Ron + Hope: Unfiltered - What Are Safe Relationships?

Foreign.

Hello, everybody.

It's Ron and Hope. Unfiltered we are so glad you're here today.

You still laying back like this?

You like these new chairs?

I don't know. I'm used to kind of like being up, like, on a stool, like, hanging over a table. It feels more comfy, like I'm getting ready to lounge and take a nap or something.

I don't do it. Don't do it.

So anyway, we got some good things to talk about. We really do, guys. So hang. Hang here. And what do we want to do? Like, share. Subscribe.

Yes.

Hit the follow button. We need you guys. We believe that. We honestly believe that the content that we're preparing is getting a little stronger every time. And of course, then you get to hear me and Hope, you know, behind the scenes, go back and forth at each other and make fun of each other and all that we do in our real life marriage. But before we start, Hope, I've got to explain the swollen eyes.

Oh, God. Looks like I punched you in this one. I do feel sorry for you, actually, because here we are, actually, we're taping right here. It's conference week 2 12, and you've been sick. You've got a busted blood vessel in this eye.

That has never happened before. My. Since you've.

Since he said that's never.

Since the last time you hit me. That is never happened in my eye. The first. I'm just kidding. I've never had a busted blood vessel. My eyes. So that did freak me out just a little bit right here in the corner of my eyes. Guys, let me tell you what. I don't know what it is, and I may sound like my voice is in a barrel, but for people who don't know, we do most of our podcast tastings. Not all of them, but most of our podcast tapings on the West Coast.

Yes.

Well, west coast, you know, up here in Northern California, they call it the Golden State. I don't know if y' all know what that means, but all the hills, all the mountains are gold. But the fact is, it's dead grass. It's dead grass because it never rains. Ever since I've been here four years, it's been in drought, you know, so when the sun hits all that dead grass, those mountains are gorgeous. But this year, everything's green because we've had so much rain. So I just like to believe that God's people brought the rain. Rain is a sign of blessing. But my allergies have been. Yes, everybody's has the Sharks.

So many things are blooming.

Yeah. We got everybody around, their eyes are all swollen. They want to pull them out and itching. And this thing has really gotten me. But I'm here. I just wanted you to know what the eyes being all red. I've got clear eyes, allergy in them. And if I've done all I can do, it is what it is. So red, swollen eyes and all. We're going to have this podcast, tell them what we're talking about.

We're talking about safe people, how to have and find and develop safe relationships. Because, you know, relationships are really what open the door for everything in your life.

Well, last week we talked about basically relationship killers, things that sabotage and kill relationships. This is not really part two, but.

Those two things, it's. In addition to.

Yeah, they kind of come together because, you know, you've got to know what to look for in a relationship, for a relationship to be healthy. I've got two main things I want to talk about. I haven't talked to you about the points that God has given you, but the fact is, I'm ready to dive right into mine. The first thing I want to talk about is you got to make sure. When we talk about safe relationships, most time you define them by talking about what's unsafe. It's unsafe to bond through pain.

That's a codependent relationship.

You're dependent.

You're two people dependent on each other because of one toxic thing.

Say that again. Say that again.

Two people depending on each other and bonding with each other through toxicity, through. Through your pain, through. Through an offense you've had together, through, you know, whatever it is, an unsafe childhood, an unhappy marriage.

A lot of second marriages.

Yeah.

So you're bonding out of pain.

Yeah.

A lot of second marriages. The. The rate of the divorce of a second marriage is 10% higher than a. About 8% higher than a first. Unless that's changed. That's several years old, that statistic. But the fact is, when you say you've gone something through as traumatic as a divorce, and then you put yourself back out there and you say, no, I'd like to have someone in my life, and you start dating or seeing each other again, and then you sit down at that coffee shop and you start telling them about how bad your first marriage was, and they start telling you about how bad their first marriage was, then you find the common ground of pain, and that becomes the place you bond. And pain is never something that you get married over with.

It's not a foundation. It's not a good godly foundation.

It makes you be able to empathize. It makes you to be able to say, yeah, I've been there and I understand you and I get you, but it can't be the tie that holds you together. And I see so many times codependent relationships. I have a deep need. So we cut a deal. I kind of give you a little what you need. You kind of give me a little what I need, but I'm now dependent. You're dependent. It's codependency, and that has never helped relationship. I know you studied a lot about that.

You know, in marriage, you know, you can have. You can have a codependent relationship with your marriage partner if you're insecure and the other person is very over the top with flattery. So you're getting your needs met by that person's flattery or whatever. And you. And it feels good to you. It feels good, but it's not a healthy bond because you're getting all of your needs met from that other person and you're not getting your needs met from God. So Pastor Denise and I did a whole podcast just on codependency. So if you haven't seen that or listened to it, you need to Google it. Go to our YouTube channel.

Can you remember two or three main points? And just hit them real quick. Yeah, because it's a big deal.

Yeah, it's an unhealthy bond.

Because there's some people that are watching right now that if you describe that, they go, oh, my, That's.

Yeah, I'm dependent on you. You're dependent on me for something. I'm dependent on you to get my needs met. You're dependent on me to get your needs met. And we are never supposed to depend on each other to get our needs met. It's only Jesus that can satisfy the longings of your soulless man. Your soul is your in, your emotions, your mind, your will, your emotions, your intellect. So when I depend on anybody, you know that I can't go anywhere without you. I can't do anything without you. You know, that is a codependent relationship. We never are supposed to bond through brokenness.

Here's what I'm thinking. The dividing line is there's somebody out there saying, well, man, my wife makes me feel great and she meets my needs. Or my husband is amazing. He meets so many of my needs. I think there's probably needs to be defined. What is the unhealthy meeting of needs and the healthy, because there's no doubt that you bring value to my life. And there's deficiencies I have, and you pick up slack. There's no doubt that you have deficiencies. And Ron Carpenter comes and picks up the slack.

So that's partnership. We talk about that a lot. But I think there's a huge difference between partnerships and codependency. You know, like, I can't do anything outside of you. I get only my value from you, because if you stop giving me that value, then I'm going to crumble.

That's.

That's not a healthy relationship at all. But my weaknesses. You're strong in just your natural giftings and my strength, your weekend sometimes. And that's just natural gifting. So we do balance each other out. That's the partnership. But there's a huge difference between that and being codependent.

So in other words, if I didn't have you, I'm supposed to be whole even without you, Right?

Absolutely.

Okay. That helps define it for somebody who may be asking questions. Here's another one that I want to talk about that. How do you define what is a safe relationship? Number one, can people not just fall in love with where you are, but can they fall in love with where you're going?

And can they celebrate where you're going?

People who are going nowhere, love for people to go with them. People who are miserable, love for people to be miserable with them. So if somebody's miserable and they see you doing something, they will be critical of what you do. Why? Because I'd rather you come be miserable with me.

Yeah. They don't like to see unhealthy relationships. Don't like to see whoever's in their life start escalating.

Starting to elevate.

Yeah. And elevate. They can't celebrate it. They. They are jealous or they're frustrated or envious or critical or whatever. They. That's not a healthy relationship if the people in your life can't celebrate you. But when. When God opens great doors for you or God blesses you, that's just.

I think we need to be real honest. That's hard to find.

It is hard to find.

We've. We've. We didn't have any enemies when we were struggling. I don't know one person that hated Ron and Carpenter. Ron Hope Carpenter. When we had 11 people.

Right.

When we had a building when it.

Was old, pitiful Ron and Hope.

In the building. People come and sit in the building wearing coats. We had no heat. No, I didn't know. Didn't nobody hate Me, when we build a 40 million dollar campus. Oh my God.

Who do they think they are?

Oh my gosh. Picking you apart on a daily basis. Why? Because you've got to understand a healthy relationship is somebody that understands where you are is not who you are and that God has a plan for you. And can they love where you're going? When I met you, you were getting a elementary education degree and you had a music degree. And that was pretty much at that time where you saw your life going well. You're going to be traveling all next week developing women. You're probably preaching as much as I am. You preached in Arizona last week. And you know what? I love you. You're sitting in there, you probably run half the church. I run the other half the church. I didn't see all that in those days. I knew what we did, we did together. But can I love your future? Can I love what God's going to have you do? And can I celebrate it when I see you rise? And getting people to celebrate your victories is a real mature friend.

It really is. It really is. Because that's love without conditions. You know, it's not. It's I love you for who you are, not what you do or don't do. And that's real hard. That is a level of maturity that has to be grown and shaped. And I don't think everybody wakes up with unconditional love or a mature love. I think that is grown and tested and stretched and challenged. And you have to admit I got that wrong that time. And Lord help me to love better. And, and I think that is, that's a sign of maturity that you know when you do miss the mark or when you do hurt somebody in relationship that you're willing to come back and say, I'm sorry and I'm going to do better next time and you just escalate.

Well, it's been said in the past that you find out who your friends are when you're in trouble or when you fail. I'm going to be honest, my experience has been the opposite. There's people that take pride in being you in a low place because I was with them when nobody was with them. There's people that take pride in that. It's when you succeed, success reveals something in the people around you.

It's true.

I like the way I said that. I need to write that down. Success reveals something. It reveals something in you. Yeah, it does, but it reveals something in the people that are around you. Because Jesus family was fine while he was the son of David. But when he became the son of God, it broke loose. And it broke loose with basically him being able to minister everywhere but there. That's how bad it was. And so I think you need to understand, can the people that you feel like you are in long term relationships with, can these people fall in love with who you're becoming and where you're going and not just where you are? Because if you don't love who they are, but you love where they are, you're going to break up soon. Because they're not going to be where they are forever. Because life functions by times and seasons. The season you met them in is going to change.

It does. Seasons change?

It's going to change, yeah.

And we change with age. I mean, and that just changes with knowledge, it changes with experience, it changes with exposure, it changes with your. All of that. Your wisdom changes. Just the older you get, the more you're exposed to things.

I think it's immaturity when you can't handle that.

Yeah.

Like I'm gonna tell you, when I hear a man, this, this blows my head off when I hear a man say, well, you know, I'm. We don't, we're not that attracted to each other. We don't do all that much anymore. You know, my wife, since we've been married, she's gained about 30 pounds. You didn't think from 18 years old to having three kids and being 44, she wasn't gonna put on no weight.

Right.

That's dumb.

Right?

I'm just going to call.

That's immaturity.

Yes.

That is not a mature response to life.

You can't look at them when they're 24 and you're married and saying, okay, I want you. I'm falling in love with this.

Yeah.

So you need to be like this forever.

But that's not love.

That's not love.

That's lust.

So that's, that's what I'm talking about. Can you love where they're going? Because they're not going to remain like that. Life shapes them. Times and seasons shapes them. Ups and downs, failures shape them. How they respond to trouble and adversity, all these things shape them. And then you have kids and then times change, responsibilities change. And can you love the entire length of the trip? It's not just marriage, but any relationship.

So we're talking about an unsafe relationship is somebody who is immature, who cannot see where you're going and love where you're going. Proverbs 13:20 says keep company with the wise and you will be wise. Right? Keep company with the wise and you will be wise. So a safe relationship is to be around people who are wise and not immature.

Well, I've heard motivational speakers put it in a different light. That's Solomon. In a different light. They say, show me the five people you spend most of your time with and I'll tell you exactly where you'll be in 10 years.

Right.

That's so powerful. It really is. Because there's truth to that. Because you trade the currency of time to develop a relationship. Why invest in a relationship that doesn't love your future? All you're going to do is get hurt. All you're going to do is get disappointed.

So if you want to be around wise people, what is a wise person? The Bible says wisdom. How do you get wisdom? Wisdom comes through what, a multitude of counselors. So if you're not teachable, if you're not hanging out with people who are teachable, who are challenged with their growth, who are challenged to change, who are. Who take instruction, that. That is not safe relationships. If you hang out with people who, well, I don't care what they have to say or I'm going to do what I want to do or that that's not a safe relationship.

Third, this is a big one. Can you know my weaknesses and still believe in me? Safe relationships are, you know, me, but you still believe in me. I hope. I'm going to tell you something. I'm going to toot your horn in front of everybody here.

Toot, toot.

There is nobody in the world that knows Ron Garpner like Hope, not even remotely close. Nobody in the same sphere. Excuse me. You know everything about me. And when I'm preaching, you're on the front row with the loudest amen. And I've told you over and over, you don't know what that means to me. Because if you can see Ron in his frail times, if you can see Ron with swollen eyes and pop blood vessels, you can see Ron when he's not having a good day, you can see Ron when he's not full of faith, when you can see that Ron when he's tired and he's got an attitude and you still believe that I'm God's man, and you still believe God can use me. And God has something great that he wants to do through my life that is very, very powerful. We call it a treasure in a. They say the kingdom is people who understand that there's great things that come along with not so great things. True kingdom people know that good and bad comes together. And so I don't know what you'd want to say about that.

Well, I think the key to that, though, is because I know your heart. I know who you are at your core. So when you do slip up or when you whatever, do something dumb, do your dumb things, I know that's not your heart. And.

And my heart will center me.

Yes. I think a safe relationship is though you. I can know your weakness and still support you. But I don't validate that weakness. I don't sit there and cheer that. Oh, just do it. Just, you know, that's a very unsafe relationship to know that's my next one. Your. Your weakness and be okay with it. I'm not okay with it.

But I know your culture that's doing that.

But I know your heart. That is not your heart. It's kind of like David. David made tons of mistakes. But God says, but I know his heart. He is a man after my own heart. And I think that's why David just kept elevating. Is not that you have to be perfect for God to elevate you. You have to have a good heart. And God knows we're all going to make mistakes, absolutely every single one of us. But there's some people who make mistakes and don't care. And you care and I care, and so I think that's a huge risk.

I know I made a mistake. You usually see me come back full circle in a few minutes and do what?

Apologize?

Yeah. I may have missed it a few times, but for the most part I say I shouldn't have said that.

Right.

I'm tired. But that's no excuse. I should not have said what I just said. That's what you're talking about with the heart. Yes, the head can still make a bad decision, but the heart will draw you back to the right place.

Absolutely.

We've always said that about our kids. We certainly have not agreed on all the decisions our children have made. But I believe when you get down to the core of my children, I can always say they've always had a great heart. And that great heart kept them from crossing a line they couldn't recover from. And it would always center them and bring them back. So if you find somebody that's got the right heart, they don't always have the right head. Who does? No, nobody's always got the right head. But the right heart will always pull you back to the right place and will always pull you Back to the right people. And so that was one of the things I want to talk about, the fourth one. We're going pretty fast here because I want to make sure we touch on all these things. A very, very unsafe relationship is somebody that validates your weaknesses.

Yes, absolutely.

The Bible says a seed producer. I'm getting up in my chair now. The Bible says a seed produces after its own kind. I want people in my life who agree with me. Okay. That's natural.

Yes.

But if what you wanting them to agree with is one of your deficiencies or one of your flaws, once you come into agreement, you have secured that that thing's going to remain in your life. We don't tend to gravitate to the person who challenges us. We tend to gravitate to the person who validates us. And we actually will move away from the person that may have the real answers and may bring the correction. But the Bible says the son who despises correction is a fool.

Is a fool.

And it said it will bring his father great shame.

That's right.

Said a foolish son is a father's shame because he despises correction. And so there are people that sit in their victim chair and they only bring people into their life which reinforce.

That bad baby who tell them it's okay to act that way, it's okay to talk like that. It's okay to feel like that.

I could be real tough here, but I've told you, since I've gotten older, I'm a little tougher and a little bit less tolerant. Okay? Somebody comes in late every time, and they come into rehearsal, and rehearsal's late. Let's say it's band rehearsal for church, and they're late, and they're late every time, and they come in. Well, you know, I'm single dad. I'm a single mom, and traffic's bad. No, you left too late. Yeah, you left too late. And there's one or two changes you can make, but you come in and want people to reinforce that, and when they reinforce it, it will not change.

Right, Right.

Well, we understand that, and we validate that situation. No great relationships call you higher and inspire you to come out of the flaws that are sabotaging your life. And so the victim, man, the victim mentality. The victim mentality wants people in your life to tell me, it's all right. You deserve to feel that way.

Right, Right.

You're entitled to be a victim. Everybody craps on you and nobody does you. Right. And that's what the victim. And I just Refuse to let anybody around me sit in the victim chair. You're not going to sit in the victim.

None of us like to be confronted, right, Abs? None of us. I mean, you, me, nobody likes to be confronted. But, man, the times in my life where, I mean, you've had to call me on the carpet, where my parents have had to call me on the carpet, where people, voices in my life, Pastor Denise, have to call me on the carpet. It's. Oh, it's cringing. It makes you feel so yucky.

Pardon me, people. I hate to keep coughing on you because immediately when they call you out, what's the first thing coming to your mind?

Well, you do.

You've got some problems yourself, right?

Right.

Who are you to be coming and correcting me? Because you don't do this right. And you don't do this right.

But it's true. Yeah, we don't.

Well, nobody would ever call anybody out. How is God going to use somebody to call you out? If you're looking for the perfect, you.

Got to have some people in your life. I mean, and it's not everybody. Strangers can't call you out. But people that you're in relationship with should have that ability because you love them.

Yeah. My friends, I'm, you know, imperfect people. Thank you, Holy Spirit. Imperfect people can still see your blind spot.

Yeah.

Much easier than you can see it.

Because it's blind to you.

Right. You're blind to it, but it's not blind to them. They see it easily. And so I've got to understand not to start critiquing their life when they bring something to my attention. And because your life ain't right, you ain't got a right to talk to me about my life. But the fact is, understand, they get a clearer picture of me than I do. Because what have I always said? You can't smell your own stink. Everybody else in the room smells like crap. But you can't tell that you smell like crap because you're with your stink all day. So it's not stink. It's normal.

Yeah.

And so I do think we. You know, the Bible talks about sowing to the flesh and sowing to the spirit. And we think that's just conduct and behavior. That's not just conduct behavior. That's people. There are people that pull different things out of you.

Good things, bad things.

There's one thing I would tell Chase. When Chase was in. Was in his problem with drugs, I would say, chase, you're not going to break it until you break them.

Yeah.

Because what has happened, you have a problem, and everybody in your life reinforces it.

It's like that codependent relationship. That's where they were tied. It's where they were meshed. It's two people. Codependent is two different people that are meshed together by whatever you can. You could just fill in the blank, whatever.

Not good.

So they were meshed through that.

And that's what I would always try to tell him. And it would frustrate me to no end, because. Does he know that his daddy's got problems?

Absolutely.

He lives in my house. Yeah. He knows I got problems. But I could see it so clearly that certain things happen every time he got around certain people.

Yeah.

And when you got away from those people, those same things didn't happen. He could not see it because he was in it. I've had people come in and say, you know, Ron, you might need to look at this. You know, you remember Bishop Tony, rest his soul, great man of God. Went to be with the Lord not too long ago. Bishop Tony, when he first came into my life, that was in that time when I was just unconquerable. You remember that? Just slept four hours a night.

Yes.

Never stopped. Wore everybody out. Wore my staff out. Wore you out. And I don't. I don't know what it was. I don't know if it was the anointing or Mountain Dew or what. I don't know. I think it was Mountain Dew because I drunk about eight of them a day. And God would do great things, and I wouldn't even acknowledge it. I'd just gone on to the next thing, and then God would do something great and another milestone would be reached, and I'm throwing out my next vision and what God's going to do next. And Bishop Tony, who was a good, good friend of mine for many years, called me out. And he called me out. He hurt my feelings because I don't know, up to that time, I'd ever had a friend confront me. But that's how I knew he was a friend, because he cared.

Yeah.

He saw what my pace and my ingratitude, let's call it what it is, for all these miracles that were taking place. He saw what it was doing to the people around me. And he said, when God brought them over, they laid stones of remembrance. I'll never forget what he told me. He said, ron, you have got to stop and let these people celebrate these milestones. He said, there's no celebration here. It's all work. He said, and that don't last. Well, first hurt my feelings. Then I got a little ticked off and I start trying to think, well, I got some things I could talk to you about. Probably those are the things that start coming to you as flesh. But in my heart, the reason it ticked me off is because I know it was true. And hope I'm going to tell you that moment I intentionally tried to pick up on that area of my life. I've increased my thank yous by a thousand percent.

Yeah. Days off.

Days off. Bonuses, compensation time. Celebrations after parties to give these people. We worked hard, God rewarded our diligence and he has done a great thing. Now let's go.

So he was a safe relationship because he confronted your weakness. He did not celebrate or reinforce your weakness. That was what this fourth point was. Unsafe relationships are people who reinforce your weaknesses who say, yeah, it's okay. Run around on your husband. Yeah, it's fine, you deserve it.

You deserve it. And we understand.

And we understand why you're doing what you're doing.

Now what have they done? They just given you more power.

Yes.

Given you more power, giving you the power to stay in a destructive lifestyle.

Right.

Something that's going to hurt you and hurt many people. Those people are not your friends.

They're not safe.

They're not your. If you've got a problem with alcohol and every time you go to those people, they pop and open the bourbon, they are not your friends. They're not your friends. If your life is being destroyed with addiction or perversion and those people give you entree to it, those people are not your friends because they are reinforcing behavior that's going to hurt you, be destructive to you and to people who care about you. So those were the main four things that I was wanting to hit today.

What about the last one? Let's do boundaries.

Safe relationships or relationships with boundaries.

With boundaries, yes. Safe relationships are people who understand your boundaries.

People need to read the book Henry Cloud. Yeah, Bound. I think he's got one in a revised version, too.

And he's got boundaries for kids, boundaries for teenagers, Boundaries.

I don't say this, but y' all don't ever hear me promote anything. I'm very slow to put my hand on something because there's too much responsibility and liability that goes with that. And people are waiting to find something wrong with the person that you just validated. But Henry Cloud, that's probably one of the top five books that changed my. When I read it, I got up and changed my life. I had no margins in my life.

Right.

I didn't fish. I didn't hunt. I used to do all those things. I didn't golf. I didn't have a hobby. I didn't play. The world's lost, and I got to save it, and there was no margin in my life. I remember Bishop Jakes told me one time, he said, you thirst is killing her. Talking about you.

Yeah.

He said, your thirst is killing her. Well, I didn't want to hear that. But a great friend looked at what my pace was doing to you because it wasn't that you were abnormal. Telling me that I was abnormal. That's what Denise told me when we first started going to counseling. She said, you think everybody else is abnormal. She said, I can tell you the way you function is the one that's.

Not normal, but I just want to toot your horn. Toot, toot. I mean, you could have bucked up against that. You know, you could have not received that at all. But you received that, and you were.

Pretty much told me that, straightforward. She said, you're the one that's not normal.

Right.

Nobody'd ever told me that.

And becoming normal is not an overnight thing either. That. That. It's a. Like I said earlier, it's a lifelong of changing. It's a lifelong of learning. And, you know, you'll never have anybody in your life. Listen. Y' all who are listening, you will never have anybody in your life if you demand that they meet up to your expectations and your perfection. You gotta give people grace. You gotta give people grace to change and grace to grow and grace, grace to relearn. And all that stuff takes time. Really, it does. That's why when we teach about healing. Healing is a lifelong journey. It. It's. It's something that you should embrace for your life, for the rest of your life, because we will always be. Once you work on this thing, then there'll be something else to work on. Then there'll be something else to work on. And we got to love people and be willing to go the distance with the people that God's brought into our life. Yeah. There's going to be some people who are just not healthy. And you got to put up your boundary, and I just. I've got to stop here. And I got to, you know, ex this relationship out of my life. But then there are some people who you're going to have to love and embrace and say, I'm willing to shift and change and grow to. I mean, you know, you just can't extra kids out of Your life. You can't ex your husband and your wife out of your life and your family. I mean, you got to be willing to shift and change and grow, to embrace these people that God brought into your life.

You know, I had something I was so hot I wanted to finish out with, and it just skipped my mind because I was paying attention to you. Ah, help me, Lord. What was that? Oh, yeah. Let's end with this thought because our time's really about up. But I feel like I got to put this in here. Boundaries make people feel safe.

Yeah, they do.

I'm going to tell you something. This is something. Now, we won't start tooting our own horn, but this is something I attempt to do. I don't want you to ever, ever have a moment of your life where you feel unsafe, where I don't know what Ron's going to do. That's a terrible thing.

Yeah, it is.

By somebody you're tied to, and they're unpredictable. I don't want to ever put. I don't want you to ever wonder where I am. I don't want anything to ever go through your head if I come in late. So I don't want to ever do anything in life that would put that seed in you.

Right.

So there are very defined boundaries in my life. Why? Not just for my safety, but for the safety of everybody who's tied to me. And, you know, every day there are lines Ron Carpenter is straight up not going to cross. You know that you get to go around your date. Ron's not going to cross that line. And if they told you I did, you'd call him a liar. No, he didn't.

Because I know my husband.

Because I know my husband. And there are boundaries in your life that bring me great peace and bring me comfort. Even David said, thy rod and thy staff.

Comfort me.

Comforts me. That's a weird statement. A rod is a disciplining tool. But when you have the sheep, when they start getting too far to the left or to the right, leaving the herd. It's dangerous for sheep to leave the herd because they're vulnerable.

Yeah.

So when they start taking a few steps out, the shepherd.

But he just tapped. It's not a beating, it's a tag.

What is it? It's a boundary.

It is a boundary.

It's a boundary. And David said, thy rod and thy step. And when I got something tapping that makes me feel safe.

Yeah, it does.

And real, positive, nurturing relationships, it's when you get with those people and, you know, there's certain things that just are not going to happen because they have boundaries and they have lines they're not going to cross. And if you have great relationships with people that have no boundaries, you are heading toward a truckload of hurt.

That's an unsafe relationship.

Yeah. You're heading toward a truckload of hurt. And so boundaries are probably some of the, if not the most healthy things in your life.

Yes.

It's where true life flows. We got to end. We've been talking about these, but we've talked about five or six really powerful points here.

Absolutely.

It comes to relationships. Thank you for putting up with my swole eyes.

It's all right. I love you.

You love me in spite of swollen.

Yeah, I sure do.

Because mine are normally big.

No, they're not. You got little tiny eyes. Anyhow, thank you so much for listening. If you've enjoyed it, like it, share it, subscribe to the podcast, go to our YouTube channel and subscribe to Ron Carpenter. Hope Carpenter. We got so many things going on, so much to offer you. We love you so much. Until next time, we'll see you guys. Ron and Hope Unfiltered.