THE SECRET TO DEVELOPING YOUR SALES SUPERPOWER

Today, we have another great salesperson. And what I want you to get out of this one is that not only does it take a lot of reps, a lot of repetition in sales, but it also takes that quality, focusing in on what does work, focusing in on thinking about the other person. And these reps, you know, it can take years or it can just take lots of reflection. Too many of us think it's just reps. You know, I was talking to my chess coach the other day, and he wants me to spend 3, 4 hours a day playing chess. And it's just, that ain't happening. I'm lucky to get half a game in a day, half hour, maybe an hour. But he says, you need those repetitions. And I go, no, that's why I hired you. I want to learn the exact process. And he goes, you're doing really good at it, but you still need the reps. And I can't argue with him, but in sales, what creates those reps? What distinguishes the good ones from the bad ones? How do we get better? Instead, what we're doing today is we're looking for the perfect subject line, the perfect cold call opener, these little tidbits. Now, are they helpful?

Yeah.

But even if you had it, The tonality, the pacing, the tempo of delivering it takes time. It does. When I talk to people who are great on the phone, especially cold calling, that first call, I'd say it's 80% of how they say it versus what they say. You can listen back on my past ones on cold calling, and it's pretty clear. You know, you can call it charm or personality, but it's really the perfection or the polishing of that approach. Because sales, we want to think of it as this game, but it's an infinite game and it's a dynamic game. It's changing while we play it. So you can either try and find a way of understanding it to become better at it. You don't want to become overwhelmed that you can never become good at it. 80% of the people out there can become very good at it. All you have to do is really practice, but learn the right things. Take your time, reflect, own it, ask for feedback, take it, integrate it, try it again. It's a great field. It's a great profession. And when you become great at it, it is so much fun. At the very end of this interview, I appended a testimonial from somebody who's in the Start the Conversation, Get the Meeting course. So if you hate cold calling and you're tired of spamming, or it's just not working for you and you need to build up a business conversation with a stranger, it's a skill. It's not the knowledge. Been teaching this for over 10 years now. Believe me, it's a skill. It's a skill for me. It's a skill for everybody. Yes, the step-by-step approach can be easily automated, but then you still have to talk to somebody.

Sorry about that.

We can't automate that part.

Here we go.

I think you're really going to enjoy this interview.

Hey, Ken, thanks for joining us today. As a way of getting started, give us a little background on yourself.

Thanks, Brian. Excited to be here. Uh, my name is Ken Stank. I live in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, so the capital right outside of Harrisburg, PA, and, uh, been doing sales for about 7 years. And so it's, it's been an exciting journey for me, um, in my young career so far, just to be able to have sales. But kind of want to take you back to where it all came from and, and how I got involved into it. So I was a wrestler my whole life. Um, one of the things that people always look for right away is cauliflower ear. I got lucky enough not to have cauliflower ear. Um, but, um, I wrestled from the time I was 5 all the way up through college. And some of the things that I learned from fighting from adversity and, you know, being out there by yourself, basically nobody else to make it happen for you, you had to be out there and will yourself. So some of the dedication and drive and all the things that had to go in before actually getting out on the mat and competing, I use those techniques and valuable skills and I've really translated over to sales pretty quickly. The other thing that has happened to me, when I was 14, I was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes. So, you know, overcoming adversity, obstacles, things like that. I've had bumps in the road throughout my career and everything I've learned from being a wrestler and fighting this disease on a daily basis, one, kept me with a positive outlook on life, and two, has really helped me be successful in this career.

That must have been difficult. I have a good friend whose daughter You know, was diagnosed very young, right? So you had to like deal with the injection, the daily injections?

Yep, yep. And pricking my finger probably 15 times a day. And the technology on that has gotten a lot better. Um, but yeah, I was in my second week of high school and, uh, you know, you're already nervous going into high school and then boom, I got hit with that. It was like, oh my gosh. But, you know, I didn't, didn't let it keep me down and You know, immediately went right into, okay, what do I got to do to be successful at this, at being healthy? So, um, that really kind of inspired me then later in life as I look back to my dedication with sales. So it's been—

And learning those disciplines, because as a teenager, you know, yeah, you're kind of impulsive, you know, right? You're constantly, you know, around your crew And social standing is hyper-conscious. Uh, how did you deal with it? How did you develop that willpower?

Yeah, so it was definitely nerve-wracking coming back because, you know, everybody's just starting high school. You're all freshmen, and they're like, dude, you were out for a week. Where'd you go? And it's like, well, you know, how do I tell them that now I have this disease that, you know, I have to sometimes leave class early? You know, when I'm going before lunch, I have to go to the nurse's office. You know, so it was, it was definitely interesting when I first came back, and I was lucky enough to have somebody in the school who also had diabetes that kind of took me under her wing. And, um, you know, she, she was like, look, you got this. Like, just be confident. It's who you are. You're not getting rid of it. So, you know, just accept it and keep moving forward. And I think also just from, you know, my wrestling background, like, you know, you might go out there and take a loss, but you come back fighting the next day, and it's It was probably that mentality that I never doubted it for a second. And even my parents were so surprised. They were probably more in doubt than I was when I first got diagnosed, just because they had— it came out of nowhere. Nobody really in my family had type 1. So, you know, I just kind of took it in stride. And I went in Monday night to the hospital, and they said, you know, you're going to be here for a week. I was out Wednesday afternoon, and that was just because I was like, First off, I didn't like being in the hospital, and secondly, I was like, I'm gonna learn as much as I can as quick as I can, and we're gonna keep moving forward.

Yeah, cool. Now that certainly builds up the will side of selling. How about the skill side, kind of dealing with people? Because wrestling, it's not a verbal sport, right?

Yeah, absolutely. So I've had some great mentors throughout my career that, you know, I've been able to learn you know, kind of the hard skills in sales and the people skills too. Like what questions to ask, how do you approach, how do you like really portray yourself when you're talking to somebody. So I always like to call myself a consultant. I don't like the term sales because, you know, you think of the guy in the suit and tie with a briefcase walking up to an office door. And really, I, you know, when I walk up, I'm trying to build a relationship. So what, you know, even if we can't do business, I'm going to have a lasting relationship because I met you today. And, you know, maybe down the road something will come up where we can work together. But that's something that I've really taken to heart. And, and when I'm talking to somebody, getting to know them, try to say their name 3 times during the meeting because it, you know, it makes them know that you're present and that you're engaged with them. So learning kind of the emotional intelligence side of things. One of the companies I worked for, the CEO there was really big into emotional intelligence. So, you know, trying to, you know, relate with people and stay grounded every day and And, you know, learning, you know, what questions to ask to help you get the answers that you're, you're searching. So I was always pretty outgoing growing up, so it wasn't a hard, uh, transition, I would say, over to sales. But, um, you know, helping learn my craft, my skills a little bit better.

But you chose a finance degree. Was there something behind that, or was it—

is that—

Yeah, it's a good question. So yeah, I went to school for finance and personal financial planning, and so I did that for probably my first year and a half out of college. And when I was in that industry, okay, yeah, it's a little stressful industry, you know. And, um, the part that I loved about it was calling on the clients or prospects and getting them to come in to meet with us. And then you kind of get that reward if they become a client. So it's like, all right, so if I put in the work and get somebody to come in and they become a client, I can get, you know, a reward for it. So that, that kind of opened my eyes up to, you know, you can always go back to this finance thing. He's like, why don't you give it a shot in sales? So that's, that's kind of what I did. And my first job in sales, and it's kind of funny, it was in the collections agency realm, which is always a fun topic to talk to people about, right? So my first sales pitch had to be, why could we help you collect monies that you were owed that you couldn't collect? And then we get to take a fee off of it. So that was very interesting, but I learned a lot in cold calling, You know, cold selling, you know, everything that comes with sales. And when I got to my next position, which was with a recruiting firm, I worked for them for about 4 years, went from an account executive to a senior account executive to a manager. Um, you know, I, I became one of their top salespeople that they ever had. And really, I, I take it back to my organization and my persistency and consistency. You know, one of the quotes I love is, be— start getting comfortable doing the uncomfortable things, things that people don't want to do. If you're doing those, you're going to set yourself up for success.

Yeah, especially in those spaces, and you've picked some pretty hard ones.

Yeah, absolutely. Some, uh, some unique industries, right?

Well, I mean, recruiting, you know, it's purely you, right? You know, it's—

no one— they may—

they They probably didn't hear about the company, right?

Yep. Yeah, it was relationship-based. You know, I was out there networking with those companies, and because they liked me, they give us a chance to— you know, I've earned their trust and I've earned their, you know, ability to work with them. And that's where they gave us the opportunity to, you know, you know, place somebody with them or, you know, get a candidate in front of them.

Well, let's dig into that, because no question you got the will and the the daily routines and everything. How did you build those relationships?

Sure. It's, you know, getting out there in the community, going to chamber events. I was networking, you know, any type of networking event that I could get out to, local charity events, things like that, walks. LinkedIn is now kind of the past year and a half where I've been living on. So, you know, and we got the company I work for now, we got fortunate enough to go into the PPE industry. So I got to have a lot of conversations with companies about the PPE and, you know, maybe, or maybe conversations I might not have had, or people would have just maybe ignored, that I've been able to start with that and now grow into what we actually do.

And did you make the transition from the quantity to the quality? Because I can see the work ethic, but then we all kind of get burnt out with the work ethic, and we then figure out a smarter way of doing it.

Absolutely. So that, that first job I had, my boss wanted me to make 100 calls a day, and that is tough to do. Let me tell you what, it's, it is, um, it's a feat in itself. It's almost sitting on the phone for 8 hours a day. So that, that was interesting. But then taking that into my next position, you know, so I had the dedication of making the calls and doing it, but then you have to realize, all right, I got to work smarter, not harder, because some of those things, you're, you know, not wasting your time, but it's not the smartest approach. So you have to get unique in, in your approach to what you're saying and what you're doing. And that's, you know, kind of the company I'm at now, you know, posting on LinkedIn is one of my things that I try to do on a weekly basis, just because it's brand awareness. You know, you want to be out there and in front of people. And if I can get a couple people to laugh at a post or, you know, smile or even like it, you know, see it, That, that's what I'm doing to try to work smarter. And, you know, same thing with the emails that I send. You know, I'm trying to customize it to who I'm talking to. And the other thing I like doing is bringing up things that I remember from our conversations. So if I find out that somebody likes to go golfing or fishing, or they have a couple kids, you know, you personalize that to them. So it's not just them thinking, okay, here's one of the 500 emails I'm getting today with a sales pitch.

Well, that's it, because what's the last thing you want? Who's the last person you want to talk to?

Right, exactly, exactly. And I know one of the things with, you know, rejection is obviously big in our, you know, in the sales field. And I always use the analogy of when somebody says no or hangs up on me, I just, in my brain, I say, you know what, they were driving to work this morning and they have a nice white shirt on and they spilled coffee on themselves, and you were the first one to talk to them after they spilled that coffee. So now, you know, I try to get it out of my system so you don't get that pit feeling and sit and dwell on it for half an hour or a whole day sometimes. It's just, okay, it wasn't the day to talk to them. And then it's another time that I could follow up with them.

And do you have kind of— because that's kind of redefining the meaning of it, right? Because the first time it happened, you probably didn't think that way.

Yeah, the first time it happened, I remember sitting there and being like, oh my goodness, I was in the middle of talking to somebody and How rude. It's like, wow. And then I took it personally, and then you're like kind of feeling like upset about it. And then I was like, you know what? I was like, let me change my perspective on this because it's just, it's not me. It just wasn't the right timing. So, um, that's something that, yeah, it took a little while to get used to, but once you get into the habit, and it obviously it happens all the time, you know, so it, it becomes a little bit easier to take that rejection as, as it happens more often.

So And that's it, because I see a lot of leaders kind of doing that 100 calls a day.

Yeah.

And you can make the argument it's, it's good warm-up, it's good reps, right?

Shape, right?

But then the other part of it is it's 100 rejections a day. And how does that person feel going home?

Oh, absolutely, it burns you out. And then, then you got to take it home, and, you know, if you have a family, you know, you gotta, you gotta switch it immediately.

The poor dog.

Exactly, exactly. It's tough to do that. And, you know, even in the past, you know, 2 years at my current position, it's— I've been working from home. So it's tough. Like, now I had to understand the role of, okay, I'm out here working, but how do I switch it off? Because I'm still here at home. So, you know, that was something I had to learn how to do, you know, pretty quickly so that I'm not taking any stress or anxiety or even like a little bit of craziness from work into the home life then and trying to calm down and be, you know, be a father, be a husband, be, you know, be even keel again because it was, you know, and I think working out is one of the things that does help me do that. Getting out doing walks at lunch, things like that, and taking our kids on a walk, it just kind of helps you get back grounded. And, you know, the work will be there. So you gotta, you gotta make sure you make time for home and family too.

And you became a people manager at the staffing company, is that true?

Yeah. So, um, I managed our skilled trades recruiting team, and on the side I was still doing sales as well. So that, that was interesting because I, you know, I thought that I always wanted to be a manager, and I told, uh, I had told that company that I was going to take over their business and become the CEO. And the CEO was like, hey, I love it, I love the attitude. Um, and so yeah, it was It was fun because I had some really good mentors then on how to manage people. And the first day that I was there and we had our first in-person meeting with the team, I said, look, I want to sit with each and every one of you and learn what you do every day because I'm not going to be an effective manager if I don't understand how you guys do it and what the process is. Once I understand that, that's where we can implement change and help you be better and, and give improvements and give feedback.

And what's your why? You're clearly highly motivated. What drives that?

Yeah, so, uh, my why is probably my family. You know, I want to be able to take care of them and not have them ever worry about anything. And, um, you know, I also like helping people too. So it's, it's kind of a mixture of 2 things there. And obviously, I'm— I want to be successful and make a lot of money too. But, you know, my family is probably the biggest reason why, you know, I push forward every day. On a bad day, you know, you're sitting here like I just got to do it. I just got to grind through this day, and because of this day, I'll be better tomorrow. So it's, it's definitely, you know, knowing that I have a family and years down the road they're going to get married and have kids too, and probably weddings to pay for and colleges to pay for. So it motivates me to be the best person I can be now to help take care of the family later on.

And I take it you have kids?

Yes.

Having kids, did that help with the EQ?

Yeah, yeah, it did. I mean, you know, you had the first one and it's like, okay, we got it out of the way. You learned how to, you know, parent, how to be good, how, like, right things to do. And then, uh, when you have the second one, it's okay. It's like, all right, we've done this before, we're good. But, um, it definitely, I think, increased that motivation behind what I was doing because it was, it was, you know, it was my wife and I before, and then, you know, obviously we both wanted to be successful. But now we got some little ones that depend on us to take care of them. And I never want them to be in a situation where we can't provide for them. So for me, every day, that's when I wake up and they're my number one thing is, you know, let's provide for the family and let's keep doing everything I can to be the most successful person that I can be and the best me that I can be, the best dad, the best father, you know, and the best salesman. So.

Did you grow up with any Other than the diabetes, any hardships financially? Or it sounds like—

Not really. Um, my mom and dad did okay, you know, they were probably in the middle of the pack, but, um, you know, it's—

Should they be glad to hear that?

Yeah, I know, I know. Um, yeah, they were okay. Yeah, they were good. They're great parents, great parents though. And they never, they never said no to us for anything that we wanted to do. which is something that I want to do with our kids. So I look back and I think of all the wrestling tournaments that I went to growing up. And, you know, somehow my parents always found a way to get a hotel room and get me there. And now that I'm older and I think about all the expenses that they incurred probably from my wrestling tournaments, I'm like, wow, they invested a lot into me for something that, you know, there's no professional wrestling sport. I wasn't going to be an Olympic wrestler. I was a great wrestler. I had a great high school career and a great college career.

Yeah.

You know, and I didn't want to get my head smashed in, in, uh, the MMA. So I was like, you know, after, after collegiate wrestling, I was like, that was it. You know, I had to find something that brought the same passion that I had towards wrestling. And that's where sales really kicked in.

Well, I think it— I've seen a lot of wrestlers, um, become great salespeople. Yeah, because it's that one-on-one, no excuses.

Absolutely, absolutely.

Which is— I mean, you're part of a team, but that's kind of a side effect, right?

They keep a score, but it's you versus somebody else. And, and—

but that training and the discipline, because it's not just the working out, you always have to try and get in the lower weight class.

Yeah, yeah. So, you know, obviously when I was diagnosed with diabetes, you know, I never really cut weight, uh, up until high school. Um, so that wasn't really an issue. But after I got diagnosed, it was like, well, how do I lose weight without my blood sugars spiking or crashing? Which, that was kind of a whole trial and error thing with my doctors because they didn't want me cutting weight. And then if I lost weight, they'd be like, something's wrong. And I'd have to tell them, no, it's just wrestling season. It's okay that I dropped 5, 8 pounds. Um, but yeah, that, that was very tricky. And, and just the dedication, you know, as a, as a high schooler, You know, kids are eating at lunch. You know, they got sodas, they got hot dogs, hamburgers. Right?

You don't know what's in it.

Salivating over everything, and I'm like, man, I had like a yogurt and a banana today, and I could totally eat your whatever you got over there. So, um, it does take a lot of dedication because you know we're we're trying to perform at our peak, and sometimes you have to lose a couple pounds. I never was big on cutting weight, and same with my parents. They they never forced me to do anything. My my coaches never forced me to cut weight. It was really whatever you wanted to wrestle at. If you won the spot. It was your weight. And, um, you know, so I tried to be the strongest and best that I could at the weight that I was at.

Yeah. And so you had no diet issues with either, um, changes?

Yeah.

So, uh, it was interesting again with the diabetes because you kind of have to change your diet for that. So, like, you know, I went, I went from, you know, being a kid drinking slushies and sodas and all the candy and It's like all of a sudden it stops and it was like, okay, so what can I eat? And then as you start to learn, you can still have some of those things. Obviously the slushies are out of the picture now, just there's too much sugar in them. But, um, you know, you can still have them in proportion. And so what I've learned is, you know, to be the same dedication that I take to wrestling is the same that I take to the diabetes and, uh, same with sales. But you have to, you have to have the right diet. Um, the right type of diet for diabetes, the right type of diet for sales, right? So when you're making calls, you know, you have to have the right blend of things, energy, your vitamins, right? Yeah. So it's the same type of thing in each aspect of my life that I tried to carry that same perspective over to.

And what do you think some of the epiphanies, the major changes, or when the light bulb went on that took your sales career to the next level?

Sure. So I have a good story about this one. It's, um, probably my organization and probably my consistency. Those are the 2 things that cause these epiphanies to happen. So I was calling on an account for about a year, and I told the guy— first thing I did, I set the expectation with them, which is huge. So one, I'm not bothering them too much, or maybe I'm not in front of them enough. So I just said, hey, is it okay if I follow up every month? I'll just send you a quick quick blast of an email saying, hey, how are you? Anything we can do? He said, sure, that's fine. So every month on the dot, I would have a follow-up set up and I would reach out to him. And, uh, I remember it was in between one of my follow-ups, I got an email and the subject said white flag. And I was like, white flag? I was like, what's that? So I opened it. He said, hey Ken, he's like, white flag, I need your help. And he was like, because you consistently followed up with me, I remembered you. So That was one of the biggest epiphanies that I've had. And, um, it's happened a lot more too. And I know in my current job it's happened already too, that somebody's like, hey, I'll give you the introduction to the right team because you've consistently followed up with me and, and you've put the time in to make sure that you follow up with me. And we appreciate that. And I can— I want to try to reward you. I'm not going to guarantee you it's business, but at least you get to get to the table.

And I think that's something in sales that we're always ready to sell, right? But the need isn't developed, the timing isn't right.

Yep.

Especially in B2B.

Yeah. Oh, absolutely. And one of the things that I love asking— well, first, I like asking a lot of questions to the people that I talk to, because you just get to know things more and you get more information is better. And then you again, take it back when you're following up. But Uh, one of the questions that I will ask in like an introductory meeting is, on a scale of 1 to 10, 1 being worst, 10 being the best, where's your current provider on that scale? And I would say most of the time nobody's going to give a 10 out of 10, but I get— we get like an 8 or a 7.

Yeah.

And then I don't really have to say, well, why is it a 7? Because they're going to say it's a 7 because— and that starts— it starts the whole process of getting to the pain points and maybe Differentiates us from who they're currently working with, which gives us an opportunity. And, and the other thing on that same boat is people only know what they know. So they're working with a provider right now that they think you're the same exact way as that provider.

Or worse.

Yeah, or worse. Yeah. So what can you bring to the table that helps them realize that you're different? And that's, you know, that's those 2 things right there are huge in the sales process because If you can get them to understand that you're not, you know, just like Joe Smith down the street, you know, then one, you can get a leg up, and then two, you can start getting to their pain points and start figuring out how you can work together. And again, you know, that whole collaboration piece of being a consultant and building that relationship with them and just keeping the conversations moving forward.

What I liked about that was you're starting where they are.

Right.

Instead of you trying to get them to start where you are.

Correct. Yeah.

Where you're, you know, more cost effective, faster, bigger, cheaper, whatever it is.

Yeah.

But they're not in active pain.

Right. Correct.

A 7 is kind of like latent pain, right?

It's like they're not perfect.

Right. Right.

You're kidding.

Why?

Why a 7?

They're not a 10.

But, and them telling you is what you want. You telling them doesn't do any good.

No. And, and I think that's something I learned pretty quickly in, in that collection sales role. It was, well, don't tell them why you're good. Let's listen and understand them first. Let's get them speaking. Let's start building the rapport. And then as we figure out those pain points, we can throw in some solutions and collaborations on how we could potentially help them improve that process.

And I mean, given your energy level, was listening something that was hard at first, or?

Yes, that, that took some time because I, I love to be out in front of people and, and learning. And, you know, sometimes that comes off a little over the top, so I have to pull back sometimes and say, okay, let's calm it down. And, and I would say in my second role, my second job that I had in, in the recruiting firm. That's where I've learned to dial it back, but also still, I can still bring the energy, but dial it back to make sure that I'm listening and let them tell me about, you know, what they're doing. Um, I always was told, let, let them speak. You know, the first thing you do, let them speak. So that's something that I always try to do is whether it's, you know, starting a meeting off saying, hey, thank you for taking this meeting. Let us know a little bit about yourself and maybe what you'd like to get out of this meeting. And then boom, it just kind of sets the tone for the meeting.

Well, I mean, that's it because I've dealt with a lot of recruiters and the bad ones are always pitching you on a job.

Yeah.

Yep.

Instead of like— and what does everyone want to talk about? Their career.

Correct.

And it's never a 10.

Right. Right. No one—

Elon Musk doesn't say it's a 10.

Correct. Right.

But they all want to talk about their career. So just let them.

Oh my gosh. Yeah. Let them speak, right?

Yeah.

And I got to believe that recruiting was a great training ground for sales.

Absolutely. Absolutely. So my job was to talk to the companies who needed people. And then I had a team that I worked with that filled those positions. So it was kind of a dual role where, you know, I had to make sure I got all the right information because if I took it back to the recruiter and they got the wrong information, then, you know, kind of makes us look like fools when we're sending somebody out for them to interview. So it was, it was a very collaborative role. And even in my position now, we're a brand manager, so we do anything with printed materials, promotional products, apparel, signage, anything you can put a brand or a logo on. That's something we can support, which is unique because there's so many different avenues that you can go down in that world too. But it's, again, it's a collaborative effort. I have an account manager team That when I bring something through, you know, I got to make sure I have all the information or else we're not going to properly source the right product for them.

And when you see other reps that, that are putting the effort in but not getting the results, what do you typically see them doing wrong or how do you coach them?

Yeah, that's, that's a good question. Because, um, one thing I'll tell, you know, beginning sales reps or people that aren't having success is go shadow somebody that's a top salesperson for a couple of days or a day or two or somebody just listen to them. And then take some of the things that you see that they're doing very well and incorporate it into your mix. So that's even, you know, when I was a top sales rep at the recruiting agency, I would— I was still going to some of the newer people. I was like, look, you have a different view than what I view, so let me see your fresh view. And if I can incorporate anything in there from what you're doing, then that's going to help me be better. I can also help you be better too by listening to what you're saying. So I'm always trying to grow, always trying to learn. And, you know, I'll never say I'm the best at it because I want to continue to have that 1% better each day type of mentality. And, you know, trying to learn from the best obviously is going to help you, but also, you know, making sure that you understand what you're doing and how to do it too is, is also important in that process.

And do you have a particular routine for that, either how you structure your day or your week?

Yeah, so, um, the other thing that I do tell newer people or new sales reps is you got to have goals. You got to write down, like, if you start it right in the morning, you know, write down what your goals are. You can have short-term, long-term. And, and when I tell them about writing the goals, it's not, I want to make $1 million, because anybody could write that down. And that's, that, that's a great goal to have. But the goal should be, what are my actions that I'm taking to get to that goal? So if it's, I'm going to make 20 calls a day, I'm going to make 5 appointments a week, I'm going to cold call on 15 businesses this week. That's kind of the goals that you have to set in order to help you reach that goal of having $1 million.

And how about like the grading of a sales call? Because like in wrestling, you had a coach over your shoulder all the time yelling at you.

Yep.

Which is great training for sales.

Absolutely. Yeah. Somebody's screaming in your ear all the time, you know, telling you you're not doing it the best. But Yeah, it's, you know, sometimes after the call when you get a chance to digest and look at your notes and figure out, um, was it one— is it worth your time to continue to move forward? Because that's what you want to know. And as you get into new industries, you're like, okay, was that something I should be spending my time on in the future? And you start to kind of make your filters to who you need to speak with and how to speak with them and what to speak to. So it's a, it's an interesting kind of trial and error in the beginning when you're figuring out like where, where you need to go and who you need to speak to. Because a lot of the times, you know, there's a couple people in the company that you could speak to because they handle different things. So it could be an HR manager, it could be a purchasing person, it could be somebody, a sales manager, because, you know, they, they get all the salespeople's brochures and swag that they're handing out. So yeah, it's, um, Yeah. It's interesting, but yeah, it's, it's, you got to go back and almost evaluate yourself call by call. And I know some of the things that I used to do when I was first starting in sales is I would make practice calls on my phone and then listen back to it and record myself on the iPhone, you know, and then replay it and say, how did I sound? Do I sound confident? Do I sound like, you know, I know what I'm talking about? Do I sound like somebody that's going to say, hey, yeah, I'd meet with them, you know, or do I sound nervous, anxious? Am I saying um a lot? Am I saying something a lot that maybe shouldn't be saying as much.

That is invaluable, right? Because I liked how you dissected it because it wasn't just— you know, an overall grade's okay, but when you really dissect it, the, the tonality, the pace, the kind of voice you, you're using, right?

Yeah, if it's monotone, if I'm— Right.

Or the uptone, hey, it's Ken!

Too aggressive.

Well, that's how you learn.

Exactly.

Because you'll build a bad habit and all of a sudden years later, unless somebody hits you.

Right. Yeah. Or if, if you're fortunate enough to be, you know, obviously the past year and a half has been different not being in offices, but if you have somebody be able to, you know, kind of shadow you and tell you maybe some pointers, it's tough not knowing because you're just, you know, I'm at my house by myself and You know, I'm making my calls, so it's like I'm assuming that I'm doing the right things. But at the same time, if you can take the time afterwards and grade yourself, that's, that's a great evaluation for yourself to keep getting better.

Cool.

Hey Ken, I appreciate your time today. Where can people go to connect and follow you?

Yeah, if you go onto LinkedIn, uh, Ken Stank, that's myself, and I work for American Solutions for Business. So if that's, uh, I don't think there's many other Ken Stanks out there. I got a unique name.

You're the first.

Yeah, so it should be pretty easy to find.

Here's some excerpts from a one-on-one that I did with one of the students in Start the Conversation, Get the Meeting course. Now, this person really embraced the course after a while. It took a couple of one-on-ones for him to try each step. He kind of fought it, tried to make it work within his current model. And that really didn't have this type of success. And then after he started, he started to get meetings. He started to get conversations. He started to get all the things that I was telling him about. And he started to get excited about it. He started to see the results that I tell you about where his week was full of meetings. Now, I'll let you hear this out. I deleted out kind of the specifics of the steps and the tools and the approach, but they're all in the course. If you're already in it, please listen to the full one-on-ones. When you hear the success that people are having, it's not just the steps. It's the matching of the steps with the appropriate actions and pacing. And then you get people asking to talk with you, which is the goal, which is the fun. So let's listen to it and I'll sum it up at the end and give you kind of an idea and recommendation if you want to take advantage of this.

And it's crazy. This week, this week I'm full of meetings. I was like, what's happening? And like, I, what I did was I baked in like, I just, I'm very generic and people are like, oh, like, like, tell me more about you. Like immediately I have like 3, 4 meetings. Like I already had 2 of this. And, and based on the, on the, on the parameters that you suggested for me, like, oh, go after these bigger companies, X amount of employees. So then. By the time I'm talking to them, I already know that, okay, they typically have budget. I mean, assuming LinkedIn is correct with the employee size, some of it was off, but it's like, okay, there's still like a deal. It can still happen. And, but yeah, I was like, whoa, this is— I limited to like 30 connections a day. So then that way it's not like, it doesn't go crazy. Cause I remember one of the reps, So doing about 30 a day, like I said, like this week, like 4 or 5 meetings. And they're good meetings, you know, and it's just conversations. Like I say, it's not about like pitching, but it's about working them up to that point where it's like, okay, yeah, we do need to advertise.

So after teaching this for quite a while, here's the steps that you should take.

Take the course once quickly through it. Find both one-on-ones and office hours that speak to the persona that you want to talk with, whether it be the CEO, the CMO, CRO, developer, marketer, whoever it is that you want to talk to. Because we break it down in gory detail. We break down the persona and what they care about. And then try each step. Try it with your friends. Try it with your coworkers. And start to see the results. Now, most people will fight me on it. They'll spend the first month, 2 months trying to make the system fit into their pitchy email and cold calls. And it works a little better. But it works a whole lot better when you apply it because each step and each pause in between each step has been designed over time to be very effective. And then when you start to see the results, all of a sudden people are replying, people are asking you, people are wanting to talk with you, want to understand what you do. It's almost turning cold outbound into warm inbound. Now, are they in market? No, no, they're not. But they're a little curious. And it's up to us. And I show you in the course, how do you build off of that? Instead of us telling everybody how great we are and hoping they can understand why they need And instead of them arguing about why they don't need us, because until you have active pain, everyone's in denial. Think about going to the doctor. Okay, you kind of know you need an operation, but you're like, can I get a prescription? And the doctor's like, he has to ease you, or she has to ease you into the process. Well, let's take an x-ray. Let's see what we're working with here.

Oh, can I—

how about just a shot? Can I just get a shot till the next time I come in? Then he flips the x-ray up on the light and he points to something. He goes, that's what we're dealing with. That doesn't heal on its own. You have to have surgery for that. He has to build up to that. Until we build up that latent pain into active pain and properly diagnose it and get People to think about what happens if they don't have that operation, they're going to avoid it at all costs. That's why the cold pitch doesn't work. You're just igniting the denial. You're not igniting interest or curiosity. It's just denial. So check out the course. Start the conversation. Get the meeting. It's all at b2brevenue.com. There's an overview video in the show notes. On my YouTube channel and on my LinkedIn profile, pretty much everywhere I am, as well as the website b2brevenue.com. Check it out if this is what you need. You know, this student, zero sales experience, but really, you know, just gobbled up this. And the people who gobble it up the fastest and the best are people who try it and get success. It has nothing to do with knowledge. It's like learning how to do a sit-up doesn't give you a 6-pack. You have to do the sit-ups. They're not fun at first, but then you get used to them and you start to like appreciating them. And then you start to get the connection between how you look and what you do. And so you start doing the things that make you look better. This is what we have. It's not just knowledge. It is applying it. Taking feedback, polishing it up, and applying the system to your clients.