SSP 001: Understanding The True Self

State Shifters Episode 1 Understanding the True.

Self welcome to the State Shifters Podcast, a show dedicated to helping you discover your true potential through connecting the mind, body and soul.

Hello and welcome to the first installment of the State Shifters podcast. My name is Jordan Kanlish and I'm the founder of State Shifters. For those who don't know, State Shifters is something that I started more of a blog to communicate my perspective with other people and help others on their own journey of personal growth and self discovery through connecting with their passions and finding a purpose through uniting the mind, body and soul. So the podcast will take the course of me bringing on my good friend Josh Collins as a co host. Each week we're going to discuss a centralized topic but then also allow it to be an open ended discussion. So we want to talk about some of the spiritual practices that we've implemented in our life that allow us to go about our days to enable us to access deeper states of awareness. So State Shifters is about transcending limiting beliefs and achieving higher state of living so you can achieve your goals and what have you set out to achieve in life. So in this first episode we're going to introduce the topic of the true self. So the true self is our essence, what we truly are, and that's behind the mind and the ego, which is the false identity that most people associate themselves with. So first off, I'll introduce Josh and he'll give a bit of background to how he got to where he is. He's actually based over in Sydney and I'm in Canada, so there's a unique story there. So enjoy the first episode. Josh, welcome.

Hello.

Hello. Glad to have you here, mate. First, first conversation of our podcast journey. Yeah, man, stuck into it with you, man.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to it.

So Josh, can you tell people a little bit about how you got to where you are today? So people who don't know Josh actually lives in Syd and I'm in Canada at the moment. So Josh, why are you in Sydney and how did your spiritual journey start out?

My big questions, what happened? I finished up university. I wanted a bit of a change. Wanted to get out of Perth, the conditioning of staying in one spot for a while. And just landed a job in big town, big Sydney and moved over here.

Big smoke.

Yeah man, it's been going well. Yeah, I think, I suppose start of my, start of my spiritual journey. Wow, that's a big question. Started at the end, towards the end of high school. Just we were talking the other day about just having like the. I Suppose emotional pain that comes along with growing up as a teenager and through the. Through different experiences of suffering and self imposed suffering. Just that started to sow the seeds of, I think, separation between mind and spirit. Yeah. And that was kind of where it kicked off. And it's just once you're on that trail, you just want to follow it because it's just. It's such a peaceful place.

Definitely. So end of high school. So you're in, what, 17? Yeah.

Americans want to start.

Yeah. It's interesting because, yeah, I was pretty much the same age and mine was pretty much the same reason why I kind of went down this path of looking for answers. I'd say that's how mine started. It was going through suffering, through a relationship and experiencing. Experiencing strong emotions of love at a very young age and not knowing how to deal with them. So I started asking questions about why do I feel this way or how can I better deal with these strong emotions? And I think it kind of naturally takes you down this path of being fed up with suffering and you look for the right answers instead of turning. I think being at such a young age, it's good because you don't turn to alcohol or you're not turning to any other form of covering up or it's trying to escape. You just face them directly. So, you know, I'm. I'm grateful that I went through this at a young age because I see a lot of people now.

Yeah.

Turn to the wrong mediums to deal with stuff like this.

Yeah, yeah, I was. I mean, I think what, what I'm happy to be a part of is this. Is this kind of bringing together a hub of information on spirituality for people that are looking to have a place to start or don't know how to get into. Can be a central hub of all the information that we've learned. And hopefully we can point some people in a direction that kind of makes them happier people.

Yeah, exactly. And that's the whole idea behind this, I think. And. And for me with stage shifters was we want to try and share our perspective, to try and help others on their own path. And obviously everyone's at different stages on the path, and I think that's the main realization that I've had is people will pick up on different things based on where they're at. And, you know, all it takes is someone to just pick up on one little thing from one of our conversations to just point them in the right direction or help them out on their little process that they're on. So Actionable takeaways is going to be something I think we're going to try and give out to people along with just sharing our challenges on our journey. Because living on the other side of the world, man, poses different challenges for each of us. So talking about that is going to be, I'm sure that we're going to deliver some value to people as well.

Yeah, yeah. I want to be, I suppose, as relatable as possible to the everyday. I think it's hard to, it's hard to contextualize just when you're hearing, you're hearing words. I think being able to relate it to everyday life is important.

Wanted to talk a little bit about the distinction between the ego and the true self because I feel that is a very important part of spiritual realization. And probably the first step on anyone's spiritual journey is identifying who they really are. And I think figuring that out first kind of sets the foundations for your growth going forward. So you could probably enlighten people on the difference between the true self or the mind made self or the ego.

Yeah, that's a huge question. Let me see if I can give it a crack. I think, I think a good way to describe it like from the way that I've heard is that we're born perfect, just basically the true essence of life with no thought, no surrounding knowledge of where they are. And then as we grow older, we get conditioned or we learn certain things and we're the production of our environment throughout that life and through that time. We have identities, we attach ourselves to certain ideas and materials and this is the image of who we are that we've created through this time. Now the distinction, I suppose in trying to understand this is this person that goes through suffering, the one that you've created is not the real energy or the real life behind that. It's. Yeah, it's unbelievable.

It's an unbelievable realization when you have it. But yeah, so you're saying it's a necessary. Well, for everyone it's a necessary step to go through the development of an ego and then a realization that the ego isn't them. So yeah, it's a necessary transition in life to go from a child who doesn't have an ego to developing one and being in the world. So then does there need to be a certain type of suffering involved to come to the realization that we aren't the ego, we aren't the mind?

Yeah, I think as we were talking about before, the pains, pain and suffering is usually the biggest gate to discovering it. I think that's due to the fact that when you're at a point where you're in a lot of pain or suffering, you're just fed up with feeling that way and you just become all of a sudden dissociated away from it. So once you realize that that person is experiencing pain, isn't really you, and you're the observer behind that form, the pain also goes with it. You realize that you're not owning the pain anymore. It's not part of who you are. It's just the situation that's affecting the form that you're temporarily residing in.

Most definitely, I think. And that's the practice, right, Isn't it? Because the first time you kind of have that realization, it obviously doesn't fully. You fully can't comprehend it because you. You kind of sink back into unconscious association with the mind. So over time, is it a matter of practicing or training the mind to disidentify with itself or is it just a matter of. Yeah, yeah, because it's that practice. I think that's the hardest part.

Yeah, I mean. Yeah, you're exactly right. The hardest part is keeping that up. I think that's the essential importance of meditation is the end goal of meditation is to quieten the mind to get to that space of no thought where it's peaceful. And I think to get there on a daily basis is quite a difficult thing. But yeah, I mean, I think that's the important point. There's nothing like. Spirituality is not what. You're not trying to fix anything. There's nothing to gain within spirituality. It's about taking away and realizing that your wholeness, your completion is already actually there. So you're not trying to gain anything, which I think is important. A lot of people self judge for that, for that type of reason.

Yeah, for sure. I've noticed in myself, even I still would say we're very early in our spiritual journey. But, you know, I'm noticing in myself now increased association with my true identity being the eternal presence or the infinite oneness. And that's come about from increasing the duration of my meditation. So, like throughout my day, I'll often have the subconscious mind will slip in and bring me to presence randomly. Be like, I don't know if that happens to you, but I'll be. Just be going about my day. And then I'll have a little reminder that they go like presence. And I'll enter a state of the watch or the observer. And those little reminders like to use as like a. I don't Know, just a reminder that this is it. Like I've made it, this is enlightenment. Now, even though there might be little, short little spells during the day. Yeah, that's it. Like when you have those reminders that come in, that's. That's enlightenment. Even though they might be short, remembering that as soon as you have them, there's nowhere else to go. There's nowhere else to be. You've made it in life then. Yeah, it's about building on them. Yeah, yeah. And you can create, you can create little Eckhart speaks about it as well. You can create little gateways throughout your day. As like back home I used to use train rides as my little gateway. Every day I use a train ride as like a reminder to be at present or be the watcher for the whole ride. And then it became a ritual or a routine. So I created this space in my day where I was always in presence, I was always watching my mind. And I think that's a good way of starting out, like brushing your teeth. Use that as a little reminder to be present. Be the watcher.

Yeah, yeah, I think that's important. The point I raised about like self judgment with it when it comes to that is that the goal of that is just to be aware of the thought. So I think a lot of people, they'll be like, oh no, I'm thinking like that. I shouldn't be thinking, that's bad. I'm trying to. So then they self judge and that's the ego coming back in again, judging. So as soon as you become aware and then judge yourself, you've lost it. The goal is just to become aware of it, accept whatever the thought is and then let it go. Yeah, I think that's the same thing that Eckhart says. We die to our past. Constantly. Constantly. We just let go. We let go of the thoughts that arise.

Dying to each thought as it comes. And that's.

Yeah, exactly.

What about the times when like. Because I've noticed this in myself as well, I'll be aware of the fact that I'm in presence. I'll be aware of the fact that I'm not having thoughts and it's very peaceful. But like you said, there'll be times I will also be aware of the fact that my mind is thinking a lot. Yeah, I find that they're the hardest times when like I notice my mind is very active. What is a good way of like coping with those times during the day when you, when you notice your mind is racing and you're overthinking a lot.

Yeah, that's right. I think most people's reaction is just to. They get angry because I don't know why their mind's so rampant. They'll try and like, stop. They'll try and stop the thoughts through excessive trying to take up tasks that. To distract themselves from their thoughts. When in reality, the only way to get around it is to observe the thought, become aware of what the thought is, acknowledge it for what it is, don't judge it, and then let it go. It's a constant cycle. You're right. It's such a long practice.

Yeah.

Because it's just about every time you become aware, that is the goal, just to be aware of it.

That's right. Yeah.

Center the thought, don't judge it, and let it go. And as you do that, because you're not resisting the thought, it doesn't keep coming back. You accept it and let it on its way. And the thoughts slowly disappear over time.

That's such a powerful thing. I think if anyone's ever experienced that before that whole. I experienced it the other day. I think we were speaking about it. I was having thoughts around, like little worrisome thoughts about my situation, about not being able to find a job. Unnecessary thoughts, but creating a bit of dense energy. And they're blocking off some energy in my body. And I actually sat with it for a while, meditated on it. And like you said, you feel it. You don't try and escape the thought. You just let it be there. And I actually felt in my body the actual energy drop away. I felt it clear because I acknowledged it and then gone through the process of letting it go. It's so powerful, especially when people carry lots of blocked energy around. The actual feeling of letting it all go. It's very cleansing. Yeah. It only comes when you have to feel it first. You have to acknowledge that it's there and let it be there.

Yeah, yeah. Don't fight it. Yeah, that's exactly right. Yeah, don't fight it.

So, I mean, we've identified what the true self is. So, you know, the true self is the background awareness behind our senses. So as humans, we only have limited capacity to experience the world through our five senses. The five senses aren't who we are. We're the observer of the five senses. I like to remind myself of that as well. Because the five senses can be used in a unique way as a reminder or as a way to create a gap between senses and who we are. So by utilizing the senses, like when you're listening to things, you're observing things through your eyes, smelling things, tasting things. Every time we do that, that can become a spiritual practice. So when I eat food, I like to. The first time you try food and you taste it, there's a gap between you experiencing the fullness of it and then your mind coming in and liking to label or question what it is that you're eating. So if you can create like a gap between the observer and then the mind labeling things, it becomes a practice. And same with, Same with the rest of the senses. Do you have, like, specific practices or techniques that you use to increase your association with the true self, or do you use the senses as well as a gateway?

Yeah, I think anything, Any, any. You can use anything that is constantly now. You can use any. Because the gateway to that place is by bringing the awareness to now. That's true. Not the past, not the future. And by bringing your awareness to the now, you automatically enter that zone. That's so true. So I think, yeah, I think the biggest practice for me is just to, yeah, use anything that's in the now. The senses. Any kind of meditation on the body, because you have all five senses, plus you have all your internal senses. I like to focus on the heart and the lungs and feel the movement up and down as you breathe. It's a very centered meditation. But then even when you're out, like out and about meditation on walking. Yeah, just use the surrounding surrounding. Like, as you say, like, nature is a great, great way to get. Get in touch with it as well.

Yeah, I think, yeah, the body's a good. The body's a great one because so many people, man, are stuck in their heads and just so disconnected with their body. And like, this is one of the things why I wanted to start state shifters was to bring the body and mind together. And to me, that's just been such a powerful influencer on my life is like treating my body and mind equally, training them equally. And when you do that, you know, you're able to be more in touch with that inner energy field in the body that's always there, which is essentially who you are. So when you bring your attention into the body, you know you're getting out of your head and you're feeling the subtle energy that pervades your whole body. And then, yeah, like you said, that becomes a meditation. That. That is presence. And yeah, you can. People can access that all the time throughout the day. Just feel the sensation in your hands. Feel, like you said, when you're walking, feel your Your feet, feel your muscles moving. So when I work out at the gym, I like to feel put my attention in the muscle that's getting worked. I think Arnold Schwarzenegger talks about that. That's a meditation. Exercise is a meditation, but people don't realize what they're doing, but that's why they feel so good.

That's true. But yeah, that's true.

So another thing I'm intrigued by the whole spiritual practice of disidentifying with the ego, disidentifying with your identity. What is the end goal for someone living society like normal society, where we have jobs? How far can we go at training the mind to disidentify with itself? Because, yeah, you know, obviously there comes a point where, you know, you can only experience extreme peace, as in connecting with your true self. But you still have to operate in a normal world. And you've got monks that kind of go off and deepen their practice by disconnecting from the world. And what. How far can you go? What's the ultimate goal?

Yeah, that's a good question, man. I don't think there's any goal. I think it's just some people want to ready and want to experience that some people aren't and they're happy in the way of life that they're currently operating in or they're used to. They're conditioned to the mild sufferings of the mind. So I mean, if you want to. I think, yeah, it's a tough question because the end goal, if you're living in a Western civilization, it's hard to achieve that. Yeah, that end goal of enlightenment. But I think you can do it in a way that you can live a life of non judgment and acceptance and non resistance to the current moment. I think what you're really going for in a civilization like we're in is just to not let external factors affect your happiness, just to understand that happiness is derived from within and it's the perspective of the situation that makes it. I mean, I don't think you have to be like enlightened and bless other people. I think there's a Western spirituality that's just designed to make people happier.

Yeah, yeah, that's cool. It's a cool thought because I agree. I think once from a Western perspective, once we get the realization of these spiritual practices and like you said, once we realize where true happiness comes from, I think that kind of creates. Makes life just a fun journey. So you can really do whatever you want with it because you can't really fail. And there's only lessons to be learned and experiences to be had without really getting too caught up in the world. And I think creates the opportunity for people who have come to that realization is to help others come to it or help others on their journey.

Yeah, that's what Eckhart says. The next evolution. Evolution of human existence.

Yeah. Well, then for me, that. I'm a bit of a futurist. I like to think of like end goals. If that's the next evolution of humans, that basically means we're all evolving to return to our essential essence, which is oneness. Is that right?

Yeah, I assume it. I mean, I suppose if you look at it that way, if you look at it was. If it was literally the entire human civilization, that this was like an evolution, then, then yeah, you, Everyone, everyone would transcend human form and therefore be in touch with that energy.

Yeah. So, yeah, you know, it's kind of. We're at a bit of a tipping point in society today, I think.

There's.

There's a large chunk of people who are so identified with the mind because it's so dysfunctional. It's. It's causing so much conflict in the world and people, people are killing each other, people are turning to violence. And then you've got this other part of society which the evolution of consciousness, which it is growing probably would like to happen at a faster rate. But the funny thing is we're both. The end goal is we're both returning to the same source, which is death of the mind, death of identity with who we are. So we're either going to get there through transcending the mind or we're going to get there through killing ourselves. But the end goal is ultimately the return to oneness. Is that right? However long that takes, that's ultimately where human evolution is going.

I suppose. Yeah, I suppose. Yeah. I mean. Yeah. I mean, who knows if we, if we even get there.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, I think, I think. To me, I'm not, I'm not as much of a futurist. Yeah. I'm just like. I think. I think if we can look at how it can just help. I think you look at how just living a life like that makes you happier, makes the people around you happier. If we just do that in small chunks and it grows organically, I mean, that could be. That could be a slow evolutional change. But I think it makes an impact straight away, mainly internally. And then obviously the external is a reflection of that.

Yeah. I mean, prefer. The only thing we can all do is change ourselves. First better ourselves, and then through that, we impact the world. People don't realize the little things. When you connect with that place of peace and happiness, you kind of go about your day and you infect it on other people. You make other people's days better. And there's just such little things that. Improving the world as we know it. Well, it's a. It's a chain. I think once one person unlocks this gateway to eternal happiness, then they go out and affect others just by being. Just by not forcing anything, but just being a space, just being a. An outlet for peace, happiness and love. Then I think that's how it starts. I think this is going to be a great way for us to do that. Just to be a space for people who want to tune in. Yeah. Feel the vibes, man. Feel the love.

Let's connect. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.

But, yeah, in summary, just. I think we should summarize again what. What we're trying to explain. The core essence of who we really are. So we've identified who we're not. So we're not the mind, we're not the body. So the mind is this identity that we've created for ourselves through our cultural upbringing, our society's perception on who we should be. That's not us. So if that's not us, we're the. What are we? We're the space behind all of that, the awareness behind all of that.

Yeah. I really like the term observer. Observer. Yeah. Of like. Yeah. Just a constant. I mean, you could. That's what people could call it. God, whatever you want to call. It's just a constant. It's a constant awareness. All perceiving. Yeah. It's just an energy. So I think it's just the space of no thought, really. I mean. Yeah. It's unbelievably hard to explain.

It is, Yeah. I got, like, one book that really stood out for me when I read it and it was clarified this. The whole association with the true self and disidentifying with the mind. It clarified it really well. It's called the Untethered Soul by Michael G. Berger, I believe.

Yeah.

I don't know if you've listened to it already.

I haven't, I haven't, no. You did tell me about it, though. Yeah.

I've listened to it a few. I had the audiobook. Listened to it a few times. It was just really. He explained it really well. So I've recommended that book to a lot of people because it was. Yeah, I think.

Yeah.

Like you said, it's a very hard thing to explain. I think the books that authors do that do are able to articulate it correctly. It's. It's funny because our mind's trying to like wrap.

Wrap your head around it, but it can't be perceived. Yeah, yeah. Which is what makes it so hard. Yeah, I would say because technically becoming that space is the death of the ego. That when you try and describe that to the mind, it's the mind trying to perceive its own non existence. It's why it's so hard to comprehend.

It's funny, I think I always just like to remind myself just to feel, think less, feel more.

Yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's right, man. I mean, stop all unnecessary thought. Yeah, I think we're not trying to stop all thought together. The mind is a very powerful, very powerful mechanism. But there's no need to think on top of on top of that. That's needless thinking. Or to put a story on top of. On top of the true factual information. Just understand the neutrality of the majority of the world.

Yeah, it's intuition as well. I think intuition is another word for that space because intuition is just your own internal guidance system that is free of thought really. And when you feel, when you enter the state of feeling your emotions throughout your day, it can actually be a really good guidance for where you need to go. I notice if you feel the fact that your emotional state is constantly unstable, it's constantly going from really excited to depressed to anxious to nervous. It's a sign that you're kind of identifying too much with your actual emotion. You identify too much with your physical identity. So you're caught up in the world too much. By feeling that more, you're actually able to a lot quicker to recenter if you're feeling and you're noticing that you're anxious. By bringing awareness and consciousness to that which is the essence of who you are, you center a lot quicker rather than being caught up in your head and trying to think your way out of being in a certain emotional state.

Yeah, that's exactly right.

So I think we've identified some of the main points we want people to realize as we go on this journey of our sharing our wisdom in this podcast. This is probably one of the essential understandings for people.

Yeah, I think, I mean, I think as we go, I'll give more applicable examples of how to actually apply that in like on a day to day basis. Yeah, it's all very easy to say it until you actually have to put into practice. But I think there's definitely, there's definitely ways to do it that'll really help.

Yeah, for sure. And then I'm looking forward to discussing them because, yeah, it's going to be. We practice what we preach. That's, that's the best part about it. I'm constantly learning every day. I'm constantly going through experiences that it teaches me.

Yeah, man. I, I, it's happened to me recently as well. Just, yeah, like, I think as, as I'm getting better at it, I think it's just more quickly bringing awareness to the situation. So you think that you see a thought going on. Yeah, I think as you grow spiritually, you become better at more quickly bringing awareness to it rather than letting that thought drag on forever. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's powerful. But you're right, you do. For me, meditation was something that's definitely improved my ability to do that. So meditation is, I recommend it to everyone. If you're not sure where to start, start meditating.

Yeah. Because I think it's almost a practice without realizing that it is.

Yeah.

People could just take it as sitting still and not trying not to think.

Yeah.

And if they get there, then it's a good side effect. Or you can do it if you really want to properly practice meditation. But either way, you kind of get to the same outcome, which I think is cool.

Yeah. There's lots of different ways to meditate these days, I think. Do you have, like, a preferred spot?

Yeah, yeah. Like, yeah, because I think a lot of people just think. Yeah, you have to just sit in a quiet place and not. And not think for a while.

Yeah.

And that's meditation by the mountain. I try to, I reckon, I reckon you can meditate five, six hours a day, man, just as you go. I think the ones we highlighted before especially. Yeah, meditation. Meditation on walking. Yeah, it's one of my favorite. Yeah. But then, man, you can, I mean, yeah, meditation on, on the surroundings around you. Meditation on nature is beautiful.

Yeah, that is.

Yeah. I mean, I, I go for a walk at lunchtime every day, working in the big Sydney cbd. Just stroll down to Hyde park, sit in the park, overlooking the water, mate. Trees everywhere. You can just feel the energy. Like, you can literally feel the energy around you and you just quiet in the mind and just breathe it in.

Yeah, that's beautiful. For me, ever since I've realized that you can kind of just sit somewhere and be silent and stillness. Extremely peaceful. I kind of. I used to like reading my book, but now I don't even feel the urge to want to read anything. I just want to, like, sit and. Yeah, like you said, and observe. Absorb the energy.

Yeah.

Like it's. It's interesting. Even on car rides now, I just like to. Anywhere where I like. You don't have to do anything or be anywhere. You can just be present. It's like there's no need to be on your phone or anything. People are constantly trying to escape, you know, waiting in line.

Yeah.

They're all little opportunities to just practice, present, you know.

Yeah, but I think that's the. I think that's the. That's the next question is why do people feel the need to fill that time? I think that that's something for another. Another chat. But that's. That. That's like. That then leads into how you can solve that. Once we've. Once we've kind of gone over that.

Yeah, well, I'm looking forward to it. I think. I think this is going to deliver a lot of value to people. Well, mate, we'll leave it there for now. Look forward to chatting again soon.

Yeah, mate, it'll be good. Yeah.

Alright, mate. Enjoy the rest of your night.

Yeah, you too, buddy. Catch you later.

There it is, guys. First episode of State Shifters podcast done and dusted. Thanks very much for tuning in. And if you'd like to know more, check me out on Instagram at State Shifters. Also on Twitter and Facebook. Otherwise you can check out the blog@state-shifters.com thanks again and we'll talk to you soon.