mindbodygreen Co-Founder & CEO, Colleen Wachob, On How To Prioritize Your Well-Being & Unlock Your Purpose

Hey, guys, before we get into the show, I have something really fun for you. I have my really good friend Natalie Ellis from Boss Babe. She is the CEO and founder, and she's also the host of the incredible Boss Babe podcast. It is one of my favorites, and she is on here to tell you the things that she recommends when you feel overwhelmed. Natalie, what should we do?

Okay, Lori, I'm so excited to be here, and what I really wanted to talk about was how you can get off of the overwhelm wheel. What? Where we get so stuck. We're like, on this hamster wheel. We cannot get off because we're so burned out. We're not doing the things or avoiding the things, and things continue to pile up. Sometimes we just need a reset. We need to fully hit pause, wipe the slate clean, and reset. The best way to do this is look at your to do list with the four Ds. Do, delegate, delay, or delete. Do. You're going to do it. Delegate. You're going to delegate it and really be ruthless with this because you can delegate so much more than you think. Delay day. You're going to put this out of your mind because now is not the right time or now is not the season that this thing should be done on. Delay it without guilt. Or finally. And the thing that I think is the most important, Delete. How many things do you have on there that you really don't want to be doing? You're just doing it because you think you should. I know when you shed the shoulds, that's how you can really get into reset mode. So I'm going to encourage you to go through it with a fine tooth combination, maybe even twice to see what things on that you can delete.

Oh, my God, this is so good. I'm going to run through my to do list with this list from now on. And I can't tell you how many things that I have written down that I'm like, why is that even on there? It's just taking up space in my brain. So, Nadalie, thank you so much for this. And if you guys loved these tips, she is full of them.

Truly.

It's one of my personal favorite podcasts. So go join Download the Boss Babe podcast for more tips from Natalie. All right, let's get in the show, guys.

Being able to have control of your destiny, to not have to do things that you don't want to do and to not have to go to sleep at night. Like, I've got enough stress. I don't want to add the financial stress of running a business to that. So while it's very unsexy, financial well being is one of our core pillars at Mind Body Green. It's how we run our business. And I do think it's an important part of health and well being as well.

Hey, everyone. Welcome back to the show. I have something for you. I want to gift you with a program that Chris and I created that we used to charge almost $1,000 for. It's a spot where Chris and I decided one day that we had to put everything that we have ever learned that has shifted to reach the success that we had reached. And we wanted to put it all in one spot for you. And this program has been taken by thousands of people and tried and true. We have so many incredible testimonials out of it, you guys, and we're giving it away to you for free for a limited time. So all you have to do is go to becomealigned.com and I'm going to give that to you totally free simply because I want to gift you for listening to the podcast for so many years. Or maybe you're new and you just get the benefits of getting it right away. Let's get into the show. Today. My incredible guest is Colleen Wakab. She is the co founder and co CEO at Mind bodygreen. You guys, she just wrote a book with her husband Jason called the Joy of well Being. It's been out for a little bit and it is one of the greatest books on all of the things that she has learned about what it really takes to be able to live a life of wellness and joy. And this woman has talked to so many people, interviewed so many incredible people, had so many different, different articles on their website, all about what it takes to live an amazing life. This is the person that you want to learn from. So let's get started. Colleen, I'm so excited to have you on the show. Thank you so much for coming on.

I'm thrilled to be here. Thank you so much.

Oh, my God. So I love the topic that we are about to dive into because my entire life I have struggled with what wellness and health and happiness even meant. And I feel like I've dedicated my whole life to trying to figure that out. So. And that's really where I want to start, Colleen, is what was your life like growing up? What were some of the core memories that you have around what your environment was like, maybe from around ages, from like 8 to like 13 years old?

Yeah. So if I think of like the two main pillars of my life right now, it's wellness and entrepreneurship. And some of that could have been predicted from my childhood and some definitely not. So I grew up in Southern California, where the word in the 80s of wellness literally didn't exist. But I was very active in sports. I did a lot of stuff outside my family, lived near the beach. My parents cooked a lot at home. So I think I learned some, some of the disciplines, like if you think of movement, if you think of nutrition, that type of stuff was happening without the vernacular of wellness. You know, a lot of the things we dive into in the book as it relates to spirituality and connection, that was less a part of my life. But I actually think I'm like the least likely entrepreneur from my childhood in that my parents were true entrepreneurs kind of before the age of raising money and, you know, VC entrepreneurship. They were family business, business owners. We owned car washes and my parents had a French pastry shop. And I saw the ups and downs of entrepreneurship. I saw the stress that it had on their marriage. I saw the stress that they carried themselves. I knew every time it rained that the family did make money that day. At one point in time, my father was robbed at gunpoint and shot on one of his properties. I am like the least likely entrepreneur because I came away from this experience kind of being like, let's make another turn. So post College, worked at Fortune 500 companies. So think Walmart, Gap, Amazon, was like, I am doing a very hard course correction from my childhood and from what I had, you know, some of the scar tissues that I still carried from that experience.

Wow, okay. I have so many questions about that portion, but the portion that I'm just like, I've worked in a bit of corporate America for a while and I can say that that was probably the place where I was in a bad position mentally. I feel like the way that that is set up, the way that that career is set up, the way that everything is structured there and kind of how we're made to think is very challenging for our health, wellness mindset. What were some of the things that you discovered that you were feeling that really spurred this kind of like passion for health from those years in Fortune 500 companies, et cetera?

Yeah. So, you know, the good of Fortune 500 was I learned a lot about business. I had health insurance and other things to cover, you know, the necessary expenses. But it was when I was working at a Fortune 500 company that I had a life threatening pulmonary embolism, which was the start of this whole really diving into this health and wellness journey. And at that moment in time, you know, my life was a little bit on autopilot. You know, early 30s, living in New York City. Imagine the lifestyle, you know, going out with friends. But are the relationships super meaningful? Probably not. And then there was one morning I was going to a very, you know, intense yoga class, which was my Saturday morning routine. And after it, I told my husband, Jason, I'm having some problems walking. Like, why don't you meet me in the city? So we walked around the West Village, and then I was like, I need to go home. I went home, and on the subway train. It was a particularly steep a train home. And so I collapsed trying to get out of the subway steps. And then I do what, you know, so many of us do when it comes to medical symptoms. I gaslit myself. I was like, I'm fine. No big deal. I'm dehydrated. It's a really hot May Day. Who wants to go to the er? So I basically convinced my doctor on the phone that I'm totally fine. And then I'm lethargic, and I nap the whole rest of the weekend, which isn't my usual weekend trajectory. So come Monday morning, I was working at Amazon at the time, and my husband was like, the only way you can go to work on Monday is if you stop by the doctor on the way. So I stopped by the doctor, and within a couple minutes, he's like, you're having a pulmonary embolism. I didn't really know what the word meant. Yeah, he gave me a little sign that said, I'm having a pulmonary embolism. Unclear if he thought I wouldn't be able to get to the NYU er or if once I got there, I could waste valuable time not being able to explain the likely diagnosis. Got to the er, had showers of clots in my lungs. And, you know, that was really, like, the cosmic kick in the butt moment that I had because I had been so disconnected from my body that I wasn't listening to all these signs. And it started not just this, like, long healing journey, you know, and through kind of searching a lot of Western searching, a lot of holistic modalities. I had a pulmonary embolism, likely because of being on birth control pills that I had been on for about 10 years. This was, again, over a decade ago when this was a little bit less of. The zeitgeist Unknown wrote about the experience for Mind Bodygreen. The article went viral. I heard from men, women who had had Sisters, daughters, cousins experience a pulmonary embolism and a lot of times weren't so lucky. And you know, through sharing this experience, I learned about the resilience of the human spirit and my own resilience. And it was really, you know, sometimes you have to hit those complete utter breakdown moments to be able to make change. And you know, my hope for everyone else is that they don't have to have such a cosmic kick in the butt from the universe to be able to kind of self evaluate. Is my life in line with my values? Is this the type of life I want to be leading to make changes?

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Yeah, and I think I was really struggling with purpose at this time. And I did what I don't think is healthy, but, like, identified purpose as my career. And I think that's what it can be wonderful and fulfilling for some people. But I think when we say it, this is where I'm going to seek all of my fulfillment in life. It can set us up for a lot of disappointment. And so mentally, I knew I wasn't in a great spot, but then there was just some symptoms that I kind of ignored. Like, even before the clots appeared in my lung, like my ankle was a little bit swollen, I knew I was having some trouble sleeping. You know, sleep is something I've struggled with my whole life, but I knew that I had sleep troubles, I had anxiety troubles. And when you kind of use talk to rationalize what's happening instead of, like, taking action and getting down deeper, like, why did I need to take a sleep aid to go to sleep, sleep every night? What was actually going on there? So there was a lot of little things that were happening before that big moment that I just kind of ignored.

What does purpose mean to you now? And what does that look like in your life?

Yeah, so when I think of purpose, I borrow a line from, from Arthur Brooks about creating a personal mission statement. It's like, we have our goals at work, we have OKRs at work, we have KPIs, we have so many things for our job. But we don't put that same amount of care and thoughtfulness and intentionality into what our purpose is today. And my purpose has changed so much over the past decades. Right when we started mindbody Green, I was going through these health issues. A lot of it was, you know, the roadmap to recovery and you know, kind of an experimentation on this edge case that I was experiencing in this N1. And now when I fast forward, I think of where I am right now as a mom of two girls and I am frightened by the mental health crisis that is happening right now in the world. So now my purpose is very much geared towards helping raise well adjusted humans, building a strong body and mind so that I can help support them in their next endeavors. But when someone is looking for purpose and not sure where to start, I think there's a couple of things I would suggest, like it's not necessarily tied to your career, it can be and like bonus points if you're able to extract that kind of value from it. But I think it puts also a lot of pressure on people to find it through that. And then there's a series of questions that we walk people through in the joy of well being. If you're just like completely, I don't know where to start, but it's really thinking about what gets you out of bed in the morning. Is it about achieving or is it about finding joy and helping others? And when I look back at that moment in time, I know that I was way too laser focused and kind of this hedonic treadmill of achievement. Rather than really cultivating a well lived life, what feels like a higher calling, what parts of your life are devoted to caring for others? So I think if we put as much thought into our personal mission statements as we do our career goals, we can really start to cultivate and get this idea of what kind of life we want to live. Because when I think of what I'm doing now for my body and for my brain, sure part of it is for the present, but part of it is when I look out 30, 40 years from now, when I'm likely not working as much as I am, but I want to be surrounded by friends, by family, if my daughters decide to have children, their families, but in order to have children that want to hang out with you, then you have to start cultivating those relationships. Now to have the friendships you want down the road, you have to start cultivating Those relationships now. So this whole idea of connection has been the most underrated, untalked about part of the health and well being conversation. And you know, Fast forward to 2023 when none of us are having enough meaningful IRL connection. This is, you know, something I, I care deeply about.

Okay. I, I kind of want to dive in deeper there because that is one of my biggest passions is, is creating connections with people. What does that look like, creating deeper relationships? Because when you don't see it modeled for you, it's very confusing. And things can get, things can get really messy. You can have these high expectations on people.

What.

First of all, let's back up and start with how much of wellness and just being a content on purpose person do you think connection with others has.

To do with it? I mean, I'll go to the science, which will tell you in recent studies that exercise lowers your risk by about 20%. And having a diet is more or less the same at around 30%. But remarkably, being in a good romantic relationship, relationship, having friends, being connected to your community can lower your mortality risk by 45%. So, you know, it's kind of like whatever gets you there to that answer, you know, the better, you know. My husband has a favorite study of his that, you know, he always loves to talk about, which is the Rosetto Study, which is a small town in Pennsylvania in the 1950s and 60s where the rate of heart attacks for people over 65 was half the nation and men under. There was essentially no cases of heart attacks, but they were doing all the things that go counterintuitive to wellness, right? They were smoking, they were drinking, they were eating lots of pasta and meatballs. So how does this all make sense? And it really boils down to these strong social connections, the intergenerational living, the parties, the parades, enjoying wine and food, but doing it with friends and family. So connection is one of those lessons where we're not taught enough earlier in life the importance of it. And I think it's going to have the most impact on ultimately our longevity.

Oh my gosh. We have some friends who moved to Italy and they are constantly out eating and drinking. And it is like such. It's so culturally like we went and visited them a few times now and it's like the cultural norm there. And they are the happiest, they look the best they've ever looked. They're in the best shape they've ever been in. And they're like, we're never going back. Because they understand how closely health is associated with community. And it's like I love tuning into watching their lives because it is really, really incredible how that is at the forefront of everything they do. And they believe that when they're eating, you know, to enjoy your food with people. And it doesn't have the same effect than when you're alone. And it's crazy when you actually it in someone's life when you've known these people for so long.

I get it, you know, and I feel that even we were talking right before about my recent move to Miami and there's something about being in a new city where you have to put yourselves in, in situations that, you know, maybe I got a little bit too lazy after being in New York for 13 years where I'm now in this new city with lots of people. And this is the community that's going to be mine for the next 15 years. So I've had to do things that are uncomfortable, be the first woman to text and be like, hey, do you want to hang out? Being a little bit more aggressive on friendships than I probably have been for the first 13 years. And you know, putting as much intentionality around forming the types of friendships that are going to be there for when you have those, you know, soul crushing moments at, you know, 12 midnight, you need a friend. But understanding, you know, that that is just as important as working on my protein and doing my resistance training.

Okay, last question around that. Because I know you're somebody who absolutely, you know, you wrote this book on well being, so you feel it in everything. Spirituality, energy of people, all of the things. So if there's somebody who's listening and they're like, well, I have lots of friends, but they're not the type of people like where I want to go. They're not necessarily matching that. What is something recommend to start these relationships that really do help us stay even more healthy with that 45% rather than the people who you're like, no, no, if I keep hanging out with these people, I'm going to die early.

No, totally. Because there's a lot of people out there who could have the inverse effect. If it's someone who's a toxic person in your life, if it's someone who's a transactional purpose in your life and you know, it's a very quid pro quo. I do this for you, you do that for that. That's not really the type of meaning and connection that's going to deliver the connection that's ultimately going to lead to better longevity. And if you're unsure where to start. I think the best place is, you know, what brings you joy. And that can be a lot of different things at a lot of different life stages. I happen to have two kids, so school and kids is top of mind. It's an easy place to meet. People who have shared values, are going through very similar struggles, literally some of the exact same ones. But, you know, depending on where you are in life, that could be taking a pickleball, that could be going to an exercise class, and, you know, taking the time to talk to the person next to you on the mat. Crazy things like that. Do think it all comes down to intentionality and that you have to make it a priority and whether that means calendaring it in, whether that means giving yourself a goal. I mean, I respond to kind of the same metrics, you know, that we do. And you know, how you run a company of like, okay, I want to. I want to go out with, you know, four new women this month. I want to, you know, connect with four great friends. I want to make sure that I keep in touch with, you know, certain friends from college. But I think if you don't have that intention, it's just not gonna happen.

At first for you. When you. Especially when you moved to Florida, was it kind of like, did you find it challenging? I know I've always found it. I'm a bit of an introverted extrovert, so I like. I like to be alone until I don't.

You know what I mean?

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You know, I think it's like evolved through these shared interests in a way that's really lovely. And I think there's been these narrow moments in time when there's been large groups of people making life changes. So between 2020 and 2022, when my family moved, there was a lot of people who moved because of shared values. Maybe they wanted their kids to be outside more. Maybe they wanted, you know, to themselves be able to live outside more. So you've had this wonderful openness here within Miami of people who are all on the same journey and they're trying to make their friends too. So it's created a wonderful openness that I don't know exists in other cities or everywhere. We had looked at other places to move to prior to Miami and one of the things that had turned us off about other cities was they were kind of like, we're good here, we're a population. Where is Miami just has this really loving, great, there's room for all of us. Keep on coming. Bring your great restaurants, bring your culture, bring your families. There's room to grow. But they're of course, is an element of uncomfortability in all of it when you try it. I just think it's been a little easier to do in Miami than New York.

Okay. I love that.

Okay.

When you were writing this book because obviously you have now had this lifetime of being super passionate about health and wellness. What were the main things that you were like? Okay, these are the main themes that must go in this book because these are the compartments that go into.

Well being. Yeah. So I think that wellness and well being is just at this like really interesting point right now. There's never been more wellness out there, but it's a Cacophony of voices. And, you know, we talk in the, in the joy of well being about, you know, kind of like the polar extremes of it. You know, you, on the one hand, you may have Kardashian wellness, where there's lymphatic drainage facials, there's just a lot of frosting involved, there's a lot of gear, Epsom salt baths every night. You're looking at this being like, how do I fix this into my life? Then there's the Bro Wellness, which could be people measuring their VO2 Max and while they're wearing a CGM. And we've just become this culture of extremes created by a lot of social media algorithms I think are to play here. And so we looked at the wellness world and understood how much these principles have helped our own lives, have helped us recover, have helped us define and redefine the type of life that we wanted for ourselves and for our family. And we felt that it wasn't represented in the wellness world. We wanted to create a reawakening and redefine wellness in terms of well being with the primary, you know, differentiator being a focus on something bigger than yourself. And yes, you absolutely have to take care of yourself first. I feel like I'm a flight attendant on a flight. You've got to put on your mask first. You have to get yourself, your sleep in check. You have to get your mind and body in check before you can start taking care of others. But ultimately it is about something bigger and then just yourself. So how do we reframe the conversation away from the protocols, the rigidity, the this way, not that way, and really reframe it in a more loving conversation around helping people create a happy, healthy, well lived life that they have to determine what that looks like.

Okay, so growing up for me, and I love the fact that you said something greater than you, something bigger than you, like living for something, something more than that. I have this conversation all the time. I feel like it's. It's very generational with a lot of my friends, moms who I, you know, the conversation for me. And I know this isn't everyone, but especially growing up in the Midwest, it was always, I gave up my life for you, I raised you, or this is, this is what this looks like now, like there's nothing after that. And then our moms are all, you know, at home right now struggling with their purpose and they're trying to figure this whole world out that we're describing right now of what this even looks like. For them? And, like, is there more to live for after what they have been told their life should look like? And this was a conversation obviously passed down from my grandmother and her mother of just, this is kind of cut and dry. You have kids, this is what you live for. And outside of that, you should, or this should be how you feel and find your purpose is within family or your career. So when you say living for something greater, how do you start expanding that? How do you start defining that? What does that look like?

Like, yeah. So it's probably one of my favorite chapters in the book and a huge influence on kind of our POV. Here has been another Miami resident, Lisa Miller, PhD, and she has drawn this wonderful kind of connection between spirituality and purpose. But it's spirit spirituality, so broadly defined, so a capacity for transcendent awareness, a transcendent relationship. And there are so many ways that one can tap into this deeper meaning and connection. It can be prayer, it can be a walk in the woods. It can be nature, it can be volunteering. It can be, you know, really anything that brings you closer to what you feel are the universal truths and experiences that we all share, while also acknowledging, like, this is going to change throughout the decades, throughout life. You know, my purpose now is so different than my purpose 10, 20 years ago. And there's one rule that we have that we don't want to be rigid about anything, aside from being flexible. So, like, our points of view, our purpose, the science, it's all going to evolve. And I think we have to be warm and inviting and open to it and also have a curiosity to help get us back on track, to check in with ourselves when our kids leave our home. And now we're left in a position to reassess what is truly matters after that. This chapter of my life and how I think about the next few decades. And I think it's an exercise that you can start now. I mean, when I think of, even on a personal level, of, I've changed the way I exercise. You know, I used to do a ton of Pilates, a ton of yoga, which are still part of what I do. But after I read this extraordinarily scary statistic about.

That usually does it.

That usually does it. If you're over 65, there's a 25% chance chance that you fall. And if you do fall, studies show that your chances of falling again double. And if you fall and break your hip, then there's a 30 to 40% chance that you die within a year. And it's not from the fall that you die. It's from everything else that can happen. It's from the infection, it's from the hospital stay. It's from the depression of, you know, perhaps not being mobile. And we put that statistic on Mind bodygreen, and wow, we ruined a lot of people's Fridays. But it's one of those moments where I started thinking about what's the type of life I want, you know, 30, 40, 50 years from now. And if I want to be able to my kids decide to have kids, hold their kids. If I want to be playing pickleball at 90, I have to start building that armor today so that I can have the type of agility in my body and strengthen my body to protect myself in my later years.

Oh, my God. Yeah, I'm having conversations I never thought I would have right now, like with my other friend who we've been friends for a long time, and she's like, was talking about muscle loss after a certain age. And you can't really build it up after a certain age. So now is kind of our time that if we want to build and maintain it. I was like, oh, my God, I never thought I'd have these conversations. But it's true. It's the moment you realize you're like, oh, I'm going to get older no matter what. And the most important thing for just like you said, health, connection, mental health is truly, can you move your body? Are you in community? Are you capable? Are you going to be able to lift things and be strong? Like, everything that you said is now my health priorities compared to what they used to be, which is very, very different. But, yeah, I'm looking at health in a completely different way now. And a lot of it is coming from purpose and community. I have a background of my whole family was overweight. I'm from a really small town in Upper Michigan. I was told my whole life I'd be overweight in that it was our genetics. And so from birth to 18 years old, while I was under that roof, environment had the strongest factor in my life. I would always try to go on diets. I started working out, but I couldn't quite get past my environment because it was dinner, first helping, second helping, third helping, then snacks all night long. And it was not an active lifestyle. We would watch movies, we would sit on the couch. I didn't want to play because the food was adding to lethargy, all of these different things. So for me, I spent over a decade learning about just food fitness all of those things, and it really helped. But I didn't quite change my environment until later, meaning, like, get myself into these communities around these really, really healthy people, and also noticing the role that purpose and fulfillment has that you talk. So when somebody right now is maybe in a place where they're really focused, you know, maybe they're really focused on that health journey of food and of fitness and of moving differently, what are the really big factors that you also think they need to look at into each week or every single day?

Yeah, I mean, I think one of the biggest pillars for me is sleep. And sleep is something that affects so many people. Right now, 33% of Americans have some sort of sleep disorder. The most common one is insomnia. And sleep is one of those things that creates, fortunately, when everything's going right, the wellness wave that says, you know, when you start to get the small momentum in your life, it begets more momentum. And if you get a good night's sleep, hey, the rest of your day usually kind of goes according to plan. Yeah. Unfortunately, the inverse of that is true, which is the sleep pile or the wellness pile up, which is when one thing goes wrong, it's harder to get the rest of your life, your life on track. And I have a, you know, a very personal, long history with sleep. I remember at my first job in my early 20s, I was supposed to give a presentation in front of senior executive, which was going to determine my job placement. And I built this thing up in my mind to a place that it was so important that I didn't sleep for three nights. Ended up in the hospital where they gave me a Xanax, which helped me sleep, but did not really solve, you know, kind of the underlying issues. And obviously there was a lot to address there from, like, childhood and all sorts of things, but also just basic, you know, sleep etiquette. And at this point in time, I was doing a lot of drinking at night, and I have the type of constitution that's super sensitive to this disruptive effect of alcohol on my body and my sleep rhythm. So this has been a lifelong journey. But why always start with sleep is if, you know, if your diet goes off track for five days, even a month, you're going to be okay. You missed the gym for a month, you're going to be okay. If you don't sleep for three or five days, you will not be okay. You will likely be in a hospital. And I just think it gives a clarity to life that's so, so important. So now I'm thoughtful about my sleep, but also to a way that stressing over your sleep can actually create more sleep anxiety. There's been an interesting study that showed that even just having an alarm clock within your room can create more sleep anxiety. So if you're the type of person that wakes up in the middle of the night and you're like, oh God, it's one in the morning and I'm still awake, that's going to affect negatively your sleep pattern. So you really have to understand like what your body needs. And then there are some fundamentals that work for most people. Like having a cool room. I keep mine at 65 degrees, 67, pretty cool. I'm very thoughtful about my caffeine curfew. So if most people say stop at 3, my body needs to stop closer, like 10, 30, 11. I can't be having caffeine but then also doing it in a way that doesn't, you know, suck the joy out of your life. You know, probably every sleep expert in the world will say don't watch TV in bed, but I do because it brings me a lot of joy. And that's not going to have the biggest impact on my sleep. It's you know, being thoughtful about my boundaries with social media, my boundaries with work because that's the things that will keep my mind going in a way where I can't get to sleep.

I'm sleep obsessed because I am that person who falls under eight hours and I, I feel it the next day. I just, I feel like my personality changes. I'm much more short tempered. I, I find it harder to like find joy in things. So I am like, this is a non negotiable for me making sure that I sleep. I love hearing that you keep your room at 65 degrees because my husband yells at me when I put 69 degrees and I'm like, I swear to God I need it cooler. And he's like, who needs it that cool? I do. Okay, good. I'm going to use this against him.

Exactly, exactly.

This wellness expert said this was normal.

Totally.

Okay. What is something that you wish more people would ask themselves or you wish more people knew about wellness?

You know, I think there's like so many easy entry points, points to start. And I think the knocks on wellness is time, money and resources. And what we really wanted to distill in the joy of well being is the time tested practices that actually work, that can be integrated and not added into your life and that bring you joy. And so when you, I think there's an outsized focus on what I would call the frosting of wellness. And not enough of a focus on actually baking the cake and the fundamentals, mental practices. So when someone is, you know, again, not sure where to start, like I would point them to the first chapter on breath, which, you know, why did we start there? Because you breathe 17,000 to 30,000 times a day and most of us are doing it all wrong. I was a mouth breather for most of my life. And breathing through your mouth not only hurts immune function and other critical functions, but it also can exacerbate anxiety because you are giving life to the fight or flight reaction part of your body. So learning how to nostril breathe is something that's super important. You can start when you're driving in your car. You can start when you're having a conversation with someone. And like, for me personally, as someone who may be prone to interrupting people, you know, breathing through your nose makes you calm down, be a better listener, listen to other points of view in a way that maybe I wouldn't if I wasn't breathing through in my mouth. So there's so many like life skills that I wish we learned when we were growing up, but it's never too late. And if you're looking for a change that's immediate, that's going to affect you literally every second of every day and that doesn't cost a thing. I start with nostril breathing.

Wow, that is so interesting. I was just doing it while you were talking and it is a different. Definitely it took me some thought there because I must be a mouth breather.

Yeah. If you're unsure, you know, have, have your husband record you when you sleep and if you hear some snoring, you could be a mouth breather.

It's probably me. Okay, what are you personally working on right now? Because I know this journey is never ending. It's always like something is revealing itself to you. So what is being revealed to you right now and how is it revealing itself of what you want to focus on?

You know, sleep is like a constant constant in my life and I think that is something that is life and entrepreneurial stressors go up and down. That will continue to be a focus focus, you know, and that is like a work in progress from day one. I'm also still in community building mode. Like we're about to have our year anniversary here and that's super exciting that we now have a community of people and convolute and are cultivating that. But it will definitely be a work in Progress. And then just as a human, I know I take things too personally and that not everyone's going to like me. And that is a long time work in progress.

Oh, you and me both. Yeah, that one always. That one will probably haunt me the rest of my life. But, you know, little by little, we learned. And community too. Good job on being there a year and getting as much done as you are. But, you know, you had mentioned pickleball, and I swear, like, all of my friends who seem extremely happy right now have pickleball in common. I'm not even kidding. Like, my neighbor just was like, you gotta come play pickleball with me. Are you playing pickleball?

Of course. Since I live in South Florida.

Tell me about it.

Yeah, I mean, there's, you know, so much I could tell you about agility and, you know, grip strength that you're getting from it. But, you know, really, it just brings me a lot of joy. And I grew up playing a little bit of tennis as someone who grew up in Southern California. And there's something that just takes about pickleball, or at least the way we're playing it, that just kind of takes the pressure and the achievement out of things growing up and having kids now in sports. Like, one of my friends asked me this astute question of, like, can kids these days play. Play sports at a certain age just because they enjoy it and not to get good at it or because they want it for college? And it's a really fair question in today's world. And I think with pickleball just taking all the competition out, it's truly fun. It's best played with doubles. So you have that, like, built in community. And I'm all for habit stacking and any activity, whether it's playing pickleball or whether it's going to the beach with my family, where you literally cannot be on your phone, which we know is not good for us in any capacity, is just further, further bringing joy and peace to your life.

Okay, hold me to this. I literally need to make an appointment to do it this week.

Meaning I'll hold you to it. Okay.

Because it has been like, pickleball has been seriously, like, one of these things. I'm like, okay, I'm getting this message again, like, hearing another happy person, person who loves wellness talking about pickleball.

Okay.

God, there's so many things that I have on my paper here. Here's what I have. I want you to talk on whatever jumps out at you first.

Okay?

So I have environment, spirituality, hydration, nature, Sunlight connection. I know we talked on a lot of those, but anything that you're like, ooh, I want to touch on that, because that's really important.

I love the punchy ones. And, you know, sometimes when we talk about things at mindbodygreen, we know what's going to strike a chord. And sometimes we have, have. We have no idea. So I'm going to go back to Lisa Miller just because I thought this. This quote from her research was. Was fascinating, and I was kind of blown away by the controversy. But she said that when she found that when mother and children were both high in spirituality, the child was 80% protected against depression compared with when mother and children were not concurrent for spirituality. So what that means is a child was five times less likely to be depressed when spiritual life was shared with a mother. So, you know, sometimes it's easier for me to kind of make those investments in spirituality when it's not just about myself, when it's about my daughters and about, you know, the greater world. But I think we're at an interesting turning point where we have less organized religion. So in some ways, you have people turning to their wellness tribes, whether it be their CrossFit tribe or whatever it may be. There's so many of them out there. But people are really searching for this meaning. And I wish, you know, that there was more education around it, more focus around it, and more time given for both people and children to help find what that something bigger is in their life. Because when I look at the absolutely frightening mental health statistics, this is what keeps me up at night and how we not only engage those muscles in our own lives, but help young girls build them in their own.

Oh, man, that hits home and that hits hard. I was just having this conversation with my husband because I had posted something about whatever you believe, it doesn't matter, universe, God, whatever it is. I use the word God, and somebody wrote underneath the post, they were like, people who believe in God have no critical thinking skills. And I just took a moment and I was like, okay, interesting. And I just felt like, wow, it doesn't matter if you believe in God or just something bigger. I had this conversation with my husband that I actually can't imagine not having a belief in something bigger because I would feel so disconnected, let alone disconnected in my community. But it really is a theme for me in my life that I find it fascinating that I really, you know, when. When you talk to friends or anyone going through anything, the first thing they do, even if they're not religious people Is like, could you pray for me or could you, you know, something like that, where you want to connect in community. So for you, what are some practices? Let's just say they're, they have no idea about spirituality or they're coming from a religious background. What, what does that even mean? Like, what does it look like to start creating a connection with something bigger than you?

I mean, I think it's about, you know, getting back to that question of what brings you joy, what lights something inside of you and how are you serving others? So spirituality could mean, you know, volunteer hearing, it could mean spending time in nature, it could mean helping and serving others. There's such a broad way that we can connect with it beyond religion in the organized way. And if, and if it's religion that, you know, speaks to your soul, fantastic. If it's, you know, so many other types of spirituality out there, but it's really, you know, the core is that you are connecting with something bigger in a transcendent way.

Yes. Okay. I love this.

All right.

What in the book do you want people to know? Like who was this book for? Who should be reading this book?

Yeah. So when I think of I had that life threatening pulmonary embolism and went on this zigzag journey which I describe as like a game of Marco Polo where you're trying to tune into yourself, you're trying to figure out what type of life I should be living. This was the roadmap that I wish I had over 10 years ago when I was on this, where instead of visiting everyone in New York City, and this was when New York City was the epicenter of the well being world. And I saw everyone in western, I saw everyone on the holistic side. I saw some good, I saw some bad. And this is the roadmap that I wish I had to get me that roi. But all that said, I wish that we didn't have to wait until we needed that cause of cosmic kick in the butt from the universe. I think we need to be a little bit more self critical and ask ourselves, is this a life I want to be living? How do I know when it's time to change my life and ask ourselves these questions. Think about our personal mission statement and our reason in the same way that we think about our objectives at work and our mission at work and apply that to the most important relationship that we have, which is with ourselves so that we can do the really hard work which is defining what is a well lived life. What does a rich well being life look like? Because it's going to look different for me than it is for you. And that's the hard work that only we can define in terms of ensuring that we have a life that cultivates these rich, joyful experiences and enables us to live a long, healthy, happy life that's full of what we like to say, joy span, not just health, Spanish span, not just lifespan, but full of truly joyous memories that, that speak to the soul.

What is your best health and business advice? It doesn't have to be of all time. Maybe it's just ringing really true for you right now.

Yeah, I mean, I go back to financial well being, which is the most unsexy answer you could ever ask for. But it's kind of such an important part of our, kind of our personal story as a couple. Mind and Green didn't make money for like over three years and I was very employable. I had worked at Gap, Walmart, Amazon, so it was really easy for me to get a job and support our family. And we would set these goals of, okay, in three months, you know, we'll look at what the numbers are in six months. And the numbers were never there from a financial standpoint. But maybe there were other metrics that were showing momentum like traffic growth. And very early in our marriage we had to to seek therapy to align our perspectives on financial well being and the risks we are willing to take and what that meant to us as a couple. Now, fast forward 10 years later, it's how we run the company. There was an age in which there was a lot of capital and businesses were unprofitable and that wasn't okay then and it's definitely not okay now in 2023 in the macro environment that we live in. But I think being able to have control of your destiny, to not have to things that you don't want to do and to not have to go to sleep at night, like, I've got enough stress, I don't want to add the financial stress of running a business to that. So while it's very unsexy, financial well being is one of our core pillars at Mind Body Green. It's how we run our business and I do think it's an important part of health and well being as well.

Oh, I love that you answered that because that is such a pillar for my husband and I, because let me tell you, when we weren't financially fit, there is nothing for your health journey or joy to stand on because it takes all your bandwidth. Takes all your bandwidth. So.

And it's not where you want to put your mind share.

No, not at all. And it's where it will go if you don't have it and you won't get sleep. Let me tell you that too.

That is true. I can. I concur. Yes.

That'll wake you up, keep you up, all the things. So I'm so grateful for you. Right when you were finished with the business talk, I was like, oh, I could have gone in that direction too. That would have been so good. So to be continued. But I'm super excited for your book. I think it's really important for people to just get that reset and reminder of really when you focus your priorities on it holistically on all these things that you're talking about, I think the results that you want will come a lot easier. So I love that you wrote this book. And where can we find it? Follow you all the fun stuff.

Awesome. So the Joy of well Being A Practical Guide to a Happy, Healthy and Long Life is sold bookstores everywhere starting May 23rd, but you can pre order now at thejoyofwellbeing.com and we have some special gifts along with that. And then Mind bodygreen is our life's work. And I'm Colleen Wakab and on all the platforms.

Amazing. Thank you so much. And you guys, if you loved this episode, especially if you know somebody, the biggest thing you can do is text this to a friend, share on social media, let us know what you loved about it. Tag Colleen, let her know your biggest takeaways because it's always so much fun to see who's actually listening to our conversation. And until next time, earn your happy. Bye, everyone.