THE SECRET TO STAYING PSYCHED AND FOCUSED ALL THE TIME IN B2B SALES

In sales today, all we're seeing is mental health issues. People burnt out, people depressed, people anxious. And it's kind of natural given the way the profession is. There's lots of ups and downs and roller coasters, things we have some control or influence over and many things that we don't. So what are we supposed to do with this? A lot of people think the answer is one state of mind. And to be even-keeled. And that works a lot of the times, but it doesn't get us connected to our deals, connected to our clients. And what we're going to get into in this interview is some of the issues and why it's so complicated and why trying to oversimplify it may make it even more complicated. Let's get into this. I think you're really going to like it. If you're struggling with getting meetings, Start the Conversation, Get the Meeting is the course for you. Go to b2brevenue.com right now. Sign up today. There's another course too. How about those deals? Are they stalled? Let's unstall them and close them and get paid on them.

That's what we're all about.

Here we go.

So how do you feel after you win a big deal, Dustin?

I feel on top of the world. I feel great. Probably a little cocky and overconfident, especially if it's a bigger deal. And you have that high for at least a day or two depending on how big the deal is. And I think it's important to celebrate success and show yourself a little bit of love and support if you do close something big. But You don't want to ride that too long and get overconfident because at the end of the day, in the world we live in, it's kind of like, what have you done for me lately type thing, especially when you're working for companies. So whether you crushed it in 2022 or 2023, whatever it is, I mean, you have to keep performing consistently. So I think you want to learn from it, go celebrate a little bit, but like keep plowing forward and have that not getting complacent mentality. And that's worked well for me. But I do think you need to celebrate a little bit. Just don't get too cocky and then keep kind of staying consistent and moving forward. Don't let, just because you did great last year, don't bank on that, that it's going to help you this year. You still have to put in the work to make that happen the following year or quarter.

But when the deal is closed, you won it. What do you attribute it to?

I probably take a lot of the glory, I'm sure, most of the time.

Right? Of course you do.

I probably take a lot of the— yeah, I take a lot of the credit or glory. I try to throw out some accolades to the people that helped, you know, sales support, customer success, your manager, all that when you're up at the award ceremony. So, but that's a little cliché. I think everyone actually probably attributes it to everything that they did, at least inside. But then outside, they probably Congratulate a lot of people.

Because I think sales is one of these weird professions where it is just this built-in roller coaster, but not one roller coaster. Let's say you're an athlete or a, in any other performance, you go, you do the performance, you get some kind of outcome and you get either some blame, all the blame, some reward, all the reward, and you have to process that emotionally. And it's easy when you win because, you know, people don't really care if you take too much credit. But then if you lose, the opposite, how do you feel?

That's usually where it turns into the blame game and you're pointing fingers, but it's the complete opposite of what you just mentioned. So if you're blaming everybody else, it's not going to be a good look. So you Unfortunately, a lot of people don't have the accountability, especially in sales. I've learned over the years to have a lot more accountability and really point at myself for losing that deal or whatever it may be. But yeah, it's so easy to point the fingers at the territory, supply chain, the economy, your territory, your manager, they chopped it up, you know, whatever it is. But at the end of the day, when you lose, it's all gonna be back on you in sales. So you have to figure out what happened, what went wrong, and be accountable in, in a positive way. I mean, don't beat yourself up horrifically, but you, you gotta learn from it and kind of keep moving forward. And if, if you blame other people, it's not gonna be a good look and you're gonna be resentful and angry at people. But if you look at yourself, you actually feel better about it and then you, you kind of move forward and learn from whatever happened.

Because I, I see this as kind of a hot topic that no one talks about because people talk about the bad outcomes, mental health, depression, burnout. You know, a couple years ago there was this sales rep who kind of like shared that she checked herself into this mental health hospital because it was just so much stress and stuff. And I'm like, wow, geez. Well, and then you, You got the groups and podcasts about mental health and sales, and it's about emotional regulation. And a lot of people now are talking about just detach, and that's contextually good advice. You know, you can't be attached to every activity. There's too many of them. If you're prospecting for 2 hours and you get no results, Detachment might be okay, but if you lose a deal, detachment's not a good way, is it? You can't go to your manager, but here's the good news, boss. I was detached. What are they going to do? Well, maybe you should be attached, right? Because clearly you didn't care enough. And what I used to tell people, At the company, like, why are you doing all of this? And I used to say, because I don't get paid unless something happens. You know, if I don't care enough, I'm not going to be thinking about the things that could go wrong because why would I? I'm detached. And I think you have to have the right amount of attachment. And this is where people get tripped up because they're like, oh, that's confusing. It is. And it's probably the hardest part because you probably don't see anybody who's been in sales for 20 years who hasn't been burnt out at least for a year or so.

Mm-hmm.

If not currently burnt out. And is that because of just repetition and doing the same thing every day? No, it's this Constant up and down, up and down. I can't think of another profession in the whole world where it gets reset every year. Can you think of one?

No, I can't.

No, I can't.

No.

And I mean, base goes up, target goes up, equity goes up, sales same or down. Every year it gets harder to make the same amount of money at the same company.

And it's not for everybody. I mean, you mentioned those stories earlier. It's not for everybody, but you can also make an excessive amount of money and do really, really well for yourself. What people may not realize, but it's not easy. It's extremely hard. It's ups and downs. You get rejected all the time. So it's not for every personality. I mean, I think in some ways everyone has to sell themselves a little bit, but If people are complaining about it, I mean, maybe a little harsh, but you maybe need to find a different profession if you can't deal with the ups and downs. And then I think the emotional regularity. Yeah. If you get someone hangs up on you on the phone, you're getting ghosted on an email, people are, you know, leave a bad comment on social media. I mean, that's just like menial stuff. I mean, it can get to you, there's no doubt, but you have to kind of tuck that kind of throw it under the rug type thing. But then if it's a deal, like for example me now, I'm working on a deal that could potentially double up the revenue of what I'm doing this year, and I'm in a startup type environment. So of course I'm definitely attached to this deal, and if it doesn't happen, I'm not going to be feeling that great. And then also your customers or potential customers, they can see that passion too, and they know that you really want it or you're upset if it doesn't go through, but you're still respectful. So I mean, I think you You have to have that passion with those bigger deals. Otherwise, you know, why are you even doing it? I mean, of course the financial side of it's great, the accolades, but you have to be passionate about it too. And I think people can read right through that. So you, you have to be connected to the deals or the company strategy, whatever the mission is. You know, when I used to do medical device, you're always helping people, you're potentially saving lives, all that type of stuff. So I mean, you need to kind of correlate to that. Otherwise, You're definitely gonna get burnt out and you're not gonna last very long in sales, but it's not easy to find that passion or do that. But I think you need to be connected to the deals, the company, something that's kind of driving you. And people will see that too when you're talking.

Yeah, because being competitive, I can't imagine hiring a sales rep who isn't competitive. And why? Because they're not gonna care if, if you don't care if you win or lose, Are you going to do the things that it takes to win? But if you care too much, you might do something stupid. So it's this real, and I think too many people just throw a platitude towards it, and that's the worst thing because that doesn't really improve anything. And this morning I was listening to Howard Stern. Now here's a guy, 40 years, He's been taking brutal feedback, so you'd think he'd be used to it, right? He's contemplating making his Instagram account public instead of private. And guess why he doesn't want to make it public?

There's going to be so many haters just ripping him apart.

No, he doesn't want to hear it.

Yeah.

He doesn't want to hear it. You think he'd be used to it. Even the Kardashians with hundreds of millions of followers on Instagram, They get bogged down with the, the trolls. These are people they'll never meet. They could delete them. That have no impact. But they, they have a hard time emotionally regulating what that means to them. And a lot of people, oh, just get thick skin.

Okay.

But then if you don't care at all about what the audience thinks, You won't look for any feedback, which can be okay, I guess.

Mm-hmm.

Maybe not in sales, but at least in their roles. And I think each of us, we have to kind of come up with a strategy and a plan because sales is not gonna change. It's been this way forever. So you have to find a way of how do you make it through a day, a day that's, you know, might start with being a hero. By lunch you lost a deal. By closing time, you know, your manager wants you to do something that makes no sense and it takes a day of your life and you're like, oh, how do I deal with this? That's why people get burnt out. They don't get burnt out because, oh, I got tired of making all this money. I don't know what to do with it, that the taxes are high, you know, and 3 houses, you know how much maintenance that is? You know, these Ferraris are fast, but they sure are annoyingly maintenance heavy. That's not why they get burnt out. They get burnt out because, oh, you didn't update your CRM, or we're just going to change your territory, or comp plan changed mid-year. Did we tell you? That's what they get burnt out from. And we have to deal with that all the time. There's no other profession like it. A baseball player has the best year of their life. Do they start the salary all over at year 1?

And my favorite was you go to companies, they all have the same base salary, whether you have 1 year of experience, Oh yeah, you're bringing back some memories with some of those, but I, I try, try to not get too high, not get too low, stay even keeled. Easier said than done, but there, there's so many ups and downs. You, you have to. And for me, it's really, there was a point where I hit some pretty significant burnout and stress like everybody does, and I ended up changing industries, but it was kind of this epiphany of Just kind of focusing on myself a little bit more in the morning. So I started doing a morning routine and, you know, that has visualization, it has some breathwork to get kind of ready for the day. It has empowering statements and it's something pretty simple. It's kind of a, a system now and a routine that I have and that kind of just starts my day off consistently. 'Cause I know there's gonna be a lot of punches to the face and good things that may happen. People are gonna cancel a meeting or reschedule it. The deal doesn't come through, get pushed to next quarter. I mean, all that stuff, you know, it's going to happen. So if I just kind of get my mind right at the beginning of the day, that helps. It doesn't make it perfect, but that kind of helps. And then I think just kind of taking breaks throughout the day too, to do something like go work out or go walk, that's helped me too, because I get so kind of focused in on everything and you just get consumed by it if you don't step away. So I try to work for a little over an hour, and then I take 10 or 15-minute break and just whatever, read or walk or do something just to kind of change it up and get my mind away from it. But yeah, it's— you still want to be attached to those bigger opportunities, uh, but just don't let it completely be soul-crushing. And because what happens, you lose those big deals, and then how do you— people never recover from it. It turns into a bad month, a bad year, and then they're negative about everything. So you, you can't You want to be attached to it, but you can't let it just completely bury you when you lose a big deal too, which that's, that's one I see a lot is you have a bad thing happen, a bad deal happen, and then it turns into a bad year. The next thing you know, they're in a rut and it's never a really good performer again. So the morning routine for me has been the biggest thing that probably stands out outside of sales process stuff is that, that's how I kind of break away and keep my, my mind as fresh as possible.

And being even-keeled in the right context, because if you're not fired up, are you going to do the things that need to be done? And the number one thing I hear from managers is reps don't seem to care. That's even-keeled, right? Because if you cared one way or the other, you're either negative or positive.

Yeah.

But they want them to care, but not about certain things. They don't want them caring about all the BS that they're forced to do. They want them caring about building a pipeline and new deals and closing deals. And I think this balance, I think too many people try and find one state, a common even keel, but that It's a good base. It's a good place to start and it's great with negative stuff. But how about the positive stuff you're supposed to do? Think of the best salespeople you've ever met. Were they even keeled?

No, they were type A. Like they were type A. I was thinking of this, this one guy, he was a wrestler in college. He was just, just a machine getting up at 5:00 AM. He was, he was intense. He was really intense. Yeah.

But, but what's going to happen to, if he, if he tries to keep that state constant, what's going to happen?

Yeah. He started doing meditation, breathwork and all that in the morning because it, because it balanced him out because he, he didn't need any more energy. So he was doing stuff to kind of tone it down.

Yeah. And the crazy thing is people will rationalize all of it being the, the hyper, Because I was doing some work with this rep who's just a chatterbox. Couldn't get her to stop talking because— and then she said, well, that's what my clients want. Like, how would you know? You talk over them.

Yeah, you never ask them.

How would they express? And I'm sure some do, and sometimes it's fun to listen to, but if it's always that way, And you're rationalizing it, maybe that's the problem and not the solution. Maybe you need to slow it down for some people. And I think that's part of being a chameleon in the sales industry. And my recommendation is don't focus on having one state. Have focus on being able to control your state. Your state being your mindset. Like what I do is instead of like the, at the highest level, like confidence, I break it down into like the little elements and I practice building those elements before I need them. You know, because like Howard Stern and the Kardashians, you know, when I see a troll on one of my posts, I know what to do. Delete and block or ignore. 1, 2, or 3. But what do I do? The little mammal in me. Yeah, I want to kill this person.

Yeah. You go down a rabbit hole and you're like looking at their profile, like seeing their job history.

How can I smash this person to the point they'll never contact me again?

But that doesn't do anything, right?

And it ruins my day and I got nothing for it. So you got to kind of like, okay, I know what to do. I'm either going to do it or ignore it. But 9 times out of 10, that'll be okay. That 10th time you flip out and you're like, but that's being human. That's, we're mammals having a human experience. We're not robots. And I think today a lot of people are trying to act like the tools that they're using. And it's detaching from the client instead of connecting people. And when people say people buy from people, is that because they're emotionally attached or logically attached?

Emotionally. Yeah.

You don't hang around with your friends for logical reasons.

Correct. Correct.

Yeah. You hang around with friends because you enjoy their company. The way they talk about the things that you're both interested in. Same thing with customers.

And yeah, you made a great point. I think doing hard things consistently kind of prepares you for those ups and downs. So that morning routine, I can use a lot of stuff that I do there when I do have a bad day or I have a bad meeting or someone, a deal doesn't close because then you can kind of rely on the stuff that you've been doing consistently to kind kind of weather that storm, whether it be gratitude or perspective. It's like, hey, it could be, it could be way worse. I'm still in a nice place in Atlanta. I have a good job making good money, friends and family. I mean, so you have like the whole perspective side of it that I think the morning routine has helped me with. Because if you don't prepare for the bad times or the good times to not get too cocky and overconfident, then you're gonna, you're gonna keep doing it. So if you can do something consistently to get you there, whether that's working out or morning routine or just understanding the ups and downs. I think that prepares you when it happens, but you're always going to have slip-ups to your point where you go after a troll or you follow up 10 times with a customer because you're upset about something. I mean, there's always going to be some, some issues, but I do like having different states because that's probably something I can work on because I am pretty even-keeled, which helps me a lot of times when the bad things happen, but I need to probably show more passion and excitement in certain situations as well when I'm speaking or presenting or in front of customers.

So, yeah, because when you talk to customers, they typically go with the rep that seems to care the most. Because when you're adamant with a customer about this is a good idea or a bad idea, and it's not just because it's financially beneficial to you, People like that. Oh no, you don't want this chip. You want this chip because this will future-proof your development. If people, if people get the sense that you're just a clerk who doesn't care, are they going to treat you as special?

Treat you like a commodity.

Right.

But if you're showing interest in them, their company, their project, whatever it is behind that, and their career and helping them, you're essentially part of their network. And people view it too much as like, oh, I don't want to be friends. It's not about being friends. It's about being friendly. So people want to talk with you outside of just the transaction. And if you don't appear that you care about them and what they're doing, are they going to want to talk to you? You're probably just checking in, looking for an update on the deal, and there's no update. So they don't feel good about telling you. So they make something up like it's, oh, my manager's going to procurement because they think you want to hear that. And then you're all excited. And I think this has been the hardest part I've seen with reps because when they come to me, they never want to talk about technique. They want to talk about the problems they're having. Manager doesn't get them. They've had success at other companies. They're not having success here. You know, they'll make the prospecting the excuse, but it's how they feel at the company. I've lost my mojo. I want my mojo back. That's all emotional regulation. And it's hard. I get it. I've done it all day long. It's just one good news, bad news, good news, bad news. And it's like very hard to stay logical and care and not to care too much about the bad stuff.

It's not easy, but it's like, how do you attain that flow state where you're just, everything's going well, you're crushing it every quarter, it's consistent, that kind of performance mindset and flow state. But it's not easy to get there. And it's probably, it's definitely not easy to maintain that. There's always going to be some dips with that, but that's something I keep trying to strive for. The only way I really know how to do it is having the right habits, having the right mindset. doing things like the morning routine to get me ready for the day. And if you keep working on that stuff daily, it just builds up so much momentum. It's like a boulder going. And then, you know, years from now, I'm sure I'll be very thankful that I started doing all this stuff now versus waiting till I was, you know, much later in life. So I think you have to kind of— the personal growth side, the personal development, I think helps tremendously with all the stuff we're talking about. If you're not doing that, that was something I lacked my first 10 years of my career. But then when I started focusing on that, Amongst some other things. I mean, that was like a big difference because I think you have to have that kind of personal growth side if you want to really be elite and take it to the next level. And you have to understand all the stuff that's going on, all these ups and downs and whatever it is. It might be different than what I do, but something you have to gravitate to that and really understand how you're reacting to things and how you can invest in yourself. I think you just need to invest in yourself from a sales standpoint, process, all that. coaching, but also personal growth and like really getting better. I think you have to have a little bit of both to, to kind of take it to the next level.

And I think this is one of the areas why people who have a sports and athletic background fit into sales naturally or easier than people who don't, because you have the competitiveness, the win, the lose, you have a coach, yelling at you. You get evaluated on your performance, not your knowledge or your social status or politics. You might rationalize that that's it. And you have emotional ups and downs. You win a game, you lose a game, you get tricked, you get bad call on the referee, whatever it is, you have to— Eat it. You have to live with it. And losing it, there's typically a big penalty for that. Sounds a little bit like sales, right?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it doesn't, the, the athlete comparison's spot on and that's why they're always doing really well because it, you do all that prep, but then at the end of the day, if you don't perform during the game, Or whatever the situation is, it doesn't really matter. I mean, you either win or lose in that game, and it's the same thing when you have meetings or big presentations. If you didn't prepare enough, or you did prepare enough, but then you kind of choked when the time really counted, then it you know that's all that matters, unfortunately. So you can learn from it, and then the athletes are really good at taking feedback. They're used to getting critiqued and taking feedback. A lot of salespeople, or Howard Stern, even people that have been doing stuff for decades. It's still hard to take feedback sometimes and hear the, hear the truth, but it's really kind of what you need to take it to the next level. So I've always struggled with that and I've gotten better, but the more you can embrace feedback and try to get better from people that make sense— don't just get feedback from everybody, but get feedback from people that you want to be like or that have been there and done that or have had success in whatever you're trying to do— but that's the way to go. And that's why athletes, they're used to the ups and downs. They've They've been at the low points where the team was terrible. Then they, like Michael Jordan, I mean, the first 7 or 8 years they lost in the playoffs to Detroit and all these other teams, and then finally they made it. But no one remembers the 7 or 8 years where he was getting beat in the playoffs, right? They remember the 6 championships, but it didn't happen until he was, I think, 30 when he started winning. So there's a lot of things no one sees, all the behind-the-scenes ups and downs.

And when you hear like all the SEALs, the Navy SEALs that have podcasts or books, when they talk about BUD/S training, that boot camp, do any of them talk about, oh, the physical demands? They all say one thing. It's all in your mind. They all, it's all that. They all have the same, pretty close, same physical Capabilities, right? Reasonable age. They've been in the Navy, right? So they're, they're used to the food, the exercise, the structure.

Mm-hmm.

But this is, this is a test. So the physical part they can do. The mental part, you know, sitting in the water, in the surf at 5 in the morning or whenever it is, You know, when someone putting your head underneath the water, it takes, it takes a certain person to be able to compartmentalize that and control how they react to that. And that's emotional regulation. And that's why they do it. They don't do it to build up their physical body. Body's already there.

Hmm.

It's their mind. And I think too many people just want to come up with a platitude— have thick skin, don't let it, you know, wash off your back. And that's good for the moment, but it doesn't solve a problem and it doesn't get you prepared for the next one.

Yeah, you can say that all you want, but if you didn't actually prepare the right, the right way and do the hard work or do the morning routine or do the training, It doesn't matter all those platitudes. You have to actually put in the work. And so it prepares you when you do have those hard times and those issues that come up, so that way you're ready to go.

Yeah, because on the podcast when I say you gotta train like an athlete, that, that's kind of what I mean. It's not just the, you know, you gotta be in shape, you gotta be, be able to, you know, slog out a good 12-hour day, but you have to be mentally prepared, be able to calm yourself down, to excite yourself up, to detach from a deal, then attach to it. That's a lot in the same day. Yeah, same day. You got to do all that in one day.

It is a lot. And you have to be thinking about it like our conversation, because if you're not thinking about it that way, then you're just going to keep doing the same thing or staying even-keeled or letting a deal ruin your whole quarter or year. So you have to really put in the work on the front end to, to make this happen.

So how do you get a better handle on this? I think you have to do it before you need it. And that's the challenge. And that's why we don't do it, is that as mammals, we do what we need. We react to pain. We're not very good at being proactive. Just think about it. How many people are saving for their retirement? How many people are proactively doing things about their health? Eh, some of us do. And typically we only do it after something bad happens. That's how we learn. And that's why a lot of people don't learn until they get burnt. But that's an expensive lesson. A genius A genius learns from other people's mistakes. And believe me, there's a lot of other people out there. So why not come up with a system, a daily practice? It doesn't have to be long. I'm talking about 1 minute a day, a couple minutes a day. Just be conscious of how you're feeling and manipulate it. Try and put a smile on your face. Stare up at the sky and smile and watch how your state changes. Go for a walk and notice how you feel differently. Just walk away from your cubicle or your desk or whatever it is and get a breath of fresh air. Get some sunshine just for a minute, just enough to break the pattern, break the current negative state, and put a positive state into your mind. And also admit that it's us, it's you, it's me creating these challenges, these depressions, these anxieties. That's a hard, a hard pill to swallow. But once you do, then all of a sudden you can look at it and say, well, yeah. Instead of saying, oh, they made me feel. No, they did something and your reaction was to feel. They didn't make you feel. And this is where people don't want to take that responsibility because it feels better to blame others. The problem is it's hurting us, not them. What we have to do is understand that it's our job to maintain our emotional regulation, our ability to recover from these. things, but still care. And there you go. There's the conundrum. Ask yourself, how could you do a little bit better? Grade yourself every day on how well you did it. And if you're struggling with this, put more energy into it. Because when you're in that flow state, you do sell better. And it's your ability to get into your ultimate state, whether you call it flow Or the zone, or unstoppable. Whatever it is for you, it's your job to do it. It's no one else's. No one else can do it for you. I hope you enjoyed this one. I think it's one you want to save and revisit often, maybe once a week, to get better at it. And here's the best way to get and feel better about selling, is to become good at it. And when you become good at selling, magic starts to happen. And if you really want to become great at selling, go to b2brevenue.com right now. Check out the courses. One is on prospecting— start the conversation, get the meeting. The other is on how to close those large complex sales— Closing the Complex Sale. Now, this is how they work. It's pretty simple. They're online courses, video-based. Consume at your own pace. They include the content, of which there's now 5 years of content in there, so it's a living course. I've recorded all the one-on-ones, all the office hours, so they're all in there. Now, do you have to listen to all of them? Of course not. You listen to the ones that are relevant for you. You attend office hours when you can. If you can't, you watch the recording. You submit a question if you're not going to be And then you have all kinds of case studies of how other people have handled different situations. And we've got people from all parts of the world and all kinds of complex sales. So I've become really good at this in the last 5 years because it really gives me a hell of a workout on how to win these deals. And let's face it, And here's the real question you got to ask yourself. Why are you not doing it? One, you're a know-it-all and you don't need to learn anything. But if you were a know-it-all, I don't think you'd be listening to a sales podcast unless you want to confirm you know it all. Two, you're cheap, but you're in the wrong profession to be cheap because to get ahead in the large complex sale and B2B, you got to make a little bit of investment in yourself. Oh, my company should pay for it. Yeah, yeah, sure they should, but are they? Can you convince them how to do that? If you can't do that, how are you going to convince a customer to buy your product? Ah, there's your first challenge as a salesperson. Oh, you can say, oh, I'm too busy. You're too busy to win deals, but you have plenty of time to lose deals? Yeah, that's logical. Sign up today. Quit putting it off. Quit rationalizing to yourself. See, that rationalization sure makes you feel better short-term, but it's like coffee or donuts. It gives you a little boost at first, and then you're on your own. Sign up today. We'll see you there. Thanks for listening. 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