Want To Stop Being A People Pleaser? Natalie Lue, Author Of “The Joy Of Saying No,” Is Teaching Us How

I think often when we talk about not just people pleasing, but also saying no, we imagine that it's only about things that are horrible, you know, that we don't want to do. Maybe somebody is imposing upon us. We also think it's often about telling others what to do. But sometimes actually we need to say no to ourselves. And sometimes, even though technically we could do it, even though technically we might want to do it, it might not be the best thing for us.

Natalie, I'm so excited to have you on the show. Thank you so much for coming on.

Thank you for having me, Lori.

You guys, Natalie is like the ultimate trooper. What time is it there? Where are you?

I am in southeast London and it is 10:30, 6p. So you.

I don't want to hear anything from.

Anyone about how building a business is hard. I'm just kidding. No, she. These are the things you have to do sometimes. Record podcasts at 10:30, align schedules like this. Oh, my gosh, I'm so grateful. Being able to sit here and feel so good in saying no has been such a freaking journey that I'm so excited to talk to you about because I think a lot of people listening right now, especially if they're in the beginning or maybe they're starting something new, the amount of things in the beginning that you have to say no to, it's like the no's are a lot more towards the beginning of the journey because it's like you've been saying yes to so many things. So if someone's waking up right now in a life where they're like, oh, my God, I just realized I created this whole life that I don't love by saying yes. What are some of the places that we start with to start, you know, creating a little room for ourselves? Because like you, I really do believe it's kind of a life or death. And death meaning as serious as death or death. Just meaning you'll never meet yourself. You'll never know what it actually means.

Wow, that is powerful. Yeah. You know, the first step I say, in breaking the cycle of people pleasing is getting to know your pleaser. And that is because your people pleasing manifests in very specific ways in your life. So if you try to look around at what everybody else is doing, people pleasing wise, or you just kind of assume that whatever is said about people pleasing, oh, well, I must do all of that. You're going to miss the wood for the trees. You need to know how are you spending your yeses, nos and maybes? How are you investing Your bandwidth on a day to day, week to week basis. And when you look at that, you are going to see some patterns, you are going to see some, some areas of tension, friction, you know, frustration that keep coming up for you. But also you're going to come across the sources of anxiety. And so for instance, the thing that I suggest is that you spend a week observing your life without judgment as much as possible. And so that is the observing how you'll spend in that yes, no and maybe. And it could be on a post it note, it could be on an index card, it could be in your journal, but tracking what are you saying? Yes, no and maybe to and noticing where what I call the people pleaser feelings show up. Which is, which are resentment, overwhelm, anxiety, feeling overloaded, guilt, frustration, helplessness, powerlessness, or even feeling low. These are signs that you have said yes to something which for all intents and purposes might be a good thing, but you said yes for the wrong reasons. Or you may have said yes to something that you actually want to do, but you're going about it in a very people pleaser way. So you're not doing it with consideration of you. And if you start paying attention to where these feelings are showing up, you will start to see where you need to start saying no.

Okay, that last part, let's talk about that. And by the way, I feel like you just described my whole personality from 20 to 30. Resentful, anxious, powerless. Oh my goodness, like I know and I was doing some of the things that I even wanted to do some of them, but I was doing them in a very people pleasing way. So let's talk about what that, what that could show up as even in the yeses that we want to be doing. How do we kind of become conscious of like okay, I'm saying yes, but man, I'm still feeling so frickin burnt out and resentful.

Okay, so I'm a really good example of this. I am what I talk about in the book as an effort. So there are five types of people. Pleasing, gooding, avoiding efforting, saving and suffering. And the names in and of themselves imply the ways in which you go about trying to please others. But it also gives you a sense of what drives you so, you know, needing to be seen as good, needing to be seen as making an effort, you know, avoiding anything of discomfort, you know, avoiding conflicts, being of service and giving and helping others. Oh yes, suffering. So like the more you suffer, the better it makes you as a person. I am an effort. So that's not to say that I haven't dabbled in the other styles of people pleasing, but I am very much about efforts. And that means that as a result of that, I can take something that I want to do and I can suck the flipping joy because my perfectionist mitts can get all over it. So, for instance, you know, I'll start out with something that I want to do. I feel energized by it. But then now as I start to work on it, I start adding in everything but the kitchen sink. And you start to be like, I overcomplicate it maybe. Or I start to think, okay, but what if they don't like this? Or what if they don't like that? And I go way above, sort of above and beyond. But also it'd be easy to see these as criticisms of myself or if you identify with these criticisms of yourself. But actually these are about noticing the patterns in your life. I am unrealistic with my time and this is something that I have to be vigilant about because I think that I can achieve more in an amount of time than is maybe possible. And that would require me to basically burn myself out. I might squeeze too many things into my calendar. So what that has meant for me is that I have to be vigilant when I notice that I either have the potential to like really kind of go for it and try to give, you know, like 150 or where I am already doing that, where I'm, I'm kind of putting an effort and I'm maybe chasing after something because I am very likely to go off piste. And as a result, then I've had to put some guardrails in place to keep me on a straight and narrow. Otherwise I will burn out. But also I'll end up hating things that I actually wanted to do in the first place. And I think often when we talk about not just people pleasing but also saying no, we imagine that it's only about things that are horrible, you know, that we don't want to do. Maybe somebody is imposing upon us. We also think it's often about telling others what to do. But sometimes actually we need to say no to ourselves. And sometimes, even though technically we could do it, and even though technically we might want to do it, it might not be the best thing for us.

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And so that's an example, I think, of how it can show up in your life, like where I love what I do, but I know how to suck the joy out of it if I don't take good care and I allow sometimes my ego to get in the way. I think this happens to a lot of us where we're chasing the shiny thing or we want to be liked or we want to, we want our thing to do well and we were seeking credibility and we want to have all the bells and whistles and, I don't know, be on a bestseller list or be liked by a particular big name or whatever it might be. And we get sidetracked by that and we don't realize where we start sort of overextending ourselves.

Where can we find you, follow you? And most importantly, go get this book because every single person in my life needs this book. I need this book. Okay, tell us.

So my website is Natalie Lou.com N A T A L I E L U E. I'm on Instagram as L U E. And the book is available at all booksellers, you know, your, your Amazon and your bookshop.org and Target, Barnes and Noble and Audible and all that. And I'd absolutely love it, you know, if you related to what we talked about here. Please do go and buy. The book will change your life for sure.

So grateful for you. You guys go grab the book, go find her, follow her, all the things. And of course, you know, I always want to see what your biggest takeaway was. So tag us on Instagram, let us.

Know your biggest takeaway, and until next.

Time, earn your happy.

Bye, everyone.