SSP 068: Jericho Bulaun - Exploring Your Identity

Yo, what's cracking, guys? Welcome back. Stay Shifters Podcast. My name is Jordan Kanlisch. Welcome to the show. If you're new here, on today's episode it's gonna be me talking about me. I was fortunate enough to be hosted by one of my clients and good friend Jericho Bullen, who brought me onto his podcast. And we had a really deep conversation sort of about the journey to date and mainly some of the really powerful insights, lessons, breakthroughs, realizations Jericho and I have shared along the journey, this journey of life that we're all on. Jericho is such an amazing guy and I've really enjoyed working alongside him over the last six months and I really encourage you to check him out online and his all his profiles we linked up in the show notes. Be sure to check that out. And he's got his own podcast as well called the Deep show. So I would suggest checking that out too. But yeah, this is awesome conversation. I just wanted to share it with you guys too. Just mainly gonna be mostly me talking about the journey I've been on to date. But Jericho shares some really powerful insights too. And as always, if anything resonates, don't hesitate to reach out to me. If you want to continue the conversation, you know where to find me. Instagram, State Shifters. Send me a DM or drop me an email. Jordanstateshifters.com Enjoy this one, guys.

Welcome to the State Shifters podcast, a show dedicated to helping you discover your true potential through connecting the mind, body and soul. So first of all, welcome to the show. Drawing Candlish. I'm super excited for this by the way. I feel like, I feel like it's been something that has been wanting to happen for a long time. I'm excited to have you here. So just for everyone that is listening, do you want to give an introduction to yourself?

Yeah. Thanks Jericho for having me on, man. I'm really excited to kind of. We've had so many conversations over the last six months, but I'm excited to have one recorded. Yeah, man. I would say like, I would call myself like a transformation coach, mindset coach, you know, you know, however you want to define, like deep coaching. And I've been, I've been in this space for a full time coach for the last 10 months. And you know, my past life was I was an accountant, a corporate tax accountant. So I've been through a big life transition. But as I'm sure we'll explore. But yeah, I would say right now I'm a transformation coach. I work mainly one on one with people really helping them just to reprogram some of the deep rooted beliefs that we carry around to really align them with their purpose so they can live the life that they want, essentially.

Yeah. Amazing. And like you say, we've been having a lot of conversations over the last six months and it's amazing to see how your journey has been from this side.

Right.

Like working together. I've seen it personally, so it's amazing to see. And so the theme for this kind of season that we're exploring is identity. And the reason why I feel like you would be a great fit for this conversation and you would have some great insights to share is because this is the kind of work that you do. You deal with people's identities. You deal with the shifting and the reshaping and the reframing of people's identities all the time. And so I thought it'd be really interesting to see anything that you could share around how we identify as people, whether it's, you know, someone's race, religion, job, financial status, you know, social status, all these types of things which we will explore, of course, with other guests in the season as well. But this is what I feel like your kind of value and your insight will be.

Yeah, for sure. And I guess that comes from my own identity crisis and identity shift that happened in my journey, you know, and that's when I realized that it was it's our identity or personality that's shaping our reality. Like Joe Dispenza says, your personality becomes your personal reality. So your identity is just who you show up in the world. And your identity is the exact indicator of what you believe internally. So if you're not happy with your identity or your personality, if you had things you don't like, then there's an opportunity there to look at parts of yourself that maybe you're trying to hide from or trying to avoid. So for me, whenever it comes to like shifting identity, I just look at what it is that I want to create for myself on an external level and then look at who has the identity or who's someone that I can model, that is living the life that I want to live, so that I can basically just insert the programming that will allow me to get to that point, level up my internal state, and that's the fastest way to do it. But most people get stuck on the part where they're too afraid to look at the parts of themselves that may be getting in the way. For example, if you're, you know, if you want to move into a business of, you know, say, coaching or speaking or creating content and sharing that with an audience, then your identity is going to have to be someone who's expressive, someone who speaks your truth, someone who's vulnerable. And if you're an accountant like me in a past life, your identity was playing small. Hiding, hiding behind a computer, afraid of what people would think about me. So there was an element of discomfort that was required to shift my identity. And that's where I feel people get stuck. They're not willing to get uncomfortable. And I guess that's sort of part of my process is I help people move through those, I don't know, uncomfortable emotions that are down there that are connected to our past so that they can shape a new identity, essentially.

Yeah, I think that's really important. You made it. You made an important point about this kind of, we build a world for ourselves where our beliefs about who we are, it fits in.

Right?

And those two things always seem to match. So if we think about ourselves and then we create a world, we create an experience for ourselves that match, that matches that story of who we are. And like you said, when you were an accountant, you had a belief of who you were. You weren't kind of empowered. You were hiding behind the computer. You were doing all these things, and that was your experience of life. And then when you. When you shifted that identity to something else, everything started to change. And when you were speaking, the kind of. The idea that Eckhart Tolle presents about the identification with thought is like the ego's doing, right? And your. And your ego is always trying to pull you back into something safe, into something secure, into something that you know, something that you're comfortable with, and it stops you from growing past itself. Because the ego wants to be real. The ego wants to live forever, right? And so when we go through this process of shifting, of transforming, it's the ego thinking, the ego thought that we're trying to reshape. And as soon as we can do that, then it starts to reshape our external experience. And I thought that was a really valuable kind of definition of identity is the identity with the thinking.

Right.

And in your experience, what was the biggest shift in your thinking that created the shift externally? So maybe, maybe we can go back to, like, you. You've already mentioned you were an accountant before. And what was your experience of shifting the way that you thought? Because did you have anyone to kind of facilitate that for you, or was it really a process where you had to do it yourself?

Yeah, initially it was myself really like, you know, when I realized that, you know, I had created this life, like taking full responsibility for, for the life that I'd created and like, man, but you know, we're so fortunate. And I've said this to you before, like I'm, I truly believe I hate the genetic lottery out here. You know, I mean that some of the challenges that I face, you know, like first world problems, being an accountant and not being happy with your life, that's, that's for a lot of people right now that would give you anything to have to be honest. So I just want to make alliterate on that fact that, you know, I was very blessed to be from Perth and I was given such like, great opportunities in life to have an education and to be in a position where I had a job at some of the best, the best firm in the world, to be honest, in accounting. So, you know, I believe what the shift in thinking that came through me was that I realized that it wasn't my highest calling and it was that understanding that I had more to give. And I actually felt like I was being a disservice to this genetic glory that I had won. If I was to stay in accounting and place more, that's. That's all it was. I truly believe that I was taking the safe route. I was playing the comfort zone, staying my, my 9 to 5 job, move my way up the ladder, become partner and my comfortable salary and, you know, live my comfortable life out here in Perth. Cool. And I just thought, man, I can't, I can't settle for that. You know, if I've been blessed in this incarnation to have the opportunities that are available to me, I want to like, fulfill on this, this mission that my soul came here to do, which is to evolve, which is to move beyond all the limitations that are keeping me cut off from who I am meant to be. So that shift in my thinking came from that just this yearning that I was just settling. And the shift in thinking came in when I was like, okay, I know I've got more to give, but I don't know what that looks like right now. I don't know how that's going to materialize, but I know I've got more to give. So it was just a matter of seeking and finding the information because I believe knowledge is the precursor, seeking the right knowledge that ultimately was leading me back inside. So I was reading all the books, listening to the podcast, but I got to a point where I realized it was all directing me back inward. And once I was able to silence my mind and connect with a deeper part of myself. Then the guidance became clear and that, and that was really the process. And I've been following that guidance ever since.

Yeah, yeah. That's amazing. And I think again, another super important point is this whole idea of the, the inner identity, or should I say the inner kind of consciousness, the inner awareness.

Right.

Because what happens most of the time is we, we tend to identify with all the external things. And this is exactly why I wanted to explore this whole topic in the first place, is because when you identify with those external things, the more you separate yourself from who you actually are.

Right.

If you make an identification to. Okay, let's say just to keep yourself as an example, if you don't mind, let's just say. All right, you climbed up the ladder like you said, you started as a junior accountant, is that correct?

Yeah.

Right.

You started as a graduation and then you got a full time role and then you move up the ladder.

Right.

You would start to form an identity of, oh, this is now who I am because I'm, I'm a full time guy now. I've got, I've got this job title. This is now who I am. And what happens most of the time is that people separate themselves so far from who they are that they have no choice but to identify with that. They've got no choice because they're kind of in too deep. You know, they're so far in this job that they don't have a choice now but to identify with it. And the point that you made about everything was directing you inwards. I think it's so important because we have this inner identity also, which is the one that we should be getting in touch with. Not the one that's external, not the job, not the money, not the, whatever else you think you're going to get from external identity. It's not the one that you need for your development, growth and eventual evolution.

Right?

Yeah.

What would you say is the kind of. Not definition, but what would you say your experience with this inner identity is? This inner awareness.

Yeah. You made a really good point about people going too deep and being too attached to their identity as their role as like the partner, this, the CEO. And what's happening right now is that a lot of these old identities are being stripped away from people and they're going through this massive awakening or identity crisis or death, ego death. I just want to allude to that fact because there probably are maybe a lot of people who know someone going through this or are going through this themselves and they're actually hold the seeds of a larger purpose that's about to be born as more people start to discover this real identity or the real essence of who they are, which is what you know, I went through and you've gone through and it's really, I've seen feel like our purpose, it's our primary purpose in life. And Eckhart talks about this, our primary purpose which is to awaken to who we really are. You know, the true, the true essence of our being which is beyond the ego identity. It's a like deeper truth and that it's like, you know, as soon as I use. As soon as we use language, we're kind of missing the point because it's something that can't be defined by language but can be felt intuitively in the body as like a feeling and energy. And once you taste it, which I had, I would say my first taste of it probably came through yoga. Yoga was my entry point into this, into this realm, into this dimension of being. And once I tasted it, man, it was like, fuck, it just, it was, it was just clarity, it was peace, it was, it was understanding, it was love. And, and the minute you taste it, it's like you realize that's. That's the purpose of life is to connect with that and just follow that feeling. So now, I mean that's the best way I can describe it. And whatever entry point you use, you know, the destination is the same. So I think it depends on the person. But you know, some people use plant medicine as their entry point and that's very common right now. But I went the kind of the traditionalist route, you know, yoga, meditation and really going deep with those practices. And it's only been recently that I've ventured into the plant medicine world where it's a whole nother conversation.

Do you want to talk about that? I mean, I know we've had a conversation about it before and I think the insights that you shared were so powerful around what happened to you personally when you went on this journey.

Right.

Because we talk about the external identity and we've spoken about the internal identity, but what happens when you go on a journey like that when you take these plant medicines, when you really get connected to the source?

Right.

This is essentially what these plant medicines are a gateway to. Yeah. Do you want, do you want to just explain or like kind of share a bit about that journey and what happened to your idea of your inner identity?

Yeah, it was a profound journey. That's for sure. I'm still feeling the like effects of it. It was only recent, like three weeks ago that I did the 5 MeO DMT, 5 methyoxalate DMT, which is like referred to as the, I believe it is the most potent psychedelic you can take. And now that I've done it, I can definitely attest to that. And it was like to me sort of what all my practices and all my spiritual like pursuits I feel like were preparing me for this moment. And it's where I got to experience firsthand what plants or Mother Nature or you know, Gaia I believe has given us access to. But I actually believe that to really get the benefits from it, you got to have a deep practice that is traditional, which is you doing your own like meditate, doing your own form of training or mental training to get beyond the mind to reach a deep state already. So that when you go into these plant medicine journeys then they're not like you're not relying on it, you're like, it's not your first journey into these kind of depths, these kind of depths. So because I had prepared for it or tried to prepare for it as best as I possibly could, I feel like I was able to kind of extract, you know, really deep lessons from it. One of them was just this illusion of control that I, that my mind tends to have is this illusion of control. And I feel like, and as I still put the pieces together around what I experienced in my journey was that the first I sat with the medicine three times. The first time that I sat with it, it's almost like it showed me the first layer that I had to move through, which for me was a lot of suppressed anger. My first sitting with it was like they caught it on film and it was like a visceral expression of anger leaving my body. Like I was shouting, yelling and this like just something came out of me and I don't remember too much from it, but that was the first layer. And then the second time I sat with the medicine and because you've done inner work before, you know there's layers, like underneath the anger there's often sadness, there's this, there's fear, there's shame. And as you keep peeling back the layers, you eventually get closer and closer to the source. So my anger came out in the first one and then the second, the second sitting was me being presented with these deep rooted fears. And these fears were masked by my mind trying to control the world and really control things so that I didn't have to feel These deeper fears. And I remember being in the depths of this experience, which is only like 8 to 10 minutes long, it's not a very long trip. But being deep in this experience, my mind just being like fully just like decompos metal mentalized, I think that's a word. But like, just like being pulled apart. Yeah, just being pulled apart. Like deconstructed. Like my mind's just being pulled apart. And the last piece that was like trying to be pulled away was this part of my ego that was like, oh no, we got to control this experience. We can't let go. We can't let go. We've got to, we've got to maintain control. And it was that last part of my ego that like just, I came face to face with because you can't control, you know, we don't have control of anything. And that was like the ultimate fear that, that I was presented with was this complete surrender of control that up until this whole point in my life that I'd been subtly trying to control things. You know, very subtly. It's down there. There's a subtle part of the mind that's just trying to control things. And I got faced with that deep rooted fear and it was very traumatizing. I'm not gonna sit here and say this was like fun, fun and games and rainbows and butterflies. It was fucking scary. And I remember just like being in that fear thinking, holy shit, I'm. I couldn't, I've messed myself up. I can't make sense of the world. What have I done? You know, I'm just useless now. And we're sort of within that last grasp, effort of my mind to maintain reality. Something was, was surrendered, something got let go and I sort of experienced like a rebirth. I just like woke up and had, you know, you know, this, this feeling of just bliss. I don't know, it was just this feeling of love. And it's something I hadn't felt before. It was like a feeling that I hadn't experienced before that I was always being blocked from feeling because of this, this, this fear that was down there that I was afraid to face. And once, once that fear broke away, it was like a massive shift in energy. And yeah, something just like really opened up inside of me. And I just feel like since then life has just been moving through me in a really like, really potent and powerful way. That's my only way of describing it. And I'm not going to say this, these type of experiences for everyone, but for me it was like it was the next step in my journey. And I've been integrating and embodying that shift since. Since then.

Yeah, that's. First of all, thanks for sharing that so openly. I really appreciate it. And you know, I wanted to pick up on something you said about your fear of not just the fear of letting go, but this piece of you that wanted to hold on, this piece of you that wanted to control everything.

Right.

Because I think that itself is the key to everyone else's need for an external identity. It's this thing that we need to control how we are perceived. We need to control how people experience us. We need to control how we act and where we show up and how we show up.

Right.

We need to control all of these things. What I got from that story was that when you fully surrendered not just to the experience you were having in the moment, but to who you were, and you saw your ego letting go, then life was moving through you more effortlessly. And I think that is the biggest shift that anyone can experience.

Right.

And the work that we do as coaches is to help people make those small shifts, the small shifts that are going to really compound to something big. And I guess that might be a good kind of segue to go into the work that you do as a coach now.

Right.

The transformations that you facilitate for people. What are the most common identity traits or identities like stories that you hear most often?

Yeah. Well said about the letting go of that illusion of control. That is. That is a big one. I actually didn't realize it was the biggest one until I faced it. So, yeah, I agree and resonate in terms of the stories I recently have been noticing. One of the main stories that have been coming up in the conversation I've been having is this story or fear around what people are going to judgment, essentially this identity that, you know, if someone doesn't approve of what I do, I'm less of a person. Or if someone doesn't approve of my path, I'm going to be not worthy of receiving love. So it's this fear of being judged. And underneath this fear of being judged is a fear of unworthiness. And like to me that that is the ultimate limiting identity that, that we often carry around that I've moved through on my journey that, you know, it was. Was a big level up for me was letting go of that belief that I'm not enough, that I have something to prove. And man, I can't tell you how many times I've told people over the last week that there is nothing to prove. You are nothing to prove. Like, how freeing is that? Yeah, you're nothing to prove. Yeah, we're all out here trying to prove something to the world. Me, like, me included. For so long, I was trying to prove to the world that I can do this, that I can be a coach, that I can make money, that I'm good enough to receive love. And the minute you, like, go in and just, like, let go of, like, all the things you were holding on to that were blocking you from accessing that deep love and significance that we're truly chasing, you realize that you don't have to prove anything to anyone. And in that, become free. And you just. You don't care about getting judged. You show up on Instagram, you show up on Facebook, you start your business, you leave your job, you. Because you don't care. You're like, fuck up. That's good. If I fail, cool, so what? Another opportunity to love myself even more deeply. So, yeah, it's that. It's that identity of, like, yeah, I'm not worthy, I'm not good enough, people might judge me, is really keeping people stuck, I guess, and powerless.

Yeah. And I mean, first of all, I think that was really well said, and I think you've kind of hit the nail on the head with what the most common identity is. And through your experience of working with that type of person or working with that identity, the most. What's the most effective kind of shift that we can start to make?

Right.

On a kind of practical level, on a physical level, what is. What is the shift that we can make from someone who believes and identifies with being unworthy? Because most of the time.

Right.

Most of the time, that belief and identity has been something that you've been carrying since childhood.

Yeah.

Right.

You've learned it from when you were a child, and you've carried it in different forms and experienced it through different ways throughout your whole life. And what is the one thing? If there is one thing, what is the one thing that could just start to shift someone out of that belief into something that is more kind of serving to them?

Yeah. Yeah. The notion that the belief is just tied to an emotion. And to rewire the belief, you just have to match it with a new emotion. And sometimes it helps to go back and look at, okay, where did I first learn this belief? Or when did I first feel this limiting emotion that's tied to this belief? And going back and reprocessing some of the emotional pain that's tied to that past event? Or it's just A matter of consciously visualizing how you want to feel when you manifest your new reality in that new identity and just repeating and anchoring in those new emotions. I feel I'm powerful, I'm confident, I'm expressive. And seeing yourself in that state and showing up in that way and just literally reprogramming your nervous system just to overwrite any of the old emotional, you know, blockages that are down there creates this internal shift. And that's Joe Dispenser's work, which is the over. The visualizer, the meditation to override old programming. But. And then I also work with. I also work with the kind of the inner child stuff, which is going back and integrating wounds from. From the past. So there's the two or two ways to go about it. But I feel understanding that it starts in. It's in. Starts in your subconscious. It's rewiring that subconscious programming to do that. You kind of got to silence your mind, get into your emotional body and just start planting seeds.

Yeah, I really like that. And something that you've spoken about before is this whole idea that when we have. When we've built this identity, when we have a story about ourselves, we tend to get pulled into doing, right? What does. And again, let's go back to the example of an accountant, right? Who is an accountant? What does an accountant do? Okay, so if I'm now going to identify as an accountant, this is what I have to do. And I have to do all these things. And you have a list for yourself of what you have to do. And what you pointed out there was when you try to match this new or when you try to match to something new, you have to match the emotion, right? You match the emotion of what that person or the thing that you would like to try and embody. How does that feel? And I think the important thing that you've said to me a lot is how can we move from the doing to the being, right? How do we. How do we start to be something new rather than just trying to do it? Because the more you step into doing, it's just doing another thing. And you're doing another set of tasks to make you. To make you another identity. But when we can strip all of those things away and sit behind that in the being, that is where. That is where you will kind of receive everything that is right for who you are.

Right?

Yeah. Well said. It's like the quote, you know, we don't attract what we want. We tracked who we are. And when you shift your being and that's when the. When the things around you start to change because you've changed. I think a lot of people are trying to change the things around them to try and change who they are. It's the other. It's the other way around. And that's. And that's a great. That's a great realization because you realize that nothing actually needs that. Your job doesn't need to change. You don't need to travel to find yourself. You can find yourself right now on the inside. So. Yeah, well said. That's a good point.

Yeah, I like that as well. I like the idea that you don't have to travel to find yourself. You can sit in your own bedroom and find yourself in exactly the same way, because it's a feeling that you're chasing. It's not an external thing. And more often than not, I'm not going to sit here and say that I haven't traveled to try and do that, because I definitely have. But it's a realization of what I was looking for was a feeling. What I was looking for was this feeling of freedom that I don't have to be the old guy who lives in England and who does this. I can be anywhere because I'm traveling and I can be who I am.

Right.

That was the feeling that I was chasing. And when you learn how to cultivate that feeling in your own bedroom, then you're free forever. Like, there's nothing that can. There's nothing that can box you into an identity that you have to conform to. It's a feeling that you can create for yourself whenever you want. And a practice I know that I've been doing recently is how can I be creating that feeling not just in a meditation, but when I'm driving, for example, or when I'm walking in a park, for example. How can I create that all the time so that then I always feel free rather than. I'm only going to feel free in a certain situation. I'm only going to feel free with certain conditions, which is what you said.

Right.

We try to change the things around us so that it changes how we feel on the inside.

Yeah.

But when you can create it on the inside first, everything else starts to change. And you could be physically in the same place, you could be physically in the same situation, but your whole outlook will change. And that's what's. That's what really starts to shift people.

So true. Yeah. And that's. And that's beautifully freeing because then all of a sudden, life becomes this game around okay, how can I look at what's getting in my way of me feeling that? And then using those little, like, triggers as guidance to integrate more things from your past that are getting in the way. So all of a sudden, your present moment gives you everything you need to evolve until you get a point in the journey, like you're starting to realize where you max out the level you're on. And the next, there's a next logical step to take or next intuitive step to take, where spirit is pulling you into the next step, the next chapter. But the key, or the next key won't reveal itself until you've learned all the lessons you need to learn on this level you're on. So that was my big takeaway from my corporate job, was like, you know, I was there for 16 months, almost two years, and, you know, had I had a left right away, I would have missed out on a lot of really important lessons that life trying to teach me. So, yeah, I definitely feel is max out the level you're on before looking to make any massive external life changes, you know?

Yeah, I like that. I like that. That's something that you talk about quite a lot as well. And it really. It really does resonate because like you say, when you start to look at life as a game, it opens your thinking up to how to approach things a lot differently. It's not something that you just are living in, but there are actions that you can take to play that game. And when you can identify for yourself what are the actions you can take to get to the next level, it just becomes exactly that. It's a game that you can play with yourself to reach the next level that you've identified for yourself. And I think that's important as well, is to say that not everyone's game is the same. Everyone's. Everyone's game of life is completely different. And when you live your life trying to play someone else's game, that's when. That's when your identity and your ego is winning because you're in someone else's game. You're not in your own game. You're not playing your own game, you know?

So true, man. I love that. Play your own game. Fuck a hundred percent. And, like, your own game has its own rules. So. And you get to create the rules.

Yeah, like, fuck.

Like. And for me, one of the most important rules that I created was, what does success mean to me? Like what? Like, what's. What's your definition of success? And I realized I was living out in someone else's definition of success When I had my accounting job. Success is you get a title, you make money, you have a corporate job, you wear a suit every day. Like, fuck that. I got that. I was like, no, this ain't success to me. You know? And that's why I rewrote my definition of success and chose to make success about how I feel. If I'm happy, if I'm fulfilled, if I'm having fun. To me, that's successful. And I don't care how much money you're making, if you're not having fun and enjoying your life, you're not a success in my eyes.

Yeah, no, definitely. So something came up when you were. When you were talking about. Well, we've been talking about identity for, you know, we've discussed the external, the internal, and the most common one.

Right.

How would someone identify for themselves what they've been identifying with? If that makes sense. So for someone who is stepping into this kind of. Or maybe someone who's hearing this conversation and they've got no clue what we're on about, they don't really understand that, oh, well, I'm not identifying with my job. I'm not identifying with this. I'm not identifying with that. Like, what would you say is important to. Not to do, but to kind of bring about in your own experience to pull out the things that you're identifying with. Because I feel like more often than not, we always identify with something, and it's just the level of attachment that we have to that.

Right.

It's something that we all work on all the time, even as coaches who have taken this journey and are maybe further on than some others. What would you say is the key thing that helps people identify what they're identifying with?

Yeah, I would take stock of everything in your life that you feel like you need or gives you a sense of, like, for example, if you were to think about, like, a prized possession, something that you really like, maybe it's your favorite watch, maybe it's your guitar, maybe it's your PlayStation. What would happen if you go out, went outside tomorrow and just gave that away to someone? So here you go and give this to a homeless person.

Yeah.

And if you have identified as to someone, I'm like, you know, I'm the guy that I'm the musician, and I need my guitar to make me feel like I'm someone. And you go to give your guitar away and you feel like no one, then you're probably identified. You're attached to your identity, and that's A good indicator is like, what are the things that you cling on to in your life that, you know, if you imagine giving them away, you would. You would. You would feel a sense of loss. You would feel a sense of, like, a death. And Wayne Dyer was one of my first spiritual teachers who I really admired and looked up to. And he gave all his shit away, sold everything, gave it all away. And I had a really close mentor of mine in Toronto, Bob Berman, who was the founder of Soul7, the healing studio where I was working out of. He did the same thing. And I was around. I was with him. You know, I saw him the next day after he did it, just started selling all these things, had a massive house, big mansion in Toronto, all these. This beautiful stuff. He just started giving it all away. He just realized it didn't mean anything. And I remember speaking to him and he said, it's one of the most liberating things he ever did. He felt so light. He said it was the most amazing spiritual practice he's ever done. So, yeah, I won't forget that. But, yeah, I would say, look at what you're holding. Yeah, we'll look at what you have, and if there's something you cling to, chances are you're attached to it.

Yeah, that's amazing. That's amazing. Yeah, I think that's. I think that's super powerful. And even now I'm thinking, looking around this room like, oh, if I was to give that away, how would I feel? But, yeah, I think. I think that's so right. I think that's so right. And I think, you know, the more we can get comfortable with the idea, like, we don't actually have to go and do it, but it's the. It's when you address the feeling that comes up when you even think about it, that's when you get to go to the next level. Like, that's when you can say, okay, cool. I've identified, like you said, I've identified with my guitar. I could never give it away. Otherwise I wouldn't be a musician anymore. I wouldn't be worth anything as a musician. Like, what would people think? Like, how would I look? What would I. What would I even play? Do you know? I mean, like, when you can be comfortable with that, then you can say, okay, I've identified maybe, and attached too heavily to this idea of being a musician. But being a musician is just a label. And who I am is a creator, right? I create things, and it just so happens to come out the best. In the form of music. And so the, the external tool, the external thing doesn't have any bearing on who the creator is. It doesn't have any bearing on who you are on the inside. And I think that's, that's an amazing exercise and an amazing, even just a thought exercise because I'm not expecting everyone to go out and give their stuff away tomorrow, but just as a thought exercise, you know, just to think, what is the way you said it was to take stock of things that you find really valuable to you, to yourself, Right. And then if you imagined yourself giving them away, what would you, what would you feel? I think that's a. I think that's a great way to identify what your external identity is and see if you can move past it or the bit.

The big one there is money.

Yeah.

So many people are identified by their worth, is identified with how much money they have. So if you think about what's required to give away a large chunk of money. Yeah. That is a complete detachment or disidentification with money. Defining, Elliot, Any element of what you're worth to society. If you go, I'm so topped up on self, love and abundance that, you know, have, have some money, give, give money to the homeless, give money to a friend, pay for your family's dinner. Like that to me is like an embodiment of it. Because most people, I fuck, I kind of can't even afford to pay my rent. I'm gonna give a homeless man 20 bucks. And I remember like thinking that in Toronto, like, fuck, this is. There's homeless people over the streets. And I was like, fuck, I want to give them money, but I can't afford it. But no, if I can't afford five bucks to give to a homeless person, there's some part of me that's latching onto this belief that I don't have enough.

So you know what the other interest inside of that was? We had a conversation a long time ago around giving to yourself first.

Right.

Some people don't even think they're there, worthy enough to give themselves something nice. And I had a conversation a long time ago with someone who said that they used to go grocery shopping or they would go grocery shopping with their, with their partner and they would see this $6 bread that they really wanted to try, but they would just go for the $2 one because this one's $4 too much. And you know, and so when you don't even see yourself as worthy enough to spend on yourself, not even from a practical point of View, like, if your budget was only $2 bread, then go and get the $2 bread. But if you've got it and you don't see yourself as worthy enough to experience it, that in itself is one of the triggers and the kind of cycles that you can keep yourself in is, I'm not going to go to the next level because I'm not allowing myself to experience what that feels like. And so the other side of it is when you can start to look at yourself as someone who's worthy. Not just the fact that having money makes you worthy, but receiving and giving to yourself makes you or you're worthy enough to give and receive to yourself. Does that make sense?

Yeah, definitely. It's like that level of worthiness that warrants investments back in yourself. And you know that because most people, like, oh, I can't afford to eat healthy, I can't afford to have a coach, can't afford to go do yoga during the week. Like, like, what's that saying to the universe about how much you value yourself? Like, it's not, it's, you know what I mean? There's like, energetically, you're just like, you're stuck in scarcity. And dude, I, I remember how much I was earning when I was living in Toronto, making minimum wage, you know, 14 bucks an hour it is in Canada. And I valued my health so highly that I would still shop at organic supermarkets. I would go to the organic supermarket and spend my fucking, you know, eight bucks on a, on a, like, on organic coconut milk or whatever, you know, like, and there's no, like, there was not that paid itself forward. It was an investment in my energy, investment in gratitude. So, yeah, investments in yourself come back to how much you value and feel like you are worth how much you value yourself. So, yeah, good, good, good point.

How would you, how would you say to someone who says, okay, look, on the inside, I feel worthy on the inside, I feel like I'm experiencing the kind of, the things I want to experience, whether it is with money, whether it is investing in myself, allowing myself to experience the $8 milk and the $6 bread. But practically and physically, there are times when that money just doesn't exist. Like, I feel like one of the biggest objections to not just coaching work, but to anything that is going to help someone and to serve someone, whether it's a course they want to take, whether they want to go back to study where they want to do a course or something like this. The biggest objection is, I don't have that right now. And even though I feel like I'm ready, even though I feel like I'm worthy, even though I feel like on the inside, I'm ready to receive that practically, it doesn't exist because there is a story there that is still limiting them. And what would you say to someone or how would you kind of navigate that story and help them identify that they're separating? First of all, this is the way I see it, is that they're separating the feeling but not letting it actually. They're not actually experiencing it. Does that make sense? So they're looking at their practical situation, they're looking at their physical situation and still using it as a limit to who they are, rather than saying, I am worth it, I am worth it. So I'm going to find a way.

Right?

There's a big difference there. What would you say to someone who's saying and thinking and feeling that way?

Yeah, that's a good one to bring up because that's a common identification with these limiting stories that we carry around, around why we're not. We don't have enough time, money, experience, you know, insert that. I don't have enough. Whatever, whatever it is that we, we believe. And, you know, it's, I guess, like you said, stepping back enough to see. And sometimes, like, we can't. We can. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make a drink. And, you know, like, some people are just. They're not ready to take that leap yet. Whereas some people hit a point in their journey with a, I'm fucking done with this. This level that I'm on, like, I'm ready for the next level of growth. And that next level of growth requires courage, it requires faith and requires trust. And, you know, it's. It's as, I guess, as a coach, it's about helping someone see that you're helping them. You're taking a stand for what's possible for them. Because as a coach, you've made big decisions like that in the past. You know what happens. You know that you always looked after. You know you're about to level up and the next level of abundance will come. But in that moment when you're, when you don't know, your mind is seeing what you're gonna lose and it's not able to see what you can gain. So I take a stand for what's possible. I'd be like, look, you know, fuck, this is. This is scary. Like, we acknowledge that it's a valid. That's the valid emotion. This is scary. As shit to move beyond an old story because all of a sudden you're in the unknown. But in the unknown is the space where all the magic happens. Like in the unknown, you're in an area where you know life can now create through you because you're not clinging to an old past story that's keeping you stuck on an old vibration. So when it comes to money, when you step into the unknown, all of a sudden, you're now placed where you're available to receive abundance in a way in which you couldn't before because you're blocking it through the story. So whether you know there's two ways to go about that, it's either you, you, you take the leap, meaning you whip out your money and you just pay for the next step in your growth. And you trust that the universe will provide for you. And I've done that. That's the path I've taken. It's not for everyone, it's scary shit. But in my experience, I've always been looked after. The other avenue is, okay, I don't have the money right now, but I know this is the next step in my journey. So I'm going to find a way to manifest that money. And if you put a gun to someone's head and say, hey, you've got two days to manifest fucking five grand, like you'll find the money. It depends how bad you want it, you know, so two ways, like we live in a world with credit cards and whatnot. So if you got access to a credit card, man, that's what I use credit cards for. Scary investments in my own growth. That. Yeah, yeah.

Do you know what? Like something that I picked up on that I think is really important with two of the experiences that you've spoken about in this conversation, there was something important that clicked for you that said I need to let go of my desire to control. Just like in the, in the DMT experience, there was one last part of your ego that really wanted to control the experience. And when you let go, everything came through. Like you said, life was moving through you effortlessly. And in exactly the same way when we're talking about our external identity, whether it's an identity with money, an identity with a job, whatever it is, when you let go of the desire to control, then everything starts to happen. And the thread that ties those two things together is they're both scary. They're both scary as shit. Like you, it's scary to go into a place where you have no idea what's going to happen because like you said, we want to control it. We want to control how we go about our business. We want to control how we experience life. And it's scary to not know. But like you said, it's in the letting go and allowing yourself to kind of move past this level of fear that you're experiencing. It's in that, through that action that everything starts to move through you and move towards you and you. You attract everything that you need at the moment. And I think. I think that was a nice little kind of circle back because you mentioned it earlier about letting go and that it was scary. And then again, in this identity that we're dealing with, with everyone's identity, it's not just noticing the identity that you've created for yourself, but the moving past the fear that I don't know what's going to happen when I let go of this identity. I don't know what's going to happen when I give away that guitar. You know, I don't know what's going to happen when I do that. And I think that's beautiful. I think the act of releasing an identity and stepping into something that you don't know brings you a sense in a weird way of calm, right? Like once you've made the step, it's like, okay, I'm in the unknown now, and so there's nowhere to go and there's nothing to do, right? We say this all the time. Now that you're in the unknown, I don't know what's here, so how can I go anywhere? How can I do anything? And it's in that being. Being in the unknown is what's going to bring you everything that you. That you think you want and that you. That you think you need and that you think you, you know. And it sounds like it's a contradiction, but we can't control that, right? We can't control that experience. But yeah, I thought that was really beautiful. I thought it was really beautiful.

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. And I resonate with what you just said. Just around, like, once you're in that space of the unknown, it's like all your survival patterns will want to kick in and really regain that sense of control. And that's why the space of the unknown is where the most growth happens. Because all those patterns or all those safety mechanisms that were down there that were just being covered up by this external comfort that you were creating for yourself once you break out of the box and all of a sudden you're in the deep end trying to swim, you Know, you've got all those, like, piranhas trying to pull you down, which are all these, like, old patterns of thinking that like, says, oh, procrastination, perfectionism, self sabotage. I'm just gonna overeat. I'm getting on social media. Distract. It's like all these things will come to the surface that will try and pull you back down into your old pattern. And that's when it's like, okay, let's learn how to swim. Let's learn how to navigate the deep waters of the unknown and swim the depths. And it's in the depths where you, you find the best fish, mate. You find the. You find the best things.

Yeah.

Out in the deep end. And that's, that's where I, like, I just reckon that's what life's about. Yeah. You know, play on the edge.

You know, it's funny, it's funny. I saw something online the other day that was saying we only know 5% of what's in the water. In the seas and our oceans and everything else, we only know 5%. So we can only identify, you know, sharks, dolphins, the type of fish that we know, the whales. Like, of all the species that we know, we only know 5%.

Right.

And it just reminded me of what you were saying just then. Like, when you dive deeper into the deeper waters, the deeper part of the oceans, you're going to experience 95% of things that you weren't even aware of before. And I think that was a funny and a nice kind of metaphor to use. Like, you're living in 5% right now with this identity that you've created for yourself. You're living in 5%. And as soon as you step into. Into, step out of that identity and into something that you don't know, you're. You are allowing yourself to experience the rest of the 95%. And it will be scary because you don't know what's there. You don't know what kind of fish are. You know, that, that, that glow fish with the thing that comes out of his head. Like, you don't. You don't know what's there.

Yeah.

But would you rather live a whole life of 5% or do you want to access the rest of it? You know? So, yeah, I thought that was a nice, A nice little link. But, yeah. So, first of all, this has been an amazing conversation. Thank you for your time spent here to share with us your insights on how we, as people identify with different things and your insights around the work that you do and the journeys that you've taken so far. So where can people find you and. And work with you and all the other good stuff? Like, if you, if you want to share that with people.

Yeah, for sure, man. And thanks so much for having me on here. This has been super fun and pleasure. And I guess if you want to, like, continue the conversation or they, like, want to, you know, follow me on social media, it's dateshifters and that's S T A T E Shifters on Instagram or just send me an email. Jordantateshifters.com I love, like just connecting and having these kinds of conversations. So yeah, man, they're my main platforms. So yeah. And thanks again for hosting this. This container, man. This is such an awesome opportunity and podcasting, such a great way to share these nuggets of wisdom. You know, it's in the deeper conversations that we have where, like just so much magic comes through. So I really enjoy our conversations and you just hold such a great space for them. So, yeah, man, thanks again. I appreciate it.

Thank you. It's been a pleasure. So, guys, if you would like to speak to Jordan and indulge yourself in his wisdom and his company, then please do reach out. He's an amazing. He's an amazing man and he will facilitate for you something amazing and the podcast as well.

I forgot to mention my podcast, State Shifters podcast. And yeah, man, I've been having a good bunch of guests come through and I'm going to get you on there as well in the coming weeks. So stage for sure. But yeah, yeah, podcast is. I'm active on there too.

Yeah, awesome. And I'll put. I'll put all the links and stuff in the little description thingy. But listen, thanks again. And that was it for the Deep show for today. I will speak to you next time.

Hey, there we have it, guys. Thanks so much for listening to this episode. And yeah, look, if you made it this far, cool. Here's my voice again in Yuria and I'm going to make one more request for you is go ahead and subscribe and leave a comment on the podcast page because I'm really putting a lot of focus and attention on getting this podcast out to more people because I know what I'm putting in here can serve and bring value to people and it would mean a lot if you got value from this to leave some feedback and subscribe. So you stay up to date with what's coming up and as always, follow me on Instagram and love hearing from you. It's eight shifters until the next episode. Guys, thank you so much, and I appreciate you.