Lessons from Facing Our Fears Scuba Diving on Our Anniversary Trip

It is the challenges that are the opportunities. I look at life as just one giant analogy for everything in life. And the ocean, the opportunity, the panic, all of that. That's all things that happen in your daily life. On the surface, these fears come. They can freak you out. They can make you run. They can make you say, I never want to try that. They can make you shut down. Or it can be the biggest opportunity to become the person that you want to be and overcome something. And we're back with another episode of He Said, she Said.

And we're back from our 19th anniversary celebration in Mexico. That was an awesome trip.

Yeah. I really was craving the ocean. I was craving something warm. I was craving just being by a pool or by the water and really having some space. And I think that that's exactly what it did for us. And it just got to the point, even where it was like, I just need some clear space in my head, where it's like, you almost allow yourself to get bored so that you can be creative again. And I really feel so grateful that we did this and gave ourself just clear space. We had days where we didn't have anything planned. And for two people who like to have a lot planned and who are very.

It's tough.

At first, it was kind of challenging. And, you know, truly, creativity requires boredom. It requires space in order to flood back in. And this morning was the first morning where I was like, ooh, I feel really, really excited to create again.

One of the exercises that we do when we go on these, like, anniversary vacations is we'll book ourselves at a beautiful resort. We sit by the pool, and we pull out this list that we have on our iPhones. Just literally notes of things that we're chasing down that we want. That we want to acquire, that we want to achieve. And it's fun because we go through the list. You know, it seems like we do it every year to 18 months or so. We update this thing, and we go through the list, and we're like, oh, my God, we hit this. Oh, my God, we're so close to this. And then some things are like, wait, I don't want this anymore. And so it's this live, always morphing list of why we work hard, what we're chasing down, what our biggest dreams are, right down to, okay, what is it going to cost us? And how much money do we need to achieve that? And it's really fun to always have those few large goals dialed in together on a list that is always updated.

You Missed our glossy tip.

Well, I was going to go there. We're just kind of talking about the vacation a little bit. But the glossy tip has to do with vacation, I always say. Lori, what's your glossy tip? I'm jumping in here with the glossy tip twice a day on vacation. Makes you feel good at the pool. I'm not kidding. Like, you, we. We drank a little bit more than usual, ate a little bit more than usual because we're on vacation. A lot of the food was kind of like bloating type food. You know, chips and guac by the pool, all that kind of stuff.

Quesadillas, tacos.

Right. And I would pound a giant glossy water in the morning, and I would pound a giant glossy water at night, and I woke up feeling by the pool. It was great.

I do feel like it helped with digestion, so.

Oh, totally.

I'm not used to going to bed full every night and that really, really helped. Like just hydration and digestion.

It's almost like. And I didn't formulate it, so I don't know, you know, if this is right or not, but to me, I kind of use it as like, this instead of Pepto Bismol. If I drink a giant glossy after a big meal, it like makes my bloat and food settle more. Am I saying that right?

Well, look at that. That's so good.

Yeah, it's great. Anyhow, you guys get 25% off glossy for being a listener. Nobody else gets that. Discount is for our listeners only if you use code happy when you're checking out@getglocy.com, that is get g l o c I.com, getglossy.com use code word happy to get 25% off.

I mean, if anything else, I've never seen you drink this much water in my life and have been trying to get you to drink water like through our entire marriage. And I think it's because not only does it taste freaking amazing, but it makes you feel really good and you're. You're getting a result. So I could not be happier. Like, if I just formulated this for you, then I'm so happy.

I'd love to say that it's not true. That's true. I'm not a water drinker. Like, I don't think, oh, I should drink some water, even though I know it's like, like building block numero uno for being healthy is drink a lot of water. Except I'm just not a water drinker. But I pound water water because of glossy because it's flavored, it tastes different.

Okay. Speaking of water.

Yeah.

We were on vacation.

Time for the lesson.

And the first day that we get there, right? We, we, we spend the night, we have a dinner that night and we wake up the next morning for a scuba class at 9am in the pool.

Scuba diving lessons. Day one, morning one of being there.

Okay, so the reason that I booked these and I honestly, truly did book this just for myself and if Chris wanted, great, I wanted him to come to face a fear. But also if he didn't want to come, I already had it in my head like, okay, it's fine if he doesn't go.

I need to describe the fear though. This is not like, oh, I'm afraid of scuba diving. This is like deep ridden panic. Like full body shut down and it's irrational. I don't have any water trauma that I remember. I'm on the water, like, you know, wake surfing or swimming or boating or doing those things all the time my entire life. It's absolutely irrational. But you stick the thing over my nose and make me breathe through the scuba thing and go into water. It is full on body shutdown panic. Even right now, I can feel the panic just talking about it. That's the level of fear that it is for me somewhere for some reason, and I don't know why, but it is strong.

And this happens even when, when you snorkel. It's something about the mask in your nose being covered.

Yep.

So I, I'm not sure what that is. But anyway, I book it. And I book it because when I was, I think it was around 18 years old, I went on a trip with a friend who I waitressed with and her sister was super into scuba diving. And she was like, hey, do you want to go on this trip with my sister? Like we, you know, we can all split a room. It'll be, you know, like, we can afford it. That's all I hear when I'm 18 years old. I'm like, great trip to Mexico.

Let's go. I'm in.

We can afford it. Wonderful. And so her sister's there with a whole scuba crew. Like, they're all going scuba ing. I don't know. Is that how you say it? Scuba diving, we get to go, like, we get to learn in the pool. It's a lot more lenient in Mexico. You can kind of learn in the pool and go in the ocean. Where in the US they're like, we need you to do 30 hours under the water for you know, probably good reason, but I like to just get it done. So. So we're in Cozumel, and Cozumel is one of the most beautiful places to scuba dive. I did not know this at the time. I just was like, oh, my God. First scuba experience is freaking amazing. Like, it was life changing. It's so beautiful and bright underneath the water. The fish, like come up to you. You're surrounded by hundreds of bright, beautiful fish. You're having this like visceral calm experience. Now I do want to share. My first experience was to walk from shore down. Like we were, we were kind of staying somewhere where there was a bit of a drop off in cliffs, like in underneath the ocean. So the reef was right. So I didn't have to go out in a boat. I didn't have to feel like I was going in really deep water right away. It was kind of like this experience picture, like walking out, putting your scuba gear on in the ocean and kind of just slowly snorkeling out to kind of a deep part. So it didn't feel like you're on a boat. You don't know what's underneath. You're going down, you're going down this rope 30ft. And so this is what I'm describing to Chris. It's just a nice gradual, you know, easy.

It's pretty, it's beautiful. Yeah, no, it's all right. You've had an hour of training. We're going out in the boat now and we're going to go to 30 to 40ft of water and you just jump in and you pull it, you know, you kind of go down this rope and then you're. We swim through these caverns. No. Anyhow, let's back up there. Let's back up. So it started in the pool. And the instructor, props to him, he was really good. He was really good. And I went from not thinking I would physically be able to do this, guys. That is the level of crippling fear. Did not think I'd be able to do this to like, okay, I'm going to give it my best shot. And I think here's where I have to make the main point. You had said earlier, like, hey, I didn't really need you to go, Chris. I booked it for myself. I disagree. I literally don't think you mean that when you say, I think you would have been horribly disappointed if I'm like, no, babe, I'm going to stay back. Day one of our anniversary trip and I think you would have been disappointed in me. And I think you would have been like kind of bummed out that you had to do it on your own. So you say one thing, but I don't think you mean it and it's okay if you do, but I literally don't think it would have been okay if I was just like, no, I'm not even going to try. I don't think you have a respect for people that won't try things.

Well, I don't. But see also I came to the conclusion within myself because, you know, I'm doing all of these different. I'm listening to these different audios just on something right now that I'm. I'm kind of just working through. And part of that for me was to allow it to be okay for me to not have to have you there.

Yeah.

Like to have that experience on my own. So, yes, I would have been upset, but only because I think that there was so much to offer you for learning how to do that in a safe environment.

And that's a great reason to be upset. I'm not saying you shouldn't be. Yeah, I like that you are because that's why I followed through with doing it. I just wanted to be on the record saying, nah, that's bullshit. You would have been upset if I didn't go. And so that was one of the drivers that made me try it on. Precise. And that's the point I wanted to make. Guys 19th anniversary together over 21 years. What's made it work? One of our rules that we made early, early on was that we always have to be willing to try the other's idea or desire on for size, but it doesn't have to be a fit, and this is so powerful. Instead of just rejecting it, instead of saying, no, I'm not trying that. Instead of saying, oh, that sounds dumb, or oh, you want to do what? Or you want to try what? Or, well, you want to be a what now, we don't reject each other's new ideas. We say, okay, I'll try it on for size and I've got permission if it's not a fit. And guess what? Most time it's a fit. I mean, so many great things in my life exist today because I tried it on for size, even though I didn't do it in the past. Like snowboarding. Huge part of our life. Massive part of our life. You're the one that got me to try it on for size and I loved it. Wake surfing. Right? Try it on for size. Love it. Lots of things in our life but scuba, that's what made me go. Follow through was, all right, we've got this commitment. I got to try it on for size. I got to give it a good, honest shot. And the end result is I did pretty damn good in a pool. Like, I was able to swim end to end to end underwater using the scuba gear. I didn't like it, but I was able to do it. And I didn't even think I would get to that point. So there is a lot of benefit to trying it on for size with the underlying rule that it doesn't have to be a fit. Because the other part of this punchline is, this shit ain't a fit for me. I'm not going to be begging you to go scuba diving anytime soon.

Our instructor was cracking me up because he reminded me so much of me. And I'm like, couldn't be, like, a better, worse fit for my husband because he was. The instructor is so passionate about scuba. Like, it's changed his life. And later we find out he's, like, accomplished some crazy things with scuba. Like, he's essentially like a master of scuba. So it couldn't have. We couldn't have been with anyone better. But he is so passionate about it that he wants it so bad for you. Like, he wanted it so bad for Chris. He was like, no, no, you're gon go in the ocean. And Chris is like, no, no, I'm absolutely not. This ends in the pool. And he's like, no, no, we'll see. And Chris is like, stop. This is where you need to kind of stop. He, like, was like, you need to kind of back off. He was saying a nice way, but he was, like, starting to get really stressed. And I'm like, oh, this is hilarious. I know that this is when I would stop, but the instructor is not stopping. I'm like, are we gonna. What. What's going to happen here?

Yep, exactly. So I had 2 lor there trying to convince me to do this in the ocean. And that's actually a great segue into the next lesson that came out of this. So the first one, you guys, I. You make an agreement with your partners, try everything on for size. Don't reject it. But it doesn't have to be a fit, but your life is going to be wonderful because you're going to find a lot of things that are a great fit for you that you wouldn't have found otherwise. So we get in the boat, right? We're done with the pool part. I'm really proud of myself. I did great in the pool. If push came to shove, I now know how to scuba. But he's like, all right, let's get in the boat. And the boat is like this white, typical boat that you would have in Mexico.

Just bare bones.

Bare bones. And we're taking it out to Milio, and it's beautiful turquoise water. Like, that part was epic. And we get out there, he's like, okay, it's 30 to 40ft, and there's these beautiful caverns. We're going to swim between and. All right, are you ready to go? And I looked at you both. I go, nope, not doing it. I'm staying in the boat. But you did it, and you had an experience of your own that you had to get through.

So, you know, for me, it's about not really knowing what's underneath that water, too, but you're gonna know right away. And I think that I had developed so much trust with the instructor that I felt pretty good about it. And I also went in. In with the idea, like, okay, if I don't like it, I can just come back up. So that made me feel really good. I'm like, if I don't like it, I can just come back up. I've done this before, so I also had that underneath my belt. I was like, I've done this. You know, I stayed out for a long time. I had a blast before. If I remember, I was under for, like, 45 minutes. That was about the time frame. So he said, you know, what we're going to do is we're going to go down. We'll be down about 45 minutes. We follow this pattern. We're going to go in a loop around these reefs, and then we're going to come back to the boat. Now, when I heard loop, I was like, what does loop mean? Like, once I go around a reef, does it mean that if I'm halfway, I can't get back to the boat? Like, my brain starts doing this because I like to know what's going on. And so I jump into the water, into the ocean. And that in itself is kind of an experience. You're like, on the side of the boat. You have to hold your mask and your breathing apparatus tanks on. Your tanks are on. You fall backwards off the boat. And so that in itself, I was like, okay, we're just. We're doing this because there's so much that this is awesome offering me. And I think that's another thing that you have to focus on is I know that this is going to offer me something so amazing because I'm facing a fear and I get to observe myself and try to work through all of the different things that are coming up in practice. Like, I don't get to be a more calm, more present, more courageous person if I don't have this experience. And these are all the desires that I want. So I have to try these experiences for myself. And so people might be like, why in the hell would you do this on a vacation? Because this is something I want to experience, those things that I just mentioned. And the only way to do that is to create these experiences where you get confronted. And so I also remember that I loved it. So there was. There were a lot of different things going on in my head. So we swim out for a bit to where the end of the rope is and all of a sudden we're going to go under. So we're going under at the same time, the instructor and I. And you have to kind of pull yourself down really slow because you have to adjust your ears so you have pop the pressure in your ears kind of like you would on a plane. I would hold my nose and blow so that my ears would pop. And so we're doing this, I don't know, it felt like maybe every like four, five feet. And that's just what I'm focusing on at that point. Slowly going down the rope and we get down there and your body has to adjust right from the pressure and just kind of like see your surroundings and start the breathing process. And for me, when I first, you know, have my nose covered too, it's a bit of a thing, like a freak out moment. And something that I always have in the back of my head is that I've realized is I don't fully trust my body because I have had panic attacks before. So ever since I was young, I have a thing that I'm trying to work through is that I don't trust my body. Right when I go on stage, I'm like, I don't trust my body. I'm afraid it's going to have a panic attack. I'm afraid it's going to. I'm going to pass out. And so I am working on trusting my body. Like it knows what to do even if it passes out, like it knows how to come back. I trust my body to be okay. And so when I was down there, I was doing okay. Of course, I was having the different fears of like, okay, yeah, I'm really down here. You can't go up to the surface Right away. Like, that could really damage your ears or whatever. I'm not even sure what could happen, but it could really hurt. And so we're swimming around and I'm just trying to focus on how beautiful everything is around me and also noticing that our brains want to constantly say, what is wrong right now? What could go wrong? And instead, what the instructor kept doing, he was looking back the entire time, is he kept pointing to his eyes and then pointing to all of the scenery. And he would kind of tell me, like, with my heart, like, you just start communicating down there with your hands. Like he was saying, like, you'll calm down if you start observing everything around you. Like, essentially get the F out of your head. Observe how stunningly beautiful this is. And he would also show me with his hands, like, the temple of my breath. Like, he'd make me make eye contact and just like, really slow, calm breathing. So for about 15 minutes down there, I experienced like, complete bliss, like, total bliss. And we come up to almost like these. This cavern where you're swimming in between two walls of coral. I'm kind of like these reefs where all of these fish are. And it's stunning. But my brain says something. It's like, ooh, I don't like this. We're really far from the boat. And I don't like feeling like I'm enclosed at all. Even though I'm not really enclosed. It's just two walls on both sides. And my brain has a freak out. And I do the little, like, I'm not really okay hand gesture to him. And instead of, like, you know, going up because I point my thumbs up like I want to go up, he's like, no, no, we're going to stay here and try to calm down. Because he knows he can't pop me up right away. And he also knows. What I didn't know is that this happens quite frequently. And this, when I say this, this is the opportunity to, like, overcome your brain. This is the opportunity to allow your body to go, oh, this doesn't feel good. But what if I just stay here and breathe and trust this person with me that they've seen this before and they've done this before, right? Like, this is what a mentor is for. This is what a guide is for. I'm full on freaking out, feeling like I'm having a panic attack. And he's like, we're gonna ride this out down here. He literally has my, like, he has my arm and he's like looking at me and he's doing the Hand gesture with the breath and he's like, you're okay. And all of a sudd. Calm down again. And that was the craziest moment for me of underneath the water, my breath, like, I could not get enough breath right because I'm like panicking down there.

Like.

And that was a full freakout, like, full freak out. And I, I know that that was also for me to be like, this is your brain, your body is fine. And the second that you look to someone who's experienced this before, it's such a reminder that this is normal. Like, this is the normal process. This is the opportunity. This is what I signed up for. This is the reason I'm doing this is because, you know, I know that there's a fear there. I know that I want to trust my body. And I can honestly tell you that I want to do it again. Even though when I came up I was like, oh, hell no. Like, I don't want to go back down there. I'm so glad Chris didn't go down there. Like, my God, that would have been a horrible experience, not only for me, but for you. 2026 is the year that you launch your business. It's the year that you've become the boss, you become the leader. That idea that you have that has been eating at you forever that just will not leave you alone is going to come to life. Maybe it's something that someone tells you you should always sell or a store you've already designed in your head. And with Shopify, 2026 is when you finally make it happen. Shopify gives you everything you need to sell online and in person. Millions of entrepreneurs have already made from household name to first time business owners. Just getting started, you guys. I use Shopify for glossy and I remember when they sent me my little shopping bag celebrating my 10,000 sales and I literally cried because I was so scared to take the leap. And I'm so glad that I did and that I use Shopify. It gives you all the tools to easily build your dream store. You can choose from hundreds of beautiful templates that you can customize to match. Your brand setup is fast with Shopify's built in AI tools that write product descriptions and headlines and help you edit photos. So marketing is built into. You can create email and social campaigns that reach customers wherever they scroll. So as you grow, Shopify grows with you. You can handle more orders, expand to new markets, and do it all from the same dashboard. In 2026, stop waiting and start selling with Shopify. Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com happy go to shopify.com happy that shopify.com happy hear your first cha ching this new year with Shopify by your side. There are so many challenges to business that I don't want starting to be one of them for you. And when you want more, when you're starting a business, you need Northwest Registered Agent because you get access to thousands of free guides, tools and legal forms to help you launch and protect your business. And it's all in one place. You can build your complete business identity with Northwest today. Northwest Registered Agent has been helping small business owners and entrepreneurs launch and grow business for nearly 30 years. They're the largest registered agent and LLC service in the US with over 1500 corporate guides. Real people who know your local laws and can help you and your business every step of the way. You can sign up for free account to begin managing your business hub with lawyer drafted operating agreements, bylaws, resolutions, membership certificates, bills of sale and more at no cost. Northwest makes life easy for business owners. They don't just help you form your business, they give you the free tools you need after you form it, like operating agreements, meeting minutes, and thousands of how to guides that explain the complicated ins and outs of running a business. And let me tell you, this is life changing because I had no idea how much went into this. So don't wait. Protect your privacy, build your brand and get your complete business Identity in just 10 clicks and 10 minutes. Visit www.northwestregisteredagent.com Earn free and start building something amazing. Get more with Northwest registered agent at www.northwestregisteredagent.com forward/earfree.

She came up, back up to the boat half hour later and I looked at her, I go, so how was it? She's like, it's awesome. I go, did I make the right decision? She goes, oh yeah, you should not have gone.

You just wouldn't. You would need a lot more time in the pool and I think you would need a different experience because I do think that having that first grade experience with scuba when I was much, I just feel like I wasn't so in my head at that age, you know, like different parts of me were in my head for different reasons. If you put me on a stage, I would have never been able to do it. But I don't think that other fears had been necessarily crept in at that point of not trusting my body, et cetera, et cetera. And so it was so powerful. It was so amazing. I'm so glad that I did it. But also, like, it's just. It's forever confronting your fears that is so important.

Here's what I love, you know, so two big lessons, right? Confront your fears. It's worth it. Or really, your lesson is learn to control your mind. Mine was try everything on for size. It's how we got to 19 years and counting for marriage. Married, you know, being married. But I'll tell you something beautiful about starting vacation off with the scary thing. I had such a great sense of accomplishment, being able to swim to one end, back to the other end, and back to the other end again underwater. Going from someone who couldn't even put this thing over their nose and breathe into this thing standing on the side to being able to do that, it really. And then, you know, watching you be able to go through with the caverns and all that, it really kicked off vacation from a positive point. I know that's the opposite of what you would think. You would think that starting at a negative point, but you have to do things that make you proud, and life is much better from that moment on.

When you do, it just opened everything up. And it is the challenges that are the opportunities. And I think that's what that did to me because I look at life as just one giant analogy for everything in life. And the ocean, the opportunity, the panic, all of that. That's all things that happen in your daily life on the surface, these fears come, they can freak you out, they can make you run, they can make you say, I never want to try that. They can make you shut down. Or it can be the biggest opportunity to become the person that you want to be and overcome something. I'm just so grateful that you tried it, too.

So what's the verdict? Do you think that you're ever going to sign us up for scuba again?

Yeah, totally. Totally. Absolutely.

I'll try it in a pool again. That's my commitment.

It. Yeah, I think you'll love it the next time in the pool. I really do. There is something so, like, if you're ever thinking of doing it, I don't want this to scare you because actually, it's one of the most peaceful experiences, especially if you can learn to control your breathing in your mind that you'll ever have in your life. Like, I have a girlfriend who, when I told her, like, about the experience, she was like, really? Because that didn't happen for me. She's like, I literally almost fell asleep under the water. It was the most calm I'VE ever been. Like, the. The scuba master who was our teacher, said, you know, adjusts to being in the water like that. He said at some points, because he keeps his heart rate monitor on. His heart rate drops 50s. He said 45.

Yeah, yeah.

And he's like, because you're so calm down there and you're breathing, you're so meditative down there that every single day, this man goes into scuba and meditates under the. Like, he's like, it's a. It's my meditation every single morning. Going down there. Well, yeah, because you're controlling your breath and at such a. Like, a perfect pace. And your heart rate is dropping and you're weightless, and the fish are stunning, and it's gorgeous. So it's like, look at this opportunity to be the most blissed out you've ever been. If you can get to the other side of your fear, which is the analogy for life with everything. Look at the opportunity to be the most blissed out version of you that you've ever been. If you can face all of your fears.

That's true.

Face my fears either a lot alone. Like, I did that with a master instructor.

Yeah, I thought you're gonna say with me.

No. By the way, can I just add one more little lesson to this? Like, if I was gonna have a codependent trait, it would definitely be that I only feel good, like, if Chris feels good. And so when he's not feeling good, I'm like, oh, my God, this doesn't feel good. This isn't right. Maybe I shouldn't have done this. And it was such a lesson for me also. And I knew this going into it. I also knew that I would simultaneously be working through the lesson that it's okay if he's not having a good experience. I can still have a good experience. So I really had to disconnect from him, like, to a point where I almost sometimes had to, like, turn away or look away to let him let it be okay that he's not enjoying it, let it be okay that he's not having a good experience. But you did let me know you weren't having a good experience under the water during the show.

Let's just say we're supposed to speak in sign language. I gave friend a two fingers, two.

Middle fingers underneath the pool when I was looking, and the instructor wasn't. It was wonderful.

All right, guys, hey, listen. We do have an opportunity for you to grow, and that is grow your network with our peers and with our audience and with the incredible human beings that we know. Our last ever dinner series advanced networking event where it's a whole day of masterminding intentional collisions, meeting the people that have been missing from your business, followed by the dreamiest, most epic dinner you've ever experienced in your life. Probably like, like we throw a wedding each time is coming up second week of November. We're going to have so few spots for that. It's crazy because all the people who signed up for the whole year or the two dinner package, they're all coming to this last one. So if you want a shot at one of the few spots that are going to be able to open up at this venue and it's our favorite five star hotel in Laguna beach, you're going to love it. All you have to do right now at the end of this episode is hit stop and text us the word dinner. Dinner to 310-421-0416. Literally right now, hit pause. Text us the word dinner to 310-421-0416. That's how we know to put you on the advanced notice list. So before it goes out to our emails with a couple hundred thousand people on it, before it goes out to our social media, before the link goes everywhere, it goes to that advanced notice list because those are people saying, hey, I'm really serious about this. I'm serious enough to text you, hey, Chris and Lori, put me on the list dinner. So text the word dinner to 310-421-0416 and we will see you there in November.

We're so grateful for you guys and we will see you next week.

Thanks for listening. Bye. Bye.