405. The Impostor syndrome [Revisiting favorite episodes]

Welcome to the Influency Podcast. I'm Hadar and this is episode number 405. Today we're gonna bring back an old episode, but a good one about the imposter syndrome.

Hello.

Hello, my friends. I hope you are doing well and.

You'Re healthy and safe and happy. Today I am going to do something.

A little different and I'm going to share an old podcast episode from the first couple of weeks after launching my podcast. And the reason why I want to bring it back is first, because I'm sure that a lot of my new listeners haven't listened to this episode since it was a episode number seven or eleven. And now we're in episode 405. So some time has passed and I think it's such an important episode and it's one of the episodes that resonated, I think, the most with my audience. So this is why I wanted to bring it back. Also, another reason is because usually on Tuesdays we share a podcast episode that is also shared as a video on YouTube. And for this week, I'm not going to release a regular video, but I'm going to go live. So it's not a typical week and this is why we still wanted to share something. And I thought it would be a good opportunity to revisit some of my old episodes that were my audience's favorites. And looking back, I think this work, the mindset of or thought work that we do in addition to the language work, is so incredibly important. And understanding this concept of the imposter syndrome is a big part of it.

So I can't wait to share this episode with you. Let's listen. Okay, today I have something really important to share with you, so I hope you stick around for the entire episode because what I'm going to share with you today has been a game changer for me when it comes to English, but also when it comes to my life and my business and who I am as a person. And this episode, as you know by the title, is going to deal with the imposter syndrome. So I'm going to talk about what it means and how it comes to play in life, but in particular where we face it when speaking a second language. I'm going to talk about my personal experience as a speaker of English and as an English coach who's also a non native speaker. And I'm going to give you examples from the life of my students. I've been wanting to talk about this for years, for years, really, since I explored this topic more and researched it a bit, and I haven't. And one of the reasons why I haven't is because I didn't feel I was enough to talk about this. I don't have enough knowledge. I'm not a life coach. Da, da, da. I don't have this. I don't have that. Which was the epitome of the imposter syndrome, because I didn't want people to say, oh, what? What is she doing talking about the imposter syndrome? Who is she to talk about the imposter syndrome? And that would make me feel like an imposter. Hey, that's the imposter syndrome. I just experienced it, and that's why I haven't talked about it so far. But this podcast has made me deal with a lot of fears and a lot of challenges. I mean, creating this podcast, recording these episodes, even though it may feel very effortless to you, that I'm just, like, turning on the mic and that's it, I'm speaking. No. Well, there are a lot of attempts prior to each episode, or at least at the beginning, until I get started, I have a lot of attempts, like, just trying to get into the groove of it. It's not supernatural to me. Also, I do edit the podcast, so sometimes I get stuck. And that was scary to me. Now, these are things that happen to you when you create something. But for me, it was a sign that I shouldn't be doing this. And here I am, still making this podcast episode, and I hope it's going to turn out nicely, and I hope you're going to benefit from it. But I just wanted to share this experience with you, just to show you that we all face it and we're not even aware that this is what's going on with us. So here's what Wikipedia has to say about the imposter syndrome. Imposter syndrome, also known as imposter phenomenon, impostorism fraud syndrome, or imposter experience, is a psychological pattern in which one doubts one's accomplishments, which actually means you doubt your accomplishments and has a persistent internalized fear of being exposed as a fraud. Despite external evidence of their competence, those experiencing this phenomenon remain convinced that they are of frauds and do not deserve all they have achieved. Individuals with impostorism incorrectly attribute their success to luck or as a result of deceiving others into thinking they are more intelligent than they perceive themselves to be. Okay, so now that we're done with the official part, Wikipedia is official. Let me just try to explain it in my words. Basically, the imposter syndrome says people like us cannot succeed. It means that even though we achieve something or people think highly of us, we think that they have the wrong perception of us, that they are missing out on something. That even though, yeah, okay, I did a good job, but it's not what they think it is, or all this credit, I don't really deserve it, they're missing out on something. And the fear is that sooner or later they will reveal the real me and they'll be disappointed because they'll discover I'm a fraud, that I'm not who they think I am or who I pretended to be. Now, it's not like you pretend to be anything. You're you, but you just simply think that you accidentally got to where you are, especially if you achieved something. So it's really around achievements or successes, like a high grade or a promotion at work or to speak in public somewhere. Every time we basically do something that requires people's attention or that people notice us. Now, you may be thinking to yourself, okay, it happens to me because I'm not used to it. So of course it's going to feel strange or I'm going to feel. Feel like I'm not good enough, because it doesn't happen that often. So here's the thing. Even people who create and put themselves out there over and over and over again, they still experience the imposter syndrome. For example, Maya Angelou, the poet, has said, I have written 11 books, but each time I think, oh, they're going to find out. Now I've run a game on everybody and they're going to find me out. And Jodie Foster said after she'd won an Oscar for Best Actress, I thought it was a fluke. I thought everybody would find out and they'd take it back. They'd come to my house, knocking on the door, excuse me, we want to give that to someone else that was going to. Meryl Streep. That's what she said. And who else? Natalie Portman said when she got accepted to Harvard and she had already been published as an actress, she said, I felt like there has been some mistake, that I wasn't smart enough to be in this company and that every time I opened my mouth, I would have to prove that I wasn't just a dumb actress. Right? The feeling that she's not good enough. And it's not just women. For example, Tom Hanks said, no matter what we've done, there comes a point where you think, how did I get here? When are they going to discover that I am in fact a fraud and take everything away from me. So as you can see, it is not just you. In fact, here are some of the stats. According to the International Journal of behavioral science, approximately 70% of us suffer from the imposter syndrome. So when I said you, maybe not you, because you might be a part of the 30%, and I cheer you on, buddy, good for you. But 70% of us do suffer from the imposter syndrome. I'm one of them, as I have mentioned before. And we find it across genders and occupations and races. But we do find it more in underrepresented and disadvantaged groups such as immigrants, minorities, people from the LGBTQ community, women, people of color, and in our case, of course, non native speakers. And I think that the reason why it is so common for non native speakers to feel like imposters and like frauds is because of the way we learn and consume English. First, by always comparing ourselves to native speakers, we always feel less and not enough when it comes to communicating in English. And all that speak like a native business just accentuates the gap between how we are expected to perform by the world like a native. Right? We need to be like a native because that is the sign that we've succeeded in English and how we really are non natives, we make mistakes. And that gap creates this feeling of a fraud. I'm not playing the part that I'm expected to play. Also, when learning in traditional schools according to conventional methods, you can you get the message that when speaking English, there is right and there is wrong. Right? There is only one right answer, otherwise you lose points. And when you're wrong, you're basically criticized for your mistakes. And sometimes you pay a high price, and sometimes you are even not encouraged to continue and to persist despite the mistakes. I cannot tell you of how many students I've had that had a teacher, like a third grade or fourth grade teacher who looked at them and said, oh, you'll never be able to learn English. Your English is so terrible, right? And then because why? Because they make mistakes and it's hard for them to learn and you feel like you are simply not enough now, because speaking English is in and of itself the source of making mistakes. Like you cannot speak a second language without making mistakes is just impossible. Instead of welcoming the mistakes, you are being punished for them. And because we perceive making mistakes as wrong and as something that we want to avoid, we've become used to constantly being judged and criticized. And as a result, we self deprecate ourselves and we downplay our abilities in English even when we do well. And I bet that you could relate to that, that when maybe you had a good. Okay, conversation in English, a good conversation, you managed to get your point across. Or maybe you had a presentation or a meeting and people said, hey, you did a good job. And you're like, no, I sucked. I got stuck. I made a mistake that was awful. I was so bad. And people like, oh, good job. Yeah, it was really interesting what you shared there. And you're like, what are they talking about? Haven't they noticed the mistakes that I've made? Haven't they noticed that I was silent for three whole seconds because I couldn't find the words? And you don't get why people are cheering you on, and you're like, I don't deserve this. They haven't noticed it. Well, they're gonna find out sooner than later, right? Or they're just saying that to make me feel better. I bet you felt that before, right? Your teacher is just giving you compliments just to make you feel better, not because you did well, because you're awful. Right? You're thinking that about yourself. I'm terrible. I constantly make mistakes. Like, she doesn't know what is going on through my head, how lost I feel. So whatever comes across, it's just like it's external. Like, whatever comes across is a fluke. It's pure luck that I was even able to. To express myself for a split second. I don't even know how she understood me. Okay, I'm actually going to share some real examples. Sorry for going on and on about this. I'm very passionate about it. I'm just going to say that or remind you that when we internalize that we are not like native speakers and that it's wrong, and that our English is not good enough because it's not the English of the native speakers. We suffer from consequences mentally, emotionally, but also financially because we go for smaller roles or we grab less opportunities and we just don't push ourselves so much because of that, because we don't think we qualify for the job or for the project or whatnot. Here are a few examples from real people, from my students. So I used to have a student that used to communicate perfectly over email. Like, he had no issues with writing emails. He was sharp, eloquent. His grammar was perfect when he was writing, but when speaking. And of course, there's always a gap between spoken English and written English. And he would get stuck and sometimes make silly mistakes that he would never make in writing. And because of that, he felt that he couldn't speak in front of people because they'll think it's not him writing the emails or that he uses Grammarly or something. They would think that he's a fraud. Again, the imposter syndrome. And because of the fact that he would get stuck so he wouldn't speak, he would avoid speaking as much as possible. And of course, what happens when you don't speak, you get stuck even more and you compromise your fluency. So he would become better and better at writing and worse and worse in speaking because of that. I had a student who was a public speaker and she wouldn't accept any offers to speak in English because she'd say, I'm gonna sound stupid. And I'm very bright, very witty, very intelligent, but in my native language, not in English. And people are gonna think that I don't deserve my PhD and I don't deserve the position that I am in because my English is not good enough. Also, I know teachers, English teachers who are afraid to teach English or to teach pronuncia because they have an accent. So they deprive their students of the opportunity of learning and experiencing with sounds. And they don't share with them things that they know so well because they're afraid that their students are going to think, who are you to teach me pronunciation if you have an accent? So they would feel that they're not worthy of this job. Or non native speakers who want to become teachers. I have had in our community so many people coming up to me saying, hey, I want to teach English, but I'm scared because my English is not perfect. Well, you don't need to have perfect English to be able to communicate something in English. You don't need to have perfect English to be able to get your students to do the work and practice and show up and learn to share with them your passion for English. You don't need to have the perfect accent to teach pronunciation because you can give them some anchors and to help them hear things that they they are unable to hear. You don't need to be perfect at something to be able to share it. Like, I'm not perfect at talking about the imposter syndrome. In fact, that's the first time that I'm talking about it. And yes, I feel like I'm not. This is not necessarily my thing, but I still do it. And let me tell you, I much rather talk about the schwa. Right now. I really prefer to talk about the schwa. That's my Comfort zone when it comes to pronunciation, yeah, I'm an expert. But when it comes to everything else, then this is where I become a little more self conscious. Let me share with you more examples. I had a student who was really fluent in English, like really fluent. He would speak so fast and he was intelligent and sharp and witty and funny and used all the idioms, all the expressions. But he was super self conscious about his accent. And he always felt that whenever he opens his mouth, people think less of him because of his accent. So he would speak, but he would feel really insecure. Okay, so another manifestation of the imposter syndrome. Because people hear I have an accent, I'm not good enough. I'm enough. Or even though I have achieved so much and I've become so fluent, it's still not enough, there's still something to feel awful about. I also had a student who said no to a really big opportunity at work because it was in English. And she knew she could do it. She knew she could do it best, better than everyone else. But she said no because it was in English. And she thought, well, they're going to be paying me a lot of money and they don't deserve to hear it with mistakes because I make mistakes in English. Now, here's the thing. Her English is awesome. She's clear, she's concise, she's funny, she's fluent. Who cares about the mistakes she did? And how many people do you know, maybe it's even you that did not ask for a promotion or did not apply for a better job because of English. Now, of course, English is a tool. You have to have a good enough English to communicate to get the job. But our perception of our English is always far lower than it really is. That's the problem. And the root of that, I think, is this imposter syndrome. I tried to track back the source of this experience, and this is what I learned from a video, a YouTube video from the School of Life. That's the name of the YouTube channel. And by the way, I'll post all the links in the description below to this video and other videos that I've listened to and I watched and I found in my research. So in that video, they say that as kids, we start out in life with this really strong impression that other people in our lives, our parents, you know, especially because we love them and we think highly of them. They all seem so competent and pull together and they're very, very different from us. They're not really like us. So we're all Messy jumping on the couch, spilling food, you know, like, not wanting to go to bed, peeing in our pants. Right. Our parents don't do that, and therefore we're very different from them. And we feel this experience that what we're doing is not okay. And that is the essence of the human condition. Because we know ourselves from the inside and we know others only from the outside. So first of all, as kids, we know that, like, this is us, and us is not like them, and them is good, and them is how it's supposed to be. And we know our messy self, but we know others just from the outside. And while we know our thoughts and our feelings and our deepest fears we have, what we have of others is a very narrow and edited source of information. Like, we only hear what they're saying, but we don't have. We don't get to look into their brain and their thoughts and their fears and their inhibitions and that external side. Like, that's what we compare ourselves to. So we compare ourselves to what others seem to be on the outside. And, you know, I think it's especially difficult nowadays with social media where the outside is so polished. People work really hard to look really good on Instagram and they find the right light and the right position and it all looks so careless, but they work like for five hours to find that exact position. And then here we are sitting on our couch in our shorts, thinking we look so different than them. So we always compare ourselves with how other people appear to be. And when that happens, we're afraid of being discovered for what we really are because we think that other people don't share those feelings. And so if we're really stressed out about something or nervous or feel ashamed, and other people seem so confident, you know, we think that it's just us and we pretend that everything's okay, and that's why we feel like a fraud instead of accepting that most shameful thoughts we have. And we experience, other people experience too. So next time you're afraid to walk into a job interview, remember that the person sitting in front of you has the same fears and anxieties, and they're concerned about how they're going to be perceived just as much as you do, because we're all humans. And before I go into how to overcome this and how to survive the imposter syndrome, I'm going to share with you a few things that I've experienced and also how I dealt with it. So I already talked about feeling like a fraud as a non native speaker teaching English. When I just opened my YouTube channel, I was really embarrassed to admit that I'm a non native speaker. And I didn't, I didn't write it anywhere and I never mentioned it. And I was really hoping that no one would call me out on it and say, hey, Hadar, where are you from? Or something like that. Because I was afraid that people would think they have nothing to learn from me because I'm not a native speaker. So that's the first thing. Also I shared with you when I started the podcast. I was afraid that people are going to discover that I'm not who I'm cracked up to be because I get stuck or I'm not that fluent. I was really visualizing myself speaking to the mic and getting stuck all of the time. Now it does still happen, but it's not as scary as it was on my mind before starting this. But yeah, like this is something that scared me because I said I'm supposed to be super fluent and people think that I'm fluent, blah, blah, blah. And what if they discover that I get stuck all of the time and they hear it in the audio? Okay, so it ended up not being that bad. But still, this is something that scared me. Also something else that happened not too long ago. I don't know if you know this, but I consulted Google on a few language related products and pronunciation products. You can even listen to episode number 10 about Pronto, the new pronunciation tool where you record yourself and you get feedback by, you know, simply using the Google search bar on your phone. It's really cool. And check it out, it's on. You can hear it on episode number 10 on my podcast. And at some point I had to write feedback, like the feedback that people get when they mispronounce something. Oh, you did this. You need to pull the tongue back. You need to push the tongue a bit more forward. So I actually wrote the feedback that Google would share with the world. You know how scary that was to me? And you know what was even scarier? The fact that a technical editor who is a native speaker had to review my work. I don't know what happened there, but as I was writing this, at some point, instead of thinking whether or not it's going to be clear to my audience or the users, I was consumed with the fact that she is going to think that my writing is awkward and as a result think that is she the one consulting Google on this product? This is ridiculous. Like I really heard her speaking to herself. Now you have to understand it's Like I think hundreds of comments, like different situations where like, if this happens, then they need to hear this and this. So I was kind of like repeating myself. And when you do that and you're not a technical person, like, I don't, I'm not that detail oriented. Then I had typos and like stupid mistakes that I just like didn't see. Let me speak, don't let me write. Okay. And when I saw that, I'm like, oh my God, what is she going to think about me? So even though I was the authority here, I doubted myself. I doubted myself so much and I thought that she's just going to discover that I'm not good enough and I'm not supposed to be doing this because I don't know how to spell or I don't know how to write clearly, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. She ended up doing a really good job and we had a nice communication between us, but still I noticed that I was procrastinating it because it made me feel nervous. And with your permission, I'm going to share one last thing where, I mean, I have many other examples, but I'm not going to bore you with all of them. But that one thing is related to my community. So we have a community on Facebook. I'm going to link to it in the show notes. So if you're a non native speaker, you need to be a part of it. So come join us. And we had an incredible challenge that was called the July Challenge where we posted, I posted a question, like a deep soul searching question or a fun challenge every single day for 30 days. And back then it was a small community. It was like 2,000 or 3,000 people. And we really got to know each other through those videos because people really shared and were vulnerable and it was incredible. And after a little after this challenge, a bunch of people from the community, from the whole world created a gift for me. So they made a video. Each person recorded something and then they edited it into one amazing video. And one of the community members lives in Israel. So she said that she has to meet me because she needs to talk to me about something. And I said, okay, so let's, let's meet up. And I invited her to come to my studio and she came with a huge cake. She. That's what she does. She does like, she bakes cakes, but she designs them like something I've never seen before. So beautiful with flowers. Now the design of the cake was based on a painting that one of the community members created. Her name is Isis, if you're in the community, you must know her. So she drew a painting that I loved because she put a picture on it in the group, and I was like, oh, I love the colors. And Sophia baked a cake based on this painting and put a huge schwa on it and flowers. And she came to me with her daughter and she gave me the cake and a beautiful orchid. And then she showed me the video and I cried like crazy. And when she left, I was gone. I was devastated. I was super appreciative, and I was so moved. Like, really, I was beside myself because I did not expect that one bit. But mainly I felt like I didn't deserve it. Like I didn't deserve this incredible gesture. And in hindsight, I know that that's what I felt. I was experiencing the imposter syndrome. I felt like a fraud. This is why I felt so bad afterwards. Actually, I took the day off the next day, and I was just, like, trying to cope with all the. All these feelings that I was experiencing. Enormous gratitude and joy, but also, like, why is this happening to me? Like, why are they. It's not me, you know, that they need to thank. They need to. You know, there are other people who are involved in this and blah, blah, blah. So I was really feeling like I wasn't deserving of all of that, but still, like, this is one of the best memories of my life. And that's a good opportunity to say thank you to all of you out there who were part of this, because it is one of the best memories of my life, really. And I still have the schwa because it's made out of sugar dough and it's sitting there in my studio. And I love you all. Thank you for doing this, even though it made me feel like a fraud. I'm kidding. It's not the experience. It was just like when we just started out, the community. So the whole thing was new to me and big and just beyond everything that I've known up until that moment. And if you're not a part of the community, I hope this little story convinced you. Anyway, what to do when you experience the imposter syndrome, first know that it's not just you. Share the shame. Share it with friends. Have a group of people, your shame buddies or your imposter buddies, that whenever you feel that, you're just like, hey, right now I'm feeling like this, like I really suck, or like, I'm really not going to succeed, or I, like, I really don't deserve this. And then it's their job to say, you freaking rock. You're amazing. You're gonna nail it. So you're, you're. You're cheerleaders around you. And also, don't forget that other people experience that too. Okay? Even the people you're intimidated by also ask other people to share their experience with impostorism and see that you're not alone. Actually, this is going to be something that I'm going to ask you to do at the end of this episode, to share it with us in the comments on my website so you'll see that you're not alone and you can read other people's comments and experiences. So it's not just me. It's not just all of these examples, but it's other people just like you. Something else that I do and that I've heard that is really helpful is to make a list of compliments that you've gotten or small achievements. What I do every time I feel insecure about my work and about what I do, I go to my inbox and I have a special folder where I save incredible emails. I think the name of it is the Best Emails Ever. And every time a student writes to me or a follower telling me how I've changed their lives or have changed the way they think about English and that I give them motivation. I'm getting emotional now, but it's just something that I read. Just a few just today, a comment on my website that my newsletter is getting them to take action. Just my words help someone else take action. So something like that immediately goes into my best emails ever. Listen. And every time I feel insecure, I go there and I remind myself why I do what I do and that I'm actually good, or at least I'm good for the people who need me, my community. And that kind of like helps me get over this fear or anxiety or stress around me not being good enough or me not succeeding with something. So created an Evernote file or a folder in your email with good things that happen to you or great compliments, and believe those compliments. That's important, too. Now, one last thing that I think can help you is to create a list of mantras or affirmations to get you back on track whenever you feel insecure or you experience that. Because if you're saying to yourself something positive over and over again, your brain will start believing that that's true. Same goes with saying something negative to yourself over and over again. Your brain will start believing that that's true too, even if it has no proof that it's actually true. So same thing with the positive things that you say to yourself. My mistakes in English don't define me. I learn from my mistake and people are interested in what I have to say or my success is inevitable. And all of those things can really get you out of a certain situation where you just feel like meh about yourself. I actually create a list of affirmations around English and around feeling confident when speaking, confident communication. So I'm going to share a link to that in the show notes as well. Well, if you need that boost, then download it and put it on the fridge and choose one mantra every day and say to yourself all day, especially when insecurity hits. Okay, now I want you to take action. Let's share the shame. Come on over to my website at Hadar Shemesh influencypodcast. I'm gonna post a link to it in the show notes and let's start a discussion. Share in the comments. A time where you felt like an imposter or like a fraud, or like you're not good enough or that you got positive feedback, but you didn't think that you deserved it in any field. At work, with friends, and of course in English. But also share with us one great compliment that you've received or one really great achievement. Okay, so one experience of feeling like a fraud and one great compliment that you've received or great achievement. If you like this podcast episode, please share it with your friends and your students and your family. And if you happen to listen to it on itunes, I would really appreciate it if you could take a moment and rate the podcast and even write a review that would be super, super helpful and help me spread the word. Thank you so much for tuning in. I hope this episode was helpful and beneficial and I hope you are going to take action from now on and to look at your English or insecurities in English from a different angle. And by understanding this and our patterns, it's easier to overcome them. Because all of a sudden it's not just you and it's not really your English, it's your brain playing tricks on you. So now that we said that straight, I hope it's going to be much easier for you to speak in English. Easier said than done. But anyway, I'm here to keep encouraging you to get back up and persist despite the mistakes, despite the insecurities and despite the judgment, because you rock and you need to be heard. That's the most important thing. Have a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful day and rest of the week and I'll see you, or I'll speak to you in the next episode. Bye. It.