488. WIN BIG in biz and life with these communication tips - with Chalene Johnson

Hi, everyone. I'm so happy you've tuned into the show. Whether you have listened before or you're brand new, I'm so grateful for you. You have no idea. And this episode is brought to you by my Become Aligned course. And podcasts are amazing. And I know that you know that because you guys all listen to them, and I do, too. And sometimes they are not necessarily enough because while we're listening, sometimes we're passively listening and we're not actively listening. So the reason that Chris and I. Chris is my husband. The reason we've created this course is because we get asked so many questions outside of the podcast on how we started living the life that we live now. A life of happiness, of abundance, of really understanding that life is always full of problems every single day, but there's always a solution. And how do we shift back into a mindset that's going to keep us happy, keep us together, keep us successful, and keep us in thriving relationships? And that is what our, our Become Aligned course is about. You guys, we cover everything from mindset to the rituals that we do every single day. We talk about different energy sources that's really gonna provide you with lasting energy. We talk about your purpose and what that actually means, what it is and how it's ever changing. We're gonna tap into your beliefs, we're gonna show you how to build a tribe to support where you're going. And we're definitely going to talk about wealth, abundance, money, all of the good things, and how to sustain all of this. Because while, like I said, POD are absolutely awesome, you don't necessarily sit down and actually write out a plan for yourself. Because as much as I can sit here and tell you on the podcast, what we do and how much, how many different people that I can interview, it's important that you actually learn how to apply these things in your own life. So if you've been listening for a while and you are ready to go deeper and you really want to get some direct training and be able to dive into your life and yourself and your mindset, this is the course for you. I don't know about you, but I absolutely have points in my life where I don't know where I'm going. I don't know what I'm doing. Sometimes I hit walls where I don't necessarily feel happy anymore, and I haven't sat with myself long enough. I haven't really let myself think. I haven't written out how I actually feel. And so many people who took this course said that it was completely life changing and they revealed a lot of things about themselves, about them, about their. About their relationships that they weren't really looking at or they were avoiding. And it's about having those tough conversations, not only with other people, but really with yourself and knowing that you have the tools and the access to the tools. And we're going to teach you all of the tools that you need not only to move through things, but to actually thrive on the other side. So, you guys, I would love for you to join the aligned community. It's such a special group of human beings and you get lifetime time access. This is nine different modules where you're going to be working through each area of your life at your own pace. So you might need something on abundance, you might need more on, you know, money, you might need more on your purpose on your tribe. This is where you can really go deep on exactly what you need and make sure that you're not missing any of your blind spots. If you are feeling stuck or if you are wondering how everyone is doing it and how they're managing it all. This is a truly honest course about how to have a thriving life and manage and deal with all of the different problems that do come up in your life and understand that not everyone is going to support you and not everyone is for you and you are not for everyone. And that's okay. It's finding your people, it's forgiving yourself. It's creating a life of abundance and choosing your own purpose and your happiness. So, you guys, you can go to becomealigned.com that's becomealigned.com and you guys know that because you're listeners, I'm gonna give you an awesome deal and an awesome discount and I cannot wait to see you in that community. And also let me know if you join because it is such an awesome, awesome community. And also I'm really proud of this course. Chris and I poured our heart and our soul into this. Everything that we've done, everything that we've learned, we've invested so much into ourself that this is everything that we have applied in our lives. And if you want to know how we've done it, we put it all on the table. We've put it all in this course. So if you want to know, go check it out@becealigned.com so let's get into the show.

People don't do anything when they feel pointed at, attacked, criticized. So it's like if you want to reach your goal, then behave in Such a way that you're likely to get people to cooperate.

Welcome to the Earn your happy podcast. I'm Lori Harder, founder of The Bliss Project, 3 Time Fitness World champion, fitness expert and cover model turned self love junkie, lifestyle entrepreneur and author. Each week I'll bring you a guest or a thought that will help you bust through your fears, connect to your soul and get better, focused and clear so you can elevate your life, business and relationships. We don't wait until we're ready for someone to tell us we're good enough. We take what we want and we anoint ourselves, get ready to earn, own, and unapologetically rock your happiness every single day. Are you with me? Here we go. Welcome back to the show. My next guest has a plethora, a bucket of talents that she has cultivated. I don't even know what to talk about first. Not sure if I should talk about her dance moves, her high kicks, her ability to completely shift and educate people to reach their highest potential, or her complete business savvy or her epic dance moves and her account on TikTok. Guys, for real. My guest is the New York Times bestselling author of Push Charlene Johnson. She is a lifestyle and business expert, motivational speaker and a podcast host. She and Brett, her husband of over 20 years, are the founders of the smart life movement. Today, with her husband, Chalene runs a fun loving collaborative team focused on helping others live a healthier, more simpl life through their online academies, membership sites and live sold out seminars. There is no question why her events sell out. I have watched her speak. I have been in her presence. She is pure fire and she will light your soul on fire with education and truth. Chalene, with the help of top dietitians, doctors, researchers and experts, founded the131 method, which is a nutritional coaching program that's turning the diet industry upside down. Her new book, the One One Hundred and Thirty One Method just came out in April 2019. She hosts two top ranked podcasts. I have listened to these podcasts so many times. One is the Chalene show and the other is Build you'd Tribe. Huffington Post recognized Chalene as one of the top 50 female entrepreneurs to watch. If she's not in your realm yet. If you have not checked her out, you definitely need to. Her energy is through the roof and she's so inspiring. Did I mention I'm mildly obsess obsessed with her closet and her clothing?

So inspiring.

You guys okay with all of these things said, I want to remind you that the Bliss Project is the very last weekend in March and this is going to be the most epic weekend of your year. You're not going to want to miss it. We are putting so many details into this bliss project and this is the place to actually connect in person with your tribe and get your questions answered.

So.

So I am making sure it's not just an event. You don't just go sit in your chairs, although that might seem a little less scary. If you want real change, you need to be connecting with people. You need to do the work. You need to have the immersive experience. This is the most immersive weekend that you will be able to find while connecting with your tribe. If that freaks you out, it is exactly where you need to be. Trust me. I make sure that you feel safe and that you are in a loving environment, non judgmental and that this can be the place where you try on this next level version of yourself and let go of what's holding you back. I know you want to let go. I know you don't want to live another year in the way that you're feeling right now. So let's come and do it together. We're all coming. We're all the same. That's going to be the best part that you realize within the first hour of connecting with people that we are all the same. Our problems are not that special, truly. It's time to let them go so that you can become the highest version of yourself. So I can't wait to see you there. That is in sunny California. I know a lot of you are in cold areas so I'm just gonna lure you with that. I'm gonna lure you with a vacation at the Ritz Carlton on the water in California. Can you say amazing photos?

That's all I'm saying.

Soul filling. All right, let's get started.

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Chalene, I am so excited to finally have you on the show.

I know we've had quite a tumultuous time trying to get together to make this happen, but I'm happy because it always gives us a chance to connect.

Yeah, this is great. It's like, I'm like, oh, when it finally happens, I'm like, well, it's divine that it's happening now. So it's perfect.

It's been happening for the two of us. We just haven't been able to air them.

Yeah, exactly. Well, I've been talking to you on your podcast for years, so I feel like, you know, I'm sure, you know, it's so crazy. Like, you know, you have those one way relationships with people and you, you like actually get to meet him and you're like, okay.

Oh, that's right.

You're meeting me for the first time. Okay, totally.

It's so weird when that happens too, because you look at that person like, they must recognize me. And you kind of like. But you're like, oh, wait, they have no idea who I am.

Yes, totally. So you are, you're one of those people who. I just wrote down a slew of different topics because there's not going to be enough podcasting time for me to just really go down all of the different areas that you've built and all the things that you've done. I think people forget just that you started with a foundation and you added and then you built something else, then you added some more. I think that that part of the journey is important to hear. I just would love for you to just kind of talk about what was foundational for you and how did you start adding all of the different pieces?

What a cool question. Yeah, Foundational for me, I don't think I've ever been asked that question before, but I love it. A foundational for me was having a problem and solving it and then realizing that could be a business and that, that's the, the through line of my life. Usually the problem sometimes, like in my early career, it was like really basic things like just convenience things like trying to sell. My first business was created to make it easier for private owners to sell their own vehicles. And I was just solving my own problem. That's how I was making money through college, was flipping cars. And then the next problem was I wanted to teach group fitness classes, just keep myself busy as a paralegal. And I realized like when you go through the process of having to create the choreography and the music and the routines and show up there early and practice and rehearse and the cues and all those things, like, I'm making less than minimum wages. It's got to be an easier way.

This is a problem.

I Solved it by creating a pre designed workout program. And that those have, you know, that's always been my through line is like whatever the challenge is that I need a solution. If there isn't one that works for me, I'll create it and share it. And that's my foundation and I let it guide me. It and my belief in God and fulfilling his purpose to guide whatever comes next. It's exciting.

Wow.

I've never actually gotten to put that into my words for my story too. But right down to fitness and then solving a problem and starting an online community and being like, wait, this is no longer working. And that's something I. So now it's on to the next problem. If this one I'm not making enough money or now I'm exhausted and this isn't worth my time. And I think that's where a lot of people get stuck in life in general, whether it's in business or whether it's in relationships where that point where something is no longer working but it doesn't seem right to either let it go or we feel like we owe it to our clients, or we feel like we have to carry this person with us because we were with them for a certain period in life. How did you start to be able to pivot, maybe detach from people you needed to detach from without feeling guilt? Because I think that's a huge thing for especially women.

Guilt and also second guessing yourself. Like, if I step in this direction, am I turning my back on something that's a sure thing for something that's an unsure thing? If I step in this direction, is it the right direction? Or should I go harder in this direction than like, just doesn't feel like it's fulfilling me?

Yes.

And that is a difficult question to answer, but I think the best way to do it is that you never dive in. You just dip your toe in. Like, I'm still standing on the platform of whatever it was I was doing last and speaking to our listener. Like, you're where you are right now and you have this thought, you might want to do this other thing. Don't dive in. I know. That's what all you know, every motivational speaker tells you. Like, dive in, go full force. Nah, just dip your toe in and see if that water's too cold, too hot. And then maybe you can sit down on the edge and let yourself get wet up until the knees. And then you're, you know, maybe floating in the water before you actually dive in. So nothing is permanent. Everything that we Want to try? There's a way out. You know, there's a way out and nothing, everything can just be like a. Let's just try this on.

What about for I. That couldn't be better advice. Like, that's totally the only thing that's gotten to me where I am. I'm like, okay, well, we just. We could play with this for a little bit. Yeah, we're just gonna try it on. And believe me, there's a lot of stuff. I was like, oh, that's not a fit.

Never gonna be able to complete that.

One because I don't care about it anymore.

Amen. Yeah.

Yeah. What about with relationships that aren't, you know, I think whether we have someone in our life from our past that we, you know, maybe we went through something with them and it just no longer. The energy is no longer there. We can't feel like we can carry them anymore or it' not. It's not working on our. On our end. And we know it. And we know.

Yeah. Yeah. Two personal examples come to mind for me. One and. But I want to start by saying what I know today is that I don't. Rarely, rarely in like, less than a fraction of 1% of the situations, do you need to sit down and have a, quote, confrontation with someone or to declare publicly or even to that person how you feel about the relationship. It's more so conversations to yourself. Because I just don't. I usually. What do we want from that? Like, when you sit down and tell someone, like, we're different now and I've evolved and you have it, like, what's going to come from that? Like, they're going to go, you're right. You're so evolved. I'm over here. Unwoke. Like, it just. No one ever. That doesn't work, and it doesn't make any sense. And they say. People say, I'm doing that for closure. No, you're just. You're doing that because you're hoping to get an apology or you're right or someone to come to their senses, but they never will in that moment, because that's why you're in that moment. In that moment, I think of one of my very closest friends. She's been in my Life for over 28 years. We went through a patch about four or five years ago where I started getting in my head, like, see? Yep, look at that. I'm the one who sends the first text message every time I keep inviting her to these things. And I don't even like the way that she's declining the invitation. It sounds kind of rude. She's not being very friendly when I'm around her. She's kind of being catty towards me or, like, you know, the joke's on me. I'm like, I don't like this energy. And I kept, like, really making a big deal about it in my own head. We're not spending any time together. And in my head, I, like, I felt like I wanted to sit down with her and say, you know, we were once best friends and we're not now, and that's cool. But I thought, why do I need to have that conversation? What is it I would want if I had that conversation? I would want. If I'm being honest, it would be for selfish reasons, so that she would say, you're right. You know, I'm the one who's been wrong. And I just realized, no, what I really want is I'd love to be able to have this relationship continue. And maybe it will look different. And that's. I just prayed on it and said, yeah, it just will look different, but I will still have love in her heart. I just have to accept that. Like, it's not the folder that's right in the front of my BFF file, but it's, like, maybe one back, you know, and that's how I decided to look at it. And we're. We're back to where it'll never be like, where we once were, because we were, like, in our 20s, right? But we're really, really tight now. And I recognize now that so much of that was our kids are at different stages. So when I was unavailable, she was available, and now she's super duper busy, and I'm more available, so it heightens those things. But I'm so glad I never sat down and had that conversation, because the relationship has just changed. The only time I haven't done that is when there was a friend I'd had for many, many years. But it was a relationship where I was taking care of her for me. So it was like a wounded bird. And you like to feel like you're altruistic and like your Mother Teresa and. And paying off her debt and paying off her mother's debt. And now there's a car accident, and now there's this. And now she needs this job and all these things like rushing in. And I taught her that that's what our relationship looked like, and I had to be honest and realize it was serving me. And then I had to have a conversation with her. Not to change her, but so that she could help keep me accountable. And I really had to be honest with her and say, this is what I'm doing, and it's taking a toll on my own life, because if I'm fixing whatever was going on with you, I don't have to deal with my own stuff. And that's not fair to my kids, not fair to my husband, and I'm doing it for really selfish reasons. And so I just want to take a little break because I need to detox my. I have to change this about myself because it's not helping you. You're capable of doing all these things, so I'm not helping you by, like, the. You know, wait. Like, basically every day I would wake up and go, like, oh, I want not. I look at it now in retrospect and realize I was excited to find out what her latest drama trauma would be so I could rush in with a capon.

Wow.

And so just being honest, and we took a little break and have never quite come back. I've been open. We're open and connect with each other from time to time. It's just, you know, I. I'm not that person anymore, and I think maybe she's not that person anymore.

Mm. Yeah. It's so interesting from. From case to case, like, knowing how to. You're. You're never gonna be able to apply almost like, that same rule to every single relationship. You have to kind of, like, sit at it and see, like, what am I gonna do?

I just don't think you. I mean, it's a very rare circumstance where you need to sit down with someone. And I think the rule of thumb there is you have to sit down with someone if you're taking ownership for what you. You've done. Never sit down with someone hoping that they're going to take ownership for what they've done, because you.

Oh, my God.

Very disappointed.

That is going to flip on you so fast.

Yeah.

It's literally like, oh, I have been in those conversations that make you learn really quick what you just did, and you're like, oh, I totally did this wrong.

Yeah. Yeah.

Like, all right, we're going to start out on the next one. Okay. So you and I had chatted just for a second briefly before this, and I was just discussing different topics. I would love to hear you talk about. And you know what? Something that you're passionate about, and I'm so passionate about talking about it right now also is communication, because I think that whether it is your friendships, your Romantic relationships, your team or your business. I think communication is going to be like that foundation of everything.

Of everything.

A lot of our pain comes from either what's being said and misunderstood or what's not being said at all. So I know that you just had a recent experience just with the clarity of communication. Would you share just some of that for us?

Yeah. Yeah. As with many families, you know, there's. That's where a lot of tension is, right? Like work tension. You can leave it at the door. Business tension. You're like, well, I can fix it. Family, you're stuck with them in some cards. And we're all pretty different. And we as a family are dealing with my father in law's Alzheimer's and he was the patriarch of the family. He's the quintessential football coach, the guy who's in charge, the guy who tells you where to go, what time to be there, show up 20 minutes early, just like no one really ever had a voice and suddenly he's lost his.

Wow.

And so it's created a grieving process. While he's still alive and with us, he's at, I think stage four or five. So he's aware also that he has Alzheimer's. And because it's changed his personality and it's. And therefore it's changed the dynamic of the family. And this is a family where we didn't communicate. We just did what Coach said.

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To tell everyone what to do. So the advice that I would have and we just sat down. The family's been dreading this conversation for months and I'm pushy and I like figuring these kinds of things out. And I just said, you know, if we realize we don't have to rush, but we do have to come up with a plan and we all need to sit down and figure out like what we're doing and how we can make everyone's quality of life better. And so I think the number regardless if you're dealing with a situation like that, or maybe it's a coworker who you need them to step up or maybe even it's a friend who you you really want to just shake them and say why are you making me do all the work? I always say start by first of all, start by thinking of love, like thinking lovingly toward that person. Because when we think with love, we act with love and then we feel love. And love can will amazing things to happen. If we think that we need to be right, if we think with pain, like, you've hurt me, then you act with pain and you hurt people. It's just how it works. And it seems so obvious. And it's also difficult to say, think with love when you're resentful or hurting or angry or feel righteous.

Yeah.

But if you can do that and imagine. Imagine, I always say, imagine that you are that person. You can put yourself in their shoes. And I want you to just, like, play the part. Like, imagine that you are them right now. You're playing the role of that individual. And your monologue or your script that you're reading is how they're describing the situation from their point of view, which is very, very different from yours. And you might not even think that's reality, but if you can do that, you understand where they are and you can have love in your heart or empathy, at least for them. And then the next step is to say, what's my goal? If your goal is to be right, go back to the drawing board and start over. Just truly, what is your goal? And we, as the siblings all sat down, said, our goal is that each of them live a happier, healthier life and that we can improve the quality of their life. It's not to say who's right or wrong. It's not to talk about the past. It's how do we improve their quality of life? And then the next step is to say, all right, what does that. What would make this person feel loved and warm and appreciated and recognized and heard? Even though I want to pinch their head off, even though I'm right and they're wrong, even though I'm an angel and they are devil spawn. Like, how I make them feel that. Because people don't do anything when they feel pointed at, attacked, criticized. So it's like, if you want to reach your goal, then behave in such a way that you're likely to get people to cooperate. It's really kind of that simple. Not easy, but it is. It is that simple. That basic.

How about when it's flipped on you? And let's say this example, that's never happened to me before. So, you know, and I have, believe me, I've been on both sides, for sure. But what about. And I get this all the time from people, you know, especially just coming off the holidays and going home for the holidays and asking people, how are your holidays? They're like, they were great. And also, you know, you go see the family, you spend a lot of time with them. A lot of things are said.

What.

What do you do when a lot of things are coming at you that you. You know, they just immediately trigger you, Immediately enrage you. And sometimes we do get caught acting the way we don't want to act.

I know. Yeah, I had to happen recently. It's a bummer. But there was a cocktail involved, too. Yeah, there's always a cocktail involved when I, like, lose my.

Damn it.

But. So it depends on what my goal is. Right? So I can think about a time when Brett and I were really struggling in our marriage, and I was trying to convince him why it would help our children because I could. We were in such a bad place. I knew he didn't care if it helped me or not. So I was convincing him that he needed to go to therapy for our children. And I just. I can remember the booth that we were sitting at in this Mexican restaurant, and I tried to, like, dress up really pretty and be really nice to him, to, like, soften his heart and talk about how this would help the kids. And I just remember he was like. He just looked at me. He's like, well, I hope you're ready to find out that you're the problem. And I just remember thinking, what is your goal? What is your goal? What is your goal? Because, trust me, I had a nice, long laundry list of all the reasons why I was perfect wife. And he was so freaking lucky. He should be on his knees in that restaurant. But I just was like, what's the goal? What's the goal?

What's the goal?

The goal is to get him healthy. The goal is to see if I can't help him be a better father. And so I just owned it. I was like, I know, I know. Let's talk about some of the things I need to change. And I remember, like, making that list. We've joked about it since, because at the time, he had a pretty serious gambling addiction that I was unaware of and which was revealed that, you know, all of those things have been resolved in therapy. But at the time I made that list because I kept thinking about my goal, and my kids were a strong enough. Why that I had the ability to remove myself from it and just know he's attacking me because he feels attacked. But again, I don't always do that. I, you know, recently blurted out what I was thinking, and doesn't. It just doesn't help the situation. You know, we're not perfect, but the more that we can just go, okay, let's. I'm a hostage Negotiator. I'm a hostage negotiator. And my. Me being right isn't going to make this happen. I have to make this person feel like I see them and I hear them. And so a lot of times, it means helping them to understand that you heard what they said and that specifically, that means do not. Especially when you know that someone's being unreasonable and unrational, irrational and accusatory. Like pointing fingers at you. Nod, smile if it's appropriate, affirm what they've said in their words, even if you're not. You don't have to say, I agree, but you can say, if I hear you correctly, and I want to make sure I understand this, you think that I don't take care of the kids in the morning as much as you do. And if I'm hearing what you're saying, you feel hurt by me. You want to repeat what they said to help them hear and understand that you understood what they're saying. Because most of us just want to be heard. And our natural go to, like, again on the cocktail night is to interrupt, make your case, and assume that they're gonna be like, oh, okay, you're right. It would just never happen. You know, that's our natural. That's our natural go to. Because I think that's how we learned how to fight when we were kids.

Oh, yeah, I learned a lot of good stuff. But then you learn. You learn that when you get married for a long period of time, you're like, oh, I didn't really realize that that's the fighting style that I had learned. That's not getting anywhere.

Yes. I had a sister. We pulled hair and scratched. And that just doesn't work well in a marriage. No, I had that shirt. That is my shirt. Take it off right now. Mom, it doesn't work with husband.

I will never forget one of those times with my sister. Like, it was that point where you're just like, whoa. We like, this is. This was, like, getting borderline dangerous. And both of us were like, this isn't working anymore. Like, two teenagers being like. To come to that. This really hurts. We need to stop. Like, this is hard.

Oh, my gosh. That's so funny. And we're both Michigan girls. Those Michigan girls. We know how to fight, y', all.

Man, Michigan don't step up. No, it's the truth. Okay, so let's take this same idea and bring it into your business, because let me tell you, like, you can.

You can think.

You're. You're challenged in Family and friends, which it really is. That's some of the most challenging stuff. But then there are those moments that just you. You know, that you're not going to get by and you're not going to be able to build your business if you don't really, really understand the art of commun. Because that's where you do have to deliver messages. You have to figure out how to deliver messages to your team in a way of maybe something totally failed, but also having to step back and see where it started with you or your expectation or your lack of communication. Okay, help me.

No, that. You just took the words right out of my mouth. I was thinking that first step, especially when you're the owner, when you're the CEO, when you're the boss, or when you're the manager, right? You have. You. Ultimately, responsibility falls on your shoulders. Even though you've hired people to do what they're supposed to do, and you were paying them really, really well to do what they're supposed to do. When they don't do that, my first inclination is to again say, like, okay, it's pretty obvious. Here's what you're supposed to do, and you didn't do it. But I always try to, like, take a deep breath and calm down, vent about it to whoever. Vent about it and then go, all right, so why did this happen? How was my role in some way? Did it allow it to happen? Did it permit it to happen? Did it miss that it was going to happen? Did I miscommunicate? Did I? What's my role? And we recently had, like, this really ugly conversation in our office as a team. And, you know, Brett and I were just, like, building up so much resentment, anger towards our team members. And because we run the business together, sometimes that can be really unhealthy because we can spiral together and there's nobody to give us to be a check and a balance to say, well, you know what? Actually, we're just like, yeah, I know. Can you believe it? No, I can't.

The people all night.

Yeah. And then we were like, okay. And then literally I was like, okay, we need to talk to our staff about it. And I just started thinking, like, like, we're gonna do that. We're gonna sit down and tell them how we're right and they're wrong or that we're great and they're not. Like, that doesn't make any sense. What is our role? And we did that. We sat down with a piece of paper and a pen and just, like, really was like, okay, if. If they were allowed to just sit at a table and come bitch and complain about Chalene and Brett, what were all the things they would probably say? And I wrote them all down. I'm like, wow, that's a. That's a lot of things. They have a lot to complain about.

We've been.

We got to get our act together. And I think if we step up and explain how we've missed the mark, how we've fallen into some bad habits, and that we're going to make every possible concession to improve those things, that then we become true leaders and talk to them about where we've missed the mark and how we plan to improve and how we expect everyone on the team. We owe that to each other and kind of start there. But for having the secondary conversations, which might need to be specifically with, like, one or two people, I think too often we address a group.

Yeah.

When really we're uncomfortable about having a conversation with one or two. And then we do this right. Like, you know, instead of, like, talking to the one parent who's driving you bonkers, you sit down. I don't know. I've done this and sat down with both of my parents because sometimes it's easier. You don't feel like it's going to soften the blow because you can say, well, one of the things I noticed about us instead of about you, you know, and just always start with yourself. I think that's the rule of thumb, is to start with you.

Yeah. Just thinking about how I've definitely done that, and when I actually have someone who is, like, thriving and doing an amazing job, and I'm like, wow, they didn't actually need to be a part of that conversation, you know?

Yeah. Yeah. You think that they know that. Yeah. You assume, like, oh, that person knows that I'm not talking to them.

Right.

Sometimes they don't while they're digging in.

Their files of, like, what did I do wrong? What's going on? Oh, my God.

They're on ZipRecruiter posting their resume.

Exactly.

So this podcast sponsored by ZipRecruiter. So communication, go to ZipRecruiter.com forward slash Lori.

And now.

Now I need. Now I need them to sponsor this. I'm going to be like, did you hear this app?

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So communication in terms of speaking to your audience, just really being clear with even who is your person? What do you stand for? What don't you stand for? I think a lot of us, myself included, are afraid to get so clear because we can feel like we're sometimes either leaving people behind or we're going to offend people. In my case, I'm always like, what if I offend this person or that person? So the importance of communication when attracting.

Your people to you, that's interesting because I've had kind of an evolution there. I think I started my career, at least this online career, in kind of more like as I am. I think I've evolved and I've softened and I, I realized, like, I've got really, really thick skin. I look for criticism. I look for you to tell me what I need to improve. I like growth. I can handle negative feedback. I look for it, I'll ask for it. But most people are not that way because they've received it all their life and they've tried to escape it. And I didn't. Like, my parents are knock on, I mean, luck, whatever. They were just like, to a fault, really positive and encouraging and great communicators. And so I didn't have as much empathy for people who couldn't receive a message as bluntly as I like to often deliver it. And I had a mentor who I got off the stage once and he like the moment I got. And I hate it when people give me feedback right when I get off the stage here.

Yeah.

Put on amazing events. You're a public speaker. Your brain is mush. You couldn't even tell. You couldn't even ask me what my middle name is. I'd be like, I don't know.

Yes, it's something.

But I walked off the stage and he said, before I forget, I want to tell you this. Your sarcasm, your sense of humor, and your direct style sometimes feels very arrogant. And I think you scare or shame people that they aren't doing the things that seem so obvious to you. And I was like, wow.

And you're so aw when you get off stage, so open.

Right. And so I didn't want to hear it. And I was like, oh, thank you, and walked away. And. But then later I realized, like, I didn't really know where I was doing that or how. And so I asked him if he could remember any examples and so that I could, you know, just think about them. I didn't want to admit that it was true. I'm like, really? Yeah. But, you know, then it made me realize there was language that I used and eye rolling and, and facial expressions and just like, I know I was trying to. I was just trying to be funny, but I could see how it could feel very condescending. And so that has softened me to realize, like, okay, I want my audience to receive the message. I want them to actually hear the message. Because, you know, we. There's things that sometimes we've said it a million times to our family members and then suddenly they go out to lunch with someone They've read a book and they're like, hey, do you know that you could do something called intermittent fasting? And you're like, ugh. You know, because people have to be in the right state to receive a message. And so for me, it was remembering, gosh, if I want to be a better speaker, I have to get my audience to receive the message. And I need them to feel love and accepted. And I certainly don't need them to feel ashamed or like, I'm better than them or I'm being obnoxiously arrogant about the message.

That is so good. Yeah. Searching for feedback. I was one of those people who got so much feedback when I was younger that now, as my career changed and getting out there and speaking, it's like, in the beginning, I was so afraid of feedback. Like, I would just. It's almost like I would reject it or it would almost paralyze me to not want to do it. Because it. The thought of feedback felt paralyzing. And now I'm finally to a place where I'm like, okay. I also know how to support myself around feedback. Like, I'm not, like, after an event, I'm not going to go two days later to read all of the comments. Like, I have. I wait a couple weeks. I like, really get in the right frame of mind for it. I have my team kind of weed through what's for me, what doesn't even, you know, matter for me. Things like that. So supporting yourself around that feedback, or like, you have, you know, said you had a beautiful mentor who. Yeah, maybe it wasn't the right time, but. But having those people that you can. That you can go to. So what would be a suggestion for you, for people who are like, oh, man, I think I've been avoiding feedback, but I would like to start getting some of it.

Yeah. To think of yourself, not that any feedback is a statement about your character or who you are, think of yourself as a product, right. And you want to improve the product. And so it's not the essence of me, it's me as the package. And that really helped me a lot, especially doing fitness and doing writing books and podcasts. Like, I used to really be destroyed when I would read negative things because there's nothing I could do to redo it. Like, it's out there in the universe. And then I realized, like, okay, well, first of all, I don't like the way that feels because I can't correct it. It's done. So the only time I will look at, for example, I Didn't read any reviews about my book push until I was ready to sit down and write one through one method. And. And I won't read any of the reviews. I read like the first week of reviews because, you know, those are all going to be positive. Right? Those are your, like, truths.

Those are your people.

Yeah, yeah. Those are your lifers. And then after that, I haven't looked at. I haven't looked at a review since then. Holy Bible. And I won't until I go to maybe write another book because I can't change it now. You know, maybe if there's a rewrite I might, but if there's some, if there's nothing I can do with it, then it's either going to make me feel better than I should or worse than I should. And I know that I did my best and I don't need to worry about what other people think of it, especially if there's no opportunity for me in the moment to change it or improve it. I also think that it's really important for people to remember that, you know, that voice in your head is often the voice of a parent, you know, or an early caregiver. And you know, to be. To be aware of those things that you're giving, you're continuing to give them control over your life, your destiny, your greatness. Because you're allowing their voice to echo in your head and to stop you from doing these things because their feedback is still on a loop. Yeah. So it's really difficult to, you know, hear things that will actually constructively grow you because you're so afraid that the criticism is going to be as harsh and as painful as that which we heard from the people who loved us the most, or we're supposed to.

Have you ever gotten feedback from somebody close to you that you didn't. That wasn't, that you knew wasn't actually feedback that you needed, like you were going to reject it because it wasn't actually in alignment with what you were meant to do.

Yeah, I get that. Sure. From time to time. Sometimes about career, a lot of times about career stuff, which is why I don't put myself in environments where I know people aren't in alignment with where I am with my career and how I prioritize that below family and also the words that guide my life. My life is centered around the word peace. Right. And now this is going to come across the wrong way to some people, but in order for me to have peace, I need to feel connection to the people that matter the most. To me. And when my life feels out of balance or the opposite of peace, chaos, it's usually because it's not because of, like, things in my house. It's like relationships. So then, therefore, it's incumbent upon me to be very selective and to not try to connect with everybody. And I think that's hard in today's social media day and age where, you know, everyone wants to introduce you to everyone. And so I really resist those things. I resist networking opportunities. I resist, hey, I should introduce you to so and so I say thank you. And then. And I purposely don't follow up because I want peace. And if I have time to introduce five new people, this is the truth. If I have time to get to know on a deeper level, five new people, the fact of the matter is that's that much less time for the people who've already been there for me, who I already love, who I already am not giving them enough. And they're already proven to be all the things that I need and love in my life. So by inter, like, I think there's these people who just collect connections and maybe they're doing it for their work or whatever, but I just. I really resist that idea. I think God will put that person in my life. I'm not going to seek it.

I actually, from afar, spot different people who are in, who are kind of mentors for me on different ways that they balance their life. And you've actually been a huge mentor of that for me because I don't. It's so funny. Of course, this is how life goes. I write a book about tribe and it's about me connecting deeper with just a few people. But it made everybody want to connect with me, like, at a deep level. And I was just like, oh, my God. It was probably the hardest thing last year was finishing out, like, a lot of these obligations that I said yes.

To as far as protecting and all.

These different things with women. And it was amazing. But I've never felt so not myself. And I didn't get to hang out with my friends and. And it was at the expense of time with my family. And towards the end of last year, it was like I was finishing up my year of yes from 2018 that trickled all the way through 2019, but through 2019, I had said no the whole year. And now this year it's very, like.

Very the year of maybe.

It's the year of maybe and truly. But it's women like you and quite a few other people that I'm kind of watching do the same. Who's giving me permission to actually feel the close supportive relationships and go deeper with my family and go, go to the places that I really need because I don't do well when I'm over committed at all.

So, girl, me and you both. And I have to have those personal policies in place because when I'm in a really kind of up, I can take on more mood. I say yes to things that just don't match my true energy level. By energy, I mean emotional energy, right? And so like, we've always had a personal policy that we did one event, one thing per month, just one. And then once the kids were out of the house, we changed it to two. And that's taking some getting used to for me because like, oh, maybe it should be two, but not back to back weekends because I need that opportunity to rebuild my emotional fuel tank. Here's the other thing that's difficult, Lori, is the more this happens in social media and when you are someone like yourself, who's known, you've got, you know, a tribe of people who, who listen and believe and look to you for direction and listen to your podcast and read your books and come to your seminars and coaching clients and all of these things, the more people who look to you, who. So this is like the catch 22, right? The more people who you are able to influence. Here's the truth. The more people you'll disappoint. And that is hard. It's just the law of averages. The more people who look to you and need you, the more people you will be disappointing. Just how it is. And that's difficult. It's a tough pill to swallow. And so I tried to set myself up where I'm not. I don't have that many people who are like, dependent upon me. Of course I serve my audience, but like, on that really deep level, like, I don't do personal coaching anymore. We did that for many years. I don't do that, don't do group coaching anymore because I don't like, I hate feeling like I've disappointed people.

Hate it. This is also my year of acceptance, Chalene. Like, this is my year of accepting what doesn't feel good, knowing that the faster I can accept it, I can also give myself. Like, then you can thrive when you're on your podcast or at your events or in setting up that expectation. Like talking about communication. Oh my gosh, this is our year of making changes.

Can you answer for me? Because I'm not clear. What do you mean by it's your year of acceptance. You just have to accept it and get on with it. It is what it is. Move on.

I realized that even last year, I was afraid. I think I was stopping myself from growing because of the fear of that, like, knowing that I could disappoint a lot of people. And I think by acceptance, I mean, like, accepting what. How things are, that this is just how they are and you can't change them and making peace with that.

I see that.

So for me, it's a lot of making peace with decisions that I know aren't necessarily the way that you want them to be.

Yeah, yeah, I understand that concept now. I guess that's how I feel about the fact that I am an introvert. Right. Like, I have to. I. Instead of trying to fight that all the time and then. Which. In which case I feel inauthentic, I just have to recognize what type of introvert I am and how I can show up to be my best.

I just feel that we'll just drop in around that some other time. But I just saw my husband.

He.

He can be introverted, but he can also be so extroverted. So for him, especially when you're building different businesses, it's like, I'll say no to so many things, and sometimes he'll come back to me and be like, lori, these are like, you know, these networking events or whatever they are. It's like, these are so important for our business. And I'm like, but, Chris, I feel like I'm dying right now on the inside. And he's just. He doesn't totally get that. Oh, and he's getting it. But I have to also let it be okay that he doesn't get that and just have to take a stand for myself and be like, not going, I know you're mad at me right now. And that's okay, because you don't get what's happening inside here.

So go. Right, right, right.

Then we'll meet tomorrow.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm an outgoing introvert, so it can be very confusing to people.

Same. Super same.

I am in the middle of that party, and I'm like, the roof, the roof. The roof is on fire. And then everyone turns their back, and I slip out of the room and into my car, and I'm like, oh, my God, did anyone see me? Oh, good, I don't have to say goodbye to anybody. And now I'm in. And now I'm in my. You know, in my bedroom, in my bed with a messy bun and oh, thank God it's only 10pm I'm teaching.

Chris the art of like, the really, like, like loving ghosting out of a party. Like, okay, kind of said yes. We kind of said hello to everyone and our niceties and everyone wanted to. And now it's time to go. He's like, what I have to say about. I'm like, you say goodbye to that guy across the room. You're adding another hour to our night right now.

1,000%. Yes.

Yes. So you so get it. So communication, let's pull this a little bit further. One step further. Let's say, what is something that you are? Is there anything in your life that you are having trouble communicating right now or that you're working through that you could feel like next level communication could really free you or help you. Something.

I think it stems for or always goes back to the workplace for me, because those are people who I don't spend my free time, weekend time with that. So I intentionally want to get to know what motivates them. But each one of them has a different style and a different motivator and a different why and a different background and a different childhood and a different voice in their head. And not knowing all these things sometimes and makes it challenging to know. Like, okay, I've used this approach with that person, but it's not going to work with this one. And so I'm always challenged in that regard because my goal is to bring out the best in them. You know, another challenging thing that's happened for us this year a lot is we teach people how to start their own online business and how to have freedom.

Yeah.

And, you know, this really becomes central to my messaging whenever we're launching. We've got a program called the Marketing Impact Academy. And I'm really just trying to reach out to people and help them understand. Like, you don't have to see yourself as an entrepreneur or a business owner, but right now, in this day and age, there's opportunities for you to make extra streams of income online. And I want to show you how to do that. I want you to have this freedom. Every year when we do that, one or two of my top people will sit down and say, I know you want this from me. And when you, when I was sitting behind the camera recording you today, Chalene, sharing that message, like, you, you got to me. And I think you're right.

I think, I think I need to.

Turn in my letter of resignation. I'm like, no, I want it for everybody else, not you guys. I wasn't talking to you. Yeah. Don't listen to me. No, you want a job. Don't want you. Why you. You don't want freedom. So that's hard because I, you know, I have to go. Like, of course I want this for you in another lifetime, you know, but. So that's. That's challenging because I've got just, like, these awesome people. And if I truly mean what I'm saying, I mean it for them, too. Which means, like I said to Brand, like, you know, we just have to remember our very best people will just like your children someday. They don't need you, and you've done good work and they'll be loyal and good friends forever.

So feel that. It's like you teach and you share, and you know that if you're doing it well, you're going to have that. Except it never makes it easier when you have it. Oh, God.

Can I tell you another thing that I really struggle with? Yeah, I'd love your advice. I have a really, really hard time with people who are stuck in victimhood. I just have such a hard time finding love to speak in love and to act in love. When I've done that. And there's still but me. And the. And, and, and. But this happened to me and this person hurt me and this person. And no, I don't have anyone in my life. And I just. But then. And then you made me cry. And the, the hurt. People who, like, live to be hurt. Yeah. That one, Lori, I still struggle with. I feel this, like. Like, it's weird. I get this, like, bubbling of, oh, I just realized where it came from.

Tell me.

Just realize why it bugs me so much. Yeah. And I'll tell you, I know why it bugs me so much. I just thought about it. It's because I had a family member who I felt responsible for fixing that for them. And so now I have, like, zero. I. Like, if I meet a woman who's that kind of a woman, I need to back away because I just. I'm repelled by it. And so it's hard for me, like, maybe in the workforce or, you know, in other environments where I start to see those personality traits, and that's obviously someone who's been hurt. Right. I'm trying to find more love and patience in those conversations.

I wish I had advice for you around it, because I actually am I very. That's one of my big triggers, too. But I know exactly why.

Is your why similar?

It's somewhat similar. So I'll tell you mine. Because it's interesting that it took the same spin, but it's a little bit different. So the way that I was, the way that I was raised a lot of my family, is that in that victim mode, and they somehow have, like, not noticed any of the hard work or the zero weekends for eight years or the. All of the things. But it's really, like, I've literally had people say to me, I don't know how you got so lucky, like. Or I don't know how you are the only thin one in the family. And I'm like, did you what? And so for me, it's triggering because it also makes me. I mean, if I'm being brutally honest, it makes me be like, nobody sees me. Nobody saw the hard work. Nobody saw the loneliness. Nobody saw those times when it would have been so much easier for me to go back and drink and eat and sit in that circle. It would have been easier for me to sit in that pain with you guys than to, like, I had to leave my family for three years and not talk to them at all in order for me to find who I was. Like, figure that out. So that is a huge trigger for me.

Can I ask when you did that?

Yes.

Did you make an announcement or was it just a gradual thing?

Well, I moved out right when I was 18. And my, you know, they didn't understand why I was moving out because I couldn't. I couldn't tell them at the time. There was a lot of religious things involved as well. And then I, you know, would I have done it different? I don't know if it would have worked, but I just stopped. I stopped answering their calls, which was horrible. It was horrendous. So I really. I actually cut off communication.

It was horrendous or was it what you needed to do to survive?

It's what I needed to do.

Okay. So it wasn't. Was hard, but needed to be done.

Yeah, Yep, totally.

But, yeah, thank you for sharing that.

Yeah. Thank you for opening that up. I was literally like, and I have nothing for you besides, like, just really. It's all it makes me do is just, I guess, dig into love more. Because I can go to a really, you know, if I was alone with someone, I could really chat with it. It just would. Would it feel good for a minute of like, ah, they don't. Why don't they do this and that? And then it just brings you to a place of like, you know, this ugly kind of feeling that doesn't get you anywhere.

And it's so true.

But what it did do is it helps me remove. I remove myself. Just like you just said. Like, you have to stay away from those people. I actually can spot when I, no matter what I do, I can't help them. And the old me would have tried to feel valuable by trying to save them or add value and that would have made me feel good. But then I now recognize that when they're in that mode, it's only going to exhaust you because they're not going to do any of the things that you say. So use my energy on people who are ready to move, to work, to go and do the things.

This is so rude because it's your podcast, but I just can't help it because I'm a know it all. Can I ask you, because it's really about me too. How, how has that impacted the way you look at or respond to developing friendships where you start to see some of that.

Oh, that's. I mean, this is interesting because I tend to pull away quickly and I wonder if I should or stay. So it can be I'm in that challenge, not challenging. I'm in that place of if I see that it's not for me right now, I won't sit with it because I'm going to need somebody who is going to be willing to find a solution.

It's not that I won't sit with.

You in pain if you're feeling a certain way, but if there's not, if I can tell a person doesn't have a solution based attitude around problems in their life, I'm not going to be able, I won't be able to help you. So it's not going to be this one thing either. It's going to be, it's going to start showing up in everything.

Yep, yep. Awesome. Same.

Okay, well, thanks for this therapy session today, Chalene. This has been great and really I just want to say thank you because you put so much amazing info out in the world and the more that I get to know people who know you, you've made such a massive impact.

Wow.

Just how you live, how you show up and your programs. Like, so amazing.

Thank you. It's really sweet to hear. I suppose I should get out more to maybe hear those things.

Just kidding.

I'll just tell you that's really nice. I really do appreciate that so much. Yeah.

I'm just honored to have you on here and honored to know you in life.

So.

I really was so freaking excited when I heard that you were going to be at Angie Lee's event. And I was like, what happened? Yes, I get to watch her speak. And truly, you are purifier on stage.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah, it was so much fun. So something that I do with.

You were the nicest person you. Yeah. I'll tell you what you do. You run over and you tell them specifically, like, not just you were great, you killed it, which anyone can say. And you always wonder, like, were they really watching? Like, you just gave me specifics and the moment I came off the stage. And you need that. I mean, I know it takes a lot of confidence, and people who go on stage and. And speak, they look like they just have it all. But the second you get off that stage, you can't remember what you said. It's like a haze. You're in a blackout. You hope you killed it. You just don't know. And so to have that, like, immediate I come off the stage and immediately hear such kind, specific words of praise from you was just. I went home to my. I actually called my husband. Like, you're not gonna believe what Lori Harder just did. You're the kind of girl you always have to say the first and last name. Lori Harder just came over to me and just. I was so touched by it.

Oh, thank you. Well, I'm going to tell you one more thing that I put in my back pocket from you, something I do from amazing speakers. When I see someone who just hits my soul that I know you're shifting everyone in the room, I'm like, what for me was something really beautiful and something that I can learn and also took with me, and I totally took it with me and used it yesterday. So thank you. You hang. You marinate in your point and you do it in such a fun way, like, whether it's like a bounce or a move or a look, and you let people get it. You let people get it. And you're so comfortable in the pause, which is kind of unusual for a lot of high energy to also be so comfortable in the pause. So I just hung yesterday on some of my points. Just felt very.

That's awesome. It also gives those. Gives those people in the audience who are notetakers, moneymakers, it gives them a chance to catch up.

It's so true. So anyway, you're making a huge impact in so many different ways. And I just want to thank you today for coming on the show. And I know that this is going to touch so many different people because I do think communication is one of our biggest hang ups. So if we can find some freedom and ways of doing that. You gave so many tangible examples. So thank you for that.

That's awesome. Thank you, Lori. Thank you so much for having me and you guys.

Go follow Chalene. Chalene, where should we find you? Where should we follow you? What's exciting right now? What do you have out in the world?

TikTok's fun.

It is fun. I've been watching you dance.

Oh, lord. Chalene official on TikTok podcast. You know, you were talking to people who are like, they get it. They want growth. And I'm obsessed with those kind of people. So I think they would like the Chalene show, which is my podcast show, and. And I'm Chalene Johnson on Instagram, and I'm just excited to go hit slopes with you.

Yes. Oh, my God, I can't wait. I cannot wait. It's like my favorite thing to do, so do it. All right, mama.

All right.

I will talk to you soon. And you guys, if you loved this episode, make sure you share it right now with your friends. For real. Text it to a friend who you know is struggling with any communication in their life. And this is the most be a huge game changer. So until next time, earn your happy. Bye. Bye, everyone.

Thank you guys so much for spending this time with me on the earn your happy podcast. I am so glad that you stopped by. If you could take one second to share this episode with someone you think would love it, that would be absolutely amazing and we would be forever grateful. Also, please leave us a review if you feel so moved by going to itunes and leaving us an honest thought, an honest comment, tell us what you think, tell us what you want to hear more of. It would really help us out on our journey to helping thousands and thousands of people. Until then, don't forget to earn your happy. Thanks again, guys.

Bye. Bye. It.