Do THIS To Make a Man CHASE YOU

Men can't resist women who do this. In this training, you're going to discover how to make a man come closer to you, to want to pursue you and chase you for a loving relationship, a long term committed relationship. And also what makes a man pull away, lose interest, become distant and not see himself having a long term future with you. Today I'm excited to present this training to you because we've actually interviewed two of our friends, Cody and Esther Cottle, and he's going to be sharing and she's going to be sharing what, what was it that made him attracted and had him fall in love with her to chase her for a loving relationship where they are now happily married. So let's dive right in.

How did you guys meet?

What was the journey and what made you really be attracted and fall in love with Esther?

Cody magnetize you. Did I? Did I?

It was just a magnet. I just had the right magnet.

In her pocket.

Yeah, it was in her pocket. Negative, positive. It pulled me to her. I had no way out.

We gotta sell that.

We're should have a magnet, a mad.

Magnet you could just put in your pocket and it just draws.

Million dollar idea. We'll take a royalty. It's all cool.

Yeah.

Well, first of all, it's an honor to be here with you guys. Thank you for welcoming us in your home, having us on the podcast. Love what you guys are doing. You know, relationships are the foundation of life and teaching me how to do them well is really important. So Esther and I'll kick us off. Love my life. I think it was 2021, it was Valentine's Day and I was invited to an event of it was basically a singles mixer for Christians and my buddy invited me. I was reluctant to go. I didn't want to go. Guys, most of us don't want to go to things like that. But a good friend of mine that loved me talked me into it and I was like, sure, I'll go at that event. I met Esther, but she was there for a different reason than me. And I think you talk about what attracted me to her. Well, I'm at an event full of 60 single women and I'm England. I'm having a great time. I met amazing women that night. But Esther was there for a different reason. She launched a book called Single shouldn't Suck and she had a table to sell that book. And I will say, as a man, one of the things I'm attracted to, and maybe this is my personality type, I don't know, is a woman who's on mission. When I see a confident woman who's going after what God has called her to and focused. It's very attractive to me as a man versus a woman, just waiting around for a guy to come to her. So she's there, has a book table at the end of the event. I was like, hey, I'd love to buy. You know, I'm like, I'll buy a book for me and my friends. And that was my way to talk to her, you know, like, I gotta buy a couple. You know what I'm saying?

It's a great lead magnet.

The best way to get her, Ben, is like, you buy. Like, if some other men are buying books, you buy multiple books. Our first date, I bought all the girl Scout cookies. I bought them out.

So if you're listening and you're single, write a book. Or get AI to write a book for you and go to your local market or church and just, you know.

Set up a booth.

Set up a.

Set up a table.

Booth.

Set up a booth.

The guy that buys two or more. It's a good shot to put your number in that one.

Business strategy for your dating life.

So she wrote this book, Single shouldn't suck. And, I mean, I'm a single guy. I was interested to read it, and I bought it for my friend, and I. And I told her, I said, hey, like, I have this vision one day of having kids, and I'm an entrepreneur. So I have all kinds of books written by so many people, many of friends and people I've met that have wrote notes in the front page and signed it. It's actually, like, one of my favorite, like, assets to pass on to my kids. I can give my kids millions of dollars, but to hand over a bookshelf full of wisdom and knowledge. Many of the authors that I personally knew or met and tell the story of how I knew them. So I was like, well, worst case scenario, I'm gonna get another one of these for my future kids. And so she signs, writes this amazing note, and then I'm standing there, and the weirdest thing happens. She rips the book out of my hands. Like, imagine I buy the book, she writes a note in it for me, and my buddy gives it to us. We're done. I'm staying there. There's about 12 other dudes around trying to flirt with her, and she just rips my book out of my hands. This girl's weird. And she starts.

It's called a pattern interrupt.

She starts, right? Yeah, she definitely. Pattern interrupt. You guys Are all the strategies the whole playbook on it? Whatever. She probably watched your course or something, and she wrote her number in it. So I get it back. I open s your number. I start cheesing. I'm like, none of you guys got numbers. So that's how we met. And then what's really weird is I didn't follow the rule books. And I texted her that night. I don't know if people say you're supposed to wait. No response. And I'm like, okay, this is weird. And then I messaged her on Instagram, like, hey, I have a podcast. You're an entrepreneur. Do you ever want to come on my podcast and tell your story and what you're doing and talk about your book? And she blasts me. She says, why would you invite me on your podcast? But I gave you my number, and you won't even text me.

Oh, wow.

And I'm like, what do you mean? I did text me.

I was nicer than that. I did call you out, but I was like. It was, like, more flirty.

Yeah. A little more graceful.

I wasn't that aggressive.

It was like, oh. So I send a picture, a screenshot, you know, on my phone of texting her. She's like, that's not my number, dummy. And I mixed up a 4 and a 9. It did look like the way she wrote it.

Yeah, I wrote it.

Some random person got a text that was very nice for me that night. And I accidentally. Accidentally kept that Esther contact. It's so funny. The next year, on Valentine's Day, I texted that number again. They got two numbers or two texts from me.

Did you ever respond?

No.

Okay. They just deleted it.

Yeah. And. Yeah. That's how we met.

Wow. So I'm curious. Okay. Yeah. Well, that's awesome. One question I had. So did you. Just to clarify, did you ask her for a signature in the book at all? Because you were talking about how you like to pass down the books. Yes.

I asked her to be willing to write a note and sign the book.

Oh, go. So you did not.

Not for.

But not the phone number. So she signed it, but then she thought about it and grabbed the book back and put the number in. Okay.

Because I had a lot of guys at the time. I mean, you know, that night, you're just being swarmed.

You know how it is as an attractive woman. You got men lining up everywhere you go.

She's making sales when you're working in the field. But there were a lot of guys at that table, and they were all asking Me for signatures and flirting with me and stuff. And so I wanted to show him that I was only interested in talking to him. That I wanted, like, you know, it was. I wanted to work my table and make my sales. And so I was, you know, flirting back, but I was really interested in him, and so that's why I did.

Why were you interested in me?

Ooh, that's. Let them ask the question, honey.

I'm like that too, Cody. I'm like. I did like.

I'm like a words affirmation guy. I'm like, just tell me, why else.

Do you love me? Why else do you love me? Yeah, I do that sometimes.

We need a. We'll need another podcast episode for that.

That'll be the podcast.

Yeah, I'm going to play it on replay every morning. It's how I'm going to start my day. Just copy?

Yeah. On your phone. It's like the Alar.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So that's how it happened. That's how we met. And then the journey of dating was a whole different story.

Okay. Did you want to ask anything about that?

Well, first off, you know, I love that how God works. Right. Because sometimes God works through other people. And, you know, for you, Cody, you didn't want to go.

Yeah.

You know, so you didn't have like this agenda. You know, sometimes we have this agenda where we like, you know, we are in control, not God, and we're gonna set out sail for our own destiny. Right. And you were like, I don't wanna go, I don't wanna go.

And I almost didn't even the day of, like, I was looking for every excuse in the book to not go.

Yeah.

My buddy's like, I'll drive. I'm like, no.

I'll pay you. I'll do whatever I need to.

That's so funny.

Oh, you wanna know another funny thing? The friend that talked me into going didn't end up going.

That sounded like Brody's story, but for Hawaii.

Yeah. I had a friend who invited me to move to Hawaii and then we went and he didn't end up coming. I went to Hawaii, similar journey. And that's where I met anti.

I was just an event for him. It was a whole move.

Wow, man, you really could.

Yeah, we met in Oahu, so it was. Yeah, it was very similar in that way.

But it's God, you know, I mean, that's what I'm saying.

Divine alignment.

Totally.

But that's a good lesson for everyone, which is. I love this saying from Woody Allen, which is 80% of success is just showing up. Yeah. So that's good for whether you're a man or woman. Just the fact the act of showing up to put yourself and make yourself available to meet somebody, like that's huge. Otherwise you know, most people are just staying at home scrolling social media. And then why am I still single and why is nobody approaching me? Well, you're not available if you don't.

Have exposure, any opportunity for that to happen and God to work through those moments. Like if you just stay home all day, how could you ever expect to meet someone?

Yeah. And so there's a concept I want to get your guys thoughts on because I think it's going to relate to this. But something I've been teaching some of our women recently is this concept versus signaling versus initiating. So signaling I view as like a feminine way of expressing interest to a man. So it's like the flower opening its petals and saying, here I am, I'm available, I'm interested. And then the initiating is like the honeybee coming to the flower, you know, bringing the pollen or texting her, calling her back. And so I feel that's what you were doing in that moment is you were, you were, it was, it was definitely a assertive move to grab the book and write your phone number in it. But in a way you're just, it was just another version of signaling your interest saying here I'm available, if you want to text me, call me, like I'm interested. But you didn't like ask him for his number and then start texting him that night. Which would have been moving more into the masculine of like initiating things and really moving it forward and taking charge. Yeah. So I'm curious what your thoughts are on that. Either of you on any other ways you may have been signaling interest or.

I think her dress was signaling.

Yeah, I had a pretty hot dress on that night. That helps. Helps. But in a really also just very. I think carrying yourself in a way that's alluring but not like leading with your sex appeal and leading with that physical component as like my main bait. Right. Because that again kind of leads into more of that initiating like all about me. Like it's very self serving and it's not in a way of inviting, it's just like you're just wanting attention. So there, there is a line there that I think too, but I totally agree with that. I love that analogy of signaling and I think that it's really leaning into just your personal confidence and self esteem and knowing what you're worth and your identity outside of dating, like, it really, your beliefs about yourself, your beliefs about even that you're worth being pursued, but that, that doesn't mean that you need to live in a cave and you need to just like be quiet all the time and never let a man know that you're interested or that you think they're cute. And, and I think that so many women are plagued with fear and intimidation and they're afraid that signaling is. That desperate energy and signaling is overstepping and it's, oh, I'm. I'm getting in God's way. I mean, he. He got my number and like, like he said, like, I didn't get a text from him. So here I am thinking he's not interested.

Yeah.

And so there was that intimidation of, oh, I put myself out there and I feel like a little bit rejected. But what was really cool was that day I really felt like, wait, no, I'm worth being pursued. I have all these other guys anyways that, you know, I met that night. I really liked him, but let me continue to be merry.

I still like.

You were not plan B?

Is that what you're saying?

No, I said they were.

Oh, yeah, they were plan B. They were.

For the record, no offense to any.

Of those guys watching.

So we love you see how the story ended? Way better.

Yeah.

But I think that that can happen is that you start to. You allow this, that rejection to really hurt your self esteem when really, oh no, that has nothing to do with me. And if I had not called him out that moment, if I hadn't stayed confident, then who knows if we'd even continue talking? I mean, you think that we would eventually would come back up again. But yeah, like, I had to overcome that intimidation and like continue the signaling in your analogy, but really just stay alluring and stay in my lane and be confident. I said yes to the podcast interview and then called him out in that. And then it led to further conversation.

Yeah. The other analogy I like is like back in the olden times when a woman would drop her handkerchief.

Yeah.

And I still had to pursue her.

Yes.

You know, so it's not like, like she did do put her number in the book, but I had to initiate buying the book. I had to reach out, I had to text her. Like, I messaged her on Instagram. So I think there is a balance of. Yeah. And as guys sometimes too, in today's world. It's a, it's a weird culture right now. Especially you go into Christian culture. Like, how do you really know if it's okay to pursue a woman and you're not being creepy and you're not being weird. So I do think women need to signal, kind of be the beautiful flower. And there needs to be curiosity. There needs to be a pursuit of man. I'd love to. To get to know her better.

Yeah.

And how do you do that? Well, if women are closed off and it's really hard.

Yeah.

So I love what you're saying and teaching because that's important and it is up to men. Men need to get slapped upside the head too, because men aren't being men anymore, you know, and men need to pursue.

Yeah. That's why I drop in the hanky. It's like a great. It's like, hey, you're. It's okay to come forward like, I'm interested. Which could be as simple as eye contact or a smile. You said you had, like, open body. You know, you're friendly and you're flirty during that. And the other thing I wanted to ask you about, which I think, well, there's a lot of things here, but it's actually very interesting to unpack that moment when he messaged you on Instagram and you said you were disappointed that he didn't reach out to you, which that goes along with our teachings as well, which is you are, in that moment are actually showing that you're high value. We use this term. It gets floated around sometimes. But the way I look at it as high value is like you feel comfortable sharing your feelings and you felt disappointment, probably, or rejection or just sadness or frustration, whatever you felt that he didn't text you. Confusion.

Yeah, probably confusion.

And then like you said, a lot of women wouldn't say anything. They'll just be like, oh, hi, it's so great. I'm glad you texted me back. Or they just continue. But you're like, wait, I felt sad that you didn't text me back and I want to talk about this. I want to tell you that that's how I felt. There was an impact there because a high value woman believes her feelings. When you go back to belief, which is really powerful. And we can unpack some more of that too, because this whole talk is about confident mindset. Right. The belief is your feelings are worth sharing. Your feelings are worth being heard by him. And that shows you're a confident, high value woman. The fact that you even shared that. Do you want to say anything else about that in that moment? Like, what made you, what gave you that courage and the confidence to really speak up and share your confusion and disappointment when he didn't text you back.

Yeah, it was interesting because in that season, I'd actually been doing a study on breaking intimidation. And so I was challenging myself to lean into moments of intimidation. I'm like, whoa, challenge. Yeah, accept it in front of me here. I was so scared. I remember driving, and you know how on Instagram when you send a message, like, if you don't slide it over to cancel it, that it will automatically send? And back then, there was no unsend button. So I was. I was like. I almost drove off the road because I was recording the message to send him, to call him out, and I didn't like what I said. So I'm like, ah, like, trying to delete the message before sending it.

Like, maybe it's a little too harsh.

I'm so intimidated.

What the heck?

Like, sweating. I got the hot sweats. And, like, it was just so much. But I felt that overwhelming sense of, oh, my gosh, I'm so intimidated by this experience. And I'm learning to lean into it and not run from it. And so I just remember everything that I had been learning about breaking intimidation because it's a spirit of fear. And so I recognized that because I had been learning about that and realized, hey, actually, like, this actually could turn into a great opportunity, even if it's not a relationship. And my focus in that season was going after my calling, like he said. And that's even what led us to. To even meet and him be invited to that. Because I had started a podcast six months prior to that, and the guy who I was doing the podcast with is who invited him to that event that night. So my purpose was my mission. And this experience, this encounter only was gonna refine me, and I was gonna get a podcast interview out of it.

Which we never did till, like, two.

Years later, we did it.

You're like, what happened to that podcast?

Yeah, I think at the core. Core of it all, I was really focused on my own personal growth and saw it as an opportunity of, wow, okay, I can lean into this. And the outcome is. Might not be what I hope it's going to be, but I'm open to that, you know?

But also the story that I like is that, Cody, that you actually reached out again, right? Because so many women say, like, oh, wait, but what if it's the wrong number? Or, what if the hamster ate the number? Or whatever, right? They come up with all those, like, excuses why the man wouldn't pursue and that actually like totally signs the belief that I have, which is if a.

Man wants to pursue you, he'll find a way.

Totally.

It's not hard to find her on.

Social media or whatever.

It's not hard. Like, yeah, if you know their name, you can find them.

Yeah, yeah.

So, yeah.

But I, I love, I want to drive that point home. And I'm curious to hear Esther for you too. It's like when you started to date Cody, like how was he different from the guys that you dated before?

Ooh, that's a great question.

That is a good question.

Well, I think part of it goes back to what even attracted me to him, which was I knew that he was also very ambitious and driven and an entrepreneur and someone who loved the Lord. We had so many different things in common, but I was so curious about him. So there was just a lot of curiosity there. And he really motivated me in a lot of ways to also go after my dreams and my goals. So as we were talking and just getting to know each other. Cause we didn't actually go on a date until a month into talking. Cause we had so much going on. But he was so consistent with reaching out and very clear with his intentions. I mean, right away, like he told me, I think you're cute, I really loved meeting you. But that night we had met a bunch of people. So I knew in the back of my head, oh, he's probably met a couple other girls. Like I know I'm not the only one. So like I had to kind of have that open mind. But also loved how honest and clear he was with his intentions. And he was very consistent. Every single day he'd send me a voice message and he asked me out within the first week of us talking. So I loved that consistency. And I was not used to that whatsoever. I mean, I was used to guys making me wait multiple days, you know, before they reached out or they were too destined, desperate and too excited to take me out. It was a little like, wait, wait, like this is weird. We just met. I'm not ready to marry you. He was like very much in between that. And so I liked that there was like tension there, but also clarity.

It sounds also like it was a very like paced, right? So I felt like when I met Brody, just my nervous system felt like regulated. I felt safe. Safe because I feel like when a man sight comes on too strong, right? We like, we don't feel safe. Cuz we're like, what does this guy want? Like he doesn't even know me. Does he want something that I can give him or not give him or doesn't matter that it's me. Or could it be just anybody?

Guys call me wifey after the. I haven't even met them in person. You just met me on social media. You call me wifey.

Oh, my gosh. Those are the scammers.

A lot of therapist.

Yeah.

Or they're diminishing.

But it's true. Guys. But guys think that that's attractive.

Yeah.

You know, or they. I don't know. I think that's what they think.

So inauthentic. Well, you know, they'll say. Any guys will say a lot of things if they think it's gonna lead to something physical. Often.

Maybe they think because it sounds serious, like, oh, you're thinking of marriage. You're calling me wifey, so you're thinking of marriage. So you think I'm gonna want you. Because it sounds committal. Yeah, but maybe that's the train of thought.

Thought.

But it's very much repulsive.

Yeah. It's so inauthentic. But yeah. So it's so great to hear you say some other. These things that you mentioned. As far as you said that you were going to be. What was the word you said you're facing? Intimidation.

Yeah.

But in a way, it sounded like what you were saying was you were also detached from the outcome, so you're going to do it more for your own personal growth. Whether he liked it or not, whether he was going to respond positively or negatively. You're like, I got to do this for myself. And that's another concept we teach a lot on as far as feminine energy, which is the feminine is detached from the outcome that she's. She will be courageous and she will be vulnerable and she will speak up. But it's also from this place of like, almost doing it for herself rather than doing it for the man, which is very magnetic. As opposed to the masculine, which is a masculine is about getting outcomes and making things happen, which is more attached to the outcome. And, like, I have to make sure he responds positively or else I'm going to be devastated, or else I'm a failure and I'm not attractive and all these other things. So it's a confident mindset, for sure, that you mentioned that I want to just bookmark for the women listening, that detachment from the outcome that you just expressed that you were in that state at that time.

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that what I've just tried to implement in my life, in all areas, is that I have Faith. And I trust God, but everything else is up to him with the outcome. I can't create the outcome otherwise that's leaning into control. That's not trust. You know, And I think that so many women want to control. They want to put on all this effort and work on themselves and get the therapist and take the course and do the class and, you know, and it sounds all nice, but a lot of times it's vain effort and it's striving effort. It's not a surrendered effort. You can still partake of all of that, but do it because you know that you need to grow and you need the healing.

And then the extreme version of that is when women are trying to manage their men, and they're trying to manage his perception of her and trying to walk on eggshells and put themselves into the perfect. Like, I'm going to be the perfect woman for him, and I don't want to offend him.

Diminish their own. Yeah.

Or they'll become like, his therapist. Like, oh, he just needs healing. He's just not committing yet because he needs. You know, he needs to find God, and I need to help him with that. I need to be like his pastor or his therapist or his nanny. His nanny or his coach. His life coach or his relationship coach or his mommy. Yeah. So we talk about the difference between mommy energy and wifey energy, which I think is another great, great distinction talking about wifey.

So really, like, the big piece here is that your. You know, Tony Robbins talks about the six human needs. Right. And that your highest need was actually growth. And that was for me, too, when I met Brody, instead of, like, saying certainty. Right. Like, okay, so if I don't know how Cody is going to respond, well, I'm not gonna say anything. Right. Because most women will say that if I can't predict.

Yeah.

How Cody is gonna respond.

You want to feel safe.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, safety is more important to them. For you, it was growth, you know, because you're actually leaning into God, and you know what I mean? You're trusting God. Right.

Come on.

Or some women might not have even responded to him when he messaged him on Instagram and say, like, oh, that's that guy who never text me back. Like, I'm.

That's that spirit of offense that is hindering so many men and women right now because they're so critical and they're offended and they become bitter.

Yeah.

Yeah.

A lot of people carry it from a past experience of trauma and offense into future opportunity and Relationship.

Oh, he's just like my ex or he's just.

And it probably ruins a lot of, you know, opportunities for great marriages. Very true relationships.

And it's another form of certainty seeking. Like, I'd rather be certain that nothing's happening rather than the unknown of, like, you know, maybe this could work out. I'm just going to, like, cut it off right now.

Can you actually ever truly be certain of anything in relationship?

I mean, no, that's.

So if you're searching for and you find it, let me know.

That's the lesson. But I want to progress it with as far as your guys's journey. So after this stage, as we talked about so far, what happened next? Especially, like, any big moments, maybe some areas where you had conflict but then you resolved it. How did you resolve it? And what also led you, Cody, to deepen your feelings for her moving forward?

I'll start with our first date because I think it is important. I, you know, I did go to that event, and I did take a couple other women out on dates. I had been in a season of my life of focusing on Cody, spending time with God, pursuing my career. I was not. I didn't date women. I started living in celibacy. I didn't sleep with women. Like, I honored God with my life. And I was now in a season where I was hungry to move into that next step and put myself out there again. So just to let you guys know, as a man, that's where I now was. But I was very clear that I was going to have a high standard and I wasn't going to sleep. My wife, before I married her, and I wanted to make sure she was in alignment with me and we could build a great future together. So going into these dates with these women and Esther being one of them, the first thing I really think that I thought was cool, that was like, oh, wow. You know, I'm a very driven guy and I intimidate a lot of people. So when a woman, you know, like Esther challenges me a little, it's also attractive in a healthy, feminine way. And what I thought was cool is I invited her to coffee and she told me, no. But not like, no, I'm not gonna go to coffee with you. Like, no, but I'll go on an adventure with you. And I'm an adventure seeking kind of guy. And I was like, oh, yeah, I like you even more now, you know? And so we planned this epic hike out into three sisters, waterfalls near Julian, and our first date, she came and picked me up Want to make her feel safe. So I rode with her, her car and we went out there and it was really cool. We got to know each other on the drive and we talked and we began to get to know each other. It was a long drive, you know, it was an hour and 15 minute drive. Plenty of time to talk. You're forced to do that in a car together. And then I think the, the hike was amazing and it was beautiful and it was challenging. I like doing hard things with people. Like I get to know someone when something's challenging, like who are you really? And then we get to the waterfalls and there's three beautiful waterfalls.

So have you guys been out there?

No, not yet.

Beautiful hike. And you got to go like around springtime when the rains are coming, because it isn't always waterfalls, it flows down from the mountains. And so we get there and there was some younger people cliff jumping, like a 30 foot jump into a waterfall. And I look at her, I was like, there's no way we hiked all the way up here and we're not jumping in. And she's like, no way, Jose. And I'm like, imagine the story we'd be writing right now. I know she's an author.

What we can tell our kids.

He's just like wooing me, romancing this whole jump. I'm like, oh.

And I was like, we, I'll do it. We'll do it together at the same time. And I didn't think she was going to do it, but I obviously was trying to convince her to. And she's like, okay, I'll do it. And so we jumped in this waterfall together. I know it sounds cheesy, but even in that jump down, I'm like, this is a girl I could see myself pursuing. Like, you were willing to trust me, you were willing to take leap, you're willing to be adventurous. And you don't see that as much today with women. And I haven't seen it much out here in Southern California, to be honest. So that was really attractive to me. And then from there, you know, we went down to Julian, we had apple pie, it was great. And ice cream. And I think that was a moment for me where I'd gone on other dates. And I was like, this is the woman I want to pursue because she's driven, she knows where she's going with her life. She doesn't need me to be happy, she's adventurous and I could see a future with her. And we're so early in dating. I'm not Trying to marry her, but just knowing I'm willing to go on another date with her, you know, I wasn't willing to go on another date with the other girls.

And I think that's like, a good point for the women watching, because, you know, we women are more like, oh, my God, this is my future husband.

This is.

You know what I mean? Like, this is. I could really see. This is. You know, we had, like, one client, and just. This is the dad of my child, you know? And so I love that you really. Keep it real, Cody. Thanks for saying that. Right. That guys are like, okay. Like, what I'm asking myself is, am I going on a second date with her? You know what I'm saying.

About. Just, you know, me. And I think maybe after there. Maybe after three, four, five dates, there is a shift.

Yeah.

You're like, okay, if I'm going to. At least for. I think guys that have good values.

Yeah.

I would never lead a woman on. Yeah, there's a lot of guys that will. But me personally, my own standard. If I'm not intentional about dating, I would not continue to date a girl after three, four, five dates because I would make room for another guy to do that that was really intentional about pursuing her.

And I want to ask you, Esther, what was your mindset during that whole adventure?

Yeah.

Yeah. Let's hear the other side.

Literally an adventure.

You know, I think that I. I was just having so much fun with him. And we were. It was. It was the best first date I have ever been on. We both have always said that.

Nailed it.

Nice.

It was. And I was just, like, really excited to get to know him. And on that date, he shared more of his story and his background with me. And, yeah, I just was excited to continue this to hopefully go on more dates. And it felt. It just felt right. It felt good. But at the same time, I was in that season where I had my. My wits about me, knowing that I'm not going to be 10 steps ahead of him. If he's. If he's not pursuing, then I'm not gonna assume where this is going. So I think that I really stayed in this place of just, like, trusting the process. We always said that. And we lived off of voice texting. I don't know if people do that enough these days. But it was so good, too, because we lived an hour apart, too. And so we only saw each other on the weekends or every other weekend. And he was just always sending me a voice message in the morning and just giving me enough to Feel pursued and to feel like affirmed by him. But also, like you said, there was a graceful cadence of our getting to know stage. And also we were really prayerful about it and allowed people to speak into it. And so there was just like these little moments of wow, that just gave me a lot of confidence. I can trust the next step. Oh, wow. I know he's planning ahead because he mentioned this event and he invited me to it. So we're going somewhere here. I'm not going to be waiting around, is this guy going to call me? I never felt uncertain or like I had to question his intentions at any point in that pursuit. And I think that that's so key and that's the hard part in dating, is that so many women want to fill in the gaps of, oh, maybe he's this, maybe, maybe he's just busy or maybe, you know, it's just like if you're having to question, it is not pursuit.

Yeah, I'd say that's probably most of the women who come to us that they're with a man right now who is giving them sort of mixed signals, wishy washy breadcrumbs. And that's one of the consistent things we've seen with the couples. We've heard their stories and our story is very similar, which is this consistency factor. And also that the man is pretty clear up front about his intentions and that he's interested and that he wants to take things seriously. In a way, men that don't know.

What they want in the world we're in is over sexualizing women to men. So there's also like, I'm just going to go there. You know, there is this overstimulation to guys of women. And I think I've met a lot of young guys and even friends I've known. And my opinion on this, if you're not rooted in the word of God and you don't learn your identity from that, it's very easy to get so off cue with this to where you're just of the world. And I think that guys, they'll meet a pretty girl, they'll go on a date, they're interested, but they struggle to commit because the world's over sexualizing women at them every day. So they might be talking also to this girl a little bit.

And this girl, can I get a hotter girl?

Yeah. And that's the mind, can I get a prettier girl? So I. There is some truth to that, but there's something about a level of consistency on both sides that Creates a stability of attraction, in my opinion. She was also consistent. And we did talk probably almost every day, but not all day. I work a lot. I was building businesses, so I had a routine. It was really easy to be drinking cup of coffee caffeinated and shoot a voice message to the girl I was interested in and talking to. And then when I got off work that night from my business, I was on calls all day at 5 to see her response and reply then. But like I didn't respond to her for eight, nine hours that day. She wasn't waiting around like, oh my God, is he going to text me back? But I also proved, hey, I will always get back to you when I can. And I think she did the same for me. And I think that that really helped.

And it's like, yeah, I mean, men, the more masculine are, the more single focused there are, right. And I think one thing I'd love for you to talk about, because you really talk about that you're like on purpose, right. And so in another excuse quote unquote that we hear from our women, it's like, oh, he needs to just focus on his business for the next three years and then he's gonna make time for me. And you made time for Esther in addiction to, you know, your purpose. So what was your mindset around that? Was that also like, oh, I'm just gonna, you know, work for the next three years my butt off and then I go on my wifey search or. Yeah, I mean, like what?

I think guys try to control everything more even than women.

Yeah.

And we try to. I'm gonna go make a million dollars and I'm gonna get my life here and I'm gonna be this fitness level and you know, all that, this thing. And then I'll find my wife. And it's not true. No, it's all a lie. And I was trying to control things. I'll share this. I think it would help. I had a mentor in my life that I was talking to and I was very driven. And I asked him, I said, how do I know? Like when I meet my wife, how do I know? And he just said, cody, you're going to be running hard and fast at what God has called you to in your life. Go build the business, go do the thing, go live out your calling. But one day you will look to your right and your wife will be running next to you. And when she is, don't be afraid to talk to her. And I just, that's what happened.

I.

It, it's just Crazy. It's like it actually happened. I was running hard past my lane. I looked to my right one day, this is this girl at this table. I buy her book, she writes her number, and I'm like, cool, I'll reach out to her. And next thing you know, I'm married.

To her because she'll be running just as fast.

And she. And she.

She could keep up.

Yeah, you gotta be able to keep up.

So I think, like, I wish women could understand too. It is okay to go for your calling. Here's the thing I think that I've seen career women mess up is when. When the guy does appear running next to her, she says no, because she just focuses on career. And I have seen women do that and then lives with regret later because you never did get married, you never did have a kid.

She made more money than him, or he's not like on her level now. And so now she has a different perception of her herself and what she thinks she deserves. He's a really great guy, but yet, like, you're married to your career at this point.

Yeah. And I think we're all running in our lane really fast, trying to be the best version of ourselves. Hopefully you are. If you're not, start doing that and eventually, you know, you run and you end up in a congruency next to someone at a time and a place. There's alignment, there's attraction, and you're like, hey, you know, and from there it grows. So that's my two cents.

And then with commitment, talking about commitment. So what were the next stages in your relationship? Especially moving towards that proposal, moving towards marriage. What shifted in your heart and what made you really clear? You already mentioned some of it. You were like clearly on the path to that. But was there anything else that led to that certainty within yourself, in your heart? And we talked about, you know, men being over sexualized and how did you personally cut through the noise and say, like, Esther's my. My woman? And you got to that place and what progressed to that?

Couple things. One good friend of mine, Justin Maina, who was the one that did the podcast, invited me to that, called me and he said, hey man, where are you going with all this? And Esther, like my friend asked me, he's like, she really likes you. I know you've gone on a date with a few other girls. Are you serious?

This was before we were boyfriend and girlfriend.

We weren't. So I just watched before.

After the cliff jumping.

That was after.

It was after. Okay, so you were still had some Women you were still sort of casually dating.

He didn't know, like, the full picture. He known I'd gone on dates with those women one time.

Okay.

But he was just more. He cared about her.

He's our best friend. And I called him to vet out Cody. And so I had told him what I thought of Cody and wanted to get some. Some intel.

And right after the call, he calls me.

But he had my back.

So there's a level, like, right between. There's a commitment to go on a date with a girl that has to be made in a man's mind. Then there's a commitment of, am I gonna pursue just her? That commitment was made in that moment where I decided, I think a real man personally pursues one woman at a time. I think it's okay to go on a couple dates. I think it's okay to play the field and find out what you like. But I think if you're going to continue to do that, you should not do that with multiple people. That's just my personal opinion.

Yeah. After, like, a certain stage.

Yeah, there's a certain stage. Two, three dates, she's becoming attracted to me, and I'm becoming attracted to her. And that's leading someone on if I'm also doing that with multiple other options. So there was a commitment that was made around them where I was, okay, I'm gonna pursue just you. And then we. I. I'm old school. I courted her in a way before we were boyfriend and girlfriend. We went on multiple dates. And then I invited her to awaken Church, a musical that's called Hero the Rock. It's not like, corny like you'd think, like, church musical. It's like Broadway and we're there. And that's when I asked. I'm so funny. I just think about this memory. I'm like, hey, will you go steady with me?

People even use that word. I know.

I like the only one.

I was not expecting. Expecting it in that moment. Like, of all we could have been at sunset clips, but it was cute.

So. So there was a commitment. They were once.

Was it during or after the show?

It was during before. Was it before?

It was before. We're eating, like, our popcorn.

Wow. That's even more interesting. Then she was thinking about that the whole show. What does this mean, steady? Does that mean we're exclusive? I don't. I have to look it up on Google.

I wouldn't even know what that means.

Yeah, that was when we got, like, serious and official.

But then engagement out like, leading to that. There, there. You asked about difficult times. We're not all sunshine and rainbows, guys. There was the reality of. In a man's mind, oh, my God, like marriage, it's come up in conversation. There's things, do I want to propose to this girl? And we went through some tough times in that, you know, there was. I was like, all in and on the path and steady and consistent. And then I started second guessing it was as a man. And I think it's not a bad thing to go through that process to make you're sure you want to marry someone. Because I. I was like, I know what this means. Like, I'm in this for a lifetime. And, like, I'm doing the best I can. I'm not perfect to align my life with God's word. And I know a covenant's made before God that I'm not going to break. So if I marry her, no matter what happens, she could be the worst wife ever. Like, I'm sticking by her, you know? No, I love you. You're not.

And turned out great.

Turned out great. Praise God. So we, you know, it's interesting, the battle I had. I had to deal with the spirit of lust. And there was a time where we sat in my car one time we came back from a date and I said, I'm struggling with attraction issues to you. And I, you know, like, it was becoming real. Like, you have. Think about, am I. Do I want to sleep with this woman for the rest of my life? I'm never going to sleep with another woman. Like, those are things we should talk about. And we had a very vulnerable, like, can you imagine being a woman and hearing that from. From the guy you've been dating? Like, And I shared this with her and we talked about it. Best thing that ever happened in our relationship. And I knew as we talked it was going to break us or make us.

Wow.

Because out of that, we became more attracted to each other than we've ever been in our entire life. And it created a solid foundation of certainty of, okay, we both are willing to go into an engagement. I'll stop there.

What's that verse in the Bible of, you know, that which can be shaken and what remains after being shaken? Yeah, like, that's the foundation. Right.

And it was shook.

Yeah, it was very much shook. Yeah.

It's interesting because we also, before we got married, we had. We did what's called a shadow ceremony, which we learned. And back then, this. I don't think this is Christian necessarily, but it was what it was, what we was. What it was. We learned it. We were new age before we became Christian, but I don't necessarily was a new age thing. But basically what we did is we had like an anti wedding before we got married where we shared our deepest fears with each other. It was like, oh, you know, the wedding's all beautiful and promises and the hope of the future, but this is like, well, we want this to be authentic, so we're gonna shake some things and get the foundation. We're gonna actually. Let's just talk about all of it, all of our deepest fears, insecurities before we get married. It was almost like exactly what you did. But this was like, right before we. The day before our wedding.

So it would have been the night before.

It would have been.

Were you thinking about the thing that.

Something would have come out and be like, oh, oops.

Yeah, well, maybe we should have talked about this months before. Yeah, well, yeah, it would have been fun. Yeah, it would have been nicer to probably do it a couple months beforehand. But it's. It's cool that you guys did a similar process, like, beforehand to talk about those fears and to talk about what's coming up. And then. So I'm curious, what then happened? You guys had this conversation. You got very clear on. You were ready to commit, or like, how did you overcome those things?

There's one thing I want to say, and this is a. Esther's heard me say this, so it's nothing she hasn't heard. Yeah. So we have an emotional side of our brain. Right. Of like, am I emotionally going to be attracted to you and connected with you for the rest of my life? Like, do I see that? And we got that worked out. But there's also another side of our brain. It's a logical side, as a man. Like, you logically should think through, Do I want to marry this woman? Do I want to spend the rest of my life with her? And my lens of doing that was very simple. Are you an asset for my life? Are you a liability for my life? And I say that because I think I've seen very successful men, and I know I'm going to be successful. I'm a driven guy. I'm already successful. And I'm only going to become more successful marrying the wrong woman just because she's pretty and I'm emotionally attracted to her. But later we get a divorce and it's ugly. Is going to be a massive liability to my life and what my purpose is. And I. That was the one thing I've never wanted to do. I never had a marriage modeled healthy for me, for my parents. So I'm not going to make a mistake of marrying a woman that's a liability for my life. I'd rather be single the rest of my life than marry a liability. And I don't think a lot of guys run this through, but what I will marry is an asset to my life. If you go invest into a stock, you should do your research and invest into a good asset that you know is going to grow and compound and yield you great, you know, reward. You don't invest into a liability. Or if you're going to invest into an asset class like real estate, you do your research and you know that real estate estate's gonna, over time, be worth more money, and you're gonna get an investment out of it.

Inspect the house.

Inspect the house. So I clearly ran Esther through a rigorous. In my mind, even on paper, of, like, thinking through things and qualities and things I noticed about her and who she was. I just needed to know in my logical side of my brain to the best that I can. You're never fully certain that if I married this woman, she's an asset to my life and. And she 100% was and actually came to a revelation that would be dumb not to marry her. That I finally met a woman that I saw made me a better man, made me want to be, you know, more focused, work harder, show up better for her, and would be an incredible mother. You know, history of nannying and all these things. So it was like, man, you will be such a great wife. I will. I am a better guy married to you. And you're being incredible mom when we have kids. And I can see spending the rest of my life with someone who has those qualities, and I'm attracted to that, to me, is like the woman I want to marry. And then it just comes down to me being a man and making a decision to commit to that.

I can hear a lot of women, though, watching this and almost like their red flags going up in that spirit of offense kind of being like, wait. What do you mean, asset?

Like, yeah, like, I'm here to, like.

You know, wait on you hand and foot and like, oh, so you just want, like, a trad wife and, you know, that whole trend of the trad wife right now, which really just irks me, which is really just wife traditional, like, irons your clothes and cooks for you and is the wife and perfect and, you know, all these things. But that is not what he's saying at all.

Esther's an entrepreneur like me.

Run our companies together, build business, we build life, we build God's kingdom together. He's explaining a partnership, which I think is not a concept that a lot of women are going into dating with. They're just wanting to be loved and cared for and affirmed, which is beautiful. And those are components of a relationship, but that's not the foundation of it. And we looked at each other and we said, okay, yes, do we make each other better? But can we build a life together where his dreams I'm supporting and my dreams he's supporting. And man, he has only opened up so much in my life to, to help me see myself the way God made me and access gifts inside me I never knew were there. And it should be like that. So that really is the asset that you should be looking for.

Yeah.

And you should, as a woman, you should look at a man. Is he going to be an asset? There are natural needs a woman has. She wants to be provided for, she wants to feel safe, she wants to feel love. Like there are some things biologically wired in a woman that she needs to feel from a man in order to, I would imagine from my studies that I've done. And a man also, he has things too. Let me just say for the record, women, it's more than just beauty and looks that fades in marriage. Now I'm married. Like, the sex and the attraction is amazing, but that's such a small percentage of doing life with another human being. Like our finances are entangled, our goals, our visions, our dreams, how we spend our days, what we do, the food we eat, like all of that is combined together to become one. And so if you don't think through, are you an asset to who I feel called to be in this world? And you marry someone that doesn't align with that, it's going to be really difficult to make it work. You're going to, you have to sacrifice in marriage, but you're going to sacrifice on a whole new level.

You shouldn't.

100%. And I think, you know, when women are more on the anxious side, they don't think about that. They just think about rose colored glasses and you know, and they don't think about, wait, a guy could also be a liability. So it's actually, I think part of like a high value woman is being like, is this guy liability to be, you know, am I gonna be drained? Am I gonna be just, yes, you know, the housewife and I have to bring in the money because secretly he doesn't want to work or secretly, he doesn't really have a purpose. And he's gonna hit this midlife crisis when he's 40 that I don't see yet because he's 30, you know, and so.

So.

So I love that, what you described, because I think women should also run themselves through, like, a process as well.

You should vet that dude.

Right?

He should vet you. And when you both vet each other and you're both like, hey, you passed. Hey, you passed.

Yeah. Move forward totally, and pay more attention to the actions. Right. I think that's what I see with both of you. It's like, actions. Because our women are so much talk. You know, we just talked about this yesterday in a group call. Like, just if you were toning down a volume, if you watch a movie and the movie no longer makes sense, like you should, it's probably time to exit.

My buddies in advertising, he calls it the bar test. When you're at a bar and the volume's not on, can you still tell what's going on in the commercial? We're shooting an ad for a Christian club, and he said it has to pass the bar test. You know, so if you can't tell what's going on without the audio, then it don't pass the bar test.

Yeah, totally. 100%.

One thing that helped me a lot, too, when I was dating was this phrase that one of my dating coaches gave me, which was, how a relationship starts is generally how it will continue. So the way I view it, also to see if some way is an asset or liability, is if things were to continue as it is now with nothing changing, would I be okay with that? Because some women, they get into situations where they've had to bend themselves into a pretzel to make him happy, to not offend him, or walking on eggshells, or it's just like a stressful thing, or he's missing a lot of qualities that they want, but they're like, well, he. You know, he could get those qualities later. He's working on it, or he's getting healing, or he's seeing a therapist. But it's like, yeah, but if nothing were to change how it is now, would. Would you be okay with that? And generally, the answer is there's always no. But then it gets two lessons from that. It's like, well, for one, don't bend yourself in a pretzel from the beginning, because it's like, speak up. Be authentic, because you don't want to have to manage that. This Old saying, he who stands on tiptoe is not steady. So it's like you're going to have this relationship where you're standing on tiptoes the whole time, and that's going to. Eventually you're going to fall down. It's going to be painful. And then also don't expect him to change because there's a high chance he won't. And so you can't rely on that.

And the other piece I wanted to say is about that. Men unconsciously test. I mean, women unconsciously test, too, right? And so how Cody tested was like when he started to become. Started second guessing. Right. And that's where so many women start to freak out. Right. And then a man is like, oh, actually, I should not marry this woman.

They really messed up the test stuff.

That's a good thing.

You know what I mean? Because they're like, her response in that conversation, that car, like, that could have went south so fast.

Yeah.

She didn't, though.

Yeah.

Yeah. What was your mindset, Esther, when he was bringing that up?

Well, of course, like, you're. You're hurt by that, but I think I had a lot of empathy. I felt. I just felt a lot of empathy. I think I went through that in my own way at a different stage of our relationship. And God really worked on my heart and spoke to me through that and really helped unravel some things inside of me. So I. I kind of felt a little bit like, oh, he's going through the same thing I went through, but in a different way. But now I'm on the other side and I'm feeling it. Whereas I had never vocalized anything because it was just more of an internal process that I had gone through. But for him, he needed to vocalize it. And so I think that I really needed to learn to detach from being hurt by him and realize that, okay, like, this is something he's dealing with, that he. He deserves to process, and he deserves to journey through that, and he deserves to choose his own outcome. And as hard as it was for me in that season, I would always tell him, like, I love you. It's even emotional thinking back on. But I would always say, like, I love you and I want to be with you, but I want. I want you to know that, like, I'm okay if. I'll be okay if you feel like you need to move on. And that's really hard to say. That's really hard to, like, even, you know, tell someone that you see a future with. But I really Just felt like I knew that he. He cared about me and he cared about even how he handled that. And so he wasn't like, recklessly just being like, I'm just not attracted to you. Like, you're so ugly to me. That wasn't it. He would tell me, like, you're beautiful. I'm just dealing with this, and I don't know the root of it, but I'm going to go get help. Like, he wasn't just, like, stagnant in that either. He was seeking counsel. He was seeking God himself. And it was a process. It was a couple months, honestly, that we had to keep having honest conversations about. But like, he said, it was the best thing because it connected us and it grew us closer and it helped us, like, get clarity for the future.

And it gave me the freedom to make that decision on my own. And I think most humans, not just women, are so scared of losing something they want that they won't create space for the other person to have the time to figure that out on their own. And because she did that, the opposite effect happened. I worked through my problems, but I became more attracted and knew, wow, this woman. I said a thing that hurt her so much, and she gave me the space to figure it out and said, whatever the outcome is, I'll still love you and I'm okay with it. And I don't think people do that in relationships because we're so emotionally charged that we don't remove ourselves from that. And one other thing I want to say to earlier, to women that bend themselves, like you said, like a pretzel. And, like, he'll change. Don't marry. The idea of who someone can become. I just felt that in my head and I just wanted to say it. We should never marry. The idea of someone who you're with now is who you're committing to. Maybe they get better, maybe they get worse. But marrying an idea and a dream fantasy outcome of a human being is setting yourself up for a disaster. And I think a lot of people do this. Like, I've seen guys do this with women. I've seen women do it with guys. And I've also seen it end in ugly divorce.

Yeah, totally. That's what my parents did too. Like, and as a saying, right, like, men marry women hoping they stay the same, and women marry men in general hoping that they will change.

Yeah. Seems to be part of the human condition. But it reminds me. Principle from Don Miguel Ruiz. Four agreements. Don't take anything personally. Right? You try to avoid. You were avoiding Taking it personally when he was going through his stuff and say, look, it's not necessarily about me, it's about his process. And I actually empathize that he's going through this because I've gone through some myself. But it's like it almost went through you, which is another version apart, different way of being detached from the outcome. And you're in your feminine. You're holding space, and you were supportive. You weren't being his therapist and trying to help guide him through it. And. But you were just. It sounds like you were just there and just kind of being there for him, you know, and like, I still love you regardless. And that was just really, you were not trying to intervene in his process. You just let him go through his process and he came out exactly how he needed to come out, and he went through his cocoon and then he was your husband basically on the other side of that, like, real ready to commit husband, it sounds like.

Yeah, I think through the process of, of course, just like, really allowing God to transform you, because there's roots. There's roots of, like you said, lust in that, and there's roots of hurt and wounds from the past and soul ties from past relationships. And that really was the answer. And, you know, it all comes back to that trust in the Lord in our journey and that trust in the Lord with my future spouse. You know, I'm dating this man who I believe we're going to get married, but God, it's ultimately, ultimately up to you and to lead us in your peace and lead us in transformation and, and to trust that maybe that. That this is a turning point for me or for him. And that's really hard. That's really hard to. To even just be honest with yourself and be like, ah, like, I thought that, you know, but I got. I thought you put this man in my life or that this was gonna happen. But even to just be like, hey, Lord, but your will be done. Allow him to move.

And, you know, this is the first woman I ever dated with intention of marriage like this that I never slept with. So you also have to understand that I grew up in the world, raised by a single mom. My dad was in prison my whole life, running the streets. Started having sex at a young age. I had to work through a lot of things and mature and grow as a man. And I was at a different season in my life. So I'm pursuing marriage. Those. Those past things and soul ties and doing that haunted me. So for the first time in my life, I'm Building a real relationship not rooted on lust. When you sleep with someone, there's an exchange of chemistry in the body and a spiritual soul tie too. I truly believe that that also helps you stay attracted to somebody. I don't believe you should have that until you get married personally and have a covenant. Because what it did is we built a spirit sturdy table. We built a foundation to build marriage on that wasn't rooted on a temporary physical, lustful attraction, but on the same token of doing that. I had had lustful relationships before and because I wasn't feeling that in this relationship, there were things I had to process at a man that were hard.

Created doubt in his mind. Only knew how to sexually connect. And so then when you remove that, then it's like what's left. And then you're having to navigate all the emotional healing and the spiritual healing, which there's a lot to that.

Yeah.

It's like when a woman's finally dating a man who's emotionally available and she's so used to all the men she dates of being unavailable. So then it's like feels weird. Like well, there's something missing. I'm not having to be anxious about him or chase him or like manage his perception of me.

Right.

And there must be something wrong. It's like, well that's actually what a healthy relationship feels like.

Yeah. That's why you need good counsel. You need, you know, mentors because you are going to make emotional decisions if you're, if you're not seeking that well.

You guys are just absolutely amazing. Like it's, you know, we've, we've met you guys like three times now and it's been so extraordinary to actually hear the story. And thank you for being so raw and real because that's brought in me too. We're just like authentic, transparent, real. Because otherwise what, you know, what are you building? You know, if there's like masks and. Yeah. Anything else you want to. I think to that, like if you have something wonderful that you guys have.

To share who want to see what you guys have to offer as well. What would be some of your guys gifts and what you would recommend?

Well, he's not exactly in the relationship space. We have a Krishna TR entrepreneur club business that we run together but for those seeking. Yeah.

In Seven Peaks and then.

Yeah. So that's a great idea actually. So we do have a free community for personal development. Faith based personal development. So if you're interested in growing yourself and getting after that mission and that calling like we talked about the beginning of the podcast, head to 7peaksofinfluence.com and that'll get you all connected to our community. We do a once a month call and then for those that are seeking relationship guidance, my focus is really the belief at the core of how you view yourself and your relationship with God and your relationship with others. And so you can go to esthermarie.org to get connected to all my resources, courses, books, Single shouldn't suck. It's available on Amazon and find us on Instagram I guess.

Yeah.

Come connect with us.

We make some cool Cuddle with the Cuddles.

Cuddle with the Cuddles.

Come cuddle with the Cuddles. See our new I am Cody Cottle on Instagram and we make a lot of content really just to encourage people to become who God's created them to be. You know, women want to attract a man. Become very confident your identity and assure in yourself and that will help and develop yourself. You know it's not to me, I say it all the time. There's not more sexy than someone that.

Works on themselves 100%.

Totally amen to that. Yeah. We'll put all the links that they mentioned below in the description. And of course also our quiz if you want to take our Magnetize youe Man quiz. Help you get a loving long term relationship as well and hope this was helpful. Much love. Leave your comments below. I'm sure you had some good thoughts and insights. I would like to hear all the top takeaways from this interview. Post them below and we'll talk to you again very soon. Bye bye.

Take care.