Know Thyself; Know Thy Business Partner | Tracy Call & Toni Dandrea

My head was always in this, like, I don't want to give anything up. And the beauty of it is, once I gave up the seat and the roles and responsibilities that I loved, I actually felt like I gained so much more. And that, to me has just been, that's been my story through this entire journey is that giving something up and giving up roles and responsibilities and giving up partnership and giving up is really not giving up. It's a massive gain.

Hey, everybody, this is Mark C. Winters, co author of Rocket Fuel and expert EOS implementer. Welcome to the Rocket Fuel podcast where visionary and integrator duos from entrepreneurial companies share a behind the scenes look at their relationship. These amazing leaders blend their unique skills to create what we call rocket fuel. Today, I'm excited to chat with my two guests, Tracy Kahl and Tony Dandria from Media Bridge Advertising, a fast growing entrepreneurial agency. Tracy is the founder and CEO and Tony is a partner and cmo. As their agency grew, it became apparent to Tracy and Tony that they needed more consistency. When Tracy noticed that one of their clients who ran on eos had remarkably efficient meetings, she hired their certified EOS implementer. From there, Tracy, they began to build a visionary integrator partnership with the characteristics of a strong marriage. In this episode, they share how operating on eos and hiring a third party to help them work on the foundation of their relationship transformed their company's journey into a love story. We're going to begin the show where Toni talks about the early days at mediabridge when she was Tracy's first employee and they were both wearing many hats. Let's dive in, Tony. So before you know, you're at the company, your employee won right in there. And so talk to us about that. The period of time from when you first joined the company to when you actually became the integrator.

Yeah. So when I first came to Media Bridge, like Tracy said, I was employee number one and we were creating processes and the way of doing things on the fly. And we were scrappy at the time and we were part media buyers, copywriters. We were doing everything, cleaning dishes out of the bathroom sink at our first office and we wore it all. I think Tracy on LinkedIn used to have like that. She was part janitor too, on our LinkedIn.

So we were really doing it all.

Figuring it out as we were going. And then it became a part where I think we were at like 10 employees, where we realized that consistency needed to happen and how we were doing things across the different teams and divisions at the time needed to be more consistent. So that's when Tracy introduced us to EOS. One of our clients, Renters Warehouse, ran on EOS. So I got really familiar with how L10s ran, and I was like, these are really efficient meetings. This is. I am bought into this whole process. And so then Tracy brought in this implementer for EOS and explained how it all works. And I was bought in. I'm like, heck, yes. Sign me up. Give me a good process. And then when he was explaining the whole hierarchy of how EOS runs and the seats and how it all operates, I'm like, I want that integrator seat.

So that's how it all worked.

So Daniel's your implementer, is that right?

Yes.

Okay. Daniel Moshe, great implementer. And so when he first lays out the accountability chart and is teaching that. So, Tony, you kind of had your eyes set on that integrator seat from the first time, right?

Yeah.

When he was reading the definitions of visionary integrator and how this all works, I was like, yes, that's me. Like, that's what I want. And I know that Tracy was sitting in both seats, and I made it known to her, like, this is where I want to go. And she helped before we really had career pathing at Media Bridge. Helped me see how I could get there.

Okay, so in that session, though, where you filled in the seats, Traci, you didn't put Toni in that seat. You stayed in both seats. Is that right?

There were a lot of us at the time. I think we had six. Six people on leadership, probably a total of 13 employees, and we were all sitting in a lot of seats. So I was visionary integrator, and I think at the time still, like, in the one of the marketing or media seats as well. So I actually enjoy being an integrator. I feel like I'm one of those unicorn integrator visionary types that I can do both. I can step in and help Toni through things that are on her role and responsibilities when she needs it. I think we have a really good rhythm of reading each other. Tony's also uniquely also a visionary. So I think we play really well together in our roles. It was difficult to let go of the vine.

What was difficult about it?

Well, I think there were a few things, but mainly I really enjoyed working for in the business just as much as I enjoyed working on the business. I enjoyed having quarterly conversations with the rest of the leadership team. I enjoy that connectivity. I enjoy some of the to dos and being responsible for the P&L and the revenue and the numbers. I really like that stuff. Up until just a few months ago, I was still acting as an account executive. We call them brand managers, but. But I was still very much in the business. And so it's been a process for me to let go. And Toni and I kind of put together a plan over a course of two years. She was in training, and very recently, I completely let go of that vine, and it's been great. It's been awesome.

So let's hear about the plan and the process and what that two years looked like. So Toni's got her eyes set on the seat. You're like, okay, here's kind of what's gonna need to be true in order to make this kind of a transition to really get you in there. We' what was the plan?

Well, the first year was rough, I think, for both of us. I think we were still trying to figure each other out and understand how to work with each other. We have a lot in common in the way we think and lead, but we're also, like, polar opposite in a lot of other ways, which I don't think at the time. We really understood how to leverage each other's superpowers and not tell ourselves stories about what the other person was thinking or feeling or doing. So the first year, I think we were just really trying to, like, feel our way through, and then we decided to take a totally and completely different, unique approach to building this partnership. Because the way Tony and I view the visionary, integrator relationship is kind of like a marriage. We are together running this business, and, you know, we had to really figure out what that looked like together. And also, she became partner to the company at the same time. So we really approached it through a very unique way. For the second year, we hired a coach. I would say part therapist, part business coach, part professional coach. His name is Finian Kelly. He works a lot with the eo. You may know Finian. He teaches intentionality. And he basically worked with each of us separately and then brought us together and created this really beautiful love between us and trust between us and have made us into. We used to call ourselves this dynamic duo, but I really think it's like, more of a marriage. You know, Toni's pregnant. We're dealing with a lot of stressful things at the company right now. And I know as her partner that I need to step up and cover for her and help her through that, and I wouldn't have been able to, like, connect with that a year ago. And I think that's what makes it so special. We literally took a honeymoon together in Mexico to a super romantic house and brought Finian and his partner Sydney in and we did a Love Path together. It's an exercise that Finian typically works with married couples on, where you set your purpose and your vision and your individual values, your joint values, how you're going to navigate through conflict. You document that. There's a lot of connectivity there. And I think that's what makes it unique. We literally have this thing called the Love Path. I printed the COVID page. And Mark, the cool thing is that our joint vision is to use the story of our relationship to inspire others to grow. And that's why this podcast is so cool for us, because we haven't told our story in this format yet. It's our first time telling the story. And I hope that it helps other visionary integrators go beyond just, you know, what they read in the books and, like, really find that next level for themselves, whatever that is.

I love that. That's bigger than that.

Was a long answer.

I'm sorry.

No, that's perfect. So, Tony, I want to get your perspective on this whole thing. So when Tracy starts talking about this, I mean, it sounds like it was pretty collaborative as you're kind of coming up with this plan. Was this, like, outlandish to you? That it would be something really different was kind of like, you know what, this makes a lot of sense to me. And you just leaned right in.

Yeah, Well, I would say for the first year, like Tracy was saying, I think we were. It was like she was half in the integrator role, half, like, not so. It's like my training wheels were on, but it was. We were stepping on each other's toes. It's like, do you got it?

Do I got it?

And there are a lot of, like Tracy said, stories that we were telling. We just weren't being effective or efficient. And it wasn't until Finn came into our life where he really helped me get out of my head and into my heart as a leader. And I thought formal business training, formal professional training. Not that Finn is not formal, he's a very well respected business executive, but it just was very different for me to be coached in that way. And when he started bringing down some layers and peeling back some things that were unspoken between Tracy and I, that we were just assuming about one another. If we didn't have a mutual person that could bring that to light to us, I don't think we would be here where we are today. As a strong visionary integrator. And I think our growth in our business has just shown what it is like to have a strong relationship when we're aligned and when we're not stepping on each other's toes and when we can, like, truly lead out the vision together. And so through that love path, like, I was like, what is this? It's like, this isn't comfortable for me. I had to really break out of my comfort zone and push myself to be uncomfortable and to have really hard conversations with Tracy and Tracy to me and where I want to go professionally, where Tracy wants to go professionally. We really had to go there before Mexico. And then when we committed, when we got to Mexico as a commitment, like, this is a new chapter. This is a fresh start. We're committing to each other. We're going to move on, leave the baggage, and reset the tone of how we're going to go about this partnership. And I thought that was really, really neat experience.

So it sounds like you kind of did the hard, scary work before Mexico, Is that right?

It's like we got married and then we went on our honeymoon, you know, gotcha. That's what it was.

It's like you've been dating for so long, you're at this point, like, am I going to commit? Are we going to marry?

Are we.

What are we going to do? Can we get through the things that we're different about? Can we not work through it and really lay it out there, the good, the bad, and the ugly, and not avoid the conversations that need to happen, especially before you get into a partnership. And that's always scary because you don't know how the other person's gonna receive, what the other one is thinking. And yeah, it was scary.

You know, it's interesting. I work with leadership teams or I work with visionary integrator duos. I see lots of really raw stuff, right? So, I mean, it happens where people get emotional, people get angry, they get hurt, and it just kind of comes out and it comes to the surface, and then they work through it and they deal with it. And same thing with the visionary and integrator, and they're same page meetings. A lot of times it goes there. It gets into that stuff. My sense of the way you're describing this is it's almost like you've created an accelerator, right? Because a lot of times they don't get to that stuff until later. And a little bit comes out, and a little bit comes out, a little bit comes out, and it's over a period of Time over a number of years, maybe they get to the same place. But it almost sounds like you've brought. Brought a lot of it into the short term and just kind of aggressively gone there and gotten that stuff out on the table just to get really clear, hey, is this right? Is it going to work? Are we aligned? Are we not aligned? Whatever? And then probably gotten this thing off to a faster start than you would have been able to otherwise. Does that sound right? Am I reading that right?

Yeah, I would say that would be accurate. I mean, granted, I've been at media Bridge for nine years. I'll be at 10 next year, which is really exciting. So we. I think we also had it in our benefit that we've known each other for a really long time. It's just when Tracy's Media Bridge was Tracy's baby. It's my baby, too, and I'm fully invested. It was just more challenging to navigate that for the next chapter.

Yeah, it's, you know, knowing somebody for a long time or being at the same company for a long time, I feel like that's different than when you get into talking about real stuff. You know what I mean? So I have people that maybe worked together for a long time, but they didn't really know each other. They didn't really know what was going on in there that was going to be important for that next step that they were looking to take or whatever. So that's very cool. So tell me about one of the hard things that you had to kind of work through in that, you know, kind of on the front side before the honeymoon where you had to kind of reconcile. All right, this is how I am, or this is how I see it, or this is what was one of the tougher ones that you had to work through.

I think one of the tougher ones to go through was as a visionary, you've kind of reached the highest point in the company.

Right.

And I think the thing that Tony and I struggled to navigate early on without fin ourselves was what's next for Tony, and what does that look like? Because if you look at the accountability chart, you know, the next thing for Tony is my job. Then what do I do? Right. So I think that was the biggest thing for us was navigating, like, how does Toni continue to grow when she's reached the integrator level and, you know, what is my next phase? How do I continue to participate in the business, you know, when Tony's ready to step into that visionary seat? So I think that was the most difficult Part for us to navigate because neither one of us had the answers. And I think that's where, like, we're telling ourselves a lot of stories, and we're still talking about what that looks like, but it's just nice to have the conversation out there and an open door with, like, a lot of rules around how we approach, you know, let's say, conflict or if we disagree with something, like, we literally have a way that we handle that. So I think there's safety in going real deep with each other and getting into that, like, 5% very vulnerable place, because we know we've got the safety net of how we deal with conflict together. From very surface level conflict to we can't resolve an issue. This is having a negative impact on the company, and we've hit rock bottom. Now what do we do? We have that. There's, like, four steps of how we deal with conflict together.

What are they? What is the model?

So the first level is we commit to a day of self healing and then come back with a strategy on how to improve our relationship. So we step away for a day, do some self care, self reflection, one big giant clarity break, and then come back.

Clear all the cortisol out of your brain.

Right. If that doesn't work, we bring in Finney in to facilitate a connection through coaching, which is kind of cool because we do that anyway together, monthly with him. And so it's like, we're always on maintenance because sometimes we're both going so fast and so hard, and we don't have a chance to connect the way that we want to or have promised each other to connect. And, like, he brings it back in for us, and it's like couples counseling before something bad happens. It's the maintenance plan.

Right.

And then the third is we go away with Finn, like, almost redo the honeymoon, and, like, we spend time away somewhere together and, like, really go deep and do the hard work in person. And then the fourth is that we transition the relationship with intentionality and we celebrate the journey. So, like, if it gets so bad, we've agreed that, you know, we'll work on a peaceful transition and we'll celebrate where we've been now. Like, I don't even think we've had to do one yet. And it's been a year, so that's the beauty of having a plan. Right.

But there sounds like there's confidence in the fact that you have a plan if you need it, right?

Yeah. Yep.

Very cool. I like that a lot. Okay, so, Tony, the question that got Us there was, you know, tell me about what the hardest thing was when you're kind of going through the hard work on the front end before Mexico. So, Tony, what was it for you?

I think it was for me, it was defining more guardrails around roles and responsibilities. And when would be the expectation that I would bring Tracy in on a X decision? Like, where's her limit? So I'm not jumping to conclusions and whether it's hiring. So we agreed that was one of our big ones, that we can't make hiring decisions without each other being involved in the communication and the overarching vision of the company. So no matter where Tracy is, I would want to clue her in that I think that said hire is needed or said person should go on the leadership. So we were just helping each other be more successful when it came to those decisions that we were. I think we were making a lot of assumptions. Well, I'm just doing it for the best of you. I don't want to burden you or this other person's saying a story like, well, I'm kind of hurt that I wasn't involved in the process. I have something to say about it, too. So I think that was just putting it to paper and, like, saying what you need to say. And Finn was really good at helping us say what we needed to say without us knowing we had to say something.

Yeah. It sounds like as your relationship kind of started in these roles and you're kind of moving through the first part of that, I heard a lot of kind of the tension and frustration of not having that role clarity yet. Right. And so that was. I'm sure it was a really important one to work through. It's interesting when, you know, we've got a tool called the rocket fuel power index, where you can really kind of look at these eight different areas and see how you're doing, how your duo is doing in each of these areas. And then you can look at where you have gaps. Where one of you sees it one way, one of you sees it another way, that's a gap that you've got an opportunity to work on and improve. And the two biggest areas that I'll hear when I'm working with a large group, and I'll ask them where their biggest gap is. Number one is that role clarity is they just. They still don't have it, you know, yet. So they're seeing it different ways. They're kind of stepping on each other and fighting for the wheel and doing stuff like that. And the other one is this Dedication to the same page discipline. So really doing what it takes to take the time and be committed to do the work to stay on the same page. So what does your same page meeting discipline look like? How do you do that?

We do it every week. We utilize the EOS tools and text in issues and we dedicate at least an hour. But once a month we try to do a dinner where we have a longer time together and spend some more quality time. But we're always giving each other a pulse checker. I'm always bringing Tracy in on the operational things that she should hear about more of the in the weeds, but also giving her enough that it doesn't give her a bunch of head trash either so she can be the visionary we need her to be. So I think we have a really great cadence in our meetings and she also is really great with those same page meetings to help me solve the bigger problems because she's really, really great at coming in and giving a whole different perspective to what I been trying to solve by myself at times.

Right. Tracy, what's your perspective on how the same page meetings work?

Yeah, I'd say the same thing. I mean, Tony's always super organized. I like texting her, slacking her issues, and she takes all my squirrels and puts them into a format and prioritizes them so that, you know, when we show up together, we're ready to really dive in. You know, it's funny, when we did our love path, one of the things that Toni likes is like coffee and breakfast in the morning. So if we have a morning meeting, I try to bring her coffee and breakfast. And she usually has a pop tart on her desk that I move to the side and say, let's have something a little more healthy. But yeah, no, I mean, I think we're really good at prioritizing those. And even if we can't get together in person because it's just impossible, which doesn't happen very often, we'll do a zoom or a call and be really, really efficient together. And you know, I love the time, the one on one time with Tony when we go to dinner or you know, do something that's a little bit more personal and it's fun because over the course of the last year, I would say we have a more natural cadence of connecting personally. Whereas before, I think for us both, but I think more so for Toni, it was like a to do, like, okay, ask Grace. Be something personal. Right. And now I know this about you. And now it feels very natural. Like we just have this, like, really beautiful connection and love for each other that it just makes everything run super, super smooth. And our time goes like that. I'm in her office for an hour, and I can't believe it's an hour.

A lot of times the integrator has to kind of rope the visionary into doing this. It doesn't sound like that's the case with you. It sounds like Traci's very much engaged in that process. And appreciate that, Tony. That's a big deal when you've got a visionary that's that committed. One of the things that I'm hearing a lot of is when it comes to the same pace course, what we prescribe is at least once a month for as long as it takes to kind of get through all the things that you need to. Understanding that there's urgent things. There's things that come up a lot more frequently than that. So it sounds like you're diffusing a lot of those things in your weekly meeting and then you're having dinner together or doing something a little bit more extended once a month. I'm curious. What have you noticed are the types of issues that you get into on those longer discussions? So when you have the time, the unstructured time where it's a dinner or something like that and you can really kind of be free to let it roam a little bit more, what are the issues that you tend to talk about there that you probably wouldn't tend to get to if you just did the kind of short bursts every week?

I kind of look at our time together in those settings as, like, we've talked about. We've may teed it up in the weekly, but we're saying we're not going to be able to solve this in our hour time frame. So let's kick it to our version of a vto. And we're talking about the more meatier topics there. Whether it's reorg or a new department that I think we need to explore or new tools and technology and things that are going to take more than an hour for us to get alignment. And. And I never want it to be the first time Tracy hears about something too. We've been really good at learning, and Tracy's taught me this as well. You never want to just bomb something on someone. You want to bring them along on your. Your journey and your noodling. And so I try to bring her along and she tries to bring me along so we can be more productive. And I'd be like, where is this Coming from, and then we're derailed. That's what I. I don't know if you agree, Tracy.

I love hearing that. Tracy. Anything you would add to that?

No, I think that's exactly how we do it. I was also gonna compare it to the EOS model where, you know, we kick the bigger things to the vto. Our version of the VTO is our monthly get togethers.

Love that. Love that. I think that's really important for our listeners to hear because one of the things I see often is the visionary and integrator work closely together day to day. And a lot of times, you know, their offices are next to each other or maybe their desks are next to each other. Right. And so they're like, well, we see each other all the day. What do we need to do this same page thing for? We're talking all the time. And it's just. There's something about creating that space where you have the time to go a little deeper and get a little further and not worry about, oh, I just. I need to wrap that up. Right. I need to tie it because we got to move on to the next thing. It lets you do that work on those important things that may be holding you back or maybe an opportunity that you can uncork that'll really leap you ahead. So I appreciate you sharing that with the listeners. So sounds like, again, because of all the front end work you've done here, that it's all just working really, really well. And so I can't imagine that it's just perfect, though. And so I'm going to poke a little bit here. And Tony, I'll start with you. One thing that Tracy might like to see changed or different about you. What do you think she would say? It's almost like the Newlywed game. If I had her write it down on her pad over there and then hold it up to the camera. Maybe I'll do that another time. But if she was going to say one thing that I'd like to see change in Toni or about Toni, what would it be?

She wants me to be more of a quick start. I'm a processor, so some things that balances us out well. Tracy's a super quick start. I need some time to reflect, but there's sometimes you don't have time to do the reflecting that I want to do, and I just need to move with my gut at times. I'm a high fact finder, and I probably can drive her batty as well. So I need to start to lean in and be okay with taking a little bit more calculated risks.

What is your quick start on Colby, Tony?

Like three.

Tracy, what's yours?

It's a nine, I think.

Yeah.

There you go. Okay. All right. So, Tracy, did she get it right, or would you have said something else?

Actually, I can't even believe she came up with something, but she is right. I was like, he's going to ask me this question, and I'm going to have to come up with something. And I really don't know because I think I could have given you a laundry list about a year ago, but it really is pretty perfect, Mark. And I'm not just saying that because she's sitting here. It really is.

Well, let's see, because we're going to flip it around. And now I want to hear what you think Toni's going to say would be the one thing that she'd like to see changed and different about you in this relationship.

So I will just jump on the Toni train and say she probably wants me to slow down more.

I wrote slow down on my paper.

Yeah, I am like, a super quick start. I've been working on slowing down. I think I've been better. And I would say that Toni's become more of a quick start. So I think we're sort of, like, coming together, at least with a way that we engage with each other. I would say not outside of our relationship, necessarily, but within the relationship. I think Tony's been much better about not taking an entire year to process something, and I'm much better about not making the decision in 60 seconds. So we're starting to, like, come together in the middle on that.

That's very cool that you're both, you know, you're tuned in. Right. So you're sensing kind of what the other is feeling now. I want you to hear this, though. Don't lose that difference. There's power in that difference. Right? So you need that energy of, come on, let's go. And you need that energy of, hang on, let's slow down and take a look at this and. And make sure we do it right. Right. That's the polarity that we talk about. So there's power in that. When you can use the structure to help you understand it in a way that you can use that difference to be most effective and most productive for you. So that's cool to hear. All right, so we've got listeners that are maybe ahead of you on their journey, maybe behind you on their journey. And so I always like to get a sort of A nugget of wisdom at this stage of your experience with the visionary integrator relationship, what's one thing that you can share with a visionary that's out there or an integrator that's out there from your experience in that seat that you think might be helpful to them, that'll help them get where they're trying to go maybe a little faster or maybe with a little less pain.

Tony, I would say as an integrator, you tend to feel like you're on an island, and finding fellow integrators is a challenge. And I haven't quite found my integrator hub yet. I know that EOS is working on that.

I know of one for you.

Okay, perfect. Give that to me. So what I have found through my journey is I don't want to be on an island. And that's where coaching really does come into play for me, whether it is within. I'm also part of other coaching dynamics, and I didn't really realize how important it was to get outside perspective because someone else is dealing with the same type of problem. So why am I trying to reinvent the wheel? So go get help right away. Go lean and make it a priority to take at least a monthly meeting with some kind of coaching.

Nice. I love that. Yeah. So we've got, obviously, an integrator masterclass and integrator Mastery forum. And that's one of the experiences that I'll see a lot is an integrator shows up and here's a room full of integrators, and they just kind of look around and it's like, I'm not alone. It's not just me. There's other people out there like me, and they're dealing with stuff that's very similar to the stuff I'm dealing with. And so there's a lot of power in recognizing that, that and kind of helping each other. So I love that you shared that. Traci, what about for you? What's a nugget that you can share with those visionaries out there that are working their way along the rocket fuel journey?

I think one of the biggest AHAs for me is to let go of the notion that, like, I have to hold on to everything. Letting go of the vine analogy is, like, perfect. But I think for me, I felt like I was giving something up when I was giving up that integrator role and when I was bringing Tony on as a partner. I can't imagine being in a visionary integrator role without some sort of formal partnership. Whether or not it's a partnership in the business or it's just something that, you know, a deeper relationship or a bond that you build with your integrator. So my head was always in this, like, I don't want to give anything up. And the beauty of it is, once I gave up the seat and the roles and responsibilities that I loved, I actually felt like I gained so much more. And that, to me has just been. That's been my story through this entire journey, is that giving something up and giving up roles and responsibilities and giving up partnership and giving up is really not giving up. It's a massive gain. And so for me, it's just been a really beautiful year.

So talk more about that in terms of the gain. What's the gain that you've experienced?

Yeah, I mean, just like Tony said, when you're the visionary and most visionaries started the company out of their spare bedroom and made no money for the first five years, and it was a total grind. And, you know, like, you finally get to the point where, oh, my God, I can have. I do, I deserve an integrator. And then, you know, you find that right person. I think it just takes everything to the next level. As far as growing the business where I thought I was going to feel not needed, not valued anymore. You know, I didn't want to be that visionary that was just like out on the golf course 247 or like, not checked into the business. But there's a little, like, bit of ego that's attached to, you know, like, me being the business and working myself out of that and bringing somebody else in with me on that has just been such a game.

Love that. Love that. Yeah, it's interesting. A lot of visionaries, to get where they've gotten, they've had to become competent, if not really good at a lot of that integrator type stuff, if you will. And so you kind of get hung up in the, well, I can do that, I can do that, and maybe I even enjoy it a little bit. And, you know, a lot of times what I see is, as they do let it go, they actually see, wow, they're pretty good at that stuff. And a lot of times, you know, my experience was I was like, wow, they're a lot better at it than I was. And so that's good. And it allows you to get to that place where you're doing things not just because you can, but you're doing the things that you should be doing that we need you to do that only you can do. Ultimately, that's the stuff that you're gifted with and that's where we want people. We want the visionaries using their gifts and the integrators using their gifts and everything goes farther because of it. So I really appreciate both of you taking some time to spend with us today on our little podcast. Have we missed anything big? Have we covered all the things that you wanted to cover?

Yeah. I hope that people lean into our journey and embrace the love path because it is something worth the journey and I don't have any regrets.

Very cool. If our listeners want to find out more about you or your business or we'll have links in the show notes, but any particular place they would go to find out more about either of you?

They can go to mediabridge advertising.com or on all the socials MediaBridge advertising perfect.

That makes it easy. Well, again, I'm super grateful for your time and have enjoyed spending a little bit of immersing myself in your journey and love hearing some new stuff today. I know it's going to help some listeners because you've given lots of nuggets that are going to help them get from wherever they are to where they're trying to go. And to our listeners, thanks for listening. If you like what you're hearing, please give us a review that'll help more people find out about us and hopefully we can reach some more people that way. So until next time, go rock it. Thanks so much for joining me today. I really hope you were inspired by our guests. If you're interested to discover how your current visionary integrator relationship compares to the relationship you'd like, I invite you to go visit rocketfueluniversity.com and take our first free Crystallizer assessment. You'll get both your Visionary and Integrator indicator scores and that's going to help you figure out your next step. The Entrepreneurs behind the Entrepreneurs EOS implementers help business owners get everything they want from their business. Businesses request a free 90 minute meeting with an EOS implementer to learn how they can help you on your journey toward EOS mastery and living your ideal Life. Go to eosworldwide.com to get started.