Bariatric Surgery Fixed Her Stomach, Not the Food Noise

It felt like I was a failure. It felt like, here I am, you know, I put myself through this surgery. Here I am, you know, I would, you know, I would beat myself up so much, just terribly. And I would see it as a failure. I'm failing. I am a complete failure. Like, here I go. I'm screwing it up again. My relationship with food was not good. I don't— feel like it's really ever been good. Sometimes it might just be like, "Oh, just a few chocolate chips," or, "I'll just have a few chips." That would happen night after night after night. It was happening more frequently, and I was entertaining those cravings more frequently. It was scary. It was a scary thought to know that I am literally going to undo everything I've done. When I stopped and listened to what you had to say, I mean, it's like a light bulb went on. I feel like, what have I got to lose? You know, like, I feel like I need to try this. I owe it to myself. I learned, was able to learn tools, help those cravings subside, just learning different ways to cope and deal with those things. When I'm feeling stressed, it's not, it doesn't seem as much of an automatic go-to. The craving had passed and I was able to go to sleep and did not go to the pantry felt really good. 'Cause 6 months ago, I would've totally ran to that pantry. I look in the mirror and like this thought popped in my head like, "I think I can do this." I never thought I would be able to walk away from snacks. Not to be cheesy, but it gave me hope. It gave me hope that I can do this.

You can. You are. You have been.

But I can continue to do this.

Hi, everyone. I'm Jessica Lawson, founder of the Bariatric Brain Institute, and I'm here with Cheryl, who has just graduated from coaching. Cheryl had bariatric surgery 3 years before we met, but she still found herself in the pantry at 9:30 at night wondering where those thoughts, the food noise, the cravings were even coming from. So today we're going to talk about what actually even changed. First off, Cheryl, thanks so much for being here.

Yes, glad to be here.

Awesome. So first off, tell us a little bit about yourself, you know, who you are, your people. What does a typical day in the life of Cheryl even look like?

Hello, my name is Cheryl. I am 52 years old from southeastern Illinois. I came across Jessica Lawson. I think I'm jumping ahead.

You're good.

Sorry. I'm married. I have 2 adult sons. I have my own private practice. I'm a mental health therapist, licensed mental health therapist. I have my own private practice going on year 12 now. I can do the math. So I've been in private practice for a while. Prior to that, did community mental health. So I've always been in that field, pretty stressful field. But I do enjoy it. I enjoy working with people. So that's what I do for a living. But so a typical day in the life, pretty You know, when my kids were younger, I'm very involved with them with sports. They played football, so we're constantly busy with sports and different things like that. We have a very— it's not a farm, but we have a little, you know, we have chickens, we have dogs, and we have, you know, we're pretty outdoorsy. We do a lot of things outdoors. And so, you know, my day would start out very much like being outside, taking care of the animals, things like that. Working a pretty long day most of the time, especially being in private practice. So usually at least anywhere from 8 to 10 or sometimes 11 hours a day, at least 4 days a week. So very busy with my work, my practice, and my kids. That's a typical, very, pretty much a typical day.

Yeah.

Okay. Anything else you want me to say about that?

No, you're good. Before we ever met, how would you have described your relationship with food?

My relationship with food was not good. I don't feel like it's really ever been good. I struggled with my weight since I believe I told you, Jessica, in the beginning, like 5 years old was when I remember, you know, my mom saying, bless her heart, because she's no longer with us. But that's when I had been sick with something. I'm not even sure what it was. But once I came out of that sickness and got better, like she said, my appetite was just ravenous. Like I just wanted to eat everything. And I could see as I go back and look through like elementary school pictures, my weight just progressively got— I just got heavier. So it's always not— it's never been a great relationship with food. It— food has been my go-to. I'm a stress eater. You know, when I'm stressed out, I don't want to drink. I don't want to smoke. I don't want to do any type of drug. I want to eat. I think I referred to it to Jessica Lawson as food is my meth, tongue in cheek, obviously, you know, never done a drug a day in my life, but food is my go-to. Food has been my go-to. And when I decided to have weight loss surgery, you know, on one hand, I knew that it wasn't going to fix everything.. But I think on the other hand, I, I hoped it would. Yeah. I had that hope like, this will be it. This will just, this will be my answer. Quickly realized that was not the case. Um, about 3 years, it was 3 years after, this was like, it was probably right after New Year's for some reason. Um, well, it, it was in my algorithm, but Jessica Lawson showed up in my Instagram, uh, feed. And I'm like, wow, like she's talking to me. And it really spoke to me and I felt like I needed to, to, to sign up for it and learn how, learn some tools that could be sustainable and that's something that I can maintain and not, hopefully not have a major setback and gain everything everything that I had lost. Yeah.

So you said when you had surgery, you pretty quickly realized it wasn't going to solve everything. When was that, and, and what happened that made you realize that?

I mean, it was probably— I mean, it was probably about a year in. I I just realized, you know, or, you know, found that some of the old habits were creeping back in, especially when I got stressed. And I see a lot of stress on a daily basis. You know, I have learned being a therapist over the years that I have to learn to separate things. I have to leave things in the office. I can't take that stuff home with me. And, and for the most part, I'm, I do pretty well with that, but there would be stressors. For instance, um, my aging parents at the time had gotten sick. Um, there was a lot of stress with that. Um, so with those stressors, I saw myself more and more turning to food, and not the healthy foods. It was chocolate, it was, you know, M&M's, whatever. I'm, I'm a sweets person, so it was usually something sweet. But I saw that happening more and more, and slowly I was having regain. It was scary. It was a scary thought to know that I am literally going to undo everything I've done. And I did not want that to happen.

Why?

You know, through our conversations, over these last 6 months and the group calls and individual calls, it's like realizing by having this surgery, I felt like I was adding life, adding years to my life. And I do, in fact, believe— I believe that that is true. But going backwards, I'm taking years off of my life. And I have, you know, I have 2 adult sons who, you know, I hope one day to have grandchildren. I want to enjoy that with them. I want to enjoy my life with my husband and enjoy life. I want to travel, you know, someday I hope to retire and I want to travel and I want to, I want, I want to continue to be active. Um, you know, be able to, to get outside and, and do the things that I enjoy doing and be comfortable doing those things.

Hmm, that all makes sense, and I feel like that's something a lot of people can relate to too.

Yeah.

Did you find any patterns around what time of the day you tend to struggle most?

Yes. Um, I absolutely did. Evening, evening slash late night tended to be where— excuse me— tended to be where I saw myself, you know, getting hungry and running to the pantry. And, you know, sometimes it might just be like, oh, just a few chocolate chips, or I'll just have a few chips. And, you know, but that happened, that would happen night after night after night. It was happening more frequently. And I was entertaining those cravings more frequently. So, you know, and, and I learned, was able to learn tools to help, help those cravings subside and, you know, just learning different ways to cope and deal with those things.

So before we started working together, what was a hard night actually like? Not just, not necessarily like what you ate, but like, what did it feel like?

I mean, it felt, it felt like I was a failure. It felt like I, I, here I am, you know, I, I put myself through this surgery, I put myself through, you know, going through this surgery, going through the, the post-operative, and, um here I am, you know, I would, you know, I would beat myself up so much, you know, just terribly. And I would see it as a failure. I'm failing. I am a complete failure. Like, here I go, I'm screwing it up again, you know. Um, it just constantly beating myself up.

Yeah. Why do you feel like you beat yourself up?

It, it just seemed like over time, I mean, that, that was just the narrative that just kept going, the loop that just kept repeating in my head. Um, because I didn't, I guess because I didn't really have any, um mechanisms in place that were, that were sustainable, that actually worked, you know, to help keep me from entertaining those cravings and going ahead and running to the pantry and going ahead and eating those chocolate chips or chips or whatever it was.

At that time before we met, like you'd had the surgery you, you knew in theory, logically, it wasn't going to change things, right? Or it wasn't going to solve the problems with food. But like, yeah, deep down a little bit, right? At that point when you were struggling with the cravings at night, did you feel like willpower was the answer? And like because you felt like you didn't have that in that moment, that thus you were a failure, or what exactly was it?

Yeah, I mean, I— yes, I do, um, think that sometimes I— the willpower, like, I have no— I have no willpower, and, um, I just, you know, I would just bend to it. I would just, you know, I have no willpower, so here I go. And then, oh well, we'll just, you know, try to do better tomorrow. And then tomorrow came and it would be the same, the same thing. Yeah, a lot of times I did blame it on willpower.

Yeah. So you found me, I crossed your feed somehow, some way. Were you looking for help at that point or was it just like There's Jessica's face.

I think, I mean, I wasn't specifically in that moment looking for help, but I think always in the back of my mind, I'm always, was always looking for something to help, something to, you know, I think I was always looking for something, but in that, in that specific moment, no. But when I stopped and listened to what you had to say, I mean, it's like a light bulb went on. And I'm like, okay, I'm like, I feel like, what have I got to lose? You know, like, I feel like I need to try this. I owe it to myself. You know, as a therapist, knowing that learning new tools, I mean, everybody can always learn new tools for things. And it just felt like almost at the time, like, I'm, if I don't try this, like, you're crazy for— I felt like I was crazy for not trying it. And I, you know, I attended, I think, your initial—

the workshop.

Yeah, the workshop. And it just spoke to me. Hmm.

Okay. You and I have actually— I don't think we've actually talked about your experience in the workshop. So I'm just curious, as Jessica, like, what about it spoke to you?

Now, forgive me, because it's been a minute.

It's been 6 months. Yeah, it was in January. We're filming this in July. Yeah.

I mean, the things you talked about, like, you know, I think, you know, do you have cravings? Do you, you know, you've had weight loss surgery, but you still have those cravings. You still experience some of the things that maybe you thought were going to go away, that were going to be fixed, and they're still there. And I'm like, yes, yes, and yes. You know, I kept answering yes to those questions. And— Yeah, I think that was— it just seemed— it made sense to me.

And what are all the things that you had tried to solve the cravings, to solve the food noise, to solve the stress eating, like all of it up until that point?

I mean, I feel like I've tried everything. I mean, I, you know, from, you know, Weight Watchers to GLP-1s, I mean, everything you can imagine. I, I can't— if I went— if I were to go back and add up the amount of money that I've spent, I mean, I feel like it could be rich. I spent a lot of money on everything. Um, I mean, you name it, I've tried it. I mean, I remember back in the day in high school I did SlimFast, and looking back at pictures, I mean, I wasn't even fat then. Yeah, but like, I did those things. I did SlimFast. I mean, I did it all. And when I'm becoming an adult and started looking into other things and then came across weight loss surgery and was like, okay, you know, this is the answer. And like I said, realizing after that, yeah, no, this, this was simply a tool. And again, knowing that, you know, that was said, I watched videos. I, you know, even my doctor told me, you know, it's a tool. It's not going to fix everything, but had this silly hope that, yeah, it will, it will. But no, it doesn't.

Yeah, everyone says that word tool, that it's a tool, but do you feel like you knew what that really meant at the time? Or additionally, do you feel like you knew what the real problem was? When you had surgery?

I don't think I didn't really know what that meant as a tool. Yeah, I don't think I really understood exactly what that meant, even though, you know, I went through the evaluation and everything, but that wasn't discussed in any of that. And then what was the other question you asked?

When you think about why you needed surgery, Okay, right. What led you to get to the point of needing surgery and having surgery? Do you feel like you even knew what the real problem was all along when you had it?

No.

Okay.

I don't know. I didn't. Um, you know, that was again, and that was never discussed. And these are things that, as I, I told you in one of our individual sessions, was like, I wish these are things that would have been discussed prior to, you know, prior to the surgery, you know, but no, none of that. I didn't know exactly why. I didn't know, I didn't know what it meant actually to be a tool. But yeah, that word was thrown around a lot. You know, it's a tool, it's a tool.

Yeah.

So.

Yeah, I use a hammer to, and that's a tool, right? Right. But I don't use it every day. So yeah. But you're also someone that other people lean on both personally and professionally, and I'm assuming probably personally you probably spend a lot of years not prioritizing yourself. So what was it like to be prioritizing yourself this time?

It was, it was really eye-opening. I knew, I knew that I usually put everybody first, personally and professionally. And, but I think realizing how much that affected me physically, for instance, you know, I had an issue at my home where my bathroom had to be torn apart. And I remember telling you, like, the day after, my husband and I were working furiously to get everything squared away. And I spent 3/4 of the day working with him, and I didn't— I didn't eat. I didn't eat correctly. I didn't eat enough. I didn't drink my water. And I felt it. And stopping to look at that, like stand back and really look at that through our conversations and through just, you know, different things we talked about in group calls and things like that. Like, wow, like I am not— when I don't put myself first, when I don't take care of me first, you know, it's the whole, um, analogy when you're on an airplane of, you know, pull your— put your oxygen mask on first. You know, I never put my oxygen and mask on first. You know, I'm like, oh, let me put mine down and so I can take care of you. Totally crazy way to think about it, but that's what I was doing. So through, through this learning— now, am I perfect at it? Absolutely not. But that's another thing, learning that, you know, nothing— it's not going to be perfect and that's okay. I'm still working on that piece of putting myself first. I think I'll be a work in progress with that. Probably for a long time to come, but I, I feel like I have definitely made improvements on that and I'm much better than what I was 6 months ago.

Awesome.

Awesome.

So let's talk now about like some of the work we actually did together, cuz we've kind of talked a lot about, you know, what led you to me, et cetera. What was different about anything we did compared to like anything else you'd ever done before?

I mean, first of all, it was, it was a great support system. You know, I could feel like I could reach out to you at any time if I needed to and had questions. And, and I remember feeling overwhelmed in the beginning, a few weeks after we had started. And, you know, not going to lie, I wanted to quit. Yeah, I can't, I can't do this. You know, it's too much.

Change is hard. Yeah.

And, um, and I'm not a quitter, but, and I ultimately did not want to quit, but I didn't know what else to do because I was so, I felt so overwhelmed. So, you know, through talking with you and, you know, you helping me realize like, okay, we can, you know, we'll, we'll work through this. And we did. And you were help, help me to, um, shift my perspective in that this is not going to be perfect. And I think for me that was a big thing because I felt like everything needed to be perfect. If it wasn't perfect, it wasn't going to work. So that was important for me to realize.

Yeah. I don't know if I've actually ever told you this, but everyone has that moment.

Really? Yeah. So I I expect it. Okay, good.

Everyone has that moment because everyone comes in with all-or-nothing mentality. Everyone comes in wanting to do— go zero to 100, you know, because you come from— everyone comes from the diet world where if you don't do it perfectly, then it means that you failed and that it's your fault, etc., right? And so I look for those kind of signs throughout time, especially around like week 5, 6, 7. That's usually when it starts to happen. Um, because the newness excitement has worn off.

Mm-hmm.

Now it's real lifetime and everyone kind of has a different way of coping with it. Um, But what I loved about you is like, you were, you were like, hey, this is how I'm feeling and this is what is going on. And that then is like my flag up, like, all right, cool. This moment's happened. Let's now address it. Right. So, right. Yeah. So everyone has it at some point.

That's good to know. That's good to know. Totally. Yeah.

So what did you find out, or what do you feel like were some, like, the biggest insights that you learned about yourself in general through all of this?

Um, I learned about myself. I think going back to the perfectionism, that it's not going to be perfect. I'm not perfect. Nothing is perfect, and that's okay. Um, That was a big one, I think, for me, learning that and getting okay with that and accepting that. Learning that some of my old habits of, you know, one big thing, just as I took the drink of water, made me realize like, oh yeah, I literally was drinking 20 ounces of water, if that, some days prior to this program and working you know, on increasing my water intake, which is, which has helped a lot. I don't know, just, but learning that I'm capable of more than I realize, I think I'm capable of doing hard things. And I'm going to go back a minute to like, I've done hard things. Can I maintain? And I— that's another word I keep going back to, sustainable and maintaining, is can I maintain doing those hard things? And yes, I can. I think when you're given the support, support is very important. And I've always had support from like my family. That's really never been an issue. But at the same time, my husband's not had weight loss surgery. My kids haven't had weight loss surgery. They don't get that. So having that support from a community, from people who have had it, kind of been there, done that, has been very helpful because you get it, you understand it. Yeah. So that was really helpful.

Awesome. Let's talk about the trigger mapping because I feel like for you, well, I don't want to put words in your mouth. You tell me. What was that exercise like for you?

It was kind of eye-opening. So my trigger mapping, I— that's where I really saw my patterns of the late night, evening into late night, excuse me, cravings and running for the snack. And also just when stressors happened, when I felt stressed, that's when I tended to Um, you know, those cravings would, would creep in, or, you know, that's when I would be more likely maybe to entertain those cravings. Hmm.

What else did we do with that? So it's one thing to know.

Okay, so that's when— yeah, sorry. You helped me with what's called— oh, boredom. Boredom. I saw that boredom for me was a trigger. Yeah. Oh yeah. And that's when obviously the cravings and the, oh, I want some chocolate or I want some chips. So you built a, what we called a boredom plan. A really cool, based off of our conversations of the things, things I like to do, things that kind of help, help me relax a little bit. And in utilizing that by whatever time of day it was and sort of like if it was 9, let's say 9:23, like take 9 plus 2 plus 3, whatever that number is, whatever activity was on that boredom plan, that's where I landed. And so that boredom plan, and I would, and I put it on my lock screen of my phone. So it's always handy. I would keep it in my, it was always near where I could get to it, whether that's on my phone, whether that was like on the little table sitting next to the chair that I sit in usually. So that was very helpful. So we built that boredom plan that has been extremely helpful. Okay, never prior to this program, you know, those things, there was things there that I have done in the past, but I never had anything available at my fingertips to be like, oh, well, I can just pop my phone open and look at this. Um, and so having those things at my fingertips has been very helpful. You know, you've always been great at providing charts or, um, You know, anything like through using like the EverFit app and things like that, like those things were always available and I could save stuff on my phone, save screenshots and things like that. So that was very, very helpful. Yeah, it's still very, very helpful.

I appreciate that because it's one thing to know what to do, but then you got to implement it, right? So I'm always thinking about, okay, for this person What is the easiest way for them to implement it, right? You're someone that is not tech, so tech savvy, they're gonna be coding, but you are more tech savvy than the average person your age. So for you, I'm like, okay, she could put something on a screensaver on her phone, be good, right? Some people might need it like laminated, printed out. I've had some people put something in a frame that's like printed out, like the kitchen closing, right? Like the kitchen closing stuff. Put that in a frame in their kitchen because they're less tech savvy, wouldn't be able to figure out how to put it on their phone too.

Right.

So different strokes, different folks too.

I think that was one thing also with your program and you, Jessica, is that you're very willing to, to meet people where they're at. And not expect, you know, not expect, you don't expect that extreme tech savvy because yeah, I'm in that generation of, I'm kind of on, I teeter. I can do some tech things, but you know, I'm not like my sons who are 19 and 22, like they can zip through all that and put things on their phone. Like I'm not quite there. And you're always very willing to meet— were always very willing to meet me where I'm at with that. So that was, that was very helpful.

Awesome, I'm glad. So let's talk about like when, when things got hard and you almost felt like you wanted to step back, right? Like what turned it around for you?

Well, I think first of all, having the conversation with you, talking with you, and you, um, What's the word I want to use? You— I don't know what exactly what word I want to say. You dumbed it down. It's— that's not it. It's not— you didn't dumb it down.

Simplified it.

Simplified. Yes, you simplified it for me, and that helped a bunch. It helps so much to simplify things. For me, simplifying it helped. I have a lot of things and it's no excuse, but I have all these things going on around me that I'm responsible for. You know, I got to keep my business going every day. I mean, that's my income. That's my livelihood. There were some other things, but like simplifying things to just make things more simple, more simple helped me tremendously to not give up and be like, okay, I can do this. This is— we simplified it. We, we've broken things down maybe. To be a little more simple, maybe not as many steps, um, was, was very helpful for me.

Awesome. I think a lot of people are scared about starting something and exactly what you went through happening, right? Like it feels bigger than them, or it doesn't feel like the, the, you know, it can feel overwhelming. But I think what's really important It's like you vocalize that, right? You vocalize that, met you where you were at, and like, what is the minimum viable structure? And then I think in turn doing that, we also discovered what is Cheryl's most sustainable structure. Like on Cheryl's worst possible day, what does she do, right? Like what are the one or two things that She does when there's a tornado.

Right. And giving me, letting me figure out what those things were. I mean, you could have sat there and told me all day long what, you know, and we talked about that, but allowing me to say, okay, here's what I, here's what I can do. Here's the things that I can do. Um, was, was very helpful. Yeah.

And then you have ownership of it and then you have more buy-in and you're more likely to do it too. Yeah, right.

Absolutely.

So tell me about maybe a recent moment where food tried to run you, but it did not. Like, what happened there?

Uh, so it was, it was a late night craving. Um, I'm trying to remember, like, it, you know, and we did the exercise kind of where you go back and you kind of see where, because things don't fall apart, right? It's not It didn't just happen then. You go back a few hours and, you know, I think it had not been a great day at work, or let me rephrase that. No, it was a funeral. It was a family funeral, I believe is what it was. It'd been kind of a stressful day, but got home that evening and a late-night craving had creeped in. Through utilizing the Boredom Plan, was able to, you know, found a couple things. I think, I believe at the time I journaled and then also did some like adult coloring type things and was able to focus on those things. And within, I mean, it was probably, I did both of those things, journaled and the coloring thing. And within, I I don't know, 15 to 30 minutes, I mean, the craving had passed and I was able to go to sleep and did not go to the pantry and grab a snack.

How did that feel?

Good. It felt really good. Because 6 months ago, I would have totally ran to that pantry. Mm.

Why?

Because, you know, at 6 months ago, I— nothing was— there was no— at least I didn't see— I didn't see that I had any tools to, you know, to, to do otherwise. You know, I didn't have any other, um, and nothing was really— I didn't have that internal conversation of, okay, but you have these tools, you have, you know, utilize that boredom plan, utilize this, you know, give yourself some time, don't just run to the pantry, you know, sit with that for a moment. You know, take your time to sit with that. Try focusing on something else. I mean, I didn't have those. I had never sat down and you know, made a list of things that I could do instead of going to the pantry. But through having that boredom tool handy on my phone or wherever next to me, I was able to utilize that and it worked. It worked for me in that moment.

How did it go the first time we tried that out?

I mean, I think I struggled the first— I struggled.

Yeah. That's okay.

That just showed me, you know, it's not perfect.

Yeah.

But you know what? It was, it was way better than anything I had had in the past.

So yeah, it only works the more you use it. Right, right. And so if you had to describe, you know, or what is your relationship with food like now, July 2026? Compared to the beginning of January 2026?

I mean, it's better. Again, it's not perfect, but it, it's better. It's much better. Um, I don't think that I rely on that when I'm feeling stressed. It's not— it doesn't seem as much of an automatic go-to. Um, when stress creeps in, because as we know, there's— we're always going to have stress in our lives. But it's, it's just, it is not my automatic go-to.

How does that feel?

Very good, very good. And it feels, again, it feels sustainable. This is something that won't— you know, that I can continue to do, that I can continue to have and utilize, um, through whenever I need it, you know.

Yeah. So right now there's someone watching this that was just like you on, let's say, January 1st, 2026. Someone whose day might be fine and then nighttime comes around and they're in the pantry, or someone who's struggling after surgery, if you could say something to them, like, what would you want them to know?

Um, don't give up on yourself. There, you know, don't give up. Don't give up on yourself. There are, um, you know, it— life is never perfect, but But you know, there are ways to find sustainable things to get you through, to help you day to day. And learning, learning new, learning about yourself, I think is important. Learning about yourself, like how you were before. Because as we know, most of the time you don't, your surgeons aren't telling you these things, going through the psych evaluations. They're not telling you those things. But doing this program helped me learn a lot about myself and some of my behaviors and some of the things that I would do or I would lean on and that I thought like, that's just normal, that's just what you do. And it doesn't have to be that way. So don't, I think my biggest thing would be like, don't give up on yourself. I was at the point, there was times where I was at the point like, okay, well, I guess we're just going to go back to square one and that's just how it's going to be. I do not feel that way now.

We talked about this a lot in our last call, right? Like, whether or not you feel that way at any point in time, you don't have a choice, right? And well, you do have a choice, but if we go back to why you had surgery, it was to gain years on your life. You know, if you want to keep those years, you don't have a choice, right? And so it's just remembering your why and continuing to do the work and to do the little small actions that will get you to where you want to be. Does that make sense?

Yes, absolutely.

Yeah, so there's also probably someone watching this who feels like She's someone smart like you, should be able to figure all this out on her own. Like, what would you tell them?

It's okay if you don't have all the answers. We don't— we're not always able to figure all of it out on our own. And it's okay to ask for help. And I think it's okay, you know, to reach out to other people and to reach out to people who have been in a similar situation, who have had the surgery, and they understand the thoughts and the feelings that you are going through. Um, because a lot of what I heard through this, like, were just— I'm like, yes, like, that's the exact thoughts that I have on a daily basis. And through our group calls and stuff and listening to other women speak is like, yes, I get it. And being able to listen to other women who have been through the same thing, it is so helpful. I mean, it just, it validates validates it. Yeah, that you're like, okay, I'm not crazy. I'm not, I'm not just this weakling, or I, you know, I have no willpower. It, it's about more than not having willpower, you know. There's, there's more to it than that. And that learning that and hearing other women talk about that and you, um, has been incredibly helpful because that was the narrative that would go through my mind is like, you just, you have no willpower. You just, you're weak. You can't, you know, you can't walk away from the chocolate or whatever the snack is. Um, it's, it's more than that.

Yeah. What do you think the narrative is now?

I, for me, the narrative is I can do this. I, you know, I, I told you a couple months ago, like literally standing in the bathroom, in my bathroom here at work, um, washing my hands. I look in the mirror and like this thought popped in my head like, I think I can do this and it doesn't have to be perfect. It was so like eye-opening and all the things. I'm like, okay, that was my sign, like I can do this. It is not going to be perfect and that's okay, but I can do this. And having that sort of aha moment really sort of at the time, I think, kind of reignited a fire in me and having more belief in myself, like, okay, I can do this. And that was, that was incredibly helpful.

A lot of this is, is confidence building.

Yeah.

Right. And building self-trust, building evidence that you can do it, and you only get evidence by doing it too. Right. Let's say there's someone out there that tried everything and is worried about this just being another thing that they try and it's not gonna work for them. Like, what would you say to that?

I mean, I would want to encourage them to try anyway. Um, you know, your life is worth it. Your life is worth it. You are worth it. And I know for me, I felt like I owed that, owed that to myself to, to try. You know, it just, at the time for me, it made sense. Yeah. I felt like, you know, I think for anybody, like, you are worth it. Your life is worth it. Your family's worth it. Um, it just is.

Yeah. And I think it also goes back to understanding like, what is the problem? What is the problem underneath everything? And whether or not this is the right place to solve it.

Yes. Yes.

Two last questions for you. Well, less questions, more of a fun exercise. Um, I want you to finish this sentence, Cheryl. Okay. 6 months ago, I never thought I'd be able to blank.

I never thought I would be able to walk away from snacks. I didn't think I'd be able to drink more than 20 ounces of water a day, which is insane to me now that I think about that. I don't think I could do those things.

How many ounces? Yeah, go ahead.

I didn't know that I could relearn or relearn how to sort of rewire the thinking you know, you talked several times, you've mentioned about how rewiring these pathways and, you know, from a therapist perspective, as I would think about like, yes, I'm like, that, that absolutely makes sense. I didn't know that it was, I didn't know if it was possible for me to do that. But through, I think with the support and just learning kind of some basic Basic things just about behaviors and kind of just looking at things in a different light, in a different way, helped me to— it definitely helped me to be able to get to what— to be able to finish out. And I feel like, you know, take these— have these tools and feel comfortable using them and utilizing them. Yeah, that makes sense.

In one sentence, what did this actually do for you?

You know, not to be cheesy, but it gave me hope. It gave me hope that I can do this.

You can. You, you are. You have been.

But I can continue to do this. Yeah. So Yeah. Oh, thank you, Jessica Lawson.

That hit me in the feels. Really did. Oh, Cheryl, anything else you want to share or add?

I just, you know, thank you and again, keep doing what you're doing because it's very helpful. And I think there's a lot of other women who are in my shoes or who will be in my shoes that, yeah, you know, this is, this is important work. I didn't know that until, you know, until I had the surgery and until I got into this. I didn't, did not realize how important it is. And hopeful, I'm hopeful that hopefully in the future that this can have an impact in the bariatric community prior to surgeries.

Well, Cheryl, you've done the hardest thing there is in this world when it comes to this, right? Like, you had the surgery, you did everything your doctor told you, and food still ran your head. And like you've said, like, you didn't need more willpower. You've had willpower in so many other areas of your life. You, you've had it plenty. What you needed was, was a, a bit of structure and to find out what was actually driving it. Right. And to learn how to change those automatic pathways too. And like you did that, I can tell you what to do, but you gotta actually do it. And you did.

Right, right.

So I know I, I said this a lot in our last coaching call, but I'm so proud of you.

Thank you.

Like, you again, you did the hardest work there is.

Thank you so much. I am actually proud of myself. Good. And that's a hard— that's, that's not an easy thing to say for me, but I am actually proud of myself. And so I just, um, I'm gonna keep going. I'm gonna keep utilizing things and, and keep going.

So Keep driving your Maserati.

Right, exactly, exactly. Awesome.

Thanks, Cheryl.

Yes, thank you.