How to Build a Billion-Dollar Business, Exit, and Do It Again with Suneera Madhani

In 2021, we did our series defunding, which that's when, you know, company was valued at north of a billion. And I did the thing. But what happens when you actually land on the moon? When you reach for the moon, what happens? And I was like, wait, what's next? We had the big party, we had all the press, crazy media.

Are you excited during this time?

Super excited, right? I'm doing the things, I'm in the thing and I'm like, it's everything you dream of, like everything you dream of. The most emotional high because you get to check off. I don't know about you, but I'm like, like I love checking off my to do list. Like you got, I literally got to check it off. Unbelievable feeling about what happened when that party was over.

Hey everyone, welcome back to the earn your happy podcast. It's that time of year where we get super confused and stressed out on what on earth to buy everyone for the holiday season. And I'm telling you, it's gonna be the easiest gift of your life to make everybody on your list happy, even the guys to get a glossy subscription. So you guys know that you get 25% off with the code happy. If you go to getgloci.com I'm telling you, you can start a subscription for your bestie, you can start a subscription for your mom. They're gonna love it. You can also stop the subscription at any time and let them take it over. If they're obsessed, it's not your problem any if they love it, they can take it over. So you guys go to getglossy.com you can get 25% off with code happy. And today on the podcast I have the incredible Sunira Badani on the show. We had so much fun on this podcast because we got to be in person. And you guys know whenever I get to be in person, I just feel like you get a whole different vibe from both parties. And she is the founder of Stacks Payments. It is one of America's top 10 fastest growing fintech companies. From an idea to over a billion dollar exit. Like, are you kidding me? It's rare in life you even like get to hear about these things, let alone meet them and drop in with them. So she is the founder of AI fintech company Worth Score, host of top ranking podcast CEO School. And Sunira Madani is an absolute powerhouse entrepreneur and trailblazer. We had the best conversation talking about mindset, grit and strategies behind building not one but two game changing companies in the fintech world. She's one of the rare few who has successfully exited a billion dollar company and decided to dive right back into the startup world with her new venture, Worth Score. It's designed to revolutionize business credit for underserved entrepreneurs. We talked about the power of building meaningful relationships and how your network is truly your net worth. I can't say it enough on this podcast. You need to drill it into your head. We also shared tips for creating your safety net and surrounding yourself champions who believe in you. If you don't have that safety net of people in your life right now, we share what's worked for us to find those close friends in our life who will support our big vision. Sanira also peels back the curtains on what it actually felt like to have a billion dollar exit and why we always need to be building our businesses with the end in mind. Whether you're building the exit or to pass it on to your kids or just because you're obsessed with it, this podcast is for you. Let's get started.

Sanira, welcome to the Earn your happy podcast. I'm so excited to finally be in person with you.

I know. I feel like it's been so overdue. We've been online digital friends for so long. I love your journey. I'm so excited to be here today talking to your audience and finally connecting.

We have been kind of just dming back and forth and I said I've been tapping on her face like liking all of her stuff because whenever you see another woman out there and especially just what you've done and you know, you're blazing trails and you're ahead of me and it's just like one of those things that you're a woman who even though you've done so, so much, especially in a different space, in a space where women are not typically in. It's like when I see somebody like that, I literally can't cheer hard enough because you're making it possible for all of us.

Oh my goodness. You're so sweet. And I appreciate the love and I appreciate the cheerleading and that's what we need as women. We definitely need that cheerleading. It's so difficult. And I'm so excited about your journey as well. And I don't think. And I think that's what's exciting. I think we're all in different phases of entrepreneurship. I'm back, actually. I'm back. I've already built, I've exited, I've sold. I'm back in startup phase again. And it's the, the journey Is. It's hard, but it's fun. And it's even more fun when you get to do it alongside people that are incredible. And so it is important to cheer. Cheer each other on, even if it's from afar, even if it's the double tapping. I feel like I do the same, but it does. It, like, it feels incredible. You could feel the love, and I appreciate the love.

Double tap, share and save everyone.

That's the.

That's the key.

It is. You know, it goes a real. It goes such a long way. It does. I think especially, I feel like people are so stingy with their likes. Right. Like, people are so stingy because we're busy. Right. I mean, I'm stingy. I'm like, well, we'll go through. We'll go through. And I definitely, like, if I have a human connection with someone, I will go out of my way to make sure, like, we cheer. We cheer on the people that we know. But I also think that it's important to cheer on people that we don't know. Yeah, right. Because they need it, too. And there's definitely. I mean, entrepreneurship is the hardest, hardest job that there is. And so just be. You know, I think receiving kindness and then giving kindness, and I think social is. It's. It's even. It's so hard. Right? It's so social is so hard. And so if we can take that two seconds and double tap and engage and, like, and just that one second, it goes a long way, I think. Yeah.

You know, it's crazy. I totally agree. I was just thinking about, you know, as you scroll past people or, you know, someone who just got started or, you know, someone who just had an event. You know, I'm a lot in the event space, and I always think where you could just scroll past because maybe you don't know them. I think about the times when I had my first event and what it would mean to me from someone who's maybe ahead to just put one little comment. It can be the thing that could keep somebody going. Oh, yeah, this is why I do that. Or, oh, my God, somebody saw, you know, all the hard work that I put in. It takes that one second. I know we can't do it to everybody, but when you have that in your head of, oh, my.

It's a weird spot to be where.

You'Re like, whoa, I could actually make a difference with one comment on somebody's stuff.

That's a.

That's a huge thing. Okay, so you had said something where you exited a billion Dollar company.

That's crazy.

I mean, the amount of people who can say that in the world, especially women, I'm like, I could count them on fingers and toes. Like that's insane. And we're going to talk today not only about what mindset that takes to get there, but also you said something crazy that you, like you came back for more, you came back to do it again. So I want to chat about what you would do differently this time, what kind of mindset you had in the beginning to even get there. But what things you're really changing on this second time around. So first for everybody, just talk a little bit about that first company and then I'm going to dig into the mindset pieces of that.

Oh my goodness, it is crazy. I didn't know I could go build a million dollar business, let alone a billion dollar business. And so that's step one is to completely uncap yourself. And I think as women we just, I didn't know it was possible, right. I didn't see women like me doing building fintechs or building, you know, technology companies. And I went for it. I have a crazy, you know, the short version of it as working for a financial services company. I am a fintech, like I'm a finance major, so I happened to actually use my degree. But I was the first person in my family to go to college. I grew up in an immigrant household where there was a lot of love. It was a middle class family. I, everything I had was more than enough. So I didn't grow up in this like, you know, I grew up privileged but in a different way. Like I just had parents who worked really, really hard. And their, their entrepreneurial dream or their American dream was for their kids to go to college. They were entrepreneurs out of necessity. So we had small businesses, we had convenience stores, we had restaurants, like, you name it. And my brother and I worked in every single small business. It was just part of the family story. And so I didn't even realize that I was getting my MBA from such an early age. Right. And conversations at the dinner table. We had dinner every night. Like we had a very traditional, like, you know, family value system of, you know, sitting at the dinner table and having conversations. And I look back at those and I'm so grateful for being part of the dialogue, having a voice at that table, you know, when things were hard. Even though as a kid I couldn't fully understand, but I felt like my opinion mattered and my voice mattered even, you know, at an early age, from.

Both your mom and dad from both.

My mom and dad. And I think it's so important, especially as girls. And I have two girls, I have an eight year old and a five year old. They're the loves of my life. And I look back at how I've been able to champion the things that I've been able to champion in industries that there's, there's no women, there's, you know, their voices are not heard. And that's true for most women. Like our voices are not heard in industries. But I look back at that little girl and I think because my voice was heard at the table, I think I there a part of me felt like I could use my voice. And so I do think it's really important that we incorporate, you know, in parenting for those that you know, have kids. Like incorporate your kids in that. Those are things that I remember that, you know, we were part of it and so I got to see some.

Things or what just for, for anyone who has kids right now, what are some things that were even said at the dinner table or do you like tangible that you do with your kids now?

Yeah, absolutely. I think that having conversations and not just like how was school or you know, what did you learn today? It was, you know, we were talking about if there was any challenges at my dad's store or if there was an employee. You were talking about employee? We're talking, we were chit chatting earlier. We're talking about some team stuff. But he like my parents would be like, well, what do you think? Right. And then that's an interesting, like we were always taught to find solutions. It was like a very, like here's a, here's a challenge. What would you do about it? How do you think we should incorporate that? And with my kids today I feel like we have, you know, our dialogues usually start with what was the best part of your day? Where one of us like that none of us were at or were around. So usually it's like if I'm with my girls will say something about me or I'll say something about them. So like what was their favorite part of the day that none of us experience? So it forces them to think, okay, what was that favorite part? And then what was the hardest part of the day? What was it? You know, did you fail at something today? And I think failure was also okay. So like talking about failures and I got to see my parents fail a lot and that was. There's parts of it that I would say you don't want to be overexposed. Because there. I do think that there were things that, I mean, I wouldn't change any of it. But, you know, I was part of the dialogue, and it was solution. It was like my voice mattered. And so I do think that that was a big part of how I think about raising my kids today. But we grew up in a great family environment. My brother and I were really close. We went to 10 different schools in 12 years, which is a big part of our story. So my parents were always on the pursuit of the next thing. And because it was the next business, it was the next. And that was. Those are things that I didn't love. Right. So there were parts of my story that, you know, we moved around so much. I had to be at, you know, we're gonna go into, like, inner child self already, oh, my goodness. Mindset. Right. But a huge part of my mindset is I always felt like I never had a seat at the table because every. Every school I attended, I was new and I was, you know, I was different, and I was in. I grew up in Dallas, Texas. And so. Oh, yeah. And so I'm going on Friday. Yeah. I loved. I loved Alice Go Cowboys. And so I just felt like I was always. I never had a seat at the table. And that's a huge part of what has been your story, of my story. And so I'm always fighting for, not only for me to have a seat at the table, but I'm always trying to ensure that everybody has a seat at the table. And that's translated, the way that I operate my teams, that's translated into the businesses that I've built. It's always been about equitable inclusion. And, like, that is something that now I'm putting together as an adult, like, thinking back about my childhood, but it's always been about having a seat at the table. I never had one. And it was really. It was. It was difficult, but it also made me. I wouldn't change it. It's made me who I am today. And so I went to University of Florida, got the degree in finance and marketing, worked for corporate and in financial services. Again, like, I saw things. I saw, you know, small businesses firsthand. And payments was something that was a critical part of the business journey. And I saw a need in the marketplace. I saw technology coming into the marketplace. Square was doing something exciting with in person payments. Stripe was doing something great about, you know, digital transactions on, like, the back end. Nobody was bridging the gap for businesses that needed both. Card, present, card, not present. I had this Wonderful idea to go bridge it. I took it back to my bosses. I had zero desire to be an entrepreneur. And they, you know, looked at me as, you know, little girl, great idea.

But like, do you know what that would take?

Yeah. Yeah. Or like, do you know what that would take? Not even, like there. It's not possible, right? Like, what you're trying to set out to do, you can't do it. And what makes you think that you can do it? And what makes you think that we're gonna do it? And so it was just a really, it was like a wake up call of, you know, looking around and they were right, how could I do it? There's no women in the organization. At the leadership table. Every woman that worked in the company was either in an administrative position or in customer support. And I, I didn't have any champions. And to be fair, they weren't wrong. I was 25 years old, right? So I had all these big ideas and so I came back home to, to Orlando and that's where we had moved at that, like, you know, post college. And I was at the dinner table and I'm sharing this experience with my family and my dad looks to me and he's like, well, why don't you go start the company? And I'm like, where do I go find Mr. Visa? Like, how do I go start a fintech? And that was it. That was like the first time that it even crossed my mind that it could. Why wouldn't I do it? I took the idea back to my team. I was a reluctant entrepreneur and so I quit my job and started the company, found Mr. Visa, found MasterCard, found American Express, did all the things. And in our first year in business, we did 5 million in payments. Wow. Five years in business, we did 5 billion in payments. And 10 years when we exited, I did 40 billion in payments. Wow. And so that idea that I wouldn't have done or started or like created not just wealth for our teams and for our community. We were the first, like first unicorn out of Florida, out of Orlando. So many great things that came of it from a community standpoint, but there was, it was so special. We grew our team to, you know, over 400. I did acquisitions, I raised multiple rounds of capital from seed to Series D, which, you know, if you want to scale a big business, you're going to need capital and resources to do it. So I got to go through a really, really big journey and made it all the way to tech unicorn. And that's, that's the story okay, so.

Now we can dig in because everybody, everyone knows what that looks like.

Whoa.

That is insane and amazing and almost seems like a fairy tale. Like, how is that even possible?

Not a fairy tale.

Oh my gosh. Okay, so let's, let's go back to the dinner table. Your dad's like, you should do it.

Yeah.

What are the first steps? So nothing in your brain was like, okay, I'm not going to do it anymore.

Or I'm not.

I'm not going to. Like, everything was gonna. Why, like, why do you think at that point you were just gonna go? What was the mindset? Yeah, around that.

I think that I don't know if I would have made the same decisions as a 37 year old as I did as a 25 year old. Because it was like going, there's nothing for me to lose.

Like, it was.

The naivete was. I was, it was, it was awesome. Like that optimism that like, okay, why not? It was powerful. And I think what is interesting is that's what we're talking about cheerleading, right? Championing. At the end of the day, whether it's. My family was a great champion, but you have to surround yourself. Like you're not gonna have the courage inside of you. That's not where it came from. It didn't come from me. I went and I was like, hey, bosses team, we should do this. You should do this. I just wanted to be like a division leader or like climb the corporate ladder. I think it takes others to see what you don't see in yourself. Yeah, right. And so I think that we all deserve to have champions around us. And especially as women, we're. We're not the ones that are rooting for ourselves. We're the hardest. And even at that age, even though I was young and ambitious, but I definitely think that that courage came from those around me that they believed in me. And I also had a safety net, right. Because I was young and I didn't have much to lose. And I was driving a Volkswagen Beetle and that was my, my one payment. And I like literally moved into my parents house. Right. And so I. You have to also be willing. And I did take risks. I'm not gonna say I didn't. I quit my job. I quit a very well paying for my time and my. Where I was in my career. I took the risk to say that I'm willing to, you know, part of my language, eat shit, right? Like just like I'm gonna, I'm gonna take. Give it a shot. And I could completely fail and there's a monetary loss, right, Because I'm going to hold myself back in my career or, you know, I'm not going to get to do the fun, you know, travel plans to Europe that my friends have, you know, or whatever it is, like, I'm going to have to sacrifice. And I had $20,000 like, that were saved in my first four years of, you know, corporate life. And I was always like, a good steward of money. And so I was like, okay, this is what I'm gonna do. And instead of I could have used that as my savings to go live on my own and go do whatever. I was like, nope, I'm moving back in. And we're gonna take that full 20,000. I'm gonna invest it into my registration. I haven't actually ever shared this. It's so fun how that happens when you tell stories and, like, something you remember details. The details. The registration. When I got mar. Licenses with Visa, MasterCard just for the. I'm sure it's completely different now, but at that time, for just the license, registration, when you got your registration to, like, get the certificate from one of the card brands, or it was. It was for Visa and MasterCard. They came together. It was $10,000 or it was like 11,000, something like. I just remember that half of the money, like, as soon as the bank account was open with that and we had the first important piece of document, I still had to go get the other card brands. I still had so much more to go do. And just seeing my bank account, literally, like, boom, one transaction and there's half of it's gone. Yeah, but that was an important part. I couldn't. I couldn't do anything without that license, without that component. But you have to. You take the risk. Right? And it's also. You've got to be willing to take the risk. You've got to be willing to do it. And I think risk comes from. It's not confidence. Where risk come from. Where it comes from. Risk comes from courage. Right? It comes from courage. And I think that it does take. Even at that age, even I had nothing to lose. It took a lot of courage. And I'm really proud of her.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, my.

We're proud of her.

Yeah, we're proud of her.

So you had mentioned you had said the word safety net, which I love because I talk a lot about building that for yourself, even if you don't have it within your parents necessarily, or maybe you don't have the network or the friend group yet. So if Somebody's listening right now and they're like, okay, well, I'm a little bit further along in my life now. I have kids. I feel like I have a lot more to lose. I don't necessarily have the network yet and my parents don't believe in me. How would you tell them to kind of build in that safety net? So if, if they fail? I think a lot of the reason why people can take risk is because they have a safety net of human beings that love them still, even if they suck terribly and ruin their reputation out in public for a while. So what would you recommend to them in order to like, build that safety net? What should they focus on?

That's such a great question. And I appreciate you asking that because I recognize and I didn't have privilege from a wealth. I had immigrant parents. So it's not like we had like, you know, I didn't have a network. I didn't go like raising, you know, even for fintech, raising venture capital. Like, I did not have the network.

Yeah.

I did not get investment until the first three years of my business. Right. Like, it was, it was the grind.

Yes.

And it was my personal hard earned checks that I was saving. Right. And the safety net was that I did have a. That, that's. That, that, that is a huge part of it. I did have family that I knew no matter what. I mean, I could always crash. Like, I could. I always had my room. Right. Like, I always had people. And I think that's important.

Well, keep the sticky stars up on.

The ceiling in case I have to.

Come back, whatever that looks like. I do think the safety net is something for, you know, entrepreneurs who want to be entrepreneurs or if you're working corporate right now. I think that's really great advice, Lori, that you're giving for you to have a safety net. So what does that look like for you? I think it looks different for everyone. I think at that time I was young and so I didn't have Faisal and I were dating and so. But like, like I think my family, like, as a young. Even though I was like an adult, it was. I was a young adult. And so I think I still like needed mom and dad, like in that way. Like, I just was getting my bearings into the world. So that was my safety net and people. But, you know, I think now my safety net is. Look would look so different. You know, it's my core friendships. Right. It does, it looks. And my family's amazing. My mom lives across the street from me now. My father passed away in 2020, but thank you. But it looks different, like I'm in a different stage of my life. And I think safety net comes from two things of what you're saying. I think there's the monetary safety net, which is important, but you talked about mindset, right? What is a safety net? Right? It's. It's a place that you can go that you feel. You feel protected, you feel. You feel safe, you feel it's okay. You feel like you've got. You've got a place to go, right? That doesn't necessarily mean a roof over your head. It doesn't necessarily mean. It means people that you know won't be disappointed in you, that will cheer you on. And so I do think that it's important for you to think about where you are in your life, in your corporate path or in your early entrepreneurship path. And that's why I believe in having a network like building your network as early as you can. And not just the network like the fake network. Real meaningful relationships are what will carry you through everything. This is the hardest journey, and I'm not shy about saying it. It is the hardest decision. You are crazy for making this decision to be an entrepreneur. You are absolutely nuts. We all, as entrepreneurs who are listening right now are like, I wish I went back to my corporate position and had that 9 to 5 and had that steady paycheck and could turn off, right? What is the saying that you, like, you're you. You know, you leave the 9 to 5 to work 24 7, right?

Totally.

That's what it is. We're not. It's hard. So the safety net, I think, looks more. It's not just about the money, right. I think it's about the community, the people. And if at a different stage in my life, right? So now if I had kids and I was doing it, there is no shot I'm risking their future. I will risk my future all day long. All day long. I could take a bet for making decisions for me, and that maybe has come, you know, a little bit more natural to me. But for my kids, there is no shot I'm risking anything for them. So I do think that if I were to do it, and I'm doing it all over again, but I come from a different place where I'm not risking their future. And so if you do have that fear of risk, fear is normal, right? We all fear failure. We all fear fear of failure.

Totally.

We all do. That's. That's. That's normal. Like, we want to See daily we feel like and it's, it's hard. But what will make you feel, I would ask yourself, like what would make me feel comfortable? Right. So it's not risking it all. You have to take some risk. Scared money doesn't make money, period. So we've got to take some risk. And that risk, I have to also weigh what's going to be if I don't take the risk. Is it better for my kids future, Is it better for me? So there are things that you should be. It's not all or nothing. Everything isn't black and white. And so do what makes you feel, I wouldn't say comfortable, but decide what that is. That that level of risk you're willing to take and then, then you've got to jump. There's a point that you've got to jump. And I've seen entrepreneurs for so long that have incredible like in a great way now you can start a business, we're in 2024. You can start a business like the easiest it's ever been to start a business. You can start a business in 24 hours, get everything set up. Technology is so incredible. So you don't really have much to risk besides your time. And then you can sacrifice that time, you can put the resources in. But it comes to the point where once you start seeing that traction, you've either got, you've got to make the plunge, you've got to. And I've seen entrepreneurs, especially female entrepreneurs where they have the most amazing side hustles and the businesses are growing but they're just not willing to go. You're not going to then see it. Right. You've already like measured the risk a little bit. So you're not going in blindly. You've started the thing, you're getting the traction, you're validating this stuff. That's awesome. Do it carefully. That's probably what I would do today at 37 years old with two kids, if I was starting over and over and I didn't have the financial freedom of dollar to do it, then I would be putting my time, putting my mind, putting my things to validate. But I would still have to jump at some point. And that is important.

So I love that you talked about that because that truly everything that you just said is a based on a belief system that whether you fail or not, you'll be okay because you had like your parents, you had, you know, in your mind you were okay. It sounds like with worst case scenario.

Yeah.

So I'd love to know Was that like a main through line belief of building that company? Like, were you able to say, okay, I can run and take risk because I know that I'm okay with worst case scenario.

Like, how did you. How did you allow yourself to keep.

Going up without getting more afraid as time went on?

Yeah, I wouldn't say that that's fully true. Right. I think, you know, the getting started component or, I mean, it's not like my goal wasn't like, oh, if I fail, I'm just gonna, like, live at home until I'm 40 and like, my mom's gonna like, mom. Totino's like, yeah, yeah, that's not what I want. So that's not at all, like, where my mind was at from a safety net. I just had an encouraging, awesome family. So, like, that's what I wanna share from that story. I think what powered me through and getting through the mindset was I was addicted to growth. Like, I think that there are people that there's ambition, right? There's definitely. We all have that. You have to have ambition to be an entrepreneur. But you've got to also, like, love the. The crazy that, like, you've got, like, there's a part of it, like, even though we're like, super crazy for doing it, even though we're working 24 7, there is a part of you are not going to change it like, you are. You love the growth. You love the inner work that's happening. You love seeing the results of it. There is an addicting, awesome factor to this journey, and that is what keeps you going. That part of your. The resilience, that's where the resiliency comes through. And you have to have such high level of resiliency as an entrepreneur. Like, you really do. And every day I knew I was showing up for a job that was harder than the one I had yesterday. Every single day, it does not get easier. I think a question everybody asks is like, you know, on the journey, like, you know, did it get easier when you're at a million in revenue, 10 million in revenue? If only I had. I had, you know, 100 employees. We had 400. When did it get easier? It never gets easier. You just get better. You get better at solving the problems. There's gonna be another problem to solve. You're gonna, you know, get to it. There's a huge mountain and you're like, all right, let's go climb the mountain. And you're gonna go climb the mountain. You're gonna get to the top and you're Gonna be like, oh, I did the thing. And then, oh, my God, there's another mountain. And you're like, okay, let's do it again. We're gonna climb the mountain. But you've gotta love climbing mountains. You've. You've gotta. There's a part of you that has to. To have that. And so that's what powers you all the way through, is having that strong desire to, like, not just, like, the desire to succeed, but the will to not let it fail. So it's not that I was afraid of failure. I wasn't gonna let it fail. That was the mindset, will you always build? God, I literally thought that I was gonna retire, and I did for not even six months and not retire. I knew I was gonna sit. I sit on boards and I. I have a podcast. I love empowering women in business. Like, this is my jam. This is where, like, it never feels like work. I could do this all day, every day. This is what I want to do with my life for my purpose. And there is something about solving problems. And after I exited the company, which we built this amazing, incredible, you know, payment solution. And it was. It was great, but it was still. I lost the connection to the. Why it was always about my people. Like, it was first about the small business. We solved this problem. Then we were serving enterprise clients, and it started becoming different, right? Like, it just. I was losing that. It just started becoming. I would. I became the corporate that I left, right? With the amount of employees, the acquisitions, the growth. That was. That was great. But then you start losing, like, when I'm not connected to that purpose. So I was a huge part of what was happening for me, and I was just part of, like, you know, when you have a goal, this is what happens to most entrepreneurs is, like, we're setting the goal, and then before we even get to the goal, you raise the bar.

Right?

Right. Then you're starting to get to the goal, and you raise the bar, and you raise the bar, and growth is great, but not knowing where you want to go, that isn't great. And so I did feel like I was surrounded by. When success was happening. I was in such a boys club, and I was letting everyone else define success for me versus ever asking myself, like, when is it enough?

Explain that a little bit, because I. I totally resonate with that. Were you just in. You know, were you just in your meetings and people were like, this is what we should do, and this is the direction. Okay.

But you never.

You never were checking in.

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I wasn't checking in. I didn't make the time to check it right? This is the mindset piece. I was so busy and heads down. We're all so busy, right? We're so, so busy. Our lives are. And at this rate of where technology is today, society is today social media. Like we are just, we're everyone is busy. It used to be we're just like the important people are busy or CEOs. Everyone is super busy. And so I just never made the time to really check in. I was just getting up doing the grind, getting up doing the grind. And I was a young mom, so I was a new mother. So my company came. My company was, you know, born first and then Mila was born and I was. It was hard. It was hard being a new mom. It was hard, you know, being pregnant and doing the things it was hard fundraising while pregnant. I was just. It was all the things that I wanted to have. Our second daughter and I miscarried in between and I went through that journey and then, you know, we. We like family was something that I really wanted to have. I wanted to. To do both. And I didn't see a lot of women sharing both.

Yeah.

So that was really important for me. And so I did the mom thing. I'm doing the mom thing and building and that was really hard. So I didn't. I don't blame her. She didn't. I didn't have the tools or the time or the, you know, to take care of myself first. Yeah. I was pouring into this company and I was pouring into my new family, my. My girls and. And there's. I wouldn't change any of that. Right. I wouldn't change I. Any of that. But I didn't take the time to pour into myself. And so I didn't have the conversations. I didn't do the inner work. I didn't take care of my body. I didn't take. I was just going. And I was so. I was so exhausted. I was so burnt out. And when you're in that, you're in this mental state of like you're just like you're an autopilot. And so for. I literally feel like there were years. Years.

Yeah.

Of my life that I was on autopilot during that company where it was just. It was the grind, it was the work, it was the conferences, it was the meetings, it was going back and it was the kids and it was that like my family and like that was it. Yeah. I didn't look up and that scenario, which I'm so grateful for because she kept putting what. I didn't give up. I did the things, I kept showing up and I was determined to take the company to. To the exit. I was determined to, you know, be the first. I was determined to build a fintech unicorn. As a woman, I was determined. I. And I saw that what we could do. I saw what my team could do. So that is what carried me through it. But I never looked inside and it was not until I think it was 2021. So we sold the company in 2020. We sold a private equity. So there's so many kinds of exits and we could talk about. I love love anybody needs any business like resources. And I think every woman as we're building, we should be thinking about the exit in mind. And so we should. Whether that means you're gonna, you know, give it to your kid company to your kids, or you're gonna sell the business. We need to be building enterprise value for our businesses from day one for another show. But at the. In 2020, I exited the company to private equity and we did a majority buy, which meant that they came in, they bought 75 of the business.

Okay.

And so I was no longer so the owner of the company, right? So even though I had done venture capital, like, I was the. I was a shareholder, right, And I was an employee of the majority. And then the next in, within the next year, we took it from 220 million in value to a billion in value. We did multiple acquisitions in a year in, yeah, 18 months, super fast. And we took the company, it was like 60 million of revenue to over 120 million in revenues. We like doubled against. We were like Inc. 500, Inc. 5,000, like eight times. Like, the most record amount of like, fast, fast, fast growth. But at that. In 20, in 2021, we did our series D funding, which that's when, you know, company was valued at north of a billion. And it was everything that I had could have ever. Like, you know, I did the thing, but what happens when you actually land on the moon? When you reach for the moon, what happens? And I was like, wait, what's next? Like, what? And I finally got a chance to look up. We had the big party. You know, everybody, you know, celebrated. We had all the press. We had like, you know, three weeks, two weeks, whatever crazy media craze. Like, that was it.

Are you excited during this time?

Super excited, right? I'm doing the things. I'm in the thing and I'm like, wow, it's here. And I'm just like, everyone wants to talk. And it's everything you dream of. Like, everything you dream of. It was the most emotionally hot, the most emotional high because you get to check off. I don't know about you, but I'm like, I love checking off my to do list, right? Like, you got. I literally got to check it off. Unbelievable feeling. Unbelievable feeling. Not just for myself, my team, right? Like, there is so much in that. Building a team is the hardest thing you'll do also for another. Another day. So hard. But to see us all do something incredible together, it was. It was amazing. But what happened when that party was over? It was empty. It was like back to the grind. Here's the next plan. Going from, you know, 1.1 billion to 1.7 to the next round to the next thing. And that was like my wake up call. Was like when it died, when I finally got I think great things happened in silence. We're so busy, we're moving all the time. I think this can be applicable to us even in our day to day. I for the first I got to sit in silence when everything was calm and really ask myself like, what is next? Is this what I really want to do? And so you know, I took some time and you know, took my family. We did like our first like four week long vacation to Europe which like I never had a chance to do and really just reflected with my girls, with my spouse, with what we really want to do in life. And that was it. I came back and I knew that I didn't want to go back and I had obligations and I was gonna. I love my company and I was still a huge shareholder of the company and the biggest champion of the company. But it was time for had been a decade, right? And it's okay, you can move on from things too. I never because I'm not a quitter, right? I'm like I'm going, I'm gonna keep going. But I didn't quit. I completed my task, I did what I needed to do and now it was time for me to really check in to say instead of doing what, you know, everyone says I should do, it's what I wanted to do. And so it was the toughest, toughest, toughest decision of my life. And it's the best thing, the best decision I ever made. And from there I got an opportunity to like, you know, have a secession plan, exit the company and take time to say what I wanted to do next, right? And six months later it was like the founding team was like back again. My brother. So I get to work with my brother. I don't think, I don't know if I got to share that. But so that childhood that crazy him and I were co founders and he's like, you know, itching, dying to start something again. And it was this time around, if I'm going to do something, what can I use my knowledge, my resources, everything that I know to go solve and what are the biggest problems that we can go solve. And I wanted to go focus on the, you know, femme entrepreneurship space and like this is where what I love I can make purpose out of my life with this. I don't need any more financial freedom. Like I'm really happy with everything I want, you know, freedom of, freedom of $I want freedom of time. I got freedom of time. I want freedom of impact. That's my Freedom, formula. Those are the three things. And Sal goes to me and he's like, michael Jordan can I swear here.

Oh, yeah.

He goes, michael Jordan can go play baseball. And he can. He's gonna go get endorsements and he's an incredible athlete, so he's gonna be able to play. You know, he's gonna just whatever the game is, he's gonna pick it up, he's gonna do fantastic because he's Michael Jordan. Michael Jordan shouldn't go play baseball. Michael Jordan needs to win fucking championships. And so he's like, go do whatever you want to do, but we need to get back on the saddle in fintech because we know how to solve the world's biggest problems. And that was like, that really hit home for me. I'm like, yeah, we're Michael Jordan and I love athletes. I'm not an athlete, by the way, but I just love, love athletes. And I'm like, I really felt inspired.

Yeah.

And it reignited me. And he was so right. Like, Michael Jordan needs, like, he need to go win fucking championships. And we're at the top of our game. We, like from two immigrant kids, like, literally no network, no nothing. We're at the top of our industry. We have the contacts, we have the network. We can go solve the problems. And then we got into a room and we did not leave that room until we were like, what is the biggest problem to solve? And one of the biggest problems that we face, you know, as minority kids or minority founders, is we couldn't get access to capital. We couldn't get, you know, we couldn't get the lending lines of credits, banking services. Like, as a business, everything is tied to our personal credit score. Even then as an institution. So I was on both sides. So one, as a consumer, as like a small business owner. But then also we were underwriting, like, or we were onboarding so many small businesses. We had 40,000 small businesses under our belt. And we had human underwriters that would manually review. Let's say, you know, Lori's llc. And let's say Lori's not. Nope, not, you know, only three years. Less than three years in business. Nope. Less than. Whatever. Oh, Lord. So there's conscious and unconscious bias as well in the, in the ecosystem. I saw it firsthand. Yeah. And we're making decisions about a business not actually based on business financial data. Right. We're making business decision because there's no standardization of that process. And what's missing is when you go buy a car, when you go buy anything in, like our Personal. In our personal finance world, our credit score determines our financial health and our credit worth. In the business world, there is no business credit score. And so we decided to go build the business credit score. It's called worth because we, everybody needs to know their credit worth. And it should be based on the business financials, not just the, not just the personal financials. And women and people of color. We've been left out of the financial ecosystem across the board and we believe that it should be standardized, we should, it should be regulated. And so that's what we left with in our, you know, coming back and deciding to go build again. And then as any, you know, entrepreneur, you can't eat, sleep, breathe, shower, anything without like constantly thinking of how you're going to solve this problem. So we're back at it again and so we're building again. Yeah.

What are you going to do different?

So much.

What's the main thing that when you sat down you were like, okay, I'm gonna make, I'm gonna make some time. Cause I'm sure this happened. I'm gonna make some time to make sure that these things look different. Give me kind of that list of what really started coming up.

Okay. So first, immediately I would say this time around I'm coming from a place of experience that is, I almost wish I had the naivete as I did when I was 26 because now I know how hard it is and I'm so like now you know what's up ahead. But it's a really great place to come from experience because you can avoid a lot of the mistakes that you made early on, which for me was we went direct to small business first and then we went to Enterprise. And so I went one to one to one to one to one to my customer and then later we went to Enterprise. This time around, guess where I'm going first. Even though we're building the business credit score, it's a one to one business solution. We're going directly to the enterprises first. So we're selling directly to the banks, large fintechs and it's not sexy because the small business is where my heart's at, but they have access to the one to many. Right? So that's something that I never knew on thinking about, you know, I don't have to. And I think this is what's interesting. I, I'm around a lot of women in business through CEO school and just through all the events and speaking at conferences. And I do see that we're, we when we see revenue we really do think that we have to get it one thing at a time. I really encourage us to look at our business models and to say, how can we unlock the one to many, whether it's partnership, channel partnership, you know, what are the avenues to many customers at a time? And so for us, it's, I mean, you know, it's enterprise financial institutions like the banks, credit unions, people, lenders. And so that's one thing that we're doing differently. Secondly, capital. The first time around, I had no access to capital. I had no network. Orlando, Florida is not a venture capital, you know, less than, you know, I think it's 75% of venture capital goes to three states. California, Massachusetts and New York. Right. That's where, that's where the venture capital goes. And from there, the rest, 47 states are left fending for that 25%. Right. That's a challenge. And then women get less than 3% overall of that venture capital, regardless of where, where we're coming from. And minority entrepreneurs get less than 1%. I mean, it's in the decimals. It's not even. It's like a rounding error of what it is. That is a huge gap in our world today. And it's baffling that still in 2024, these are still the stats since I started 12 years ago. Those were the stats back then. These are still the stats now. And a lot has to change for that. And we're working on. That's what I'm trying to work on, on those solutions. But this time around, I do have a better network, right? This time around, I don't need, you know, I remember just the amount of rejection, the amount of showing up and, you know, I had to build investor trust and relationships. I gave away the farm, like building that company. I made so many mistakes, but I don't again, I don't blame her. I had to give up so much equity because it was hard to get investors into the, into the door, right. This time around, I get to come from a place of strength. This time around I have partners like Equifax that are already at the table. Right. This time around, I've got, I've got credibility. And so that is, that is something that is really unique to do it second time around. And I do see why, you know, it's. Again, it doesn't get easier. You just get better is what I said. And this time I'm better. I know. And I would say because I'm coming from a place of experience, I think what you're Gonna love this. I think, Lori, it's. It's my mindset, right? I'm more confident this time around. I'm. I'm not in my head as I was. And of course there's gonna be things that we're gonna fail at, and I know the hard that's coming, but I'm so proud of where I put in the work. I feel like I'm making decisions from a place of. For, like, truly, I really do feel like I know who I am now and I get to make. I mean, don't you feel that way in, like, our 30s and 40s? Like, I'm in, like, in this next chapter in my life. I feel more confident in who I am today than I was in my. You know, it's. I love who I am today, and I love who I'm growing into as well. And so I think that that makes experiences amazing. But experience and maturity is also different. And I'm coming from a much more mature place this time around. And I love who I am now, and I feel confident in who I am, and I feel proud of where I've been, and I'm excited to go where I'm going. And that mindset, that internal dialogue is so freaking amazing. I didn't have that. That was all the doubt, the imposter syndrome, all the things. And not saying that that's not going to be there. But I'm so glad it's scenario 2.0 today on that driver's seat.

Mm. So how does sceniro 2.0 handle? You know, anything that feels a little scary now. Also failure and rejection. Like, how do you tell me about coming home?

She still cries. Yeah.

Okay, great. No, this is so good. Coming home after just like, feeling like you cannot get through this wall and you're not getting the answers you want. What does that actually look like? You walk through the front door. Who are you talking to? Who are you calling? What are your self care routine?

What do you do? Yes. Oh, my God. And it's still. It's still hard, right? Business is so personal. Business is so personal. I was told my entire career that you take things too personally. It's not personal. It's business.

You're like, but I'm a person.

I'm a person. And business is the most personal thing we're ever gonna do. Totally.

Totally. It's like your baby.

It is your baby. It's your baby. And, like, it's where you spend most of your time. Your emotion, especially for women. That's true. We literally are not starting companies for like the sake of starting a company. We're starting companies because there is a problem. We're starting companies because no one solved this. We're solving companies because we're not heard it. Things have to be different. So as women, we are very purpose driven already in what we're building, in what we're doing. And so it is a different. My. It is personal, it is, it's hard. And so I am an emotional being. I, I am emotional because I care. And I have learned to probably better manage and have tools towards that. So I don't, I don't, I don't internalize it for too long. I think those are the differences. Whereas maybe I would take it and let's say it's a team challenge or an employee challenge or, you know, not getting a contract. Right. I didn't actually recent, like, like, even if it's like we didn't get a contract and I'm like, wow, I haven't, I don't remember, like not winning at something for a really long time recently. Right. Like, I. We win, but it's good. You have to fall. Otherwise, like, it's just part of the journey. Like, if that's where I'm gonna fail, like if I'm. That's where I'm gonna fall. I rather take that fall all day than like big life falls. Right. Like, I do believe that, like, life has its energy. We have to. It's grounding, it's humbling. And so the tools and the mindset, in order for me to see it this way now I still cry. And that's okay. Like, I have my. And I have people that I go to now. So I've got what I. What was different for me in the first journey is I think I tried really hard to go to my core friends. And I have this amazing group of core friends which are all flying into la. We're in LA right now. They're all flying. It's my birthday. It's my birthday week this week. And we're going to Napa tomorrow.

Oh, my God.

Yes. And so it's like two days. Yeah. We have like, everyone's so swamped and they're all coming for like, we're literally going to be together for like 40 hours. Like, it's so.

That's the perfect spot.

And so we're all meeting. I'm so excited. I have this core group of friends who always keep me grounded. They don't care about my awards, they don't care about fortunes. They don't care where I just spoke. They don't care about Forbes. They don't care about the accolades. They care about me and they know me and they check me and they just, they check my ego. They check. They check the things I. And I have that group of girlfriends that is a huge part of, of that. And. But I love them for that. And they are not my business tribe because they are some of them. And they're all successful in their own ways. We've got moms, we've got corporate. Like, you know, I've got my friends who are corporate executives. Like, some of us are entrepreneurs. And so we're all in different paths in our life, lives. And in the first part of my journey, I felt like I would go to them to be like, oh, my God, you don't understand. Like, this is what's happening. And, like, nobody gets this. Like, they don't get how hard it is. They don't get the whatever. Like, and I put a lot of pressure on this. Like, what's one space that I would go to? And that's not fair. What I actually needed was, I didn't realize, is that you can have core friends and core groups and you can go to them for different things. And I didn't have that until post pandemic, probably post starting the podcast. I feel like I literally met the most incredible women through this journey. I started to get to get outside of my industry bubble, right? So I had my industry fintech group, which is a complete boys club, right? Complete boys club. And I can show up and I do the things and we are trying to bring more women into that space. And then I have that. My, my core friends who check me in life. And I, I needed that. I needed the energy of femme entrepreneurs. I needed the energy from women. I. And I never got that from a business standpoint. And when I got that, I feel like it unlocked a different room for me. I felt like I found a space that I could also cry with, that I could also share life with, but that also were, you know, going through the same struggles and hurdles and understood, like, they were also ambitious. They were also risking a lot on their lines and on their, you know, on their businesses. And they also had their, like, mortgages at risk for their business. And it's a difference, a different table. And I'm so glad that I got an opportunity to start cultivating that network. And I mean, it's been. That was game changer. And how did you find it?

Like, how was it? I know it's Pieced together.

Yeah.

But what were some of the. What were some of the pieces that really helped you showing up?

Right. I think that again, going back to being too busy 100, your network is your net worth period. And you know, one of my mentors, she gave me, she gave me the best advice in my, in my career early on and I understood it. I finally, I feel like I've been able to do this. But it's. She said that the, the number one thing that you. People collect coins, people collect sports things, memorabilia, you know, guys collect cars, the works. Shoes. We collect shoes. I collect shoes. I collect handbags. The most important thing that you can collect in life are relationships. Relationships. It's not about. I think that the world is so transactional. How do we actually build upon that meaningful, like, how do we actually like collect meaningful relationships that you can add to your network? So not just I'm meeting a bunch of people, but actually sitting down to say, hey, I really want to. To cultivate this relationship. And that takes time. And so to spend time with people. And she's like, every year, you know, pick and choose from your different networks to people that you're going to invest time into to build that network. And then it goes from two to four. So every time I go to a conference, every time I go into a room, I'm always looking for not just my network to meet people. And that's, that's one part of it. But how do I go form like meaningful relationships? And the way that I was able to do that was by getting out of the screen and getting into rooms. And that is, that's important. I think that we want all the things, but we're not willing to actually show up for it. And then when we're willing to show up for it, we expect everybody. We expect like we're not this. Like that we're better than. But it's like, it's so busy, it's so full. We're like, what do you need from me? What do I need from you? What do you need from me? Like, it's so transactional. Show up without an ask. Yeah. Show up to just meet and just like build relationships. And I will say that that mindset, when that shifted for me, I've been able to bridge all of these and I have set the most incredible network. I think that my superpower is connecting. I'm one degree away from any single person that I want to meet in the world. I really like anyone. I've been in every single room. I went to the White House twice last year. Like, I've been able to do the most incredible things. And it didn't come from that one thing, it didn't come from this one. It came from that thing that I did seven years ago that I met this one person that we then totally met up and then did. It's the long game and you have to be planting those seeds. But I didn't have that intention in mind. Right. It's just, you go with it, you say yes, you show up, you check in, and it's not transactional. And I think that the world will be a much different place if we remove that. And I think it's not our faults as well. So I want to give us all grace. It's so busy, right? And we've become this on demand economy. But we're training ourselves, we're training our teens, we're training our children to be in this world of. Of chaos and on demand, everything. We're not taking the time to actually slow down and to build, to build together. And. And that only comes from kindness and true, like not asking for anything, just truly being there and just being a friend and giving love and cheering people on genuinely. And that's. That was it. So that was where it really shifted and I'm super grateful for that shift. And I'm really. That's something that I really do encourage everyone to. To really think about.

Tell me about some of the rooms that you go into, because if people are like, where are these rooms? What is it? So tell me about some of the rooms where people can find them, you know, anywhere throughout the us or did you have to travel? Did you have to invest into some. And before you go in the rooms, like, what sort of. Did you ever get nervous?

Were you ever.

You know what I mean? So share that.

Great questions. I think that there are so many ways to get into the. To the rooms. I think it's first identifying what you know, where you want to go. So you always, like, I do believe that it's important to surround yourself with both peers and people that are five steps ahead of you.

Yeah.

Right. So I think both are important. I think I've seen where you're always just trying to chase and you're five, you know, that's important to be around people that are five steps ahead of you and that's going to add so much benefit. But you also need those peers that are going through it. So you can pick up the phone and be like, what are you paying for this? What is this contract? Who are Using like we need that totally. Right. And so I think both rooms are important. Where I found that was, you know, conferences. And so some key in my industry I like started branching out into. It was the fintech stuff. And then Ernst and Young played a really huge part of my professional growth and career. And ey I was part of a group called winning women in 2019. I was part of their kind of like their YPO group of a women's circle. And that was Game changer. It was peers that were also multi millions in revenue that had various styles of businesses. And then from there someone had another network. And then when I started the podcast, the online space, like the just like just connecting with women through social media, that's how you and I have been connected and just truly connecting with them and meeting at the most incredible places, like at. At events, right. So actually being at, you know, events with each other and supporting each other, like every time I go even, even like, you know, an event that I can think of, the Female Founder collective, like going to New York and doing their Female Founder day was super great. You know, like, and just showing up in those rooms, showing up at south by Southwest and you know, going to south by Southwest for. I went for the INC event, but then Jacqueline Johnson, who was having a Crete and Cultivate event and a Cherub event, like I went to that event. And so we're just like always showing up in different ways in different spaces. I've definitely been part of Masterminds as well. And so I had an opportunity to. Being a mastermind in 2020 was like my first time ever being in something like that. And it was scary and cool and. And I got to meet some of the most, like literally got into being the room with the most incredible digital entrepreneurs. You know, Amy Porterfield and Jasmine Starr, Sophia Moroso. We were in like a tiny group together. It was so fun, so beautiful. I've never been invited to a space like that. And from there it was another network and another network. And now that's what I'm building. Right. So even with CEO school, we've got a community, we've got digital community. But I created the Millionaire Founders Club, which is. It's literally. It's your network is your net worth. And we're bringing seven and eight fair entrepreneurs together. And it's a forum. It's, you know, we meet twice a year. It's very low commit because at this stage that's what that is. And then people are breaking off into their smaller groups. But that's. I'M building my own network and I just show up. Like, I just say yes, and I show up. And I'm coming back for LA for LA Tech Week for cool stuff. Like, I'm just always doing the things and you have to. It takes time, it takes discipline, and there's seasons of it too. So this whole set, like, you go through your seasons and I think that that's important too, especially, you know, burnout and just. Also my family. And just, you know, all summer I didn't travel at all for work, so I was like, that's my. No, no travel zone. And then now I'm back. Right now I'm in the fall. We're doing podcasts. I'm at, you know, like every week. I've been. I was at a dinner last week for Goldman Sachs in New York. This week I'm in LA for, for media. Next week I'm heading to New York again for the Clinton Global Initiative. And like, just like, it's various parts of my life, but right now is a time that I'm in a season. I'm in a season of yes. And I'm gonna, It's gonna suck. Travel sucks. It ruins your. The, the, the, the routines and the things. And it's hard. It's super hard. But right now I'm in that season and then I turn the season off and then I'm back on. And so I found my way to kind of ebb and flow through it. You also don't want to just, you know, businesses aren't built by just being out of your business as well. So I've seen those styles of entrepreneurs that are everywhere, but then they're not actually focused on building their business. You've got to execute, you know, so you've got to work on the business every day and find pockets to build a network to give back. None of these place. I have no ask anywhere. No ask. Just going and showing up and it's leading to the next thing. To the next thing. So I'm back in building and therefore I have to re. Cultivate that network. So that's what's worked for me. What's worked for you?

That, that.

Okay.

That's literally my whole story is getting into rooms with people who know more than I do and just showing up and entering the room. As you know, I think in the beginning, when we enter those rooms, it's really like, who's got what I need? Who's got what I need when we're new at it, right? It's because that's what you think it's for? That's kind of what you hear. And then you start to realize, you enter the rooms and you're like, how can I help them? How could I help them? How could I help them? And you know, people that you're strategic with or that you like really feel a connection with and like sticking with that. And I think that that's been one of the biggest things is I have a list of women in my head and they rotate through the years, you know, but I'm always thinking, what is she up to? How could I help her? Who, who does she need? Like, who should I intro her to? And that is just like a boomerang. That's boomerang energy. It's just boomerang energy. It's so great.

So that's kind of like, isn't it so crazy of all of, like the things that you like? It's you, you know, you give and you receive. Like, it's literally you are what you give, you receive what you get. Like, it is truly the world goes around. It's so true. It applies so much not just to the day to day, but I do believe that business is life. Like, it is what that is. And you apply the same human philosophies to it totally. And magic happens.

It's relationships. It's like you can't get business done without humans and humans desire relationships. So it's all, it's all relational, whether some of it's transactional and some of it's really real. But truly, at the end of the day, it's just the most massive personal development, relationship building thing you'll ever do. So I'm so grateful for you. You are so generous with just everything, sharing everything and being super, just real and honest about the whole journey. And I'm so grateful that you are looking back and bringing everybody with you and taking us along on your new one. Because I also think that's so powerful for women to be able to talk about where they're at right now, especially the second build. Because I do know that there's a lot of like expectation and pressure and so many things that can come with that.

Oh my God, yes. Let's talk about that for a hot second. Because there is, it's, there's, it's easier in so many ways the second time around. But I've already built a pretty, like I've done the thing and so you can't just come out of the gate. Like, there's an expectation of product, there's an Expectation of brand. There's an expectation. There is an expectation that's set once you've set the bar. Yeah. And that's a lot of pressure too.

Yeah.

And so delivering upon that and still having to go through the weeds of everything. Like right now, even though it's. We've got resources, we've done the things, we don't have an unlimited. We're still a startup. So I can't operate from just like, you know, a different pocketbook. I've got to operate from the startup pocketbook. We've got to make the startup successful. And I forget how hard it is. And there's so many things that have also changed, like the world is the, you know, marketing landscape is constantly evolving and changing. The people environment is constantly evolving and changing. There's so much that's different. And so I'm, you know, rolling up my sleeves. I'm very excited to build again. It's also hard again to build and I've got lots of great, you know, I feel like I. It's going to be successful because I've got the right tools now to go to do it again. But I'm also. Okay, Like, I'm. This time around, I'm like really just wanting to go for it. Like, I'm, I want to take bigger risk. I took a lot of risk last time, but I'm just like, I want to go play in a different. I'm. I could see it and I'm just taking a lot more. Taking a lot more risk this time and playing a little bit bigger, but it is there. It's harder in a different way the second time around. So it's. I'm. I'm feeling that this, the second one is not. It's just not. It's not that it's easy. It's different.

Yeah.

And hopefully I get to, you know, share what I'm working on and that's what I, you know, try to do transparently on social and everything. So, you know, here's what I'm doing that this is not working. This is working and I think we can really help each other that way. Yeah.

I think that's what, that's what we all need is like people to be sharing more.

Yeah.

More of that so that we can know on our hard days. So thank you so much for coming on. I'm so grateful for you. What can we, what can we help you with? What would your ask be?

Oh, my God.

Ask anything.

That is just. That's so sweet. Okay, so the ask is just follow along on Social. Right. So follow along. I love for. If you're a small business owner or if you're a business listening, go to Word Score. You know, we'll link it into the show notes and just go sign up for the wait list for when the credit score comes out. It's going to be amazing. I need champions to beta test to go do it. So, you know, my, my goal is to have a 10,000 beta and I want it to be in my mind. I see just all women that are there that are doing it. I haven't actually said that out loud. And so I'd love for you to sign up for the Word Score beta. I'd love for you to, you know, tune into the podcast as well. We're gonna have Lori on here shortly and just follow along and cheer, you know, cheer me on and share what's working, share what's not. I'm here as a resource and come join me at our table.

Amazing.

Well, we'll have that all linked up, so if you guys want to go check that out, you just have to scroll through the little show notes at the bottom.

Yes. If you just go to Samira Madani on social, it's on my link tree, so everything that I said is all there. So just go follow on social and then everything will be linked up.

Amazing. You guys, if you love this podcast.

Make sure you share it with a.

Friend and go follow her. Don't just listen, go follow so that you truly can get all of the behind the scenes. And until next time, earn your happy.

Bye, everyone.