Breaking Down a $450K Security and IT Business

This is Jerry. He runs a business that installs security cameras, lighting, and video gear for churches, schools, and homes. He made $450,000 in revenue last year, but cash is really low and he struggled to make payroll and took a whole bunch of debt on. This is the Business Breakdown Show where we take real home service businesses and analyze exactly what's holding them back. Our goal is to give Jerry a strategy to turn around the company in the next 6 weeks. So the name of the business is Bensberg Tech. And so let's go ahead and look at their application video. Hey, my name is Jerry Kirksey.

I own Bensberg Technologies. 2023 was a good year for us. We grew, we grew from 15 to 20% every year since 2016 when we purchased the business. And 2024, we, our revenue was in half. It was half. We didn't get some of the big jobs. We were concentrating a lot of big school district jobs. And so we didn't get a lot of those jobs, but we had to end up, we had 9 employees and we haven't fully recovered. In fact, we couldn't make payroll at the end of last year. So it's just me and my wife running the business currently. And, but we, we have a way forward. It's going to be, but we have a lot of debt that we've accrued in the downtime. And so we're trying to get our head above water before we can go forward with the plan.

So, okay, so Jerry and his wife looks like they've grown the business for 7 or 8 years, 10 to 15% a year, doing very well. And all of a sudden dropped by 50% because they had this school district. At the time, they had 9 employees. Now they're solo. Okay, this is sort of underpinning of a lot of what I talk about, and that is, as much as you want to go after the whales in your industry, like a school district that's going to increase your revenue by double, if you lose them and lose 50% of your revenue, we have a big problem. Most of the time, the reason the problem is created is because you have to create the infrastructure for a business that's twice the size, and everyone wants the business to grow by double, but you don't remember what happens if that customer leaves. You're stuck with the infrastructure that is trucks, equipment, office space, leases, software. Everything you've purchased to be able to have a twice the size business is the thing that's going to be all overhead once that big contract leaves. So when you're first getting started thinking that you're going to get a one contract or one customer that doubles, triples, quadruples your revenue, it's actually very dangerous to the business. So I talk a lot about this in my content, but that should be a warning to anyone that's just getting started thinking that they're going to get this massive business or one customer that just solves all their problems. Let's go ahead and jump into Jerry's website, bensberg.tech. Okay. From a design perspective, I can tell this is sort of probably built by himself. I have quite a few things in terms of design that we can improve. For example, like all of these should be probably service pages, specific things that people are going to be searching on Google. Even here, like, I don't see the actual— like, see, streaming, like, that's wanting me to call them. So your top logo here, area, this area here, these are services, but it's actually connecting to your telephone number. So if I click any of these words, which are the words that I'm going to be searching, like audiovisual, lighting, streaming, security, access, networking. These are things that people are searching for. I would have these as service pages. So it'd be like bensberg.tech/audiovisual, for example. And I'll be honest, like when I first look at this website, it's not super clear what you do. If someone can't figure out within 3 seconds of what services you offer and what service area you provide that service to in your geography, you We have a problem, 'cause the reason customers are coming here is like, do they take care of the problem I have, your services, and do they serve my area, your service area? And so this is why if you go to like home service web design or lawncareswebdesign.com and see our work, almost every single headline is we do these services in this area. Because if I don't answer those two questions for the customer when they first get to the site, I create so much confusion, they don't go anywhere. Usually they go right back to Google or wherever they're searching. If I look at your social media though, looks really good. I like this a lot, mostly because it shows a lot of your face. You talking here in front of you, looks like your office, your vans. The vans look really sharp, so I'm happy about that. You're talking to the camera. Looks like you're doing about once a week, maybe even a couple times a week, showing different things in your local area with the city government, with around security cameras, showing you on job sites, installing things. So I'm actually really kind of impressed, honestly, with your social media. I think some of this is not conveyed in your website, especially right now because you are now basically a solo operator. Lean into that. Like, lean into the fact that you're gonna be on all these jobs, you're gonna be taking care of customers, you have the most experience, you're not just hiring some kid that knows how to splice wires together. And so I would lean to that. That's why your social media is probably, in my opinion, probably bringing a lot of your leads in locally. Because they're connecting with you. And so I want your website to say the same thing and not have these kind of ominous-looking black and white shots of like an empty classroom. That's not really what you do. An empty church. That's not really what you do. What you do is you provide solutions to customers when it comes to audio, visual, security, streaming, et cetera, and it connects people. Like, if you think about a church, they're trying to connect with their givers. They're trying to connect with their patrons. If you're thinking about schools, they're trying to connect with their students. I would make this much more on connection and then making the experience of the connection with audiovisual awesome. I would wanna see your crew, I wanna see you, your vans, all of that that makes Bensberg Tech, I wanna see that here. And I think on your social media, you do a good job of it, showing your local, showing your trucks, showing your brand, showing you and your face, and that's just not clear on your website right now. Probably the thing that's needed the most in terms of problems here with the site is having those service pages. So that when someone is looking for streaming, a really good streaming company to set up their church stuff, they're finding you because you have service pages built around that. Right now you have service pages built around like schools, but when you go here, for example, this page, the actual URL doesn't show schools. So like from an SEO, search engine optimization perspective, this isn't super helpful. And then like the design is not you, it's not, your trucks and your branding and your uniforms and you doing work at a school. That's the type of thing I'd want to be seeing on these web pages, these actual service pages. Also, when I notice here too, like when I click on security, for example, it just opens up like this other portal. It looks like this is like a third-party Evolve Alarm. So I don't know if you've kind of created two different divisions because I saw Evolve Alarm on your financials too. So I'm not sure if this is a separate or like a sister company, but I would again try to make— if you're going to make Bensberg Tech the brand, make it there where people can stay on this website and get all the information they need to make a buying decision and solve their problems. And so I think overall, even when I go to the security page now, all of a sudden I don't actually even have my— your banner went away. So your main menu, if I go back here, your main menu went away as soon as I went into one of these pages. So like the only way for me to get back to your homepage, I can't click the logo either. Like usually if you click someone's logo, it goes back to their homepage. That doesn't happen. So the only way for them to really get back to the homepage is go back a couple pages. So overall design could certainly be improved. We'd actually, you know what, Jerry, if you're willing, Home Service Web Design, we'd love to build your site for you. We'd give you 6 months completely free. Reach out to Tori and the team here. We have a whole bunch of SEO and designer experts that would be happy to rebuild the site for you. We do it 6 months for free, and if it's not, worth it, you can cancel anytime, we don't have long-term contracts. But for you, Jerry, please reach out. I'll reach out to my team too, make sure that when you contact them, they are ready for you. But I think a lot of these elements, you have lots of pictures, you have tons, like you have years, you've been in business for 10 years. That's since you owned the business. It sounds like you acquired the company, so there's a good chance you have hundreds and hundreds of really good contacts in your database that if we can just tie up this website, make it look professional, make it feel local, people connecting with you, I feel like this can be super powerful. Also, when we click on Let's Get Started, it goes to this page, to our partnership. Let's do it together. Okay. Yeah. Like, I feel like someone's looking for a quote. They're wanting to know, like, what's it going to cost me to install my AV system at my church, install cameras at the school? Like, that's what they want to know. And so I think here, just having a dropdown of your services and being much more like, this isn't an estimate request form, this is a submission for a quote. That's what I would be trying to lean in here as well. Okay, let's go ahead and give a grade to Jerry on the website. Unfortunately, I got to give it a D, a D. There's just a lot of things that from a design elements aren't great. Mobile devices don't look great. There's the menus are broken, the clickability of like your phone number and certain elements like, for example, your contractor number does not need to be the most like the most sought after spot on your website, which is right below the URL. Is a bunch of security numbers that probably needs to be on there from a licensing perspective, I'm guessing, but not at the very top of the web page. So I got to give you a D when it comes to your website. All right. Let's pull up the financials for Bensberg because I could be wrong on everything to do with the website if all the numbers are just absolutely killer. Let's see what we got going on. The profit and loss statement for 2025. Now, remember that they've gone down by over 50% in revenue. In 2024. Okay, so I expect when I look at this, there's going to be some inflated costs due to the fact that we downsized, but there's still other costs still lingering. Let's see what's going on. Okay, this is interesting. So out of $455,000, only about $120,000 of that is services. So actual labor, $330,000 is sales of product. So I'm going to assume you are selling cameras, gear, etc. at a markup. To the customers. But keep in mind, the reason this is important, because a huge amount of the actual materials go into that revenue. And so this is why you can't just look at dollars per employee and consider a business healthy or not. I have to look at like the fact that of this revenue, a big chunk of it is the actual materials, the actual wires, cables, video cameras, the actual gear that's being sold. But it looks like to me you're marking it up substantially, which I'm, that's totally okay. But you can also see that in the cost of goods sold here. So cost of goods sold are gonna be things that go directly into the product, the direct labor, the direct materials. And right now we have $160,000, which is what, like 35% of our revenue is actually just cost of goods sold in the form of materials. And I'm guessing like the equipment itself that we're selling the customer. So I really like this breakdown. If you have this kind of a breakdown on your profit and loss statement, very good, because it actually gives me understanding as to where you're making your revenue. Not just like one line. It's just like income. It's like, okay, that's fine. But like, how much of that is material markup? How much is that fees? How much of that is labor? So this is actually a really good breakdown. As we scroll through this, I'm looking at kind of the bigger numbers, right? So $22,000 a month, that's $2,000 a month for insurance. Seems a little high, especially if you're a sole operator. I'd probably renegotiate. This insurance because it's probably based upon doing like almost $1 million in revenue. So I would renegotiate that. Legal and professional fees, that's fine. Okay, so wages are at $111,000. And this is something Jerry brought up in terms of just getting these employees, etc. In the past, they had 9 employees, so I'm not super concerned. If you look at $120,000, as a function of revenue, it's about 26%, 27% of their revenue is going to wages. Not horrible, so it's passing the sniff test, but keep in mind, you can't just use a blind law of 40% or lower is good because a huge amount of their revenue is coming from product costs and materials, and so that's why the general rule of thumb of 40% of revenue being spent on wages, That rule of thumb can fall apart if a third, 40%, 50% of your revenue's coming from just selling the materials back to the customer. Okay, so as we look at this, we got a lot of little things, just a lot of little cuts and bruises. So here's the thing, on paper, they're making $94,000. 'Cause again, if we look at top line revenue, $455,000, bottom line revenue or bottom line profit, $94,000, we can do the quick math on that. That's almost a 20% profit margin. That's not like it's bad. So whenever I get someone saying, "Hey, I'm struggling, I don't have enough money to make payroll." But then I look at their profit and loss statement and I'm like, 20% profit is not bad. $94,000, $100,000 a year. Like, that's not so bad. Almost every single time I see this, I am then needing the balance sheet. I don't have the balance sheet, but I can make some assumptions based upon interest expense. Let's see if they— they did. That's very good. Very good. So we have $7,000. Let's break this down. So, we have $7,000 being spent on interest. Okay, this is fantastic. So, $7,000 in interest. I am very happy, Jerry, because he is breaking out interest expense on his profit and loss statement. A lot of people will take the entire payment that they pay back to a loan or equipment loan, etc., and let's count all of it as interest expense or interest expense. Payments. That's not the case because interest expense is the only thing that shows up as an expense on your profit and loss statement. But what this hides is the fact that you're also paying down principal. In other words, you're paying down the original balance on the loan. So even though they only paid $7,000 in interest, there's a really good chance they're paying a whole lot more in principal paydown. Now I'm going to try to figure out what that number approximately might be. I'm going to assume they have like some equipment, some trucks, on these loans. So let's assume we have some loans. If we paid $7,000, let's assume for the sake of, you know, easy math that they're getting 3.5% interest on these. Now, I'm going to assume this because they probably got a lot of this debt in 2022, 2021, etc. This percentage, you know, annual percentage rate could be higher, in which case the loan amount that I'm going to guess is lower than I'm thinking. But if that's the case, if they're paying 3.5%, and they paid $7,000 in interest, that would mean that they have about $200,000 in debt. So I do not know this number. The reason I don't know this number is 'cause I don't know the balance sheet. The other part of this is if you have $7,000 in interest, 3.5% interest, you know, as a percentage per year and $200,000 in loan paydowns, let's assume they have all of that debt on like 5-year terms. So if you have this on 5-year terms, that means I'm gonna have to pay, approximately $40,000 in principal paydown on top of the $7,000 that I actually see on the profit and loss statement. And so this is the part that is hiding right now on the P&L because everyone's like, well, $96,000, $94,000 sounds like a great business. But the $40,000 in principal paydown is on the balance sheet. And this is why when I do turnarounds in person, I have to see the balance sheet. Because I need to know these numbers. I am guessing all of this based upon just the fact that there was $7,000 in interest expense paid. So I could be off on the loan amount. It could be a little bit lower if some of this is higher interest debt, but I'm pretty confident about $40,000, maybe even $50,000 if they have only 3-year terms, is actually coming out of their bank account on top of the interest. So if I take the $40,000 of principal paydown on top of the $7,000 of interest, that's $47,000 of expenses, cash going out of the business because of these loans. And that's where Jerry feels like he's drowning. 'Cause you take $50,000 off of their $94,000, we're only making up $40,000 or $50,000 in profit. And that's not enough to really float a $500,000 business. When it comes to the financials, I am going to give them maybe a B+. Let's go with a B+. Mostly 'cause I just don't see the breakout of the wages for the employees versus the officer. Like, how much are you getting paid? I'd love to know that. Like, of that $111,000 for wages, I'd love to know how much of that is going to you or if none of it is going to you. I have a feeling you're taking a salary though, because of the business being bigger in the past. So I would figure you're taking a salary. I'd love to see that broken out in wages, but I'm gonna give them a solid B+ and I'm really happy with the cleanliness of the financial statement. It's not like, the grade doesn't have to do with whether they're doing good or bad. Are you accurately representing your numbers? And I love the fact that they broke out their cost of goods sold. They have very clean numbers. Their interest expense is inside of here, not just random payments, because everyone does this. A lot of people do. I would see on here, I'd see $47,000 as interest expense when in reality it was $47,000 that included $7,000 of interest with $40,000 of principal paydown. And so I'm really glad they broke this out. And this is the type of clean numbers you can get from Home Service CPA. And if you need help with bookkeeping, payroll, taxes, my firm here, we have 3 fully capable people to do your bookkeeping, your taxes, and make sure you have clean numbers like this that are reconciled with your bank statements every single month. Okay, let's jump into the 4L framework. The 4L framework shows the 4 reasons why every home service business owner stops growing. It's either a lack of liquidity, a lack of leads, a lack of labor, or a lack of leadership. And so let's go through all 4 and just identify some of the problems that we currently see with Bensberg Technologies. So when it comes to liquidity, we know that we have very low cash. We have high debt. We don't know what that number is exactly, but this is what Jerry is saying. And we miss payroll. So we're almost missing payroll. And so from a liquidity or cash in the bank perspective, things are really pretty tight right now. Okay. When it comes to leads, and we'll talk about this more when it comes to the 6-week plan, I want to see them go from one-time jobs to recurring jobs because this huge drop in 50% of their revenue, that is scary. I don't want that to happen again. And I can mitigate that risk by having one-time jobs turn into recurring revenue. And we'll talk about that in the 6-week plan. Now, another problem I see when it comes to the labor side, I don't want to see any sort of change in revenue without direct correlation with my labor, meaning I want to be able to pay for performance where a percentage of my revenue goes to my employees, or I don't think this is a business that you can't use contractors. When I look at their cost of goods sold, contractors are only making up $600. And so he's not really leaning to contractors. And this type of work is kind of made for subcontractors, mostly because people that are really good at video and AV, a lot of them end up doing it themselves as solo operators. I could find really good network of subcontractors so that I can take on bigger jobs and then just funnel it towards a really good system of contractors. And if you're not going to do that, I want to make it where when a job gets done, the percentage of labor revenue is what my employees get on pay for performance. We'll talk more about that in the 6-week plan. When it comes to leadership, I think that the leadership that Jerry has is really solid on the social media side, and I want to see him do more of that social media and sales. Right now, he is a solo operator. He's out in the field doing all the work simply because the business has shrunk so much. I think the community outreach is really what turns Jerry on and makes him happy and satisfied. And I think if he focuses more on that, the business will continue to grow. So this is the FOREO Framework. These are the 4 reasons why every home service business stops growing. And these are the current problems we're having each of these different areas of the business. So let's jump into the 6-week plan. What can we do for Jerry and for Bensberg Technologies that in the next 6 weeks they can turn around the business? The first thing is the website. Now, the cool thing is it takes us about 6 weeks at Home Service Web Design to build out your website. And so again, Jerry, please reach out to us, Tori and the team. We will build the whole thing for you completely free for the next 6 months. And if it's worth it, you can continue after that. It's a flat monthly subscription, $499, and you cancel anytime. I really believe if you do this, the long-term value from SEO perspective is good, but that way, anytime you ever run ads in the future, your conversion will be higher. I would guess that your conversion rate, let's call it like 1%, meaning 100 people come to your site, 1 people submits an estimate request form. I believe that number can get to 1 out of 20 or 1 out of 30. In other words, increase your conversion rate by like 4 or 5x. And if that happens, you get 4 to 5 times as many leads for the same number of clicks or eyeballs on your website. And so I really don't feel comfortable driving web traffic or running ads to a website that doesn't convert well. And that's why I want you to focus number one on the website. So 6 months for free, reach out to our team, we'll make sure, make it happen for the next 6 months. The next thing I really want to do is focusing on one-time jobs going into recurring. I do not care about one-time jobs. And right now it's probably where 95% of your revenue is coming from is installation of these cameras, of the security system, of the systems for streaming. And what I want you to focus on is subbing that work out and then focusing on this recurring offer. Where annually you're going to come to these businesses or to these schools and you're going to annually do a checkup. And it might be, you might have a couple of packages like a $199 package or $499 package, or based upon the size of the install, it might be even $1,999, like $2,000. I want your recurring revenue on an annual basis minimum. Ideally, you can do it twice a year. So semi-annually, where every 6 months you show up and you're almost like their it person. But you're gonna go through the security system, you're gonna do updates to their malware, to updates like for things like security cameras, it's important that you actually do the updates. You're gonna make sure that everything is running well, the software is updated, any obstructions, if someone knocked the security camera, you're gonna fix it. These are little things that you can include inside of a recurring package and then tie the warranty of the devices and the equipment to them being in the recurring plan. So when you sell the one-time job, let's just call it a $20,000 job, Mr. Jones, this is a great system, really looking forward to it. That being said, every year or so it does need to be updated, the software. We can make sure that anything gets resolved. It's $499. We come annually. And if you're in that program, we warranty for lifetime, as long as you're in the program, all of your, all of the devices, meaning if anything breaks, and you obviously have terms and conditions around this, like they can't just take a bat to the camera and like, yeah, come replace it. Like you'd have terms and conditions, but it's going to prevent any sort of unexpected cost that they have to incur within the next couple of years after they thought they just did an installation with you. So I think I would tie in the warranty like you're selling air, you're selling insurance essentially on your one-time install and you take away the commodity that you currently are selling, which is installing cameras, installing security microphones and all this is a commodity. Now you become a member of the community that they always are staying in touch with. And every single time you come back every year to do your annual inspection, do any malware updates, do any improvements, clean any of the devices, when you're doing those things, their business is probably growing. Their school is probably growing. Their church is probably growing and has other needs that you then upsell them. So we're also trying to get in front of them more often. And that's what I want you to build the business around. That is where I feel like you could stay solo, continue to do these recurring jobs and sales for the one-time jobs. The one-time jobs are simply a funnel in the long term to be able to get more recurring revenue. And we'll come back to that in a second. So the next thing I want you to do is get Google reviews, focus on your Google Business Profile. Okay, so this means the pictures, the videos that you have on social media, I want you putting that on your Google Business Profile. When I look you up on Google right now, you have 10 reviews. I think we could easily get that to 50, just going back through your Rolodex, all the customers you served. And I don't see a lot of content. So all the content that you're putting on social media, I want you to put that in your Google Business Profile. So that way, when somebody goes on to Google, Google knows that you actually are consistently open and not only responding to reviews, but you're uploading pictures, video, etc. And by the way, you're not really responding to reviews. So there's one here that's great. Kale Jean from 2 months ago. Jerry and Company are the best. He completed several projects ranging from my church to business over the years. And left each place much better than he found it. Awesome. I want you to copy that or screenshot it, put into Gemini or into ChatGPT and ask for an SEO, search engine optimization, friendly response for you to give as the owner. So instead of just saying, thank you, Megan, like you did here, I want you to actually mention the services that you're offering, the service area that you're offering it to. So that way, that's what Google loves, like data. And then in your Google Business Profile, I want the pictures, the video, that you're sharing on Facebook to also go into your Google Business Profile. So that's the next thing I want you to do in the next 6 weeks. The next part is gonna be the hardest. This is gonna be the real change to the business model. And I think you should do contractors, but I don't know enough about your business 'cause I haven't asked you enough questions. Whether I would go pay for performance where I'm getting a percentage of my employees, or when I sign them up, I'm giving them a lower base, but I'm saying, hey, look, you're getting a percentage of labor revenue, which means if you crush out these huge jobs, you might make a lot more money. So I have lots of information about paying by performance. I think your market and your industry is ripe for contractors because there's so many solo operators and skilled workers that do this to where your job is getting the work and then operations, they do the work and then you grease the gears. Then in the future, you get all the recurring revenue because I would love it to where you have 50 or 100 customers that are paying you $500-$600 every few months, or let's just call it $1,000 a year in recurring payments. That's a really good business. I think that keeps you busy. It's a steady flow of income year round. You're not living from one job to the next, but rather you at least are getting like— if you could just get $10,000, $15,000 a month as recurring revenue that's coming in no matter what, that's going to give you a lot of foundation to continue growing the business on top of. I think finding those contractors is difficult, but you haven't really been using contractors a lot. And I think if you create a really good network and even training for contractors, like, hey, here's how we do our AV stuff, here's how we do our camera stuff. And then you give that to them and they set up— they're more or less subcontractors. I think that'd be great. You create this network of contractors that you know are good at certain aspects of AV and you pull on them when those type of jobs come up. But the whole goal is that you get really good at sales. You then delegate out operations using subcontractor model where you maybe you make 15, 20, 30% as a margin. That's great. But then I'm trying to upsell every one of those customers into a warranty or recurring package of service, and I'm tying that warranty to the recurring package and them being in it. And so I truly believe if people are spending $20,000, they're very happy to spend $500 a year for you to come back, maintain, update, clean, and ensure those devices. And I guarantee you, over the course of 3 or 4 years, they're going to need other equipment, and now you're right in front of them. And every time you're going and doing an inspection, you're also seeing other opportunities to produce more revenue by serving them more and solving more of their problems. So I really want to focus on this sales machine and this recurring engine. That's really what I want the whole business to become down the road. And the reason is, Jerry, I want this, like, this is scary. Look, you've done this for 10 years. Almost all of your revenue, I would guess, is coming from one-time projects where you've been employing people. I'm asking you to say, hey, I want you to focus on your website, get 2, 3, 4 times as many leads, be the salesperson, 'cause I think that's what you're actually good at, is community building, talking with people, creating connection, being involved out in your local community. Become the sales engine that then gets 4 or 5 really good contractors that you know specialize in certain things. Make 20%, 30% as a markup on their subcontracted labor and then focus on selling the recurring side of the business. That's the part that I want you to slowly grow. So in 10 years, you're doing half a million dollars in recurring revenue, let alone all the upsells every single time you go visit those customers, that you're able to make. So the whole goal is that one-time jobs, right now that's been really paying the bills, okay? I don't expect you over the next year or two or even the next 6 weeks to like change all your one-time jobs to recurring revenue. That's not gonna happen. You're gonna wanna text, use HomeWorks, text all of your customers and try to get them on this plan. I think if you did it very specifically with your customers, you could probably get in front of a lot of these customers again and sell them more work. I think greasing the gears of that upsell in and of itself would be a whole nother thing you could do. But what I want to do is take the one-time jobs and that's going to continue to pay for your bills. But what I want to happen is this recurring for now is going to pay down debt. So every single time for now that you get one of these one-time projects to convert into a recurring package and now you're making, you know, it's $1,000 a month, $1,500, $2,000 a month. Use that to pay down this debt, 'cause I know that's scaring you right now. And especially if you have, like, if you're not paying 3.5%, it's like 5%, 6%, 7%, 8%, it's higher interest or it's credit cards, definitely be paying that down. And I can tell, like, that's where a lot of the stress is coming from is having this debt. And so to recap, you're getting a new website from Home Service Web Design for the next 6 months. I want you to get this one-time projects to go into this recurring on at least an annual. Or even 6-month basis. I want you to focus on getting Google reviews and fixing your Google Business Profile with having the content from your social media on there as well and responding back to reviews with really SEO-friendly responses. I want you to focus on creating a contractor network or pay for performance for your employees, but that you have a governed percentage of revenue that's going to them because you're not trying to make any more money now on the operations. You're trying to make it on sales and then upselling customers into a recurring package. And that's the sales engine, number 5, that I want you to create, that recurring engine that slowly builds. It takes longer. It's gonna take you a year or 2, 3 years to see that momentum, but that's what I want you to build. And number 6 is keep doing the one-time jobs. You're gonna get more of them as the website improves. That's gonna pay your bills. And then I want you to use this recurring revenue that will slowly stack over the course of time to be able to pay down this debt. And it's gonna really come down to the creativity that you come up with around the offer, around what are the 2 or 3 packages that I can offer on a 6-month. 12-month basis to get back in front of these customers, make more recurring revenue, and be able to upsell them more stuff in the future. All right. If you would like my help in your business and I can actually fly out to your business in person for a day and help you turn around your company, we will fill out the 4L framework. We will come up with a 6-week plan. If that's of interest to you, it's completely free due to the support of the community. Just go to mikeandes.com/turnaround and apply today. It's 5 minutes and doesn't cost you a penny.