Holding Yourself Accountable & Living Your Life For YOU With Ben Nemtin, Co-Founder Of The Buried Life

When you start to surround yourself with these types of people that are inspiring, you know that they give you energy and are doing things that you find inspiring. You by default then think that you can do things that are inspiring, and you think that you can achieve your goals because you see people around you that you know doing the same thing, and you know that you're not very different than they are.

Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the earn your happy podcast. I'm so excited you're here. I have a question for you.

Do you have a bucket list?

Because before this podcast, I really did not have a bucket list. Like, yeah, there's some things that I want to do, but I never really gave it thought. I thought it had to be like these big, grand things that, you know, I had to put on a list, like go to other countries or try to get in the book of Guinness world Record. I don't know, something like that. And it's not that at all. Yes, there are those big, giant, audacious things, but there's also little things like, I want to learn how to ride a horse. I want to learn how to play polo. I want to learn how to do the splits. These are all things that are on my bucket list now. And you guys, today, this human being is so freaking amazing because he essentially is the person who pretty much started getting everyone to create a bucket list. So Ben Nemton is the number one New York Times bestselling author of what do you want to do before before you die? And he's the star of MTV's highest rated show on itunes and Amazon called the Buried Life. As the co founder of the Buried Life movement, his message of radical possibility has been featured on the Today show, the Oprah show, which I remember, you guys, I remember this episode so well because I was like, that is the coolest thing ever. And he has been declared by President Obama the inspiration for a new generation. You guys, they would go down a bucket list with their best friends. They borrowed a rickety old RV and crisscrossed North America, achieving the unthinkable. And he talks more about the story in the podcast. And most importantly, every time they accomplished a dream, they helped a complete stranger cross something off of their bucket list as well. From playing basketball with President Obama to having a beer with Prince Harry, from reuniting a father and son after 17 years to surprising a girl with a much needed bionic arm, Ben's bucket list quest has inspired millions to thrive personally and professionally. I'm telling you, this is going to.

Change the way that you look at your life.

And now I keep a running bucket list on my phone, and Ben has a bucket list journal that I'm telling you will change the game. It's such a fun gift to give to people. And I've also been having fun reading every single prompt in there, which is freaking amazing. It makes me think in a way that I have never thought. They're really beautiful questions to get you thinking of what you actually want want out of life and how you can accomplish it.

So let's get started. Ben, I'm so excited to have you on the show. Thank you so much for coming on, Laurie.

I'm excited to be here, you guys.

It is the new year, which means everybody is clamoring to finally create the life of their dreams and do all the big things. And then, you know, two weeks from now, we're all going to be back to where we were last year. So this is. This is literally. I am like, so excited to have you on. It couldn't have come at a better time, because if I was going to go to someone to not let my dreams die, I would go to you, Ben. I would literally consume all of your information because you've lived it. You've not just lived it, but you've lived it, like, beyond pretty much anyone that I can even think of on the planet. Is that a weird thought?

I guess because we started so early, but it is funny when you say it, but we stumbled into it and I'm happy that we did, but I'm excited, too. This is my favorite time of year. I think this. At the end of this podcast, you'll have a very clear roadmap of how to actually achieve those goals that you write down that usually never get achieved and they just fall through the cracks and you get buried by the day to day. So that's my goal. I'm going to write that down on my list. Today is actionable takeaway to achieve your goals. Understand why we don't achieve our goals, like, what the research says, and then now we know what the problems are, the steps to overcome them. So that's what I think I want to get into.

Okay. I love this because you are like, you've given such a linear track with everything that we're going to talk about, which is so exciting for people. But I want to know what got this all started. Like, what was the cost of you not going for your dreams? Like, how were you paying in your life for not living out your dreams?

The cost was it was too expensive. For me to afford. I mean, so I literally got depressed. I was in university, I was quote unquote, living the dream. I was on the under 19 national rugby team, which in Canada is a huge deal, especially on the west coast. It's like the order of sports is like hockey, hockey, rugby. So I was, I was, I had an academic scholarship to university. I had a great group of friends, support a family, and I put so much pressure on myself to succeed. And when we were training for the World Cup, I started worrying about missing field goals because I played fly half, which is like quarterback, field goal kicker. And so these worries would come to me at night and then they'd come in the form of anxiety and I would lose sleep. And then I started to get anxious and not be able to go to practice. And so I got dropped from the team and I ended up dropping out of school, become. Become a shut in in my parents house, crippled by this depression.

Wow.

And this was in my first year at university. And luckily I was pulled out of the house by some friends to work in a new town for the summer. And I started to meet new types of people in this new town. And I met kids that had started their own businesses. I met creative people that would just imagine something and then do it. I met kids that had traveled around the world and I was like, holy shit, I've never met young people like this. And I realized that they gave me energy. And I was like, oh my God, some people give me energy, some people take energy away from me. At that time in my life, I was like, I need to be around people that give me energy. So I thought I'm going to try and only surround myself with people that inspire me almost by necessity. And so that one decision totally changed my life because this buried dream that I had was to make a. A film, a documentary. And so I called up this kid from the neighborhood who I knew was a filmmaker. I didn't know him too well. And we got him and his older brother and our other friend together and we thought, okay, we're going to make a documentary. But we still didn't know what it was about. And now I was starting to feel a little more alive because I was starting to go after this creative impulse that ultimately would lead to this wild adventure. And so this friend of mine, Johnny, got assigned a poem in English class at the time called the Buried Life. And it's an old poem, 150 years old by an English poet. And it was articulating the same feeling that we were feeling that Was that we felt buried and all of our goals and dreams were buried and we were inspired in a moment and then life got in the way and so we thought, whoa, that's interesting. This dude wrote this poem almost 175 years ago. We're feeling the same way. Why don't we borrow this name? Let's call this film we're going to make the Buried Life. And then we just made a list of all of our buried dreams and we're like, we're going to go on a two week road trip. We're going to accomplish as many dreams as we can, but we're also going to help other people achieve their dreams. And that's what the film's going to be. And it's going to take two weeks to film and we'll be done it two weeks later and then we'll go back to school. So we begged Boron Stoll to get this road trip going. We bought an rv, bought a camera on ebay. Ebay. We built a website by hand. We started to throw parties as fundraisers to pay for gas. And we took a two week road trip in 2006 to go after this bucket list and help other people achieve theirs. And unexpectedly, people started to hear about it and they started to find our website and they started to send us emails and they're like, hey, I saw ride a bull on your list, I can help you. I saw get up on a hot air balloon, I can help you. And so we're like, oh my God. People are actually wanting us to achieve these goals and then they start sending us their dreams, asking for our help. So this two week road trip, it ended up lasting 12, 13 years. And the list items like those big dreams, because when we wrote the list, we just pretended we had $10 million and we pretended we could do anything. So it was like, play basketball with Obama, have a beer with Prince Harry, pay off our parents mortgage, make a TV show, get interviewed by Oprah. Like these really pipe dreams that we never thought would happen. But the more we did it, the more those big list items started to fall off the list. And this two week road trip really turned into a philosophy. A way to live life by following your true self. And what I realized was when I wrote my list, it was the first time in my life that I actually identified and proclaimed what I wanted. And then when we went out and we shared it and we talked about it and we would talk about with anyone that would or wouldn't listen, right? People on the street, on radio stations, whatever we could. And by talking about it, it was liberating. These are my goals and dreams. And I realized that that was such a key piece in my mental health healing journey, was coming back to doing the things that I truly wanted. Now let's be very clear, like therapy was by far the most important part of this journey. And there were many other things that contributed to me coming out of that depression. But I really believe, and when I start to feel depressed, I know that I, part of me is not following my true self. There's a major part of my life that I am being inauthentic with, whether it's a relationship, a job or something I'm spending a lot of my time in doing. And that's something that I need to stop and look at and shift. And that paired with sleep and exercise and hanging with the right people and the right therapist, you know, has, it's sort of, that's my mental health toolkit that I use to stay healthy. But this idea that I think a lot of us have is that it's selfish to have these personal goals and passions I really think is backwards. I think it's actually service because when you put yourself first, you're able to make a bigger impact and you're able to, I think, be happier. And so it started as a two week road trip and it brought us to LA to make a TV show and it got us on Oprah's couch. It was this wild journey that we also along the way realized all these big ticket list items are really fun. But when we help someone else do something that they want to do, that's an immediate connection that almost lasts for a lifetime, you know, because you're, you're sharing this moment with someone that means so much to them. And so you realize like, wow, you can actually get so much more from, from giving. And so it's been a wild, wild ride. But that's what brought me here.

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Oh my gosh. Oh, I love this for so many reasons. Okay. Especially the, the mental health aspect because I have kind of discovered and uncovered what you have around. Like, okay, when I, when I go for these big things or when I help people do it, I feel less like anxiety, I feel less depression, I feel less lonely for you when you were like, really in it. And whether it was on the Road or doing those things, did you notice that you pretty much felt very, I guess, stable, like, you felt pretty darn good all the time? What were some of the things that you noticed while you were in it and on the road? Did you feel, like, content? Did you not feel depressed or anxiety for the most part, within doing those things?

Well, the biggest thing is I just felt energized. Like, I felt unbelievably excited, which is, like.

So the opposite of depression. Anxiety. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, I felt as well that, like, things were starting to happen for us, you know, and. And there was this. This momentum and this ease that was. That we were creating that you just wanted to follow, even though everyone around you was saying, you know, this isn't a good idea. You're gonna, like, drop out of school and go continue this road trip. You know, you just got into business school, you know, and so I think that when you are true to yourself, life happens for you. You start to get into a flow state with life. Whereas when you're not, small things that shouldn't be so hard end up really being hard. And. And that's a big indicator for me when I start to question, like, why is it so hard? You know, like, it just. This should not be this difficult, and my day should not be this difficult.

Yeah.

And so I look at. Am I really being true? Because this is not a new feeling. This poem was written 175 years ago articulating the same feeling. Like, this is the human condition. And if anything, it's much worse now than it was in 1852, because we have so many things to bury us. Right. We have technology, you know, we have isolation. We have all of these other factors that really dampen this full expression of who we are. And so if you look at the number one regret that people have on their deathbed, it's, I wish I would have lived for me, not for other people, or not the life that others expected of me. So I started realizing, okay, this guy wrote this poem in 1852. He was talking about this. I felt like this research coming out of Cornell is talking about the biggest 76% of people on their deathbed. Their number one regret is not living the life they wanted to. This is a huge problem. Like, this is the biggest problem, I think, that we have right now is that we're unconsciously not living for us. So first we need to say, okay, why is this happening? And I think this ties into achieving your New Year's goals is because these are the things that bury you okay. So the first is, with these personal passions and goals, there's no deadlines. We think we have all this time, but then we realize that it's too late. And so there's no accountability. And we have accountability and deadlines for everything else in our life. So that's why we always push these personal goals to the back burner. And so there's three ways to create accountability. Write your list. It actually seems very small, but it's like a contract with yourself. When you write your bucket list, you take something that doesn't exist, and that's a thought that's intangible. You make it tangible. Then you have a reminder that it exists. So that actually creates accountability. You talk about your dreams, and I think that there's valid reasons for keeping things close to the vest. And I understand that sometimes you can talk about these things that aren't real, and you don't feel like you want to until they're actually solid because they're fragile and people can crack them. Right? So, like, when you put it out there, someone can be like, that's not. That's a dumb idea. Like, really? You want to do that? Like, I don't think that's really feasible. You got a good thing going. Don't be dumb. You know, But I. I think there's. There's much more. There's a lot of more positives that come from sharing your goals because you. You create accountability. Because if I tell you right now, hey, you know what my goal is? Like, I'm gonna learn to crochet. I'm gonna make the best stocking next year. I'm gonna sit and I'm gonna. And then I run into you back here when you're back in. In la, and you say, like, hey, how's crochet coming? I can't wait to get my stocking that you said you're gonna send me. And I'm like, oh, I better start learning how to crochet. Right. So you feel accountable to the people you share them with. If you. If you announce something on your podcast, you're probably gonna do it.

Yeah.

You have thousands of people. They're like, okay, Lori, where is it? Right. Yep. So you build accountability, and you also give other people the opportunity to help you. If you don't talk about your dreams, no one can help you. Yes. The only way that we cross things off our list is through the help of strangers. And I was always so surprised how people stepped up in unexpected ways to help us. You know, they came out of the Woodwork, literally by the, by the second and third road trip that we did, because we just kept doing it, we have thousands of people wanting us to cross everything off our list. And this is pre social media, right? This is like 2006, 2007. Facebook's in universities. Twitter still has just started. YouTube just started getting going, but it wasn't like today. So it was this in pouring of support. And so I find that people are generally more willing to help than you think. And sometimes you feel like you can't ask for help, but I really encourage people to just ask. The worst they can say is no. Then if you can have someone that checks in on you, like an accountability buddy, then you increase your chances of success by I think about 77%. I mean, you know about like training with a training partner, right? Like you don't feel like going to the gym. Well, they're there to pick you up, so you're going to the gym. So that's the one of the three big things is there's no deadlines. The second is usually we're waiting to feel inspired to go after these things, or you're sort of waiting for the right time, but that just rarely comes. Like, you don't get hit with inspiration. You create your own inspiration through action. And so that's why it's so important once you write your New Year's resolutions or you write your goals, is you start with the easiest thing you can think of to move a fraction closer to that goal. And so you want to start even if you don't know what the next step is after that, you just start with that first one. Call a friend or ask for help, right? Book the ticket, go online, do some research, write the first page of that book, and you start to build inspiration. I think sometimes we plan too much and we just forget that action is a plan. And so you want to create that momentum. So you're the architect of your own inspiration just by taking action. I'll say the third one quickly and then we can talk about it. Is, and this is the biggest, is fear. So when you look at your goals and you are like, I'm afraid of what other people are going to think of me going after this, or I'm afraid I'm going to fail you and everyone else will feel like that. That is a completely normal feeling. And that feeling does not go away. That is a tax you have to pay to achieve your goal. That discomfort and that fear, that that's vulnerability, that that means that you're actually pushing yourself to grow. At the very least, you're going to learn something about yourself. And I always thought, like, I was so worried about what other people thought. I was like, oh, what are they going to think about me when I do this? Or if I try and I fail? And I just like, I'm like, dude, people aren't thinking about you that much.

So true.

They just don't care. They're also too busy worried about what other people think. Going to think about them all the time. So, like, a lot of these fears we're making up, you know, you look at the fear of failure, it's like, yes, that is a real fear, but what are the not. What's the risk? What's the real risk? What is at risk here? And I think that if you make a list of those things and you start to say, okay, is your livelihood at risk? Financials or your house or your family? Like, yes, of course. Take care of those. Make sure you don't put those at risk. But a lot of times it's the ego, right? Or it's fear of what other people think and that type of thing. So, in short, you know, you've written your. Your. Your list of goals, and now it's like, okay, what are these barriers? Like, what am I eventually going to hit? Well, you're gonna have to create accountability because there's no deadlines, which means you're gonna have to get an accountability partner or you're gonna have to tell people about it. Second, don't wait. Like, right after this podcast, just start. Make sure. Write three things you can do in the next 48 hours and go after those three things. Create your own inspiration and understand that. That fear, you're not going to conquer it. And then you're going to be ready. You're going to have to move through that. And that actually is a net positive.

Oh, man, there's. There's so much good stuff here. So I was just thinking about you and your journey with fear, and I was like, okay, well, I wonder what he did when you were first doing this, you know, going into these things, and you had a lot of fear around it. But I'm like, wait, he had all these people around him who also had this same idea that you're probably all not going to be scared to death at the same exact time. So how does that work? Like, what. What did that look like? Were there moments where you guys were all like, God, I don't know. Or tell me about some of those. Just the beginning moments when things are. They're they're messy, right? They're just all over the place.

I mean, we almost didn't go. We borrowed an RV from our friend's uncle that was so run down. It was a 1977 Dodge Coachman RV pulled it out of a swamp. Keep in mind, we don't have, like, we worked two jobs each for 90% of the summer to afford to take two, like, two weeks off. Right. So we're. We just have a couple thousand dollars between the four of us. We have companies that have given us juices so we can live off in the rv. We have Red Bull giving us Red Bulls. A granola bar company gave us granola bars. Like, the community rallied to help us make this happen. And we get the RV checked out by a mechanic because we're like, we don't have enough money to tow this back if it breaks down. And mechanics, like, don't expect this to make it back. And so the night before we're supposed to leave, I remember this clear as day. We're sitting outside on the curb now it's like nine o', clock. And we're just talking about how this is a dumb idea. How do we afford to bring this RV back and what are we really doing? How are we going to help people? How are we going to. Our goal is to achieve all 100 things in two weeks. And I remember Dave, one of the guys, just said, we're. All three of us are naysaying. We're like, I don't know. I don't think it's going to work. And Dave's just like, guys, we've come this far. We're doing it. And it was just like, all right. And so many moments when, you know, I tell the story in five minutes, it feels like a rocket ship. We're talking about, you know, 10 years. And there were many moments of, you know, where I would. I got depressed again because, like, we had spent all this time on money and making the film, and then we ran out of money and we just went back to. I worked in a bar at that time. Interesting. And anytime I felt down, one of the guys would pull me up and vice versa. So, like, that's the accountability, though, right? And that is also the power of surrounding yourself with people that inspire you.

Yes.

So that when you. Not only are they going to be your biggest cheerleader and they're going to be happy for you when you win, they want you to win, they are going to pick you up when you're. When you're down and we all need that. And so there's no way I would have done this on my own. Right? There's just no chance. And it would have been as fun.

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So I've been a solopreneur. We work with a lot of them. We've helped a lot of different people like come together. We create these containers because I'm like, I can honestly say I believe in what you're saying so much that when people work alone and they're not reaching their goals, I'm kind of like, I just want to be like. And you're not ever going to. If you don't find these groups of people, you know, to do them with or you're going to be absolutely miserable if you don't find these groups of people because you will hit a wall and you won't come out, you'll start telling yourself a story. Because alone, I feel like alone we can, we really feed ourselves a negative story. And together I just, I believe that we're meant to be together. So I have a couple of questions around just like your experience while you were, were doing this and obviously you have some science around the, like achieving goals as well. But what were like some universal truths that were undeniable for you to see that? Like maybe there was two or three of them or maybe just one that came out of this experience. Like maybe we start relationships. Or was there a universal truth around relationships and achieving your dreams that you found throughout this experience?

Yeah, I mean, I think one is just this. Absolutely. I think if I could drill down the one thing that changed my life was this intention of leaning into relationships that gave me energy. And I still to this day try and do that. So that means if I meet someone, I now know right away whether I love them because I feel it. I feel. It's not like I feel I am more myself around these people. I'm having more fun. I. I have more ideas. And. And so I know that the. This person has probably got a group of friends that is similar. So I try and meet their friends.

Yeah.

And inevitably what I found is that. So when you start to surround yourself with these types of people that are inspiring, you know that they give you energy and are doing things that you find inspiring, you by default then think that you can do things that are inspiring and you think that you can achieve your goals because you see people around you that you know doing the same thing and you know that you're not very different than they are. Whereas when you see someone you don't know. Right. If I don't know you and I. I see Lori, I'm like, Jesus, wow. She is. She's got her shit together. Like, she is smarter than me. She has it all figured out. You know, she is better because you don't know them. But when you, if you know, now that we're friends and I see you, I'm like, wow, like, that's inspiring. Laurie did that. I wonder what I could do. And that's. I think this the shift that happens, you start to. Instead of think they're better than me, you think, wow, that's amazing. I wonder what I could do. And that's what happened to me. In high school, a friend of mine started a clothing line out of nowhere. I was so blown away. How did you do this? You don't have experience in fashion. And he's like, what do you mean? I just took out a loan and did it. I was like, what? Like, that's.

Wait, so I could do that.

I was like, well, if he. I thought if he started clothing line, what do I want to do? And I was like, I want to make a movie. And so that's where the buried life started. Wow. And so what happens is it's sort of like the high tide rise, the boats, right? So this, your subconscious starts to believe in you a little more when you are around these people because you're energized. You see people doing great things and you start to believe it's almost by osmosis that you can too. And then you can go to great people for support. And so that I think is one huge thing. The other piece is that it's not selfish to go after your bucket list, it just is the opposite. And I'll tell you why. Number one, you are not going to be truly happy if you're not doing those small things that make you feel most alive. You're just not going to be truly fulfilled. And you won't be able to take care of the people around you if you don't do those things. You won't be able to do your job at the highest level if you don't do those things. Because all of these things make you who you truly are. And when you are who you truly are, that is when you are in your position of power. And that's when life starts to happen for you, as I said. And so this is so big because it also inspires other people to do what they want to do. And so one of the things that I was found so fascinating was like we went on this road trip and our list wasn't even going to be in the documentary because we thought like, who cares about our list? Like that's self serving. We'll ask people, what do you want to do before you die? And then if we can help them, we will. And that's what the doc will be about. And unexpectedly, other people were inspired to go after their bucket list just because we were. And then I realized, wow, there's this ripple effect that happens when you do what you love. You inspire other people to do what they love. And that is an amazing thing, right? So it's really not selfish to pursue these things. You inspire other people, you get to fill yourself, you get to be better in your career. And so I think that's just a narrative that we need to flip. It's the same narrative of like, I feel guilty taking vacation, right? Well, you're not taking time off work, you're taking time off for work. You're recharging yourself so you can come back and be better. So that's the second and the third one is just I try and think about my own death as much as possible just to remind me that I'm not going to live forever so that I can keep these in perspective. And we got really lucky by coming up with this, you know, sort of coming to this question, what do you want to do before you die? When we were, you know, younger, that the answer to that was our bucket list. And then we'd ask other people, but for us, it was just death was the only thing that actually shook us enough to realize what was truly important. And the older I get, the faster my life seems to move, and the more I forget that it's the small things that mean the most and that it doesn't matter how much money I die with. Like, I was just saying, I just talked about the book Die with Zero. It's amazing. Book just basically says you should die with zero money. Doesn't mean that you shouldn't give money to your kids and stuff, but give money to your kids while you're alive, like, while they can. You don't die with money, right? Like, if you die with, like, $80,000, there's a year and a half of your life that you could have not worked. Like, that's crazy. Yeah. So I love talking about death, you know, I love doing anything. I have an app on my phone that reminds me I'm gonna die, like, five times a day. We croak, and it sends you quotes like, because it really. It's so wild to me that you think there's only one thing that we can count on, and that's that we're gonna die. Everything else, you know, and we don't even know when we're going to die. But, like, if we see someone in their 90s walking slowly, shuffling along the street with a cane, hunched over, our initial reaction is not, oh, my God, that's going to be me. Our initial reaction for me is, I. I don't think about it at all. I don't even notice the fact that my own mortality doesn't hit me, not even for a fraction of a second. And I keep going on with my life. And so I think that's why people end up with that regret. Because you think you have all this time, but a year from now, you're going to wish you started today. So that's why you got to create this inspiration through action, and you just got to start moving towards it. You don't need to know how you're going to achieve your goal. In fact, a lot of times, we can't even imagine Ourselves achieving the goal. We don't know what's possible until we're actually doing it. But you will prove to yourself that it's possible, and that'll be a little domino that will fall, and you'll continue to build that belief in yourself that you can do these things.

I love that conversation so much. We actually talk about that all the time, we. About death. And I was just hearing. I'm trying to remember what area it is, but it's like they, you know, for different blue zones and things like that. Like the happiest, happiest, healthiest people in the world. And most of those people talk about death all the time, or it's like a normal part of their culture. And it's like, it's such a way to live a more fulfilled life. We recently lost my husband's dad, like, out of the blue. He was, like, the best family member of all of us. What's been interesting is, while that was the most painful thing ever, we live more now than we ever did before because his life now means something by us utilizing his death and saying, life is this precious. Like, how can we live more to even honor him? And how do we live even more because of this, you know, human. And knowing that life is so short. And I can honestly say, like, that is. It was my worst nightmare. I don't know about for you, but it used to be my worst nightmare to, like, lose someone really close to you. And while it was the worst thing ever, it was also, like, the biggest gift of. Of. Of living life. Like, it was remarkably, like, moving and special and all of the things. But I love that you share that, because I do think it's such an important, like, realization of what this gift is every single day and how we as humans, like, man, we blow things out of proportion. We make up stories, we, like, sit in our fear by ourselves. That's why I love your accountability portion, too, is it doesn't let you sit and wallow in those things that aren't even real. Like, how much of our life do we spend in something that's not real? You know, I got to.

I couldn't. I got severely depressed worrying about something that hadn't happened.

Yeah, totally.

Like, I. I missed a big kick in high school at a big game, and I was like, oh, that could not. If I do that at the World cup, like, no.

Yeah.

So that was. It hadn't happened, and it never did. I never even got a chance to have it happen because I couldn't go. And, you know, you look at like, okay, wait, am I going to be worried about this in a year?

Yeah.

Am I even gonna remember this in a year, five years? Or like, like use your future self as a barometer like I always liked. I'm like, okay, what? Let me ask my 90 year old self, old Ben, like shuffling along the street, this shuffle, puck stick, going to his, his exercise class, his Jazzercise. Yeah. Like, will you regret not doing this? Ask your future self, your 90 year old self or yourself on your deathbed, Whatever is like the one thing that you actually feel is as real as it can be. Are you going to regret not doing this on your deathbed?

I love that actually. It's funny, I've asked like my younger self things, but I've never actually like sped up to my 90 year old self and been like, hey, how do you feel about this?

Oh, they gotta go there. They're the smartest.

Yeah.

They live the whole life. They got all the answers. Yeah. And then if the answer is, is yes, I mean, I think you have to do it because here's this. This actually reminds me of a really good quote from Les Brown. This is. I just read this and it's like one of my favorites. Imagine being in your deathbed and standing around your bed is the ghost of your dreams. The ideas, the abilities, the talent given to you by life. But you, for whatever reason, never pursued those dreams. You never acted on those ideas, you never used those gifts, you never used those talents. And there they are staring at you as you were lying on your bed with large angry eyes. And they say, we came to you and only you could have given us life. And now we must die with you forever.

Oh, that is like the best quote of all time.

Isn't that amazing?

That is so essentially everyone. Your dreams are going to haunt you for the rest of your freaking life.

If you don't do them 100%. You have to. That's why people die with that regret. That is what Tom Gilvich found. People regretted that ghost, the ideas, the dreams, that's you unfulfilled. Only you have the ability to bring those dreams to life. You have an obligation to at least try so that you don't have that regret. And so this is another great one by BJ Miller. This is more about like, people, not really like, internalizing their death. The graveyard is the richest place on earth because it's, it's here that you will find all the hopes and dreams that were never fulfilled. The books that were never written, the songs that were never sung. The intentions that were never shared, the cures that were never discovered, all because someone was too afraid to take that first step. Keep. Keep with the problem or be determined to carry. Yeah, they were right. They were afraid to take that first step or keep with the problem or determined to carry out their dreams. So, yeah, this is, like. This is what it's all about. And I think that the bucket list is, like, it feels like such a simple, almost trite idea, right? It's a little trivial, like, okay, bucket list, I think. No, that's not what a bucket list is. A bucket list is a list of all the things that you will regret not doing at the end of your life. Anything that brings you joy and happiness, big or small. And so that's why I encourage people to just forget anything they know about a bucket list and rethink it and think about, like, all 10 categories of your life so that you actually write a bucket list that is well rounded and holistic and reflects those things. So it's not just adventure travel. It's not just bungee jump and travel to France. Like, those. Those are on there. But it's also, what are your relationship goals? What are your physical health goals, mental health goals, intellectual goals? What do you want to learn? Financial professional? How do you want to give back? Right? So all you want to think about all 10 categories of your life when you write your list.

Okay. There was so much right there that I'm like, okay, I have so many thoughts around what you just said that are just. You're. You're amazing. I love it. So, like, some of the things I. I think of too, is like, oh, my gosh. Like, think of, like, your. You in particular, Ben. Like, think of your grandparents, your great grandparents. Like, think of all of the ancestors who literally got you here, and imagine if you didn't go and do the thing. Like, right now, they're probably literally cheering like, oh, my God, this guy took all of the hard work and actually used it. Like, thank God lineage is doing. Like. Like their life wasn't for nothing. I think of that sometimes. I'm like, I don't like my great, great, great, great, great grandmother. Like, how cool would that be to be like, oh, because they did what they did. I am here doing this. Like, I don't want to waste the opportunity of the evolutions that have happened in my family line. Like, you know, when they're like, damn it, she had everything. It was the easiest time in history to ever do anything, and she squandered it. Like, and we Sacrificed and suffered. Like, I think of that a lot. I'm like, it really is such a crazy time in history, isn't it, that we can think of something and get it out into the world or like you did with your friends. How incred. I think some of the questions that come up for me that I'd love to ask you around. I know we have the accountability and the. For the fears and things that come up, but can you tell me the difference in what you have found between, like, fear and the anxiety of meeting someone? Or, like, what is a normal fear?

Or.

Okay, I'm asking this specifically around, like, meeting people. So when you meet someone, how do you know that that's a fear of, like, oh, they make me nervous because they're just maybe like, you know, ahead of me. Or is it a real energy of, like, I should stay away from them? How do you, like, differentiate between those fears? Does that make sense?

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. So I think one thing that, I mean, I guess I could just speak from my experience. I think that there's a very thin line that separates anxiety and excitement. Anxiety and excitement are very similar feelings. And when my therapist said this to me, it kind of, like, clicked in a way that really resonated with me because I'll just give you an example. I do a lot of speaking, and when I'm nervous for a big talk or whatever it might be, I say, well, I must be excited because I know that it means enough to me to actually feel something. And that fear, that anxiety and excitement are so similar. I can shift some of that anxiety into excitement. So if you're meeting someone, you know, that you look up to or that, you know, whatever reason is giving you that. That feeling of butterflies, it's like, well, this is a really cool moment to be alive. Like, I'm actually feeling something. That's why I think sometimes when you're sad, it's amazing because you actually feel alive even though you're really, really sad. You know, I think, like, deep down, if you know you're going to be okay. Which, by the way, like, I've been at points where, like, when I first hit my depression, I didn't know, and that is terrifying. But, like, now that I'm older, I know myself a little more. It's like, I know that I'm going to be okay. And so when shit hits the fan or, like, something happens and I'm like, I feel that I'm, you know, I just kind of feel and let it wave, wash over me because I also feel like. Like I'm alive. And so just, like, noticing that you're feeling these feelings, and that's pretty an amazing thing to feel. And so I kind of be grateful for that and know that, like, a lot of that is excitement, that you're excited to meet this person because they inspire you or they mean something, or this is an opportunity where your life might shift a little bit. And so then you meet them, and then I think it's trying to just be yourself and feeling how it's feeling to be interacting with that person. And this is, like, a harder one to answer because I think it's different for everyone. But for me, when I feel the difference being like, oh, this. This. This. This energy isn't right, or, like, the. This person is not someone that I'm going to be doing business with or hanging out with or whatever, it's just, how do they make me feel? Do I come out of that a little tired? Do I come out of that energized? And so. And I'm excited or, you know, do I feel like myself around them? Sometimes I don't feel. I don't. I'm like, what. What were you doing back there? Like, that was weird, Ben.

Like, you know, oh, my God. I know this all too well, where I'm like, do I not like me or do I not like them? Or are we not a match?

Like, yeah, yeah. I think if you act weird around people, you're like, okay, that's a good indication. It's just, like, you're trying to be someone you're not, and that means, like, there's just not maybe the right, you know, fit there.

I was just at a party, and I was like, why were you so weird? And I was like, it's okay.

It's okay.

We can move on from that. It just was not jiving between us. But it came out as me. You know, like, sometimes, especially if you podcast and you speak, you know how to fill space, which doesn't need to be filled, so you're just, like, filling it with the weirdest. It was so weird. Anyway, Been there multiple times. Okay, so how about the difference between. You were talking about when something is hard and you're questioning, like, God, why is this so hard? And then a challenge? Because I do feel like in my life, I'm always going, challenge does make me happy, and it makes me. It's like, such a huge thing for me. I need new challenges. I love to, like, become a new person through a challenge. But then there's the Hard. Where I'm like, is this hard or is this a challenge? Like, is this something that I'm holding on to that doesn't need to be in my life anymore, that I'm trying to just bust through, but it's just not feeling right, you know? Can you explain to me, like, do you know what I'm talking about? Do you have that in your Life?

Okay, yeah, 100%. So I think that it comes down to, for me, when I am continually hitting this challenge, and it gets to the point where I just don't want to do it anymore. I've just sapped all of the passion out of this thing because of the consistent, you know, headwinds or whatever. Then I step away. I step away and I just say, oh, I guess, like, this is. Like, I tried that and it didn't work. And maybe I'll come back to it later and I'll feel reinspired and try it a different way. And I think sometimes you need that space. Right. So give me an example. We did Buried Life, which is the name of the. Of the project, and then the TV show and the book and stuff. And then, you know, we did a bunch of speaking after the book, and we just all got zapped and we were like, okay, we're done. Started a production company, did some other things, and then I got asked to do a TEDx talk, and I was like, I'm not doing that. I was. I literally almost wrote back. I was like, sorry, I'm.

What was the immediate. No. Was it because you were still exhausted?

No, it's because I was. I was. Yes. When I was burnt out on the Buried Life stuff, but mainly I was afraid.

Oh.

I was like, this is going to be online forever.

Yep.

And. And anyways, I ended up doing it because I knew that that was the reason why I had to do it, was I was. Didn't want to do it. And that ended up launching my whole Speak career and got me re. Inspired to write the next book and reinspired to do what I'm doing now, which is like, the same thing, but it's a different. I'm doing it in a different way. Right. And so I think space is good. You come back to it and you want to be inspired to do it. Like, you don't just want to be hitting your head against the same wall until you're. Until you die. Right. Basically. So I think that that is something that has definitely helped me. And then. So it's. It's an energy thing. That's the biggest.

Okay. So we're going to talk about this amazing tool that you've created for everybody. But before we do that, I want to know in your life right now because you know, you're, especially if you do this, you're. You're always looking for a challenge or you kind of just, just mentioned like where there's resistance or what you're avoiding, you tend to go towards or you know you need to do it. What is something in your life that you're like, oh God, this is the next evolution or next level. But it's feeling kind of scary. And then I'm guessing you're gonna use your journal to overcome it. The tools. The tools.

I hope so. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I am, I am sort of conflicted about the number 100 on the list. So we did 96 of a hundred of those original dreams and.

Oh, okay.

But also like added tons more. And it's not really, it's not about like the 100 done because you grow, you change and your list changes with you. But it is, I think, fun to think about. Can we do all 100? Number 100 is go to space. And I'm super close to like signing something to go to space in the near future. Yeah, it's very, I'm like, okay, wait, is this that I actually want to do? You know, and so that's, that's definitely. There's some legitimate fear there. Yeah, there's. There's probably some made up fear as well. But that's one thing that's kind of top of mind. The other thing that I would love to big challenge and I is finish the film right. Like we started this whole thing to make a movie and we thought it would take two weeks, then we'd be done and here we are 15 years later. But I just recently looked through all the footage with, with Dave, who's one of the guys. We put it all in one drive and. And this footage of us in 2006 and 2007. We were so young and we didn't know anything was going to happen and we just like, we just wanted to feel something and that's. And we were following this feeling. And I just think it's so relatable to so many people these days, more so now than then, you know, just this feeling totally feeling buried and struggling with depression, struggling with feeling stuck and feeling not like they're being their full potential, like hitting their full potential. And so I, I want to finish that film and that can be hopefully the thing that will inspire people for, you know, Years and years to come. So those are the two big things, the two big challenges. Right?

Okay, so the space one. Are you asking yourself questions around, like, okay, is this. If there was no risk, obviously, you. You'd go, yeah, because that's amazing. You want to do it, but is it worth risking? Is that what you're asking? Like, is this something that I would actually be willing to risk my life over?

Yeah, like, right.

So you're weighing that. That's how I am with skydiving. I'm like, I just. I don't know if I want it that bad. Like, I know I would love it, but I also am just not sure if that's worth it to me. Like, I bungee jumped, and I was like, I think I'm good.

Yeah, but you don't really get to terrifying.

But, yeah, terrifying. And I can't really tell you to go to the planetarium. That's not quite the same.

But also terrifying. Yes. Okay.

Equal to. Okay, so tell me about the journal. Because it's amazing. It essentially takes everything that we talked about and gives you, like, step by step, daily, and is not overwhelming. Like, I. I literally. It's just. Should be. It's like the Bible number two. So there you go.

Thank you. I love that. Thank you so much. Yeah. So, yes, the bucket list journal is. It's kind of like your accountability buddy. You still need real people to be accountability buddies, but this is your accountability buddy in your back pocket, if you have a fairly large back pocket. But no. So this is basically, you're going to write your list in those 10 categories, right? You're going to write. You're going to. Sometimes it's overwhelming to look at a blank piece of paper and just think, okay, what's my life's purpose? What's everything I want to do? So I. I like structure. So you write your intellectual goals, write your financial goals. It gives you thought starters, right? So it's like creative goals. You're like, well, what are creative goals? Well, it's like, is it take a painting cast, write a book, learned an instrument, Take improv. Like, start using your. Your. Your camera more, start a YouTube channel. So take pottery class. That's probably my favorite creative one. And then you learn about, like, okay, what are these barriers that I talked about? Looks at the research. And then you. You start to take these steps to overcome those barriers. So you set a deadline, you set a reward for your goals. So you get something when you do it. You said, choose an accountability buddy. You share your goals with your Accountability. You break your goals down to smaller steps. You identify why. And so the big thing is, like, I think you want to write your list in a beautiful place that you're going to keep forever, because don't write it on an app, on your phone or notes. Don't write on a loose leaf piece of paper, because this is going to change. So you want to come back, you want to update your list, and you want to keep it in a place that you love to come back to. So I tried to make it nice, you know, and beautiful, and it's really cool because now there's a lot of them that are out there, and people are, you know, sharing stories of things they've accomplished. Taking their, you know, like, parents to Ireland, you know, or climbing Kilimanjaro, or sometimes just the simple things, like reconnecting with someone they've lost touch with that they just would regret not calling up and chatting to and telling them how they really felt if they died tomorrow. And so it feels small to write your list, but, you know, you're 40% more likely to achieve it just by writing it down. That's easy. 40%. So you want to. You want to take that. So even if you don't buy the journal, write your list in a journal. And you can go to writeyourlist.com, which is the bucket list journal website. It's writeyourlist.com, you can use those 10 categories as a guide and find a safe place to write. Write your list.

There's something really magical about even writing, like, the act. I feel like you already feel creative, especially with the prompts of knowing. And there's something, like, cathartic about. Right. Actual writing, like handwriting.

Yeah.

Is so awesome for me. And writing it down. So, I mean, everything that you have shared is exactly how I've accomplished anything. Like, I wouldn't have been able to do anything that I've done without all of the things that you said. Truly. And when there's been a hole in something, it's. It doesn't get accomplished if I'm missing one of those pieces. So, you guys, there is a science to it. It's an actual, like, it's. It's one of those. For me, like, when I was asking you about universal truths. There are universal truths to goals, like, to achieving goals. And I know you've talked with so many people and been in so many rooms and done the research, and it's like, why don't we just follow the thing that everybody has used that is saying has worked. So this is what works.

Buy one for your friend because then.

You have your accountability partner.

Exactly. A great gift is the gift of, like, permission to dream, because you need to give yourself permission to dream, but you can give other people permission to dream and support them to do that thing. And I think that, you know, there's a lot of moms out there that have just been selflessly giving for so long, and now's the time for them to dream and you. They need permission because it's just not a muscle. They have worked for a really long time. So I think we all have people in our lives that, like, you're just thinking, you know, it's time for you to get after it, you know?

Oh, man. I. I just want to say one thing on that, because you're so spot on with, like, mothers. And, like, I think women can feel really selfish for going after things. And I just remember growing up, like, I wanted more than anything just for a happy mom. Like, I would have had less time with her if she was just in. My mother's still around. I love her so much. But the conversation is like, they sacrifice their lives for you, but that's not what you actually want for them. Like, I would love to see my friend's mom and my mother go after her dreams rather than, like, just be present, but not actually present in her life, you know, like, to the things that she wants. So I think the biggest gift we can give our loved ones, like, I just want my husband to go after his dreams and be happy. And it's like that everything you're saying, like, that is the ultimate gift to the people that we love, is to show up happy and fulfilled. That's so beautiful. Well, thank you so much. I'm so grateful for you. This conversation has energized me. Where can we order your journal?

Get it on Amazon, Search the bucket list journal or writeyourlist.com. that's probably the best places. I do have a link on my Instagram, which is Ben Nemton.

Okay, amazing. So you guys go give him a follow. Go check it out. Everything is in the show notes as well below. And you know, one of the biggest gifts that we can give to our guest is to give him a shout out and let him know what your biggest takeaway was like. What was your aha moment during this podcast? So until next time, earn your happy. Bye, everyone.

It.