Behind the Scenes of a High-Performance Sales Team
Matt Ryder leads a Q&A on high-performance sales, breaking down the problem-impact-solution-consequence framework and how to qualify intent. He covers real objections like unproven offers and vague prospect signals, and introduces a community tracker that rewards daily activities and referrals with points and cash prizes.
Chapters
In like a week or two, I had like, like 3 sales managers who I was connected with, like 5 offers on the table.
Yep.
So like, bite the bullet, dude, and fucking reach out to it.
The industry is in your favor, guys. You don't even need to be amazing. Like, if you really just treat finding a new offer like sales, you find an offer in the 2 weeks.
Hmm.
Oh yeah.
What's up, guys?
What's up, baby?
What's going on, baby?
Maybe like your brother, right? I know you guys say no more, but I don't say that shit. Uh, Matthew, we need a new trophy, uh, mate. We need a trophy for the most retarded guy in the community. It's become very urgent. Uh, there's a lot of retard. Um, I think Julius is gonna be number one most likely, but, um, I will out-retard Julius, Chef. Yeah, he has competition. Like a lot.
Alrighty, well, you know, I'll, uh, I'll come up with some proofs and we'll, uh, we'll get it approved, right?
Thank you.
By the committee. Um, all right, I just want to do straight Q&A today, guys. Like, I haven't done that for a little while, so like, uh, ask away and, uh, we'll get in and get amongst it.
Okay, so, um, in prom awareness What's your metric to know, like, when you've hit the depth at which you need to hit?
Ooh.
What do you think?
What do you think you need from that stage of sales?
So I need root of the problem, you know, the problem itself, like what they don't like, and also impact. So I'm saying specifically in the impact portion, like how do you—
What does impact mean?
So emotional and just like personal. So for example, if they're not making the money they want to make, I like to get a better understanding of like how they're looking at the end of the month financially, how it's affecting the people around them, how it's affecting them emotionally. Biz Up Amazon FBA coaching.
Okay.
So what you want is you want like, you have to understand when you're getting what in a sales call. To know when you have enough, right? Because you only need the information that you need, right?
So can't hear you, Matt.
Yeah, I can hear you neither, brother.
Can you hear me now?
Oh, it may be some far away.
Too far.
Really?
That's weird.
Hold on one second.
There we go.
That's a bit—
that's bizarre.
Hold on one second.
Oh, you know why? Now, now we hear you.
Is that better? Yeah, yeah, we're better.
It's—
I was using my, um, it was using my phone as the— I've got headphones on, I was using my phone. All right, so, um, you only need what you need, okay? And you need to know what you're going to get in other places because you only need enough to get through the next bit. So if you need to know what is the problem, what's causing the problem, what impact is the problem having, right?
Mm-hmm.
And then like, what have they tried to solve the problem? It's like the, the impact component of that could be Like, could be almost nothing or it could be very deep. It would depend on like what you're selling. I would say in B2C, you don't need a lot. And if you, because you're going to get most of the impact is in consequence, right? So like if you're, if you're gonna go through after that and you're gonna do like a whole solution component, do you know what I mean? And then you're gonna go through and do a consequence component. What's the point of getting super deep and emotional on not having enough money? Like, they're very aware they don't have enough money. They're very aware of how their problems are affecting them today. That's why they're on a call with you.
Yeah.
Right? So I don't see the point in like diving really deep into like, woe is me, because like clearly they're okay with their current circumstances enough to have them.
So, but wouldn't that extend to like any B2C offer?
Yeah.
Oh, so problem awareness is just like, you don't need to, like, when you talk about like, how would you describe impact then? You just get like a little bit of how it's emotionally affecting them and then move on?
Yeah. Like, I mean, for me, not even, but yeah, for most people. Oh, I don't go through it. I don't go through any of that stuff. That's why, like, it's not taught in any of the stuff that I do.
Well, yeah.
What comes up for me is like, if I don't get the impact there, then when I get to consequence, it'll kind of be fucked up because they won't want to give me a consequence. They'll be like, oh yeah, things are all right.
That's— those are unrelated problems.
Okay.
It just means that you haven't solutioned them very well and that your consequence is weak. It's got nothing to do with the impact that the Because like you're, you're consequencing them on not achieving the outcome, right? And like never getting to the dream goal. You're not— and like you're not consequencing on like just staying the same. If you consequence on just staying the same, like they're already okay with where they are. That's why they're there. So like, what's, what's the point of doing a consequence of like, what happens if you stay exactly where you are right now? It's like, well, nothing. I stay where I fucking am. Are you willing to settle for that? I mean, I don't want to, but like, it's not my bed.
Yeah, it's kind of what I get. So now I'm confused.
Yeah, but what's that got to do with the consequence of not achieving the end state?
Okay.
So like, I think you don't understand the phases. I think you should go back through and watch the— watch some of the videos because I can tell that you're not understanding, like, what you're trying to get from solution and consequence.
Okay, cool.
Yeah, and I explained that specifically in the consequence section.
Okay, cool.
Yeah, I can tell.
Yeah.
All right, but like, those things are unrelated. Um, alrighty, next.
I, um, I just hopped off a call with, uh, I was just on a call with a prospect. Um, how would you handle like somebody that Like they're going through the process, like they're giving you the answers, but it's like super like laid back, like vague and like saying like, oh yeah, I'm just pretty interested. I just want like a, like a side income. Um, like, because my problem is like an intent when I try to get like the intent why they're here. I sell a biz op, by the way, AI consulting, a biz op.
Mm-hmm.
And I just don't understand like why, um, how, how would I handle like, okay, yeah, I just want a side income. Just make make some more money on the side.
Okay.
What I just said, huh? Isn't that the whole point of a biz model?
Yeah, but I would would I take like the vague like more money intent or would I just like be like okay what has you looking at making more money like what's behind that or what do you think has them wanting more money? They don't have enough.
Okay.
How—
what's, what's changed for them recently where they sort of want to make more cash?
Yeah, I asked that and then it was just like a back and forth of like, well, I mean, I've always wanted more cash.
So why are you doing something about it now then?
I saw the ad.
You've seen a ton of ads?
Yeah.
I mean, I'm just— I'm really interested in like with AI. AI is like the future. So I just thought I would Jump in now.
Okay, it's been around for a while though, like at least a few years. What's changed recently to where you're like, I want to go from doing the thing that I've been doing for a long time to then adding something else? Like, what's been the catalyst that's made you actually want to do something now rather than like when OpenAI came out 5 years ago?
Um, Realizing that I wanted to like have like a side income and not just continue.
What made you realize that?
Huh?
What made you realize that?
Um, okay, I see where you're going with it.
Yeah, just keep asking questions.
I found a problem, maybe.
It's just probing and clarifying. Like, none of it makes any sense, so you just have to get better at that. I mean, now, like, or maybe the person was just like, I don't fucking know. They never thought about it. Most people have never thought about it. So like, you just have to get them to think about it.
Okay. And like, with the main thing like that, I just— I don't know, like, when do you know when you've got like a good enough intent, right? Because like, my thought process would be like, I use that intent. Like, if they say I want to have more—
The question on like, when do you know it? To me, it just says that you don't understand what you're looking for.
Right.
So like, have you gone through, have you done the course material?
No.
Yeah.
Like I understand, like I want to get like an overarching goal, right? A tangible that they want, like something that they want.
That's in your situation questions. Yeah. So like you just want to get an overarching goal.
Sweet.
And then you can get like, what are you doing about it?
Yeah.
Like I think you guys think you need more than what you need. Which is why you stress out about stuff. Like, if you get what you need, like, you, you should literally have the answers that you need written down. So like, the whole like, when do I know it's enough question is an indicator to me that you don't know what you want.
You know what I mean?
This isn't like me having a go at you. This is like me just saying—
Got it.
Like, you don't know what you want from it, but you should know what you want from it, because when you sit down and write your script, You should know what you want from each section, and then like that should be part of it.
Okay.
Right? Like I know that like I have 2 or 3 different avatars. The avatar is like, go through the script voting section. It's like, okay, these are the people that are gonna come through. The side hustle people, the people that wanna replace their 9 to 5 cuz they hate their job and they're sick of it, and the successful people who wanna have a passive income stream.
Cool.
Those are my 3 people. All right, cool. When I ask this question, what are— what am I looking for for those people so I can link it to this question? What am I looking for so I can link it to this question? Yeah, so you have to write all that stuff down and you have to know it, right? Otherwise, like, you just run into kind of inane shit like this.
Yeah, that makes sense. And would you, like, also just continue holding— like, would you take the vague, like, answer? Like, let's say, like, somebody hops on the call You ask the intent question, like, yeah, just more money. Like, would you just take that?
No.
Okay. That was like my question. Okay.
Yeah, I would do exactly what I do. Why though? I just, you know, just keep asking questions. What I want is like why they're doing it. Like, what are they— what are they looking like? What was the catalyst, right? Like, what shifted recently to where you want to start doing this? Like, I'm just going to stay in there until Like I get, you know, a catalyst and then I'll go into rationale.
Okay.
Yeah, that makes sense.
Yeah.
Appreciate it. Sweet. Sweet to the beat.
All right.
Next, Reno.
I can go if that's okay. Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Okay. Yeah. A bit of background. So I'm really new to sales. And I've launched a new offer for my business. So it's in the same niche, but it's completely different offer. So I don't have any case studies, any proof for this. And I'm right now building my script and I guess I'm struggling to find the proper angle because if I haven't done it for anybody yet, I don't really have that authority to, I guess, you know, and belief in myself around the proof. So how would you go about framing? I don't like basically everything because I have an offer which is a free trial for my first few customers, but right now I'm not sure how to frame it.
What do you mean by frame it?
Well, I guess it's a position of weakness, you know, to not have any proof and to be starting out. So I was curious, like, how would you go about it?
Yeah, but you're just— I'm sorry, Matt, you're not asking a question. How would I go about it? And you said, how would I frame it? And then you said, well, it's a position of weakness, but you haven't told me what you mean by frame it.
Yeah, I see what you mean. So I don't—
I don't— I don't— I don't— I just don't know what you're asking. Like, you're asking, how do I write a script for that offer? I don't know what it is. But there's a whole scriptwriting process. If you don't feel confident that you can do it, I for sure wouldn't do it because that's what it sounded like to me. You said like, that's what it sounded like.
Okay.
Yeah. Am I wrong in that?
I meant that ultimately, like a couple of sales that I had, it came down to, okay, can I speak to some of your clients? Some of your clients right now and see like what results they're getting. And I don't have any clients for this offer right now, but I have clients for my old offer.
Yeah.
So, so where do you think that objection comes from? I guess it's just a trust objection.
That's all it is.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah. But like, that's a symptom. It's not a, like, there are ways to overcome that objection, but like, Which are in the objection portion, but like, it's just a symptom of like, you haven't, you haven't, the pitch hasn't filled them with enough confidence to where they know that it will work. Right now, if you are not confident, that's gonna be difficult, right? But like, it sounds like you're asking me, How do I sell this thing that I've never sold before and I have no clients and no proof? Is that what you're asking me?
Yeah, basically.
You sell it the exact same way as everything else. There's no difference.
Okay.
And like, like, it's— there's no difference between selling something new and selling something that's not new. Um, it's— there's brand trust, you know what I mean? If there's no brand trust, like, people need to go through the 5 levels of awareness. Like, so if you're getting them on the call, like, they're they're pretty keen to do something, they're keen to solve the problem. It really doesn't matter if like, if you do a good job on the sales call of like listening to their problems, understanding it, and then presenting a solution that makes sense. It doesn't matter if it's new or not. When I, when we started selling 7th Level, like nobody knew who Jeremy was. I just sold it. I mean, it's just you have to be confident and convicted that the product's gonna work, and then you, you take them through a process that uncovers their problems. Like, what do you want? What's your problems? Once you solve those problems, what do you want to achieve? What happens if you don't achieve that, that, that goal? Are you willing to do the things required to achieve the goal? Yes. This is how I think you should achieve the goal. How do you want to proceed? Okay, so that's the sale. It doesn't matter It doesn't matter if it's established or not established. Makes no difference in the sales process.
Okay, so this is an overcomeable objection. So this is not like something that it's a deal breaker.
It's an objection you should never get.
Okay.
If you're doing a good job on the sales call, you won't get it.
Okay.
So it's a sales call issue. It's not an objection issue. Makes sense.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Yeah.
Yep.
All right, cool. Who's next? Might have asked a question. Yeah, I do actually. Of course.
Of course. Okay.
Okay, nice.
I'm new to this. This course was my first call, so loving, loving the mod so far. My question Is when it comes to speaking about your authority during the call and asking them with asking them if they've worked with a fitness coach before, as I do fitness coaching, do you feel like there's a point to that? And or if it's like a, on a like if-then basis?
I would definitely want to get what they've done in the fitness, if they've ever had a coach before.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah, for sure.
And then because like, that's a part of saying like, what, like, what have you done in the past to like, if you look at like ideal criteria, it's like just after rationale, it's like, hey, before you started talking to me, you're out there looking for ways to actually solve this problem.
Yeah.
You know what I mean? And it's like, you know, to lose weight, to get yoked or whatever it is. Right. And then it's like, yes. Or they go, no. It's like, what happened in the past? Have you ever done anything?
Yes.
What have you done? I worked with a coach. And how'd that go?
Right.
Okay.
And it's like, well, didn't they work? Why, why don't you think it worked? Right. And then what you're going to do is you're going to try and be like, well, do they have clients? Do they get results? Well, yeah. Okay, cool. So like, was it that you didn't have the time? You didn't put in the effort? Was it just not tailored for you? Like, what is it that prevented you from having success? Do you feel they're going to go, well, you know, it was this. Okay, cool. So what do you feel like you need to be successful? And then that's where you're going to go into your ideal criteria. Perfect.
Okay, so that makes sense. And then when it comes to— because I, I have a script that comes from obviously a different mentorship, and since I, since I am again new— which one, Brian? You know who Brian Mark is?
I don't.
Okay, he's, he's a, he's a big like fitness coaching person, and one of the parts of, of that script, obviously, like, I don't know if you— I don't know how much you care, but it's You ask a question where it's that where you ask, are you— am I new to your radar or have you been following me for a while? Because if they are new, yeah, a bit of a spiel on—
It's a shit question.
Okay.
Jeremy used to try and get me to ask it at the beginning of sales calls. That's a Jeremy thing. And I always refused because like basically it's a way to like Like, it ends up— the reason why I think it's a shit question is probably not— it's because it ends up giving people like internal reasons to like, oh, this is a bad lady, they're not nurtured enough, and gay shit like that, right? Whereas like, it makes no difference. Like, it— like, whether they follow you, don't follow you, it makes absolutely no difference. Like, that's why I never asked that question. That's why the top guy at seventh level right now doesn't ask that question, right? Because like it's how long have you followed Jeremy? How long have you followed me for? Are you new? Like all it does is give you a reason to like justify why you can't sell someone, right? And and like and and when you think about it, like does does it make a difference? Yeah. And like listen, like it's not it's not like it's a terrible question. I just don't think it does anything. And like, I don't like things in sales that I don't see a tangible value because speed is like key, right? And like, I've done a lot of fitness sales, like well over $10,000 myself, you know what I mean? And I just don't see the point of that question. Okay, cool.
Okay, thank you.
Appreciate it.
Yeah. Cool. Next one, let's go.
If I could ask a pretty short question.
Yeah, go for it.
Okay, sweet. So I'm not too sure if it's important. I know you talk about the scripts don't matter or focus on one thing. So for the past 3 months, I've been using the Impact Formula and using that and only selling with that. But I'm no longer learning from them and more so want to only— I'm only pretty much in this to learn from you and the other mentors. So would you recommend that I switch over? I'm not sure if you have a script, but switch over to your script or your framework or your process of selling. That way I can learn better from you or just continue with the Impact Script.
I don't think there's much point in changing stuff, um, if it's working. Like, they're all pretty much the same, man.
Yep.
Like, who do you think Yash learned from?
Yeah, yeah, I know, I know, I know he learned from you. Um, I just want to make sure that, like, me learning from you isn't limited because of, like, I'm not using the same framework. I'm not sure if that matters though. Um, that's why I was just Making sure.
I mean, it's all pretty much the same. It's like, it's just, it's just like different names for the same shit. Like, you know what I mean?
Yeah.
Like, it's like it, but all of it's like the same. Like whether it's Socratic selling or NPQ or impact or fucking whatever the fuck Johnny Mao is doing from the 12 Minutes to Using Sales. Like, do you know what I mean? Like the, like, oh, like it's people have to go like, hey, why are you here? What do you want? What are the problems associated with what you're doing? If you ever solve their problems, what would you like? If you got that, like, how would that make you feel? What happens if you don't do that? Are you sad? Okay, are you willing to commit to changing things? Yes. Okay, here's what I think you should do. Like, that's sales, and they're all the fucking same.
Okay.
You know what I mean? It's just like, well, it's just like the packaging. I think from like a, like if I had to pick a winner, I would say NEPQ from a packaging standpoint has fucking crushed everything. I was part of the packaging, so like I'm biased towards it. But like any, anything that you can process and conceptualize and then understand is just super helpful. But like at the end of the day, like, you know, learn a variety of sales styles, right?
Okay.
Because like they all have very like they all have good, they all have good in them. They all have bad in them as well. Like if like an APQ, if you're like a more passive leaned out person, it can make you into a pussy if you don't understand that. And so like People can drop sales from that, you know what I mean? And so, but there's pros and cons. I just try and teach like principles, right? Like I'm style agnostic. I don't care.
Okay.
Right.
Yeah.
Okay.
But like, if what you're doing is working, do not change your script.
Okay. Gotcha. Um, and a quick question. What do you think of verbal cueing? Cause I was just reviewing one of your calls and You don't do it, but Yash and Andres and all of them, like, what do you mean when you say that? Yeah, like when someone's talking, you're like, okay, got you, right? Yeah.
Like, just I do do it. It's just the calls that you've seen are really old.
Oh, okay.
It's it's it's it's a good thing to do.
Sweet.
Okay, perfect.
Thank you.
I think the lesson right there is huge because the boys always ask that question, Matthew, and I always tell them the same shit you just said, like, especially when they come from a different game, right? I'm like, mate, if you understand sales fundamentally, nothing changes.
Nothing changes.
Yeah, right.
That's why it's good. That's why it's good to learn like the principles, not just like the word tracks.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because you—
yeah, yeah. And like the sales calls that I put in there, like I don't like it's if I put like how I sell the like it's just not relatable. So like putting it in there is like useless, especially when I buy. Yeah, yeah, I buy. Yeah, and putting in my seventh level calls is useless, like completely useless. Yeah, it's because like selling sales training is a very niche skill set and it's un it's untransferable.
Right?
So like, I have to have like old calls of me selling different things, right? But like selling sales training, if I was to put my sales training calls in there, people would be like, oh, but you do this thing. I was like, oh yeah, but you shouldn't do that because you're not selling sales training.
Yeah, that happened all the time, by the way. Yeah, that happened all the time. Oh wait, but Matthew do that. I'm like, mate.
Yeah, sales training is like, it's very difficult and also It's very difficult because you're selling people who like are studying what you're doing, right? So they're very aware of what you're doing. However, you, you— the other side of that is that you get to fuck with them so much that like makes the sales easy once you figure that out, right? So there are things that I would do on a sales call selling sales training that would be really bad ideas for selling anything else.
Yeah.
I mean, And so that's why it's like not transferable. Alrighty, next question. Yeah, Matt, what's up?
Hello, Matt, can you hear me?
Yeah.
What direction did you take with how to make decisions on the spot sort of thing? Well, I mean, again, like I want to defer to the process because like there's a specific process for objection handling, right? And like once you're in that realm, you're like, yeah, I have to make a series of assumptions that like you've gone through all the logistical, right? So like all logistical is handled. This is the assumption I'm going to make. They're like, yes, I need this. I want this. All the money works, the budget works. I know that this will work for me. I just don't make decisions like this. Like, that's the assumption I have to make. So if that's not the case, then like, do that, right? Then from there, it's like the way that I handle objections is that you just, as soon as you get past that logistical stuff, like, I don't care what they say. I go through the same process, which is like that looping back to What do you need to put yourself in the best position to achieve the outcome? Right now, if they're in a bad position, right, if you can think of it logically, if they're in a bad position and they're not happy with where they're at, then the way in which they make decisions is fundamentally flawed. So continuing to make it the same way would probably not be a good idea.
Yeah.
Yeah. And so like, that's the, that's the logic, but it would be in between that, what do you need to do to put yourself in the best position to be able to achieve your outcome? It'd be in between that question asked 2 different ways, right? So it's like, are you happy with where you're at? No. Why not? Cool. So decision-making process that you've used to get to where you are, which is XYZ, with a gap of XYZ to where you wanna go. Yeah, I mean, I'm assuming it's weight loss for you, right? So it's like, you know, they got you 50 pounds overweight. The decision-making process that you use every day to put yourself in that unhealthy and unmanageable position of being that overweight, right? It's like, how much longer do you allow that decision-making process to dictate your life and your results moving forward? Because what's causing you to hesitate right now is what's caused you to gain the 50 pounds. So like, you either have an option of breaking that habit or just convincing yourself that now isn't the right time again. So like, tangibly, what are the action steps that you need to take in order to put yourself in the best position to be able to actually shed the fucking weight, dude? Well, I need to get something going. Yeah, but when? Because 2 days, 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years can fly by. So when do you start making the decision to actually get healthy? Well, I want to do it fucking soon. Soon or now? Soon is a funny word, man. No, no, I want to, I want to do it now. Are you sure? Because you don't have to. You can keep putting it off next year. New year, new me, that whole thing. Yeah, sweet. See how they're gonna fucking buy, right? I mean, they're fucking buying, you fucking piece of shit. Yeah, that can, that can be applied to— I'm gonna get into, uh, I'm gonna get into like being a business Coaching as well. So like the same thing. Hey dude, your audio is really bad. I'm getting what you're saying, but it's, but it's, it's like in and out.
So I got you, bro.
Yeah, but all, all, all that stuff is the same. So it's the same for business coaching. It's the same. That's why again, principles, right? Same for business coaching. Same for weight loss. Same for whatever, right? It's the same. Like if they're not in a good position, Don't use the same decision-making process that got you in that not good position to keep you in the not good position. Right. So then, then you break it back immediately. So what do you need to do? What are those tangible action steps that you need to take as a business owner to put yourself in the best position so you can achieve XYZ goal? Like best case scenario, like what would you do? I would do this. Okay. Do you feel like we can help you with that? Yes.
Why?
All right, perfect, man. So like, what are the best next steps for you to make sure that when you go to bed tonight, you're doing everything you can as the business owner to ensure that you can be successful. Now, if you go back and listen to the recording of that, all the wording is very specific. It's not will be successful, can be successful, right? One, because compliance, but two, because I'm not promising fucking anything, dude. Like, but what I can promise is that if you do nothing, nothing will change. So in order to have a chance of being successful in whatever endeavor you're doing, right, you, you have to take the actions required. Whether you achieve it or not, like, that's up to God, right? You know what I mean? But like, like, you have to do the actions. So it's like, ah, okay. So it's like, do you decide to do the actions or not, dude? Like, what the— like, what the fuck?
Right?
Perfect. But that was helpful. And like, when you listen to like when I'm doing that, like there's a conviction in the voice. Do you know what I mean? Like I'm, I'm pushing that person in like in that direction. And I'm not being pushy, but I'm being convicted in what I'm talking about.
Talking about. All right.
All right.
Who's next?
Um, I have a question.
Go for it.
How do you land a genuinely good offer when there's so many closers applying to the job boards and there's not— there's a lot of like bad offers as well? Like, how can you be different and actually land the good offers that sometimes aren't even on the job boards? Is there anything that you recommend that most people aren't doing?
Yeah, so I will— I'm going to caveat this with never once have I ever had to try and find a job sales, right? I'm gonna caveat that. I had to do it like once, but I'm very good. And when you're very good, word gets out and you're— you have offers on the table all the time. So I'm gonna caveat that. However, I can answer your question. Okay, so the first thing is that, um, like, you, you want to have the attributes of a good salesperson, which means like you do not take no for an answer.
Mm-hmm.
Right? Like, if I'm doing an interview And I want the gig, I'm fucking getting the gig, right? So you need to objection handle obnoxiously, right? Like when I interview someone for sales, I'll tell them no on purpose. I tell everyone no. Hey man, not really sure it's a good fit. If they go, oh, okay, fair enough, I go, you fucking pussy. I'm like, fucking beat it. No chance.
I did have that thought at the back of my mind. I was like, are they like, could that be on purpose? But at the same time, it's like—
Relentlessly handle their objections. I would say like, if they go, yeah, we're gonna go away and think about it, I would say, what do you want to think about? They go, well, like, we have a lot of applicants. I go, applicants aside though, do you feel like I could be a good fit for your company? Like, like, this is your opportunity to show your skills.
Yeah.
You will never not get a job if you do this.
How are you getting in front of the good offers? Because a lot of— I mean, there's, there's some offers on the job boards that like aren't that great. So I've turned quite a few down. Okay, so you're going that way.
So like, you have, like, you have to go out and get what you want.
Yeah, by all means.
Sales is like, like the first offer that I really wanted, right? When I didn't have a reputation or anything. Um, like it was a, it was a, it was a good proven offer. I did the interview, they said they'd get back to us. I fucking relentlessly hounded this dude, like relentlessly. He said, hey man, no, I'm not interested. He actually didn't want me because I was ex-military. He said, I've had bad experiences with ex-military guys before. And I said, what the fuck's that got to do with me? I said, I'm the greatest goddamn salesperson you've ever seen. Like, fucking give me the job. And he was like, uh, so I just chased him, right? And then I go, hey man, how much does it cost you to book a sales call? And he goes, $400. So I'll pay you $400 for when I don't close, right? I didn't have any money. I just want to be very clear on that. And he was like, well, I can't say no to that. I was like, perfect, put me in the game, coach. Made 12 sales my first month, right? I like outsold everyone by like, I think I made, yeah, no, sorry, I made 6 sales in the first week.
Yeah.
And it was $2,000 a sale. I was like, fuck yeah. Um, I outsold the crap out of everybody. And, and so, um, like you need to get what you want. And so as a sales rep, like you just have to say no for an answer. Right? Book a fucking sales call. Like, find the sales manager, right? Be like, hey, I want to fucking sell on your offer. Like, I'll give you $50 for everyone I don't close.
Um, that's fire. Thank you. That's really helpful. And you mentioned like word travels fast as well.
If you're good, word travels.
Even without like posting online or anything like that, just Just from okay.
Yeah, travel travels in the sales manager sphere.
Ah, okay.
But like, but like still post posts about your wins, post about what you're doing.
Right?
Like the more your name is out there, the better. Like that that that that's how I did it. I just started posting all the time.
That's really really helpful. Thank you.
But you should never take no for an answer. Never take I'm gonna go away and consider it. Think about it. Like be like this is how I would do it. I go so you want me. to let you go away with a fucking think about it objection. And I'm gonna be like, hey, listen, man, like, and I've done this exact thing many times with like the business owner and everything. I've gone to the problem is you want me for sales, right? They're like, yeah. And I was like, but you want me to let you go away and think about it? Does that— do you want the sales guy that does that? Do you want the guy— I go to the other guys that you interviewed, do they let you go away and think about it? Are they fucking pussies?
How would you objection handle? So there's this offer that I wanted to apply for, but they said they're only accepting male applicants only for AI trading offer.
Ignore, do it anyway.
And then first of all, saying that out loud is fucking wild.
Yes, yes, it is super illegal.
What the fuck is the— which offer is it?
Uh, I actually Don't know the name because it was one of my friends who was like, yeah, I want, I want to get you on the offer. I'm— I've interviewed for it, I got it, I want you on the offer too. So I was like, okay, cool, yeah, sweet. So sales manager sent me the details. They're like, ah, yeah, so they said they're only hiring guys. It's like very Jordan Belfort kind of like energy in there apparently. So yeah, they said they're not hiring women.
Yeah, for sure. You just gotta like be like, nah, give me the fucking phone with this dude.
Okay, just force it.
Put me in a group chat with him and I'll show this pussy who's boss. And you just have to show— like, I'm gonna say something. The reason is because, like, women in workplaces can be fucking annoying, right? Like, in a male sales environment. Yeah, because people want to be raucous and you— and like, you start— so you just have to be okay with the raucousness.
Yeah, I don't mind.
Right? Like, you just have to be— yeah, yeah, you don't sound like you mind, right? So it's like That's what they're worried about is like somebody coming in with fucking pronouns in their profile and being like, meh, and everyone going like, ah, fuck this, and leaving, right?
Yeah.
So it's like, that's what they're worried about, 'cause they wanna be workers and they wanna be boys, right? So it's like, as long as you can show like, nah, I'm fucking cool. Like, I've had some savage sales chicks that fucking beast everyone.
Yeah, exactly.
Like, a good sales chick is like very hard to find because like a good consistent sales chick will savage people.
Yeah, because the guys on my cell phone aren't even closing anyway. It's just my friend who's like, he's now top closer, been in there a week.
Savage them. Yeah, even say it, say it, go, these pussies in your team don't even close anyway, so what's the difference of having a group of pussies versus one?
No, it's fine.
I know that's raucous. I'm just thinking, I'm just saying, don't fucking cancel me. Not that I can be canceled. I can say anything I want. But anyway, I'm just fucking around. But like So go in there and be raucous at them and like, that's how you get that gig.
Yeah. Okay. That's really helpful. Thank you.
Yeah.
Yeah. I'm fired up now.
Anyone here, anyone here in sales, do not take no. Like, this is your entire job and persona. Like, you don't take no for answers. Like, you keep digging and you keep digging. And then the cool thing about this— sorry, Jeff, one sec— is like, you get to do it obnoxiously and in their face because like, this is like I am a fucking sales guy. It's like, do not test my follow-up, right? And I do this to people all the time. I do. I did it to fucking Grant Cardone's team, right? I literally like went and screenshotted like their follow-up guide shit on their website and sent it to them. It's like, does this shit even work, right? And I said like, I'm a raw sales rep. Do not test my follow-up. And they were like, yeah, haha, we'll get back to you in a minute. And then like I called them and sold them.
Right?
Like it just be relentless and be like open and proud about it. I am a fucking relentless, raucous sales rep. Fuck you, I'm gonna do my thing.
Right?
Yeah, that's lit a fire. Thank you. Yeah, that's yeah, it's lit a fire. Thank you so much.
Good shit. All right.
All right. I told I told Jorge and uh and we have also Johnny. Johnny was hesitating. To get a piff from his clients and he pays his own leads. I'm like, are you fucking kidding me? They either buy from you or they hang up the phone. Those are the only 2 options.
Yeah, it's a good headspace to get into and then you learn the nuances. But that's the good, like, that's the default head against the wall type attitude.
Yeah.
Alrighty, who's next?
Yeah, I got a question.
Go ahead.
Okay, far away. Yeah, yeah, for sure.
So my question is, because I'm starting to understand more like the fundamentals, like that's my homework right now specifically. And so like with Jeff, we were discussing like in situation you're supposed to create doubt, but what does that actually mean, right? Creating doubt, it has to be problematic, but what does that even mean, like problematic? And so Jeff told me like that the situation is not safe. Like where they are is not safe.
But my question is, what do you know that you can do? What do you sell? What do you sell?
Uh, so specifically marketing services for painting businesses.
Okay. So, uh, why do they come to you?
They come for more jobs.
Okay. What are they doing at the moment to get more jobs?
Uh, so typically like paper lead services, word of mouth.
Okay. That's what they're doing to get their current level of job. What are they doing to get more?
Pretty much nothing.
Okay. So what shifted for them recently to where they want to get more above and beyond what they're currently getting?
Yeah, they just want to make more money, grow the business.
Yeah, but they've always wanted to do that. So what's, what's changed? Like in the recent past to where they're like they want to get other and explore other avenues. I think it's because I'm sure I'm sure they actually didn't start the business to not grow it, right?
No, yeah, of course. Yeah, I think they just already got burned so many times, and so they're looking for like legit company that can actually help them.
Got burned?
Yeah. So like you know. Yeah, I mean there's a lot of people out there who can just start an agency and just say like hey, I can help you grow. And it's, you know, they can get scammed. Like, they actually never done the walk.
Done done the walk?
Yeah.
So like, you know, they pay for the service, they get ghosted, they don't get refunded, they just end up losing their money.
Okay, okay. That could be trouble. Yeah.
Okay.
Well, just so I can, you know. Okay. So do you see what I was doing there? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, because I was doing what you should be doing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's what you do. That's what you do.
Yeah. How do you know when you tick off the box though? Like, how do you know when you actually created doubt?
So again, you have to make the box though. Like, it's not— you can't know what they're thinking. You just have to know what information you need and then move on.
Um, okay.
I mean, like, if you're looking for like, how do I know when they're feeling it? It's like, well, you don't. I mean, you do, but it takes time. So like, don't worry about it.
Yeah, right.
Just know what answer you need and then like move on.
Sweet.
Yeah. Yeah, sounds good.
And like that probing around, you know, it's like, well, you've always wanted to grow the business. So what's changed recently? Like, that's just asking the questions again in different ways to where you start getting good answers, and then you can move them down.
Yeah.
Right? You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So like, it's just that process of like, when once you know what you're looking for, like I'm looking for them to say something along the lines of XYZ. Once you get something around that, once you get something around that, then you go, all right, cool, next, next. Just like the rest of them, I'm looking for, you know, to get more gigs through, I guess, working through an agency. Like, what's the reason for doing that rather than just like double down on your pay-per-click that you're doing right now? You know, go get a door knocker. You can just like knock more doors, right? Go walk the walk.
Yeah.
Well, man, I'm already so fucking busy anyway, and like, it doesn't seem to be working, and winter's coming, and it's like, okay, you know what I mean? And it's like, okay, so let's just say like before you started talking about looking for ways to sort of solve that problem, like, what have you done? Well, yeah, I had this company, this company. Okay, so what worked with them? What didn't work with them? What held you back from having success? All right, cool. So what do you need from me to ensure that you can actually be successful? Like, what's an ideal criteria of what you would want from us to make sure that you know that this could actually work? Well, I want this, this, and this. Why that? You see how that works? But again, that involves you writing out a script, thinking about the answers that you want. Right. Writing them down, having a few probes and clarifies, knowing what intonation you're gonna use. If you haven't done that, then like it's just all a giant waste of time. Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay. That makes total sense. So just, just so I'll kind of recap just to make sure I understood. So you map out what answers you want in each question that you're looking for. And in a way, every prospect is gonna give you kind of similar. Obviously everybody has different like situations. But it's kind of similar, like it becomes predictable. Would that be accurate?
Yeah, very much so.
Okay, that makes sense. Appreciate it, man.
I want to clarify that, um, for Johnny, uh, I was just covering with him because, you know, he follows the principles of NVQ. I was just explaining to him purely which stage was what and what outcome you're looking for. For his specific industry, there are no need to sit out because the guys are blue collar. And they don't want to do it on their own at all. But again, the boys just love to, you know, twist the shit I said.
I still love them, but no, I knew, I knew, I knew what was happening.
Yeah, I know, I know.
Yeah, it's just like, you know, again, you need to sit down, like, go to this— everyone should go to the scriptwriting section and like go through that because it literally says like This is like the scriptwriting section is not like, here's a script, go write it. It's the process that you use to get the information to be able to write a good script. That process is important. Like you have to understand the marketing, right? Because like, why would you, you wouldn't write a script like that. Like the opener of the script would be dependent on like how the lead comes in. Right. Yeah, I mean, and so like it has to be contextual, has to all make sense. And so if you've got like wildly different lead sources, you want to have maybe different openers for your outbound for each one. You know, you can write your sales process along with your scripts and make sure that everything makes sense as one like coherent process, right?
Yeah.
Also, has everyone here gone to the tracker? And started entering their details.
Yes. Right.
FTG. Yeah. Right. I think Mr. Frinton is first still.
Right.
So everyone go to that. It's $1,500 to the winner. If you guys want $1,500, all you have to do is fucking do the things on the thing, right? And the winner will win. And we're going to be running these like either every week or every other week. I might make some of them $5,000, might make some of them $2,000. This one's $1,500. Right, but it's basically like a series of activities that you have to do. Now I'm going to answer this question for the 12,000th time, and it's written in every single post: the sales numbers make no difference to the scoring. So if any of you fucking retards ask me that again, I'm gonna lose my shit, right? Because I reckon I've written it on every single one of the posts, every single one of the comments, and said it in every single video, and it's written on the fucking site, right? So like the sales numbers make no difference, right? But you have to fill out your sales data to get the points, right? But there's activities to do if you fucking ask me, Jeff.
I might do the cash collection.
You fucking piece of shit. This is why I hesitate to make nice things for you guys. This is a sales tracker. I'm going to build out that sales tracker. But it's essentially just a series of activities like go to the gym, post a gym selfie, right? Post a video in the group, post about the group in a separate place, do some affiliate content for the group, provide value in the group, fill out your sales data, ask for a referral. You know what I mean? Make a sale or make a set, right? All these like just bang, just checkboxes. Whoever has the most amount of points at the end of the week wins $1,500.
Right?
If there's a tie, okay, we're gonna have a presentation on different conspiracy theories. Whoever's the most compelling will win.
Okay?
There we go.
That's how it— that's how we settle this. We settle like gentlemen. Okay?
Just have a hard word.
Is this real?
Somebody screams at me, is this real?
I have a Harvard Review question for you.
Okay.
I talked to Lars recently, right? Because I told you last year, I told you when I had the cliff effect in the sense of like my close rates skyrocket because I completely figured out like, you remember that video where you mentioned, it was a while back, you were at Sales Sniper, you were talking to one of the members of the team and you said it is very hard in sales to explain what kind of answer you are looking for. Those are actually easy. But how does it sound when you get the answer for each outcome that you want, right? And when you really figure that out, that's where you skyrocket. You say in that video that it's pretty hard to transfer that because the guy needs to really understand his framework. He really needs to understand sales, the mechanism of it, right? And I arrived to that stage, my close rate was around like 70%. And I want your opinion on my process, on the way I see it. The way I see it is like, once you really understand sales fundamentally, what's a sales conversation, what you are supposed to do in a sales conversation, you're not just asking random fucking shit. You ask very specific stuff. Once you understand that, then you can go into the how, probably more the tonality, the objection handling, reframe and stuff like that. And I think it's that component, the speed of the call. So no white space, right? You mentioned that in the advanced classroom, like no white space. I'm there myself, no white space. And then objection handling, it's between you, me, and Jesus. I don't hang up until you buy. That's it. Unless I guess—
Okay.
Straight up. Unless I guess I want to optimize for the time of my call because I don't optimize for close rate, optimize for cash collection, right? You also mentioned that to me. That's the view I have right now.
Yeah.
What it takes to close. When I see Loz, when she was teaching me, she was at like 80% close rate on an offer. And the second best was like 37. I was like, what the hell is going on? Like, how come she closed so much?
Yeah, you can do it. It's just difficult.
Yeah.
Because the most important thing that you can do as a sales rep is like stop worrying about like, what do I do when people say this? Like, as soon as I get asked that question, I know you don't really understand sales.
Yep.
Like, and I'm not— I'm still gonna answer your question, try and help you through it. That's why I try and answer it with principles instead of like say these words because it's disingenuous. to say that. And any coach that's like, say this when you get this, it's, it's just retard maxing, right? It's like, it's just, it's just nonsense for silly people. It's because like there's so much context that's happened before the call that to me, to give you that not knowing the rest of it is stupid. And so the most important thing you can do is understand the framework that you're using Like what information I want to get and when, right? And then that can get much deeper as you go. The first layer is I'm looking for the answer that I'm looking for, which is like the words. The next layer is like I want the answer, the words, and the tone. Do you know what I mean? And then it's like, you know, and then so that's why it's so important to write your script. And like really deeply think through what do I fucking want them to say, right? Like, because people are very predictable, otherwise marketing wouldn't work. Okay, so if I say don't think of a pink elephant, everyone thinks of a pink elephant, right? It's, it's predictable. If I say why is that important to you now though, you're gonna give me a time frame answer 95% of the time. If I go, why is, why is that important to you now though? You're going to talk about the thing we were just talking about. You're not going to mention the time frame. You just like— so it's, it's, it's predictable. So I can use my intonation, my pausing, my pacing, my timing, my tonality, and my word choice to, uh, get you to answer in very specific ways. But like, I need to know what I want you to say.
Right?
And so like people just don't do the work to do that. It's like, write down, like you need to know where are they coming in from. Like if you don't, if you've never looked at the marketing of the business that you sell for, you're a lazy rep, right? Because that's what's gotten them off their feet to come to you and say, I would like some more information about this, please. Like, so what is the problem that's been espoused in the marketing? It's essential to know. The next thing is like, like, how do you solve the problem? Right? Like, understand the product, you know what I mean? Like, how is it, how is it put together? How does it do it? Right? What are some of the, what the competitors are doing? So in case I get like, oh, well, I have this Spooked to Fucking Johnny over here and yada, yada, yada, right? Like, understand. Okay. Understand, like, the key and put your pillar structure together of your pitch to where like it solves the key problems that most of the avatars are going to come in to get. Obviously that can be delivered, right? But, but it's like you want to have your pillars laid out. You want to have your pillars laid out before you write the rest of the script. It's why like, it's why in the scriptwriting fucking section it has you go through the marketing and then it has you put your pillars down of your presentation, right? And then it has you put your client, your problem avatars down. So it's like if I'm selling biz op, there are 3 distinct problem avatars that people are coming in from. If I'm selling fitness coaching, right, what is the problem avatar? Is it guys that want to get jacked, right? Is it fat people that want to lose weight? You know what I mean? Like these are again different problem avatars, same solution. Eat clean, train hard, done. Yay, right? But different problem avatars. Then it's like because the pillars, the pillars are gonna like solve their problem. You know what I mean? Then we can label the pillars because we can then use them as anchoring statements. Hey, so I really want one-on-one. Okay, like, what is it about one-on-one that you want? Oh, I just want, you know, I love the feedback. Okay, so really you're not looking for one-on-one, you're looking for feedback, is that right?
Yes.
Okay, cool. So like, like, what do you want from feedback? Like, why is that? And right, and feedback's one of your pillars, but you don't do one-on-one. It doesn't matter anymore because they get the feedback. Right? So again, these are all things. Then from there you're like, okay, situation questions, like connecting questions. What I want, overarching goal. Cool. What's the overarching goal? Uh, lose weight. All right, cool, easy. Lose weight, get jacked, get lean, whatever. From there, situation. What are you doing to do X?
Right?
Okay, perfect. Problems. What are the problems associated with what you're doing to get X?
Okay.
Rationale question, uh, build a specific gap. Then it's like, what have you been doing to achieve that? Okay, perfect. Ideal criteria in order to achieve that, so you can solve that problem, so you can get to X in with that specific gap that we just built. Uh, what do you need from me? I'm not really sure. Cool. Insert pillars. What about feedback? What about accountability? Oh yeah, that would help. Why would that help? This, this, and this. Okay, so when you say you need feedback, what do you mean? Okay, anyway, then it's like, okay, cool, let's say you're able to get the feedback, right? You're able to get the accountability, get the training, nutrition that you needed, and you're able to actually lose XYZ pounds. Like, what would that do for you personally? Like, it's gotta be worth chasing, right? So like, what can you do then you can't do now? Solution, future pace, okay? And then what you have in place right now, right? Can you achieve that? No. Why not? Okay, cool. What happens if that doesn't change? You never figure out how to actually achieve X. What happens then?
Oh, fuck.
All right, cool. You want to change that? Yes. Okay, here's how you do it. Now, if you can't roll through that off the top of your head like I just did, you're just not going to be that good, right? Because like what that shows is I have a deep understanding of the sales process. I know what I want, when I want, and I know what I know, how to listen for it. Yeah, I mean, but it's like the step one is like I just have to know that process back to front because then I never get lost. I always know what I'm looking for. And if I do get lost, I always know what's next. So who cares? Right. And then that allows you to actually listen to the prospect and then, you know, I mean, you realize that like you're far more in control than what you think. Of most of the aspects. Okay. And so you should have a really deep understanding of that component because like if you were a professional, like a professional musician has a deep understanding of their instrument and of music itself.
Mm-hmm.
Right? You're a professional salesperson. So you should have a deep understanding of your sales process, your product, the marketing of the business that you represent. The problems that you help solve, how you solve them, right? And the common problems that people are coming in at. And then like the process that you plan to take them through. If you don't have that, you're not a professional. And if you're not a professional, you're an amateur. And amateurs don't get good results, right? So it's like, that's just the way it is. That's not like a value judgment on anybody in particular, but like That is truth, right? So it's just like, you know, if, if you hired an electrician and they had the same level of sales knowledge, or, you know, they're the same level of professionalism that you had, would you hire them?
Right?
Yeah.
And like, you know, that's an interesting conundrum, you know. So would you be happy turning the light switch on every day knowing that someone with your work ethic and skill set did that?
Yeah.
So, and again, everyone, if you're starting out, everyone starts in different places. Like, that's why they have apprentices, right? But, but, but it's like, again, the apprentice has to like do all the things the professional does. They just suck at it. That's why the professional's there, right? So it's like, do all the things And with sales, like, the more understanding you have, the better everything will go. All right. That's all the time I have for today. I want everyone to go down to— is it FT— is it FTGurus.site? Is that what it is?
It's in the chat. I just posted about it.
Yeah, it's FTGurus.site.
Yeah, right.
If you're not in there, just tag Ivy. But unless you're brand new, like, you're in there. It's got— basically, it's a tracker. Did I post today? Given value, posted about the group, attended a coaching session, watched school content, made affiliate content, liked and commented on one of my videos, completed a sale, asked for a referral, closed a deal, made a set, did your data, hit your daily activity goal, and went to the gym. Okay, these are all good things. All right, so if you just do those things every day, every other day, whatever, and there's a testimonial which you can do once a week, right? Film a testimonial video, right? So a lot of the things are designed to like make you do daily activity things to become better at sales and to like make more sales. Like asking, like, it'd be interesting to see how many people don't fill it out because like it's hard. To fill out, I did not ask for a referral every day, when asking for a referral is super easy, right? So it's like, that's why I like those things, because you have to look at it and go, oh God, I'm a piece of shit, right? And be like, fuck, okay, tomorrow I'm asking for a referral. Just ask for referrals, guys. Like, if you ask for referrals, you'll, you'll fucking— yeah, you'll get sales, right? You'll get them. They'll come.
Right.
So like, go out there, do those things, crush it, go out, fill the tracker out. We also— the belt, right, that we do every quarter that the champ Holden got, right, the big wrestling belt for the FC Gurus, that's based on that tracker over the all-time metric.
Right.
So like, if you want to be in the position to be the top dog, then go fill it out, be involved. And the more involved you are, the more you post, the better. You know, all right. Be part of the community. All right. Come to Tin Foil Hat Thursdays. Tell us who's responsible for everything. All right. All right, guys. Have a phenomenal day. I have to have to go. All right, guys. Good shit.
Love you all.
Bye.
Bye bye.
Thank you.
