Prioritizing Our Marriage, Choosing Business Partnerships, and Managing Multiple Businesses, Live Q&A with Chris Harder

I just kind of let it go. I was like, you know what? I'm gonna really focus on me and I'm gonna make the changes in my life and I'm not gonna worry. Of course I wanted him with me. Like, he's my everything. But at the same time, I knew that there was something for me that I had to follow and not worry about him. So it was when I stopped worrying. Ladies, ladies, we love to worry. It's our favorite thing. We think it changes things, but it doesn't. It makes it worse. And when I did that, everything changed.

Foreign.

And we're back with another episode of He Said, she Said. Now, notice Lori did not say that part. That's because she's getting on an airplane going one direction. I'm getting on an airplane going another direction. We are dividing and conquering right now. But this episode's really cool because you're going to hear from both of us in an episode where we were just interviewed on stage at our Elite Mastermind client Melissa Hanelt's event called Burnout to All Out. Now, she puts on this live event every single year, and if you don't know Melissa, you've got to go check her out. Melissa Hanault on all of the socials. She's an incredible LinkedIn expert that teaches her audience how to get a lot more leads by leveraging LinkedIn, and she's like the master at it. Now, what makes this episode really cool is that it's the entire time that Lori and I are on stage being interviewed by her about all things being a couple in business, and we even get into, like, how did we know when we had to make pivots in our business and how did we support each other? We talk a lot about what's it like when one person in the relationship, and this could even be a friendship, gets into personal development and the other person's not ready yet.

We even tell a funny story how.

Lori tricked me into personal development in.

Costa Rica, if you will.

Anyhow, it's an incredible episode, and when we got off that stage, we're like, wait, this needs to be our next he said, she said, because there was so much good stuff in here. Now, in the beginning, you heard me say that Melissa is one of the members of our Elite Mastermind, and we loved that we got to jump on an airplane, fly out to Austin, Texas, get on her stage and be able to support her in this way. That's one of the things that we love doing when we all lock arms together in the Elite Mastermind is we travel to each other's events. We support each other. We had Miriam who was there. We had Aaron who used to be in the elite Mastermind there, like, people show up to support each other when they are a member of our elite Mastermind family. Now, we're about to start enrolling in the end of October, so I would hit pause right now if you want to apply for our elite Mastermind, because every year, more than half the people renew. So that means every year there's less than half of the seats in this very intimate setting that become available, and the waiting list is tough. We go in the order that we get your applications. So literally right now, if you're going to make more than $500,000 this year, hit pause and go to Chrisharder Me Mastermind and click Apply. Get your application in, because we go through those in first come, first serve basis based on the order they come in. So hit pause, go to Chrisharder Me. That's me, Chrisharder Me Mastermind.

And.

And click Apply. Then come back to this episode because you are going to love everything that we talked about on stage. Here we go.

All right. This is going to be fun. So, Chris and Lori, the very first question I would love to jump into with you guys, because one of the big things we talked about yesterday is purpose and impact in what you do. And I. It was maybe a week or two ago, I think it was you, Chris, that made a post about how you and Lori are most excited and just in momentum in your businesses when you have alignment and purpose in what you're doing. Can you speak a little bit to that? Because I know you guys and we'll get into this. You've had many iterations and in new evolutions in business and offers and what you do. And as you go through business and you go through entrepreneurship, there's moments where you lose your way and you kind of forget, like, the purpose. Like, why did I get started? So do you guys want to speak to that a little bit?

Absolutely. You want to go first or me? Okay. So just so I can get an idea from you guys, hand up if you feel like you have momentum in your business right now. Be real. Perfect. And now hand up if you feel like you're kind of stuck. Okay. And hand up if you feel like you're both. See, that's the real thing right there. That's the real thing right there. I'm both right now. I've started a massive fintech company. It's called Frello, a friendlier Loan and it match makes those that have an urgent need and those that would lend to the person that have an urgent need. And we protect the loan and move the money and do all this stuff. Except when you get involved in something like that, there's a few things. You know, the term ignorance is bliss. If you knew what you were about to encounter, you wouldn't actually do it. Anybody else feel that it's real, but once you're in, you're in. And that's the difference between those that make it across a finish line or not is you have to decide. I stepped into this now I'm going to step all the way through this, and I'm going to see this all the way through to the end. And the amount of regulatory, the amount of attorneys calls, the amount of government agency calls, the amount of all those things that I never thought I would have to do, that I spend my life on zoom doing right now. Zoom fatigue is horrible. But simultaneously, to your question, this is also the most fun and the most excited and the most, like, lit up I've ever been about anything I've ever done in my entire business career. And the fact that those two things can exist simultaneously is what you have to be okay with. And when you actually accept that as fact, you no longer dwell on, you know, this went wrong, or I have to make this pivot or this feels like a disaster, or I'm waking up at 3am every single morning. You no longer dwell on that, and instead you feed off the energy of. I also get to build the biggest thing I've ever built. I also get to help these people. I also get to bring this really cool thing to the market that hasn't been there before. And you get to choose which one of those categories you're going to lean into and get your fuel from.

I love that. Good morning, everyone. I'm so excited to be here. Melissa, thank you so much for having us.

Thank you so much for coming. Coming.

This is our favorite thing to do, truly like to be in rooms with all of you guys. I see some familiar faces. So, you know, for. For me, it's really easy for everybody, I think, to get caught up in the numbers. Who just sets that goal. And then that's all you can. That's all you can remember. You're like, I forgot why I'm doing this. I don't even know, like, what was the whole purpose. Because you just get so caught up in feeling like you have to meet. Meet those numbers and hit those goals. Who is that in Here, like, it's really easy.

Especially.

Especially once you start getting a team. You're like, oh, my God, this is all I can think about. So, you know, it's. It's going back and consistently, either being in rooms like this, being a part of programs, or having friendships that remind you, like, hey, we are so lucky to get to do this. We are so lucky to be in this room, you guys, just to even remember why we're doing it. And I think that when I think of purpose, there's always two things in your business and your life of why you're doing it. And, you know, the first one is the problem that you set out to solve with your business, right? The reason why you want to help these people, the reason why you want to solve that problem. And the second one that people forget about but I think is so important is the permission that you are giving other people and the roadmap and the playbook of you just even stepping into your dreams. So you have to think of who's watching you, who you've inspired. Could be. Who are you inspired? Look at by Melissa stepping into doing this event. How many of you said to yourself, okay, I'm gonna take that as, like, a nudge that if she can do it, I can do it. Like, just by her doing this, you're like, okay, if I can just go be in her presence because she did it, that I could probably do it too.

Right?

And that's something that we do every single day whenever we decide to overcome a fear or get a little bit of courage. Like, you are inspiring so many people. You don't always hear it right away, but as you guys get into years and years of this, that is the part that literally keeps us going, is when we get to hear people who message us and say, like, in your intro, I'm like, I did not know these things. That's like, I can't quit now. You just ruined me. Like, yeah.

So that's.

Those are big ones that we always try to tap into. And, you know, it's nice if you don't have a partner doing this with you, like, finding an accountability partner in this room that you connect with frequently. Because Chris and I now have so many people around us, and we have each other to remind each other daily. Like, when we're on our walks and we get so overwhelmed with the to do list or with a big challenge that's happening because we have plenty of them now, it's like, oh, we. We signed up for this.

Yeah.

This challenge is turning us into the people that we want to be in that can handle the big blessing. Because if we can't handle this, we can't handle the big blessing coming from it.

Yes. You know, we. I did a big talk on this yesterday about how the challenge is what changes us and that we have to embrace it. Right. Love this so much. Okay, so I'm going to. Let's move into pivots, because this is something that you guys have done really well. You know, you guys have pivoted in your brands. You've pivoted in your offers over the years. You've just had a series of iterations of really successful businesses and coaching programs and running live events. And I think my question for each of you, because I know, like, Laura, you went from celebrity fitness competitor to being top in network marketing, to being the guru in personal development, to running these coaching programs and having these live, massive live events and then switching into the product space and launching a product. Right. We heard with your bio as well, Chris. Like, you started off as an executive, and you've made many iterations of transformations yourself in business. And my question to both of you is, when do you know that it's time to make a pivot? Because I know you and I have talked about this. Again, I'm selfishly getting free coaching up here, you guys, because we also talk about how when something's going really well and it's bringing in a lot of revenue, I see this myself with clients that I coach that sometimes or a lot, we get the shiny object syndrome of, like, well, but this is my passion, and this is what I want to go do. And then the thing that was funneling, like, the revenue, like, dries up, and sometimes it can be a bad decision. Right. And sometimes it's the right decision. So I guess my question is, since you guys are kind of, like, experienced in this space of pivoting and pivoting well, is when do you know that it's the right time? When you've ridden out this show long enough that it's time to close that chapter and move to the next one and do it with calculated risk? Does that make sense?

Okay.

I don't. I don't think you can always know right away. I think that just like with anything, as you make decisions and you get the data from that decision, you're going to be able to make a better choice the next time. So I think that it's really important to first of all know that as you're pivoting that you might make a wrong decision. And it wasn't a wrong decision. It was a right decision because it gave you the data for what you need to do. So, you know, there have been times where I think I pivoted way too soon. And I also don't regret that because it served me in some other form. But one of the ways that I can always tell, like, I wouldn't even call it necessarily a pivot now I just kind of realize that it's the next evolution of myself calling me forward or a part of me that is already in there but wants to come out. Meaning, like, I've always been into personal development, even when I was in fitness. But then I wanted to start showing that more because I realized I couldn't get a transformation for people in their body if they didn't do personal development. So it was like, you know, I'm like, okay, well, now I really want to start leaning into this. So some keys about when I know that's starting to have to come out is I start waking up in the.

Middle of the night.

Like, truly, I'm like, ooh, something is there. Like, I'm supposed to do something else. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? You're just waking up going, oh, there's more. I don't know what it is, but there's more. And then you start asking questions around that. When we pivoted in business to let's talk about, I had a small personal training studio that we would also do, like, group workouts and stuff on the weekend. And when network marketing started taking off, I remember going to Chris and saying, I don't want to do my gym anymore because it's consuming way too much time for me. And I want to go all in on network marketing because look at the money we're already making over here. And, you know, at the time, I was really upset with his answer because I said, we still get really mad at each other. It's great, but we work it out. And he was like, you know, you're not quitting your gym. Because that's what I wanted to do. I'm very much like that. Anyone like that? You see the new thing? I'm like, I am over it. Like, I was done with it. I had a bad attitude. Like, I didn't want to train anyone. All of a sudden, all these clients I used to like, I didn't like them in, like, a day because I was done right? It's just my personality, and I have to go back and reset and reframe. And so he tells me he's like, no, you have to. You know, what we're going to do is we're going to set a goal with network marketing and when you hit this number, then we can close the gym. I was so irritated with him then and now I'm so glad that we did that because it taught me a few things. It taught me that I had way more capacity than I thought that I had. I was upset with him because I was like, I don't have time to do both. Like, I'm just stuck in these in between worlds. And what it taught me is that I had way more capacity. I was like working nights, I was working weekends. And that was really good for me because you guys know if you want to grow a business, there will be seasons where you are, you are all out, you really are. And so it taught the capacity. But then also it gave me that goal of, you know what, he's right. If I can't get this business to this place, which wasn't that much further, do I deserve to quit? Is it in the right place to quit the gym? So whenever we're pivoting now, we set those goals or we make sure. Is it something that, like you said, could we have kept the gym going? Could we have like really secured a team there, which we didn't want to do that. But if you're thinking of that, that's the other thing is when do you know it's okay to pivot? Do you want to keep that business? Is it really self sufficient? Do you have the team that could not only keep it going, but grow it? So those are all questions that we ask ourselves now of are you really done with this or is this something that you could sustain, keep the money coming in, you know, and keep that business going as well.

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I would add to this there's two types of pivots. There's a forced pivot and an elective pivot. A forced pivot is when you lose your job, or when your industry shuts down, or when the CFPB says, hey, if you do it this way, we're going to sue you. In those situations, you have no choice but to pivot. But I'll tell you what. In the thousand plus examples I've seen of friends and clients and everybody else being in a situation of a forced pivot, I have yet to see one where it wasn't working for you in your favor. And that's not to say it's going to feel good. It's not to say it's not going to be scary. It's not going to say that you're not going to be angry and scared and all those things. But I have yet to see one where it wasn't working out in somebody's favor. My father, I forget my arm says live as though universe conspires in your favor. And you have to believe that. And if you believe that, then your chances of it turning out that way are always going to be in your favor. The elective pivot, though, that's the tougher one. People would think that the force pivot is a tough one. The elective pivot is the tough one because you have to examine where it's coming from. You know the phrase the grass is always greener. The grass is green where you water it. No, it really is. And the money's in the monotony. And what I see way too many times is somebody's all excited to build their program or build their product, and they love the ideation phase and they love the launch phase. And then when it gets monotonous, when it's been a couple of years, when it's no longer new and exciting, like has that new car smell, guess what? They want to pivot because something else seems cool, something else seems shiny, something else seems exciting. And that's where you have to be certain, as Laurie was alluding to. Is this pivot coming from a place of me being bored or me not wanting to do the unsexy stuff anymore? Like it's sexy to announce a new product, it's sexy to launch something and everyone tell you how cool you are and how great it is? It's not to do the day to day stuff. So is your elected pivot coming from you not wanting to do the boring, monotonous, difficult stuff you just want to do that shiny part of the journey, or is it coming from what you're doing right now is truly no longer aligned? And I think the only way to answer that is to make sure that you know why you want to wake up every single day. If you get really in touch with knowing what you want your life to look like, what is important to you, and why you want to wake up every single day, then all you have to do is use that centerpiece pillar to measure should I pivot or not?

Against.

And if it says yep, you got to pivot because you're no longer aligned with what you want to wake up for every day, then pivot. And if you realize, wait, what I'm doing right now really is aligned with what I want to wake up for every day, it's just not very fun right now. Then choose to water that grass and make it green where you already are.

So, so, so good. So good. Okay, next question. This is around because you guys are really big personal brands and I would argue that is a business all in itself. So what is it like managing a personal brand while lifting up a product at the same time? And how do you do that? Because to me it feels like two different businesses. Can you speak to that?

It truly is. I tell people all the time I have two full time jobs, the personal brands, that's a full time job plus and then fro is a full time job plus. So you have to be able to know, okay, who gets the tiebreaker. In my case, I know it's always Frollo. That's the first thing you have to establish who gets the tiebreaker. The second meaning which one gets your attention if you have to give it one way or the other. The second thing is to realize that over time, you spending energy and resources and continuing to grow that personal brand, even when you don't want to is what's going to keep you safe is what's going to be your safety net anytime that you want to or have to do something else. Almost related to the pivot question. Yeah. When Lori wanted to switch from fitness to self development because she already had such a large personal brand, she had all of those individuals that already had the know like and trust factor with her able to bring them over. And not everybody comes. Some people only wanted abs, nothing else. But a lot of them will come with and it makes your pivot. It makes whatever change you have to or want to do that much easier.

Yes.

Your safety isn't in one particular business. Your safety isn't in how much money you have in the bank. I've got a friend that lost $80 million out of his checking account overnight. Your safety isn't in any of those things. Your safety is in having an engaged audience that you have sustained over a long period of time, building that know, like and trust factor so that if you had to start selling donuts tomorrow, they would invest in your donut shop and come to your rescue and line up at the front door on opening day and tell all their friends about it.

We have a surprise donut shop business coming.

I wish. I wish.

They're kind of healthy. Okay, so my answer for what I do is just a tiny bit different. Just because I really do believe that they are so the same, your personal brand and your other brands. Because the more that I invest into my personal brand, the more eyeballs I convert into the product or into, like when I had fitness memberships. So, you know, because so much of the way that I run my brand is all about a lifestyle. So it's kind of the more I show myself, whether it's being goofy or with my dogs or doing business or whatever that is, and the more people that I can recruit into that personal brand or that that lifestyle, the better all of the products do. So for me. When you. When you think of it from a company perspective, they always say, you know, for somebody who is an influencer or who has the ability to have a personal brand or who has a large personal brand, you're either allocating that time and money into marketing, right? So let's say you're not an influencer. You have to pay for eyeballs. Correct. So you're either paying with money or your time. If you're someone who's an influencer, you can put a lot of time there and you get to take away from the marketing budget of your company because you can invest time and get more eyeballs. So when I'm investing into my personal brand, I'm probably having to invest less into Facebook ads or when I'm investing into my relationships, because right now with my product, a big part of what we're about to do is run ads through different people who are influencers or influential people. And for me, because I've spent a lot of time, like, if you see me, I'll be at a, you know, a girls weekend mastermind with people who are also influential. And that moves the needle so much on my business because if they say, yes, Lori, I'll record my, you know, testimonial or an ad for glossy because I love it so much, then what we'll do is we'll put money behind that where I would have had to pay that person 5, 10, 15, $20,000 to do that, dependent upon how influential they are where if I just went and invested in them and said, hey, what can I do for you? What can we do for each other?

That.

That is, you know, I'm investing time to get that back. So there's so many different ways that you. You can, you know, spend that time on your personal brand that can convert into your brand, because it's eyeballs. We're always, you know, Chris always says this, but there's not a whole lot of things in your company that couldn't be solved by more attention and eyeballs, right? By more people looking at you, by more followers, by more people in your email list, by more people on your text list. Like, most of our problems in here would be solved if we had a massive email list, right? Then we could just kind of dial in the message. We could just kind of dial in the product. But it's usually that attention that we're trying to get.

So good. So good. And I love this. And I've actually seen this lately. I feel like maybe it was with maybe Jenna Kutcher and Amy Porterfield kind of promoting each other through Facebook ads. And I was like, wow, that is brilliant. Right? So it's like investing in the network. And we talked about the law of reciprocity yesterday. How can I serve and how can I help the. These people? Okay, so more on. I want to go a little bit further around collaboration in personal brands, because I've seen the two of you be wildly synergistic. We're kind of like, faster. You can go faster together. So I know you were just talking about your girlfriends, but I've also seen the two of you promote each other and what each other does on with leveraging your personal brands. Do you feel that that's been impactful kind of running together and supporting each other? And if so, like, how are. How are you doing that? And can you share that with these guys?

Yeah, I think. Are you talking about between us or between kind of everyone?

Like, between the two of you as spouses who have big brands, like, supporting each other, like, running faster together kind of thing. Like, you're like the live events that you guys are doing right now, the dinner series and stuff like that.

You know, the cool thing about partnering, whether it's with. With your spouse or with a friend, you know, I do some stuff with Lindsey Schwartz and stuff some other people. And whenever I get the opportunity to, if it works, like, I will absolutely partner in Glocee. I have Natalie Ellis from Boss Babe. We learned, you know, real quick before we get into partnering. Like, we learned the mindset of abundance within about partnering and about, you know, lifting other people up and about promoting people's stuff. Way back in network marketing because the teams that were thriving were not afraid to share and they also weren't afraid to, you know, if a leader came to them and they're like, hey, you know, I talked to this other leader and I think I want to, I, I'm supposed to join their team cause they talk to me first, but I want to join your team. We would turn them away every single time, hands down, even if we thought they could make us a ton of money. Because we believed that what would be created energetically in that awkwardness of another large leader that we always have to work with is going to create a problem. And we always got blessed times 10. So with that said, when it comes to your audience, I think that partnering, you know, with, with Chris is huge because I don't need all the credit, nor do I do what he does. Like, he is so much better than me at strategy and coaching people. Like, I'm one to many for sure. I don't know who's a one to many person in this room. Like, you're better with way more people. Like group coaching in front of a lot of people. Okay, one of you. Awesome. I feel very so cool.

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All right, Chris, you talk. No, I'm just kidding. But he's a one to one. He's a one to one. Like he loves the one on one coaching. You know, he's great with strategy in your business, which is why he's doing so great with you and all of his other clients. And so for me, when I partner with Chris, I get better. Like I get better. We get to serve way more people. So we do have a bit of, you know, I wouldn't say we like sit down and have a strategy around it, but we get to cover so many more people because there's a lot of people who will listen to, start listening to my podcast, hear an episode with him on it and resonate way more. Start listening to him, go to his stuff. And so, you know, that all funnels into our business as a whole and that just, we feel a lot more covered. So when you're thinking of your business partner, you know, with Natalie Ellis in Glossy like she is, so she's like a Chris, she's very strategic, she's very linear. So we can cover a whole lot more in that company than with me, who wants to be out collecting the eyeballs from the many, bringing them home into the funnel and the strategy.

Strategy, yeah, yeah.

I would just echo what she said and I think if I said it in slightly different words, it would be collaboration is always the shortcut. Whether it's as spouses or you finding somebody else in here to collaborate with or a few somebody else's to collaborate with or the way you mentioned Jenna and Amy always collaborating on their stuff. Lori mentioned you got to come from a place of abundance, right. So you can't be like, oh, they're not going to come to my event if I promote their event. Guess what? People are event junkies or book junkies or product junkies. And I mean that in a positive way. They should be. You should want to consume you a lot of books and there's not enough books from one author. So authors should be promoting each other. You should want to go to a lot of events and there's not just one person that can put on enough events for you. So they should be promoting each other and so on and so on. So we just happen to be good complimentary halves. We happen to be good at opposite things. And so it, it fits together really nice. But if you don't have that built in at home, which most people probably don't, in that, in that situation, go get it. Like I did with my business partner Matt, you know, Fred Low that I mentioned, I know nothing about tech and I am not exaggerating when I say if our TV breaks, my brother has to come over and like fix it and plug it in and do something.

Really just plug it in.

I am not. I hate tech. I never wanted tech, I never wanted an app, none of that. But it was the only way to create this two sided marketplace in order to match these people. Right. And so instead of saying, oh, I'm not good at this, oh, I don't know how to do this, I went and I found Matt, my business partner, who was a friend of mine, and I knew that he and his team were good at the pieces that I am not good at. And I also knew that I brought some things to the table that were not their area of expertise. And so when I pitched Matt on this, and then when I pitched his team on this, we saw that it was a really good fit and we're off to the races together. And that's the spirit of your question, is everything is easier if you go find somebody else to do it with instead of just muscling it out yourself the whole time.

Yes. So good. Okay, follow up to that actually. So let's talk about the startup because both of you have gotten into the product space, digital, physical, and Lori went first. So I'm curious. Lori went first in this journey. Chris, you're in the thick of it now. And again, being in the same household together, is there anything that you were able to glean from Lori going first? And now that you're in the thick of it, is there any different perspective you have than you didn't have prior to launching your own product?

I love this question.

I have it much easier because Lori went first even though they're entirely different products.

Right, right.

No joke. Watching the way she did a strategic fundraise so that they weren't just checks, but they were people that could immediately share the product. Right. Because they had skin in the game. Watching the way that she kept hitting wall after wall after wall and instead of being defeated by it, just kind of pick herself up with no energy left and just find that one last ounce of energy to go find another wall to throw herself up against. And I'm not kidding. And then finally seeing her break through one of those unexpected walls, it teaches you, just keep slamming your face against the wall because one of them will break. I'm not kidding. It really gives you that inspiration. Like, okay, one of these has to break. When she would wake up at three in the morning and make me cuddle her night after night after night. Now when I do that, I'm like, oh, it's just part of the journey. Dead serious. So having her go first was absolutely everything. It was a huge unfair advantage to be able to watch it, see the outcome, so that at least when you can't see the outcome yourself, you can borrow somebody else's evidence that there will be a positive outcome for anyone going through it.

Like, it can be really brutal, but it's, it's, it's the biggest upgrade of your life. Like, so watching him has been challenging because you don't want your partner to be going through that pain too. But also, there's a little part of me that's like, Not only because I'm like, oh, he gets it now. Because he would just try to fix it right away. And I'm like, this is an unfixable. There's. There's not a fix in sight. Like, come sit with me and see what I'm talking about. Legal. Like, he's in the same legal issue, you know, challenges that I was in. But why I can cackle like that is because I'm just like, he doesn't know the version of him that he is about to meet. And that excites me.

Yes. Yes. I love that. I love that so much. Okay, well, then let's get into high performing relationships. And I want to save some time for these guys to ask you questions because I know we're going to come back up with Kayla later this afternoon with some more even pointed questions with. Specifically with your business. Businesses as well. But because the two of you are here right now, I wanted to speak around the high performing relationship piece and I wanted to start here yesterday. Many of them. How many of you guys let these guys know? How many of you just came into my ethos in September, signed up for the Legion Academy, and, like, didn't know me before that? Raise your hand. Okay. They came in not knowing that they were maybe going to learn just business strategy. And yesterday we went right into the depths of the dark of the inner work and the shadow work. And Preston Smiles was here and Sam was here and everybody's crying. And some of them, it's their first big breakthrough, that there's a lot of work that actually needs to go on in here before they can actually hold what they're calling in. Right. And I guess where I'm going with this is many of us, when we're on our own personal inner journey, sometimes in our household, one is going first before the other. Right. We're not necessarily both on this journey at the same time, especially the ones probably who Raised their hands have just been cracked open for the first time, and they're about to go home to a spouse who maybe has no idea what has happened at this event. And they're going to go down in this rabbit hole journey of this personal development, inner work. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like maybe Lori went into that journey first. So I thought maybe we could talk about how do you go home to a spouse who's not quite there yet and maybe authentically share your own journey here. Do you mind?

Well, I mean, don't do what I did.

You know, you.

You go to these things and you are different. You're different. You're a different person on the other side. Like, you. You've learned things, you've experienced things, you've met people. You can't unsee. What is reality for other people in this room, right? You're just like, no, this is a real thing for so many people. We just haven't allowed ourselves to be in the rooms where we get to see it. And so now you see it, and once you're in a room of possibility, it's possible for you, and that's on. Like, you cannot come back from that. So what was happening to me is I was going in these rooms, and sometimes in the beginning, like, I. I went all in. Like, it was like a week long, like, transformation, where It'd be like seven days. And I come home from 7 in the morning till 11 at night were some of the first things that I would do. Like, Jack Canfield did, like, these deep trainings. And so I come home and like, I don't even know how to relate to him, how different I am. Like, I'm. I'm gonna talk different, I'm gonna think different, I'm gonna perceive things differently. And all we want is for our partner to feel the same thing and do the same thing, right? So we come home and we don't. We're not professional speakers or transformational coaches yet. So we do the absolute worst thing we can possibly do, and we just kind of like, tell them everything they're doing wrong. So it was like, don't do that. You shouldn't do that, and here's why. And he's just like, he didn't get to go through that experience. Experience of how these rooms are highly facilitated. You guys, like, they know that you have to be, you know, you have to be told stories and you have to be asked for your buy in first. And you have to just like, it's all of these Things that you're opting in for that you don't realize where at home. You're just throwing it on them and you're pissing them off, and they're irritated and it's just bad and ugly, and it was not good. So what would happen is he would shut down and throw a wall up, and that would bug me even more. And I would just be like, you know, short answers to him, or maybe this isn't working or whatever, things like that. So in the beginning, it was not great, but I learned really quickly, like, the more of those things you go to, the more they talk about it from stage. Thank God. It's like, you know, go home and just be different. Like, love them the same, but you be different in your life and let them notice that you're different. Invite them along. Like, if you're coming, like, hey, I'd love for you to do this because it's changed my life. Just talk about your transformation. Do not talk about why they need to be different or why you think they're struggling in their life. Don't try to diagnose them. Like, those are the things that they'll throw the wall up. Right? So with Chris, I learned really quickly that that would just shut him down. It would irritate him, and pretty soon he would be like, like, I'm really not going to these wacky cracky things that you're going to like. Like, you can't. You go to the jungle and howl up by yourself. Like, you cannot do these. So anyway, I would just. I would just show up different, and I would love to hear how that kind of changed for you, because I just kind of let it go. I was like, you know what? I'm gonna really focus on me, and I'm gonna make the changes in my life, and I'm not gonna worry. Of course I wanted him with me. Like, he's my everything. But at the same time, I knew that there was something for me that I had to follow and not worry about him. So it was when I stopped worrying. Ladies, ladies, we love to worry. It's our favorite thing. We think it changes things, but it doesn't. It makes it worse. And when I did that, everything changed.

This is such a good question, because it's not just applicable to couples. It's applicable to your friends.

Yes.

Like, you guys are leaving here a different person, and now you're afraid. What if my friends. Friends don't want to do this? Or what if my friends think I've changed? This really is a Question about anybody that you care about, period, full stop. What happens when you've changed and they haven't? How do you bring them along? And I think the answer is this. The only thing you can control is leading by example, Always inviting them along and giving them enough time for them to decide do they want to have a life like yours or not. Because if you lead by example and you do the right things, you're going to start getting great results and they're going to notice these new results. Wow, you look happier, you look healthier, you're making more money, you're doing these things. And when they see the evidence working on you, then they're going to say, hey, maybe I should try sucking those unicorn farts or that breath work or whatever type of woo woo thing it is that you went and did. Right?

I've never heard that one. That's a good one.

Because they see the end result, that it worked. And when Lori started coming home from.

These things, she started it over there.

I was just straight bro. Like, all I cared about was this, how was business going and what time was the Packer game on on Sunday? That's all I cared about. That was it. And so for Lori to come home this new person with all these spiritual woo woo things, all this stuff, I couldn't be more opposite. But it was seeing her get new results, it was seeing you be happier, it was seeing things happen easier for you that finally made me say, hey, maybe she's doing it right and I'm doing it wrong. And it really had to be on my timing. But she always invited me along or tricked me like Costa Rica, that one.

Time I did trick him.

Yes.

Should I tell that story really quick? I don't recommend this. And I do because I left a changed person. So, like, this is not advice, this is just a real story. And do with it what you may, but she somewhere in this journey when she was all amped up on this stuff.

Unicorn farts.

Unicorn farts in Costa Rica.

They're hard to find, by the way. That was tough for me.

She told me, she's like, hey, because we did a lot of vacations together, she's like, I want to go to this surf and yoga retreat on this beach that has white sand and it looks amazing. Would you come with me? I'm like surfing and yoga. Sure. I'm in no problem. And I got there and you land in Liberia, which is like a tiny little junkie airport. And I was a little bit bougie back then, so now I can Stay anywhere. But now, back then it was a little different. And then you take like a three hour car ride in roads that aren't real roads, to be honest. And we get to this place and they're just huts and it was packer season and the huts did not have Internet and they sure as hell were not showing the packer game. And we got there and, you know, they have to like, I don't know, anoint you somehow when you are checking in and all this stuff. And so I get, I check in and I'm tired from the day of travel and I'm sitting in the hut and I'm like, babe, I'm going home tomorrow. You lied to. Oh, and I left out the punchline. This was not a surf and yoga retreat. This was a breath work and meditation retreat that had one surfing outing. That was it in the 10 days. So like, couldn't be more opposite from what I was into. So when I see the itinerary, I get there, I'm like, babe, this is not what you told me it was. I'm out of here tomorrow. Don't let this be the first big rift in our marriage, but this is just not my thing. And now it's like 6 o' clock at night, it's getting dark out a little bit and there are no flights back home to LA at this point. So she says, that's fine, I understand, I did trick you. In the meantime, we're going to see these sea turtles hatch. And it's supposed to be majestic and it's supposed to be like one of the seven wonders of the world. The whole group's going, do you want to go? And I said, am I going to sit in the dark hut? Might as well go see the sea turtles hatch. So we go to see what I think is going to be sea turtle porn and we have to ride in the back of a cattle truck that has cattle shit in it. No joke, no joke. Through rivers and all this. But here's where it starts to change for me. It's kind of fun getting back to my Wisconsin roots, being in a cattle truck with shit. With shit. And it's really fun riding through the rivers because it was wet season and all the bridges were out and it was really epic when we got to the beach and these turtles would come up and lay their eggs and then slowly work their way back. And there were not thousands, there were not hundreds of thousands. There were millions of these things as far as your eye could see to the right, and as far as your eyes could see to the left, no joke. There were these millions of turtles doing this, and it was one of the coolest things I had ever experienced in my life. And then the people that were in a group, they were pretty cool. So we get back and it's like nine or ten o', clock, and she said, are you still going home tomorrow? I said, I'll tell you what, I'm not going home tomorrow. And whatever this thing is, I promise I will play all out because I know it'll just take one person, me, to ruin the small group. And I did, in that eight or nine or 10 days, whatever it was, absolutely change my life in every way possible. So trick them into it. I don't know if that's good advice, but if Laurie wasn't exposed to this and already in it, I know I wouldn't have ended up there one way or another. And that's really the spirit of the answer. Just keep going. Just keep going. You do you. And it's up to them if they're going to come along or not.

So good. So good. Well, we've got about 10 minutes left. Are you guys okay if I open up to the audience?

Anything?

Yes, you guys. Okay. So my mic runners.

I love that your kids are the mic runners. This is the coolest thing ever. And while you guys are coming up, can I. Can we give Melissa a round of applause?

Yeah.

Like, guys, I'm so proud of you. Putting these things on is so, so much work. It's so much work for you, so much work for the team. This is months and months and months into planning to make these things happen, and you do this literally for them. So you're. You're incredible.

Thank you. Thank you. All right, Wesley, you want to bring Mar on the microphone?

Okay. I just have to say I did the same thing to my husband. I tricked him to go to a tantric retreat in San Miguel, and he came back a coach, which is amazing.

Oh, my God, that's awesome.

As a member of Ultra and as a leadership coach for women, I've seen you go through this trajectory the last couple years. I've also seen Natalie Ellis go through a similar trajectory and leave her business partner. And I've seen the two of you partner up. Can you talk a little bit about the behind the scenes on that? How do you structure that in a way that is mutual for the both of you?

Well, I think we've. Her and I had both been in multiple. Maybe not public partnerships, but different partnerships, friendships, things that you want to work with people on throughout your career, and all of the things that fail you learn the most from you just get better and better. So as we were partnering, we had quite a few phone calls and then questions that we would use that I had conversations on and she had conversations on around, meaning I went to some mentors in my life and said, hey, what are the questions that I need to make sure we ask each other and topics we need to cover and contracts we need to have in place? I talked to quite a few people and got all of the stuff that made me feel really secure on that, and she did the same thing. So then we talked about where was the breakdown in our. In all of our last partnerships and what. What happened, like, and. And where was it our fault and where can we make sure that we put something in place so we don't have that again? So it was one of the best conversations we've ever had. And one of the main questions in there was, where are you afraid of disappointing the other person? And that question freed us both up so much. And, you know, some of those answers within that, for me, it was like, I'm afraid that I'm not going to be able to, like, you know, I told her, I'm like, I'm not a strategic. I'm not very strategic. Like, I need someone to really help me with strategy. Here's where I excel. Here's where I will fail you. Like, I do not do well in this area or this area. And so if you expect me to, that's going to be a breakdown for us, you know, and even with the two of us, we were like, hey, this is amazing, but we need these people, or you and I are not going to get the job done. And, like, we're not going to be, like, we're not going to push this forward in the way that we want. So having super honest conversations. And I know that he had these with his business partner, too. Of the places that you're secretly afraid of, of disappointing them or failing them, that conversation opened up so much for us. But also, you know, the one where have you broken down before? Where's this failed you? Where can you honestly take accountability for where the breakdown was in that? So those honest conversations were huge because it had us both go into it without being afraid. And I think that the main thing is now when we go into partnerships too, if you know that about the other person, like, if you know different. Different ways that they're not, you know, going to feel comfortable, you can also support them. You can support it in Your business and then having that hard conversation from the top. We have what could be, could sound like a hard conversation to some people all the time now because it's just like, hey, here's where I'm at. Like, I'm willing to get really vulnerable with her right away. Like, hey, here's how I'm feeling. I told you, I have this, you know, abandonment issue. So when, when these meetings keep getting canceled because you're busy, this is a made up scenario when they keep getting canceled because you're busy. You know, maybe it makes me feel this way. Could we make sure we don't miss these? Because they're really important for me. So just clear communication across the board when you start out with like the hard stuff. Because that was not. Those were not easy conversations to have. So we like braced ourselves for it, you know.

So. Good.

Great question. Yeah, great question.

Another question. Yes, Erica. Oh, no, that's not Erica, who I said earlier, it's.

It's hard with the lights.

I know.

I'm like blind.

More on the line of that. I'm not exactly sure how to articulate it, but I'm in a situation with a partnership and I sometimes in my head swirl around between like a financial partnership and maybe more of a mutually beneficial partnership in terms of maybe more marketing, you know, so how do you kind of delineate between where you want to come up with a contract and say, here's the financial side for both of us, or here we're just going to kind of rise up together? Like was brought up yesterday. Where do you know when to make the difference and how do you go about that? Because a lot of times if you're. There isn't a clear dollar that you can set on each item. I'm not sure if I'm being articulate.

But yes, this is. Chris will have something to say on this too, but this one's kind of interesting because if one person can bring in the money and the other person is. How am I going to say this? This is a tough one.

Let's say one person's a worker bee and the other one could bring in the money.

Yeah, that's. It's tough because if there's one person who can always bring in the money and the other one's a worker bee but couldn't bring in the money without you, the other one is technically hireable. Does that make sense? So this is where I kind of went wrong in the beginning of when I was looking for partnerships. I'd be finding people where I'M like, oh. But then I'd have them, and it would be great, and I could bring them on as a partner because I think there was a part of me that didn't trust myself to do the business on my own when I was very first looking in, like, even light pink days, because I was very open to partnerships. And what I realized fairly quickly was like, oh, my gosh, I'm trying to make someone a partner who actually would just be a great hire. And as they grow, I could hire someone else or, you know, because you don't know who you are in the beginning of these companies or partnerships at all. Like, you're about to change so much, and you're about to. Like, you haven't even figured out your role 100%. So if it's hireable, don't take on a partner for it, because once you're a partner, you're a partner. And if you realize that person isn't able to, like, when you really need them, you're exhausted. You can't bring in the money. At that point, if they can't do it, you don't have someone else to rely on. So I think that, you know, a partner almost needs to be someone who it would be really hard to hire out their skill set or real expensive to the company. Does that make sense?

So good.

Did that answer what you were asking?

Yeah. Awesome. All right. Yes. I think that's Stephanie, if I'm seeing correctly over there.

I can't tell.

Hi, Chris. Nice to see you again. We saw each other at the Mastermind retreat with Melissa in Arizona, so last year. And then Laurie. It's nice to see you for the first time. So my question is about family. You touched a little bit on friendships and how when you're a business owner, you become this new version of yourself. And I'm okay with growing out of some friendships, but how do you handle the family aspect of it? Because for my husband and I, we have our own level of success, but I think our families are seeing us become this other version of ourselves, and I feel like sometimes there's some resistance and almost like they're turning their backs on us a little bit. And it's kind of hard to deal with that, because friendships is one thing, but family is another. So what are your thoughts on that?

Well, he's looking at me. We've absolutely had this. And there'll be multiple iterations of this. Multiple. And we're so close to our family, so I'll put that bow at the end. But also, I Have some family I'm not close to anymore. So there will be people you will remain close to. And I also have faith that some of the others could still come around. And if not, I'm at a place of peace with that. So I think the first thing I would say is, like, release all expectations around what you want, but work on what you want. You know what I mean? Because it may not turn out how you want, but we can always work on, like, you guys can always work on yourselves and being the best version of you to them. The thing is, is when we change, our families are just uncomfortable because you're changing the dynamic that they're used to. It might change what you put up with, too, which might mean that they have to change. They don't get to be, like, low vibe around you or treat you poorly or, you know, whatever. Whatever that dynamic looked like. Because as. As you change your, you know, you want, you. You won't put up with what you've put up with before. I'm not sure if that plays into it at all, but that was a part of how we were. So we had so many conversations around this. We had a couple moments where some people in our family, our parents were like, they told us that we. Our values were awful. Like, they were like, you're putting money first. You're. You're not valuing the family like you. You know, you're so out of. What was the word they used? I can't remember. Like, we're not prioritizing the right things. And all we heard was, you've lost yourself. We've lost ourselves. We're being selfish because we had moved away. Any. Any Midwesterners in here, okay, we did the cardinal sin and we moved away from the Midwest, away from our family. And that was just like, how could you do that? So they see us in Los Angeles living this. What they think is a shiny, shiny life. And they felt very left behind, and like, we were not prioritizing them. So what that looked like for us is realizing, okay, let's have a conversation. Even though that really irritated us, it made us, like, want to blow up and be mad at them and, you know, yell at them, like, we need to make money if we want to help you, like, all these things. And we have a vision for why we want to do it, because we knew why we wanted to do it. We wanted to show them except experiences. We wanted to take them on trips. We wanted to do all these things. So when they told us that, we were so offended. So instead of Telling them, I'm so offended. Which is what we wanted to do. We had to be like, okay, we have to be the people. We're the ones who are growing. We're the ones who are doing the personal development. They're not. We're the ones who are getting the tools. We have to be the people to go back to them and say, okay, you know, what do you need? What would make you feel better? Okay, it looks like, you know, Chris is so good with this. All right, let's, we'll prioritize a trip where, you know, do we need to see you two or three times a year? Do you need to come out a couple times? What does this look like to make you feel like you're a priority to us? And you know, that conversation didn't really go super awesome the first time, but we did it multiple times. Like we've had full on blow ups where it's like, we're like, we're not talking to you again. And then we go back to them like, hey, this is not how we want to be. What could we make this look like? So don't give up and keep trying to be the person who's like, okay, what would be important to you? What do you need and why? Because you're important to us.

Yeah, thank you. And it's also like, like feeling the love in return. Because we're very close knit to our families, we also decided to move away. So for them it's a sign of betrayal. But like for them it's like, well, you decided to live far away, so we're not going to come see you. You know, it's been 15 years in the U.S. they've come maybe once and some of his brothers have not even been here. So it's like, yeah, we'll come. There's five of us now, so we'll come. But it's like that expectation of you have to do the work all the time. It's kind of like they're punishing us. So it's, it's, it's hard.

Yeah, that's a hard one. That's where the, the work on yourself with making peace with that is sometimes the only thing that you can do and know that you're, you're a pattern breaker for your children or whatever situation that you were walking out of, you know?

So good.

Awesome. This is so good. So we're gonna take one more and then know that these guys are gonna come back up this afternoon just so we can stay on time because I'm cognizant of the clock up here.

Yes.

Hi.

I'm a relationship coach that specializes in entrepreneur marriages. And sometimes people say, what's an entrepreneur marriage? And it's like, well, if, you know, you know, you guys have an entrepreneur marriage.

And.

I have heard couples refer to the business as the mistress, feeling that, you know, it gets more time than they do. One of the things I have so appreciated about the two of you as I've followed you on social media, is that you clearly have prioritized your marriage and you've worked at it somehow. And you. You, at least by appearance, seem to have a very healthy relationship and supporting each other. So I would love to hear what are a few things that you do to. To prioritize your marriage to strengthen that partnership? You know, kind of this theme of partnership. What do you do to strengthen that partnership as you are both chasing big dreams?

What a great question. First thing is, you decide what's most important to you. Like, it's easy for the two of us to always put each other first because we know that if we were broke in the middle of nowhere, we'd still be happy together.

We've been broke.

We've been broke in the middle of nowhere, still happy together. So that is literally what we protect and prioritize, first and foremost over everything else. But then what happens? Busyness, life, Everything else really starts to try and chip away at this. This stake that you're putting in the ground. So you have to build these things in to protect that. Like our protected time in the morning where nobody can get ahold of us unless they're really close friends or family, because that's the time that we've protected to put ourselves first, to take the dogs for a walk, to do our power 9. Lori can explain what that is to, you know, fill up our cups first so we can be the cup that's full, that's pouring out for everybody else after that, after we let people get access to us. What else would you throw in there?

I would say, you know, this goes for. This goes for parenting as well. Whenever I ask people, I'm like, what makes you. I see you guys have such an amazing relationship with your children. How did that happen? It's the same exact fundamentals. And they always say, and it's exactly what we do. They say, you know, we set aside allotted time every day where we're, like, connecting and checking in with each other. For some people, it's dinner. Where they do. You know, they do, like, what's the highlight of the day? What was the. The struggle of the day? What is it? The rose and the thorns. Yeah. And that's like the most successful families, whenever I ask, they have this set aside. Time for them to connect and check in with what's going on with each other's lives. That's what we have. We've had that with our walks in the morning and our walks in the evening. So even if we just did a walk in the morning, I know we would cover what we needed to cover. And we have set things that we do within there. So just like I said, the families who are like, it's not just set time together in a room in front of the TV like I did in the 80s with my family TGIF every single Friday, you'd be like, oh, we're so connected. But you have to set. You have to set an actual ritual where you ask each other questions within there and there. It has to be questions that, like, get a little bit more to the root. So for Chris and I, we do something called the Power nine. And it's not even a set of questions, but what it does is it gets out. We say three things that we're grateful for, we say three things we're excited about, and we say three things that we're manifesting. We do this every single day. So I always know what he's working on, what he's excited about. And some of you are like, well, you don't know what the problems are. Trust me, when you say what you're excited about or what you're grateful for, you're like, I'm so grateful for my health because I've been struggling lately. Or it always comes out. Like, the whole thing always comes out. So that's been a way for us that I not only connect with him, but I know how to support him. Like, if he's excited about something or he's working on something or something he's manifesting. I'm like, oh, you know, he's really had, like, fitness. Like, he wants to be more fit. Great. Okay, do you want me to cook? Like, should I be like, should we do something this week where I'm supporting you around food? Or what does that look like? So those questions naturally happen, but create a set of questions or something that you do with your partner or your family every single day where you know exactly where they're at.

I think the only thing I would add to that being conscious of time is we also have a zero tolerance policy around hanging out with anybody that isn't a positive influence on a relationship. Right. We won't hang around people that complain about their spouses or that do shitty things or even that have negative attitude. Like, if they aren't reinforcing the kind of relationship we want to have, they're out, no matter who they are.

And that's not to say, you know, I think for every relationship, you know, we've struggled. It's not to say. And we've had a lot of friendships who struggled in their marriage, too. It's like. It's not that we won't hang out with those people because we've been those people for them. It's the people who don't want a solution. It's the ones who complain about each other who don't want the solution. We've gone to dinners. We're, like, kicking each other under the table. We get in the car and go, never again. Never again. Like, never, never. Like, block, delete.

That's.

We're out.

My gosh.

So good, guys. Thank you so much for coming up here.

Thank you for having us.

So fun.

Thank you, everyone.