(Ep. 47) 3 Communication Mistakes Financial Advisors Make (And How To Fix Them) | Deirdre Van Nest

This is the Ideas by Mike podcast, and I am your host, Mike Milligan. On this and each and every one of our podcasts, you will get an idea that I've tried and maybe have not executed, an idea from our guests that you can implement in your daily life, and hopefully you'll be inspired to build better ideas for yourself. Well, today on this podcast, I've got Deirdre. Hi. Van Ness, the founder of Crazy Good Talks. We're going to talk about her journey through, through a former profession where she is now has the wrong letters behind her name with what she does now. We're also going to talk about 3 mistakes that financial advisors make in their practice that can be applied to a lot of other industries and really how we communicate with people in general. And then finally, you're going to find out what makes Her one of a kind. So let's welcome Deirdre Van Ness to the Ideas by Mike podcast. I'm excited for this conversation today on the Ideas by Mike podcast. Uh, in the, in the warm-up Right before we actually came live on the screen, there was a conversation that could have been a top podcast in and of itself. I'm so excited to talk to Deirdre today. Uh, Deirdre, the sea of sameness. Let's start there. Will you define what sea of sameness is?

Yeah. In my mind, sea of sameness is when everybody is a cookie-cutter version of the next person. Right? So if we're talking specifically about financial advisors, I think you'd agree, Mike, that every advisor has access to the same content, the same information, a lot of the same strategies. At this point in time, even consumers have access to the same. And so a lot of times when they, you know, they get up and speak or they're communicating or meeting with clients, they just sound like the next person. Or you go on LinkedIn and it just kills me. I'm reading some of these profiles and I'm like, wow, that sounds like the last one I read. Wow, that sounds like the last one I read. So the sea of sameness is just— Blending in. Nothing makes you stand out.

It's intriguing to me, right? Because our firm is called One Oak Financial and we have this one that's tilted to the side with a dot at the end that makes no sense to anybody until they ask the question. And then I go out and write this. I had this idea in the past that I'm going to become this world-renowned famous author. I had that idea for the first time in 2003, and I wrote a book that was just absolutely crap. Mm-hmm.

I've wrote one of those, I feel like, too.

Yeah. And like, it's just like, I would never put this out. And so I put this whole idea of writing books on the table for a long time. One of the interesting things I find about you and your ideas, you're proof positive you could make a career change and be and stand out in an industry where everybody doesn't look like you. Can you, can you talk about how you are proof positive and what specifically I'm talking about from doing something and then now what you do and how you're making an impact?

Absolutely. I think one of the things that is unique about me in this industry is I am typically, and again, I have not dug in, Mike, and done the data, but I'm observing, right, from my 17 years in and around this industry and speaking and working with top organizations and being on their stages, is I am oftentimes the only person in the room or the only person on the stage who doesn't have any type of credentials in this industry. Like, the letters after my name would probably impress nobody in this industry.

And those, those letters come from a medical field. We don't have to give out what those are, but they're medical.

Correct. Yes, absolutely.

And although we always claim that we diagnose problems, we prescribe, we want to act like we're doctors, right? We diagnose, we prescribe. We use some of the same terminology. One of the interesting parts about it is like we are, what you've been able to bridge between where you were and where you are now is a successful platform with crazy good talks and your firm.

Yes.

Can you tell our audience what it's like, what the energy is like to be on a stage and what continues to make you want to drive the financial planning world instead of this one-size-fits-all, see if same, just into something that really impacts the consumer at the end of the day.

Yeah, absolutely. So I, um, when I was 10, unfortunately my mom and dad were in a really bad car accident and we lost my mom, Mike. Um, I kissed her goodbye one second and then a few minutes later she was gone. And, uh, I almost lost my dad. Fortunately we did not. And as I was growing up, I, uh, You know, I fortunately did not have to worry about moving or where my next meal was coming from or any of those things that happens to a lot of people when tragedy hits. But when I became an adult and got pregnant with my first child, I really started thinking about, oh my gosh, like, what would've happened to us had my dad not been able to go back to work and provide for us?

Wow. Right?

What would our life have been? And so, I'll never forget, I dragged my— before I knew if Annika was a boy or a girl, I dragged my husband, Peter, to a financial planner. He thought I was like, what are we doing? I'm like, no, no, no, we're doing this thing. We sat down, we started the planning process, we got the will and all the things. And Mike, I started talking to my friends who were in similar life stages. And these were people with assets to protect and invest, okay?

Right.

And when I started talking about things like life insurance and wills and all this, they looked at me like I was crazy. They couldn't understand why a woman of my age, at that point, early 30s, was even considering this. And that's when it hit me for the first time that so many people right now, all around the world, but in the community that our advisors are in, are one tragedy away from total financial devastation. And these are not necessarily people who don't have means, right? Like, these are people who do, and they're one tragedy away from total financial devastation. And so, What started becoming clear to me was how important not only the industry is, but how important it is for a consumer to have a trusting, long relationship with an advisor who completely has their best interest at heart. And so my role in this, Mike, is I think you'd agree that people who are better communicators have more influence. Would you agree with that?

I would 100% agree with that.

Okay. So my role as a communication expert is teaching growth-committed advisors how to make their communication skills their superpower. How do you not just enter a room, but own the room? How do you stand out in the sea of sameness with your communication as your competitive advantage? Because what I want is I want all of those people, we know the consumer doesn't wanna have difficult conversations. No one wants to talk about dying. or being disabled, and a lot of people kick the can down the road and they put off these decisions. I want advisors to be able to influence and persuade all of those people who would rather put off these important conversations and planning decisions for someday. I want them to have them today. So that's my, that's my why in this industry.

We, we always have, um, there's seems like rarely in our life we have like breathtaking experiences when people are talking. And you just gave me one. Like, you just literally took my breath away. You took the air out when you talked about your mom and dad and then, and how it has become such a driving factor, or, or, or like what, as a, as an academic person would call it, like a money script. Like it, it just scripted in you the need for not only being a part of this as a client, as the financial planning world, but also influencing the next generation. And more importantly, um, we, we, we, we've got this saying called the convinced are convincing. That's what, that's what we talk about in our firm. Like, if you're, if you're convinced, if you're, if you're convinced and convicted at the same time, you can, you can, you can help others. You can lead others.

Yes.

Not, uh, uh, with When you convince somebody to do something, you're not selling them. You're showing them that a problem exists and that you have a solution that can help solve their problem to help them sleep at night, have less fear, have less anxiety. And that is—

Absolutely.

Exactly what you talked about is like in your daily role. And I love the work you're doing, by the way, because we don't have enough financial professionals in America for the need that exists.

That's right.

That's right. There's such a— we also talked about ahead of our, uh, the recording here, just about like the lack of women in the industry. And, uh, and I, and I get this, right? We have a lot of widows and older women who look at our firm. It's like, wow, you got a lot of women working in your firm. Like, why is that different than what I see over here? You had some great takes. Or why there are not a lot of women. And I think it's worth maybe exploring that for a couple minutes on the show.

Yeah, absolutely.

Like, can you share with the audience why you think there's not as many women financial advisors, financial professionals in the industry as relation to the men that are out there doing this?

Absolutely. And this is just my opinion, just from observation. Okay. So I think it starts with schooling. Historically, you know, math and science have been for boys, if you will. Right. So that started, I mean, decades decades ago, right? That's how we were raised coming through school. I was certainly raised that way going through school. And so this wasn't even something that was offered to us as a profession. So I think that's the first thing. But the second thing is I don't feel that the profession is necessarily set up incentive-wise in the best way that it could be for women. And so what you and I talked about was part of my background is I am a certified fearless living coach. It's a real thing, Mike. Took me 2 years to get the certification. And so I, when I started that practice back in 2007, I worked with a lot of female entrepreneurs, advisors among them. And what I found is that women were and are a little more hesitant to take risk. And so this type of business is riskier in the first 5 years. Right? There's a lot of risk. You're not guaranteed an income in most situations. You know, you're kind of having to, you know, live wherever you're going to live. I mean, there's not a lot of safety and security here. So, I think the early parts of the career are not conducive for attracting a lot of women into the industry. So, I think that's one. The second is, I speak at a lot of conferences, so I get the privilege of listening to the awards that are being given.

Right.

And the Majority of the awards, if not all, are focused around production. Now, that is not bad. I am a production-oriented person, right? As an entrepreneur, you have to be. However, for a lot of women, we want more, and we think there's more that we'd like to be recognized and rewarded for. So one of the things, a compliment I shared in the beginning that I got last week from someone when they saw me coaching a group of entrepreneurs, she said, the thing that stood out to me, Deirdre, is that you coach with love.

Mm.

And I was like, oh, yes. Every— anyone that's in my presence, Mike, I want them to feel that they are loved. And so for me, that's more of a reward and an incentive to me than you had the most production. Or Deirdre, you impacted 1,000 lives this year versus what my production is, right? And so I'm not saying production's not important, but I think we need to change the script on what makes someone a great advisor and the things that we are rewarding to include things that a lot of women, and quite frankly, there's a lot of men, because I work with a lot of men and I coach a lot of men who would also be motivated by impact.

I would, I would tell you that I'm motivated by both, by revenue and impact, because impact is something that like, in the development of like the one-of-a-kind financial plan and building the vision for retirement, impact is one of the central hallmarks that I think everybody should focus on. Like, what can you leave behind? Your real legacy is your impact, right?

100%.

There's a reason that George Washington's name is still talked about and Jesus Christ's name is still talked about, right? But Matthew Smith, from 1400 Scotland is not talked about, right? Because it's the impact they make. I do want to shift topics. I do want to shift topics just a little bit, and I want to get into your zone of genius.

Okay.

Because you found that there are 3 big mistakes most advisors make when it comes to how they communicate with prospects and clients and even centers of influences. And I want you to walk us through them if that's, if you're okay with that. But first I want to know.

Yeah.

Is the personal reason that you created these 3 mistakes, was it your experience with your mom and dad, or was there some other reason that you found these mistakes?

Yeah. So the experience with my mom and dad is why I work in this industry, why I am committed to the financial services industry. But the reason why I actually got into speaking coaching and communication coaching and speaking is because I used to be absolutely terrified to speak in front of groups. Like, I would not take the stage. I had a really bad experience in my 9th grade acting class where my teacher, uh, I don't think he did it on purpose, but I was humiliated in front of the class. And I shut down from that point forward for 24 years, Mike. I would not talk in front of a group of people.

I, I, I have somebody that I live with, my wife, who is also deathly scared of speaking on stage. So I get it.

Yeah, you get it. Yeah. And I gave up leadership opportunities for this, right? Um, but when I got certified as a Fearless Living coach and I started working with clients, everybody was like, Deirdre, you've got to speak. You got to get on stage. You'll grow your business. You'll make a bigger impact. And I realized, yeah, you know, this is one of my biggest fears and I'm helping my clients with their biggest fears. I need to walk the talk. And so I made a very courageous decision back in '08 to hire a speaking coach, Mike, and it changed my life.

Wow.

It changed my life. Opportunities came to me that never would have happened. And that, like, the reason why I can speak in financial services and be sought after in financial services with no degree, with no, like, degrees in that industry is because of my communication skills. So, like, I am proof positive of the power of making communication your superpower. But yeah, it changed my life. It changed my opportunities, my income, my influence, my impact, everything. So much so that in 2011, I said, you know what? I'm, I'm so excited by the changes in me. I wanna move this forward and teach this to other entrepreneurs and other advisors.

Wow. Well, thanks for sharing that story. So now, if we can, let's talk about the 3 mistakes.

Yes. Yes. Okay. So there are 3 big mistakes that, um, many advisors make when it comes to talking to clients, prospects, and COIs. So the first mistake is thinking something like, Oh, I only need to work on my communication skills if I'm speaking on a stage. This is the, this is like the predominant viewpoint in the industry is that if I'm not doing seminars or workshops or speaking on big stages, then I'm good enough. I don't need to work on my communication skills. And that couldn't be more wrong for this reason. Presidential speechwriter James Hume once said, Every time you speak, you audition for leadership.

Mm-hmm.

Every time. So this doesn't matter if it's a one-on-one conversation. It doesn't matter if you're talking for a minute, 5 minutes, an hour, if it's a video, if it's a professional, a workshop, you're speaking at your kid's board, you know, you're on the soccer board. Every time you open your mouth, people are making subconscious decisions. Do I like them? Can they lead me? Do I trust them?

That is a powerful statement to make, right? Is that we are, it's not only like your initial statement was that when we're speaking, we're always seeing if we can be a leader. That's what people are judging us by. But it's more about like, it's probably how fast do you believe people are making that decision about you? Because aren't people looking to find like, no, that person can't lead me as soon as possible in the Yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely.

So that's the first, that's the first.

Okay. So that's, so that's the first one. So here's the thing to remember. If you're an A+, let's just say you're an A+ advisor and a B- communicator, you have a gap that has to be filled because this is where opportunity, impact, revenue, and influence is leaking out of your life.

Wow. That is powerful.

Yes.

Absolutely powerful.

Okay, so that is the first mistake. The second mistake is thinking that being a crazy good speaker means and originates with being a crazy good speaker. Now, that might be like, well, what do you mean? Right?

Yeah, I was getting ready to say, duh, but I feel like there's a twist coming to this one.

There is a complete twist here. And let me define what I mean by crazy good speaker. Crazy good speaker means you know how to grab people's attention, You know how to keep their attention. You know how to inspire action. Okay? And it has nothing to do with— I won't say nothing. It has a lot less to do with your speaking skills than one would think. It actually has to do with your writing or your content creation skills.

Ooh.

So let me give you an example of what I'm talking about. It's highly likely you have seen a really great actor in a bad movie. The one that comes to mind is the movie After Earth. Have you ever heard of the movie After Earth?

No, but I bet I've heard of the actor.

You have heard of the actor. So After Earth was in 20— I believe it's '14. Will Smith was—

Oh yeah, he's a pretty famous guy.

Pretty famous, and he's won an Academy Award. I think he's great. He's a great actor, right? But he did not win an award for After Earth. Why, Mike? Was it because he's not a great actor? No, it's because an actor can never rise above the level of the screenplay. It was a crappy screenplay. So this is the thing. People think someone's a good speaker because they have great delivery skills. They're charismatic, they're energetic, they're enthusiastic, blah, blah, blah. But that can last for about 10 minutes, maybe 30 at most. You cannot deliver your way out of a crappy screenplay. On the flip side, if you've got a great screenplay, and what I mean by that is a message that is masterfully crafted with the goal of engaging people and not just giving them information, but appealing to the emotional centers of the brain. I have worked with the most boring speakers on the planet. You would think this person would be the most boring speaker because they're very monotone. They talk like this. They don't have a lot of, right? And they knock it out of the park. So crazy good speaking starts with crazy good writing and content creation skills. And the good news for that, it, it's very formulaic. Once you know the formulas, you can be an amazing, crazy good speaker.

All right. We're not gonna give away the formula here because people are gonna have to follow you to find that or see you on stage. But that probably brings us to mistake number 3. That is probably a lot about emotions if I've done my homework correctly.

Yes. So mistake number 3 is most communicators, whether speaking one-on-one or to a group, whether it's written or it is spoken, most communicators think that their primary role as a communicator is to make sure people get what they're saying, that they understand it, that you appeal to logic. And I am not saying it's not important for people to get what you're saying, but when you're wanting to be persuasive, you're wanting to win people over, it is more important that they feel what you're saying because that's how people make decisions. They make decisions based on how they feel, and then they back it up with logic.

Maya Angelou says, people will forget what you say. They'll forget like the stats, but they'll never forget how you made Absolutely. And that's 100% the case. So, uh, so summarize those big 3 just in a couple bullet points for those people who just like bullet points. Number 1 is?

Yeah. You, number 1 is every time you speak, you audition for leadership. So if you're an A+ advisor and a B-, B- communicator, you have a gap that must be bridged because that's where revenue, opportunity, influence, and impact is leaking out.

And then number 2 was a tongue twister, but what was that one again?

Well, number 2 is crazy good speaking doesn't start with crazy good speaking. It starts with crazy good writing and content creation skills. And so here's the bullet point for this. Here's the great news. Crazy good speakers are not born that way. They're built.

And then point number 3, it's all about how people feel, correct?

It's more important that people feel your message than they get your message. If you want people to make decisions faster, they have to feel why what you're recommending is something they should do. They can't just get it logically.

That was absolutely just gold right there. And I could see why over 17 years of doing this, you have actually, you're putting those 3 big mistakes into action because you're so, from like the backstory of your mom and dad to the actual 9th grade story of where you didn't want to speak again for a number of years, you now have created something that is empowering other people to take charge and become the advisors that we need them to be for the crisis we have in America, which is the retirement crisis. I do want to spend just a couple minutes because I had a couple of other questions other than like the 3 big mistakes and your backstory. I wanted to talk about AI and retirement.

Love that.

And you admittedly said that you're not the biggest expert on this, but Uh, but I think it would be good for 2 novice— well, not, not so novice, but I mean, I think—

We're kind of—

Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, I, I use it a lot.

Yeah, me too.

Creating some tools.

Right. But, but talk about like how AI is impacting retirement from your point of view.

Yeah. So, okay. So here's what I think about, here's what I think about AI. Um, with AI, we have a massive opportunity for efficiency that we didn't have in the past.

Yeah.

Right? So AI can do jobs for us that would've taken us hours or days or weeks that could be done in minutes. And so that is something that every professional and every advisor needs to embrace as quickly as possible. And I personally would not be threatened by it. I would be excited by what it's gonna allow you to do. And based on the conversation we just had, what it's gonna allow you to do is to work on Your communication skills so that you can have the most influence and impact on clients when they come in, when they come in, right? And we were talking about how clients might come in. They literally might come in with a financial plan and be like, here, here, what, how do I do this thing, right? Your job is to create the relationship with them. Your job is to spend your time learning how to be an authentic, vulnerable communicator who can gain trust and connection and likability in just a few minutes or less. So that you can help them implement either the plan that they put together that you looked at and thought was great, or the one that you come up with them with the, with the, with the help of the AI. So I think AI allows us to be more human and focus on what was traditionally considered a soft skill. These are actually now the kind of hard skills, if you will. For this next, this next, I don't even wanna say this next generation 'cause we're in it right now, but this next evolution of how we're all going to work.

I have a guest coming on the podcast soon. His name's Dan, his, his name's Dan Chernoff. He's an AI expert. And I had another guest, Axel Meyerhofer, who's an AI guy too, to talk about like how AI plays. But Dan actually educated me on something I didn't know about AI. I mean, I think I subconsciously knew this about AI, but I didn't know it is that AI is when you ask it something, it's predicting what the next thing is.

Correct.

All to get the most democratized or probable outcome, right? Not necessarily your outcome, the most probable outcome. And so the interesting thing is like, yeah, we were talking about how advisors who have actual intelligence are going to be able to take statements, And AI plans and actually make it customized. Because remember, AI is the sea of sameness.

Yes. That's what it is. It is. And my husband, I was telling you, my husband just got certified as a chief AI officer. And so he has this saying that he learned in his certification that I love.

It's 80—

sorry, 10-80-10. So you start, let's say you have a project for AI. 10% is us, the human. Giving the right prompts to the AI. And that's really important. And it needs our prompts or we can't do anything, right? So 10% is us giving the right prompts. 80% is the AI putting together and doing a lot of the heavy lifting. And then where the rubber's gonna meet the road is that last 10% where we as the human, we go in and we edit, we redirect, we refine, and we customize. Yeah.

That's really good.

And that's what we're doing in our business.

Yeah, that's really good. Um, this has been a great conversation, but we always end or get close to the end. We always ask people that, uh, you know, what makes them one of a kind? And I cannot wait for you to share with our audience what makes Deirdre one of a kind.

Okay. Well, I would say like where I always go to with that question, and then, and then everybody sitting here could say the same thing, is that, I mean, I'm a child of God, right? God created me. his daughter, and he thought of every little hair on my head and every little molecule. And so I am unique simply for that fact. Even if I never did or achieved anything, I'm unique for that fact. And so are you, Mike, right? And so are your listeners.

100%.

Yep.

They are.

But if we're— yeah, if we're looking for something more tangible, I would probably go back to being one of the very few people in the financial services industry that gets called upon by people like you, by experts like you and big brands who don't have the, you know, the credentials in the industry. And it all goes back to my communication skills. Like, that is my superpower, is how I communicate. It's gotten me more opportunities and business and relationships than I ever could have imagined. But again, that doesn't have to be unique either, because anybody who wants to learn how to do it can do that.

So you, you are—

I have to take up some sort of skill. I've always wanted to be a magician.

Oh, yes.

So maybe I, uh, going to magic school is something that I'm starting to look at. So I would love to have a few tricks that I could do in my keynote. So maybe I could be like the financial, um, industry keynote magician or something like that. What do you think?

The financial Houdini.

The financial Houdini.

That's what it is. Yeah. You are unique. You're one of a kind. And I love both parts of what makes you one of a kind, your uniqueness, because you're called by God. And then the second one, it's just that you are doing something that is your proof pudding that you are You're meant to be doing this, of all things. Um, if people wanted to follow more on your story and your impact that you're having, um, how do they, how do they do that?

Yeah, LinkedIn. I am very active on LinkedIn, so post a lot of content there. That would, that would be great. And, and please, uh, please ask me to connect. I'd love to connect with people on LinkedIn. And then our website is crazygoodtalks.com. So that's a great place to learn more about us. And there's a resource tab with the podcast and blogs and You know, all sorts of stuff.

This has been an amazing conversation for advisors who listen to our, to our show, for, uh, consumers or clients who want to get into the belly and see like what we talk about behind the scenes. And more importantly, for anybody who is looking to maybe change the outcome of the future, because remember, the future is spotless, folks. It is 100% with Without a destination in mind, you're there and able to dictate where you want to go in your future. But it's all through knowledge, education, experience, and a little bit of risk-taking that's going to get you there. But thank you for joining us today, Deirdre.

Thanks for having me.

Absolutely. For those who are looking to hear us more, don't forget to like, subscribe, and follow the Ideas by Mike podcast and reach out to us at oneoakfinancial.com. That's the number oneoakfinancial.com. Until next time. This has been Mike Milligan. Thank you for logging in and listening or watching to another episode of Ideas by Mike. If you want to learn more about my firm, One Oak Financial, please visit us on our website at www.oneoak. That's the number 1, oakfinancial.com. If you enjoyed this podcast, you could help me by liking it, subscribing to our channel, and telling others about what we're doing. See guys, we're looking to change the game, and that game is about making financial planning more about you. Until next time, this has been Mike. CFP Board owns the marks CFP, Certified Financial planner and CFP in the United States. As a reminder, Mike Milligan, Certified Financial Planner, is an investment advisor representative of Advisory Alpha LLC, an SEC-registered investment advisory firm. All opinions expressed by me or our guests are solely our own opinions and do not reflect the opinions of Advisory Alpha. This recording is for informational purposes only. It should not be relied on for investment, tax, or legal decisions, and it's in no way intended to communicate or guarantee specific performance or suitability of any security instrument or product as we may have discussed. Investment advisory and financial planning services offered through Advisory Alpha LLC, a registered investment advisor. Insurance is offered through Ideas by Mike, a Virginia-based LLC here to serve you in all 50 states and the District of Columbia. Ideas by Mike is a separate and unaffiliated of Advisory Alpha LLC. While tax and legal issues may be discussed in the general course of financial and investment planning, Advisory Alpha does not provide tax or legal services. Please consult with your tax or legal professional prior to making a decision relative to those decisions. Any and all statements of purported or observed general practices of non-affiliated firms and advisors or conditions of the broad financial services industry are solely the opinions of Mike, And are not intended to be offered as factual. The validity of these statements has not been verified, and as such, no representation of their validity are made. An annuity is a long-term financial product designed largely for asset accumulation and retirement needs. All guarantees are backed by the claims-paying ability of the issuing insurance company. This podcast is produced in conjunction with Mike Milligan, LLC. Thank you again for joining us today. We'll see you on the next podcast.