become a better prospector. I need to— I don't have big accounts. Create big accounts. I'm not against switching jobs. I did it quite a bit. But if you want to make more money in sales, you gotta focus on the person in the mirror because that you are. The revenue generator. If you're not, who is? At least for your own income. So change that mindset to have that personal responsibility that if I want to make more money in sales, I have to become better at selling. Not just busier. Better.

Busier usually Reduces income.

Better always increases income, doesn't it? Seems logical. Let's get into the interview. I'll sum it up at the end. And don't forget to go to brevitypitch.com. The product is amazing. Let me tell you a story. I had a call this week and I was a little— didn't have time to really practice, but I said, Look, I got to do this. And I fired it up. And within 5 or 10 minutes, I was so grateful to have done it. And it asked me a question that came up in the call. Because Brevite, I put in their company, that LinkedIn profile, my concerns, and I asked it to ask me the toughest questions about this. Particular topic, and it did.

Check it out.

It's magic. brevitypitch.com.

Hey, David, thanks for joining us today. As a way of getting started, give us a little background on yourself.

Hey there, Brian. Absolutely. I'm glad to be on here. Glad to join you. Yeah, I am a sales professional of about 30 years. So I've been doing anything from selling, you know, corrugated boxes To office products and now marketing. I've been doing marketing now for about the past 10 years. So having some fun with it for sure.

Yeah.

And I watch your— watch all your videos every day and just the way which flair and humor with which you deliver those things. It gets— it's a great way of delivering some content and getting some messaging across to sales professionals for sure.

Cool. And why sales for you? What was the motive? Sales for me.

My dad was in sales when I was growing up. And I was very introverted. I was extremely introverted all through school. So one of the things I wanted to do, wanted to be like Dad, obviously. And so when I went to college, I did everything that I could to, to get myself out of the introverted, introverted phase. So I did anything from setting up appointments for, for water softener things. I did, I did cemetery plots, set up financial planning meetings with financial advisors. I did anything that I could to just kind of hear the worst things that people were going to say to me. So that's what worked out. I enjoyed it. I like the idea of being able to add some value to the efforts of my clients, get them to where they're making money and get them to where they're getting the word out there. So I definitely have fun with it. That's why sales for me.

And where'd you get that contrarian mindset where you You ran into the storm instead of from the storm.

Well, like I said, my dad always had fun with it. I saw all the relationships that he had built over the course of time, um, the way that he conducted himself. And I said, you know, I want to do that. I want to be able to position myself in a way to where I can be successful in doing that. So that's why I ran to it versus away from it. Uh, my initial instinct was to run away from it, like you mentioned. I said I was very Very backwards and very shy. But now that I've been doing this for some time, I feel that I just continually improve day in and day out. My relationships with everybody that I talk to, I feel I conduct myself in a much, much more effective manner now than I have over the course of years. No, and and one of the things is when I I hear you talk about how we gauge ourselves as a sales professional, I used to compare myself to my colleagues, to my peers. But now what I do is when I go into a situation, I say, "How would I if I was sitting across?" across the room, how would I at this point compare with a version of myself from, say, 10, 15 years ago? So that's kind of what I do. Would I be able to compete with that? How would I engage differently? So that's the way I conduct myself on a day-to-day basis and, and track my growth, if you will.

Well, I, I love that because if you compare yourself to your peers, you're gonna start acting like a better salesperson. If you think like a client, you're gonna become more empathetic.

Yes.

And that's what really, I mean, when we're with a client, we wanna be asking ourselves, what are they thinking and how do I help them through this?

Exactly. And one of the things that I think is every day, and one of the things I try to impart to my clients is, look, I know a lot of sales professionals approach different businesses saying, hey, I work with a lot of clients in your space. I think that we have products and solutions that are going to be able to help. And I recognize that there are so many differences and so, so much uniqueness to each business. Not every business, like if you're a heating and cooling, you know, plumber, not every one of those is gonna be wanting to add. They don't all have the goal to add 15 trucks to grow and add 5 or 6 new territories. Some of them are good where they are. They just want to, you know, just maybe shift their profitability buckets a little bit. So it's just a matter of, of just like you said, many of the things I hear you say is just understanding where they're coming from, what their differentiators are, not just assuming, hey, I work with, you know, 15, you know, HVAC players. I can just do the same thing for you. It just doesn't work that way.

And do you still consider yourself an introvert?

No, no, no, no. I think I've gotten past that. I've had numerous years to get over that, and I think I've been pretty successful in that. Yeah. So that's, that's no longer a factor, whether I'm in networking sessions, when I'm talking to a number of people, you know, I think I'm pretty good these days.

Yeah.

And you get energy by being around people now?

I do.

I do.

I love it. I actually have one of my own networking groups that I do. When I moved to central Pennsylvania from Southern California, I started this Business Professionals of Harrisburg and Central PA networking group on LinkedIn, Facebook, and it's now grown to where we just do monthly in-person networking events. So I just do those like a chamber of commerce. I just find a local business that can benefit from some foot traffic from about 35 to 45+ professionals. And we just, uh, we just have some networking events. So I facilitate those and I think that helps. A number of years ago, I would've probably struggled with that, but now, you know, it's just like second nature now. So, and I figure that if I can't get, if I couldn't get to that level, I probably had no business being, being in sales because you just, you just can't do it. It just doesn't— being very introverted makes it very challenging to, to be in sales.

Yeah. And how do you find selling media? Is it because I gotta imagine it's different every day, each client?

It is. And again, that's what I say. I say much like, you know, the people I'm talking to, much like their worlds are very different and they're not all the same. It's like, why, why me? There's so many media sales professionals out there. And it's not just about the fact that, hey, I'm with Nexstar Media Group, but we've got all this It's why would— what it comes down to is, do they trust me enough? Do they know enough about me and the way that I engage with them to trust that, hey, David can use, pull together the resources from whatever background he's got, whatever platforms he has, whatever the resources he has at his disposal, I trust and know that he can get that done for me to do what we want to do or what he says that we're going to do. So that's it. So that's kind of the way I approach this. Just do they know and trust And feel confident enough in me to pull the resources together versus just saying, hey, I've got all these, you know, I've got all these arrows in the quiver and I've got all these resources. It's not so much about that.

And how do you build that trust? Because it doesn't happen just because Dave walks in the door, right? It takes a while. You look trustworthy.

It does. And I appreciate that. And for instance, like when I go to networking, I see a lot of the people, they're like, hey, what's your goal when you go to networking event? Are you going to get this many appointments or this many deals out of that particular networking event? I don't view it that way anymore. I used to when I was a rookie.

Yeah.

But now it's just, hey, I just want to go there. I want to find 5 or 6 people that are on the same wavelength that I am to where I feel that, hey, we can engage in conversations, we can understand each other and what we do, and we might not have a deal right then and there. We might not have one in 1 week, 2 weeks, a month, but eventually we're going to establish that relationship to where they're gonna say, hey, David, you know, we've known each other, we've been talking for long enough. Let's work on a project together. Let's start, you know, referring each other out to some people. Let's collaborate on some things. And that's what it is. And that's where it flows versus just going into a, a meeting and just trying to squeeze somebody that to get them, you know, to, to just to hit one of my buckets or whatever the case is.

And how would you come to that conclusion? Because you use the word rookie and, you know, the rookie who's in the room, they've got the stack of business cards and it's how many can I give out?

Right.

But there's no connection there, right?

Yeah. And I understand that now some of the, my most successful, and it's taken me some time, but most of my successful client relationships are the ones who have been built. It's not something where I've just tried to transactionally Just jam something down somebody's throat. They say, okay, I'll give it a shot, and then it just doesn't work, and the relationship is not there, and they'll just say, hey, that didn't work, and we're just gonna go elsewhere. Whereas now, again, like I'm sure you're aware, not everything is perfect. It doesn't always go as smoothly as we would like. There are gonna be some hiccups. But when you establish these relationships, and that's the kind of level you are with the clients, they're going to be willing to work with you to work through those things. And that's what's going to strengthen the relationships. Not just because I just pushed something on them. It doesn't work. They don't trust me, and then they just move on. That's not— I've gotten well beyond that. Although I will say, just like most people, when you first start out, I had my little bucket of things I needed to do, and I was guilty of that. I think like anybody else, hey, I need to push this. So I would do that. And I found more often than not the result that we just mentioned. If something goes awry without establishing that level of trust and rapport, They're not as apt to say, hey, let's, I'll, I'll give you a chance to help me fix this. They're just gonna go to the next person because I didn't do that. Yeah.

Yeah. Because in a transaction, you're trying to take the least amount of risk.

Correct.

So you probably take the smallest package, the least risky option. And that probably doesn't do much, especially in media, right? You know, one ad doesn't do much. Might have a little blip. It's the 20 ads, right? It's doing it every day, constantly building it up the same way you do one-on-one.

Correct.

You start to hear the name, you start to hear their customers, you start to understand them, you get to know them.

Yeah. And that's the same thing that I, that I mentioned to my clients. I said, look, I said, there are a lot, much like there's a number of me out there, people doing and claiming to do what I do. I have to try and differentiate myself, and I do that by doing a lot of podcasts. I put myself out there on social media. I put myself in front of so many people that it holds me accountable to the sense that I can't really hide behind just the computer or the phone. I mean, I'm out there putting myself out. So if I'm not doing what I say I'm going to do, it's very easy for people to, to let others know, hey, this Bruno guy you're seeing all over the place. Is not as good as what he's sort of thing. So it holds me to keep myself in the forefront and to make sure that I'm on top of my game and doing right by all the clients that I deal with.

And this networking group, this wasn't something you just started because you lived in a new town and you were bored, right?

You had an objective. Well, I, I, I did actually, I did start it for that because I just wanted people to know who I was. But then over time it grows and it's up to about 3,500, 4,000 people in both Facebook and LinkedIn now. And out of that, there's probably about 200 or so who are engaged online. And then out of that, you know, there's about 50 to 60 to 70 who say, hey, I would like to meet some of the other members in person. So that's when I started doing the in-person meetings. And like I said, we get about anywhere from 35 to 55 people to these meetings. The feedback has been good. They continue to expand and get better. And we just had— we're just starting to have some— a lot of fun with it now to where it's starting to get the ball rolling and pick up some traction. So it's, so it's good.

Yeah.

And it does a couple of things. It gets my personal brand out there, but more importantly, it gets people conversing. I'm able to facilitate some other relationship building, and it gets the people who are sponsoring and hosting those meetings, it gets their message out there as well and gives them a platform for whatever my personal sphere of influence is worth. So that's that, right?

Because everyone thinks prospecting is either cold calling or cold email pitches. Prospecting can be just having a conversation with a stranger.

Oh yeah. And as I listen to your, to your post, the conversing with a stranger, I mean, it's just when you, when you can empathize with that and say, well, would I respond to somebody like I saw the one video where the gentleman was just walking around Manhattan He was there in Times Square, and he just approached and sat down to people and basically recited a cold email to them. And they just looked like, are you— you're like, are you out of your mind? And as I listened to it, I said, yeah, probably most of it. A lot of mine sounded just like that.

Well, of course, how could it, right?

Yeah. But when you sit down next to somebody and he was actually just introduced himself that way, it just sounded so Ridiculous. It's like, who would listen to this, you know, sort of thing?

Yeah. And let's, let me, let's take you back to a networking event. Your group, not every of those 35 people know each other already, right?

Correct.

But they don't stand in the corner on the wall like a high school dance. What do they do?

There's a lot of engagement and I will facilitate.

But they're strangers. How would you, why would you engage with a stranger?

Yeah, there are some people though that they do show up and they're like, I'm not used to this. This is like my first time. And I'm good now because now I'll go around and introduce them to everybody.

Yeah.

And I just have a good time with that. So I think I've totally come out of my shell to where I'm more of a facilitator versus just the person that I used to be over in the corner like what you did. I'd be standing like what you just said. I'd be standing over there waiting for people to come to me. And bring me in, but it's not the case anymore. So, well, that's it.

And it's like, imagine a date where you start reading your resume to the date. Well, I went to this high school, I played volleyball, I was number 7 out of 100. It's like, who cares? Let's talk, let's get to the ultimate.

And people don't want to do that because it's a transaction.

Yeah, nobody at that networking event is transacting though, right?

No, no, no. They're there to have a good time. They're there to learn about the the host business for whatever that's for whatever that is, but to facilitate and engage and meet people. And when you come across those people that hey, you know, I can get along with this person. I can have a decent conversation with them. At some point, perhaps we can work together. That's that's all of it. But just going out there and not knowing anything about them, saying here's my card. I can help you with this, and then moving to the next person. I just remember myself doing that to get as many people as I could when I was first starting. And now I just say I was that person in the room that—

Because that's efficient. It's not effective, but it's efficient. Yeah.

Like when you say do more dumb things faster, that was, you know, that's kind of what that, where that fell into.

And what were some of the epiphanies along the way when you, you know, because you went through a lot of transition, you've done a lot of things, you found what seems like your home or your, your comfort zone or your, your thing, right? What'd you learn along the way? What were some of the epiphanies that you really wish you learned year one?

Some of the things I wish I learned year one. Well, primarily one of the things we already talked about is being— is establishing those relationships versus just being transactional, especially in what I'm doing now with media. There's a lot of dollars that go into that. There's a lot of trust that needs to go because the, the lifeblood of businesses are reliant on, you know, what their messaging is, what it's saying, and who it's saying it to and when. And so that's not just a transactional type of thing that, again, they wanna know, hey, there's a lot of marketing companies out there. There's a lot of people that say they do what Bruno does. Why would I go with him? Versus someone else. And so that's what I've learned is, hey, I have to— I can't be just like everybody else, and I don't want my clients to be like everybody else. So when I talk to clients, I say, look, I said, what we're going to separate you from the pack. We're not just going to say, hey, I work with 15 HVAC companies and we're just going to get you doing the same thing they are. No, no, we're going to, you know, they do their things well. You do your things well. We're gonna highlight that. We're gonna spotlight that. We're gonna bring that to the forefront, and we're gonna show everybody why you're a key player in this in this space. And that's it. And we have a good time doing it. And that's the other thing that I do. I said, "Look, we're gonna do this, and we're gonna have a we're gonna have some fun doing it. It's not just going to be you know." I said, "You might not invite me to your barbecues. However, if you do, I'll be there, and I'll have some bells wrapped around my neck." You know?

Well, I got to imagine that your customers say that. Hey, David gets me. He understands what we're trying to accomplish.

Yeah, that's the thing. I always have my clients' best interests in mind. You know, there always used to be when I— again, when I started, there was always— I said, okay, my goals are X and I need to push my clients into that bucket. I view it the other way around now because the more I help my clients, those other things are going to eventually fall into place. I mean, I have to keep them in my head. But I, it's, it's, it's about the, the customers and the clients, not me. If I'm doing what I need to do to help them, those things will fall into place for me because it's helping them. It's not the other way around. You know, it's not help me, I get to where I am and then I figure out how to make it work for them. That, that's, I think that was one of my pitfalls early on. And so if you're talking about an epiphany, it was that.

Well, well, that's it. Because in your space, I'm sure someone says, well, just send me a media kit or a rate card and next call.

They absolutely do. And those people, I say, I could certainly do that, but I say, I'm not that, that's, I might not be the person for you to work with there because I say, that's just, uh, I said, I'm not an order taker. I am a consultant. My time, I value my time as much as anybody else's. And so the way we're going to work together is to have a conversation. We're going to find out specifically what's going on, and we're going to go from there. We're going to get to know each other, and if it's something that makes some sense, that's great. But there's no sense in me just sending out media cards and rates and things like that saying, I hope you pick me over somebody else. So there's that.

How long does it typically take from that first initial call? And let's say you You feel it's a match, but they need to get comfortable with you because they probably don't buy on the first call, right?

Correct. Correct. Now, sometimes there are, and what I'm doing, there are some transactional pieces that kind of get some people's feet wet. So there are those, some of those may happen a little bit more quickly than others. But when we're looking at the bigger picture and I'm trying to say, hey, there's, there's certain goals you have, places you want to go with your growth, you want to expand, you want to add territories, whatever the case is, you want to add headcount. Those things require a lot more. And so there's going to be a 60, 90-day, 120-day sometimes time from when we start to when we get to that point. And that's fine because when I talk to enough people, it just keeps on moving. It just keeps on moving. So it constantly keeps the pipeline full. So when people are ready, then we're there and we're set to go.

And how do you keep their attention along the way? Because You run out of stuff to talk about sometimes, don't you? Maybe you don't, but some people do. Some people do.

I use LinkedIn a lot. I use LinkedIn a lot. So I'm just trying to look for common threads. I want to know as much as I can about people because then that's how I can gauge who do I want to work with. I don't want to just work with everybody and anybody. I want to work with people who are kind of very much in the same mindset that I am because those are the people that I'm going to be able to establish that those strategic relationships, the ones who I'm going to be able to expand on the programs that we're working with, not just saying, well, I just want to work with everybody just because. So I just go a little bit deeper on some of these things and I just try and keep them updated on trends. I try and keep them updated. I don't know if anybody who's seen some of the things that I post on my social media, for instance, I mix it up. I'll do some business posts, I'll do some sales posts, I'll inform and educate. But then I also just put some things just about me. I mix those in there. Hey, I'm at an event or I'm at a game or something like that. Just wanted to check in and say hi to everybody so that people have an insight on what I do to where when I do post sales or educational pieces, it doesn't get lost in just the minutia and the shuffle. So that's kind of something there as well.

Yeah, because I think people want to know who you are. That you're not a marketing robot, or that you have interests outside of that.

Yeah, there are not—not everybody appreciates the way that I conduct myself on social media, and that's fine. Not everybody's going to. But like I said, I think that if I—if all I did was day in and day out, I had no humor; all I did was just post all the stuff that we do, I think that's going to get just. pushed off and lost in the shuffle. But, you know, I get a lot of play if I put a goofy picture up there or show myself at a game or doing something fun besides just selling, if you will. People understand and they have a better conception of what I'm about before we even speak most of the time. So that's— so I think that's worked out really well, and I have more and more fun doing that. In this way as we go, I love sales more every day because I just keep evolving with it and trying to make how can I make this as fun as possible and still keep my clients happy and moving forward and getting where they want to go by working with me.

That's what it's about, and that's a great question to ask. How do I make this fun? Yeah, yeah.

Again, you can't please everybody. Not everybody is going to approve. They, they, they said, well, why would you put yourself at a game on there? It's not professional. It depends on how you define professional. I mean, it's just a difference. It's just difference in how you define that. I'm not acting a fool. I'm not doing anything crazy. I'm just showing, hey, I actually do other things besides sit in this office. I mean, or sit at a networking event. And even that, that's a challenge. People say, man, you're at all these networking events. When do you ever do work? Oh, that's, that's what kind of— they think I'm just a salesperson who gets to be out and about having a good time. And I said, well, that's when I'm up at, you know, 4:30, 5 o'clock in the morning at times, or doing this at 11, midnight, because there actually is that time when you have to get the things done. It's not just all networking conversations. So, yeah.

And when you either compete against or work with another salesperson, what are they not getting?

But a lot of the people that I talk to, they're not getting the relationship aspect of it.

Yeah.

It's very transactional. They're just thinking, hey, you know, I can just do the same thing, take the same programs I'm working with this one and put it over there. And, and then that's it. And then that, that customer is supposed to say, oh, well, it works for them, so therefore it must work for me. And that's not, you know, you realize that's not the case. I mean, you can do some similar sorts of things, but it's not just a plug-and-play solution for one heating and cooling company to another or one, you know, roofer to another. It's that they all have their separate things that they're looking for. And because again, one of them could be focused on growth. Hey, we want to— the one I could just recently work with, they want to add 10 trucks and expand their territory out to, from a 1-hour radius to a 3-hour radius from their location. Not every roofer wants to do that. So, I mean, I can't apply the, you know, that sort of program to the next one. So, yeah.

And you used the word relationship, and I think a lot of people think that that's just rapport, but there's a lot more to it. What does it mean to you?

Well, the rapport is, is probably a key element to it because you just, like you said, like you always emphasize, you gotta have to— they have to trust you, they have to believe you, and they have to, to a degree, like you. So there's that. But they also have to believe that I am an expert at what I do. I'm not just a guy out there networking.

Talking to a pretty face.

Yeah, this is a person who believes in what they do, who understands what they do, who understands The business and the operations of their clientele to where they can make some things happen for me as well. To where we're going to engage with him in this process and start some things and give us a couple couple little nuggets to chew on and work with, and then develop that relationship from there. So that's what I view as a relationship. It's constantly evolving, and you know when you start to know people and have some conversations at these events, or you're out and about, or you have a couple phone calls with them. Doing business together is just a byproduct of some good productive conversations and calls. I don't think it's really the other way around unless you are in a purely transactional sort of situation.

And how do you keep expectations in line? Because what you're— you got to build it up enough for them to take action, but not too much for them to overestimate the outcome and how fast it'll happen.

Right, right. Set those expectations right up front. Again, when I first started, I was glad. I said, oh, okay, they're going to do something with me. I'm just going to run with it and just cross my fingers and hope for the best. But now it doesn't really work that way. We set up the expectations from the beginning. I want to make sure that we're on the same page with everybody's key performance indicators. So I say, if we do these programs and these components, of a marketing initiative, what are your performance indicators for that? What are your expectations? Are you just looking to get some of your name out there? Are you looking to generate direct leads? Do you just want people to look at your webpage and then take it from there? We want to make sure there's no mysteries. So when they— so when we go back to do the review, we just say, look, this is specifically what we talked about. This is where we are. Either we make it, we don't. Let's It's what can we do to get there if we're not? And if we're exceeding it, you know, how can we keep it there and how can we keep that ball rolling? So that's the expectations. I just do that right up front. There's no mysteries as to what this program is going to, is wanting to accomplish.

And do you have any go-to questions or techniques to get to their why behind the why? Because, you know, at first it'll be like, oh, we want to add 10 trucks. But you really want to understand, you know, what caused that and what changed. What—

Exactly. I mean, in many cases I'll ask them questions like that. I'll say, with you as the business owner, if you want to add trucks like that, I mean, are you looking to— is that going to impact when you wrap up your career? Is that going to impact your retirement? Are you wanting to get there just faster or are you looking to hand this off to the next generation of your family or what's, what's, what's going on there? What do we want to do? Who do we want to involve? And so that's, that's one of the ways that I look at that from that perspective. And one of the first questions I always ask everybody when I go into a meeting, I said, look, I said, your time's valuable. I said, I know I'm busy. You're busy. There's many calls you receive, many emails, many reach-outs. What prompted you to take this call with me today? What do you expect to get from it? What do you feel? I bring by sitting here? Because we know we're not there just to waste time. And so I always ask that. And I think that opens up a lot. That question opens up, I think, more information and more conversation than any other line of questioning that I do. That really gets the ball rolling. And I think that's probably the most— the easiest way of figuring out where we are before we even start talking.

Great. Hey, Dave, really appreciate your time today. Where can people go to connect and follow you?

People can find me on my LinkedIn page. I mean, it's just David Bruno on LinkedIn. I'm David Bruno on Facebook as well. I'm in the Philadelphia area, so you can find me there. And then I got my cell phone number is the best way to catch me, 949-742-1402. Call, text, email dbruno@abc27.com. And I look forward to just having as many conversations as we can, getting to know everybody out there. And if you think that I can add some value to your efforts, you know, let's Let's have that conversation.

See, with this kind of modern prospecting, the cold calling and the cold emailing, you're trying to find interest at that one moment. And you say, well, I leave voicemail too, and I follow up with an email. Well, it's all about a transaction. So the question is, are they In need, in market at that moment, that particular moment for that transaction. That's why it's so hard. Now listen to David's approach. He knows that, you know, if someone's interested in advertising, they're more likely to call him than him finding them. So he's got to build up a know, like, and trust relationship with them. We all believe that, know that, understand it, but do we know what it means? What it means is you make investments in the other person. You show interest in them before you expect them to show any curiosity or interest in you. And I'm sure you're listening to this and go, yeah, I know that, I get that, but Are you doing it? Well, yeah, I call them up and I tell them about the problem that I can solve for them and— Yeah, but have they shown any concern about that problem? Well, they should be concerned. I didn't say they should. Are they? Most likely they're not. And remember, the first stage of change is denial. It's not acceptance. That's the last. Step change. Go ahead, Google it. And this is what people do. And we find it illogical because we're— we look at them as buyers. Well, they're just people. They're strangers at first. Take the baby steps and then start the conversation. Get the meeting. I explain this in exact detail with, I don't know, maybe 150 or so use cases, particular markets, everything from copiers to enterprise software to Learjets to million-dollar construction equipment. If you want to become great at sales, you got to study it from someone who understands it. And there's a lot of people Who teach sales, but they don't— never done it, never done it to that really core level. Because what's different about my training is you get one-on-ones, you get office hours, everything is put back into the course. So if you can't make it, you just go into the course and it's there. All the past ones are there. There's all new topic. It's not just Q&A. There are case studies and there's particular deep dives on unique areas of sales. And it's all about being proactive. And I really try and articulate what the best salespeople do, the process that people go through to get these big enterprise deals. And whether you might have smaller deals, But are they closing? If they are, great, you might be all set. But if they're not, you're working essentially for free. I know the base is nice. I love a big base. I miss a big base. But you know what the base is. That's it. I appreciate you listening this week. Tell a friend about the show. Grab your manager, go check out brevitypitch.com. And it is— I, I have not seen something that's going to help you sell better. You know, there's stuff that'll, you know, give you more information, make you do— be able to do things more automated. But as a salesperson, getting better, getting immediate feedback Let's face it, what does every person who wants to be in my training want? They want somebody, you know, on demand who can give them a little feedback, someone who can kind of show them and then, you know, role-play a little and then experiment. That's what everybody wants, and that's what you get, all without having to make an appointment with somebody. And worry about their judgment. It's a machine, baby. Nobody cares. We'll see you next time.